Re: Unknown Schumann piece
I'm not sure that for very small people really describes the piece well, given the large stretch at the end of bar 4. Or maybe, like Stravinsky, he forgot that small people have small left hands as well as right hands. Another solution - a very small child plays the upper part, and a slightly more advanced one the lower part, using two hands. So whether it's for two pianists or very small people becomes irrelevant. Regards, Peter mailto:lilyp...@ptoye.com www.ptoye.com___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: Unknown Schumann piece
Am 06.05.2014 17:36, schrieb Peter Toye: I'm not sure that for very small people really describes the piece well, given the large stretch at the end of bar 4. Or maybe, like Stravinsky, he forgot that small people have small left hands as well as right hands. I think this piece is already more complex than the other of the first pieces. I can imagine that this was the reason to emend the title. Urs Another solution - a very small child plays the upper part, and a slightly more advanced one the lower part, using two hands. So whether it's for two pianists or very small people becomes irrelevant. Regards, Peter mailto:lilyp...@ptoye.com www.ptoye.com http://www.ptoye.com ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user -- ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: [SPAM] Re: Unknown Schumann piece
Am 04.05.2014 04:22, schrieb Mogens Lemvig Hansen: See http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HMcrb-sKh5wfeature=youtube_gdata_player :-) Regards, Mogens On 2014-05-03, at 17:26, Urs Liska u...@openlilylib.org wrote: Am 04.05.2014 01:49, schrieb Pierre Perol-Schneider: 2014-05-04 1:38 GMT+02:00 Martin Tarenskeen m.tarensk...@zonnet.nl: On Sat, 3 May 2014, Urs Liska wrote: There is just one important thing that I couldn't read in Schumann's handwriting. It's overstroken by Schumann and in that typical 19th century German handwriting. But maybe someone in this group is able to read it. See attachment. Maybe something like Für ganz Kleine:? Would make sense in the context of op. 68, but I really can't read the last word. I like that one. Until someone comes up with a better idea I'll use that one. I have attached the tune (.pdf and .ly). Thanks Martin. I'm pretty sure that the last letter is an r... I've tried to clean your image, see enclosed. The second-to-last is most probably an n - compare with the second-to-last character of the second word. Then we have a clear i dot before that. With the r I'm not 100% sure - although I admit this looks quite convincing. The r in Für has a first stroke that is more distinct than in that last character. Believe it or not, I can well imagine that the last and the fourth-to-last characters are both es. I'd like to know what that stroke above/between the first two characters of the last word is. Just an arbitrary stroke? Or an apostrophe separating a letter and a word? Urs Cheers, Pierre ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: Unknown Schumann piece
On Sun, 4 May 2014, Pierre Perol-Schneider wrote: Maybe something like Für ganz Kleine:? Would make sense in the context of op. 68, but I really can't read the last word. I like that one. Until someone comes up with a better idea I'll use that one. I have attached the tune (.pdf and .ly). Thanks Martin. I'm pretty sure that the last letter is an r... I've tried to clean your image, see enclosed. Thanks. Für ganz Kleiner could very well be right. -- MT ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: Unknown Schumann piece
Martin Tarenskeen m.tarensk...@zonnet.nl writes: On Sun, 4 May 2014, Pierre Perol-Schneider wrote: Maybe something like Für ganz Kleine:? Would make sense in the context of op. 68, but I really can't read the last word. I like that one. Until someone comes up with a better idea I'll use that one. I have attached the tune (.pdf and .ly). Thanks Martin. I'm pretty sure that the last letter is an r... I've tried to clean your image, see enclosed. Thanks. Für ganz Kleiner could very well be right. Except that Schumann could be expected to have a basic grasp of German grammar. It _would_ explain striking through the title out of embarrassment, but then one would have expected a properly spelled version below. -- David Kastrup ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: Unknown Schumann piece
2014-05-04 9:30 GMT+02:00 Martin Tarenskeen m.tarensk...@zonnet.nl: Für ganz Kleiner could very well be right. Is it possible that there is a word after ? Something like Für ganz Kleiner Spieler ? Otherwise it is grammatically wrong. After seeing the video I vote for Für ganz Kleine. Cheers, Pierre ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: Unknown Schumann piece
“Für ganz Kleiner Spieler” is grammatically wrong as well, it would be “Für ganz kleine Spieler”. And I don’t think that there is another word, it seems like this text ends with a colon or a dot (I forgot how this dot is called in English …) On 04.05.2014 09:53, Pierre Perol-Schneider wrote: 2014-05-04 9:30 GMT+02:00 Martin Tarenskeen m.tarensk...@zonnet.nl mailto:m.tarensk...@zonnet.nl: Für ganz Kleiner could very well be right. Is it possible that there is a word after ? Something like Für ganz Kleiner Spieler ? Otherwise it is grammatically wrong. After seeing the video I vote for Für ganz Kleine. Cheers, Pierre ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: Unknown Schumann piece
Pierre Perol-Schneider pierre.schneider.pa...@gmail.com writes: 2014-05-04 9:30 GMT+02:00 Martin Tarenskeen m.tarensk...@zonnet.nl: Für ganz Kleiner could very well be right. Is it possible that there is a word after ? Something like Für ganz Kleiner Spieler ? Still ungrammatical. -- David Kastrup ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: Unknown Schumann piece
2014-05-04 9:54 GMT+02:00 David Kastrup d...@gnu.org: Still ungrammatical. Oups, sorry for that... ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: Unknown Schumann piece
