Re: Someone needs to take jwz aside...
On Wed, Apr 27, 2011 at 8:17 PM, Pedro Figueiredo wrote: > If only it knew how to manage a Shipwright vessel... > So, I was gonna ask. Does Shipwright do most of what "we" like about Maven? Would it be that hard to define a list of modules, a Perl version, and let something driving Perlbrew just get stuck in to it? I could see that being an issue for mod_perl apps, but for other stuff? Some Perl modules need compiling, which again, throws a spanner in the works, but...? -P
Re: Junior-mid level Perl
On 27/04/2011 22:48, Dirk Koopman wrote: On 27/04/11 22:31, Pedro Figueiredo wrote: On 27 Apr 2011, at 18:08, Dave Hodgkinson wrote: On 27 Apr 2011, at 16:55, Pedro Figueiredo wrote: On 27 Apr 2011, at 16:18, Paul Makepeace wrote: Also: geek-operated mojito bars in the caribbean. Ten years ago I considered opening a margarita bar on a deserted beach in Thailand, but couldn't find such thing. Would gladly consider mojitos, perhaps serve margaritas in the morning when you need to replenish the salt reserves, and switch to mojitos in the afternoon, as the sugar would keep you going. MAGIC ALCOHOLIC DIET!! And lime for vitamin C. I was just thinking that surely a Bloody Mary is 1 of your 5-a-day. Stick a big celery stick in there (and maybe a sprinkle of celery salt) and you've got at least two. Do you need to eat the vegetable for it to count? Only in a 250ml serving. Less than that and, I reckon you've got a shooter. Uncle Billy recommends Hawksmoor Shoreditch's bottomless bloody mary (if they're still doing it). If you can drink three glasses and eat one of their breakfasts then you are better than I. --billy -- http://bbblog.org.uk
Re: Junior-mid level Perl
Pedro Figueiredo wrote: > I was just thinking that surely a Bloody Mary is 1 of your 5-a-day. How about sloe gin? -- Aaron Crane ** http://aaroncrane.co.uk/
Re: Junior-mid level Perl (Victoria Conlan)
> "YS" == Yitzchak Scott-Thoennes writes: YS> On Wed, Apr 27, 2011 at 3:19 PM, Victoria Conlan wrote: >>> Specifically, it must be butter. No butter, no shortbread. >> >> I've found that vegan buttery-style margarine is >> acceptable. Especially if you replace half of the flour with >> ground almonds. Pop over, I'll make you it some time. YS> Here in the US, most of the margarine has dairy ingredients, YS> especially the more buttery tasting ones. YMMV. there are several quality margarine products that are vegan. earth balance is one we use. definitely good enough for many butter replacement apps. and we use butter too so we can compare. uri -- Uri Guttman -- u...@stemsystems.com http://www.sysarch.com -- - Perl Code Review , Architecture, Development, Training, Support -- - Gourmet Hot Cocoa Mix http://bestfriendscocoa.com -
Re: Junior-mid level Perl (Victoria Conlan)
On Wed, Apr 27, 2011 at 3:19 PM, Victoria Conlan wrote: >> Specifically, it must be butter. No butter, no shortbread. > > I've found that vegan buttery-style margarine is acceptable. Especially if > you replace half of the flour with ground almonds. Pop over, I'll make you > it some time. Here in the US, most of the margarine has dairy ingredients, especially the more buttery tasting ones. YMMV.
Re: Junior-mid level Perl (Victoria Conlan)
Vegan shortbread? WTH. The short(ening) agent in Short Bread = fat. Specifically, it must be butter. No butter, no shortbread. I've found that vegan buttery-style margarine is acceptable. Especially if you replace half of the flour with ground almonds. Pop over, I'll make you it some time.
Re: Junior-mid level Perl
On 27/04/11 22:31, Pedro Figueiredo wrote: On 27 Apr 2011, at 18:08, Dave Hodgkinson wrote: On 27 Apr 2011, at 16:55, Pedro Figueiredo wrote: On 27 Apr 2011, at 16:18, Paul Makepeace wrote: Also: geek-operated mojito bars in the caribbean. Ten years ago I considered opening a margarita bar on a deserted beach in Thailand, but couldn't find such thing. Would gladly consider mojitos, perhaps serve margaritas in the morning when you need to replenish the salt reserves, and switch to mojitos in the afternoon, as the sugar would keep you going. MAGIC ALCOHOLIC DIET!! And lime for vitamin C. I was just thinking that surely a Bloody Mary is 1 of your 5-a-day. Only in a 250ml serving.
