[LUTE] Re: 17th century continuo practice evidence
Fabulous link! Many thanks, and you do a good job. --- En date de : Jeu 22.10.09, j...@horseforce.se a ecrit : De: j...@horseforce.se Objet: [LUTE] 17th century continuo practice evidence A: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Date: Jeudi 22 Octobre 2009, 6h27 The Dueben collection at the Uppsala University Library, Sweden, is one of the largest collections of music from (essentially) the second half of the 17th century. There are about 2300 works in manuscripts, and there are vocal and instrumental pieces by more than 300 composers. For most of the works we have the parts, and for some we also have the scores (but in German organ tablature...). But these manuscripts are what "the old ones" actually played from! Almost all works have one or more parts for Basso Continuo in form of figured base. There are 40+ works that have a BC part labeled Tiorba (or something similar), so my guess is that this is what "the old pluckers" played from. But there are two works that also have lute tablature, an anonymous work titled "Ach Swea Trohn" and one by Buxtehude "Fuerchtet Euch Nicht". Now to the evidence... The work "Ach Swea Trohn" was composed for a special occasion (the death of a Swedish Queen) and is written for soprano, 2 viola d' amore(actually one of the earliest pieces specifying that instrument) and BC. But there are 4 BC parts(one marked Tiorba) + 2 (almost identical) lute tablature parts for something in d-minor tuning. I don't think they wrote out parts just for fun, so I think we can assume that the solists (soprano + 2 viola d'amore) were "supported by" 6 continuo players (including one tiorba and two other lute instruments)! We don't hear the very often today. The really fun thing is that the whole Dueben collection is being scanned and made available on-line. So if you would like to look at the parts for the piece above, click at [1][1]http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/presentationSource.php?Select_Dnr =1705 and you will get a list of all the parts. From there you can go on to the individual manuscript pages. When you have looked at those you can continue with the other 30.000 manuscript pages The home page of the Dueben collection is [2][2]http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/Duben.php and there are search functions for composer, title, scoring If you have comments or questions you can contact me, I'm currently working on the implementation of the Dueben collection data base. Have fun exploring this unique collection! Jan Johansson References 1. [3]http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/presentationSource.php?Select_Dnr=1705 2. [4]http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/Duben.php To get on or off this list see list information at [5]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html __ Do You Yahoo!? En finir avec le spam? Yahoo! Mail vous offre la meilleure protection possible contre les messages non sollicites http://mail.yahoo.fr Yahoo! Mail -- References 1. http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/presentationSource.php?Select_Dnr=1705 2. http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/Duben.php 3. http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/presentationSource.php?Select_Dnr=1705 4. http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/Duben.php 5. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/%7Ewbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Brazilian duet a la Dowland
wowo! wow! Original-Nachricht > Datum: 22 Oct 2009 07:48 GMT > Von: "Mathias Rösel" > An: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu > Betreff: [LUTE] Re: Brazilian duet a la Dowland > "Daniel F Heiman" schrieb: > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CcsSPzr7ays > > WOW!!! > -- > Best, > > Mathias > > > > To get on or off this list see list information at > http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Brazilian duet a la Dowland
Very impressing! But it also demonstrates the basic problem of the classical guitar nowadays. Am 22.10.2009 um 05:22 schrieb Daniel F Heiman: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CcsSPzr7ays Daniel To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: 17th century continuo practice evidence
