Re: tetex 2.5 and lilypond 2.0
The changes necessary to make lily 2.0 compatible with teTeX 3.0 should be very simple. From the top of my head, make a new directory /usr/share/lilypond/fonts/map/ (or wherever your .../lilypond/fonts/ currently is installed) and put a copy of the file lilypond.map in that directory. On a Debian compatible installation, I recall that the LilyPond TeX related files are included into the standard teTeX texmf directory structure, so in that case, there is probably already a fonts/map/ directory where you can place the lilypond.map file. Then, you should also run texhash (as root) to update the filename database. If your LilyPond binary is compiled using an older teTeX you might also get compatibility problems with the version of the kpathsea library which is linked. However, if you compile LilyPond yourself on a machine with teTeX 3.0, that shouldn't be a problem. /Mats Laura Conrad wrote: I sympathize with all the users who are just now running into the difficulties of keeping lilypond files in sync with lilypond development. I've been using lilypond since about 1.4, and it hasn't gotten any easier. I also agree with the people who've been saying that the right answer is to keep old lilypond versions installed, so that you can update a lilypond file in a minor way without going through the conversion and re-tweaking process every time. My problem is that I have several major projects that are in lilypond 2.0. Even where convert-ly performs flawlessly (which it doesn't for a number of features, like multi-verse vocal music), it would be at least hours and more likely days of work to do all the re-tweaking and repaginating to convert these books to lily 2.8. You can't just install lily 2.0 on a modern (less than a year old) linux system, because the fix for having lilypond use tetex 3.0 happened sometime in the 2.4 development cycle, and was never backported to older versions. Until last week, I was dealing with this on my Debian Unstable system by pinning tetex to 2.5. Unfortunately, last week my machine died, and I decided to put Ubuntu Dapper on the new machine. It turns out not to be possible to install tetex 2.5 directly on an Ubuntu Dapper machine. A very nice person on the ubuntu users list is attempting to walk me through building the tetex 2.5 from Ubuntu Breezy for Ubuntu Dapper, but it doesn't seem to be easy, and in any case, as a publisher I use TeX for enough things that sooner or later I'm sure I will want something that needs tetex 3.0. So I'm considering the following options: Installing Ubuntu breezy or some other distribution with tetex 2.5 on it in another partition on my giant new hard drive. I only need to change the 2.0 lily files a few times a year, so this might be the most straightforward thing for me to do. Seeing if I can run lilypond 2.0 from a TeX Live CD of the appropriate vintage. Has anyone tried to run any lilypond with any TeX Live CD and what were the results? Finding out what were the changes necessary for lilypond to run on tetex 3.0 and what's involved in backporting them to lilyond 2.0. Can anyone help with this? This would be the most straightforward answer for lilypond development in general. I'm sure I'm not the only person facing problems like this, so I'd be interested in hearing what other people are doing about them. -- = Mats Bengtsson Signal Processing Signals, Sensors and Systems Royal Institute of Technology SE-100 44 STOCKHOLM Sweden Phone: (+46) 8 790 8463 Fax: (+46) 8 790 7260 Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] WWW: http://www.s3.kth.se/~mabe = ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: tetex 2.5 and lilypond 2.0
On Monday 10 July 2006 15:14, Laura Conrad wrote: My problem is that I have several major projects that are in lilypond 2.0. Even where convert-ly performs flawlessly (which it doesn't for a number of features, like multi-verse vocal music), By the way, there are plans to drop the old-lyric-combine compatibility altogether, so in order to upgrade to the next stable version, you'll have to rewrite all your old-style \addlyrics expressions manually. -- Erik ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: tetex 2.5 and lilypond 2.0
Erik == Erik Sandberg [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Erik By the way, there are plans to drop the old-lyric-combine Erik compatibility altogether, so in order to upgrade to the next Erik stable version, you'll have to rewrite all your old-style Erik \addlyrics expressions manually. I'm not sure how this differs from what I have to do now. Do you mean that in addition to breaking multi-verse upgrading, you're also planning to break single-verse upgrading? Before that happens, could someone rewrite abc2ly to use something that convert-ly will know what to do with? Or at least explain what that something would be? -- Laura (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] , http://www.laymusic.org/ ) (617) 661-8097 fax: (501) 641-5011 233 Broadway, Cambridge, MA 02139 ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: tetex 2.5 and lilypond 2.0
On 7/11/06, Laura Conrad [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Erik == Erik Sandberg [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Erik By the way, there are plans to drop the old-lyric-combine Erik compatibility altogether, so in order to upgrade to the next Erik stable version, you'll have to rewrite all your old-style Erik \addlyrics expressions manually. I'm not sure how this differs from what I have to do now. Do you mean that in addition to breaking multi-verse upgrading, you're also planning to break single-verse upgrading? I think so. The command that used to be \addlyrics, and which now is known as \oldaddlyrics, will be removed. \lyricsto (and hte new \addlyrics) will be the only ways to align lyrics. Before that happens, could someone rewrite abc2ly to use something that convert-ly will know what to do with? Or at least explain what that something would be? I don't know much about abc2ly, but it will have to produce \lyricsto expressions in order to work with 2.9. Erik ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: tetex 2.5 and lilypond 2.0
Erik == Erik Sandberg [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Erik On 7/11/06, Laura Conrad [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Erik == Erik Sandberg [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Erik By the way, there are plans to drop the old-lyric-combine
Erik compatibility altogether, so in order to upgrade to the next
Erik stable version, you'll have to rewrite all your old-style
Erik \addlyrics expressions manually.