Re: Junior-mid level Perl
On 27 Apr 2011, at 18:08, Dave Hodgkinson wrote: > > On 27 Apr 2011, at 16:55, Pedro Figueiredo wrote: > >> On 27 Apr 2011, at 16:18, Paul Makepeace wrote: >> >>> >>> Also: geek-operated mojito bars in the caribbean. >> >> Ten years ago I considered opening a margarita bar on a deserted beach in >> Thailand, but couldn't find such thing. >> >> Would gladly consider mojitos, perhaps serve margaritas in the morning when >> you need to replenish the salt reserves, and switch to mojitos in the >> afternoon, as the sugar would keep you going. MAGIC ALCOHOLIC DIET!! >> > > And lime for vitamin C. I was just thinking that surely a Bloody Mary is 1 of your 5-a-day. >
Re: Junior-mid level Perl (Victoria Conlan)
On 27/04/11 21:58, Sue Spence wrote: On 27 April 2011 19:54, Dirk Koopman wrote: On 27/04/11 13:00, Sue Spence wrote: On 27 April 2011 12:49, Victoria Conlanwrote: I still favour getting the hell out of IT and setting up a tea shop, though. (tea and cakes at my place when I do so!) Victoria(n) sponge cakes? But of course! I also do a pretty nifty chocolate fudge cake, and a hugely calorific sachertorte, plus very nice vegan shortbread. I am going to get s fat. :-) Vegan shortbread? WTH. The short(ening) agent in Short Bread = fat. Specifically, it must be butter. No butter, no shortbread. Actually LARD works even better (as shortening), but then a) it would not taste the same and b) is arguably even less vegan. So what is Vegan shortbread then? Dirk
Re: Junior-mid level Perl (Victoria Conlan)
On 27 April 2011 19:54, Dirk Koopman wrote: > On 27/04/11 13:00, Sue Spence wrote: >> >> On 27 April 2011 12:49, Victoria Conlan wrote: >>> > I still favour getting the hell out of IT and setting up a tea shop, > though. > (tea and cakes at my place when I do so!) Victoria(n) sponge cakes? >>> >>> But of course! I also do a pretty nifty chocolate fudge cake, and a >>> hugely >>> calorific sachertorte, plus very nice vegan shortbread. >>> >>> I am going to get s fat. :-) >>> >> >> Vegan shortbread? WTH. >> >> > > The short(ening) agent in Short Bread = fat. > Specifically, it must be butter. No butter, no shortbread.
Re: Junior-mid level Perl (Victoria Conlan)
On 27/04/11 13:00, Sue Spence wrote: On 27 April 2011 12:49, Victoria Conlan wrote: I still favour getting the hell out of IT and setting up a tea shop, though. (tea and cakes at my place when I do so!) Victoria(n) sponge cakes? But of course! I also do a pretty nifty chocolate fudge cake, and a hugely calorific sachertorte, plus very nice vegan shortbread. I am going to get s fat. :-) Vegan shortbread? WTH. The short(ening) agent in Short Bread = fat. Dirk
Re: Junior-mid level Perl
Also: geek-operated mojito bars in the caribbean. Having just returned from a slightly overly rich-Americans-taking-over kind of trip to St.Lucia (got a bit fed up with "no, we're not rich American tourists, we can't afford to pay you 20 dollars just to take a rope and tie the boat to a bouy for me!" type arguments), I can tell you exactly where to build it. (Just as you come out of Rodney Bay, turn left, very nice white sand beach with lots of afore-mentioned Americans and American bars and hotels, and at the very /far/ end of the beach it gets a bit grubby and there are lots of locals ... and AnnaMarie's food shack type place. Scary lady, very relaxed serving and eating, pretty reasonably priced and she probably wouldn't mind the geeky competition. Although if you check the place out, do try out the spiced rum!)
