Re: [LAD] Polyphonic normal guitar to midi: Jam Origins' MIDI-Guitar
On Tue, Jun 26, 2018 at 04:25:27PM -0400, Tim wrote: "The method consists of a computational model of the human auditory periphery, followed by a periodicity analysis mechanism where fundamental frequencies are iteratively detected and canceled from the mixture signal." Neat. Sounds like the Progressive Interference Cancellation my team patented for CDMA years ago. Hear a signal, reconstruct it based on what you think you heard, subtract the synthesized signal from the input, drop the noise floor. Lather, rinse, repeat. (We got ~3x channel capacity from it in a CDMA context...) Of course, it's a bit easier to reconstruct a CDMA signal than an analog guitar signal, but we'll get there some day. I can't wait! ;) -g ___ Linux-audio-dev mailing list Linux-audio-dev@lists.linuxaudio.org https://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-dev
Re: [LAD] Polyphonic normal guitar to midi: Jam Origins' MIDI-Guitar
On 06/26/2018 03:55 PM, Hans Wilmers wrote: On 06/26/2018 08:32 PM, Spencer Jackson wrote: I don't know of anyone really working on polyphonic pitch recognition in the open source world. I think Bayesian filtering of some kind though would be compelling. Perhaps some of the work from ISSE (http://isse.sourceforge.net/) could be used and made realtime. There is a SuperCollider plugin by Nick Collins called PolyPitch, which does what the name suggests. The source is GPL, and available here: https://composerprogrammer.com/code.html / Hans From Klapuri, "Multipitch analysis of polyphonic music and speech signals using an auditory model", from PolyPitch: "The method consists of a computational model of the human auditory periphery, followed by a periodicity analysis mechanism where fundamental frequencies are iteratively detected and canceled from the mixture signal." Wow. That seems much different than all the other papers I read. Wonder how well it works, especially if applied to guitar. It sort of reminds me of how I once was part of Sony's rollout of Surround Retrieval System technology. It was TV surround speakers modeled based on human hearing, to make one pair of these speakers simulate a truer surround. Tim. ___ Linux-audio-dev mailing list Linux-audio-dev@lists.linuxaudio.org https://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-dev
Re: [LAD] Polyphonic normal guitar to midi: Jam Origins' MIDI-Guitar
On 06/26/2018 08:32 PM, Spencer Jackson wrote: > > > I don't know of anyone really working on polyphonic pitch recognition in > the open source world. I think Bayesian filtering of some kind though > would be compelling. Perhaps some of the work from ISSE > (http://isse.sourceforge.net/) could be used and made realtime. > There is a SuperCollider plugin by Nick Collins called PolyPitch, which does what the name suggests. The source is GPL, and available here: https://composerprogrammer.com/code.html / Hans ___ Linux-audio-dev mailing list Linux-audio-dev@lists.linuxaudio.org https://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-dev
Re: [LAD] Polyphonic normal guitar to midi: Jam Origins' MIDI-Guitar
On 06/26/2018 02:16 PM, Ralf Mardorf wrote: On Mon, 25 Jun 2018 18:31:12 -0400, Tim wrote: Then I stumbled across this product, MIDI-Guitar from Jam Origins. For quite some time now, the free version is installed on my iPad, but I never tested it and meanwhile I've got two electric guitars with Roland GK-3 PUs and a Roland GR-55. Keep in mind that even the best polyphonic tracking done by software for Apple and Microsoft based computers, for usage with averaged guitar pickups, at least suffers from the additional audio device latency. What is truly astounding is the product's low latency. The patent mentions an ideal FFT data block of around 95mS or 4096 samples at 44100Hz samplerate. But, I know what a 4096 sample delay feels like. It's long. The latency seems /much/ less than that in this product. It sure feels like magic. I've been playing it for two nights now and it really is fast and accurate. If I understand correctly the theory goes something like this: If you are looking for a dog in a picture, far better to compare with real pictures of dogs already stored than to only have a rough mathematical idea of what a dog should look like. Before I bought the Roland gear, I watched videos and read reviews. Roland seems to be the best solution at the moment, even combinations of a Roland GR-55 with piezo bridge pickups, instead of the Roland GK-3 seems to be less reliable. However, for several reasons it indeed would be nice, if the polyphonic tracking software, for usage with averaged guitar pickups would make