[LUTE] Re: My god...my lute is on strike!
Omar: 1) Are the strings all breaking at the same place (i.e. all breaking at the point they cross over the nut)? If so, check for roughness at that location. 2) Whose strings are you buying? It may be that you have received a weak batch from your supplier try a different source. 3) What material are you using? If gut, try a Nylgut chanterelle for the Summer. The sound of the chanterelle is usually the least dependent on the material of which it is made. Daniel On Tue, 8 Jun 2010 09:27:54 +0300 Omer Katzir writes: > It goes like this, > Yesterday I drove to the other side of the country with my 10c, she > never goes out unless i'm going to a lesson, and it was hot day, > very hot day. > First I wanted to tune, and *SNAP* first string snapped right on my > face. Lucky for me, I had two more strings with me, so I tried to > replace it. But, my lute didn't wanted to... > these strings also snapped and the peg gave me hard time spinning > it. Finally we gave up and played on Levi's lute (which is also 10c, > but much different then mine) > > I said ok, she might need some rest, so I wanted to replace that > string today, and give her a rest until tomorrow. But no! she still > don't want the string on her, snapped again, right into my eye! > The heat, and the cold also changed my frets, which is bad...but I > can handle the frets. I can't handle to be stringless. > > Any suggestions on how to solve the strike? > > > > To get on or off this list see list information at > http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html > >
[LUTE] my apologies, beginner's question on strings
Hi list, I am VERY sorry to write this as a new email, but the archives havenot given me the information I am seeking. I purchased a 60cm 1977 james cox lute (very light instrument), with some repaired crackson the spruce top. the previous person had put nylon strings on the instrument and the spruce top evenwarped up underthe bridge and warped down on top of the bridge. My guess is this is due to high string tension? Should i let the instrument rest without strings with higher humidity to remove the warp? would that work? Also I had to remove the old strings as they were VERY old. now I need to buy a new set of stings, I see many la bell and pyramid string sets online, but I think that they will be too high-tension for this instrument. So I am looking at buying lower tension strings (thinner diameter?), but do not know what diameter I should buy for each course. Does anyone know where I could get the diameters i need for each course? Or should i simply put on the pyramid sets I see online everywhere? I can't afford gut, unfortunately. thanks list! -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: my apologies, beginner's question on strings
Dear Samuel Welcome to the list, and congratulations on your lute! > nylon strings on the instrument and the spruce top evenwarped up > underthe bridge and warped down on top of the bridge. My guess is this > is due to high string tension? Maybe, but also maybe due to too humid or dry conditions. Have a luthier look at it to ease your mind. > instrument. So I am looking at buying lower tension strings (thinner > diameter?), but do not know what diameter I should buy for each course. Send an e-mail to any major string supplier (e.g. Kuerschner or Aquila) with the specifications of your lute (string length, number of courses, desired tuning and pitch) and tell them you want a low string tension. They will make you an individual set. Alternatively, buy a standard set and tune your lute a little lower than the set indicates. That will give a lower string tension. No problems as long as you don't plan on playing with other instruments. But if that is the case, go for the first option. On a side note, a 'standard' set is a strange thing, as there is no such thing as a standard lute. You have a 60cm lute, a standard set covers lutes with string lengths from say 58 to 63cm (my guess). Is it a set for 415 or for 440Hz? And what kind of string tension does the supplier consider standard? Many variables. You can of course calculate your own string diameters, by using one of the many on-line string calculators. David -- *** David van Ooijen davidvanooi...@gmail.com www.davidvanooijen.nl *** To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: A Draft Idea
