[LUTE] Re: 8-course lute literature?

[Sean Smith]

One more:
Emanual Adriaensen: Novum Pratum Musicum Longe amoenissimum 1592.

The 8th course (D) has an extended horizontal line through it whereas 
the 7th (F) has a short line. This seems to predate the diagonal slash. 
Not much harmonic material is given to the 8th course and it is usually 
a reiteration of the D-chord root.

A quick look at the Pratum Musicum of 1584 showed quite a few 7th 
course indications (short lines) but no 8ths. In both books the 7th 
course is occasionally fingered.

Sean Smith


On Aug 17, 2006, at 11:36 PM, Luca Manassero wrote:

>
>Thank you, Kenneth.
>between the authors you mention Santini Garsi da Parma is really 
> new to me.
>Do you have any example and/or better reference?
>Regards,
>Luca
>[EMAIL PROTECTED] on 17/08/2006 22.54 wrote:
>
> Luca:
>
> It is fine to play 6-course tablature repertoire on a 7 or 8 course  
> lute.
> The earliest source of lute music from Italy is the manuscript in  
> Pesaro from
> around 1480 to 1495 and it contains a piece or  two requiring a 7th 
> course
> (D)!  And the famous Siena Lutebook  with mostly 6 course repertoire 
> was compil
> ed
> during the second half of the  16th C. and contains some works 
> requiring a
> 7th course.
>
> For 7 or 8 courses in Italian repertoire:
>
> in addition to Molinaro and the Raimondi manuscript, you can find nice
> pieces to play by Terzi (1593 and 1599), some works by Kapsberger from 
> 1611 are
> playable, as well as Piccinini (1623 and 1640).  Also Giulio Cesare  
> Barbetta
> and Santini Garsi di Parma.  All of the dance repertoire is nice,  
> too, and you
> can always add extra basses in yourself: Negri and Caroso.
>
> There are also plenty of Italian-based composers to be found in 
> Dowland's
> Varietie of Lute Lessons 1610 and in Besarde's Thesaurus Harmonicus, 
> as well as
> the Lord Herbert of Cherbury Lutebook (not available as an edition).
>
> I recommend the Lyre Music Publications anthologies of "The Art of the 
> Lute
> in Renaissance Italy" (three volumes covering Intabluations, Dances, 
> and
> Fantasia) to have much of this repertoire bound in convenient editions 
> that fit
> well on the music stand.
>
> Kenneth Be
>
> References
>
>1. mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
> To get on or off this list see list information at
> http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
>

[LUTE] Re: 8-course lute literature?

[demery]

On Thu, Aug 17, 2006, Manolo Laguillo <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:

> Hi,
> 
> Am I wrong thinking that 8 courses is for having both F and D in the 
> bass register, using one_or_the other in a given piece, but rarely_both_?

some willtune the 7th course to C, giving other options.

If you go outside the lute repetoire and consider its contemporary music
you will discover the additional basses useful, both for solo music and
for chordal accompaniment.

-- 
Dana Emery




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[LUTE] Re: 8-course lute literature?

[LGS-Europe]

Fun music: lots of cross rhythms/hemiola etc.

There's an edition form the German Magazine Gitarre & Laute:
G + L 148
Santino Garsi da Parma
Lautenwerke
Facsimile and modern transcritpion in guitar notation.
All the mss. sources combined into one book. Nice edition.

Before that there were transcritpions around from somebody's thesis.

David

>   between the authors you mention Santini Garsi da Parma is really new to 
> me.
>   Do you have any example and/or better reference?




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[LUTE] Re: 8-course lute literature?

[Luca Manassero]

   Thank you, Kenneth.
   between the authors you mention Santini Garsi da Parma is really new to me.
   Do you have any example and/or better reference?
   Regards,
   Luca
   [EMAIL PROTECTED] on 17/08/2006 22.54 wrote:

Luca:

It is fine to play 6-course tablature repertoire on a 7 or 8 course  lute.
The earliest source of lute music from Italy is the manuscript in  Pesaro from
around 1480 to 1495 and it contains a piece or  two requiring a 7th course
(D)!  And the famous Siena Lutebook  with mostly 6 course repertoire was compil
ed
during the second half of the  16th C. and contains some works requiring a
7th course.

For 7 or 8 courses in Italian repertoire:

in addition to Molinaro and the Raimondi manuscript, you can find nice
pieces to play by Terzi (1593 and 1599), some works by Kapsberger from 1611 are
playable, as well as Piccinini (1623 and 1640).  Also Giulio Cesare  Barbetta
and Santini Garsi di Parma.  All of the dance repertoire is nice,  too, and you
can always add extra basses in yourself: Negri and Caroso.

There are also plenty of Italian-based composers to be found in Dowland's
Varietie of Lute Lessons 1610 and in Besarde's Thesaurus Harmonicus, as well as
the Lord Herbert of Cherbury Lutebook (not available as an edition).