I'm not sure how this differs from what I have to do now. Do
you mean that in addition to breaking multi-verse upgrading,
you're also planning to break single-verse upgrading?
Erik I think so. The command that used to be \addlyrics, and
Erik which now is known as \oldaddlyrics, will be
Erik removed. \lyricsto (and hte new \addlyrics) will be the only
Erik ways to align lyrics.
I suppose I should be reading the fine manual more, but I've never
figured out the difference between \oldaddlyrics and \addlyrics. In
any case, my manual conversions use \addlyrics.
Before that happens, could someone rewrite abc2ly to use
something that convert-ly will know what to do with? Or at
least explain what that something would be?
Erik I don't know much about abc2ly, but it will have to produce
Erik \lyricsto expressions in order to work with 2.9.
OK, in abc, I might write:
X:1
T:Row, row, row your boat
M:6/8
L:1/8
K:C
C3 C3 | C2 DE3 | E2 D E2 F | G6 |
w:Row row row your boat, gen- tly down the stream
cc c GG G | EE E CC C |
w: Mer- ri- ly, Mer- ri- ly, Mer- ri- ly Mer- ri- ly,
G2 F E2 D | C6 |]
w:Life is but a dream.
abc2ly would have formerly (1.5.71) written a score for that as:
\score{
\notes
\addlyrics
\context Staff=default
{
\voicedefault
}
\context Lyrics=default
{ \wordsdefaultVA }
}
and now writes:
\score{
\context Staff=default
{
\voicedefault
}
\addlyrics {
\wordsdefaultVA }
}
Which looks pretty similar to me. So if something major is going to
change about how addlyrics works, someone (I'm willing to be the
someone if I'm in the loop) should make sure that abc2ly can convert
Row, row, row your boat.
Now the reason I'm grumpy about this, is that if we have a two verse
song:
X:1
T:Row, row, row your boat
M:6/8
L:1/8
K:C
C3 C3 | C2 DE3 | E2 D E2 F | G6 |
w:Row row row your boat, gen- tly down the stream
w:Bat, bat, bat your ball, fierce- ly o'er the fence,
cc c GG G | EE E CC C |
w: Mer- ri- ly, Mer- ri- ly, Mer- ri- ly Mer- ri- ly,
G2 F E2 D | C6 |]
w:Life is but a dream.
The old abc2ly would have said:
\score{
\notes
\addlyrics
\context Staff=default
{
\voicedefault
}
\context Lyrics=default
{ \wordsdefaultVA }
{ \wordsdefaultVB }
}
And the new one says:
\score{
\context Staff=default
{
\voicedefault
}
\addlyrics {
\wordsdefaultVA }
\addlyrics {
\wordsdefaultVB }
}
I've never seen why convert-ly wouldn't be able to write that from the
old output of abc2ly, but instead it writes:
\score{
\oldaddlyrics
\context Staff=default
{
\voicedefault
}
\context Lyrics=default
{ \wordsdefaultVA }
{ \wordsdefaultVB }
}
Which doesn't work, and leaves the second verse out.
