Re: Multiple accounts and iCloud?
On 09/06/2011, at 4:15 AM, objectwerks inc wrote: Just FYI: Here is the relevant section from the iTunes USA TC pages http://www.apple.com/legal/itunes/us/terms.html Great - thank you. AUTOMATIC DELIVERY AND DOWNLOADING PREVIOUS PURCHASES BETA Interesting it is beta? Association of Associated Devices is subject to the following terms: (i) You may auto-download iTunes Eligible Content or download previously-purchased iTunes Eligible Content from an Account on up to 10 Associated Devices, provided no more than 5 are iTunes-authorized computers. 10 devices and only 5 of them are computers (where you have to authorize for an account). I would have thought iPhones and iPod touches would be considered computers as well? Maybe not because you don't have access to file system? (ii) An Associated Device can be associated with only one Account at any given time. Ok. (iii) You may switch an Associated Device to a different Account only once every 90 days. This is interesting / strange. I change the iTunes store account on my Mac and iPhone often (sometimes many times in a day). Does this only relate to non iOS devices like iPod nanos and shuffles? (iv) You may download previously-purchased free content onto an unlimited number of devices while it is free on the iTunes Service, but on no more than 5 iTunes-authorized computers. Unlimited devices but only 5 iTunes-authorized computers? Why this limitation for free content? AUTOMATIC DELIVERY AND DOWNLOADING PREVIOUS PURCHASES BETA When you first acquire App Store Products, as defined below, (excluding products acquired from the Mac App Store) or iBookstore Products, as defined below, through the App and Book Services (collectively, “Eligible Content”), you may elect to automatically receive (“auto-download”) copies of such Eligible Content on additional compatible iOS Devices and iTunes-authorizedcomputers with compatible software by associating such iOS Devices and computers subject to the association rules below (each, an “Associated Device”). For each Associated Device, you may specify which type of Eligible Content, if any, may be auto-downloaded to it. On an Associated Device that is capable of receiving push notifications (“Push-Enabled”), including iOS Devices, the Eligible Content will auto-download to that Associated Device when it has an Internet connection; on an Associated Device that is not Push-Enabled, including those running on the Windows operating system, Eligible Content will automatically appear in the download queue and you may manually initiate the download within iTunes. Again, push sounds like this is beta for iCloud? (i) You may auto-download Eligible Content or download previously-purchased Eligible Content from an Account on up to 10 Associated Devices, provided no more than 5 are iTunes-authorized computers. So apps to 10 devices of which only 5 can be computers (Macs I guess). (ii) An Associated Device can be associated with only one Account at any given time. (iii) You may switch an Associated Device to a different Account only once every 90 days. Hmm, not sure I understand this or that it is being enforced? The above terms (i) to (iv) do not apply to App Store Products. Products? They mean electronics / accessories? Can someone simplify all this? How is it supposed to work for a household of 4 people who wish to share music and apps? Are we supposed to share apps like we share music? Cheers, Ashley. ___ MacOSX-talk mailing list MacOSX-talk@omnigroup.com http://www.omnigroup.com/mailman/listinfo/macosx-talk
Re: Multiple accounts and iCloud?
This is all based on my non-lawyerly reading On Jun 9, 2011, at 2:29 AM, Ashley Aitken wrote: (iii)You may switch an Associated Device to a different Account only once every 90 days. This is interesting / strange. I change the iTunes store account on my Mac and iPhone often (sometimes many times in a day). Does this only relate to non iOS devices like iPod nanos and shuffles? This is not what account you log in to from you iPhone (for example to purchase from the app store). It is the account set for auto-push download stuff from iCloud. (iv) You may download previously-purchased free content onto an unlimited number of devices while it is free on the iTunes Service, but on no more than 5 iTunes-authorized computers. Unlimited devices but only 5 iTunes-authorized computers? Why this limitation for free content? It is not free content. It is previously purchased content that can be re-downloaded for free. AUTOMATIC DELIVERY AND DOWNLOADING PREVIOUS PURCHASES BETA When you first acquire App Store Products, as defined below, (excluding products acquired from the Mac App Store) or iBookstore Products, as defined below, through the App and Book Services (collectively, “Eligible Content”), you may elect to automatically receive (“auto-download”) copies of such Eligible Content on additional compatible iOS Devices and iTunes-authorizedcomputers with compatible software by associating such iOS Devices and computers subject to the association rules below (each, an “Associated Device”). For each Associated Device, you may specify which type of Eligible Content, if any, may be auto-downloaded to it. On an Associated Device that is capable of receiving push notifications (“Push-Enabled”), including iOS Devices, the Eligible Content will auto-download to that Associated Device when it has an Internet connection; on an Associated Device that is not Push-Enabled, including those running on the Windows operating system, Eligible Content will automatically appear in the download queue and you may manually initiate the download within iTunes. Again, push sounds like this is beta for iCloud? (i) You may auto-download Eligible Content or download previously-purchased Eligible Content from an Account on up to 10 Associated Devices, provided no more than 5 are iTunes-authorized computers. So apps to 10 devices of which only 5 can be computers (Macs I guess). (ii) An Associated Device can be associated with only one Account at any given time. (iii)You may switch an Associated Device to a different Account only once every 90 days. Hmm, not sure I understand this or that it is being enforced? The above terms (i) to (iv) do not apply to App Store Products. Products? They mean electronics / accessories? That did not make sense. Can someone simplify all this? How is it supposed to work for a household of 4 people who wish to share music and apps? Are we supposed to share apps like we share music? Cheers, Ashley. ___ MacOSX-talk mailing list MacOSX-talk@omnigroup.com http://www.omnigroup.com/mailman/listinfo/macosx-talk ___ MacOSX-talk mailing list MacOSX-talk@omnigroup.com http://www.omnigroup.com/mailman/listinfo/macosx-talk
Re: Multiple accounts and iCloud?