Pierre Perol-Schneider pierre.schneider.pa...@gmail.com writes: 2014-05-04 9:54 GMT+02:00 David Kastrup d...@gnu.org: Still ungrammatical. Oups, sorry for that... I consider it a feature rather than a bug that not everyone is German. -- David Kastrup ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: Unknown Schumann piece
On Sun, 4 May 2014, Martin Tarenskeen wrote: I have attached the tune (.pdf and .ly). So much response for a question about such a small and simple piece! Isn't this mailinglist great? Following up on this I have another question. What are the rules for the vertical placement of rests in polyphonic writing? Are there any? For example in my Schumann piece, lower staff, Lilypond did a very ugly choice by default and I had to use something like b'\rest even for this very simple piece. (Don't know if that's the correct placement but it looks fine to my eyes) -- MT ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: Unknown Schumann piece
Am 04.05.2014 13:09, schrieb Martin Tarenskeen: On Sun, 4 May 2014, Martin Tarenskeen wrote: I have attached the tune (.pdf and .ly). So much response for a question about such a small and simple piece! Isn't this mailinglist great? Following up on this I have another question. What are the rules for the vertical placement of rests in polyphonic writing? Are there any? For example in my Schumann piece, lower staff, Lilypond did a very ugly choice by default and I had to use something like b'\rest even for this very simple piece. (Don't know if that's the correct placement but it looks fine to my eyes) This has just come up recently. See https://code.google.com/p/lilypond/issues/detail?id=3902 and follow the link there to see how different notation programs handle that situation. Urs ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: Unknown Schumann piece
At 13:09 04/05/2014 +0200, Martin Tarenskeen wrote: What are the rules for the vertical placement of rests in polyphonic writing? Are there any? For example in my Schumann piece, lower staff, Lilypond did a very ugly choice by default and I had to use something like b'\rest even for this very simple piece. (Don't know if that's the correct placement but it looks fine to my eyes) Elaine Gould says (pp. 36-7): For clarity, upper-part rest are usually placed above the centre stave-line, lower-part rests below the centre line When one part lies outside the stave (on ledger lines), crotchet, quaver, and shorter-value rests for the other part may move back to the centre of the stave Semibreve and minim rests must never stray across the centre stave line When both parts have rests simultaneously, as in strict contrapuntal writing, separate these with at least one stave-line Many editions place all minim and semibreve rests only on the outside stave-lines, to avoid confusion; some avoid rests on the middle stave-line, for the same reason This last remark appears to describe (and validate?) what Lilypond does by default. But it's clearly not the only way. Brian Barker ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: Unknown Schumann piece
On Sat, 3 May 2014, Martin Tarenskeen wrote: Hi, I have an edition of Robert Schumann's Album für die Jugend that has some pictures of his handwritten scores inside. One of the pictures shows a small but apparently unapproved pianopiece, before the first tune Melodie starts. The tune is very simple and not very interesting musically. That's probably why Schumann didn't like it and dumped it. But I couldn't resist trying to typeset it with Lilypond anyway. There is just one important thing that I couldn't read in Schumann's handwriting. It's overstroken by Schumann and in that typical 19th century German handwriting. But maybe someone in this group is able to read it. See attachment. (I will share the tune later.) Sorry, I accidentally attached the complete page, instead of just the title. See attchment. -- MT ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: Unknown Schumann piece
On 03.05.2014 21:54, Martin Tarenskeen wrote: On Sat, 3 May 2014, Martin Tarenskeen wrote: There is just one important thing that I couldn't read in Schumann's handwriting. It's overstroken by Schumann and in that typical 19th century German handwriting. But maybe someone in this group is able to read it. See attachment. Hi, the first word is “Für” (English: “for”) an I think the third one could be “Clavier” (“piano”). Oh, maybe “Für zwey Clavier(e)” (“for two pianos”)? That would explain the two hooks/swashes below the line (belonging to the z and y). And could also explain why this text was cancelled. Cheers, Malte ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: Unknown Schumann piece
Am 03.05.2014 22:20, schrieb Malte Meyn: On 03.05.2014 21:54, Martin Tarenskeen wrote: On Sat, 3 May 2014, Martin Tarenskeen wrote: There is just one important thing that I couldn't read in Schumann's handwriting. It's overstroken by Schumann and in that typical 19th century German handwriting. But maybe someone in this group is able to read it. See attachment. Hi, the first word is “Für” (English: “for”) I think this is absolutely clear. an I think the third one could be “Clavier” (“piano”). This not. (I mean it's not clear). Oh, maybe “Für zwey Clavier(e)” (“for two pianos”)? That would explain the two hooks/swashes below the line (belonging to the z and y). And could also explain why this text was cancelled. I wouldn't bet my reputation against it, but I am quite sure the second word is ganz Maybe something like Für ganz Kleine:? Would make sense in the context of op. 68, but I really can't read the last word. Urs Cheers, Malte ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: Unknown Schumann piece
On Sat, 3 May 2014, Urs Liska wrote:
There is just one important thing that I couldn't read in Schumann's
handwriting. It's overstroken by Schumann and in that typical 19th
century German handwriting. But maybe someone in this group is able
to
read it. See attachment.