Now I have been hand-converting my multi-verse songs by using
something like the new output of abc2ly. I hope that's going to go on
working. If not, abc2ly should stop using it, of course. And it would
be good if convert-ly could handle it better than it handled the
conversion between 2.x and 2.6 where it broke all multi-verse lyrics
that I know anything about.
--
Laura (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] , http://www.laymusic.org/ )
(617) 661-8097 fax: (501) 641-5011
233 Broadway, Cambridge, MA 02139
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Re: tetex 2.5 and lilypond 2.0
On Tuesday 11 July 2006 17:13, Laura Conrad wrote: Erik == Erik Sandberg [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Erik On 7/11/06, Laura Conrad [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Erik == Erik Sandberg [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Erik By the way, there are plans to drop the old-lyric-combine Erik compatibility altogether, so in order to upgrade to the next Erik stable version, you'll have to rewrite all your old-style Erik \addlyrics expressions manually. I'm not sure how this differs from what I have to do now. Do you mean that in addition to breaking multi-verse upgrading, you're also planning to break single-verse upgrading? Erik I think so. The command that used to be \addlyrics, and Erik which now is known as \oldaddlyrics, will be Erik removed. \lyricsto (and hte new \addlyrics) will be the only Erik ways to align lyrics. I suppose I should be reading the fine manual more, but I've never figured out the difference between \oldaddlyrics and \addlyrics. In any case, my manual conversions use \addlyrics. \addlyrics will still be supported, only \oldaddlyrics will be junked. So according to what you say below, abc2ly will still work fine. I've never seen why convert-ly wouldn't be able to write that from the old output of abc2ly, but instead it writes: The reason why convert-ly can't handle oldaddlyrics, is that it is based on regexps, which makes it very difficult to move stuff far distances (such as across a \context Staff ... expression). -- Erik ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
tetex 2.5 and lilypond 2.0
I sympathize with all the users who are just now running into the difficulties of keeping lilypond files in sync with lilypond development. I've been using lilypond since about 1.4, and it hasn't gotten any easier. I also agree with the people who've been saying that the right answer is to keep old lilypond versions installed, so that you can update a lilypond file in a minor way without going through the conversion and re-tweaking process every time. My problem is that I have several major projects that are in lilypond 2.0. Even where convert-ly performs flawlessly (which it doesn't for a number of features, like multi-verse vocal music), it would be at least hours and more likely days of work to do all the re-tweaking and repaginating to convert these books to lily 2.8. You can't just install lily 2.0 on a modern (less than a year old) linux system, because the fix for having lilypond use tetex 3.0 happened sometime in the 2.4 development cycle, and was never backported to older versions. Until last week, I was dealing with this on my Debian Unstable system by pinning tetex to 2.5. Unfortunately, last week my machine died, and I decided to put Ubuntu Dapper on the new machine. It turns out not to be possible to install tetex 2.5 directly on an Ubuntu Dapper machine. A very nice person on the ubuntu users list is attempting to walk me through building the tetex 2.5 from Ubuntu Breezy for Ubuntu Dapper, but it doesn't seem to be easy, and in any case, as a publisher I use TeX for enough things that sooner or later I'm sure I will want something that needs tetex 3.0. So I'm considering the following options: Installing Ubuntu breezy or some other distribution with tetex 2.5 on it in another partition on my giant new hard drive. I only need to change the 2.0 lily files a few times a year, so this might be the most straightforward thing for me to do. Seeing if I can run lilypond 2.0 from a TeX Live CD of the appropriate vintage. Has anyone tried to run any lilypond with any TeX Live CD and what were the results? Finding out what were the changes necessary for lilypond to run on tetex 3.0 and what's involved in backporting them to lilyond 2.0. Can anyone help with this? This would be the most straightforward answer for lilypond development in general. I'm sure I'm not the only person facing problems like this, so I'd be interested in hearing what other people are doing about them. -- Laura (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] , http://www.laymusic.org/ ) (617) 661-8097 fax: (501) 641-5011 233 Broadway, Cambridge, MA 02139 ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
RE: tetex 2.5 and lilypond 2.0