Well, I do occasionally get to tune in between pieces: when I need an otherwise unavailable bass note. RT - Original Message - From: "Benjamin Narvey" To: "Roman Turovsky" Cc: "lute-cs.dartmouth.edu" Sent: Monday, June 07, 2010 6:58 AM Subject: Re: [LUTE] A Draft Idea Oh Roman. Actually, it worked out all right tuning-wise: I didn't have to tune long, only often (about 3 times). On 7 June 2010 12:56, Roman Turovsky wrote: Playing such drafty venues on gut is a daft idea. Go with carbon. RT - Original Message - From: "Benjamin Narvey" To: "lute-cs.dartmouth.edu" Sent: Monday, June 07, 2010 6:52 AM Subject: [LUTE] A Draft Idea Dear Collected Wisdom, I played a solo recital yesterday in a rather drafty medieval church in Champagne on a lute with loaded gut basses. Tuning was difficult but manageable, but nevertheless my experience got me wondering if anyone out there may have any advice with regards to how one may discern where the optimal performance place is with regards to drafts, i.e., how does one check for drafts in a concert space? Any advice would be most welcome! As ever, Benjamin -- Dr Benjamin A. Narvey Institute of Musical Research School of Advanced Study University of London t +33 (0) 1 44 27 03 44 p/m +33 (0) 6 71 79 98 98 Site web/Website: www.luthiste.com To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html -- Dr Benjamin A. Narvey Institute of Musical Research School of Advanced Study University of London t +33 (0) 1 44 27 03 44 p/m +33 (0) 6 71 79 98 98 Site web/Website: www.luthiste.com
[LUTE] Re: my apologies, beginner's question on strings
On Jun 8, 2010, at 7:17 AM, Samuel Jacques wrote: > the spruce top evenwarped up > underthe bridge and warped down on top of the bridge. My guess is this > is due to high string tension? Perhaps, but it could be that it's a perfectly normal "scoop." The top is always lower on the neck side of the bridge. Without seeing it, there's no way to tell. > So I am looking at buying lower tension strings (thinner > diameter?), but do not know what diameter I should buy for each course. > Does anyone know where I could get the diameters i need for each > course? Or should i simply put on the pyramid sets I see online > everywhere? You might start with an online string calculator. Arto Wikla, a frequent poster here, has one: www.cs.helsinki.fi/u/wikla/mus/Calcs/wwwscalc.html To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: my apologies, beginner's question on strings
Samuel, No apologies needed. For strings I'd avoid any pre-packaged sets. These seem to have little relationship with any playing reality. I've also had little success with finding strings of adequate tension using several online calculators - I either end op with broken strings or floppy rubber bands, often produced by the same program. I'd highly recommend Chris Henriksen from Boston Catlines: catli...@aol.com, (617) 776-8688. Speak with him on the phone and he will assemble a customized set, sometimes of mixed materials and manufacturers, that is ideal for your specific instrument and playing needs. For me, he plays things a bit on the safe side in regards to tension, but this might be just what is needed for your lute. Chris Christopher Wilke Lutenist, Guitarist and Composer www.christopherwilke.com --- On Tue, 6/8/10, Samuel Jacques wrote: > From: Samuel Jacques > Subject: [LUTE] my apologies, beginner's question on strings > To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu > Date: Tuesday, June 8, 2010, 10:17 AM > > Hi list, I am VERY sorry to write this as > a new email, but the archives > havenot given me the information I am > seeking. > I purchased a 60cm 1977 james cox lute > (very light instrument), with > some repaired crackson the spruce > top. the previous person had put > nylon strings on the instrument and the > spruce top evenwarped up > underthe bridge and warped down on top of > the bridge. My guess is this > is due to high string tension? > Should i let the instrument rest without > strings with higher humidity > to remove the warp? would that > work? > Also I had to remove the old strings as > they were VERY old. now I need > to buy a new set of stings, I see many la > bell and pyramid string sets > online, but I think that they will be too > high-tension for this > instrument. So I am looking at > buying lower tension strings (thinner > diameter?), but do not know what diameter > I should buy for each course. > Does anyone know where I could get the > diameters i need for each > course? Or should i simply put on > the pyramid sets I see online > everywhere? I can't afford gut, > unfortunately. > thanks list! > > -- > > > To get on or off this list see list information at > http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html > To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: my apologies, beginner's question on strings
Thanks for all the answers!!! I should have known that by picking up the lute as an instrument things wouldn't be as easy as buying something on ebay in a pre-packaged set. I put a set of pyramids on my other heavier lute, and it sounds great but more like a guitare. This lute will hopefully have a better sound because its lighter. although I do think they should have a full-degree course on the art of pickinglute strings! Material, tension, diameter, pitch, it's more involved than I had thought! I did play around on the string calculatorsand still have no idea what the ideal tension would be for this particular lute - 2kg? 3kg? Great answers here, I would like to thank everyone for their help and will contact the string makers you all gave me and they will send me the right strings. -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: Carbon strings?
