Re: Amazon or Hulu on Apple TV?

[Mary Otten]

Hi ‘Donna,
Well, I’m pretty sure Prime and Hulu offer free trials. So perhaps the best way 
to go is to sign up for both and see who’s programming you might like the best. 
I would be shocked if Prime wasn’t fully accessible. I’m not entirely sure 
about Hulu, and Prime does have more original programming also more described 
program. They do have some older shows. Hulu probably has more older shows.
Mary


Sent from my iPhone

> On Jun 9, 2019, at 5:12 PM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi Mary,
> 
> Unfortunately, it's not that simple.  We are not currently Prime members.  so 
> our decision is between signing up for Prime--and getting the free TV--or 
> signing up for Hulu.  If you get Hulu Premium, they cost about the same..
> Cheers,
> Donna
> 
> 
>> On Jun 9, 2019, at 3:46 PM, Mary Otten  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi Donna,
>> Well, since prime is free assuming you are a prime member, that would be a 
>> no brainer. I mean, it won’t cost you anything. Somewhere, I think I heard 
>> that the prime app is self voicing. That might not be true anymore, or I 
>> might simply be misremembering. I hope it isn’t self voicing, because my 
>> experience with self voicing apps on the Amazon platform, Netflix for 
>> instance, is not a happy one. Unless you know of specific things on Hulu 
>> that you want to watch, and you only want one service, I’d go with a freebie.
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On Jun 9, 2019, at 12:15 PM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi Mary,
>>> 
>>> Amazon Prime is what I'm talking about.
>>> Thanks,
>>> Donna
>>> 
>>> 
 On Jun 9, 2019, at 11:20 AM, Mary Otten  wrote:
 
 Hi Donna,
 What do you mean when you say you will be adding Amazon? The only Amazon 
 thing I am aware of is Amazon prime. There’s a lot of free stuff in there 
 for prime members, and there is a good bit of audio described stuff within 
 that. Hulu has just started having audio description. I think they only 
 have a couple of things. But I’m unsure about what you can “subscribe to“ 
 with Amazon as a non-prime member. I really can’t comment on the 
 accessibility of the actual apps on the Apple TV, because I use my Fire TV 
 for Amazon prime, where it is of course, very accessible.
 
 
 Sent from my iPhone
 
> On Jun 9, 2019, at 6:37 AM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> We're thinking about adding a second streaming service--we currently just 
> have Netflix.  We're debating between Amazon and Hulu.  Just wondering if 
> there are any accessibility issues I should be aware of.  We'll be 
> watching on a 4th Gen Apple TV.
> TIA,
> Donna
> 
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Re: new mac books

['Janina Sajka' via MacVisionaries]

Hi, Simon:

Being limited to 8Gb RAM might be a problem if you're running Win10, and
especially if running in a vm.

But, I should think a keyboard you don't like would be even worse.

Can you hold out to see what comes from Apple later in the year? A lot
of people are having issues with the newer keyboards. Seems reasonable
Apple will do something about those complaints.

Janina

Simon Fogarty writes:
> Hi Janina,
> 
>  That' my thoughts also,
> 
>  I can get a 2017 13" air for 2504 NZ dollars,
>  But it's got the custom build with 8gb ram, 2.2GHz I7 processor and 512GB 
> ram,
> Oh and it's got the older keyboard style,
> But now I'm thinking I should just go for a newer pro and get use to the new 
> butterfly keyboard as I'm guessing it's not going anywhere quickly.
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: 'Janina Sajka' via MacVisionaries  
> Sent: Thursday, 6 June 2019 12:20 AM
> To: 'Shawn Krasniuk' via MacVisionaries 
> Subject: Re: new mac books
> 
> Thanks very much for this info, Shawn.
> 
> 
> These days I'm preferring the smallest and lightest physical unit I can get 
> packed to the teeth with RAM, CPU, and SSD. So, a 2017 Air might just be the 
> ticket.
> 
> Janina
> 
> 'Shawn Krasniuk' via MacVisionaries writes:
> > I should've said the 2017 MacBook Air did the startup chime in Mojave which 
> > is what I have.
> > 
> > 
> > > On Jun 3, 2019, at 11:03 PM, 'Shawn Krasniuk' via MacVisionaries 
> > >  wrote:
> > > 
> > > Hi Janina. In Mojave, the 2017 models did make the startup chime. I'm 
> > > currently beta testing Catalina which is 10.15 so I can't say if it's 
> > > still there or not.
> > > 
> > > 
> > >> On Jun 3, 2019, at 12:45 PM, 'Janina Sajka' via MacVisionaries 
> > >>  wrote:
> > >> 
> > >> I'm also interested in this question and wondering whether the 2017 
> > >> models still have the boot chime?
> > >> 
> > >> Janina
> > >> 
> > >> Simon Fogarty writes:
> > >>> Hi Listers,
> > >>> 
> > >>> It's looking like I'm going to have to replace  my mid 2013 11" 
> > >>> MacBookAir,
> > >>> 
> > >>> Currently the closest replacement would be the still currently 
> > >>> available 2017 version of the mac book air, Apart from only being 
> > >>> able to have 16GB ram in them it's an ok machine if spec'ed out 
> > >>> completely,
> > >>> 
> > >>> However what I'm really wondering is if it's really possible for apple 
> > >>> to put the older non butterfly keyboard in to something in the mac book 
> > >>> pro range?
> > >>> 
> > >>> I've been using a mac book pro 2018 for almost a year and I still can't 
> > >>> get use to the keys on the keyboard.
> > >>> Preferring my 11" MBA keyboard.
> > >>> Does anyone know if there is such a customize option for the mac book 
> > >>> line?
> > >>> 
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> > >> 
> > >> Janina Sajka
> > >> 
> > >> Linux Foundation Fellow
> > >> Executive Chair, Accessibility Workgroup:http://a11y.org
> > >> 
> > >> The World Wide Web Consortium (W3C), Web Accessibility Initiative (WAI)
> > >> Chair, Accessible Platform Architectures http://www.w3.org/wai/apa
> > >> 
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> > >> reach Cara at 

Is there a limit on the number of devices you can have signed in to iCloud drive?

['Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries]

If so, what is it?
TIA,
Donna


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Re: Amazon or Hulu on Apple TV?

['Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries]

Hi Mary,

Unfortunately, it's not that simple.  We are not currently Prime members.  so 
our decision is between signing up for Prime--and getting the free TV--or 
signing up for Hulu.  If you get Hulu Premium, they cost about the same..
Cheers,
Donna


> On Jun 9, 2019, at 3:46 PM, Mary Otten  wrote:
> 
> Hi Donna,
> Well, since prime is free assuming you are a prime member, that would be a no 
> brainer. I mean, it won’t cost you anything. Somewhere, I think I heard that 
> the prime app is self voicing. That might not be true anymore, or I might 
> simply be misremembering. I hope it isn’t self voicing, because my experience 
> with self voicing apps on the Amazon platform, Netflix for instance, is not a 
> happy one. Unless you know of specific things on Hulu that you want to watch, 
> and you only want one service, I’d go with a freebie.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Jun 9, 2019, at 12:15 PM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi Mary,
>> 
>> Amazon Prime is what I'm talking about.
>> Thanks,
>> Donna
>> 
>> 
>>> On Jun 9, 2019, at 11:20 AM, Mary Otten  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi Donna,
>>> What do you mean when you say you will be adding Amazon? The only Amazon 
>>> thing I am aware of is Amazon prime. There’s a lot of free stuff in there 
>>> for prime members, and there is a good bit of audio described stuff within 
>>> that. Hulu has just started having audio description. I think they only 
>>> have a couple of things. But I’m unsure about what you can “subscribe to“ 
>>> with Amazon as a non-prime member. I really can’t comment on the 
>>> accessibility of the actual apps on the Apple TV, because I use my Fire TV 
>>> for Amazon prime, where it is of course, very accessible.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
 On Jun 9, 2019, at 6:37 AM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries 
  wrote:
 
 Hi all,
 
 We're thinking about adding a second streaming service--we currently just 
 have Netflix.  We're debating between Amazon and Hulu.  Just wondering if 
 there are any accessibility issues I should be aware of.  We'll be 
 watching on a 4th Gen Apple TV.
 TIA,
 Donna
 
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>> 
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Re: iPadOS

['E.T.' via MacVisionaries]

   Maybe. Let's see what happens in September when iPadOS is officially 
released and the developers come out of the woodwork.


From E.T.'s Keyboard...
   ancient.ali...@icloud.com
Many believe that we have been visited
in the past. What if it were true?

On 6/9/2019 7:20 AM, 'Jason White' via MacVisionaries wrote:

I think you still need a Mac for high-quality braille translation and 
formatting of documents to prepare them for embossing.

On 6/4/19, 17:08, "'E.T.' via MacVisionaries" 
 wrote:

 Considering what is to come this fall for iPads (sadly my model is
 not supported), and the potential to use one as a laptop, one question I
 have is...is it possible to create and emboss braille documents?
 
  From E.T.'s Keyboard...

 ancient.ali...@icloud.com
 Many believe that we have been visited
 in the past. What if it were true?
 
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RE: Map bug on iPhone

[M. Taylor]

Hello Simon,

I know.  I have access to the developer betas.

Mark

-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Simon Fogarty
Sent: Sunday, June 09, 2019 1:21 AM
To: 'macvisionaries@googlegroups.com'
Subject: RE: Map bug on iPhone

Hi Mark,

Just to let you know, only the dev betas are currently out for the new OS 
platforms,

Public betas will be out in July.

Simon F


-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com  On 
Behalf Of M. Taylor
Sent: Sunday, 9 June 2019 6:31 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: Map bug on iPhone

Hello Robert,

I assure you that I, too, experience this same issue.  It has been around for 
the longest time.

However, a little bird, from the Apple orchard, sent me an email, a couple of 
days ago, stating that this glitch should be resolved in iOS13 and that I 
should update my bug report on it, once confirmed.

As yet, I have not downloaded a beta of iOS13 to confirm the claim, but we can 
certainly keep our proverbial fingers crossed, eh?

Happy Travels,

Mark


From: 'Robert Cole' via MacVisionaries [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com]
Sent: Friday, June 07, 2019 6:14 AM
To: Email Groups
Subject: Map bug on iPhone

Dear List,
This bug from 2017  still exists.
Am I the only one who is having this problem?
Using a iPhone 7 with the latest IOS. 

Begin forwarded message:

From: Apple Accessibility 
Date: October 3, 2017 at 7:01:02 PM EDT
To: mr.robertc...@icloud.com
Subject: Re: iOS 11 Maps App Card Grabber TimeOut VoiceOver Bug; Follow-up: 
674583055

Hello Robert,

Thank you for writing to Apple Accessibility. We appreciate your feedback. 
In our testing, we found that the Details overlay is dismissed regardless of 
whether you are using VoiceOver. We will pass this report along to the 
appropriate team.

Sincerely,

Apple Accessibility

On September 29, 2017 at 20:40:37 PM GMT, mr.robertc...@icloud.com wrote:

IOS 10 and
iOS 11 Maps App Card Grabber TimeOut VoiceOver Bug

DESCRIPTION:
In iOS 11, only when VoiceOver is enabled, the full-screen Card Grabber 
display, times-out after 10 seconds, when reviewing the live route details list.

Steps to Reproduce:

1.
Make certain that VoiceOver is enabled.

2.
Open Map and activate a route by selecting a destination and tapping the GO 
button.  Siri will announce a direction instruction; for example, "In one mile, 
turn left onto Main Street."  

3.
Single-finger, double-tap the "Arrival" label, located near the lower left of 
the display in order to activate the Card Grabber which will bring up various 
route options.

4.
Select Details.  A directions list will be displayed.  Unlike for a 
non-VoiceOver user, for whom this list will remain on the screen until the DONE 
button is activated, after approximately ten seconds with or without screen 
activity, the list will disappear as if the VoiceOver user activated the DONE 
button.


