Re: Apple Silicon vs Intel x86 for Voiceover users on Mac

['Sabahattin Gucukoglu' via MacVisionaries]

I don’t think there’s any meaningful difference, personally, certainly no more 
than would normally be expected for machines of similar benchmarks on either 
platform. So, for instance, my 2019 iMac is more powerful than my 2020 M1 Mac 
Mini, and it feels just the same. JMO.

I can’t wait to see Linux running on the M1 Mini. At last, a super-powered 
small-form-factor Linux server!

Cheers,
Sabahattin

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Re: Apple Silicon vs Intel x86 for Voiceover users on Mac

['Jason White' via MacVisionaries]

For anyone who is planning a purchasing decision, it’s worth noting that there are software features that won’t be available on Intel-based Mac systems, such as new text to speech support for certain languages, and on-device speech recognition for dictation. I would expect this list of features exclusive to the M1 and its successors to grow in subsequent operating system releases. None of these features is specific to VoiceOver yet, but this may change over time. I know the question was about performance, but anyone who is seriously deciding what hardware to buy should consider features as well, including the likelihood that software development will shift increasingly toward Apple’s new hardware architecture. On 10/24/21, 18:28, "'Sabahattin Gucukoglu' via MacVisionaries"  wrote:I don’t think there’s any meaningful difference, personally, certainly no more than would normally be expected for machines of similar benchmarks on either platform. So, for instance, my 2019 iMac is more powerful than my 2020 M1 Mac Mini, and it feels just the same. JMO. I can’t wait to see Linux running on the M1 Mini. At last, a super-powered small-form-factor Linux server! Cheers,Sabahattin -- The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries list. If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark at:  mk...@ucla.edu and your owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com The archives for this list can be searched at:http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/--- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group.To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/macvisionaries/2532CB84-4F48-4337-A3DE-16C8F250A20B%40me.com. 



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RE: Apple Silicon vs Intel x86 for Voiceover users on Mac

[Rebecca Skipper]

I think Intel Macs will not be supported at some point, but the question 
remains how long Apple will continue supporting Intel based Macs once they 
finish their transition to the M1 chips.

 

From: 'Jason White' via MacVisionaries  
Sent: Sunday, October 24, 2021 6:44 PM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Apple Silicon vs Intel x86 for Voiceover users on Mac

 

For anyone who is planning a purchasing decision, it’s worth noting that there 
are software features that won’t be available on Intel-based Mac systems, such 
as new text to speech support for certain languages, and on-device speech 
recognition for dictation. I would expect this list of features exclusive to 
the M1 and its successors to grow in subsequent operating system releases.

 

None of these features is specific to VoiceOver yet, but this may change over 
time. I know the question was about performance, but anyone who is seriously 
deciding what hardware to buy should consider features as well, including the 
likelihood that software development will shift increasingly toward Apple’s new 
hardware architecture.

 

On 10/24/21, 18:28, "'Sabahattin Gucukoglu' via MacVisionaries" 
mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com> > 
wrote:

I don’t think there’s any meaningful difference, personally, certainly no more 
than would normally be expected for machines of similar benchmarks on either 
platform. So, for instance, my 2019 iMac is more powerful than my 2020 M1 Mac 
Mini, and it feels just the same. JMO.

 

I can’t wait to see Linux running on the M1 Mini. At last, a super-powered 
small-form-factor Linux server!

 

Cheers,

Sabahattin

 

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Re: Apple Silicon vs Intel x86 for Voiceover users on Mac

[Brad Snyder]

Apple generally supports a product for about 5 - 7 years after it has been 
discontinued and is no longer sold by Apple. At that point, it is termed a 
vintage product.
A product that has been discontinued and has not been sold by Apple for more 
than seven years is termed an obsolete product, and Apple will not service or 
support these products.
See the link below for more information.
https://www.idropnews.com/news/heres-what-apple-actually-means-by-vintage-and-obsolete-products/137865/amp/
 selected 

- Brad -

On Oct 24, 2021, at 17:47, Rebecca Skipper  wrote:


I think Intel Macs will not be supported at some point, but the question 
remains how long Apple will continue supporting Intel based Macs once they 
finish their transition to the M1 chips.
 