On Tue, Jun 7, 2011 at 23:16, Jean-Christophe Helary jean.christophe.hel...@gmail.com wrote: On 8 juin 2011, at 11:34, Arno Hautala wrote: I also wonder how they're pulling off iTunes Match. Is it a tag editor away from downloading any track at will? Or is there some sort of acoustic hash that protects against this attack? Even if there is a hash, how soon will we see a DropShip style app that generates the appropriate data, or directly spoofs the iTunes connection? Why would it matter ? More controversy for one. [...] but the bad guys have not waited for Apple to get their good quality free stuff. No, that's true, but I've already seen plenty of comments about Apple legalizing years of pirated downloads. Where DropShip isn't a feasible file sharing paradigm, iTunesDrop (NeedleDrop?) certainly could be. And, you'd be getting the files directly from an official channel. And I'm guessing that Apple will do some monitoring and keep tabs on suspect matching requests too. Like, there are economical and physical limitations to the number of CDs a normal human being is capable of owning... I doubt that they will do any monitoring of this. They certainly don't want to get involved in calling people out as thieves based on their past purchasing habits. Even assuming 25 tracks per disc (overall pretty generous I think) the 25000 songs that Apple mentions (I doubt this is actually a yearly limit) comes out to over 1000 CDs. That's not unreasonable for a large collection, but surely quite small for some customers. It just seems like a sticky issue to me and I'd love to hear what Apple was able to tell ($?) the labels that persuaded them this wouldn't be a problem. I also can't wait to see how iTunes Match operates. And with the Download Previous Purchases, I'm sure glad I didn't pay to upgrade my purchased tracks when they upgraded to 256 kbps. -- arno s hautala /-| a...@alum.wpi.edu pgp b2c9d448 ___ MacOSX-talk mailing list MacOSX-talk@omnigroup.com http://www.omnigroup.com/mailman/listinfo/macosx-talk
Re: Multiple accounts and iCloud?
On Jun 8, 2011, at 12:36 AM, objectwerks inc wrote: On Jun 7, 2011, at 5:39 PM, Nathan Sims wrote: Looks to me like the writing's on the wall. I don't think it'll be very long before content from the iTunes store is streamed, not downloaded, i.e. you can enjoy but not own it. The rest is all downhill from there. If Apple wanted to do streaming, they would have done it by now. They know that is a losing proposition. I read an article yesterday -- wish I had saved a link -- that basically expounded on this and why all the iCloud will be a streaming service people will wrong. It meshes with what Steve has said all along.Apple is not pushing you to a streaming only setup. They know that won't fly. Not just that. There was an actual breakdown of the amount of money you get from streaming versus buying. The amount of plays you need for streaming to pay off is astronomical when compared to simple sales. I use a streaming music service as a supplement, kind of like radio. I don't want to have to trust that I have a network connection to get the data, I prefer having a cloud component but not requiring it. This seems to be the tack Apple is taking as well, I think it is the smart one. --Larry___ MacOSX-talk mailing list MacOSX-talk@omnigroup.com http://www.omnigroup.com/mailman/listinfo/macosx-talk
Re: Multiple accounts and iCloud?