So does the end with the hook go on the bridge or the nut? -Original Message- From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf Of Paul Kieffer Sent: Tuesday, June 08, 2010 8:08 PM To: Eugene C. Braig IV Cc: Stathis Skandalidis; lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Subject: [LUTE] Re: Carbon strings? I've been using carbon fishing line for some time now for just the top 'g' string on my 10 course lute. It works tremendously well, lasts incredibly long, and is about 1000 times cheaper than "lute string." If you live in any big or medium sized city, you should be able to find a store with the right diameter fishing line. They have the perfect diameters for the top string, I've tried anything from .36 mm to .42 mm. Make sure you don't get wound fishing line, because it won't stretch, of course. It just comes apart. Just yesterday I bought 140 meters of fishing line at .41mm diameter. It was around $20 Canadian. This new line has been on my lute for a day now, and it sounds and works amazing. I break the top string quite a bit, and having 140 meters of the top string is comforting. (If you're in a concert and the g string breaks...what are you going to do...go backstage and put another gut string on it, and then wait for it to settle in and then break again? Or you can just unravel some fishing line, stick it on there, and bam. It doesn't need any time to stretch or get settle really.) IMO, it's much better to go with this option, than it is to order strings online from expensive sources (*and many times unreliable). Also, when you order that stuff online, you pay huge shipping costs, and you have to wait 1-2 weeks (or 4 or 5). I've wasted a lot of money ordering actual lute strings when my top string would break. I've had very bad experiences with gut when it comes to the top g string... it's just not worth the effort or money if you ask me. I was weary at first about using fishing line, but when I put it on the lute and started playing, it was a miracle. And then I just keep the remaining 139 meters of string in the case... .40 mm tends to be on the larger side for fishing line. but almost all outdoor and fishing stores have it (and anything from .38-.48). They will probably think you are some fly fishing expert Paul On Mon, Jun 7, 2010 at 6:09 PM, Eugene C. Braig IV <[1]brai...@osu.edu> wrote: Not all fluorocarbon fishing lines make good strings. I've had pretty poor luck with Berkley's house brand of fluorocarbon fishing line. Under continuous tension (e.g., as an instrument string), I have found it to fray and lose intonation along its length. I've had much better luck with P-Line CFX flourocarbon fly fishing leader material. It's much more expensive than large spools of line, but still much less expensive than an equivalent length of gut string. Most of the fluorocarbon made for fishing you'll find will be ca. 0.5 mm or thinner. Best, Eugene > -Original Message- > From: [2]lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:[3]lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On > Behalf Of Stathis Skandalidis > Sent: Monday, June 07, 2010 5:04 PM > To: [4]l...@cs.dartmouth.edu > Subject: [LUTE] Re: Carbon strings? > >Dear Arto, >according to Makoto Tsuruta and his intuitive site >[1][5]http://www.crane.gr.jp/CRANE_Strings/strings_linesE.html it's the >same material. >As I am living on an island, it is quite easy at least for me to find >fishing line. >Regardless your place of residence there are many on-line shops where >you could order it from. >A 25 m spool Seaguar Grand Max fishing line 0.405mm diameter costs >around 10 euros. That spool could give you 3 dozens of strings for a >g-lute, not a bad business at all! >Stathis > __ > >From: wikla <[6]wi...@cs.helsinki.fi> >To: [7]l...@cs.dartmouth.edu >Sent: Mon, June 7, 2010 11:31:23 PM >Subject: [LUTE] Carbon strings? >Dearest lute gang, >one question about the "carbon" string material (=high density >hydrocarbon >polymer): >I have been using it much, but I have always ordered it from lute >string >makers. But as far as I know, this material was developed for a non >lute >world (fishing?). So, does anyone here really know, if the lute string >"carbon" and the fishing line "carbon" are the same thing and the same >quality? If yes, please let me know, where to get this quality "fishing >carbon"? I guess the fishers order their stuff in 100's of meters, and >to >me a couple of meters is the maximum per one string. In the fishe
[LUTE] Re: Carbon strings?