Please check this out.

Thank You,
Robert Cole
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To 

Re: mac book pro 2017

['Jason White' via MacVisionaries]

I agree that the better processor is probably worth it in the long run.

On 6/9/19, 04:31, "Simon Fogarty"  wrote:

Hi Janina,

That was my choice also.

 Even the current models are 7th gen processors so I'm not losing anything 
currently.

I actually just went to make th purchase using the IOS app for apple store 
and can't see an option for educational pricing.

So guess I'll use the computer in stead

Thanks Janina,

 Great minds think alike
As for the start up sound, I'll just pretend it is there when the machine 
starts up.




-Original Message-
From: 'Janina Sajka' via MacVisionaries  
Sent: Sunday, 9 June 2019 3:13 PM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: mac book pro 2017

So, I've been playing pretending I didn't have the boot chime and simply 
holding in option for a longish time while pressing the power button second.

I still want the chime, but I can see making it without it. I can reliably 
get to all three of my available environments.

I'd go for the greater processing power of the I7. In the grand scheme of 
things, that's a steal for only $50, because you get to live with the benefits 
for a long time.

Janina

Simon Fogarty writes:
> Na,
> 
>  I've made up my mind as to which one to get.
> 
>  And then cancelled at the last moment the choice I made.
> I've got a choice of 2 machines,
> The only difference is one has the I7 2.5GHz processor an the other 
> has the I5 2.3GHz processor,  other than that, they are the pro 13.3"  
> with 16GB ram, 512GB ssd,  Although one is release date 2017, The 
> other is new as of purchase time.
>  There is only $50 for the upgrade to the I7.
> 
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: 'Janina Sajka' via MacVisionaries 
> 
> Sent: Sunday, 9 June 2019 2:37 AM
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: mac book pro 2017
> 
> Simon, it sounds to me like you're weighing the trade-offs with a clear 
head. Good luck! I expect a few of us will be interested to hear what you 
decide and how it works out.
> 
> Best,
> 
> Janina
> 
> Simon Fogarty writes:
> > Hi Janina,
> > 
> >  The 2017 I7 2.5GHz 16GB ram & 512GB ssd pro has 2 USB-C ports for 
> > charging and connectivity  to go with a crazy new Zealand price of
> > $3179.00 That's a refurbished price, Brand new RRP is approx. 600 more.
> > 
> > But it would be my first choice
> > 
> > I'm thinking over the weekend on what device to purchase.
> > 
> > -Original Message-
> > From: 'Janina Sajka' via MacVisionaries 
> > 
> > Sent: Saturday, 8 June 2019 1:54 AM
> > To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> > Subject: Re: mac book pro 2017
> > 
> > Simon:
> > 
> > That 2017 Pro with an I7 and 16 Gb RAM sounds a lot better. It should 
have a pretty compelling price, because I should think that's pretty baseline 
specs for 64bit Windows 10 under Bootcamp--especially if you also want to run 
the Windows in some kind of vm.
> > 
> > For me it would also need USB 3 ports, at least one, as I've got Linux 
booting off a tiny 256 Gb USB 3 stick that sticks out less far than the 
charging connector on my Air.
> > 
> > Depending on the price and the weight, I will consider that one myself, 
because I'm looking to upgrade and get a few more years out of chiming boots.
> > 
> > I do think asking for "a long time" may be asking a bit much from this 
specification, though.It really does strike me as baseline today.
> > 
> > Best,
> > 
> > Janina
> > 
> > Simon Fogarty writes:
> > > Hi Tim,
> > > 
> > > I’ve gotta couple of options,
> > > 
> > > The air would be a custom build to fully spec’ed out and yes still 
has USB-A and thunderbolt 2.
> > > 
> > > But only 8GB ram,
> > > 
> > > I’m also looking at a 2017 I7 2.5GHz pro with 16gb ram and 512 GB 
> > > ssd, I’m not going to touch bar as that causes trouble with windows 
in bootcamp.
> > > 
> > > Which ever I end up doing it’s a long term thing so it will have to 
be considered carefully.
> > > 
> > > 
> > > From: 'Tim Kilburn' via MacVisionaries 
> > > 
> > > Sent: Friday, 7 June 2019 2:35 AM
> > > To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> > > Subject: Re: mac book pro 2017
> > > 
> > > Hi Simon,
> > > 
> > > Janina may be right :).  No, it doesn't have a boot chime.  I have a 
similar model, but the 3.1 I5 processor and 16 GB of RAM.  It's the one with 
the Touch Bar and 4 USB C ports.  I haven't had any problems with my model 
although, like you, many don't like the feel of the butterfly keys, and some 
are stuck on USB A ports, of which the MBP's have none.  Battery life is good, 
but 

Re: mac book pro 2017

[Anders Holmberg]

Hi!
What’s the difference?
I have an old mac ke yboard connected to my Macbook air.
THe old usb one.
Its till my preference.
/A

> 6 juni 2019 kl. 23:04 skrev 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries 
> :
> 
> I agree with the opposing viewpoint.  I've had my Mac for almost two years 
> now, and I've never made so many typos as I do with the butterfly keyboard.  
> I kept thinking I would get used to it, but I haven't.  I still hate this 
> stupid keyboard.
> Cheers,
> Donna
> 
> 
>> On Jun 6, 2019, at 3:51 PM, Petrus Tuerlings > > wrote:
>> 
>> Okay, I mast be the odd one out, maybe Simon has something when he keeps 
>> referring to me living in Auckland. But I think the butterfly keyboard is 
>> the best I’ve ever had. I can’t comment on the start up chime as I’ve only 
>> had a Mac for about 6 months or so. But it would still be nice to have one.
>> 
>>> On 7/06/2019, at 8:29 AM, lenron brown >> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> Those butterfly keys drive me nuts, and no chime that just breaks my heart.
>>> 
>>> On 6/6/19, 'Tim Kilburn' via MacVisionaries
>>> mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com>> 
>>> wrote:
 Hi Simon,
 
 Janina may be right :).  No, it doesn't have a boot chime.  I have a 
 similar
 model, but the 3.1 I5 processor and 16 GB of RAM.  It's the one with the
 Touch Bar and 4 USB C ports.  I haven't had any problems with my model
 although, like you, many don't like the feel of the butterfly keys, and 
 some
 are stuck on USB A ports, of which the MBP's have none.  Battery life is
 good, but not excellent.  It's nice and light and handles processing big
 jobs well.  If the price is right, I'd go for it.
 
