Re: [WSG] onKeyPress or not onKeyPress
Derek Featherstone wrote: On 5/9/06, Jan Brasna wrote: early builds of Safari on Jaguar might have exhibited a failure to execute onclick with the keyboard. I remember something similar, be it an old Safari or some wacky Netscape, don't really know. I'd say it's not an active issue anymore. Jan - agreed, wholeheartedly. However, if we can pinpoint user agent compliance and/or non-compliance, we can make a much better case for ignoring some of the outdated guidelines. Using Safari with user-agent string: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC Mac OS X; en) AppleWebKit/312.b(KHTML, like Gecko)Safari/312.6 No event is triggered by tabbing to a link with the onkeypress paired with an onclick event handler in Al's test page. Behavior consistent with that expected of an onblur event occurs. For example in Al's test page when 'test this link' loses focus, the content is revealed /not/, as should be the case, when a key is pressed with the link having focus. [Mac OSX 10.2.9 / Safari 1.3.2(v312.6)] -Jon ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] onKeyPress or not onKeyPress
Katrina wrote: I am currently reading a book called 'DOM Scripting' by Jeremy Keith. In it, the author suggests not to use onKeyPress as it can lead to accessibility issues when users are tabbing past those elements with that eventHandler. But at the same time it remains recommended to add both. HTML Techniques for Web Content Accessibility Guidelines 1.0 http://www.w3.org/TR/WCAG10-HTML-TECHS/#directly-accessible-scripts. The problem is that onkeypress is not a direct equivalent of onclick. The proper, device independent handler would be onactivate (which, if I remember correctly, is part of the DOM events, but not part of the HTML spec and only supported in IE, of all browsers). Suggests that tabbing through may cause accessibility issues http://webstandardsgroup.org/manage/archive.cfm?uid=BAC0AC1F-FFCB-6022-5ECD34D2CF16F906 Yup, that's correct. In principle, it seems right that even hitting TAB should trigger an onkeypress...it's a key, after all; however, this cause issues as noted. Suggests writing a function that tests for TABbing because Mac browsers don't treat onClick in a device independent way. http://webstandardsgroup.org/manage/archive.cfm?uid=BAC115E5-AA7E-1E4F-82E6DE89F699ED80 Safari does indeed seem to be the only current web browser which doesn't generate an onclick event via the keyboard - anything else treats a keyboard activation (e.g. hitting enter when the focus is on a link, for instance) as onclick. Is the recommendation to use onKeyPress and testing for certain keys to prevent the TAB activating some onKeyPress code? So, to accommodate Safari, you should consider using a custom function that only gets triggered if the user has hit enter etc (i.e. not indiscriminately firing for every keypress). Another technique (if you're applying this to links) could be to programmatically change the href to a javascript pseduo-protocol via the DOM on page load...this will then be fired when the link is activated, no matter how (mouse, keyboard, etc). Purists will frown at this (although I myself frown at the need to write our own event handler, just because Safari doesn't follow the de-facto standard...even Netscape 4 triggers onclick via the keyboard, if I remember correctly...so why not Safari?) P -- Patrick H. Lauke __ re·dux (adj.): brought back; returned. used postpositively [latin : re-, re- + dux, leader; see duke.] www.splintered.co.uk | www.photographia.co.uk http://redux.deviantart.com __ Web Standards Project (WaSP) Accessibility Task Force http://webstandards.org/ __ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] onKeyPress or not onKeyPress
From: Katrina [EMAIL PROTECTED] I am currently reading a book called 'DOM Scripting' by Jeremy Keith. In it, the author suggests not to use onKeyPress as it can lead to accessibility issues when users are tabbing past those elements with that eventHandler. I would (and do) avoid onKeyPress. Most people I observe using it, do so because they have onclick events embedded and when they run the page through an automated accessibility checker it throws an error :-) As you've gathered, onkeypress wreaks havoc with people's expectations when using the tab key. In 99% of the browsers on the market, the Enter key will fire an onclick. In some modern browsers, onkeypress will prevent the Enter key from behaving as one would expect it. -- Al Sparber PVII http://www.projectseven.com Designing with CSS is sometimes like barreling down a crumbling mountain road at 90 miles per hour secure in the knowledge that repairs are scheduled for next Tuesday. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] onKeyPress or not onKeyPress
