Re: How Perl Saved the Human Genome Project
On Sep 1, 2012 2:47 PM, "Adrian Howard" wrote: > > > On 1 Sep 2012, at 20:22, "Jones, Chris" wrote: > > > Its an old article - but interesting. But one bit I really don't like is Lincoln's comment; > > > > "Because Perl is quick and dirty….." > > > > That's just silly. > > But Perl can be quick and dirty... it's just not *all* it can be :) Right. It's just a reasonably valid stereotype. :)
Re: Can I get some advice on best way to start Perl Programming
> "Paul" == Paul Makepeace writes: Paul> You don't say specifically Perl so I'm going to suggest a similar language: Paul> An excellent start to get your feet wet that takes about 15 minutes, Paul> is quite fun, and you actually do some programming without having to Paul> set everything up on your computer is, http://tryruby.org/ You can try perl 4 too... -- Eden CardimSoftware sob medida +55 11 9644 8225 Gestão de projetos de software ed...@insoli.deGestão de servidores e bancos de dados Treinamento em soluções Open Source Insolide Soluções de TI Ltda. Converse conosco a respeito de como nossas http://insoli.de soluções podem ajudar o seu projeto ou empresa
Re: Can I get some advice on best way to start Perl Programming
i'm not sure which books to start with. i think i started with Learning Perl. Do you speak any other programming language? Are you familiar with Object Oriented programming? I strongly recommend Perl Best Practices, once you know the basics and have tried a few examples. On 31 Aug 2012 22:55, "Mark Fowler" wrote: > On Friday, 31 August 2012 at 07:16, Rick Deller wrote: > > Hi all, > > Hi Rick! Good to have you on the mailing list! (If it's not too much > trouble would you mind not reply to existing emails when starting a new > thread - it makes life ugly for the web archives and for people using > threaded web clients as the mail gets put in the wrong place.) I think > it's awesome that a recruiter is actually interested in learning some of > the skills they are recruiting about. > > I have brought a couple of books on the subject which I'm reading through > > A good start! What books did you buy? There are good and there are bad > books…and it's important to get the right ones (or at least the good ones.) > > Do you have any other programming experience in any other language? > > I'm very keen to learn more and how to do it. Can anyone suggest more > books or another way of doing it ? > > I'm wondering if you found your way across to http://learn.perl.org which > has a collection of books, some examples, links to all the documentation > and more. > > Do you have a programming environment set up (you know, Perl installed, an > editor installed, etc, etc) or are you looking for any help with that too? > (If you don't it might be useful for you to tell us if you're using > Windows or a Mac, or something else…) > > Of course the best way to learn programming is to pick a (simple) problem > and try to solve it. And ask lots of questions. There's the #perl-learn > irc channel for interactive help. In the worst case if you get stuck feel > free to email me directly. > > Mark. > >
Re: How Perl Saved the Human Genome Project
On 1 Sep 2012, at 20:22, "Jones, Chris" wrote: > Its an old article - but interesting. But one bit I really don't like is > Lincoln's comment; > > "Because Perl is quick and dirty….." > > That's just silly. But Perl can be quick and dirty... it's just not *all* it can be :) Adrian -- http://quietstars.comadri...@quietstars.comtwitter.com/adrianh t. +44 (0)7752 419080skype adrianjohnhowardpinboard.in/u:adrianh
Re: Who made the law?
On Sat, Sep 1, 2012 at 7:19 PM, Mark Fowler wrote: > Tom, > > I know this is a lot to ask of you, especially as you're right about having a > limited time to spend on all of this, but could you if you haven't already > would you please watch this year's YAPC::NA keynote: > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TAOxGjNbp_Y > Just watched that a couple of hours ago, excellent stuff.