On Jun 6, 2011, at 2:04 PM, Ashley Aitken wrote: On our iOS devices and iTunes we use multiple accounts (family members, work) for apps, music, etc. Some are even international accounts (used for purchases that were not available locally or cheaper in an O/S store). I've recently run into the limit that an iOS device can only have content from 5 accounts - that's a pain. I'm now wondering if anyone has a hint as to how iCloud will work with multiple accounts. I'm thinking that we're going to have to consolidate accounts (i.e. repurchase apps and music for one family account). Now for international accounts we probably deserve it but are family member really expected to buy separate copies of music and apps? We share the devices but we've had separate accounts so kids can manage their own spending etc. Probably too early for anyone to know and probably not much we can do but I hope iCloud is multiple account friendly. Cheers, Ashley. ___ MacOSX-talk mailing list MacOSX-talk@omnigroup.com http://www.omnigroup.com/mailman/listinfo/macosx-talk Just FYI: Here is the relevant section from the iTunes USA TC pages http://www.apple.com/legal/itunes/us/terms.html AUTOMATIC DELIVERY AND DOWNLOADING PREVIOUS PURCHASES BETA When you first acquire music iTunes Products and music video iTunes Products (collectively, “iTunes Eligible Content”), you may elect to automatically receive (“auto-download”) copies of such iTunes Eligible Content on additional compatible iOS Devices and iTunes-authorized computers with compatible software by associating such iOS Devices and computers subject to the association rules below (each, an “Associated Device”). For each Associated Device, you may specify which type of iTunes Eligible Content, if any, may be auto-downloaded to it. On an Associated Device that is capable of receiving push notifications (“Push-Enabled”), including iOS Devices, the iTunes Eligible Content will auto-download to that Associated Device when it has an Internet connection; on an Associated Device that is not Push-Enabled, including those running on the Windows operating system, iTunes Eligible Content will automatically appear in the download queue and you may manually initiate the download within iTunes. As an accommodation to you, subsequent to acquiring iTunes Eligible Content, you may download certain of such previously-purchased iTunes Eligible Content onto any Associated Device. Some iTunes Eligible Content that you previously purchased may not be available for subsequent download at any given time, and Apple shall have no liability to you in such event. As you may not be able to subsequently download certain previously-purchased iTunes Eligible Content, once you download an item of iTunes Eligible Content, it is your responsibility not to lose, destroy, or damage it, and you may want to back it up. Association of Associated Devices is subject to the following terms: (i) You may auto-download iTunes Eligible Content or download previously-purchased iTunes Eligible Content from an Account on up to 10 Associated Devices, provided no more than 5 are iTunes-authorized computers. (ii)An Associated Device can be associated with only one Account at any given time. (iii) You may switch an Associated Device to a different Account only once every 90 days. (iv)You may download previously-purchased free content onto an unlimited number of devices while it is free on the iTunes Service, but on no more than 5 iTunes-authorized computers. Some pieces of iTunes Eligible Content may be large, and significant data charges may result from delivery of such iTunes Eligible Content over a data connection. --- AUTOMATIC DELIVERY AND DOWNLOADING PREVIOUS PURCHASES BETA When you first acquire App Store Products, as defined below, (excluding products acquired from the Mac App Store) or iBookstore Products, as defined below, through the App and Book Services (collectively, “Eligible Content”), you may elect to automatically receive (“auto-download”) copies of such Eligible Content on additional compatible iOS Devices and iTunes-authorizedcomputers with compatible software by associating such iOS Devices and computers subject to the association rules below (each, an “Associated Device”). For each Associated Device, you may specify which type of Eligible Content, if any, may be auto-downloaded to it. On an Associated Device that is capable of receiving push notifications (“Push-Enabled”), including iOS Devices, the Eligible Content will auto-download to that Associated Device when it has an Internet connection; on an Associated Device that is not Push-Enabled, including those running on the Windows operating system, Eligible Content will automatically appear in the download queue and you may manually initiate the download within iTunes. As an accommodation to you,
Re: Multiple accounts and iCloud?
On Jun 6, 2011, at 16:04, Ashley Aitken mrhat...@mac.com wrote: Now for international accounts we probably deserve it but are family member really expected to buy separate copies of music and apps? I never wanted to be in a position of rebuying anything, so everything has always been purchased on a single account. This has its own share of problems with syncing Devices, and pretty much means I have to sync every device myself. I've found the tradeoff acceptable as the last thing I wanted to do was manage multiple accounts with multiple purchase histories. The problem that I have now is that my AppleID necessarily has a fairly simple password (I have to type it frequently on my iPhone), and I have my iOS and OS X developer accounts on it as well. When it comes time to renew, I may create a second Apple ID just for those. As far as I know, there is currently no way to combine accounts into one, and Apple does allow five accounts to cohabitate on your phone. This seems to be a magic number for 'family' as we see it all the time but I wonder what families with 4 or 5 kids do for mobile 'family plans'? ___ MacOSX-talk mailing list MacOSX-talk@omnigroup.com http://www.omnigroup.com/mailman/listinfo/macosx-talk
Re: Multiple accounts and iCloud?
Anybody else get a queasy feeling about iCloud? iCloud: All your data are belong to us! ___ MacOSX-talk mailing list MacOSX-talk@omnigroup.com http://www.omnigroup.com/mailman/listinfo/macosx-talk
Re: Multiple accounts and iCloud?
On 8 juin 2011, at 00:54, Nathan Sims wrote: Anybody else get a queasy feeling about iCloud? iCloud: All your data are belong to us! Sure, but the business model is different. With Google, your data _is_ the product. With Apple, your data is a byproduct of the process. And the process is the product. Jean-Christophe Helary fun: http://mac4translators.blogspot.com work: http://www.doublet.jp (ja/en fr) tweets: http://twitter.com/brandelune ___ MacOSX-talk mailing list MacOSX-talk@omnigroup.com http://www.omnigroup.com/mailman/listinfo/macosx-talk
Re: Multiple accounts and iCloud?