If your new system is powerful enough (and no, I haven't any experience of this but I'm planning to do something like this myself :-) Experiment with UML (User Mode Linux) and Gentoo. There's a good chance that if you get a minimal gentoo system running, then tell it to install the packages you need such as tetex 2.5, it will hopefully work fine. The portage system *should* resolve the necessary dependencies. As I say, I haven't done this. But it's an idea to play with ... and if you can get UML running you can easily run an old setup as a program inside Dapper :-) Cheers, Wol -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] .org] On Behalf Of Laura Conrad Sent: 10 July 2006 14:14 To: lilypond-user@gnu.org Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: tetex 2.5 and lilypond 2.0 I sympathize with all the users who are just now running into the difficulties of keeping lilypond files in sync with lilypond development. I've been using lilypond since about 1.4, and it hasn't gotten any easier. I also agree with the people who've been saying that the right answer is to keep old lilypond versions installed, so that you can update a lilypond file in a minor way without going through the conversion and re-tweaking process every time. My problem is that I have several major projects that are in lilypond 2.0. Even where convert-ly performs flawlessly (which it doesn't for a number of features, like multi-verse vocal music), it would be at least hours and more likely days of work to do all the re-tweaking and repaginating to convert these books to lily 2.8. You can't just install lily 2.0 on a modern (less than a year old) linux system, because the fix for having lilypond use tetex 3.0 happened sometime in the 2.4 development cycle, and was never backported to older versions. Until last week, I was dealing with this on my Debian Unstable system by pinning tetex to 2.5. Unfortunately, last week my machine died, and I decided to put Ubuntu Dapper on the new machine. It turns out not to be possible to install tetex 2.5 directly on an Ubuntu Dapper machine. A very nice person on the ubuntu users list is attempting to walk me through building the tetex 2.5 from Ubuntu Breezy for Ubuntu Dapper, but it doesn't seem to be easy, and in any case, as a publisher I use TeX for enough things that sooner or later I'm sure I will want something that needs tetex 3.0. So I'm considering the following options: Installing Ubuntu breezy or some other distribution with tetex 2.5 on it in another partition on my giant new hard drive. I only need to change the 2.0 lily files a few times a year, so this might be the most straightforward thing for me to do. Seeing if I can run lilypond 2.0 from a TeX Live CD of the appropriate vintage. Has anyone tried to run any lilypond with any TeX Live CD and what were the results? Finding out what were the changes necessary for lilypond to run on tetex 3.0 and what's involved in backporting them to lilyond 2.0. Can anyone help with this? This would be the most straightforward answer for lilypond development in general. I'm sure I'm not the only person facing problems like this, so I'd be interested in hearing what other people are doing about them. -- Laura (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] , http://www.laymusic.org/ ) (617) 661-8097 fax: (501) 641-5011 233 Broadway, Cambridge, MA 02139 ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user * * This transmission is intended for the named recipient only. It may contain private and confidential information. If this has come to you in error you must not act on anything disclosed in it, nor must you copy it, modify it, disseminate it in any way, or show it to anyone. Please e-mail the sender to inform us of the transmission error or telephone ECA International immediately and delete the e-mail from your information system. Telephone numbers for ECA International offices are: Sydney +61 (0)2 8272 5300, Hong Kong + 852 2121 2388, London +44 (0)20 7351 5000 and New York +1 212 582 2333. * * ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: tetex 2.5 and lilypond 2.0
Anthony Youngman wrote: If your new system is powerful enough (and no, I haven't any experience of this but I'm planning to do something like this myself :-) Experiment with UML (User Mode Linux) and Gentoo. There's a good chance that if you get a minimal gentoo system running, then tell it to install the packages you need such as tetex 2.5, it will hopefully work fine. The portage system *should* resolve the necessary dependencies. As I say, I haven't done this. But it's an idea to play with ... and if you can get UML running you can easily run an old setup as a program inside Dapper :-) Cheers, Wol Gentoo currently has support for Lily 2.0.3 -- in fact, that is the latest version marked stable in the Gentoo build tree! --Daniel ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
Re: tetex 2.5 and lilypond 2.0
On Mon, 10 Jul 2006 09:29:32 -0700, Daniel Johnson wrote Gentoo currently has support for Lily 2.0.3 -- in fact, that is the latest version marked stable in the Gentoo build tree! But AFAIK it does not even compile anymore. I'm running 2.6 on Gentoo, it works, though it has still some Problems with a4 paper sizes... I don't know what the Gentoo people did wrong there, it seems nobody else has that kind of problems. But unfortunately there seem to be much too less testers on Gentoo. :( -- MfG Jan Open WebMail Project (http://openwebmail.org) ___ lilypond-user mailing list lilypond-user@gnu.org http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/lilypond-user