Re: How Perl Saved the Human Genome Project
Its an old article - but interesting. But one bit I really don't like is Lincoln's comment; "Because Perl is quick and dirty….." That's just silly. Chris On 1 Sep 2012, at 17:24, Daniel Mantovani wrote: I just read it right now. http://genetics.stanford.edu/gene211/handouts/How_Perl_HGP.html -- "A Jedi uses the Force for knowledge and defense, never for attack." - Yoda Software Engineer Just Another Perl Hacker Daniel Mantovani +5511 8538-9897 XOXO Begin forwarded message: From: Walter Lamagna Subject: [CaFe-pm] Como perl salvó el proyecto de genoma humano Date: September 1, 2012 12:19:17 PM GMT-03:00 To: Perl Mongers de Capital Federal Reply-To: Perl Mongers de Capital Federal Hace dos años hice un trabajo práctico donde uno buscaba similitud genética entre diferentes cepas de tuberculosis y utilicé perl. Los demás en el curso usaron python y otros lenguajes. En la similitud recuerdo que tenias que buscar diferentes secuencias de diferentes maneras, y perl me dió una ventaja frente a los demás por que de unos miles de genes, con perl encontré unas 4 o 5 similitudes que otros no encontraban, de hecho podías encontrar todas las similitudes (problema np completo). No se por que los demas no tenian tanta certeza, en ese tp tuvimos un 10. Ahora publicaron esta nota sobre como perl salvó el proyecto del genoma humano, y tiene sentido, perl tiene fortalezas únicas frente a otros lenguajes. http://genetics.stanford.edu/gene211/handouts/How_Perl_HGP.html Saludos -- Walter ___ Cafe-pm mailing list cafe...@pm.org http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/cafe-pm
Re: Who made the law?
On Saturday, 1 September 2012 at 06:04, Tom Hukins wrote: > Thank you all for the constructive discussion. I'm going to think for > a while before making a decision on this: I want to avoid rushing > anything important. I'm happy to listen to everyone's thoughts, > either on the list, privately, or in the pub on Thursday. Tom, I know this is a lot to ask of you, especially as you're right about having a limited time to spend on all of this, but could you if you haven't already would you please watch this year's YAPC::NA keynote: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TAOxGjNbp_Y It's 40 minutes long, and essentially covers why I think this is important. Mark. (Of course, you should watch Doctor Who first, starting right now on BBC One / BBC One HD)
Re: Who made the law?
On 01/09/2012 12:19, Greg McCarroll wrote: 3) Top posting emails, like bow ties are cool! (7.20 tonight). Best post yet! (read in comic book guy voice) Thanks for the reminder!
How Perl Saved the Human Genome Project
I just read it right now. http://genetics.stanford.edu/gene211/handouts/How_Perl_HGP.html -- "A Jedi uses the Force for knowledge and defense, never for attack." - Yoda Software Engineer Just Another Perl Hacker Daniel Mantovani +5511 8538-9897 XOXO Begin forwarded message: > From: Walter Lamagna > Subject: [CaFe-pm] Como perl salvó el proyecto de genoma humano > Date: September 1, 2012 12:19:17 PM GMT-03:00 > To: Perl Mongers de Capital Federal > Reply-To: Perl Mongers de Capital Federal > > Hace dos años hice un trabajo práctico donde uno buscaba similitud genética > entre diferentes cepas de tuberculosis y utilicé perl. Los demás en el curso > usaron python y otros lenguajes. En la similitud recuerdo que tenias que > buscar diferentes secuencias de diferentes maneras, y perl me dió una ventaja > frente a los demás por que de unos miles de genes, con perl encontré unas 4 o > 5 similitudes que otros no encontraban, de hecho podías encontrar todas las > similitudes (problema np completo). No se por que los demas no tenian tanta > certeza, en ese tp tuvimos un 10. > > Ahora publicaron esta nota sobre como perl salvó el proyecto del genoma > humano, y tiene sentido, perl tiene fortalezas únicas frente a otros > lenguajes. > > http://genetics.stanford.edu/gene211/handouts/How_Perl_HGP.html > > Saludos > > -- > Walter > ___ > Cafe-pm mailing list > cafe...@pm.org > http://mail.pm.org/mailman/listinfo/cafe-pm
Re: Can I get some advice on best way to start Perl Programming
On Saturday, 1 September 2012 at 03:32, Dave Cross wrote: > Looks like [Perl Medic is] out of print now, but Amazon has a few > second-hand copies. It's available as part of O'Reilly's Safari online service: http://my.safaribooksonline.com/book/programming/perl/0201795264 Mark.
Re: Who made the law?