On Jun 7, 2011, at 11:18 AM, Jean-Christophe Helary jean.christophe.hel...@gmail.com wrote: On 8 juin 2011, at 00:54, Nathan Sims wrote: Anybody else get a queasy feeling about iCloud? iCloud: All your data are belong to us! Sure, but the business model is different. With Google, your data _is_ the product. With Apple, your data is a byproduct of the process. And the process is the product. they'll still cave to the Feds. Or Hollyweird. Pure queasiness. g./ ___ MacOSX-talk mailing list MacOSX-talk@omnigroup.com http://www.omnigroup.com/mailman/listinfo/macosx-talk
Re: Multiple accounts and iCloud?
On Jun 7, 2011, at 11:54, Nathan Sims newsli...@autonomy.caltech.edu wrote: Anybody else get a queasy feeling about iCloud? iCloud: All your data are belong to us! Not so far. I will almost certainly pay the $25 a year to out most if my iTunes collection on it. I have over 200GB of songs, and this will not only free up iOS space, but also will allow me to access some rarely listened to music when I am away from my computer. As for the rest, I already sync all my mobile me stuff to my phones, this is just the same thing for free. ___ MacOSX-talk mailing list MacOSX-talk@omnigroup.com http://www.omnigroup.com/mailman/listinfo/macosx-talk
Re: Multiple accounts and iCloud?
On Jun 7, 2011, at 9:38 AM, LuKreme wrote: On Jun 7, 2011, at 11:54, Nathan Sims newsli...@autonomy.caltech.edu wrote: Anybody else get a queasy feeling about iCloud? iCloud: All your data are belong to us! Not so far. I will almost certainly pay the $25 a year to out most if my iTunes collection on it. I have over 200GB of songs, and this will not only free up iOS space, but also will allow me to access some rarely listened to music when I am away from my computer. As for the rest, I already sync all my mobile me stuff to my phones, this is just the same thing for free. With the iCloud paradigm, you no longer own your data; you're only granted access to it, and then only according to their rules. Did I not drink the right KoolAid or something? ___ MacOSX-talk mailing list MacOSX-talk@omnigroup.com http://www.omnigroup.com/mailman/listinfo/macosx-talk
Re: Multiple accounts and iCloud?
With the iCloud paradigm, you no longer own your data; you're only granted access to it, and then only according to their rules. Did I not drink the right KoolAid or something? I got upset about this too, but the realized that I don't have to use it and can still keep my data at home. I did make a new super password to help prevent unexpected charges from the Apple store when I realized that my old Apple ID made me vulnerable. ___ MacOSX-talk mailing list MacOSX-talk@omnigroup.com http://www.omnigroup.com/mailman/listinfo/macosx-talk
Re: Multiple accounts and iCloud?
On Jun 7, 2011, at 12:04 PM, Nathan Sims wrote: With the iCloud paradigm, you no longer own your data; you're only granted access to it, and then only according to their rules. Did I not drink the right KoolAid or something? I believe you misunderstood the keynote. You really should revisit the keynote, in particular Steve's explanation of iCloud. I think you'll come to an entirely different conclusion. At least you should! K ___ MacOSX-talk mailing list MacOSX-talk@omnigroup.com http://www.omnigroup.com/mailman/listinfo/macosx-talk
Re: Multiple accounts and iCloud?
On Jun 7, 2011, at 12:52 PM, Kevin Callahan wrote: On Jun 7, 2011, at 12:04 PM, Nathan Sims wrote: With the iCloud paradigm, you no longer own your data; you're only granted access to it, and then only according to their rules. Did I not drink the right KoolAid or something? I believe you misunderstood the keynote. You really should revisit the keynote, in particular Steve's explanation of iCloud. I think you'll come to an entirely different conclusion. At least you should! Okay, to be fair I'll rewatch that portion of it. But here's where I'm coming from: Shouldn't the real iCloud be where everyone has his own? That's the product I was hoping they were going to come out with: My iMac is my iCloud or some such. Same functionality and availability but *I own my data*. Why would I want all my stuff to reside on _their_ server, not mine? I can get to my IP as easily as I can get to theirs. I would think a simple software product atop OSX could easily take care of this, and they wouldn't have to build that monstrous big iron mainframe complex in Virginia or wherever, which really sounds like Old Think to me... Isn't replicated and distributed the 21st century way? ___ MacOSX-talk mailing list MacOSX-talk@omnigroup.com http://www.omnigroup.com/mailman/listinfo/macosx-talk
Re: Multiple accounts and iCloud?
