Re: Checking the battery level on my new MacBook

[Jonathan Cohn]

Yes, Speak Battery Status is now a VoiceOver command, so you don’t need to use 
the shell script function.
It can be reached as already mentioned with the VO-F8 three times, or you can 
assign it to any of the commanders that are available.
 

> On Oct 1, 2024, at 12:21 PM, Hai Nguyen Ly  wrote:
> 
> Brian,
> You can create an Apple script using the following and bind it to a keyboard 
> shortcut using the keyboard commander in VoiceOver utilities. 
> I don’t remember if this list is set up to accept attachments, but I’ve 
> included a copy of the script just in case. 
> 
> set cmd to "/usr/bin/pmset -g batt | grep -Eo '[0-9]{2,3}%'"
> set batteryLevel to (do shell script cmd)
> set cmd to "/usr/bin/pmset -g batt | grep -Eo 
> '(charged)|(charging)|(discharging)'"
> set batteryStatus to (do shell script cmd)
> if batteryStatus = "charged" then
>   set batteryStatus to "fully charged"
> end if
> set message to batteryLevel & ", " & batteryStatus
> tell application "VoiceOver" to output message
> 
> Hai
> 
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> 
>> On Oct 1, 2024, at 11:54 AM, Brian Hansen  wrote:
>> 
>> Is there a voice-Over command key combo I can use to find out the battery 
>> status of my MacBook? I’m running the latest Mac operating system. Thanks 
>> for anyand all help.
>> Blessings,
>> 
>> Brian
>> 
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Re: Passwords and Passkeys

[Jonathan Cohn]

I highly recommend that you attempt to find the funds to buy a Macintosh that 
does not have an Intel chip. Walmart was selling M1 MacBook Airs for under $600 
a bit ago. But there is no easy way to push a 10 year old Macintosh to the 
current OS.
Good luck!
Jonathan
 

> On Sep 25, 2024, at 12:25 AM, Michael Irons  wrote:
> 
> I have a MacBook Air from early 2015. Should I not update yet. I think the 
> farther state will go is Monterey. Don’t want to try the update and have it 
> crash on me. I know one individual that ended up doing that. I know when I 
> found the computer Howard if it talked about update, but I wonder if it just 
> met security updates for just the stuff that I already have.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Sep 24, 2024, at 10:41 PM, 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Jonathan,
>>  I get it now, having  done some reading about them. 1Password is what I am 
>> moving from.
>> 
>> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
>> Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
>> My e-Mail:
>> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
>> 
>>> On 9/24/2024 6:40 PM, Jonathan C. Cohn wrote:
>>> A pass key is a digital signature certificate that is exclusive to you. 
>>> It’s supported by Apple, Google and 1Password and probably others. 
>>> Microsoft also uses them. In order to know whether you have any I’d have to 
>>> know your password manager, and the only password manager, I really know 
>>> anything about is 1Password.
>>> Sent from my iPhone
> On Sep 24, 2024, at 2:13 PM, Phil Halton  wrote:
 
 You’d be amazed how much you can find out with a simple Google search. 
 For example, search Google for “what is a pass key“? It’s really your best 
 Avenue for information when this list goes silent on you.
 Sent from my IPhone
 
 
> On Sep 24, 2024, at 1:04 PM, 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
>    Still need an answer to my question. Please help. Thanks.
> 
> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
> Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
> My e-Mail:
> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
> 
>>> On 9/19/2024 1:03 PM, 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries wrote:
>> Hi all,
>>  Soon I will export from a third party password manager into Apple's 
>> Passwords. First though, what is a passkey? I need to know if I have any 
>> before exporting. Thanks.
>> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
>> Ambivalent?  Well yes and no.
>> My e-Mail:
>> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
> 
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Re: Calculater on the Mac

[Jonathan Cohn]

Well, I hadn’t used calculator for over a year. There is certainly no voice 
option now, but there are several views available now that I don’t remember. 
I’m not quite sure why you want to turn off VO with the calculator though, it 
seems very functional  just using the standard +-*/ keys.


> On Sep 22, 2024, at 7:03 AM, Tom Rash  wrote:
> 
> Since I’ve upgraded to the latest version of iOS, The calculator doesn’t work 
> as it did before.  
> There was an area in the menu where you could turn off speech and use the 
> speech from the calculator.  That speech menus no longer there.  Anyway, any 
> thoughts for those of you that have used the calculator before?  
> 
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Re: Emojes in Messages app after upgrade to Sequoia

[Jonathan Cohn]

The categories are actually “grids”, if you interact with any of them you will 
find 200 or so possible symbols.