On Saturday, 1 September 2012 at 08:56, William Blunn wrote: > On 31/08/2012 10:39, Philippe Bruhat (BooK) wrote: > > And more explicit rules mostly mean more incentives to game the system. > > We could have a rule which says "No gaming the system". I'm not proposing a "system", so there's no "system" to be gamed. I'm proposing a code of conduct which is *simply* a written down version of informing people that we[1] won't put up with the stuff that traditionally (you know, being nice human beings) we wouldn't put up with anyway. We[1] might not put up with stuff that's not explicitly listed too. Anyone who wants to "game" a code of conduct is on dubious footing, and their grand prize in "defeating" the code of conduct will be subject to the same arbitrary judgement that they're now at. This isn't a court of law[2] Mark. [1] And by "we" I obviously mean "Tom who makes the decisions about all of this and us lot that will follow them" [2] That's not to say laws of the land don't apply here, just that, despite the subject, a code of conduct isn't one.
Re: Which sucks least? Sky, Talktalk to BT broadband?
On 31/08/2012 13:56, lesl...@herlug.org.uk wrote: Unfortunately for you it looks like a stark choice between BT and Sky. The choice is between Sky TalkTalk Any provider that re-sells BT Wholesale ADSL services. If we eliminate TalkTalk on the grounds of low satisfaction rating, then the choice becomes Sky Any provider that re-sells BT Wholesale ADSL services. Writing "BT" makes it look like the only choice is BT (retail) broadband. If BT Wholesale has ADSL service at the exchange, then one can choose any reseller who provides service using BT Wholesale ADSL services. This includes BT retail, but there are many other providers who can provide service. By way of example, for two providers providing service over BT Wholesale ADSL, Which? customer satisfaction rate satisfaction as: BT (retail) 46% PlusNet 73% So, leading people into BT (retail) might not be a great idea. Don't get me wrong, some people (46% according to Which?) are perfectly happy with BT (retail) broadband. But if all other things were sufficiently similar, then one might as well pick the one with the higher satisfaction rating. If all other things are not sufficiently similar, then it comes down to other things, which can't be accommodated with a potted answer. Regards, Bill
Re: Who made the law?
On 31/08/2012 10:39, Philippe Bruhat (BooK) wrote: And more explicit rules mostly mean more incentives to game the system. Wikipedia has a policy on not gaming the system [1]. We could have a rule which says "No gaming the system". Bill [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:GAME
Re: Who made the law?
I'd suggest two things ... 1) be excellent to one another - all the best philosophies come from bad 80's, 90's movies, if you need a good movie from that time period, might i suggest the mantra 'save ferris'. 2) what Tom says goes, not an IRC op, not an ex-leader, not anyone else, 'In Tom we trust'. Of course we can also say 'Blame Tom'. 3) Top posting emails, like bow ties are cool! (7.20 tonight). G. p.s. I only suggest 2 of the 3 options. On 1 Sep 2012, at 11:04, Tom Hukins wrote: > On Thu, Aug 30, 2012 at 06:47:47PM +0100, Dave Hodgkinson wrote: >> Where is the usage policy of #london.pm IRC channel. > > Hi, sorry I'm a little late to this therad. > > Thank you all for the constructive discussion. I'm going to think for > a while before making a decision on this: I want to avoid rushing > anything important. I'm happy to listen to everyone's thoughts, > either on the list, privately, or in the pub on Thursday. > > All of us have limited time and energy to put into this group. Let's > focus on doing good things. If there's something we should be doing, > but we're not, let me know. > > Tom
Re: Who made the law?
On Thu, Aug 30, 2012 at 06:47:47PM +0100, Dave Hodgkinson wrote: > Where is the usage policy of #london.pm IRC channel. Hi, sorry I'm a little late to this therad. Thank you all for the constructive discussion. I'm going to think for a while before making a decision on this: I want to avoid rushing anything important. I'm happy to listen to everyone's thoughts, either on the list, privately, or in the pub on Thursday. All of us have limited time and energy to put into this group. Let's focus on doing good things. If there's something we should be doing, but we're not, let me know. Tom
Re: Who made the law?