The chances that a home DSL or Cable connection can send up data as fast as their data center can send it down, coupled with ISP bandwidth monthly caps, and things like outages or power failures make that idea less than ideal for me. Plus iCloud is free, and for $25 more they will upgrade 25,000 of my favorite songs to high quality. But your data doesn't JUST reside on their servers. It also resides on a home mac - and a subset resides on your iOS devices. Sent from my iPhone On Jun 7, 2011, at 4:14 PM, Nathan Sims newsli...@autonomy.caltech.edu wrote: On Jun 7, 2011, at 12:52 PM, Kevin Callahan wrote: On Jun 7, 2011, at 12:04 PM, Nathan Sims wrote: With the iCloud paradigm, you no longer own your data; you're only granted access to it, and then only according to their rules. Did I not drink the right KoolAid or something? I believe you misunderstood the keynote. You really should revisit the keynote, in particular Steve's explanation of iCloud. I think you'll come to an entirely different conclusion. At least you should! Okay, to be fair I'll rewatch that portion of it. But here's where I'm coming from: Shouldn't the real iCloud be where everyone has his own? That's the product I was hoping they were going to come out with: My iMac is my iCloud or some such. Same functionality and availability but *I own my data*. Why would I want all my stuff to reside on _their_ server, not mine? I can get to my IP as easily as I can get to theirs. I would think a simple software product atop OSX could easily take care of this, and they wouldn't have to build that monstrous big iron mainframe complex in Virginia or wherever, which really sounds like Old Think to me... Isn't replicated and distributed the 21st century way? ___ MacOSX-talk mailing list MacOSX-talk@omnigroup.com http://www.omnigroup.com/mailman/listinfo/macosx-talk ___ MacOSX-talk mailing list MacOSX-talk@omnigroup.com http://www.omnigroup.com/mailman/listinfo/macosx-talk
Re: Multiple accounts and iCloud?
On Jun 7, 2011, at 12:37, Ashley Aitken mrhat...@mac.com wrote: Yes, there was mention of 10 devices being used with iCloud, so perhaps they will increase the number, but still when everyone in the family has a phone or iPod touch and a desktop, laptop or tablet, then even 10 is small. Now wait a minute, there is no device limit for any content from the Apple stores other than te 5 computer limit for DRM. You can put a single purchase ups app on 100 iPhones. ___ MacOSX-talk mailing list MacOSX-talk@omnigroup.com http://www.omnigroup.com/mailman/listinfo/macosx-talk
Re: Multiple accounts and iCloud?
On Jun 7, 2011, at 15:04, Nathan Sims newsli...@autonomy.caltech.edu wrote: With the iCloud paradigm, you no longer own your data; you're only granted access to it, and then only according to their rules. Did I not drink the right KoolAid or something? What do you base this on? I still have my iTunes library on my computer. It is now accessible to me anywhere I am. ___ MacOSX-talk mailing list MacOSX-talk@omnigroup.com http://www.omnigroup.com/mailman/listinfo/macosx-talk
Re: Multiple accounts and iCloud?
On Jun 7, 2011, at 16:14, Nathan Sims newsli...@autonomy.caltech.edu wrote: That's the product I was hoping they were going to come out with: My iMac is my iCloud or some such. That already exists. It's called Back to my Mac and it's been around for awhile. For most people it is limited in usefulness because they do not treat their computers like servers. ___ MacOSX-talk mailing list MacOSX-talk@omnigroup.com http://www.omnigroup.com/mailman/listinfo/macosx-talk
Re: Multiple accounts and iCloud?
On Jun 7, 2011, at 1:14 PM, Nathan Sims wrote: On Jun 7, 2011, at 12:52 PM, Kevin Callahan wrote: On Jun 7, 2011, at 12:04 PM, Nathan Sims wrote: With the iCloud paradigm, you no longer own your data; you're only granted access to it, and then only according to their rules. Did I not drink the right KoolAid or something? I believe you misunderstood the keynote. You really should revisit the keynote, in particular Steve's explanation of iCloud. I think you'll come to an entirely different conclusion. At least you should! Okay, to be fair I'll rewatch that portion of it. But here's where I'm coming from: Shouldn't the real iCloud be where everyone has his own? That's the product I was hoping they were going to come out with: My iMac is my iCloud or some such. Same functionality and availability but *I own my data*. Why would I want all my stuff to reside on _their_ server, not mine? I can get to my IP as easily as I can get to theirs. I would think a simple software product atop OSX could easily take care of this, and they wouldn't have to build that monstrous big iron mainframe complex in Virginia or wherever, which really sounds like Old Think to me... Isn't replicated and distributed the 21st century way? Steve said the PC/Mac is demoted to device level. But, for those of us with computers and Time Machine backups etc, we still own our data and can opt into using iCloud as a very slick, clean and easy sharing (or sync) service across all devices - and only for that data which we choose to share. If you opt out of iCloud after using it, you still have your data and still own your data. RIght now, I see iCloud as a slick service + much needed, by the way! Thankfully, for non-computer owners, iCloud offers a repository for people who just want an iOS device as their main device. This is a much needed service for millions of potential iOS customers. Will the day come when we put all our stuff in the cloud with no local repository or copy/backup? For some, yes. For others, probably not for a very long time. K ___ MacOSX-talk mailing list MacOSX-talk@omnigroup.com http://www.omnigroup.com/mailman/listinfo/macosx-talk
Re: Multiple accounts and iCloud?
