Re: VoiceOver: a convenient option for the sighted?

[Nicolai Svendsen]

Hi!

I tend to agree with this. I've met very few employees who know about 
VoiceOver, but those who have have been knowledgeable in that area. I've 
watched Youtube videos where people deliberately go out of their way to display 
"accessibility" on iOS, and when VoiceOver is on they refer to the gestures as 
"messed up" and "useless" simply because they lack the ability to understand 
them, or even read a user manual. Amusingly enough, he tried to scroll on the 
screen using the sighted scrolling gesture even though his iPhone told him how 
to scroll using VoiceOver.

Given the title, sighted users attempting to demonstrate an accessibility tool 
like VoiceOver gives people a bad impression of it, regardless of their 
disability. This is particularly true if they don't know how to properly use 
it. The video in question has had comments like "OH god I couldn't figure out 
how to turn it of thx!" which again makes the user manuals readily available to 
any user useless, simply because people panic instead of thinking rationally.

Again, reviews like these are horrible because it gives the tool in question a 
very bad reputation, and regardless of how in-depth the video happens to me it 
always has an impact. That's definitely the case particularly if the user has 
posted trustworthy information in the past. Of course, sending in a comment 
yields a single word as a reply, that being "SUBSCRIBE!" without addressing the 
problem.

This discussion could go on, though.

Regards,
Nicolai
On Oct 26, 2011, at 11:04 PM, Travis Siegel wrote:

> And, though it's off topic, I've tried to get the media access group at wgbh 
> to market their dvs videos to sighted folks as well, for exactly those same 
> kinds of reasons.  Watching a movie in the car while going to work? Wow, 
> helping adhd kids concentrate on what's going on? check, helping folks keep 
> track of the action while they're away from the set? yep.
> There's all kinds of things sighted folks could find to do with such a thing, 
> but for whatever reason, they just don't seem interested. 
> I suspect vo will be similar.  Sure apple mentions it in their marketing 
> material, but how many sighted folks do you know that actually use it?
> I've seen posts on other apple lists where folks accidentally turned it on, 
> and didn't know how to turn it off, and trust me, they weren't happy the 
> computer was talking.
> It's all about education, and I honestly think apple has tried, but most of 
> the apple stores I've been in don't even know about vo, and those that do 
> haven't a clue how full featured it actually is.
> That's a real shame, all sorts of folks could benefit from it's use, but too 
> many just don't ever find out about it, or of those who do, most never learn 
> how it works.
> 
> I know it's human nature, but I really wish folks were better informed about 
> it.
> I actually pointed out the accessibility of apple products off the shelf on a 
> post about Steve Job's death, and though it did warant a reply by the 
> article's author, it was merely to indicate that he'd not thought about that 
> aspect of things. 
> 
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Re: VoiceOver: a convenient option for the sighted?

[Travis Siegel]

And, though it's off topic, I've tried to get the media access group  
at wgbh to market their dvs videos to sighted folks as well, for  
exactly those same kinds of reasons.  Watching a movie in the car  
while going to work? Wow, helping adhd kids concentrate on what's  
going on? check, helping folks keep track of the action while they're  
away from the set? yep.
There's all kinds of things sighted folks could find to do with such  
a thing, but for whatever reason, they just don't seem interested.  

I suspect vo will be similar.  Sure apple mentions it in their  
marketing material, but how many sighted folks do you know that  
actually use it?
I've seen posts on other apple lists where folks accidentally turned  
it on, and didn't know how to turn it off, and trust me, they weren't  
happy the computer was talking.
It's all about education, and I honestly think apple has tried, but  
most of the apple stores I've been in don't even know about vo, and  
those that do haven't a clue how full featured it actually is.
That's a real shame, all sorts of folks could benefit from it's use,  
but too many just don't ever find out about it, or of those who do,  
most never learn how it works.


I know it's human nature, but I really wish folks were better  
informed about it.
I actually pointed out the accessibility of apple products off the  
shelf on a post about Steve Job's death, and though it did warant a  
reply by the article's author, it was merely to indicate that he'd  
not thought about that aspect of things. 


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Re: VoiceOver: a convenient option for the sighted?

[Ian McNamara]

hi yep i do think that voiceover could be useful for some sighted people 
although i don't think that a lot of the genral public would want to take the 
time to learn the diferent jesjures that are needed.

Ian McNamara
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Re: VoiceOver: a convenient option for the sighted?

[Jane]

I already know of soe sighted people who use VoiceOver here i the uS> One Apple 
employee uses it to check Twitter on his way to work.  Others use it for 
similar tasks.  Some use it to listen to books with iBooks, just as you said.

Jane




On Oct 26, 2011, at 5:14 AM, chris hallsworth wrote:

> Hello all.
> Thought I would bring this up for discussion.
> I had a support worker this morning who has an iPhone 4. I mentioned that it 
> can be used by the blind and visually impaired thanks to VoiceOver. So I made 
> them aware of where to turn on VoiceOver. But I had some ideas that came into 
> my mind.
> 1. You could be reading a book, but you would rather listen to it than 
> looking at it.
> 2. You could be driving. Here in the UK drivers are prohibited from looking 
> at their mobile phones, including iPhones, while driving. So they could 
> perhaps use VoiceOver so they can hear when a call is coming in or listen to 
> a message they received. Of course the call would have to be made through a 
> handsfree kit.
> So what do you think to the idea that VoiceOver, if made aware by the general 
> public, could in fact be used as a convenient option for the sighted?
> I look forward to this discussion.
> Chat soon.
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Re: VoiceOver: a convenient option for the sighted?

[Nicolai Svendsen]

Hi Chris,

I actually have a sighted classmate at university who uses VoiceOVer to read 
iBooks. However, I do know that iBooks also has a setting which lets you read 
kids books aloud, I believe, but I'm not sure if this extends to all books or 
simply depending on the author's permission.

However, it does mean that he knows how to even navigate the phone with 
VoiceOver, and though he uses Navigon, he still finds it useful to tap the 
directions sometimes in the car.

I'd definitely agree with you that VoiceOver can be a very convenient tool.

Regards,
Nicolai
On Oct 26, 2011, at 11:14 AM, chris hallsworth wrote:

> Hello all.
> Thought I would bring this up for discussion.
> I had a support worker this morning who has an iPhone 4. I mentioned that it 
> can be used by the blind and visually impaired thanks to VoiceOver. So I made 
> them aware of where to turn on VoiceOver. But I had some ideas that came into 
> my mind.
> 1. You could be reading a book, but you would rather listen to it than 
> looking at it.
> 2. You could be driving. Here in the UK drivers are prohibited from looking 
> at their mobile phones, including iPhones, while driving. So they could 
> perhaps use VoiceOver so they can hear when a call is coming in or listen to 
> a message they received. Of course the call would have to be made through a 
> handsfree kit.
> So what do you think to the idea that VoiceOver, if made aware by the general 
> public, could in fact be used as a convenient option for the sighted?
> I look forward to this discussion.
> Chat soon.
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> 
> To reply to this post, please address your message to 
> mac-access@mac-access.net
> 
> You can find an archive of all messages postedto the Mac-Access forum at 
> either the list's own dedicated web archive:
> 
> or at the public Mail Archive:
> .
> Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from:
> 
> 
> The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and 
> worm-free!
> 
> Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting 
> the list website at:
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