From: 'Jason White' via MacVisionaries  
Sent: Sunday, October 24, 2021 6:44 PM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Apple Silicon vs Intel x86 for Voiceover users on Mac
 
For anyone who is planning a purchasing decision, it’s worth noting that there 
are software features that won’t be available on Intel-based Mac systems, such 
as new text to speech support for certain languages, and on-device speech 
recognition for dictation. I would expect this list of features exclusive to 
the M1 and its successors to grow in subsequent operating system releases.
 
None of these features is specific to VoiceOver yet, but this may change over 
time. I know the question was about performance, but anyone who is seriously 
deciding what hardware to buy should consider features as well, including the 
likelihood that software development will shift increasingly toward Apple’s new 
hardware architecture.
 
On 10/24/21, 18:28, "'Sabahattin Gucukoglu' via MacVisionaries" 
 wrote:

I don’t think there’s any meaningful difference, personally, certainly no more 
than would normally be expected for machines of similar benchmarks on either 
platform. So, for instance, my 2019 iMac is more powerful than my 2020 M1 Mac 
Mini, and it feels just the same. JMO.
 
I can’t wait to see Linux running on the M1 Mini. At last, a super-powered 
small-form-factor Linux server!
 
Cheers,
Sabahattin
 
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Re: Apple Silicon vs Intel x86 for Voiceover users on Mac

[Muhammad Fayed]

A direct thing that you can notice the speed of performing image recognition 
using VO+shift+l since it is an ML feature. That should be significantly faster 
on M1 according to my experience with the same feature on iPhone 10s compared 
to 2016 MBP. It is much faster on iPhone.

As Rebecca and Brad mentioned, the other key difference in purchasing decision 
is how many years of software updates to get. If Apple decided to cut it 
earlier than the number of years Brad mentioned because of the small number of 
Intel Mac users, Intel Mac users will be annoyed by that decision.

Some of the other new features are specific to Apple silicon Mac like life 
text, as I remember in Mac OS 12. If it exists in both platform, it should be 
significantly faster on Apple silicon devices compared to Intel ones.

HTH,

Mohamed E. Fayed 


> On 25 Oct 2021, at 12:27 AM, 'Sabahattin Gucukoglu' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> I don’t think there’s any meaningful difference, personally, certainly no 
> more than would normally be expected for machines of similar benchmarks on 
> either platform. So, for instance, my 2019 iMac is more powerful than my 2020 
> M1 Mac Mini, and it feels just the same. JMO.
> 
> I can’t wait to see Linux running on the M1 Mini. At last, a super-powered 
> small-form-factor Linux server!
> 
> Cheers,
> Sabahattin
> 
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Re: Apple Silicon vs Intel x86 for Voiceover users on Mac

[Muhammad Fayed]

BY THE WAY, how do you use your Macs? I think the performance difference for 
you is not much because it is not a high workload that shows the difference. 

One of the things I noticed between two Macs one of 2016 and another from 2020 
is in dealing with larger numbers sheets. I find it more responsive and 
VoiceOver stays busy for shorter periods of time.

A thing I remembered and think it is useful to keep in  mind.

Regards,

Mohamed E. Fayed 

> On 25 Oct 2021, at 12:27 AM, 'Sabahattin Gucukoglu' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> I don’t think there’s any meaningful difference, personally, certainly no 
> more than would normally be expected for machines of similar benchmarks on 
> either platform. So, for instance, my 2019 iMac is more powerful than my 2020 
> M1 Mac Mini, and it feels just the same. JMO.
> 
> I can’t wait to see Linux running on the M1 Mini. At last, a super-powered 
> small-form-factor Linux server!
> 
> Cheers,
> Sabahattin
> 
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> 
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Re: Apple Silicon vs Intel x86 for Voiceover users on Mac

[maurice mines]

Hi, unfortunately here are my concerns about this entire Apple silicon 
versus the Intel mock debate, and my concerns about it when it is in 
respect to this issue.