On 08/06/2011, at 5:01 AM, LuKreme wrote: On Jun 7, 2011, at 12:37, Ashley Aitken mrhat...@mac.com wrote: Yes, there was mention of 10 devices being used with iCloud, so perhaps they will increase the number, but still when everyone in the family has a phone or iPod touch and a desktop, laptop or tablet, then even 10 is small. Now wait a minute, there is no device limit for any content from the Apple stores other than te 5 computer limit for DRM. You can put a single purchase ups app on 100 iPhones. Sorry, don't have the time to rewatch the keynote or search, but I'm pretty sure he mentioned a limit of 10 devices, it was just for iTunes Match, but it may be more generally. Now that Macs (iMacs, MacBooks, Mac Pros) are just devices I suspect this applies to them as well, and that's why its larger than 5. Hope we see the details soon. Can anyone else recall what the 10 device limit related to? Cheers, Ashley. ___ MacOSX-talk mailing list MacOSX-talk@omnigroup.com http://www.omnigroup.com/mailman/listinfo/macosx-talk
Re: Multiple accounts and iCloud?
On Jun 7, 2011, at 2:10 PM, Ashley Aitken wrote: On 08/06/2011, at 5:01 AM, LuKreme wrote: On Jun 7, 2011, at 12:37, Ashley Aitken mrhat...@mac.com wrote: Yes, there was mention of 10 devices being used with iCloud, so perhaps they will increase the number, but still when everyone in the family has a phone or iPod touch and a desktop, laptop or tablet, then even 10 is small. Now wait a minute, there is no device limit for any content from the Apple stores other than te 5 computer limit for DRM. You can put a single purchase ups app on 100 iPhones. Sorry, don't have the time to rewatch the keynote or search, but I'm pretty sure he mentioned a limit of 10 devices, it was just for iTunes Match, but it may be more generally. I think if you do your own manual syncing, you can have as many iOS devices as you want. If you use iCloud, then 10 devices per account. I think that's what I heard. Hopefully it will be spelled out somewhere on the Apple site if it isn't already. -K Now that Macs (iMacs, MacBooks, Mac Pros) are just devices I suspect this applies to them as well, and that's why its larger than 5. Hope we see the details soon. Can anyone else recall what the 10 device limit related to? Cheers, Ashley. ___ MacOSX-talk mailing list MacOSX-talk@omnigroup.com http://www.omnigroup.com/mailman/listinfo/macosx-talk The Red Fantasy: http://www.gspguitar.com/jsp2/cart.jsp?action=addCartItemsku=DO695 The Fourth Stream: http://www.gspguitar.com/jsp2/cart.jsp?action=addCartItemsku=DO696 Suite Seattle: http://www.dobermaneditions.com/en/sheet-music-for-guitar/c378033608/p17644453.html Three River Moments: http://www.henry-lemoine.com/en/catalogue/rechercheFiche.html?cotage=27461 Accessorizer: http://www.kevincallahan.org/software/accessorizer.html Homepage: http://www.kevincallahan.org/ http://www.xeniamara.com ___ MacOSX-talk mailing list MacOSX-talk@omnigroup.com http://www.omnigroup.com/mailman/listinfo/macosx-talk
Re: Multiple accounts and iCloud?
On Jun 7, 2011, at 1:23 PM, Patrick Coskren wrote: On Jun 7, 2011, at 4:14 PM, Nathan Sims wrote: But here's where I'm coming from: Shouldn't the real iCloud be where everyone has his own? That's the product I was hoping they were going to come out with: My iMac is my iCloud or some such. Same functionality and availability but *I own my data*. Why would I want all my stuff to reside on _their_ server, not mine? Because a big part of the point is that they want to eliminate the need to have a Mac or PC in order to use an iOS device. Exactly! Look where the graph is taking us: towards NO private data storage, no desktops, everything is 'mobile' and all content (especially licensed content) resides in the cloud except what's needed locally in cache RAM on the device. I'm not quite ready to be so dependent, so tied-in tied-up, to any one single thing -- and to a potential single point of failure at that. No one else feels a bit _powned_ by the paradigm or where it's leading? ___ MacOSX-talk mailing list MacOSX-talk@omnigroup.com http://www.omnigroup.com/mailman/listinfo/macosx-talk
Re: Multiple accounts and iCloud?
On Jun 7, 2011, at 4:08 PM, Nathan Sims wrote: On Jun 7, 2011, at 1:23 PM, Patrick Coskren wrote: On Jun 7, 2011, at 4:14 PM, Nathan Sims wrote: But here's where I'm coming from: Shouldn't the real iCloud be where everyone has his own? That's the product I was hoping they were going to come out with: My iMac is my iCloud or some such. Same functionality and availability but *I own my data*. Why would I want all my stuff to reside on _their_ server, not mine? Because a big part of the point is that they want to eliminate the need to have a Mac or PC in order to use an iOS device. Exactly! Look where the graph is taking us: towards NO private data storage, no desktops, everything is 'mobile' and all content (especially licensed content) resides in the cloud except what's needed locally in cache RAM on the device. I'm not quite ready to be so dependent, so tied-in tied-up, to any one single thing -- and to a potential single point of failure at that. No one else feels a bit _powned_ by the paradigm or where it's leading? Eliminating the need for a Mac or PC is a long way from eliminating the capability of doing local storage etc. I see the desire to eliminate the requirement for a Mac or PC and will use some of the services. However, I will still make my data in my own possession my main copy of the data, personally. Chad ___ MacOSX-talk mailing list MacOSX-talk@omnigroup.com http://www.omnigroup.com/mailman/listinfo/macosx-talk
Re: Multiple accounts and iCloud?