progress. I highly advise to try the software. I found it amazing. There is talk of this software obsoleting using special pickups. I would tend to agree, it's pretty darn good. OTOH some kind of divided pickup build into modern guitars has got an advantage, too, since modeling makes a lot of progress. My new guitar additionally has got a Sustaniac driver. Ah, just looked that up. Similar to the famous e-bow hand-held sustainer? I use a novel approach: I 'sing' into my guitar neck, the neck touching my throat, which resonates the strings infinitely for as long as I can sing a note. IOW adding special pickups to guitars is not necessarily a disadvantage. Perhaps polyphonic tracking software, for usage with averaged guitar pickups, in combination with special pickups is interesting in the near future. Yeah that would be neat. Maybe someday all guitars will come with such pickups and standardized connections. From there, the sky's the limit on modeling and recognition. Tim. ___ Linux-audio-dev mailing list Linux-audio-dev@lists.linuxaudio.org https://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-dev
Re: [LAD] Polyphonic normal guitar to midi: Jam Origins' MIDI-Guitar
On Mon, Jun 25, 2018 at 4:31 PM, Tim wrote: > I read they use more than just spectral stuff. > Like AI used in speech recognition and so on. > > Amazing what DSP audio and image coding can do these days. > Any thoughts on coding techniques? I've read a lot of papers! > Some say using FFTs + auto-correlation comparisons. > Some say non-negative matrix. > My head spins, but this team definitely deserves praise. > Can open source come up with something? > Had I sufficient time I'd like to investigate using hidden markov models and turbo coding the way some speech recognition algorithms do. This could give you estimates of the key you are playing in and use that data to calculate the likelihood of various pitches etc etc. I suspect you could get some interesting results. I don't know of anyone really working on polyphonic pitch recognition in the open source world. I think Bayesian filtering of some kind though would be compelling. Perhaps some of the work from ISSE ( http://isse.sourceforge.net/) could be used and made realtime. _Spencer ___ Linux-audio-dev mailing list Linux-audio-dev@lists.linuxaudio.org https://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-dev
Re: [LAD] Polyphonic normal guitar to midi: Jam Origins' MIDI-Guitar
On Mon, 25 Jun 2018 18:31:12 -0400, Tim wrote: >Then I stumbled across this product, MIDI-Guitar from Jam Origins. For quite some time now, the free version is installed on my iPad, but I never tested it and meanwhile I've got two electric guitars with Roland GK-3 PUs and a Roland GR-55. Keep in mind that even the best polyphonic tracking done by software for Apple and Microsoft based computers, for usage with averaged guitar pickups, at least suffers from the additional audio device latency. Before I bought the Roland gear, I watched videos and read reviews. Roland seems to be the best solution at the moment, even combinations of a Roland GR-55 with piezo bridge pickups, instead of the Roland GK-3 seems to be less reliable. However, for several reasons it indeed would be nice, if the polyphonic tracking software, for usage with averaged guitar pickups would make progress. OTOH some kind of divided pickup build into modern guitars has got an advantage, too, since modeling makes a lot of progress. My new guitar additionally has got a Sustaniac driver. IOW adding special pickups to guitars is not necessarily a disadvantage. Perhaps polyphonic tracking software, for usage with averaged guitar pickups, in combination with special pickups is interesting in the near future. ___ Linux-audio-dev mailing list Linux-audio-dev@lists.linuxaudio.org https://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-dev
Re: [LAD] Polyphonic normal guitar to midi: Jam Origins' MIDI-Guitar
On 06/26/2018 02:44 AM, Bengt Gördén wrote: Den 2018-06-26 kl. 00:31, skrev Tim: I read they use more than just spectral stuff. Like AI used in speech recognition and so on. Amazing what DSP audio and image coding can do these days. Any thoughts on coding techniques? I've read a lot of papers! Some say using FFTs + auto-correlation comparisons. Some say non-negative matrix. From the abstract of the patent [1] [2] "An audio matching method, use of the method in a game system, an audio matching system and a data carrier are provided, where the audio matching method is for comparing an input audio fragment with reference audio fragment variants, the method being an incremental search method, including repeating the steps of: obtaining a number of