 Later...
 
 Tim Kilburn
 Apple Teacher
 (with Swift Playgrounds Recognition)
 
 
 
 Jamf Certified Associate
 Fort McMurray, AB Canada
 
 On Jun 6, 2019, at 05:38, 'Janina Sajka' via MacVisionaries
 mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com>> 
 wrote:
 
 Hey, Simon. My wish for you is that someone returned these machines
 because they'd heard there shouldn't be a boot chime any longer! 
 
 Janina
 
 PS: I looked at the 2017 Air machines still available today. I'm
 disappointed. It looks to me like the only advantage of leaving my 2014
 Air for a 2017 model is a measly 4Gb more RAM. That's ain't enough
 today, imo.
 
 I'm back to looking at the small Thinkpad X1 Carbon machines for
 laptops. I realize that would leave me out of the Apple eco system. I am
 finding the new minis very attractive, so perhaps I'm thinking
 transitionally.
 
 You all have gotten under my skin enough so that I don't really want to
 leave Apple out of my life. Heck, Safari has become my favorite gui
 browser in recent months. Go figure.
 
 Best,
 
 Janina
 
 Simon Fogarty writes:
> Hi List,
> 
> Just wondering if anyone on the list has a 2017 13.3" Mac book pro with
> 2.3GHz I5 prodessor?
> 
> I'm just looking at one of these model machines from the apple refurbished
> devices and wondered why such a nice sounding machine would have been
> returned to apple?
> I just wondered if this might be a problematic model as there are 3 of
> them showing in the NZ apple website refurbished list.
> 
> Cheers for any information.
> 
> 
> Simon f
> 
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Re: Amazon or Hulu on Apple TV?

[Mary Otten]

Hi Donna,
Well, since prime is free assuming you are a prime member, that would be a no 
brainer. I mean, it won’t cost you anything. Somewhere, I think I heard that 
the prime app is self voicing. That might not be true anymore, or I might 
simply be misremembering. I hope it isn’t self voicing, because my experience 
with self voicing apps on the Amazon platform, Netflix for instance, is not a 
happy one. Unless you know of specific things on Hulu that you want to watch, 
and you only want one service, I’d go with a freebie.


Sent from my iPhone

> On Jun 9, 2019, at 12:15 PM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi Mary,
> 
> Amazon Prime is what I'm talking about.
> Thanks,
> Donna
> 
> 
>> On Jun 9, 2019, at 11:20 AM, Mary Otten  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi Donna,
>> What do you mean when you say you will be adding Amazon? The only Amazon 
>> thing I am aware of is Amazon prime. There’s a lot of free stuff in there 
>> for prime members, and there is a good bit of audio described stuff within 
>> that. Hulu has just started having audio description. I think they only have 
>> a couple of things. But I’m unsure about what you can “subscribe to“ with 
>> Amazon as a non-prime member. I really can’t comment on the accessibility of 
>> the actual apps on the Apple TV, because I use my Fire TV for Amazon prime, 
>> where it is of course, very accessible.
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On Jun 9, 2019, at 6:37 AM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi all,
>>> 
>>> We're thinking about adding a second streaming service--we currently just 
>>> have Netflix.  We're debating between Amazon and Hulu.  Just wondering if 
>>> there are any accessibility issues I should be aware of.  We'll be watching 
>>> on a 4th Gen Apple TV.
>>> TIA,
>>> Donna
>>> 
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Re: Amazon or Hulu on Apple TV?

['Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries]

Hi Mary,

Amazon Prime is what I'm talking about.
Thanks,
Donna


> On Jun 9, 2019, at 11:20 AM, Mary Otten  wrote:
> 
> Hi Donna,
> What do you mean when you say you will be adding Amazon? The only Amazon 
> thing I am aware of is Amazon prime. There’s a lot of free stuff in there for 
> prime members, and there is a good bit of audio described stuff within that. 
> Hulu has just started having audio description. I think they only have a 
> couple of things. But I’m unsure about what you can “subscribe to“ with 
> Amazon as a non-prime member. I really can’t comment on the accessibility of 
> the actual apps on the Apple TV, because I use my Fire TV for Amazon prime, 
> where it is of course, very accessible.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Jun 9, 2019, at 6:37 AM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi all,
>> 
>> We're thinking about adding a second streaming service--we currently just 
>> have Netflix.  We're debating between Amazon and Hulu.  Just wondering if 
>> there are any accessibility issues I should be aware of.  We'll be watching 
>> on a 4th Gen Apple TV.
>> TIA,
>> Donna
>> 
>> -- 
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Re: Amazon or Hulu on Apple TV?

[Mary Otten]

Hi Donna,
What do you mean when you say you will be adding Amazon? The only Amazon thing 
I am aware of is Amazon prime. There’s a lot of free stuff in there for prime 
members, and there is a good bit of audio described stuff within that. Hulu has 
just started having audio description. I think they only have a couple of 
things. But I’m unsure about what you can “subscribe to“ with Amazon as a 
non-prime member. I really can’t comment on the accessibility of the actual 
apps on the Apple TV, because I use my Fire TV for Amazon prime, where it is of 
course, very accessible.


Sent from my iPhone

> On Jun 9, 2019, at 6:37 AM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> We're thinking about adding a second streaming service--we currently just 
> have Netflix.  We're debating between Amazon and Hulu.  Just wondering if 
> there are any accessibility issues I should be aware of.  We'll be watching 
> on a 4th Gen Apple TV.
> TIA,
> Donna
> 
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Re: iBooks

[Ben Constantini]

Thanks Anne , I just  tried it on my mac with an old book I had purchased  
awhile back and it seemed to work okay . I am anxious to see how it works on my 
iPhone xr .