On Jun 7, 2011, at 3:21 PM, objectwerks inc wrote: On Jun 7, 2011, at 4:08 PM, Nathan Sims wrote: On Jun 7, 2011, at 1:23 PM, Patrick Coskren wrote: On Jun 7, 2011, at 4:14 PM, Nathan Sims wrote: But here's where I'm coming from: Shouldn't the real iCloud be where everyone has his own? That's the product I was hoping they were going to come out with: My iMac is my iCloud or some such. Same functionality and availability but *I own my data*. Why would I want all my stuff to reside on _their_ server, not mine? Because a big part of the point is that they want to eliminate the need to have a Mac or PC in order to use an iOS device. Exactly! Look where the graph is taking us: towards NO private data storage, no desktops, everything is 'mobile' and all content (especially licensed content) resides in the cloud except what's needed locally in cache RAM on the device. I'm not quite ready to be so dependent, so tied-in tied-up, to any one single thing -- and to a potential single point of failure at that. No one else feels a bit _powned_ by the paradigm or where it's leading? Eliminating the need for a Mac or PC is a long way from eliminating the capability of doing local storage etc. I see the desire to eliminate the requirement for a Mac or PC and will use some of the services. However, I will still make my data in my own possession my main copy of the data, personally. Looks to me like the writing's on the wall. I don't think it'll be very long before content from the iTunes store is streamed, not downloaded, i.e. you can enjoy but not own it. The rest is all downhill from there. ___ MacOSX-talk mailing list MacOSX-talk@omnigroup.com http://www.omnigroup.com/mailman/listinfo/macosx-talk
Re: Multiple accounts and iCloud?
On Jun 7, 2011, at 18:08, Nathan Sims newsli...@autonomy.caltech.edu wrote: Exactly! Look where the graph is taking us: towards NO private data storage, no desktops, everything is 'mobile' and all content (especially licensed content) resides in the cloud except what's needed locally in cache RAM on the device. I don't see how you are jumping from your data on your machine and backed up and accessible on the cloud to no data on your machine at all. You're making a very large jump that seems to me to be unsupported by any facts. If I am missing missing, I'd love to know what it is. ___ MacOSX-talk mailing list MacOSX-talk@omnigroup.com http://www.omnigroup.com/mailman/listinfo/macosx-talk
Re: Multiple accounts and iCloud?
Nathan, Do use iMap mail or are you still using Pop ? On Jun 7, 2011, at 4:39 PM, Nathan Sims newsli...@autonomy.caltech.edu wrote: On Jun 7, 2011, at 3:21 PM, objectwerks inc wrote: On Jun 7, 2011, at 4:08 PM, Nathan Sims wrote: On Jun 7, 2011, at 1:23 PM, Patrick Coskren wrote: On Jun 7, 2011, at 4:14 PM, Nathan Sims wrote: But here's where I'm coming from: Shouldn't the real iCloud be where everyone has his own? That's the product I was hoping they were going to come out with: My iMac is my iCloud or some such. Same functionality and availability but *I own my data*. Why would I want all my stuff to reside on _their_ server, not mine? Because a big part of the point is that they want to eliminate the need to have a Mac or PC in order to use an iOS device. Exactly! Look where the graph is taking us: towards NO private data storage, no desktops, everything is 'mobile' and all content (especially licensed content) resides in the cloud except what's needed locally in cache RAM on the device. I'm not quite ready to be so dependent, so tied-in tied-up, to any one single thing -- and to a potential single point of failure at that. No one else feels a bit _powned_ by the paradigm or where it's leading? Eliminating the need for a Mac or PC is a long way from eliminating the capability of doing local storage etc. I see the desire to eliminate the requirement for a Mac or PC and will use some of the services. However, I will still make my data in my own possession my main copy of the data, personally. Looks to me like the writing's on the wall. I don't think it'll be very long before content from the iTunes store is streamed, not downloaded, i.e. you can enjoy but not own it. The rest is all downhill from there. ___ MacOSX-talk mailing list MacOSX-talk@omnigroup.com http://www.omnigroup.com/mailman/listinfo/macosx-talk ___ MacOSX-talk mailing list MacOSX-talk@omnigroup.com http://www.omnigroup.com/mailman/listinfo/macosx-talk
Re: Multiple accounts and iCloud?
On Jun 7, 2011, at 5:18 PM, Jacob Danilchik wrote: Do use iMap mail or are you still using Pop ? I use IMAP, but copy the emails off to a local mailbox. I've been bitten too many times in the past by the mail server hiccuping and losing all my mail. ___ MacOSX-talk mailing list MacOSX-talk@omnigroup.com http://www.omnigroup.com/mailman/listinfo/macosx-talk
Re: Multiple accounts and iCloud?