The issue that I see is simply this. If you have to the way Apple sees 
it financially is trade-in your Intel Mac spend $600 which I think is 
abruptly the price difference between the two machines then spend 
another $300 on Apple care protection. That if you live in a state or a 
region that has a sales tax based on the total price of the item this 
could get to be very expensive. In fact for many of us were blind at 
least in the United States it is prohibitively expensive. In other words 
I think for now they must support both the Intel and the silicon in 2023 
I think that would be a different story but right now in late 2021 they 
have to support both otherwise some people may just say Dell's elegant 
switch to Windows in fact that's what I'm using to dictate this message 
to simply because there is nothing comparable in terms of dictation on 
the Apple side. In fact people hate me because I can't spell because I 
have a written expression disorder so I have to use Dragon in Windows to 
at least have a shot of being understood. I hope this helps, and is not 
to unduly long.


On 10/24/2021 9:04 PM, Muhammad Fayed wrote:

BY THE WAY, how do you use your Macs? I think the performance difference for 
you is not much because it is not a high workload that shows the difference.

One of the things I noticed between two Macs one of 2016 and another from 2020 
is in dealing with larger numbers sheets. I find it more responsive and 
VoiceOver stays busy for shorter periods of time.

A thing I remembered and think it is useful to keep in  mind.

Regards,

Mohamed E. Fayed


On 25 Oct 2021, at 12:27 AM, 'Sabahattin Gucukoglu' via MacVisionaries 
 wrote:

I don’t think there’s any meaningful difference, personally, certainly no more 
than would normally be expected for machines of similar benchmarks on either 
platform. So, for instance, my 2019 iMac is more powerful than my 2020 M1 Mac 
Mini, and it feels just the same. JMO.

I can’t wait to see Linux running on the M1 Mini. At last, a super-powered 
small-form-factor Linux server!

Cheers,
Sabahattin

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--
maurice Mines
Maurice mines.
Board member, National Federation of the blind deaf blind division.
Vice president National Federation a of the blind of California Bakersfield 
chapter.
Amateur radio call sign kd0iko.
Direct phone number,  661-241-3788



maurice Mines
Maurice mines.
Board member, National Federation of the blind deaf blind division.
Vice president National Federation a of the blind of California Bakersfield 
chapter.
Amateur radio call sign kd0iko.
Direct phone number,  661-241-3788

maurice Mines
Maurice mines.
Board member, National Federation of the blind deaf blind division.
Vice president National Federation a of the blind of California Bakersfield 
chapter.
Amateur radio call sign kd0iko.
Direct phone number,  661-241-3788

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Re: Apple Silicon vs Intel x86 for Voiceover users on Mac

['Sabahattin Gucukoglu' via MacVisionaries]

It’s absolutely right that Apple Silicon is the future and if you’re buying 
now, and want to have maximum future and feature support, that’s the way to go. 
I would not dismiss Intel Macs out of hand—they can do one thing Apple Silicon 
can’t, namely, run Microsoft Windows. They are available now and will be 
supported, and if you don’t plan for the future, they’re still a viable choice. 
FWIW, the only features I could use, but do without, and that are only 
available on Apple Silicon, are Touch ID unlock via a remote keyboard and the 
Siri voices with intelligence-enhanced emphasis. However, that is today’s 
macOS; assuming I am not tempted to simply switch platform to continue using my 
Intel Mac, it might be a dead end for future features I desire later in 
upcoming macOS versions.

Cheers,
Sabahattin

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RE: Apple Silicon vs Intel x86 for Voiceover users on Mac

[Rebecca Skipper]

Well,
I was intrigued by the idea of running windows on a Mac, but I am starting to 
agree with others who say that if you want Windows get a Windows machine.
I haven't heard of anyone running Mac on Windows using a screen reader, and I 
do not take this feature for granted.
If you really want to run windows on a Mac look into Windows 365.
It is currently available only for business users.