Thanks again , 
Ben Constantini
bennnyconstant...@gmail.com



> On Jun 9, 2019, at 11:48 AM, Anne Robertson  wrote:
> 
> Hello Ben,
> 
> Both on the Mac and on iOS, iBooks is now just called Books. On iOS, it’s 
> very easy to use, rather less so on the Mac.
> Cheers,
> 
> Anne
> 
> 
> 
> 
>> On 9 Jun 2019, at 17:25, N2KPV > > wrote:
>> 
>> I was wondering if anyone uses Ibooks and how accessible it is with 
>> voiceOver . I saw  a book I am interested in and was considering purchasing 
>> it .  I remember a few years back having trouble navigating  it . Hopefully 
>> it has gotten better .
>> 
>> Thanks in advance , Ben C.
>> 
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Re: iBooks

[Anne Robertson]

Hello Ben,

Both on the Mac and on iOS, iBooks is now just called Books. On iOS, it’s very 
easy to use, rather less so on the Mac.
Cheers,

Anne




> On 9 Jun 2019, at 17:25, N2KPV  wrote:
> 
> I was wondering if anyone uses Ibooks and how accessible it is with voiceOver 
> . I saw  a book I am interested in and was considering purchasing it .  I 
> remember a few years back having trouble navigating  it . Hopefully it has 
> gotten better .
> 
> Thanks in advance , Ben C.
> 
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Re: Playing the King's corner on Ios 12

['Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries]

You can't put six of hearts on five of diamonds.  You have to play against the 
opposite color. so diamonds and hearts can only be played on spades and clubs 
or vice versa.  Also, it goes in inverse order, so you can play a 9 on a 10, 8 
on a 9, etc.
Donna

> On Jun 9, 2019, at 10:11 AM, Ramy Moustafa  wrote:
> 
> Hi dear, I swear is that I did what you told me, but the same result let’s 
> say that I need to put six of hearts over five of diamonds, they are not cheap
> 
> Ramy moustafa saber
> licturer at:
> faculty of musical education
> music arranger and sound engineer
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Jun 9, 2019, at 2:23 PM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi Ramy,
>> 
>> You have to make sure that when you lift your finger, you're on the exact 
>> spot where you want to drop the card, otherwise it doesn't work.  so let's 
>> say you want to move a five of clubs and drop it on a six of diamonds.  
>> Double tap and hold on the five of clubs, and move your finger until you 
>> hear VO say Six of Diamonds, then lift up.  If you tap the six of diamonds 
>> again, you should hear VO say "Six of diamonds through five of clubs."
>> 
>> The other thing I've noticed is that it seems to work better if you're 
>> holding your phone upright.  Not sure why that would matter, but it seems 
>> too.
>> HTH,
>> Donna
>> 
>>> On Jun 9, 2019, at 6:20 AM, Ramy Moustafa  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi
>>> 
>>> I did that, but just 1 time it moved, all other times, not working.
>>> 
>>> Ramy moustafa saber
>>> licturer at:
>>> faculty of musical education
>>> music arranger and sound engineer
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
 On Jun 8, 2019, at 3:35 PM, Bob Hill  wrote:
 
 Hi Ramy, 
 To move a card, you need to double-tap and hold on the card you want to 
 move, then drag it to the card you want to place it on. 
 
 Bob 
 
 
 
 Sent from Bob's iPhone  7 
 
> On Jun 8, 2019, at 8:34 AM, Ramy Moustafa Saber رامي مصطفى صابر 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi:
> 
> I had the King’s corner game from many years, but i decided to play just 
> yesterday, do not know if i forgot something, but the cards are not 
> movable, i hit double tab on a card and try to move it, VO tells me the 
> Distination card, but leaving my card did not move the card on it. did 
> the accessibility broken or what?
> I have the latest version, on Ios 12.3.31
> Thanks in advance 
> 
> -- 
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 For 

iBooks

[N2KPV]

I was wondering if anyone uses Ibooks and how accessible it is with 
voiceOver . I saw  a book I am interested in and was considering purchasing 
it .  I remember a few years back having trouble navigating  it . Hopefully 
it has gotten better .

Thanks in advance , Ben C.

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Re: Playing the King's corner on Ios 12

[Bob Hill]

Hi Ramy, 

If you're trying to put a heart on a diamond, it won't work because they're the 
same color. 
You need to put a diamond or heart on a spade or club. 
You need to alternate red and black cards. 

Bob Hill 


Sent from Bob's iPhone  7 

> On Jun 9, 2019, at 11:11 AM, Ramy Moustafa  wrote:
> 
> Hi dear, I swear is that I did what you told me, but the same result let’s 
> say that I need to put six of hearts over five of diamonds, they are not cheap
> 
> Ramy moustafa saber
> licturer at:
> faculty of musical education
> music arranger and sound engineer
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Jun 9, 2019, at 2:23 PM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi Ramy,
>> 
>> You have to make sure that when you lift your finger, you're on the exact 
>> spot where you want to drop the card, otherwise it doesn't work.  so let's 
>> say you want to move a five of clubs and drop it on a six of diamonds.  
>> Double tap and hold on the five of clubs, and move your finger until you 
>> hear VO say Six of Diamonds, then lift up.  If you tap the six of diamonds 
>> again, you should hear VO say "Six of diamonds through five of clubs."
>> 
>> The other thing I've noticed is that it seems to work better if you're 
>> holding your phone upright.  Not sure why that would matter, but it seems 
>> too.
>> HTH,
>> Donna
>> 
>>> On Jun 9, 2019, at 6:20 AM, Ramy Moustafa  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi
>>> 
>>> I did that, but just 1 time it moved, all other times, not working.
>>> 
>>> Ramy moustafa saber
>>> licturer at:
>>> faculty of musical education
>>> music arranger and sound engineer
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
 On Jun 8, 2019, at 3:35 PM, Bob Hill  wrote:
 
 Hi Ramy, 
 To move a card, you need to double-tap and hold on the card you want to 
 move, then drag it to the card you want to place it on. 
 