> So does the end with the hook go on the bridge or the nut? It's those lead weights that I can't figure out ... do they go between the rose and the neck? T > -Original Message- > From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On > Behalf Of Paul Kieffer Sent: Tuesday, June 08, 2010 8:08 PM To: Eugene > C. Braig IV Cc: Stathis Skandalidis; lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Subject: > [LUTE] Re: Carbon strings? > >I've been using carbon fishing line for some time now for just the >top 'g' string on my 10 course lute. It works tremendously well, >lasts incredibly long, and is about 1000 times cheaper than "lute >string." > >If you live in any big or medium sized city, you should be able to >find a store with the right diameter fishing line. > >They have the perfect diameters for the top string, I've tried >anything from .36 mm to .42 mm. > >Make sure you don't get wound fishing line, because it won't >stretch, of course. It just comes apart. > >Just yesterday I bought 140 meters of fishing line at .41mm >diameter. It was around $20 Canadian. This new line has been on my >lute for a day now, and it sounds and works amazing. > >I break the top string quite a bit, and having 140 meters of the >top string is comforting. (If you're in a concert and the g string >breaks...what are you going to do...go backstage and put another >gut string on it, and then wait for it to settle in and then break >again? Or you can just unravel some fishing line, stick it on >there, and bam. > It doesn't need any time to stretch or get settle really.) > >IMO, it's much better to go with this option, than it is to order >strings online from expensive sources (*and many times unreliable). >Also, when you order that stuff online, you pay huge shipping >costs, and you have to wait 1-2 weeks (or 4 or 5). I've wasted a >lot of money ordering actual lute strings when my top string would >break. > >I've had very bad experiences with gut when it comes to the top g >string... it's just not worth the effort or money if you ask >me. > >I was weary at first about using fishing line, but when I put it on >the lute and started playing, it was a miracle. And then I just >keep the remaining 139 meters of string in the case... > >.40 mm tends to be on the larger side for fishing line. but almost >all outdoor and fishing stores have it (and anything from .38-.48). > They will probably think you are some fly fishing expert > >Paul > >On Mon, Jun 7, 2010 at 6:09 PM, Eugene C. Braig IV ><[1]brai...@osu.edu> wrote: > > Not all fluorocarbon fishing lines make good strings. I've had > pretty poor luck with Berkley's house brand of fluorocarbon > fishing line. Under continuous tension (e.g., as an instrument > string), I have found it to fray and lose intonation along its > length. I've had much better luck with P-Line CFX flourocarbon > fly fishing leader material. It's much more expensive than large > spools of line, but still much less expensive than an equivalent > length of gut string. Most of the fluorocarbon made for fishing > you'll find will be ca. 0.5 mm or thinner. Best, Eugene > >> -Original Message- >> From: [2]lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu >[mailto:[3]lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On >> Behalf Of Stathis Skandalidis >> Sent: Monday, June 07, 2010 5:04 PM >> To: [4]l...@cs.dartmouth.edu > >> Subject: [LUTE] Re: Carbon strings? >> >>Dear Arto, >>according to Makoto Tsuruta and his intuitive site >>[1][5]http://www.crane.gr.jp/CRANE_Strings/strings_linesE.html >it's the >same material. >As I am living on an island, it >is quite easy at least for me to find >fishing line. > >Regardless your place of residence there are many on-line shops >where >you could order it from. >A 25 m spool Seaguar Grand >Max fishing line 0.405mm diameter costs >around 10 euros. That >spool could give you 3 dozens of strings for a >g-lute, not a >bad business at all! >Stathis > >__ >> >From: wikla <[6]wi...@cs.helsinki.fi> >To: >[7]l...@cs.dartmouth.edu >Sent: Mon, June 7, 2010 11:31:23 PM > > Subject: [LUTE] Carbon strings? >Dearest lute gang, >one >question about the "carbon" string material (=high density > >hydrocarbon >polymer): >I have been using it much, but I >have always ordered it from lute >string >makers. But as >far as I know, this material was developed for a non >lute > >world (fishing?). So, does anyone here really know, if the lute >string >"carbon" and the fishing line "carbon" are the same >thing and the same >quality? If yes, please
[LUTE] Re: Carbon strings?