This is a really interesting collection, with quite a few basso continuo parts marked as being for theorbo. What strikes me is that these theorbo parts are basically the same as the other basso continuo parts, with no attempt made to adapt them for the instrument. Chromatic bass lines. A range that doesn't use the instrument's bass notes. And no manuscript annotations to show how the player adapted the part for his instrument. Maybe the musicians simply weren't allowed to write on the music. Are there any theorbo basso continuo parts anywhere which are clearly designed for theorbo, more instrument-specific? P 2009/10/22 <[1]...@horseforce.se> The Dueben collection at the Uppsala University Library, Sweden, is one of the largest collections of music from (essentially) the second half of the 17th century. There are about 2300 works in manuscripts, and there are vocal and instrumental pieces by more than 300 composers. For most of the works we have the parts, and for some we also have the scores (but in German organ tablature...). But these manuscripts are what "the old ones" actually played from! Almost all works have one or more parts for Basso Continuo in form of figured base. There are 40+ works that have a BC part labeled Tiorba (or something similar), so my guess is that this is what "the old pluckers" played from. But there are two works that also have lute tablature, an anonymous work titled "Ach Swea Trohn" and one by Buxtehude "Fuerchtet Euch Nicht". Now to the evidence... The work "Ach Swea Trohn" was composed for a special occasion (the death of a Swedish Queen) and is written for soprano, 2 viola d' amore(actually one of the earliest pieces specifying that instrument) and BC. But there are 4 BC parts(one marked Tiorba) + 2 (almost identical) lute tablature parts for something in d-minor tuning. I don't think they wrote out parts just for fun, so I think we can assume that the solists (soprano + 2 viola d'amore) were "supported by" 6 continuo players (including one tiorba and two other lute instruments)! We don't hear the very often today. The really fun thing is that the whole Dueben collection is being scanned and made available on-line. So if you would like to look at the parts for the piece above, click at [1][2]http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/presentationSource.php?Select_Dnr =1705 and you will get a list of all the parts. From there you can go on to the individual manuscript pages. When you have looked at those you can continue with the other 30.000 manuscript pages The home page of the Dueben collection is [2][3]http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/Duben.php and there are search functions for composer, title, scoring If you have comments or questions you can contact me, I'm currently working on the implementation of the Dueben collection data base. Have fun exploring this unique collection! Jan Johansson References 1. [4]http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/presentationSource.php?Select_Dnr=17 05 2. [5]http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/Duben.php To get on or off this list see list information at [6]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html -- Peter Martin Belle Serre La Caulie 81100 Castres France tel: 0033 5 63 35 68 46 mob: 0044 7971 232614 e: [7]peter.l...@gmail.com [8]www.silvius.co.uk -- References 1. mailto:j...@horseforce.se 2. http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/presentationSource.php?Select_Dnr=1705 3. http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/Duben.php 4. http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/presentationSource.php?Select_Dnr=1705 5. http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/Duben.php 6. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html 7. mailto:peter.l...@gmail.com 8. http://www.silvius.co.uk/
[LUTE] Re: 17th century continuo practice evidence
On Thu, Oct 22, 2009 at 10:33 AM, Peter Martin wrote: > What strikes me is that these theorbo parts are basically the same as > the other basso continuo parts, with no attempt made to adapt them for .. > And no manuscript annotations to show how the player adapted the part > for his instrument. Maybe the musicians simply weren't allowed to An experienced continuo player will not need to write in his adaptations. An experienced continuo player most probably didn't get the part in advance anyway. That's what my experience as a continuo player today tells me, and I suppose two or three hunderd years ago it would be more or less the same. David -- *** David van Ooijen davidvanooi...@gmail.com www.davidvanooijen.nl *** To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: 17th century continuo practice evidence
I heartily concur ! Good job indeed and congratulations to the Uppsala University Library for this wonderful work. Jean-Marie == En réponse au message du 22-10-2009, 09:25:27 == > >Fabulous link! Many thanks, and you do a good job. > --- En date de : Jeu 22.10.09, j...@horseforce.se a > ecrit : > > De: j...