On 5/9/06, Patrick H. Lauke wrote: Safari does indeed seem to be the only current web browser which doesn't generate an onclick event via the keyboard - anything else treats a keyboard activation (e.g. hitting enter when the focus is on a link, for instance) as onclick. Patrick - I just want to clarify this piece of information here. Is there a specific version of Safari that does this, or do you have documented test cases? I've got scripts that respond without fail to the onclick in Safari, so I'd like to try and delve a little deeper. I'm running the latest version of Safari 2.0.3 Cheers, Derek. -- Derek Featherstone [EMAIL PROTECTED] tel: 613-599-9784 1-866-932-4878 (toll-free in North America) Web Development: http://www.furtherahead.com Personal:http://www.boxofchocolates.ca ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] onKeyPress or not onKeyPress
Quoting Derek Featherstone [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Patrick - I just want to clarify this piece of information here. Is there a specific version of Safari that does this, or do you have documented test cases? I've got scripts that respond without fail to the onclick in Safari, so I'd like to try and delve a little deeper. I'm running the latest version of Safari 2.0.3 Sorry, my reply was based on a bit of research that I never got around to collating properly carried out over a year ago. It's well possible that more current versions of Saf finally fire onclick even following keyboard activation, which then makes this point fairly moot (unless you need to support older versions of Safari, of course) Will fire up my BrowserCam remote access and double-triple-check tonight. P -- Patrick H. Lauke __ re·dux (adj.): brought back; returned. used postpositively [latin : re-, re- + dux, leader; see duke.] www.splintered.co.uk | www.photographia.co.uk http://redux.deviantart.com __ Web Standards Project (WaSP) Accessibility Task Force http://webstandards.org/ __ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] onKeyPress or not onKeyPress
From: Derek Featherstone [EMAIL PROTECTED] Test this page for yourself: http://www.projectseven.com/testing/keypress/ -- Al Sparber PVII http://www.projectseven.com Designing with CSS is sometimes like barreling down a crumbling mountain road at 90 miles per hour secure in the knowledge that repairs are scheduled for next Tuesday. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] onKeyPress or not onKeyPress
From: Derek Featherstone [EMAIL PROTECTED] Test this page for yourself: http://www.projectseven.com/testing/keypress/ Thanks for the test case, Al... that wasn't my point though. I was looking for documented cases where Safari didn't work with onclick. I *know* that it works just fine with my current version of Safari. I'm looking for history that shows where it didn't in the past. Ah. We upgraded all of our Macs to Panther and Tiger, but, if memory serves, early builds of Safari on Jaguar might have exhibited a failure to execute onclick with the keyboard. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] onKeyPress or not onKeyPress
early builds of Safari on Jaguar might have exhibited a failure to execute onclick with the keyboard. I remember something similar, be it an old Safari or some wacky Netscape, don't really know. I'd say it's not an active issue anymore. -- Jan Brasna :: www.alphanumeric.cz | www.janbrasna.com | www.wdnews.net ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] onKeyPress or not onKeyPress
On 5/9/06, Jan Brasna wrote: early builds of Safari on Jaguar might have exhibited a failure to execute onclick with the keyboard. I remember something similar, be it an old Safari or some wacky Netscape, don't really know. I'd say it's not an active issue anymore. Jan - agreed, wholeheartedly. However, if we can pinpoint user agent compliance and/or non-compliance, we can make a much better case for ignoring some of the outdated guidelines. Cheers, Derek. -- Derek Featherstone [EMAIL PROTECTED] tel: 613-599-9784 1-866-932-4878 (toll-free in North America) Web Development: http://www.furtherahead.com Personal:http://www.boxofchocolates.ca ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] onKeyPress or not onKeyPress
Gday, I am currently reading a book called 'DOM Scripting' by Jeremy Keith. In it, the author suggests not to use onKeyPress as it can lead to accessibility issues when users are tabbing past those elements with that eventHandler. But at the same time it remains recommended to add both. HTML Techniques for Web Content Accessibility Guidelines 1.0 http://www.w3.org/TR/WCAG10-HTML-TECHS/#directly-accessible-scripts. (I am having a hard time trying to resolve both.) But going through list archives, I find that certain posts Suggests that tabbing through may cause accessibility issues http://webstandardsgroup.org/manage/archive.cfm?uid=BAC0AC1F-FFCB-6022-5ECD34D2CF16F906 Suggests writing a function that tests for TABbing because Mac browsers don't treat onClick in a device independent way. http://webstandardsgroup.org/manage/archive.cfm?uid=BAC115E5-AA7E-1E4F-82E6DE89F699ED80 Suggests using onKeyPress http://webstandardsgroup.org/manage/archive.cfm?uid=F40C2D16-D963-2946-32B3E0B81A16ADCA As Dan Cederholm writes, there are decisions, and better decisions. I would like to make an informed decision about the uses and consequences of these event handlers. Is the recommendation to use onKeyPress and testing for certain keys to prevent the TAB activating some onKeyPress code? Kat ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