 Bob 
 
 
 
 Sent from Bob's iPhone  7 
 
> On Jun 8, 2019, at 8:34 AM, Ramy Moustafa Saber رامي مصطفى صابر 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi:
> 
> I had the King’s corner game from many years, but i decided to play just 
> yesterday, do not know if i forgot something, but the cards are not 
> movable, i hit double tab on a card and try to move it, VO tells me the 
> Distination card, but leaving my card did not move the card on it. did 
> the accessibility broken or what?
> I have the latest version, on Ios 12.3.31
> Thanks in advance 
> 
> -- 
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> Visionaries list.
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> caraqu...@caraquinn.com
> 
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 For more options, 

Re: Playing the King's corner on Ios 12

[Ramy Moustafa]

Hi dear, I swear is that I did what you told me, but the same result let’s say 
that I need to put six of hearts over five of diamonds, they are not cheap

Ramy moustafa saber
licturer at:
faculty of musical education
music arranger and sound engineer
Sent from my iPhone

> On Jun 9, 2019, at 2:23 PM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi Ramy,
> 
> You have to make sure that when you lift your finger, you're on the exact 
> spot where you want to drop the card, otherwise it doesn't work.  so let's 
> say you want to move a five of clubs and drop it on a six of diamonds.  
> Double tap and hold on the five of clubs, and move your finger until you hear 
> VO say Six of Diamonds, then lift up.  If you tap the six of diamonds again, 
> you should hear VO say "Six of diamonds through five of clubs."
> 
>  The other thing I've noticed is that it seems to work better if you're 
> holding your phone upright.  Not sure why that would matter, but it seems too.
> HTH,
> Donna
> 
>> On Jun 9, 2019, at 6:20 AM, Ramy Moustafa  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi
>> 
>> I did that, but just 1 time it moved, all other times, not working.
>> 
>> Ramy moustafa saber
>> licturer at:
>> faculty of musical education
>> music arranger and sound engineer
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On Jun 8, 2019, at 3:35 PM, Bob Hill  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi Ramy, 
>>> To move a card, you need to double-tap and hold on the card you want to 
>>> move, then drag it to the card you want to place it on. 
>>> 
>>> Bob 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sent from Bob's iPhone  7 
>>> 
 On Jun 8, 2019, at 8:34 AM, Ramy Moustafa Saber رامي مصطفى صابر 
  wrote:
 
 Hi:
 
 I had the King’s corner game from many years, but i decided to play just 
 yesterday, do not know if i forgot something, but the cards are not 
 movable, i hit double tab on a card and try to move it, VO tells me the 
 Distination card, but leaving my card did not move the card on it. did the 
 accessibility broken or what?
 I have the latest version, on Ios 12.3.31
 Thanks in advance 
 
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>> 
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Re: iPadOS

['Jason White' via MacVisionaries]

I think you still need a Mac for high-quality braille translation and 
formatting of documents to prepare them for embossing.

On 6/4/19, 17:08, "'E.T.' via MacVisionaries" 
 wrote:

Considering what is to come this fall for iPads (sadly my model is 
not supported), and the potential to use one as a laptop, one question I 
have is...is it possible to create and emboss braille documents?

 From E.T.'s Keyboard...
ancient.ali...@icloud.com
Many believe that we have been visited
in the past. What if it were true?

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Re: iPadOS

[Anders Holmberg]

Hi Donna!
Actually if its the everest  you can set both lines per page and chars per line.
There are tons of buttons on the front of the everest and if its the everest 4 
there should be a menu button and from there you cah select a lot of settings.
Let me know how you get along and i can try to help you further.
/A

> 5 juni 2019 kl. 14:24 skrev 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries 
> :
> 
> Hi Anders,
> 
> I've had an index Everest for years, and I never knew they did this.  How 
> does it work?  Can you configure parameters such as line length, formatting 
> etc?
> TIA,
> Donna
> 
>> On Jun 5, 2019, at 6:21 AM, Anders Holmberg  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi!
>> I guess this depends on what embosser you have.
>> THe Index braille embossers do translate at their own without software.
>> So the brailetranslation is built-in.
>> Therefor i can use it without duxbury on the Mac.
>> But it needs a driver and i guess and hope that Index Braille will create 
>> one for the IpadOs.
>> /A
>> 
>>> 5 juni 2019 kl. 02:52 skrev Erik Heil :
>>> 
>>> Hello there
>>> Well certainly, The new iPad iOS does have a lot to offer new iPads. 
>>> However, dance your question, I believe there are two ways to get this 
>>> done, i.e. and boss braille. However, work to do this is ongoing. I’m not 
>>> sure, but if iPadOS runs in implementation of CUPs, that shouldn’t be very 
>>> hard to do. If you have a custom PPD filter written for the printer, this 
>>> actually can be done. However, printers now do you have Wi-Fi support, so 
>>> this in fact it may be easier. What I’m worried about is the translation of 
>>> braille documents. And I’m not sure as to what capabilities the iPadOS 
>>> actually has to handle that.
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
 On Jun 4, 2019, at 2:08 PM, 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries 
  wrote:
 
 Considering what is to come this fall for iPads (sadly my model is not 
 supported), and the potential to use one as a laptop, one question I have 
 is...is it possible to create and emboss braille documents?
 
 From E.T.'s Keyboard...
 ancient.ali...@icloud.com
 Many believe that we have been visited
 in the past. What if it were true?
 
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Amazon or Hulu on Apple TV?

['Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries]

Hi all,

We're thinking about adding a second streaming service--we currently just have 
Netflix.  We're debating between Amazon and Hulu.  Just wondering if there are 
any accessibility issues I should be aware of.  We'll be watching on a 4th Gen 
Apple TV.
TIA,
Donna

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Re: Playing the King's corner on Ios 12

['Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries]

Hi Ramy,

You have to make sure that when you lift your finger, you're on the exact spot 
where you want to drop the card, otherwise it doesn't work.  so let's say you 
want to move a five of clubs and drop it on a six of diamonds.  Double tap and 
hold on the five of clubs, and move your finger until you hear VO say Six of 
Diamonds, then lift up.  If you tap the six of diamonds again, you should hear 
VO say "Six of diamonds through five of clubs."