@horseforce.se > Objet: [LUTE] 17th century continuo practice evidence > A: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu > Date: Jeudi 22 Octobre 2009, 6h27 > > The Dueben collection at the Uppsala University Library, Sweden, is > one > of > the largest collections of music from (essentially) the second half > of > the 17th century. > There are about 2300 works in manuscripts, and there are vocal and > instrumental > pieces by more than 300 composers. For most of the works we have > the > parts, > and for some we also have the scores (but in German organ > tablature...). > But these manuscripts are what "the old ones" actually played from! > Almost all works have one or more parts for Basso Continuo in form > of > figured base. > There are 40+ works that have a BC part labeled Tiorba (or something > similar), so my guess > is that this is what "the old pluckers" played from. > But there are two works that also have lute tablature, an anonymous > work titled > "Ach Swea Trohn" and one by Buxtehude "Fuerchtet Euch Nicht". > Now to the evidence... > The work "Ach Swea Trohn" was composed for a special occasion (the > death of a Swedish Queen) > and is written for soprano, 2 viola d' amore(actually one of the > earliest pieces specifying that > instrument) and BC. But there are 4 BC parts(one marked Tiorba) + 2 > (almost identical) lute tablature > parts for something in d-minor tuning. > I don't think they wrote out parts just for fun, so I think we can > assume that the solists > (soprano + 2 viola d'amore) were "supported by" 6 continuo players > (including one tiorba and two > other lute instruments)! We don't hear the very often today. > The really fun thing is that the whole Dueben collection is being > scanned and made available > on-line. So if you would like to look at the parts for the piece > above, click at > [1][1]http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/presentationSource.php?Select_Dnr > =1705 > and you will get a list of all the parts. From there you can go on > to > the individual > manuscript pages. When you have looked at those you can continue > with > the other 30.000 manuscript pages > The home page of the Dueben collection is > [2][2]http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/Duben.php > and there are search functions for composer, title, scoring > If you have comments or questions you can contact me, > I'm currently working on the implementation of the Dueben collection > data base. > Have fun exploring this unique collection! > Jan Johansson > References > 1. > [3]http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/presentationSource.php?Select_Dnr=1705 > 2. [4]http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/Duben.php > To get on or off this list see list information at > [5]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html > > __ > Do You Yahoo!? > En finir avec le spam? Yahoo! Mail vous offre la meilleure protection > possible contre les messages non sollicites > http://mail.yahoo.fr Yahoo! Mail -- > >References > > 1. http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/presentationSource.php?Select_Dnr=1705 > 2. http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/Duben.php > 3. http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/presentationSource.php?Select_Dnr=1705 > 4. http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/Duben.php > 5. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/%7Ewbc/lute-admin/index.html > >--- >Orange vous informe que cet e-mail a ete controle par l'anti-virus mail. >Aucun virus connu a ce jour par nos services n'a ete detecte. > >
[LUTE] Re: Brazilian duet a la Dowland
which is? A Bruno On Thu, Oct 22, 2009 at 4:29 AM, JAP:rg Hilbert <[1]hilbert.jo...@t-online.de> wrote: Very impressing! But it also demonstrates the basic problem of the classical guitar nowadays. Am 22.10.2009 um 05:22 schrieb Daniel F Heiman: [2]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CcsSPzr7ays Daniel To get on or off this list see list information at [3]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html -- References 1. mailto:hilbert.jo...@t-online.de 2. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CcsSPzr7ays 3. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Brazilian duet a la Dowland
Great. This piece even outdoes Dowland: at one point the players switch their right hands so that each is plucking what the other is fingering with the left hand. Amazing coordination. I can't think of any colleagues I know with whom I'd feel comfortable spending the hours needed to practice this! ;-) Chris --- On Wed, 10/21/09, Daniel F Heiman wrote: > From: Daniel F Heiman > Subject: [LUTE] Brazilian duet a la Dowland > To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu > Date: Wednesday, October 21, 2009, 11:22 PM > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CcsSPzr7ays > > Daniel > > > > To get on or off this list see list information at > http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html >
[LUTE] Re: 17th century continuo practice evidence