On 31 Aug 2012, at 19:10, David Cantrell wrote: > You're worried about the opinions of those who assume that because a > person looks like or has a similar background to another person they > must therefore behave the same as that other person? > > This is like saying that women walking home at night should carry > placards saying "I'm not a prostitute" just because some dumb bastards > might think that because some women who are out on the street at night > are hookers they all are. I don't think it is saying anything like that. Let me give a story from a different domain to illustrate the kind of thing that I think these statements do. My partner has spent a large chunk of the last five years in a wheelchair or on crutches and unable to cope with stairs. In theory, after the DDA went into law in 2010, she should have had pretty good access to goods and services. In many cases it's completely fine. In many other cases there are minor problems, however well intentioned the people are, that make the experience a minor annoyance or embarrassment. Very occasionally you meet people or organisations that are complete and utter f**king asshats. Those experiences are relatively rare compared to the mediocre/good ones (although still far too common) - but they stand out because they cause a huge amount of hassle and emotional pain. Sometimes, often even, we have the energy and enthusiasm to deal with the latter two categories in appropriate ways. But sometimes you just want to have a nice day out somewhere new and know that you're not going to have any problems. We understand completely that not all hotels are evil. We know from experience that most hotels are going to give a good, or at worst mediocre, experience. But if a hotel has a statement about disabled access, has photos of the lobby that include somebody in a wheelchair, and obviously understands how wheelchair access works on the notes about getting to the hotel - guess which one we're more likely to pick. These statements are a sign on the door that says everybody welcome. They remove the question from peoples heads on whether they will be welcome or not. Removing that question can have a big effect since people are not choosing between an event and nothing - they're choosing between competing events. Cheers, Adrian -- http://quietstars.comadri...@quietstars.comtwitter.com/adrianh t. +44 (0)7752 419080skype adrianjohnhowardpinboard.in/u:adrianh
Re: Brainbench perl test?
Uri Guttman writes:
> that is my primary filtering technique. i review their sample code and
> talk about its strengths and weaknesses, ways i would like to see it
> improved, etc. HOW they react to that is a critical part of my review.
> a couple have been so pissed they almost hung up on me. how dare i
> tell them how to improve their code!! but most are very open to
> getting reviews and we end up in good conversations about reasons why
> i said that and other ways to do things, etc. a collegial attitude
> where they can learn.
I've found that too.
And also that, in some ways, "experience" counts negatively:
When a job requires a certain number of years experience, the hirers are
generally using experience as a proxy for ability. But with programming
it's possible to look at an applicant's code and get a better idea of
her ability directly.
Once I interviewed two applicants on the same day, with a programming
task. Both applicants turned out similar mediocre solutions, both with
SQL injection errors in their solutions. The morning applicant claimed 8
years' Perl experience. The afternoon one had downloaded Perl 1½ years
previously, cos he'd heard it might be useful for his job; nobody else
in the organization was using Perl, he had no support network, and
initially he'd just been dabbling with it a little in-between continuing
to do his job the previous way, gradually building up his Perl
experience in that time.
So we hired the afternoon applicant, the one with the _least_
experience. Somebody who'd spent 8 years as a Perl programmer and was
still churning out code like that didn't seem likely to improve, and
gave the impression he thought what he'd written was decent Perl code.
Whereas for the relative newbie to've already got to that point in the
circumstances he'd been demonstrated somebody striving to improve and
willing to learn.
The attitude Uri mentions appeared when I pointed out the SQL injection
problem ("What would happen if somebody called O'Reilly fills in that
form?"), and then introduced them to the concept of DBI placeholder
variables -- which neither had seen before.
The morning applicant was defensive over interpolating into SQL
directly, saying it's the way he's always done it and he's never had any
problems with it. The afternoon applicant was clearly keen to learn how
he could avoid such SQL injection issues, and enthusiastically grasped
the concept and advantages of placeholders.
So I think the actual code an applicant writes is much less important
than their replies and attitude when you ask them about that code. And
that's something which can't be automated away to an online test.
Cheers
Smylers
--
http://twitter.com/Smylers2
Re: Can I get some advice on best way to start Perl Programming
On 01/09/12 08:13, Adrian Howard wrote: On 1 Sep 2012, at 08:01, Peter Sergeant wrote: On Fri, Aug 31, 2012 at 11:52 PM, Uri Guttman wrote: also the o'reilly school of technology has 4 levels of perl courses written by *peter scott* Interesting! He's the author of what I consider to be one of the best Perl books of all time (Perl Medic), so that sounds highly worth looking in to... A big ++ to Perl Medic from me too. Sad it never got more mind-share. Agree. It's a great book. I said so as it was published: http://dave.org.uk/reviews/medic.html But, as Adrian says, it very few people seemed to buy it. Looks like it's out of print now, but Amazon has a few second-hand copies. Dave...