I recommend the Lyre Music Publications anthologies of "The Art of the Lute
in Renaissance Italy" (three volumes covering Intabluations, Dances, and
Fantasia) to have much of this repertoire bound in convenient editions that fit
well on the music stand.

Kenneth Be

References

   1. mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]


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[LUTE] Re: 8-course lute literature?

[KennethBeLute]

 
The music of Laurencini di Roma is another high point of 7 - 8 course  
Italian repertoire.  Much of his music is in Besarde's Thesaurus  Harmonicus, 
but 
there is a good modern edition of his music published by the  Lute Society:
 
 
Thirty  Pieces for the Lute by Laurencini 

edited by Tim Crawford. Fantasies and other pieces by one of the  leading 
Italian virtuosi of Dowland=E2=80's time, in French tablature, for 6 to  
9-course 
lutes, 32 pages. 
Kenneth


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[LUTE] Re: 8-course lute literature?

[Robert Clair]

If you have an 8 course lute and wish to play 6 course repertoire as  
it might sound on a 6-course (as others have noted there is nothing  
wrong with playing it on an 8 course, as is) two  things will help:

1) put an octave on your fourth course

2) weave a small piece of cloth or felt into the 7th and 8th courses  
to temporarily damp them and prevent them from ringing sympathetically.


...Bob 



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[LUTE] Re: 8-course lute literature?

[JCetra]

Dear Luca and All:
 I have a one-word answer for you:
 Dowland.
 True, most of Dowland can be played on a seven-course lute, but that eighth 
course really comes in handy on a few of the fantasias.
Cheers,
Jim
p.s. Don't sell the lute! Or better still, sell it to me! 8^)


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[LUTE] Re: 8-course lute literature?

[KennethBeLute]

 
In a message dated 8/17/2006 4:38:07 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

Dear all,
as an amateur lute player  studying in Italy I tend to spend most of my time
playing  Italian lute music from the XVI century. Well, I guess this  happens
to everybody, anyway... ;-)
I own a  splendid 8-course lute made by Stephen Barber and Sandi Harris  and
suddenly started wondering why I *ever* bought an 8 course  lute. In fact, I
either stumble on "pure" 6-course lute  tablatures or on a Baroque repertoire
written evidently for a  10-course lute.
I would be very, very, *very* grateful if you  could post me some indication
regarding 8-course lute music  pieces to avoid selling my lute to finally get
a  6-course...
Thank you in advance,
Luca



 
Luca:
 
It is fine to play 6-course tablature repertoire on a 7 or 8 course  lute.  
The earliest source of lute music from Italy is the manuscript in  Pesaro from 
around 1480 to 1495 and it contains a piece or  two requiring a 7th course 
(D)!  And the famous Siena Lutebook  with mostly 6 course repertoire was 
compiled 
during the second half of the  16th C. and contains some works requiring a 
7th course.  
 
For 7 or 8 courses in Italian repertoire: 
 
in addition to Molinaro and the Raimondi manuscript, you can find nice  
pieces to play by Terzi (1593 and 1599), some works by Kapsberger from 1611 are 
 
playable, as well as Piccinini (1623 and 1640).  Also Giulio Cesare  Barbetta 
and Santini Garsi di Parma.  All of the dance repertoire is nice,  too, and you 
can always add extra basses in yourself: Negri and Caroso.
 
There are also plenty of Italian-based composers to be found in Dowland's  
Varietie of Lute Lessons 1610 and in Besarde's Thesaurus Harmonicus, as well as 
 
the Lord Herbert of Cherbury Lutebook (not available as an edition).
 
I recommend the Lyre Music Publications anthologies of "The Art of the Lute  
in Renaissance Italy" (three volumes covering Intabluations, Dances, and  
Fantasia) to have much of this repertoire bound in convenient editions that fit 
 
well on the music stand.
 
Kenneth Be


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[LUTE] Re: 8-course lute literature?

[Arto Wikla]

Hi all

Just one idea on 8-coursers (I've wrote about it earlier, too, but perhaps 
there are new members in the List):

In my 8-courser in G I have the 7th course in D and 8th course in F - so
it is contrary to the "common" order. It is nice to be able to finger the
chromatics on the low D and it is still very easy to find the open F.

Try that!

All the best

Arto



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[LUTE] Re: 8-course lute literature?

[Manolo Laguillo]

Hi,

Am I wrong thinking that 8 courses is for having both F and D in the 
bass register, using one_or_the other in a given piece, but rarely_both_?

What is the string length of your 8-course lute, Luca?