Hi Peter, I have not looked into if there are any theorbo-related writings or markings in the manuscripts apart from the two tablature parts. I already discussed the anonymous piece for d-minor-tuned-things, and the other tablature in the Buxtehude work is most likely written by a copyist, there are a number of mistakes in that. There is of course a possibility for you to look into this: If you go inte the Basic Search [1]http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/basicSearch.php and in the field Scoring uses "contains" and types in th you will get a list of all works where th(=theorbo) is indicated. You should get the 44 works that actually specifies theorbo, and from them get into the bc parts. Please note that not all manuscripts are yet available, and that there is a "layer of musicology" covering the actual manuscripts... Regards Jan On Thu, 22 Oct 2009 10:33 , Peter Martin sent: This is a really interesting collection, with quite a few basso continuo parts marked as being for theorbo. What strikes me is that these theorbo parts are basically the same as the other basso continuo parts, with no attempt made to adapt them for the instrument. Chromatic bass lines. A range that doesn't use the instrument's bass notes. And no manuscript annotations to show how the player adapted the part for his instrument. Maybe the musicians simply weren't allowed to write on the music. Are there any theorbo basso continuo parts anywhere which are clearly designed for theorbo, more instrument-specific? P 2009/10/22 <[1][2]...@horseforce.se> The Dueben collection at the Uppsala University Library, Sweden, is one of the largest collections of music from (essentially) the second half of the 17th century. There are about 2300 works in manuscripts, and there are vocal and instrumental pieces by more than 300 composers. For most of the works we have the parts, and for some we also have the scores (but in German organ tablature...). But these manuscripts are what "the old ones" actually played from! Almost all works have one or more parts for Basso Continuo in form of figured base. There are 40+ works that have a BC part labeled Tiorba (or something similar), so my guess is that this is what "the old pluckers" played from. But there are two works that also have lute tablature, an anonymous work titled "Ach Swea Trohn" and one by Buxtehude "Fuerchtet Euch Nicht". Now to the evidence... The work "Ach Swea Trohn" was composed for a special occasion (the death of a Swedish Queen) and is written for soprano, 2 viola d' amore(actually one of the earliest pieces specifying that instrument) and BC. But there are 4 BC parts(one marked Tiorba) + 2 (almost identical) lute tablature parts for something in d-minor tuning. I don't think they wrote out parts just for fun, so I think we can assume that the solists (soprano + 2 viola d'amore) were "supported by" 6 continuo players (including one tiorba and two other lute instruments)! We don't hear the very often today. The really fun thing is that the whole Dueben collection is being scanned and made available on-line. So if you would like to look at the parts for the piece above, click at [1][2][3]http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/presentationSource.php\?Select _Dnr =1705 and you will get a list of all the parts. From there you can go on to the individual manuscript pages. When you have looked at those you can continue with the other 30.000 manuscript pages The home page of the Dueben collection is [2][3][4]http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/Duben.php and there are search functions for composer, title, scoring If you have comments or questions you can contact me, I'm currently working on the implementation of the Dueben collection data base. Have fun exploring this unique collection! Jan Johansson References 1. [4][5]http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/presentationSource.php\?Select_Dn r=17 05 2. [5][6]http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/Duben.php To get on or off this list see list information at [6][7]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html -- Peter Martin Belle Serre La Caulie 81100 Castres France tel: 0033 5 63 35 68 46 mob: 0044 7971 232614 e: [7][8]peter.l...@gmail.com [8][9]www.silvius.co.uk -- References 1. [10]...@horseforce.se','','','')">[11]...@horseforce.se 2. [12]http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/presentationSource.php\?Select_Dnr= 1705 3. [13]http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/Duben.php 4. [14]http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/p
[LUTE] Re: plucked (and plonked) trio