> So does the end with the hook go on the bridge or the nut? Perhaps this fishing line would be good for "bass" strings? T > -Original Message- > From: lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu [mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On > Behalf Of Paul Kieffer Sent: Tuesday, June 08, 2010 8:08 PM To: Eugene > C. Braig IV Cc: Stathis Skandalidis; lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Subject: > [LUTE] Re: Carbon strings? > >I've been using carbon fishing line for some time now for just the >top 'g' string on my 10 course lute. It works tremendously well, >lasts incredibly long, and is about 1000 times cheaper than "lute >string." > >If you live in any big or medium sized city, you should be able to >find a store with the right diameter fishing line. > >They have the perfect diameters for the top string, I've tried >anything from .36 mm to .42 mm. > >Make sure you don't get wound fishing line, because it won't >stretch, of course. It just comes apart. > >Just yesterday I bought 140 meters of fishing line at .41mm >diameter. It was around $20 Canadian. This new line has been on my >lute for a day now, and it sounds and works amazing. > >I break the top string quite a bit, and having 140 meters of the >top string is comforting. (If you're in a concert and the g string >breaks...what are you going to do...go backstage and put another >gut string on it, and then wait for it to settle in and then break >again? Or you can just unravel some fishing line, stick it on >there, and bam. > It doesn't need any time to stretch or get settle really.) > >IMO, it's much better to go with this option, than it is to order >strings online from expensive sources (*and many times unreliable). >Also, when you order that stuff online, you pay huge shipping >costs, and you have to wait 1-2 weeks (or 4 or 5). I've wasted a >lot of money ordering actual lute strings when my top string would >break. > >I've had very bad experiences with gut when it comes to the top g >string... it's just not worth the effort or money if you ask >me. > >I was weary at first about using fishing line, but when I put it on >the lute and started playing, it was a miracle. And then I just >keep the remaining 139 meters of string in the case... > >.40 mm tends to be on the larger side for fishing line. but almost >all outdoor and fishing stores have it (and anything from .38-.48). > They will probably think you are some fly fishing expert > >Paul > >On Mon, Jun 7, 2010 at 6:09 PM, Eugene C. Braig IV ><[1]brai...@osu.edu> wrote: > > Not all fluorocarbon fishing lines make good strings. I've had > pretty poor luck with Berkley's house brand of fluorocarbon > fishing line. Under continuous tension (e.g., as an instrument > string), I have found it to fray and lose intonation along its > length. I've had much better luck with P-Line CFX flourocarbon > fly fishing leader material. It's much more expensive than large > spools of line, but still much less expensive than an equivalent > length of gut string. Most of the fluorocarbon made for fishing > you'll find will be ca. 0.5 mm or thinner. Best, Eugene > >> -Original Message- >> From: [2]lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu >[mailto:[3]lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On >> Behalf Of Stathis Skandalidis >> Sent: Monday, June 07, 2010 5:04 PM >> To: [4]l...@cs.dartmouth.edu > >> Subject: [LUTE] Re: Carbon strings? >> >>Dear Arto, >>according to Makoto Tsuruta and his intuitive site >>[1][5]http://www.crane.gr.jp/CRANE_Strings/strings_linesE.html >it's the >same material. >As I am living on an island, it >is quite easy at least for me to find >fishing line. > >Regardless your place of residence there are many on-line shops >where >you could order it from. >A 25 m spool Seaguar Grand >Max fishing line 0.405mm diameter costs >around 10 euros. That >spool could give you 3 dozens of strings for a >g-lute, not a >bad business at all! >Stathis > >__ >> >From: wikla <[6]wi...@cs.helsinki.fi> >To: >[7]l...@cs.dartmouth.edu >Sent: Mon, June 7, 2010 11:31:23 PM > > Subject: [LUTE] Carbon strings? >Dearest lute gang, >one >question about the "carbon" string material (=high density > >hydrocarbon >polymer): >I have been using it much, but I >have always ordered it from lute >string >makers. But as >far as I know, this material was developed for a non >lute > >world (fishing?). So, does anyone here really know, if the lute >string >"carbon" and the fishing line "carbon" are the same >thing and the same >quality? If yes, please let me know, where >to get this
[LUTE] Re: Carbon strings?