-Original Message-
From: 'Sabahattin Gucukoglu' via MacVisionaries 
 
Sent: Monday, October 25, 2021 1:19 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Apple Silicon vs Intel x86 for Voiceover users on Mac

It’s absolutely right that Apple Silicon is the future and if you’re buying 
now, and want to have maximum future and feature support, that’s the way to go. 
I would not dismiss Intel Macs out of hand—they can do one thing Apple Silicon 
can’t, namely, run Microsoft Windows. They are available now and will be 
supported, and if you don’t plan for the future, they’re still a viable choice. 
FWIW, the only features I could use, but do without, and that are only 
available on Apple Silicon, are Touch ID unlock via a remote keyboard and the 
Siri voices with intelligence-enhanced emphasis. However, that is today’s 
macOS; assuming I am not tempted to simply switch platform to continue using my 
Intel Mac, it might be a dead end for future features I desire later in 
upcoming macOS versions.

Cheers,
Sabahattin

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RE: Apple Silicon vs Intel x86 for Voiceover users on Mac

[Rebecca Skipper]

Well,
Please remember that iPads could be an option, and don't forget about the more 
affordable Mac Mini.
I am using windows to type this message, and I do not see myself using a Mac 
for all my computing needs for a while because there are apps that do not work 
on the Mac.
However, if Windows was gone tomorrow I could accomplish all my tasks using a 
combination of mac and IOS or IPad OS once I learned the differences.


-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com  On 
Behalf Of maurice mines
Sent: Monday, October 25, 2021 12:44 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com; Muhammad Fayed 
Subject: Re: Apple Silicon vs Intel x86 for Voiceover users on Mac

Hi, unfortunately here are my concerns about this entire Apple silicon versus 
the Intel mock debate, and my concerns about it when it is in respect to this 
issue.

The issue that I see is simply this. If you have to the way Apple sees it 
financially is trade-in your Intel Mac spend $600 which I think is abruptly the 
price difference between the two machines then spend another $300 on Apple care 
protection. That if you live in a state or a region that has a sales tax based 
on the total price of the item this could get to be very expensive. In fact for 
many of us were blind at least in the United States it is prohibitively 
expensive. In other words I think for now they must support both the Intel and 
the silicon in 2023 I think that would be a different story but right now in 
late 2021 they have to support both otherwise some people may just say Dell's 
elegant switch to Windows in fact that's what I'm using to dictate this message 
to simply because there is nothing comparable in terms of dictation on the 
Apple side. In fact people hate me because I can't spell because I have a 
written expression disorder so I have to use Dragon in Windows to at least have 
a shot of being understood. I hope this helps, and is not to unduly long.

On 10/24/2021 9:04 PM, Muhammad Fayed wrote:
> BY THE WAY, how do you use your Macs? I think the performance difference for 
> you is not much because it is not a high workload that shows the difference.
>
> One of the things I noticed between two Macs one of 2016 and another from 
> 2020 is in dealing with larger numbers sheets. I find it more responsive and 
> VoiceOver stays busy for shorter periods of time.
>
> A thing I remembered and think it is useful to keep in  mind.
>
> Regards,
>
> Mohamed E. Fayed
>
>> On 25 Oct 2021, at 12:27 AM, 'Sabahattin Gucukoglu' via MacVisionaries 
>>  wrote:
>>
>> I don’t think there’s any meaningful difference, personally, certainly no 
>> more than would normally be expected for machines of similar benchmarks on 
>> either platform. So, for instance, my 2019 iMac is more powerful than my 
>> 2020 M1 Mac Mini, and it feels just the same. JMO.
>>
>> I can’t wait to see Linux running on the M1 Mini. At last, a super-powered 
>> small-form-factor Linux server!
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Sabahattin
>>
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maurice Mines
Maurice mines.
Board member, National Federation of the blind deaf blind division.
Vice president National Federation a of the blind of California Bakersfield 
chapter.
Amateur radio call sign kd0iko.
Direct phone number,  661-241-3788



maurice Mines
Maurice mines.
Board member, National Federation of the blind deaf blind division.
Vice president National Federation a of the blind of California Bakersfield 
chapter.
Amateur radio call sign kd0iko.
Direct phone number,  661-241-3788

maurice Mines
Maurice mines.
Board member, National Federation of the blind deaf blind division.
Vice president National Federation a of the blind of California Bakersfield 
chapter.
Amateur radio call sign kd0iko.
Direct phone number,  661-241-3788

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