Some nice photos from the LSA Lute Festival concert are here http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~lsa/old/Cleveland2006/CYoungConcert.html http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~lsa/old/Cleveland2006/CYoungConcertPhotos.ht ml Unfortunately I have been unable to get Crawford to choose some of the audio clips so I can post them. Margit was very nice about granting permission. She can also be heard very prominently (and seen in the background -- only person standing other than Philippe) in this amusing video of Christine Pluhar's organization: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EZ-VsKB_tNw Regards, Daniel On Wed, 21 Oct 2009 17:52:41 -0700 Sean Smith writes: > > Hi Stuart, > > Margit actually flew out to the LSA seminar in Ohio a few years ago > to > play duos with Crawford. Yes, it's in the hammered dulcimer family, > > yep, sure sounds great and believable in that context and, oh yeah, > is > she ever in control! > > It looks like a pretty versatile instrument and very overlooked. I'd > > think most of the lute rep would be available: certainly tenors with > > whomever, formal ensemble music and I'm sure they made solo > arrangements of popular vocal or ensemble music. The latter could > range from tenor-contrapunto settings, to (mostly) strict 3-part > settings of their own --just like the lute rep. Furthermore, if its > > metal strings and good simple solid body was as portable as the lute > > and twice as durable I'm sure there were those that took advantage > and > specialized in it. > > There's a guy here in Berkeley who's been playing one on street > corners for 30 years. I'm pretty sure that for some of it it was > keeping him fed. A tradition that goes back centuries, if not > millenia, in hammered dulcimer circles. > > Sean > > > > > On Oct 21, 2009, at 3:25 PM, Stuart Walsh wrote: > > > http://www.lewon.de/inhalt/projekte/ensembles_dulce.php?navbat=03 > > > > Ont this page, under 'Tonbeispiele' there are three pieces, > > including one by Obrecht, 'Nec mihi nec tibi'. Jon Banks claims > > > that this Obrecht untexted chanson was actually conceived and > > composed for three plucked instruments but here in this Ensemble > > > Dulce Melos version the three instruments are: ? at least one > > plucked thing and, surprisingly what seems to be a hammered > > dulcimer. The three instruments create a strange sound; very nice, > > > very beguiling. I was really surprised to hear a hammered dulcimer > > > (if it is one) in this context (of quite sophisticated polyphony) > > > and the as can be heard, the player (Margit Übellacker) is in > > complete command. > > > > The instrument Margit Übellacker is playing is described as a > dulce > > melos, after Henri Arnault de Zwolle: fully chromatic over 3 > > octaves. But Margit sounds like she is playing with hammers and > > Henri is definitely sniffy about hammers and his dulce melos > > proper has an elaborate keyboard mechanism. Iconography of 15th > > > century hammered dulcimers suggests long, thin instruments with a > > > limited range but Margit's instrument looks a monster by > contrast. > > > > > > Stuart > > > > > > > > > > To get on or off this list see list information at > > http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html > > > >
[LUTE] Re: plucked (and plonked) trio
David Tayler wrote: There are some people who play the plucky version http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W9APMU2jXJE But that is a later style. Still, it is an original :) d http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W9APMU2jXJE Thanks. I've never seen that before. That psalterio looks like a dulcimer, not a psaltery - I've never seen a psaltery with chessman bridges, nor any bridges other than the two...err bridges. Even the quanun, a sophisticated-looking beast, just has the strings, harp-like but in a different plane (as it were). I wonder if the music says to pluck it rather than plonk it? Stuart At 05:52 PM 10/21/2009, you wrote: Hi Stuart, Margit actually flew out to the LSA seminar in Ohio a few years ago to play duos with Crawford. Yes, it's in the hammered dulcimer family, yep, sure sounds great and believable in that context and, oh yeah, is she ever in control! It looks like a pretty versatile instrument and very overlooked. I'd think most of the lute rep would be available: certainly tenors with whomever, formal ensemble music and I'm sure they made solo arrangements of popular vocal or ensemble music. The latter could range from tenor-contrapunto settings, to (mostly) strict 3-part settings of their own --just like the lute rep. Furthermore, if its metal strings and good simple solid body was as portable as the lute and twice as durable I'm sure there were those that took advantage and specialized in it. There's a guy here in Berkeley who's been playing one on street corners for 30 years. I'm pretty sure that for some of it it was keeping him fed. A tradition that goes back centuries, if not millenia, in hammered dulcimer circles. Sean On Oct 21, 2009, at 3:25 PM, Stuart Walsh wrote: http://www.lewon.de/inhalt/projekte/ensembles_dulce.php?navbat=03 Ont this page, under 'Tonbeispiele' there are three pieces, including one by Obrecht, 'Nec mihi nec tibi'. Jon Banks claims that this Obrecht untexted chanson was actually conceived and composed for three plucked instruments but here in this Ensemble Dulce Melos version the three instruments