Re: Junior-mid level Perl
On 27 Apr 2011, at 16:55, Pedro Figueiredo wrote: > On 27 Apr 2011, at 16:18, Paul Makepeace wrote: > >> >> Also: geek-operated mojito bars in the caribbean. > > Ten years ago I considered opening a margarita bar on a deserted beach in > Thailand, but couldn't find such thing. > > Would gladly consider mojitos, perhaps serve margaritas in the morning when > you need to replenish the salt reserves, and switch to mojitos in the > afternoon, as the sugar would keep you going. MAGIC ALCOHOLIC DIET!! > And lime for vitamin C.
Re: Someone needs to take jwz aside...
On Wed, Apr 20, 2011 at 5:05 AM, Simon Cozens wrote:
> On 20/04/2011 09:40, Dave Hodgkinson wrote:
> > Or does he have a point?
>
> He completely has a point. CPAN developers right now seem to have a strong
> predilection for throwing the kitchen sink into modules that really don't
> need
> it. ("You want to parse dates, you use DateTime." Um, no, not necessarily.)
> And certainly Moose is not the only way to do object orientation.
>
That's right. If you want OO, you can always use a real programming
language.
Re: Junior-mid level Perl
On 27 Apr 2011, at 16:18, Paul Makepeace wrote: > > Also: geek-operated mojito bars in the caribbean. Ten years ago I considered opening a margarita bar on a deserted beach in Thailand, but couldn't find such thing. Would gladly consider mojitos, perhaps serve margaritas in the morning when you need to replenish the salt reserves, and switch to mojitos in the afternoon, as the sugar would keep you going. MAGIC ALCOHOLIC DIET!! Cheers, Pedro
Re: Junior-mid level Perl
On 27 April 2011 16:18, Paul Makepeace wrote: > On Wed, Apr 27, 2011 at 11:30, Sue Spence wrote: >> On 27 April 2011 11:15, Victoria Conlan wrote: >>> >>> >>> I still favour getting the hell out of IT and setting up a tea shop, though. >>> (tea and cakes at my place when I do so!) >>> >> >> Where? I'll be right over. :) > > Seriously :) > > Also: geek-operated mojito bars in the caribbean. > Ooh. I didn't even know I needed one of those until just now.
Re: Junior-mid level Perl
On Wed, Apr 27, 2011 at 11:30, Sue Spence wrote: > On 27 April 2011 11:15, Victoria Conlan wrote: >> >> >> I still favour getting the hell out of IT and setting up a tea shop, though. >> (tea and cakes at my place when I do so!) >> > > Where? I'll be right over. :) Seriously :) Also: geek-operated mojito bars in the caribbean. P
Re: Xcode 4.0.2 and XS modules
a. No, they were paying me to develop a test suite... b. Because I wouldn't want to be sued by ... oh, that was close ;-) b.b. Probably spent too long "south of the border". c. I agree, but this is the usual case of them developing for windoze and exploder and not giving a flying f*** about the rest of the planet. The usual short term thinking that gives software development a bad name. Ciao Richard -- Richard Foley Ciao - shorter than AufWiederSehen! http://www.rfi.net/books.html > On Wed, Apr 27, 2011 at 11:43:36AM +0200, Richard Foley wrote: > > This sounds similar to the response I got when reporting a number of bugs > > in released software at a company which shall remain nameless. The > > suggested fix > > > > was for me to: > > "change your operating system"... > > > > There's really no (polite) answer to that. > > a: Had you previously paid them money for this software? > > b: why are you still being nice enough not to name and shame them, so that >they get the reputation, mindshare and customer base that they deserve? >You're usually far more "Yorkshire" than that. Is Munich slowly changing >you? :-) > > because it's sounding very much like they *don't* actually "support" the > operating system that you were trying to use, so it would be better if > their lies on this matter were public to avoid other people having the > same problems that you did. > > Nicholas Clark
Re: Junior-mid level Perl
> I still favour getting the hell out of IT and setting up a tea shop, > though. (tea and cakes at my place when I do so!) > Sounds better than coffee and cake, that's for sure! -- Ciao Richard -- Richard Foley Ciao - shorter than AufWiederSehen! http://www.rfi.net/books.html > > There's enough of a demand for Perl devs in London that a lot of > > companies that are looking to hire in that space are willing to hire > > people with OO-PHP/Python experience. > > That's good to hear. I'm alternating between excitement and terror at the > prospect of being back on the job market. :-/ > I still favour getting the hell out of IT and setting up a tea shop, > though. (tea and cakes at my place when I do so!)