  The other thing I've noticed is that it seems to work better if you're 
holding your phone upright.  Not sure why that would matter, but it seems too.
HTH,
Donna

> On Jun 9, 2019, at 6:20 AM, Ramy Moustafa  wrote:
> 
> Hi
> 
> I did that, but just 1 time it moved, all other times, not working.
> 
> Ramy moustafa saber
> licturer at:
> faculty of musical education
> music arranger and sound engineer
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Jun 8, 2019, at 3:35 PM, Bob Hill  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi Ramy, 
>> To move a card, you need to double-tap and hold on the card you want to 
>> move, then drag it to the card you want to place it on. 
>> 
>> Bob 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from Bob's iPhone  7 
>> 
>>> On Jun 8, 2019, at 8:34 AM, Ramy Moustafa Saber رامي مصطفى صابر 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi:
>>> 
>>> I had the King’s corner game from many years, but i decided to play just 
>>> yesterday, do not know if i forgot something, but the cards are not 
>>> movable, i hit double tab on a card and try to move it, VO tells me the 
>>> Distination card, but leaving my card did not move the card on it. did the 
>>> accessibility broken or what?
>>> I have the latest version, on Ios 12.3.31
>>> Thanks in advance 
>>> 
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Re: Playing the King's corner on Ios 12

[Ramy Moustafa]

Hi

I did that, but just 1 time it moved, all other times, not working.

Ramy moustafa saber
licturer at:
faculty of musical education
music arranger and sound engineer
Sent from my iPhone

> On Jun 8, 2019, at 3:35 PM, Bob Hill  wrote:
> 
> Hi Ramy, 
> To move a card, you need to double-tap and hold on the card you want to move, 
> then drag it to the card you want to place it on. 
> 
> Bob 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from Bob's iPhone  7 
> 
>> On Jun 8, 2019, at 8:34 AM, Ramy Moustafa Saber رامي مصطفى صابر 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi:
>> 
>> I had the King’s corner game from many years, but i decided to play just 
>> yesterday, do not know if i forgot something, but the cards are not movable, 
>> i hit double tab on a card and try to move it, VO tells me the Distination 
>> card, but leaving my card did not move the card on it. did the accessibility 
>> broken or what?
>> I have the latest version, on Ios 12.3.31
>> Thanks in advance 
>> 
>> -- 
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JAMF Training

[Simon Fogarty]

Good day Mr Kilburn,

Please tell me
Where did  you do your JAMF certification and what is the associate status?

I’ve been looking at JAMF for a while now and would like to follow it up more 
as it’s a feature that would help with a new Job with my current employer

But they wont help with training or even providing course material.

Where did you do your training?

Cheers for any information on this,
And if need be email me back off list even though this is apple related.

Simon F

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RE: mac book pro 2017

[Simon Fogarty]

Hi Janina,

That was my choice also.

 Even the current models are 7th gen processors so I'm not losing anything 
currently.

I actually just went to make th purchase using the IOS app for apple store and 
can't see an option for educational pricing.

So guess I'll use the computer in stead

Thanks Janina,

 Great minds think alike
As for the start up sound, I'll just pretend it is there when the machine 
starts up.




-Original Message-
From: 'Janina Sajka' via MacVisionaries  
Sent: Sunday, 9 June 2019 3:13 PM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: mac book pro 2017

So, I've been playing pretending I didn't have the boot chime and simply 
holding in option for a longish time while pressing the power button second.

I still want the chime, but I can see making it without it. I can reliably get 
to all three of my available environments.

I'd go for the greater processing power of the I7. In the grand scheme of 
things, that's a steal for only $50, because you get to live with the benefits 
for a long time.

Janina

Simon Fogarty writes:
> Na,
> 
>  I've made up my mind as to which one to get.
> 
>  And then cancelled at the last moment the choice I made.
> I've got a choice of 2 machines,
> The only difference is one has the I7 2.5GHz processor an the other 
> has the I5 2.3GHz processor,  other than that, they are the pro 13.3"  
> with 16GB ram, 512GB ssd,  Although one is release date 2017, The 
> other is new as of purchase time.
>  There is only $50 for the upgrade to the I7.
> 
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: 'Janina Sajka' via MacVisionaries 
> 
> Sent: Sunday, 9 June 2019 2:37 AM
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: mac book pro 2017
> 
> Simon, it sounds to me like you're weighing the trade-offs with a clear head. 
> Good luck! I expect a few of us will be interested to hear what you decide 
> and how it works out.
> 
> Best,
> 
> Janina
> 
> Simon Fogarty writes:
> > Hi Janina,
> > 
> >  The 2017 I7 2.5GHz 16GB ram & 512GB ssd pro has 2 USB-C ports for 
> > charging and connectivity  to go with a crazy new Zealand price of
> > $3179.00 That's a refurbished price, Brand new RRP is approx. 600 more.
> > 
> > But it would be my first choice
> > 
> > I'm thinking over the weekend on what device to purchase.
> > 
> > -Original Message-
> > From: 'Janina Sajka' via MacVisionaries 
> > 
> > Sent: Saturday, 8 June 2019 1:54 AM
> > To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> > Subject: Re: mac book pro 2017
> > 
> > Simon:
> > 
> > That 2017 Pro with an I7 and 16 Gb RAM sounds a lot better. It should have 
> > a pretty compelling price, because I should think that's pretty baseline 
> > specs for 64bit Windows 10 under Bootcamp--especially if you also want to 
> > run the Windows in some kind of vm.
> > 
> > For me it would also need USB 3 ports, at least one, as I've got Linux 
> > booting off a tiny 256 Gb USB 3 stick that sticks out less far than the 
> > charging connector on my Air.
> > 
> > Depending on the price and the weight, I will consider that one myself, 
> > because I'm looking to upgrade and get a few more years out of chiming 
> > boots.
> > 
> > I do think asking for "a long time" may be asking a bit much from this 
> > specification, though.It really does strike me as baseline today.
> > 
> > Best,
> > 
> > Janina
> > 
> > Simon Fogarty writes:
> > > Hi Tim,
> > > 
> > > I’ve gotta couple of options,
> > > 
> > > The air would be a custom build to fully spec’ed out and yes still has 
> > > USB-A and thunderbolt 2.
> > > 
> > > But only 8GB ram,
> > > 
> > > I’m also looking at a 2017 I7 2.5GHz pro with 16gb ram and 512 GB 
> > > ssd, I’m not going to touch bar as that causes trouble with windows in 
> > > bootcamp.
> > > 
> > > Which ever I end up doing it’s a long term thing so it will have to be 
> > > considered carefully.
> > > 
> > > 
> > > From: 'Tim Kilburn' via MacVisionaries 
> > > 
> > > Sent: Friday, 7 June 2019 2:35 AM
> > > To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> > > Subject: Re: mac book pro 2017
> > > 
> > > Hi Simon,
> > > 
> > > Janina may be right :).  No, it doesn't have a boot chime.  I have a 
> > > similar model, but the 3.1 I5 processor and 16 GB of RAM.  It's the one 
> > > with the Touch Bar and 4 USB C ports.  I haven't had any problems with my 
> > > model although, like you, many don't like the feel of the butterfly keys, 
> > > and some are stuck on USB A ports, of which the MBP's have none.  Battery 
> > > life is good, but not excellent.  It's nice and light and handles 
> > > processing big jobs well.  If the price is right, I'd go for it.
> > > 
> > > Later...
> > > 
> > > Tim Kilburn
> > > Apple Teacher
> > > (with Swift Playgrounds Recognition)
> > > 
> > > [cid:image001.jpg@01D51D78.1FAE3810]
> > > 
> > > Jamf Certified Associate
> > > Fort McMurray, AB Canada
> > > 
> > > On Jun 6, 2019, at 05:38, 'Janina Sajka' via MacVisionaries 
> > > mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com>> 
> > > wrote:
> > > 
> > 