> De: Laura Maschi > Fecha: 9 de junio de 2010 1:03:30 GMT-03:00 > Para: Paul Kieffer > Cc: Miguel de Olaso > Asunto: Re: [LUTE] Re: Carbon strings? > > Hi Paul, can you recommend any fishing line maker? > Which brands have you trÃed? And is ir better the line or the leader > type? > So far I have only the reference for 'seaguar' a japanese maker, > that unfortunately is very difficult to get here in Argentina. > Suggestions welcomed! > Thanks > Laura > > Enviado desde mi iPod > > El 08/06/2010, a las 21:07, Paul Kieffer > escribió: > >> I've been using carbon fishing line for some time now for just the >> top >> 'g' string on my 10 course lute. It works tremendously well, lasts >> incredibly long, and is about 1000 times cheaper than "lute string." >> >> If you live in any big or medium sized city, you should be able to >> find >> a store with the right diameter fishing line. >> >> They have the perfect diameters for the top string, I've tried >> anything >> from .36 mm to .42 mm. >> >> Make sure you don't get wound fishing line, because it won't >> stretch, >> of course. It just comes apart. >> >> Just yesterday I bought 140 meters of fishing line at .41mm >> diameter. >> It was around $20 Canadian. This new line has been on my lute for a >> day now, and it sounds and works amazing. >> >> I break the top string quite a bit, and having 140 meters of the top >> string is comforting. (If you're in a concert and the g string >> breaks...what are you going to do...go backstage and put another gut >> string on it, and then wait for it to settle in and then break >> again? >> Or you can just unravel some fishing line, stick it on there, and >> bam. >> It doesn't need any time to stretch or get settle really.) >> >> IMO, it's much better to go with this option, than it is to order >> strings online from expensive sources (*and many times unreliable). >> Also, when you order that stuff online, you pay huge shipping costs, >> and you have to wait 1-2 weeks (or 4 or 5). I've wasted a lot of >> money >> ordering actual lute strings when my top string would break. >> >> I've had very bad experiences with gut when it comes to the top g >> string... it's just not worth the effort or money if you ask me. >> >> I was weary at first about using fishing line, but when I put it >> on the >> lute and started playing, it was a miracle. And then I just keep >> the >> remaining 139 meters of string in the case... >> >> .40 mm tends to be on the larger side for fishing line. but almost >> all >> outdoor and fishing stores have it (and anything from .38-.48). >> They >> will probably think you are some fly fishing expert >> >> Paul >> >> On Mon, Jun 7, 2010 at 6:09 PM, Eugene C. Braig IV <[1]brai...@osu.edu >> > >> wrote: >> >>Not all fluorocarbon fishing lines make good strings. I've had >>pretty poor >>luck with Berkley's house brand of fluorocarbon fishing line. >> Under >>continuous tension (e.g., as an instrument string), I have found >> it >>to fray >>and lose intonation along its length. I've had much better luck >>with P-Line >>CFX flourocarbon fly fishing leader material. It's much more >>expensive than >>large spools of line, but still much less expensive than an >>equivalent >>length of gut string. Most of the fluorocarbon made for fishing >>you'll find >>will be ca. 0.5 mm or thinner. >>Best, >>Eugene >> >>> -Original Message- >>> From: [2]lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu >> [mailto:[3]lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On >>> Behalf Of Stathis Skandalidis >>> Sent: Monday, June 07, 2010 5:04 PM >>> To: [4]l...@cs.dartmouth.edu >> >>> Subject: [LUTE] Re: Carbon strings? >>> >>> Dear Arto, >>> according to Makoto Tsuruta and his intuitive site >>> [1][5]http://www.crane.gr.jp/CRANE_Strings/strings_linesE.html >> it's the >>> same material. >>> As I am living on an island, it is quite easy at least for me to >> find >>> fishing line. >>> Regardless your place of residence there are many on-line shops >> where >>> you could order it from. >>> A 25 m spool Seaguar Grand Max fishing line 0.405mm diameter costs >>> around 10 euros. That spool could give you 3 dozens of strings for >> a >>> g-lute, not a bad business at all! >>> Stathis >>> >> __ >>> >>> From: wikla <[6]wi...@cs.helsinki.fi> >>> To: [7]l...@cs.dartmouth.edu >>> Sent: Mon, June 7, 2010 11:31:23 PM >>> Subject: [LUTE] Carbon strings? >>> Dearest lute gang, >>> one question about the "carbon" string material (=high density >>> hydrocarbon >>> polymer): >>> I have been using it much, but I have always ordered it from lute >>> string >>> makers. But as far as I know, this material was developed for a >> non >>> lute >>> world (fishing?). So, does anyone here really know, if the lute >> string >>> "carbon" and the fish
[LUTE] Re: Carbon strings?