are: ? at least one plucked thing and, surprisingly what seems to be a hammered dulcimer. The three instruments create a strange sound; very nice, very beguiling. I was really surprised to hear a hammered dulcimer (if it is one) in this context (of quite sophisticated polyphony) and the as can be heard, the player (Margit Übellacker) is in complete command. The instrument Margit Übellacker is playing is described as a dulce melos, after Henri Arnault de Zwolle: fully chromatic over 3 octaves. But Margit sounds like she is playing with hammers and Henri is definitely sniffy about hammers and his dulce melos proper has an elaborate keyboard mechanism. Iconography of 15th century hammered dulcimers suggests long, thin instruments with a limited range but Margit's instrument looks a monster by contrast. Stuart To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.423 / Virus Database: 270.14.26/2451 - Release Date: 10/22/09 08:51:00
[LUTE] Re: plucked (and plonked) trio
Daniel F Heiman wrote: Some nice photos from the LSA Lute Festival concert are here http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~lsa/old/Cleveland2006/CYoungConcert.html http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~lsa/old/Cleveland2006/CYoungConcertPhotos.ht ml Unfortunately I have been unable to get Crawford to choose some of the audio clips so I can post them. Margit was very nice about granting permission. She can also be heard very prominently (and seen in the background -- only person standing other than Philippe) in this amusing video of Christine Pluhar's organization: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EZ-VsKB_tNw Regards, Daniel Those photos are really interesting. Crawford has single strings on the fourth and fifth courses of his gittern? Is this just a practical way of getting five courses from 8 pegs, I wonder? Or based on iconography? Or do they yield a clearer bass or something? I'm alsovery interested in the pictures of the dulce melos (if that is what it is) - the long rectangular instrument with (12?) single strings. So there are two bridges, but no under-and-over stuff (as on later dulcimers). And a ration of 2:3? So 12 notes on the left hand side of the instrument and twelve notes, a fifth higher on the right side? Did the dulce melos do long tenors and the lute/gittern twitter away on top? Stuart On Wed, 21 Oct 2009 17:52:41 -0700 Sean Smith writes: Hi Stuart, Margit actually flew out to the LSA seminar in Ohio a few years ago to play duos with Crawford. Yes, it's in the hammered dulcimer family, yep, sure sounds great and believable in that context and, oh yeah, is she ever in control! It looks like a pretty versatile instrument and very overlooked. I'd think most of the lute rep would be available: certainly tenors with whomever, formal ensemble music and I'm sure they made solo arrangements of popular vocal or ensemble music. The latter could range from tenor-contrapunto settings, to (mostly) strict 3-part settings of their own --just like the lute rep. Furthermore, if its metal strings and good simple solid body was as portable as the lute and twice as durable I'm sure there were those that took advantage and specialized in it. There's a guy here in Berkeley who's been playing one on street corners for 30 years. I'm pretty sure that for some of it it was keeping him fed. A tradition that goes back centuries, if not millenia, in hammered dulcimer circles. Sean On Oct 21, 2009, at 3:25 PM, Stuart Walsh wrote: http://www.lewon.de/inhalt/projekte/ensembles_dulce.php?navbat=03 Ont this page, under 'Tonbeispiele' there are three pieces, including one by Obrecht, 'Nec mihi nec tibi'. Jon Banks claims that this Obrecht untexted chanson was actually conceived and composed for three plucked instruments but here in this Ensemble Dulce Melos version the three instruments are: ? at least one plucked thing and, surprisingly what seems to be a hammered dulcimer. The three instruments create a strange sound; very nice, very beguiling. I was really surprised to hear a hammered dulcimer (if it is one) in this context (of quite sophisticated polyphony) and the as can be heard, the player (Margit Übellacker) is in complete command. The instrument Margit Übellacker is playing is described as a dulce melos, after Henri Arnault de Zwolle: fully chromatic over 3 octaves. But Margit sounds like she is playing with hammers and Henri is definitely sniffy about hammers and his dulce melos proper has an elaborate keyboard mechanism. Iconography of 15th century hammered dulcimers suggests long, thin instruments with a limited range but Margit's instrument looks a monster by contrast. Stuart To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.423 / Virus Database: 270.14.26/2451 - Release Date: 10/22/09 08:51:00
[LUTE] Re: plucked (and plonked) trio