Re: Someone needs to take jwz aside...
On 27 Apr 2011, at 13:51, Andy Armstrong wrote: > > http://www.sonatype.com/books/mvnref-book/reference/pom-relationships-sect-project-dependencies.html As far as dependency management goes. It does so much more than that. I'd go for the "by example" book for a quick overview, and then use the reference to find more details: http://www.sonatype.com/books.html Also, http://maven.apache.org/users/index.html and http://maven.apache.org/plugins/index.html <--- there be gold in them hills! These days I manage everything with Maven, from Java apps to a Map/Reduce framework to shell scripts and presentations, and obviously our CI. It's removed so much hassle from my work day I'm even glad to put up with it sometimes having to download half of the internet. If only it knew how to manage a Shipwright vessel...
Re: Someone needs to take jwz aside...
On 27 Apr 2011, at 13:29, Pedro Figueiredo wrote: >> In my limited BBC experience, mvn just pulls freshest everything down >> from the repo... > > No, it pulls whatever you tell it to pull. This explains the gist of what Maven does. http://www.sonatype.com/books/mvnref-book/reference/pom-relationships-sect-project-dependencies.html -- Andy Armstrong, Hexten
Re: Someone needs to take jwz aside...
On 27 Apr 2011, at 13:15, Dave Hodgkinson wrote: > > On 27 Apr 2011, at 13:02, Nicholas Clark wrote: >> >> Which makes me ask the same question. How is Java doing it "right"? > > > In my limited BBC experience, mvn just pulls freshest everything down > from the repo... No, it pulls whatever you tell it to pull.
Re: Someone needs to take jwz aside...
On 27 Apr 2011, at 13:02, Nicholas Clark wrote: > > The issues seem to be dependency management and code reuse. > > How is Java solving these in ways that Perl is failing at? > > It's not automating the (to some degree necessary) bureaucratic > permission-gaining exercises. So what is it doing differently? > >From my point of view, when we decide to update a dependency, run the tests, >get Ops approval, have run it on a few live servers, etc (the whole >bureaucratic process), all I have to do is update or add the dependency >information in the POM file: mysql mysql-connector-java 5.1.13 compile I would either add this block, if it's a new dependency, or change the version number. Then I would run 'mvn deploy' and go have a coffee. Ops aren't even involved in this other than to deploy the new package (a single file) to live and having given their amen to the results of the previous testing. Cheers, Pedro
Re: Someone needs to take jwz aside...
On 27 Apr 2011, at 13:02, Nicholas Clark wrote: > > Which makes me ask the same question. How is Java doing it "right"? In my limited BBC experience, mvn just pulls freshest everything down from the repo...
Re: Junior-mid level Perl (Victoria Conlan)
On 27 Apr 2011, at 13:00, Sue Spence wrote: > Vegan shortbread? WTH. Short vegans and a touch of Fee-Fi-Fo-Fum? Nigel. -- [ Nigel Metheringham -- ni...@dotdot.it ] [ Ellipsis Intangible Technologies ]
Re: Junior-mid level Perl (Victoria Conlan)
On 27 Apr 2011, at 12:49, Victoria Conlan wrote: > >>> I still favour getting the hell out of IT and setting up a tea shop, though. >>> (tea and cakes at my place when I do so!) >> Victoria(n) sponge cakes? > > But of course! I also do a pretty nifty chocolate fudge cake, and a hugely > calorific sachertorte, plus very nice vegan shortbread. > > I am going to get s fat. :-) Nail a good cheesecake an I'm there. Had a GREAT one in Primrose Hill the other day...
Re: Someone needs to take jwz aside...