reference audio fragments variants on the basis of one or more stored audio fragments from a reference storage; and comparing the input audio fragment against the number of reference audio fragment variants to determine a comparison result; whereby repetition of the steps is carried out a predetermined number of times or as long as the comparison result improves." SOS had a review of it 4 years ago [3] ref. [1] https://patentimages.storage.googleapis.com/93/f6/7b/30b78e5067b5e5/US20120132057A1.pdf [2] https://patents.google.com/patent/US20120132057A1/en [3] https://www.soundonsound.com/reviews/jam-origin-midi-guitar Cheers, Awesome. Thank you for that. I am always late to the party, but I can't help gushing over this thing since I have a special interest in it. Tim. ___ Linux-audio-dev mailing list Linux-audio-dev@lists.linuxaudio.org https://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-dev
[LAD] [ANN] Vee One Suite 0.9.1 - An Early Summer'18 Release
Hi! One more time and not the last! The 'Vee One Suite' of so called 'old-school' software instruments, synthv1 [1] as a polyphonic subtractive synthesizer, samplv1 [2] a polyphonic sampler synthesizer, drumkv1 [3] as yet another drum-kit sampler and padthv1 [4] as a polyphonic additive synthesizer, are here once again released just before the northern hot-season starts... For all you 'meridional' fans: don't ever take this as some kind of a disadvantage: you'll sure have it perfect and practice while northlings may go party and bust, whatever ;) Still available in the so called dual standard forms, for Linux anyway: - a pure stand-alone JACK client with JACK-session [5], NSM (Non Session management [6]) and both JACK MIDI and ALSA MIDI [7] input support; - a LV2 instrument plug-in [8]. The change for this joy-of-season goes as follows: - Loop crossfading and zero-crossing detection (the later being an old staple by default) are now set as brand new user options accessible from the main UI. (applies to samplv1 only [2]) - Fixed for some g++ >= 8.1.1 warnings and quietness. - Added LV2 UI X11 support option. - Disable reference micro-tuning settings when a Scala keyboard map override is in effect. Added "All files (*.*)" filter to every file requestor dialog, wherever missing. And now, in order of (chronological) appearance: **synthv1 - an old-school polyphonic synthesizer [1] ** synthv1 0.9.1 (early-summer'18) released! synthv1 is an old-school all-digital 4-oscillator subtractive polyphonic synthesizer with stereo fx. LV2 URI: http://synthv1.sourceforge.net/lv2 website: https://synthv1.sourceforge.io http://synthv1.sourceforge.net downloads: http://sourceforge.net/projects/synthv1/files - source tarball: http://download.sf.net/synthv1/synthv1-0.9.1.tar.gz - source package: http://download.sf.net/synthv1/synthv1-0.9.1-38.rncbc.suse.src.rpm - binary packages (openSUSE Tumbleweed): http://download.sf.net/synthv1/synthv1-0.9.1-38.rncbc.suse.x86_84.rpm - AppImage packages (JACK stand-alone only): http://download.sf.net/synthv1/synthv1-0.9.1-5.x86_64.AppImage git repos: http://git.code.sf.net/p/synthv1/code https://github.com/rncbc/synthv1.git https://gitlab.com/rncbc/synthv1.git https://bitbucket.org/rncbc/synthv1.git **samplv1 - an old-school polyphonic sampler [2]** samplv1 0.9.1 (early-summer'18) released! samplv1 is an old-school polyphonic sampler synthesizer with stereo fx. LV2 URI: http://samplv1.sourceforge.net/lv2 website: https://samplv1.sourceforge.io http://samplv1.sourceforge.net downloads: http://sourceforge.net/projects/samplv1/files - source tarball: http://download.sf.net/samplv1/samplv1-0.9.1.tar.gz - source package: http://download.sf.net/samplv1/samplv1-0.9.1-38.rncbc.suse.src.rpm - binary packages (openSUSE Tumbleweed): http://download.sf.net/samplv1/samplv1-0.9.1-38.rncbc.suse.x86_84.rpm - AppImage packages (JACK stand-alone only): http://download.sf.net/samplv1/samplv1-0.9.1-5.x86_64.AppImage git repos: http://git.code.sf.net/p/samplv1/code https://github.com/rncbc/samplv1.git https://gitlab.com/rncbc/samplv1.git https://bitbucket.org/rncbc/samplv1.git **drumkv1 - an old-school drum-kit sampler [3]** drumkv1 0.9.1 (early-summer'18) released! drumkv1 is an old-school drum-kit sampler synthesizer with stereo fx. LV2 URI: http://drumkv1.sourceforge.net/lv2 website: https://drumkv1.sourceforge.io http://drumkv1.sourceforge.net downloads: http://sourceforge.net/projects/drumkv1/files - source tarball: http://download.sf.net/drumkv1/drumkv1-0.9.1.tar.gz - source package: http://download.sf.net/drumkv1/drumkv1-0.9.1-34.rncbc.suse.src.rpm - binary packages (openSUSE Tumbleweed): http://download.sf.net/drumkv1/drumkv1-0.9.1-34.rncbc.suse.x86_84.rpm - AppImage packages (JACK stand-alone only): http://download.sf.net/drumkv1/drumkv1-0.9.1-5.x86_64.AppImage git repos: http://git.code.sf.net/p/drumkv1/code https://github.com/rncbc/drumkv1.git https://gitlab.com/rncbc/drumkv1.git https://bitbucket.org/rncbc/drumkv1.git **padthv1 - an old-school polyphonic additive synthesizer [4]** padthv1 0.9.1 (early-summer'18) released! padthv1 is an old-school polyphonic additive synthesizer with stereo fx padthv1 is based on the PADsynth algorithm by Paul Nasca, as a special variant of additive synthesis. LV2 URI: http://padthv1.sourceforge.net/lv2 website: http://padthv1.sourceforge.net https://padthv1.sourceforge.io downloads: http://sourceforge.net/projects/padthv1/files - source tarball: http://download.sf.net/padthv1/padthv1-0.9.1.tar.gz - source package: http://download.sf.net/padthv1/padthv1-0.9.1-5.rncbc.suse.src.rpm - binary packages (openSUSE Tumbleweed): http://download.sf.net/padthv1/padthv1-0.9.1-5.rncbc.suse.x86_84.rpm - AppImage packages (JACK stand-alone only): http://download.sf.net/padthv1/padthv1-0.9.1-5.x86_64.AppImage git repos:
Re: [LAD] Polyphonic normal guitar to midi: Jam Origins' MIDI-Guitar
Le Mon, 25 Jun 2018 18:31:12 -0400, Tim a écrit : > Hi list, some time ago a coder was asking about > making such an app. I think it's on github. > > Amazing what DSP audio and image coding can do these days. > Any thoughts on coding techniques? I've read a lot of papers! > Some say using FFTs + auto-correlation comparisons. > Some say non-negative matrix. > My head spins, but this team definitely deserves praise. > Can open source come up with something? To go fast and get a low enough latency, you can use can what time is between 2 consecutive peaks of the signal. Be aware than you would have to smooth the signal because when playing loud and the strings are touching the frets, the harmonic content become so weird you can get false maximums (as seen by a signal analysis of my electrical guitar with a memory oscilloscope), which will give you a much higher fundamental frequency than expected. Normal signal: * * * * * * * * * * ** ** * ** * * * * * *=*=*=* * * * * ** ** * * * * * * * * * * Fretted signal: * * * * * ** * * ** * * * * * * * * * * * * ** * * * * * *=*=*=* * * * * ** ** * * * * * * * * * * These double peaks can be very huge as an electrical guitar have a huge dynamic during the attack of the notes. Doing a repetitive arithmetic average calculation when the sampling are coming in must be enough to smooth them in real time, and to get ride of other high order harmonics at the same time. The latency will be dependant of the fundamental frequency, something like one period + trigger delay. Cheers, Dom > > Cheers, Tim. > ___ > Linux-audio-dev mailing list > Linux-audio-dev@lists.linuxaudio.org > https://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-dev -- If you have a problem and you are not doing anything to fix it, you are at the heart of the problem. ___ Linux-audio-dev mailing list Linux-audio-dev@lists.linuxaudio.org https://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-dev
Re: [LAD] Polyphonic normal guitar to midi: Jam Origins' MIDI-Guitar
Den 2018-06-26 kl. 00:31, skrev Tim: > > I read they use more than just spectral stuff. > Like AI used in speech recognition and so on. > Amazing what DSP audio and image coding can do these days. > Any thoughts on coding techniques? I've read a lot of papers! > Some say using FFTs + auto-correlation comparisons. > Some say non-negative matrix. From the abstract of the patent [1] [2] "An audio matching method, use of the method in a game system, an audio matching system and a data carrier are provided, where the audio matching method is for comparing an input audio fragment with reference audio fragment variants, the method being an incremental search method, including repeating the steps of: obtaining a number of reference audio fragments variants on the basis of one or more stored audio fragments from a reference storage; and comparing the input audio fragment against the number of reference audio fragment variants to determine a comparison result; whereby repetition of the steps is carried out a predetermined number of times or as long as the comparison result improves." SOS had a review of it 4 years ago [3] ref. [1] https://patentimages.storage.googleapis.com/93/f6/7b/30b78e5067b5e5/US20120132057A1.pdf [2] https://patents.google.com/patent/US20120132057A1/en [3] https://www.soundonsound.com/reviews/jam-origin-midi-guitar Cheers, -- /bengan ___ Linux-audio-dev mailing list Linux-audio-dev@lists.linuxaudio.org https://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-dev