> So there are two bridges, but no under-and-over stuff (as on > later dulcimers). if one bridge each side, then each set of strings are likely to be sloped relative to the other, so they look like an X viewed from the side; this allows the player a choice, play left, or play right. Some players will tune both sides diatonically, but with different accidentals on each side, extending the compass. Pretty sure praetorius illustrates a hammer dulcimer. Yes, a very bright sound that goes well with harp and does dance music nicely. -- Dana Emery To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Dowland - LOL
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hyLjQdLMYpg JD works it some more. Popstars got his thumb in the door; now it's time to break out the big tools: i-memes and jib-jab. N ur strngbox, nibblng spgtti, smthy To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Dowland - LOL
Hoops, mon. TCamp. Cute-glaze, addled brain. s On Oct 22, 2009, at 12:44 PM, Sean Smith wrote: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hyLjQdLMYpg JD works it some more. Popstars got his thumb in the door; now it's time to break out the big tools: i-memes and jib-jab. N ur strngbox, nibblng spgtti, smthy To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] A-Wn 18688 (Craus)
Hello For a work on the Benzenauer / Schwarz Knab I need very quickly the following pieces: A-Wn 18688 fol. 15v-16v fol. 26v Can somebody help me? Thanks a lot!!! Andreas To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Brazilian duet a la Dowland
On Thu, Oct 22, 2009 at 2:10 PM, wrote: > Great. This piece even outdoes Dowland: at one point the players switch > their right hands so that each is plucking what the other is fingering with > the left hand. Amazing coordination. I can't think of any colleagues I know > with whom I'd feel comfortable spending the hours needed to practice this! > ;-) I have a guitar pupil with a broken left arm. He still comes to the lessons. We play his pieces together: he only right hand plucking the strings, me with left hand (the wrong one for me!) on the fingeboard. If it gets too challenging for me I change to my right hand on the fingerboard, but approaching it from above, so I don't have to bend my knees. (We all have our weak points ...). It's fun! David -- *** David van Ooijen davidvanooi...@gmail.com www.davidvanooijen.nl *** To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: 17th century continuo practice evidence
We just did a whole program of pieces here from the collection--it is great music. I am very curious if you come across any evidence for the bowed instrument in Buxtehude because we did several of the cantatas on 5 string cello, which was very popular in the 17th century, in my research I did not find very many examples with clear indications for the obbligato and bass parts. Best wishes, and thanks for the collection--someof the cantus firmus settings are amazing! dt At 11:27 PM 10/21/2009, you wrote: >The Dueben collection at the Uppsala University Library, Sweden, is one >of >the largest collections of music from (essentially) the second half of >the 17th century. >There are about 2300 works in manuscripts, and there are vocal and >instrumental >pieces by more than 300 composers. For most of the works we have the >parts, >and for some we also have the scores (but in German organ >tablature...). >But these manuscripts are what "the old ones" actually played from! >Almost all works have one or more parts for Basso Continuo in form of >figured base. >There are 40+ works that have a BC part labeled Tiorba (or something >similar), so my guess >is that this is what "the old pluckers" played from. >But there are two works that also have lute tablature, an anonymous >work titled >"Ach Swea Trohn" and one by Buxtehude "Fuerchtet Euch Nicht". >Now to the evidence... >The work "Ach Swea Trohn" was composed for a special occasion (the >death of a Swedish Queen) >and is written for soprano, 2 viola d' amore(actually one of the >earliest pieces specifying that >instrument) and BC. But there are 4 BC parts(one marked Tiorba) + 2 >(almost identical) lute tablature >parts for something in d-minor tuning. >I don't think they wrote out parts just for fun, so I think we can >assume that the solists >(soprano + 2 viola d'amore) were "supported by" 6 continuo players >(including one tiorba and two >other lute instruments)! We don't hear the very often today. >The really fun thing is that the whole Dueben collection is being >scanned and made available >on-line. So if you would like to look at the parts for the piece >above, click at >[1]http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/presentationSource.php?Select_Dnr=1705 >and you will get a list of all the parts. From there you can go on to >the individual >manuscript pages. When you have looked at those you can continue with >the other 30.000 manuscript pages >The home page of the Dueben collection is >[2]http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/Duben.php >and there are search functions for composer, title, scoring >If you have comments or questions you can contact me, >I'm currently working on the implementation of the Dueben collection >data base. >Have fun exploring this unique collection! >Jan Johansson > >References > >1. http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/presentationSource.php?Select_Dnr=1705 >2. http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/Duben.php > > >To get on or off this list see list information at >http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: 17th century continuo practice evidence