Re: Can I get some advice on best way to start Perl Programming
On 31/08/12 23:09, Denny wrote: Hi Rick, On Fri, 2012-08-31 at 11:16 +, Rick Deller wrote: I have brought a couple of books on the subject which I'm reading through I'm very keen to learn more and how to do it Can anyone suggest more books or another way of doing it ? As well as Mark's suggestions, I can personally recommend the Perl courses run by Dave Cross from this group. I did one of his intermediate courses a few years back, and he's just recently started doing more beginner and cross-training courses if I recall correctly. His website is http://mag-sol.com/ - it doesn't look like he's got any dates coming up in the immediate future, but there's a mailing list you can subscribe to. That's because I've been rather neglecting that web site in favour of my new "Perl School" brand - http://perlschool.co.uk/. There's a "Modern Perl for Non-Perl Programmers" course coming up on October 6th. I'll also be running an OO Perl tutorial at the London Perl Workshop. Cheers, Dave...
Re: Brainbench perl test?
Simon Wistow writes: > On Tue, Aug 28, 2012 at 10:15:27PM +0100, Dave Cantrell said: > > > For perl hiring, we had what I think was a great test. And now that > > they no longer exist, I can tell you what it was! > > Yahoo! Europe's was variations on this > > http://thegestalt.org/simon/yahoo_questions.txt My experience of taking Yahoo!'s test in 2000 was: * Yahoo! e-mail me the test. * I reply with my answers within the allowed 48 hours. * After a while of not hearing anything, I mail to check they received it. * Yahoo! confirm that they did, and they'll be getting in touch about it. * Somebody else offers me a job, which I accept without having heard back from Yahoo! The last communication between us stands at Yahoo! saying they'll let me know how I did on my test. I'm reasonably confident that I answered enough questions correctly to be worth interviewing. After 12 years I'm not holding out hope. A year or so goes by, then: * The company I work for runs Perl courses, and Yahoo! books one. I end up turning up to Yahoo!'s offices and training some of their Perl team, I think the team I applied to work for. Smylers -- http://twitter.com/Smylers2
Re: Can I get some advice on best way to start Perl Programming
On 1 Sep 2012, at 08:01, Peter Sergeant wrote: > On Fri, Aug 31, 2012 at 11:52 PM, Uri Guttman wrote: > >> also the o'reilly school of technology has 4 levels of perl courses >> written by *peter scott* >> > > Interesting! He's the author of what I consider to be one of the best Perl > books of all time (Perl Medic), so that sounds highly worth looking in to... A big ++ to Perl Medic from me too. Sad it never got more mind-share. Adrian -- http://quietstars.comadri...@quietstars.comtwitter.com/adrianh t. +44 (0)7752 419080skype adrianjohnhowardpinboard.in/u:adrianh
Re: Which sucks least? Sky, Talktalk to BT broadband?
Andrew Beattie writes: > What, in the option of London.pm would be my least lame broadband > option? TalkTalk gave me one of the worst customer experiences I've had with any organization. I wouldn't touch them again. To move away from them I switch to BT to 'cleanse' my line. Many ISPs, including TalkTalk, say they work with "a BT phone line". However, after switching to TalkTalk I no longer had a BT phone line but a TalkTalk phone line, which didn't work for them. The least hassle way out of this was for me to switch to BT for both phone calls and ADSL for a bit, then be in a position to switch on to somebody else. Except that I found myself happy enough with BT, so I've stayed with them. Their ADSL includes free unlimited access to any Openzone or Fon wi-fi hotspot, which I've found useful; many places, both city centres and residential areas, have one or t'other in range. And you get a Flickr Pro account thrown in. Smylers -- http://twitter.com/Smylers2
Re: Can I get some advice on best way to start Perl Programming
On Fri, Aug 31, 2012 at 11:52 PM, Uri Guttman wrote: > also the o'reilly school of technology has 4 levels of perl courses > written by *peter scott* > Interesting! He's the author of what I consider to be one of the best Perl books of all time (Perl Medic), so that sounds highly worth looking in to... -P