RE: Installing boot camp?

[Simon Fogarty]

You are not going to be able to run a PE version of windows on your mac from a 
cd rom or other type of media.

 You will really only have 2 options,
 Either get sihted assistance to help you step through what is required to 
repair the bootcamp installation or 

2 run the bootcamp assistant and remove the bootcamp installation and then re 
install windows again via bootcamp.


-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com  On 
Behalf Of Hayri Tulumcu
Sent: Sunday, 9 June 2019 8:10 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Installing boot camp?

You can only install win 8 ore win10

> Den 4. jun. 2019 kl. 13.53 skrev 'Robert Cole' via MacVisionaries 
> :
> 
> Dear List,
> Yesterday my Mac updated, Now I can’t load windows.
> I used my phone to try to read the screen. It wasn’t too good, but It said 
> automatic repair could not repair disk errors.
> I don’t know what to do other than delete boot camp and start all over.
> I have a windows 7 PE disk with NVDA, But I can’t get it to boot.
> After hearing the mac chime, I hold the C key, but it loads the Mac OS 
> instead of the CD.
> 
> So Here is my question, What version of Windows can I install on a late 2015 
> iMac?
> I can’t remember what I used when I installed it the first time.
> Thanks in advance.
> Rob
> 
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RE: Map bug on iPhone

[Simon Fogarty]

Hi Mark,

Just to let you know, only the dev betas are currently out for the new OS 
platforms,

Public betas will be out in July.

Simon F


-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com  On 
Behalf Of M. Taylor
Sent: Sunday, 9 June 2019 6:31 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: Map bug on iPhone

Hello Robert,

I assure you that I, too, experience this same issue.  It has been around for 
the longest time.

However, a little bird, from the Apple orchard, sent me an email, a couple of 
days ago, stating that this glitch should be resolved in iOS13 and that I 
should update my bug report on it, once confirmed.

As yet, I have not downloaded a beta of iOS13 to confirm the claim, but we can 
certainly keep our proverbial fingers crossed, eh?

Happy Travels,

Mark


From: 'Robert Cole' via MacVisionaries [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com]
Sent: Friday, June 07, 2019 6:14 AM
To: Email Groups
Subject: Map bug on iPhone

Dear List,
This bug from 2017  still exists.
Am I the only one who is having this problem?
Using a iPhone 7 with the latest IOS. 

Begin forwarded message:

From: Apple Accessibility 
Date: October 3, 2017 at 7:01:02 PM EDT
To: mr.robertc...@icloud.com
Subject: Re: iOS 11 Maps App Card Grabber TimeOut VoiceOver Bug; Follow-up: 
674583055

Hello Robert,

Thank you for writing to Apple Accessibility. We appreciate your feedback. 
In our testing, we found that the Details overlay is dismissed regardless of 
whether you are using VoiceOver. We will pass this report along to the 
appropriate team.

Sincerely,

Apple Accessibility

On September 29, 2017 at 20:40:37 PM GMT, mr.robertc...@icloud.com wrote:

IOS 10 and
iOS 11 Maps App Card Grabber TimeOut VoiceOver Bug

DESCRIPTION:
In iOS 11, only when VoiceOver is enabled, the full-screen Card Grabber 
display, times-out after 10 seconds, when reviewing the live route details list.

Steps to Reproduce:

1.
Make certain that VoiceOver is enabled.

2.
Open Map and activate a route by selecting a destination and tapping the GO 
button.  Siri will announce a direction instruction; for example, "In one mile, 
turn left onto Main Street."  

3.
Single-finger, double-tap the "Arrival" label, located near the lower left of 
the display in order to activate the Card Grabber which will bring up various 
route options.

4.
Select Details.  A directions list will be displayed.  Unlike for a 
non-VoiceOver user, for whom this list will remain on the screen until the DONE 
button is activated, after approximately ten seconds with or without screen 
activity, the list will disappear as if the VoiceOver user activated the DONE 
button.


Please check this out.

Thank You,
Robert Cole
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