Chromatic bass lines are no problem! Just use 7 or 8 fretted. dt ifAt 01:33 AM 10/22/2009, you wrote: >This is a really interesting collection, with quite a few basso >continuo parts marked as being for theorbo. > >What strikes me is that these theorbo parts are basically the same as >the other basso continuo parts, with no attempt made to adapt them for >the instrument. Chromatic bass lines. A range that doesn't use the >instrument's bass notes. > >And no manuscript annotations to show how the player adapted the part >for his instrument. Maybe the musicians simply weren't allowed to >write on the music. > >Are there any theorbo basso continuo parts anywhere which are clearly >designed for theorbo, more instrument-specific? > >P > >2009/10/22 <[1]...@horseforce.se> > >The Dueben collection at the Uppsala University Library, Sweden, > is one >of >the largest collections of music from (essentially) the second > half of >the 17th century. >There are about 2300 works in manuscripts, and there are vocal and >instrumental >pieces by more than 300 composers. For most of the works we have > the >parts, >and for some we also have the scores (but in German organ >tablature...). >But these manuscripts are what "the old ones" actually played > from! >Almost all works have one or more parts for Basso Continuo in form > of >figured base. >There are 40+ works that have a BC part labeled Tiorba (or > something >similar), so my guess >is that this is what "the old pluckers" played from. >But there are two works that also have lute tablature, an > anonymous >work titled >"Ach Swea Trohn" and one by Buxtehude "Fuerchtet Euch Nicht". >Now to the evidence... >The work "Ach Swea Trohn" was composed for a special occasion (the >death of a Swedish Queen) >and is written for soprano, 2 viola d' amore(actually one of the >earliest pieces specifying that >instrument) and BC. But there are 4 BC parts(one marked Tiorba) + > 2 >(almost identical) lute tablature >parts for something in d-minor tuning. >I don't think they wrote out parts just for fun, so I think we can >assume that the solists >(soprano + 2 viola d'amore) were "supported by" 6 continuo players >(including one tiorba and two >other lute instruments)! We don't hear the very often today. >The really fun thing is that the whole Dueben collection is being >scanned and made available >on-line. So if you would like to look at the parts for the piece >above, click at > > [1][2]http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/presentationSource.php?Select_Dnr > =1705 >and you will get a list of all the parts. From there you can go on > to >the individual >manuscript pages. When you have looked at those you can continue > with >the other 30.000 manuscript pages >The home page of the Dueben collection is >[2][3]http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/Duben.php >and there are search functions for composer, title, scoring >If you have comments or questions you can contact me, >I'm currently working on the implementation of the Dueben > collection >data base. >Have fun exploring this unique collection! >Jan Johansson > References >1. > [4]http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/presentationSource.php?Select_Dnr=17 > 05 >2. [5]http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/Duben.php > To get on or off this list see list information at > [6]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html > >-- >Peter Martin >Belle Serre >La Caulie >81100 Castres >France >tel: 0033 5 63 35 68 46 >mob: 0044 7971 232614 >e: [7]peter.l...@gmail.com >[8]www.silvius.co.uk > >-- > >References > >1. mailto:j...@horseforce.se >2. http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/presentationSource.php?Select_Dnr=1705 >3. http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/Duben.php >4. http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/presentationSource.php?Select_Dnr=1705 >5. http://www.musik.uu.se/duben/Duben.php >6. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html >7. mailto:peter.l...@gmail.com >8. http://www.silvius.co.uk/
[LUTE] cantio ruthenica 101
http://www.torban.org/ruthenicae/images/258.pdf http://www.torban.org/ruthenicae/audio/258H.mp3 Amitiès,' RT To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