Be careful to be just a little more specific on this subject. The generic description of "fishing line" is not sufficient to arrive at appropriate instrument strings. I can't find enough detail to determine the material you're using, Paul, but I would guess it's nylon from your descriptions of quantity and price. Most monofilament fishing lines are nylon and of different density from fluorocarbon, the different materials requiring different diameters at any given pitch and scale length. To dabble in fishing lines as strings, use a string calculator to estimate appropriate diameters and be certain you know what material you're buying. Again, almost anything labeled simply "monofilament" will be some variant of nylon. If a monofilament is made of fluorocarbon (what instrumentalists often simply call "carbon"), the package will say so: i.e., packaging will state "fluorocarbon", "100% fluorocarbon", or similar. As Paul mentioned, any braided, Kevlar, or "fusion" fishing lines won't really be appropriate as instrument strings. You can even find fluorocarbon-coated nylon, which I would also avoid. Again, read the package if you intend to pluck fishing line! Nylon monofilament fishing lines can be really cheap. Fluorocarbon is much more expensive than nylon monofilament, but still much, much cheaper than gut or even fluorocarbon packaged as individual strings by musical instrument string manufacturers. Unfortunately, to find such synthetics in appropriate diameters for most instruments' lower courses (say the 3rd and below in many cases and even 2nd in some), you'll probably have to buy designated instrument strings. I've had a little less time with fluorocarbon lines than nylon. However, as I'd mentioned before, I've had plain bad luck with Berkley's "Vanish" brand fluorocarbon which tends to fray very quickly along its whole length when under modest sustained tension. It will begin to look rather hairy and loses consistent intonation too quickly. I've had much better luck with P-Line CFX flourocarbon fly fishing leader. I've found most nylon monofilament fishing lines by brand-name manufacturers to be pretty similar. Berkley's nylon monofilament (branded "Trilene") seems more dependable than their fluorocarbon as instrument strings. Best, Eugene - Original Message - From: Laura Maschi Date: Wednesday, June 9, 2010 12:12 am Subject: [LUTE] Re: Carbon strings? To: "lute@cs.dartmouth.edu" > > > > De: Laura Maschi > > Fecha: 9 de junio de 2010 1:03:30 GMT-03:00 > > Para: Paul Kieffer > > Cc: Miguel de Olaso > > Asunto: Re: [LUTE] Re: Carbon strings? > > > > > Hi Paul, can you recommend any fishing line maker? > > Which brands have you trÃed? And is ir better the line or the > leader > > type? > > So far I have only the reference for 'seaguar' a japanese > maker, > > that unfortunately is very difficult to get here in > Argentina. > > Suggestions welcomed! > > Thanks > > Laura > > > > Enviado desde mi iPod > > > > El 08/06/2010, a las 21:07, Paul Kieffer > > > escribió: > > > >> I've been using carbon fishing line for some time now > for just the > >> top > >> 'g' string on my 10 course lute. It works > tremendously well, lasts > >> incredibly long, and is about 1000 times cheaper than > "lute string." > >> > >> If you live in any big or medium sized city, you should > be able to > >> find > >> a store with the right diameter fishing line. > >> > >> They have the perfect diameters for the top string, > I've tried > >> anything > >> from .36 mm to .42 mm. > >> > >> Make sure you don't get wound fishing line, because it > won't > >> stretch, > >> of course. It just comes apart. > >> > >> Just yesterday I bought 140 meters of fishing line at > .41mm > >> diameter. > >> It was around $20 Canadian. This new line has > been on my lute for a > >> day now, and it sounds and works amazing. > >> > >> I break the top string quite a bit, and having 140 > meters of the top > >> string is comforting. (If you're in a concert and > the g string > >> breaks...what are you going to do...go backstage and > put another gut > >> string on it, and then wait for it to settle in and > then break > >> again? > >> Or you can just unravel some fishing line, stick it on > there, and > >> bam. > >> It doesn't need any time to stretch or get settle > really.)>> > >> IMO, it's much better to go with this option, than it > is to order > >> strings online from expensive sources (*and many times > unreliable).>> Also, when you order that stuff online, you > pay huge shipping costs, > >> and you have to wait 1-2 weeks (or 4 or 5). I've > wasted a lot of > >> money > >> ordering actual lute strings when my top string would break. > >> > >> I've had very bad experiences with gut when it comes to > the top g > >> string... it's just not worth > the effort or money if you ask me. > >> > >> I was weary at f