Maybe something like Für ganz Kleine:?
Would make sense in the context of op. 68, but I really can't read the last
word.
I like that one. Until someone comes up with a better idea I'll use that one.
I have attached the tune (.pdf and .ly).
--
MT
00-unknown.pdf
Description: Adobe PDF document
\version 2.19.5
%\pointAndClickOff
\header {
title = Für ganz Kleine (?)
composer = Robert Schumann
}
rh = \relative {
c''4-.( c-.) e-.( e-.) | g( f d2) | e4-.( e-.) c-.( c-.) | d1 |
\break
c4-.( c-.) e-.( e-.) | g( f d2) | e4-.( e-.) d-.( d-.) | c1 |
\bar |.
}
lh = \relative {
\new Voice {
\voiceOne
b'2\rest e, g | b'\rest d, g | b'\rest e, g | b'\rest b, d g |
b'\rest e, g | b'\rest d, g | c e g b d g | c e1 |
}
\new Voice {
\voiceTwo
c1 | b | c | g | c | b | s | s |
}
\bar |.
}
\score {
\new PianoStaff
\new Staff \rh
\new Dynamics { s1\mf }
\new Staff \lh
\layout {}
}
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Re: Unknown Schumann piece
2014-05-04 1:38 GMT+02:00 Martin Tarenskeen m.tarensk...@zonnet.nl: On Sat, 3 May 2014, Urs Liska wrote: There is just one important thing that I couldn't read in Schumann's handwriting. It's overstroken by Schumann and in that typical 19th century German handwriting. But maybe someone in this group is able to read it. See attachment. Maybe something like Für ganz Kleine:? Would make sense in the context of op. 68, but I really can't read the last word. I like that one. Until someone comes up with a better idea I'll use that one. I have attached the tune (.pdf and .ly). Thanks Martin. I'm pretty sure that the last letter is an r... I've tried to clean your image, see enclosed. Cheers, Pierre ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: Unknown Schumann piece
Am 04.05.2014 01:49, schrieb Pierre Perol-Schneider: 2014-05-04 1:38 GMT+02:00 Martin Tarenskeen m.tarensk...@zonnet.nl: On Sat, 3 May 2014, Urs Liska wrote: There is just one important thing that I couldn't read in Schumann's handwriting. It's overstroken by Schumann and in that typical 19th century German handwriting. But maybe someone in this group is able to read it. See attachment. Maybe something like Für ganz Kleine:? Would make sense in the context of op. 68, but I really can't read the last word. I like that one. Until someone comes up with a better idea I'll use that one. I have attached the tune (.pdf and .ly). Thanks Martin. I'm pretty sure that the last letter is an r... I've tried to clean your image, see enclosed. The second-to-last is most probably an n - compare with the second-to-last character of the second word. Then we have a clear i dot before that. With the r I'm not 100% sure - although I admit this looks quite convincing. The r in Für has a first stroke that is more distinct than in that last character. Believe it or not, I can well imagine that the last and the fourth-to-last characters are both es. I'd like to know what that stroke above/between the first two characters of the last word is. Just an arbitrary stroke? Or an apostrophe separating a letter and a word? Urs Cheers, Pierre ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: Unknown Schumann piece
See http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HMcrb-sKh5wfeature=youtube_gdata_player Regards, Mogens On 2014-05-03, at 17:26, Urs Liska u...@openlilylib.org wrote: Am 04.05.2014 01:49, schrieb Pierre Perol-Schneider: 2014-05-04 1:38 GMT+02:00 Martin Tarenskeen m.tarensk...@zonnet.nl: On Sat, 3 May 2014, Urs Liska wrote: There is just one important thing that I couldn't read in Schumann's handwriting. It's overstroken by Schumann and in that typical 19th century German handwriting. But maybe someone in this group is able to read it. See attachment. Maybe something like Für ganz Kleine:? Would make sense in the context of op. 68, but I really can't read the last word. I like that one. Until someone comes up with a better idea I'll use that one. I have attached the tune (.pdf and .ly). Thanks Martin. I'm pretty sure that the last letter is an r... I've tried to clean your image, see enclosed. The second-to-last is most probably an n - compare with the second-to-last character of the second word. Then we have a clear i dot before that. With the r I'm not 100% sure - although I admit this looks quite convincing. The r in Für has a first stroke that is more distinct than in that last character. Believe it or not, I can well imagine that the last and the fourth-to-last characters are both es. I'd like to know what that stroke above/between the first two characters of the last word is. Just an arbitrary stroke? Or an apostrophe separating a letter and a word? Urs Cheers, Pierre ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