Saludos from Barcelona,

Manolo Laguillo



Luca Manassero wrote:

>   Dear all,
>   as an amateur lute player studying in Italy I tend to spend most of my time
>   playing Italian lute music from the XVI century. Well, I guess this happens
>   to everybody, anyway... ;-)
>   I own a splendid 8-course lute made by Stephen Barber and Sandi Harris and
>   suddenly started wondering why I *ever* bought an 8 course lute. In fact, I
>   either stumble on "pure" 6-course lute tablatures or on a Baroque repertoire
>   written evidently for a 10-course lute.
>   I would be very, very, *very* grateful if you could post me some indication
>   regarding 8-course lute music pieces to avoid selling my lute to finally get
>   a 6-course...
>   Thank you in advance,
>   Luca
>
>
>To get on or off this list see list information at
>http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
>
>  
>

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[LUTE] Re: 8-course lute literature?

[David Rastall]

On Aug 17, 2006, at 4:37 AM, Luca Manassero wrote:

>I own a splendid 8-course lute made by Stephen Barber and Sandi  
> Harris and
>suddenly started wondering why I *ever* bought an 8 course lute.  
> In fact, I
>either stumble on "pure" 6-course lute tablatures or on a  
> Baroque repertoire
>written evidently for a 10-course lute.
>I would be very, very, *very* grateful if you could post me some  
> indication
>regarding 8-course lute music pieces to avoid selling my lute to  
> finally get
>a 6-course...

Dear Luca,

Think of your 8-course lute as a 6-course with two extra basses.   
That makes it the most versatile of all the renaissance lutes!  The  
10-course, with four extra basses, is a bit too heavy for the early 6- 
course polyphony , but only having two extra basses does not IMO ruin  
the "pure" 6-course sound.

When the music contains chords, that's when you can use the extra  
bass courses:  when you play F and D chords on an 8-course you can  
play the bass notes an octave lower if you want to.  Sometimes the  
music calls for that, and sometimes it's fun just to play them that way.

David R
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
www.rastallmusic.com





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[LUTE] Re: 8-course lute literature?

[Jo . Luedtke]

Dear Luca,
take a look into the music of Pietro Paolo Raimondo's Libro de Sonate
diverse 1601, e.g. (a Ms. in Como, published in facsimile in 1980).
Courses 7 and 8 come in diverse tunings in this book - as is the case
with other Italian lute manuscripts around and after 1600 - which makes
it a bit uncomfortable to play the pieces, but there is nice music in
this manuscript. 
Simone Molinaro's Intavolatura from 1599 (Facsimile: SPES) asks for an
8-course instrument. Most of the pieces are pretty hard to play but the
music is fascinating ...
Best wishes,
Joachim

 "Luca Manassero"  schrieb:
> 
>Dear all,
>as an amateur lute player studying in Italy I tend to spend most of my time
>playing Italian lute music from the XVI century. Well, I guess this happens
>to everybody, anyway... ;-)
>I own a splendid 8-course lute made by Stephen Barber and Sandi Harris and
>suddenly started wondering why I *ever* bought an 8 course lute. In fact, I
>either stumble on "pure" 6-course lute tablatures or on a Baroque 
> repertoire
>written evidently for a 10-course lute.
>I would be very, very, *very* grateful if you could post me some indication
>regarding 8-course lute music pieces to avoid selling my lute to finally 
> get
>a 6-course...
>Thank you in advance,
>Luca
> 
> 
> To get on or off this list see list information at
> http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
> 
> 
  
-- 
Dr. Joachim Lüdtke
Frühlingsstraße 9a
D - 93164 Laaber
Tel. +49-+9498 / 905 188

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[LUTE] Re: 8-course lute literature?

[Phalese]

In einer eMail vom 17.08.2006 10:39:29 Westeurop=E4ische Normalzeit schreibt 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]: 

>   Dear all,
>   as an amateur lute player studying in Italy I tend to spend most of my 
> time
>   playing Italian lute music from the XVI century. Well, I guess this 
> happens
>   to everybody, anyway... ;-)
>   I own a splendid 8-course lute made by Stephen Barber and Sandi Harris and
>   suddenly started wondering why I *ever* bought an 8 course lute. In fact, 
> I
>   either stumble on "pure" 6-course lute tablatures or on a Baroque 
> repertoire
>   written evidently for a 10-course lute.
>   I would be very, very, *very* grateful if you could post me some 
> indication
>   regarding 8-course lute music pieces to avoid selling my lute to finally 
> get
>   a 6-course...
>   Thank you in advance,
>   Luca

Hi,

if you are mainly playing early Italian repertoire, then a 6course instrument 
would have been the better choice. Even if you wanted to play English music 
around 1590 you would have no problem finding enough repertoire.

But that said there is a huge amount of 7course music. An awful lot of which 
needs a low F. Most English lute songs need a low D and also a lot of the solo 
music. An 8course instrument is therefore useful in this respect. But I 
prefer 7 course instruments as I find the F course can get in the way.

There is not so much 8 course music compared with 6 or 7 course, but there is 
enough to keep you going for a lifetime.
best wishes
Mark
www.myspace.com/pantagruelian

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