On Wed, Apr 20, 2011 at 11:59:33AM +0100, Peter Edwards wrote: > I had problems installing deps on some antique POS server combined with > bureaucracy putting me off building my own perl. > And to be honest, why would I wade through bureaucratic permission-gaining > exercises when 30 lines of code did the job. > You'll also note that on a stock company install of Redhat 5.5 last week the > Moosified version failed to install without my upgrading lwp manually. > > Go ahead and write CPAN modules requiring perl 5.12 and up to date Moose > then watch organisations throw Perl out the window and replace it with Java. > Like I'm seeing right now because they end up stuck requiring particular > versions of libraries to work and rolling upgrades are not company policy or > are politically inexpedient. > You can get away that if you're running it on your Macbook or in a small > central team, good luck on a large corporate platform. The issues seem to be dependency management and code reuse. How is Java solving these in ways that Perl is failing at? It's not automating the (to some degree necessary) bureaucratic permission-gaining exercises. So what is it doing differently? On Wed, Apr 20, 2011 at 12:27:30PM +0100, Andy Armstrong wrote: > On 20 Apr 2011, at 12:05, Jason Clifford wrote: > > So how are you handling the requirement to maintain the code doing what > > those many modules do? > > > > If you are not using a modular approach does that have any impact upon > > the TCO of maintaining the systems you are deploying? > > Short answer: we're writing most of our new services in Java with a toolchain > that makes a lot of dependency management problems go away :) Which makes me ask the same question. How is Java doing it "right"? Nicholas Clark
Re: Junior-mid level Perl (Victoria Conlan)
On 27 April 2011 12:49, Victoria Conlan wrote: > >>> I still favour getting the hell out of IT and setting up a tea shop, >>> though. >>> (tea and cakes at my place when I do so!) >> >> Victoria(n) sponge cakes? > > But of course! I also do a pretty nifty chocolate fudge cake, and a hugely > calorific sachertorte, plus very nice vegan shortbread. > > I am going to get s fat. :-) > Vegan shortbread? WTH.
Re: Junior-mid level Perl (Victoria Conlan)
I still favour getting the hell out of IT and setting up a tea shop, though. (tea and cakes at my place when I do so!) Victoria(n) sponge cakes? But of course! I also do a pretty nifty chocolate fudge cake, and a hugely calorific sachertorte, plus very nice vegan shortbread. I am going to get s fat. :-)
Re: Junior-mid level Perl (Victoria Conlan)
On 27 April 2011 11:15, Victoria Conlan wrote: > I still favour getting the hell out of IT and setting up a tea shop, though. > (tea and cakes at my place when I do so!) Victoria(n) sponge cakes?
Re: Xcode 4.0.2 and XS modules
On Wed, Apr 27, 2011 at 11:43:36AM +0200, Richard Foley wrote: > This sounds similar to the response I got when reporting a number of bugs in > released software at a company which shall remain nameless. The suggested > fix > was for me to: > > "change your operating system"... > > There's really no (polite) answer to that. a: Had you previously paid them money for this software? b: why are you still being nice enough not to name and shame them, so that they get the reputation, mindshare and customer base that they deserve? You're usually far more "Yorkshire" than that. Is Munich slowly changing you? :-) because it's sounding very much like they *don't* actually "support" the operating system that you were trying to use, so it would be better if their lies on this matter were public to avoid other people having the same problems that you did. Nicholas Clark
Re: Junior-mid level Perl
On 27 April 2011 11:15, Victoria Conlan wrote: > >> There's enough of a demand for Perl devs in London that a lot of companies >> that are looking to hire in that space are willing to hire people with >> OO-PHP/Python experience. > > That's good to hear. I'm alternating between excitement and terror at the > prospect of being back on the job market. :-/ > > I still favour getting the hell out of IT and setting up a tea shop, though. > (tea and cakes at my place when I do so!) > Where? I'll be right over. :)
Re: Junior-mid level Perl
There's enough of a demand for Perl devs in London that a lot of companies that are looking to hire in that space are willing to hire people with OO-PHP/Python experience. That's good to hear. I'm alternating between excitement and terror at the prospect of being back on the job market. :-/ I still favour getting the hell out of IT and setting up a tea shop, though. (tea and cakes at my place when I do so!)