On Jun 7, 2011, at 5:23 PM, Nathan Sims newsli...@autonomy.caltech.edu wrote: On Jun 7, 2011, at 5:18 PM, Jacob Danilchik wrote: Do use iMap mail or are you still using Pop ? I use IMAP, but copy the emails off to a local mailbox. I've been bitten too many times in the past by the mail server hiccuping and losing all my mail. Well, think of ICloud as an imap server for your data. It propagates your data/media to all your devices.Then back up your data to time machine or manually do it so you can sleep well at night. Personally I've never been bitten by apples iMap server , so I guess I'll just keep trusting them. Knock on wood. Anyway, iCloud really isnt storing all your data just noting changes and making sure every device has the same data. It is a great free service and isn't about data mining at all. If it was it goes against everything Apple is about. Just my opinion though. ___ MacOSX-talk mailing list MacOSX-talk@omnigroup.com http://www.omnigroup.com/mailman/listinfo/macosx-talk
Re: Multiple accounts and iCloud?
On Jun 7, 2011, at 5:23 PM, Nathan Sims wrote: On Jun 7, 2011, at 5:18 PM, Jacob Danilchik wrote: Do use iMap mail or are you still using Pop ? I use IMAP, but copy the emails off to a local mailbox. I've been bitten too many times in the past by the mail server hiccuping and losing all my mail. I use POP (yes, I'm consistent) even on GMail, even on domains I own and operate! I use IMAP only on AOL because they don't implement POP. I don't mind, because I don't so much use my AOL accounts as monitor them. And whenever I send sensitive information to anybody (application forms with my birthdate, SSN, bank account numbers; or forms with credit card numbers of clients), I send it in an encrypted PDF and phone in the password. -- Macs R We -- Personal Macintosh Service and Support in the Wickenburg and far Northwest Valley Areas. http://macsrwe.com ___ MacOSX-talk mailing list MacOSX-talk@omnigroup.com http://www.omnigroup.com/mailman/listinfo/macosx-talk
Re: Multiple accounts and iCloud?
On Tue, Jun 7, 2011 at 11:54, Nathan Sims newsli...@autonomy.caltech.edu wrote: Anybody else get a queasy feeling about iCloud? The iCloud queasiness for me stems from the recent controversy over DropBox having access to your data. What will Apple's access be? Did they design iCloud with client side encryption that protects all data from non-user access? I also wonder how they're pulling off iTunes Match. Is it a tag editor away from downloading any track at will? Or is there some sort of acoustic hash that protects against this attack? Even if there is a hash, how soon will we see a DropShip style app that generates the appropriate data, or directly spoofs the iTunes connection? -- arno s hautala /-| a...@alum.wpi.edu pgp b2c9d448 ___ MacOSX-talk mailing list MacOSX-talk@omnigroup.com http://www.omnigroup.com/mailman/listinfo/macosx-talk
Re: Multiple accounts and iCloud?
On 8 juin 2011, at 11:34, Arno Hautala wrote: I also wonder how they're pulling off iTunes Match. Is it a tag editor away from downloading any track at will? Or is there some sort of acoustic hash that protects against this attack? Even if there is a hash, how soon will we see a DropShip style app that generates the appropriate data, or directly spoofs the iTunes connection? Why would it matter ? Apple would not be guilty of distributing copyright protected contents. The user would be guilty of misusing copyright contents. I guess Apple put the price tag only to discourage sunday cheaters to even try that, but the bad guys have not waited for Apple to get their good quality free stuff. And I'm guessing that Apple will do some monitoring and keep tabs on suspect matching requests too. Like, there are economical and physical limitations to the number of CDs a normal human being is capable of owning... Jean-Christophe Helary fun: http://mac4translators.blogspot.com work: http://www.doublet.jp (ja/en fr) tweets: http://twitter.com/brandelune ___ MacOSX-talk mailing list MacOSX-talk@omnigroup.com http://www.omnigroup.com/mailman/listinfo/macosx-talk
Re: Multiple accounts and iCloud?
On Jun 7, 2011, at 23:16, Jean-Christophe Helary jean.christophe.hel...@gmail.com wrote: Like, there are economical and physical limitations to the number of CDs a normal human being is capable of owning... I WI set what those might be. I know two people who are not in the music industry that own more than 10,000 CDs. One of them owns more than 10,000 vinyl albums as well. I'm sure there are people working in music who have more than that. ___ MacOSX-talk mailing list MacOSX-talk@omnigroup.com http://www.omnigroup.com/mailman/listinfo/macosx-talk
Re: Multiple accounts and iCloud?
On Jun 7, 2011, at 5:39 PM, Nathan Sims wrote: Looks to me like the writing's on the wall. I don't think it'll be very long before content from the iTunes store is streamed, not downloaded, i.e. you can enjoy but not own it. The rest is all downhill from there. If Apple wanted to do streaming, they would have done it by now. They know that is a losing proposition. I read an article yesterday -- wish I had saved a link -- that basically expounded on this and why all the iCloud will be a streaming service people will wrong. It meshes with what Steve has said all along.Apple is not pushing you to a streaming only setup. They know that won't fly. ___ MacOSX-talk mailing list MacOSX-talk@omnigroup.com http://www.omnigroup.com/mailman/listinfo/macosx-talk