Re: Junior-mid level Perl - and London Perl Jobs
We have two mailing lists for Perl jobs... http://london.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/jobs is the London.pm jobs mailing list - please post job specs / details here (archive: http://london.pm.org/pipermail/jobs/ to see examples of job specs) http://london.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/jobs-discuss also exists for job discussions (this is not archived) Also check out http://jobs.perl.org/ Cheers Leo
Re: Xcode 4.0.2 and XS modules
This sounds similar to the response I got when reporting a number of bugs in released software at a company which shall remain nameless. The suggested fix was for me to: "change your operating system"... There's really no (polite) answer to that. Ciao Richard -- Richard Foley Ciao - shorter than AufWiederSehen! http://www.rfi.net/books.html > Ah. So _this_ is what fucked jwz.
Re: Junior-mid level Perl
My employer is looking for a Perl dev at the moment, and has been so for six months. Apparently Perl skills are actually fairly hard to find at the moment I think the job spec calls for "a technology generalist with Perl skills" , but databases and Python wouldn't go far amiss. Details if you ask me via off list email Dominic Sent from my iPad On 26 Apr 2011, at 16:04, Mike Whiting wrote: > > > Looking for an opportunity to cross-train to Perl. > > Please find my CV here: http://mikew.co/resume > > Thanks >
Re: Xcode 4.0.2 and XS modules
On 26 April 2011 13:24, Simon Cozens wrote: > On 23/04/2011 13:46, Sue Spence wrote: >>> Beyond installing my own Perl >> >> Do this. Best to ignore the system Perl IMO. > > I don't get it. I've never used anything other than system Perl all the time > I've been using OS X, and I don't recall any problems. (Of course, that may be > the RDF talking.) In fact, I get annoyed with things like macports/fink/etc > that won't accept system Perl (or system X11) and try and do their own thing, > and have since switched to homebrew, which seems to get a lot right. > I may have slightly overstated the case. If what you have is working for you, great. It clearly wasn't doing the job for Simon. I have a tendency to want a) specific version(s) of Perl, usually due to CPAN dependencies, but not always b) better certainty that it will not be disturbed by Apple I install and manage my own versions of other software too, for much the same reasons.
Re: Junior-mid level Perl
That's good to hear. All I ever hear in the new-projects-arena from management is everything is being replaced with Java. Although I am still gainfully employed contract-to-contract as a Perl developer and have been for a number of years, there seems to be this constant undercurrent of "it's a dead language". *WE* might know that's not true, but the "word on the street" is different, and it's the (maybe technical) managers who decide what language to use most of the time. Having said that, it seems as though it's getting harder to find good perl developers, or at least that's what the agencies tell me, maybe that's a good thing in some ways in the short term (for me), but it's not so good in the long term (for us), imho. The other day I heard of a new Perl project replacing an old Java project - that was a nice noise indeed. Ciao Richard -- Richard Foley Ciao - shorter than AufWiederSehen! http://www.rfi.net/books.html > There's enough of a demand for Perl devs in London that a lot of companies > that are looking to hire in that space are willing to hire people with > OO-PHP/Python experience. > > Katie
Re: Junior-mid level Perl
On 04/27/2011 09:07 AM, Katie T wrote: On Tue, Apr 26, 2011 at 5:04 PM, Mike Whiting wrote: Looking for an opportunity to cross-train to Perl. Please find my CV here: http://mikew.co/resume Checkout: http://www.coderstack.co.uk/perl-jobs There's enough of a demand for Perl devs in London that a lot of companies that are looking to hire in that space are willing to hire people with OO-PHP/Python experience. /me sees lots of cross-training potential in his future :-) Dave...
Re: Junior-mid level Perl
On Tue, Apr 26, 2011 at 5:04 PM, Mike Whiting wrote: > > > Looking for an opportunity to cross-train to Perl. > > Please find my CV here: http://mikew.co/resume > > Checkout: http://www.coderstack.co.uk/perl-jobs There's enough of a demand for Perl devs in London that a lot of companies that are looking to hire in that space are willing to hire people with OO-PHP/Python experience. Katie -- CoderStack http://www.coderstack.co.uk The Software Developer Job Board