> On Sep 21, 2024, at 1:02 PM, 'Andrew' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> How do I use emojes in Sequoia in Messages app?  When I activate the button, 
> a popup window appears with the categories of emojes but then I can’t do 
> anything about it. There’s no list of emojes to choose from.  What am I doing 
> wrong?
> 
> Andrew
> 
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Re: Accessing Page Menu in Safari

[Jonathan Cohn]

I tried for quite some time after your e-maill, and none of my tricks would do 
anything. 
I thought perhaps it was throwing info into the sidebar but I had no luck there.
I am though running on a developer beta right now hooping to get some 
understanding of the AI features.
Jonathan


> On Sep 20, 2024, at 5:23 PM, Kelly Ford  wrote:
> 
> Hey,
> 
> Does anyone know how you activate the Page menu/button in Safari with 
> VoiceOver. This appears when the page supports their reading view and such. I 
> can use cmd+shift+r to turn on reader but when I activate the button that 
> says Page menu in the address area with VO, nothing happens.
> 
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Re: Zoom App

[Jonathan Cohn]

I believe this is correct. It is trying to compete with Teams, discord. and 
slack. I hope accessibility does not take a back seat.
Jonathan  

> On Sep 12, 2024, at 4:53 PM, 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hello,
>   I've not yet used Zoom. The version that is installed is Zoom Workplace. Is 
> that the correct one I want?
> 
> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
> I reserve the right to be wrong. Which will never happen.
> My e-Mail:
> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
> 
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Re: Question Re MS Teams ...

[Jonathan Cohn]

There are two modes to MS Teams.
1. Personal 
2. Corporate 

In both cases, it uses features from SHarePoint and Exchange to allow file 
sharing. 
and scheduling. When I set up a [personal account, it prompted me for my 
GITHUB/MS account information. Perhaps your email is associated with 
outlook.com  or another MS based mail service? That is the 
only reason, I can think of to provide your e-mail password to Teams. 
I would have expected Microsoft to be more clear on this, since getting access 
to an eMail is an easy way to get access to a change password process for a 
significant number of accounts.
 


> On Aug 25, 2024, at 6:50 PM, 'Eileen Scrivani ' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi,
>  
> In a few weeks I will need to do a phone call or session with someone using 
> MS Teams. I downloaded the app to my phone and in starting the setup, it 
> wanted both my email and its password. Exactly how does MS Teams work and why 
> would it require the password to my email account?
>  
> Thanks for any information on using this.
>  
> Eileen
>  
> 
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Re: iPhone 15 Pro Max

[Jonathan Cohn]

First, I believe that Apple generally only sells the non-pro versions of a 
older phone, though this year might be different since only the 15 pro and 15 
pro max support Apple Intelligence.
Another rumor just starting up is that in 6 months, there will be a new SE with 
the body of an iPhone 13.

Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn

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Re: split buttons on the mac

[Jonathan Cohn]

I wonder if enter and space do different things for these split buttons.
Is this on some kind of Microsoft site?


On Wed, Aug 7, 2024 at 10:17 AM Caitlyn Furness 
wrote:

> Hi John,
>
> command down arrow does nothing here.  I've tried interacting with the
> button first as well and still nothing.
>
> Thanks,
> Cait
>
>
> > On Aug 7, 2024, at 9:24 AM, John Panarese  wrote:
> >
> >It works some times, but on the split button, press
> command-down-arrow and that will make the choices separate.
> >
> >
> >> On Aug 7, 2024, at 9:07 AM, Herbie Allen 
> wrote:
> >>
> >> One thing I would try is interacting and see if it displays them
> separately.
> >>
> >>> On Aug 7, 2024, at 06:02, Caitlyn Furness 
> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Hi,
> >>>
> >>> I have to work with a web page which has a split button on it.  One
> side of the button says print, and the other says save.  How do I click on
> the save portion?  Right now, if I click on the button, it always picks the
> print option.
> >>>
> >>> I think I have to use the mouse buttons for this, but don't have a
> clue how!
> >>>
> >>> Thanks,
> >>> Cait
> >>>
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Re: Weird issues with mail

[Jonathan Cohn]

There is a “sync” mailbox command in the mailboxes folder. If the information 
you are seeing on the Mac is different from other devices or the web this 
should help.
If not, a less drastic activity (assuming you are using IMAP or Exchange would 
be to delete the mail account and then re-ad it.
Also, Google accounts have a “All Mail” folder that sometimes Apple Mail calls 
archive and sometime it calls it all mail. This folder should contain every 
message that is not permanently deleted from your mailbox, so make sure you are 
not in that folder.
  
Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Jul 13, 2024, at 9:39 PM, 'Mary Ward' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hello.  I am having some really weird issues with mail.  I usually use the 
> all inboxes and do fine.  However, the inbox is all messed up.  I am seeing 
> messages from a long time ago and not always recent ones.  Except maybe those 
> that have downloaded right when I had the app open.  When I delete a message, 
> I think that sometimes the message it is deleting is not the one I am seeing. 
>  So somehow, I am not focused on the message I think I am but a different 
> one.  Then, mail quits unexpectedly.  I have rebooted a few times. 
> 
> What should I do?  Will I have to go into Recovery?  I don’t feel comfortable 
> there.  I have never heard of anything this weird.
> 
> 
> 
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Re: contacts

[Jonathan Cohn]

Apple will not automatically add email addresses to the best of my experience.
However, Google contacts at least once upon a time would. So perhaps going into 
the list of internet accounts and unchecking Googles contacts will make you 
happy!

Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Jul 13, 2024, at 2:05 PM, Lorie McCloud  wrote:
> 
> in contacts on my phone there’s all kinds of clutter. email addresses I’ve 
> only sent 1 email to and things like that. I’d prefer to manually enter 
> contacts that I want in there. is there a way to clear this up and set it 
> differently so it doesn’t include anything but what I put in there?
> 
> thanks.
> Lorie
> 
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Play playlist shortcut

[Jonathan Cohn]

This was in my shortcuts gallery. I haven’t tested it out specifically, but it 
should prompt you for a playlist when first run and then remember that playlist.
After you have done that you can do any of the functions that you can with any 
shortcut
1. Save to home screen
2. Define a siri command that will play the list
3. Put it in the Mac’s menu bar
 
https://www.icloud.com/shortcuts/5a24a14bf7cc423d9ab65e4e8c606fd6 
<https://www.icloud.com/shortcuts/5a24a14bf7cc423d9ab65e4e8c606fd6> 


You should be able to open the shortcuts app on your computer or iPhone and 
search the gallery for this if you don’t want to trust the URL.
Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



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Basic HTML training

[Jonathan Cohn]

Hello,

I am going to try and set up some training sessions so that blind folks can 
understand the language that powers the web and how it can effect accessibility.
This will be a fairly basic class at least at the beginning. 
• What is an element 
• What is the most basic web page 
• What are attributes, classes and text nodes 
• Why do I see so many div’s and span’s when I view source
•  What about CSS 

This could be either a separate mailing or we might meet on zoom over the 
weekend. 
Please let me know if you are interested. 
Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



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Re: keyboard shortcuts on a site

[Jonathan Cohn]

 I can’t remember where, but there was a site I used where I needed to check 
this box or else I  could not navigate properly. 
It might have been CodePen or Google Docs, I just remember being stuck with no 
way to get to the control I needed.
I suppose a activity could be created with this checkbox checked. Personally, I 
only have 3 activities configured, but could probably use a few more. I just 
worry, because when they were first introduced, it took a noticeable time to 
switch applications if the activity changed.
 
Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Jun 19, 2024, at 12:20 PM, Dave Carlson  wrote:
> 
> Jonathan,
> Well, that is probably one of the most of obscure checkboxes I’ve 
> encountered. And now what you say makes sense. Sure wish they would have 
> named it differently, so that we understood it applied to site based key 
> commands. It seemed to me logical to have that check, if I wanted keyboard 
> command to work. So again, thanks very much for pointing that out. I think 
> it’s going to help my web experience a lot.
> Dave Carlson
> Woodworker, Farfar, Oregonian, pioneer, engineer, and Musician
> 
> 
> On Jun 18, 2024, at 7:06 PM, Jonathan Cohn  wrote:
> 
> Well, there is a VO setting to disable web defined keystrokes in preference 
> to VoiceOver ones.
> Make sure that in VO Utility Web area that the  "Always allow keyboard 
> commands to navigate websites” is unchecked. 
>  
>   Best wishes,
> 
> Jonathan Cohn
> 
> 
> 
>> On Jun 17, 2024, at 5:53 PM, Lorie McCloud > <mailto:lorice...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>> 
>> I just joined the resident portal for my apartment complex. on the site it 
>> gives several keyboard shortcuts which it says are global. when I tried 
>> them, they didn’t work at all. Safari just behaved as it always does. is 
>> there any keyboard command for putting safari into a mode where these 
>> keyboard shortcuts will work?
>> 
>> thanks.
>> Lorie
>> 
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Re: keyboard shortcuts on a site

[Jonathan Cohn]

Well, there is a VO setting to disable web defined keystrokes in preference to 
VoiceOver ones.
Make sure that in VO Utility Web area that the  "Always allow keyboard commands 
to navigate websites” is unchecked. 
 
Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Jun 17, 2024, at 5:53 PM, Lorie McCloud  wrote:
> 
> I just joined the resident portal for my apartment complex. on the site it 
> gives several keyboard shortcuts which it says are global. when I tried them, 
> they didn’t work at all. Safari just behaved as it always does. is there any 
> keyboard command for putting safari into a mode where these keyboard 
> shortcuts will work?
> 
> thanks.
> Lorie
> 
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Re: Apple Watch Series 9

[Jonathan Cohn]

There is no Safari on the watch, but both Apple Podcasts and Overcast have apps 
to listen to podcasts.
One thing I really appreciate about my watch is that if you use the iPhone 
health app to create a wakeup alarm, and ware your watch to bed then the alarm 
only goes off on your wrist. I can easily wake up to this without disturbing my 
spouse.
I know several people   on this list have discussed the taptic time feature 
that will step in morse code on your wrist. I personally only seem to be able 
to get this to work when I’m not trying to use the function.

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Re: Should I buy carbon copy cloner? Is it good enough to just use time machine? Thought anyone?

[Jonathan Cohn]

I would tend toward a network storage solution for a second backup strategy. 

You need to consider your risks an significance of your files to decide what to 
use

Types of hazards:
1. accidental deletion of important information 
2 Home/Office disaster (fire/flood)
3. hackers  / encrypting / or deleting your files. 

The second and third  issues are more likely avoided with either a off-line 
backup strategy or an off-site backup system.

Don’t forget that iCloud/One Drive / Google Docs / dropbox can do a fairly good 
job of maintaining files as long as you pay efor enough storage and there is no 
corruption in the synchronization process. These can act as a pseudo backup 
method, though sometimes files are not on your local system then (but just a 
link) and then time machine won’t back them up or will back them up incorrectly.
There are books written about best approaches.

 

Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Jun 4, 2024, at 1:56 PM, 'Jason J.G. White' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> Note that the operating system volume is managed entirely by Apple on modern 
> machines, so you only need a backup strategy for the data volume.
> 
> On 3/6/24 13:42, 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries wrote:
>>I use both. CCC will do the same basic backup as Time Machine but is very 
>> flexible if you wish to make more focused backups of specific data.
>> 
>>Also creating restore tasks can make restoring easier.
>> 
>>If CCC offers a trial, give it a try.
>> 
>> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
>> "Alone we can do so little; together we can do so much."
>>  -Helen Keller
>> My e-Mail:
>> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
>> 
>> On 6/3/2024 10:15 AM, Maurice A. Mines wrote:
>>> Hello everyone, I'm trying to decide if just using time machine as a 
>>> backup and restore option is better than purchasing carbon copy cloner? 
>>> Because my research seems to show that one does the same thing as the 
>>> other. Meaning I'm using time machine what would be the benefit to using 
>>> carbon copy cloner? Bottom line, is carbon copy cloner worth the $40? Or is 
>>> this expense a waste of time and money.
>>> 
>>> Will time machine Restore my machine should anything bad happen?
>>> 
>>> All the best Maurice mines.
>>> 
>> 
> 
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Re: Apple Health App

[Jonathan Cohn]

I think you mean the blood oxygen sensor. Watches are not cabable of
measureing blood pressure.
Also, since the Watch 8 was mentioned, the primary difference between a
Watch 8 and a Watch 9 that I remember is that the 9 (and also the Ultra 2 )
can do some speech processing on the watch directly and don't need to hand
it off.
I believe there were also some changes in the  technology used for crash
detection. .

On Thu, May 30, 2024 at 1:39 PM Anders Holmberg 
wrote:

> Hi!
> One thing I miss is the blood pressure check.
> THey removed ot for some reason I think.
> At least on my Apple Watch Ultra 2 it can not be found.
> /A
>
> > 30 maj 2024 kl. 06:56 skrev 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries <
> macvisionaries@googlegroups.com>:
> >
> > Hi ET,
> >
> > Not Jonathan, but the watch has:
> > Emergency alerts
> > Fall detection
> > Heart monitoring, including EKG
> >
> >
> > I know from personal experience that the emergency feature on the watch
> works quite well.  A year and a half ago, when I was in a car accident, my
> watch called 911, and also all of my emergency contacts.
> > HTH,
> > Donna
> >
> >> On May 30, 2024, at 12:14 AM, 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries <
> macvisionaries@googlegroups.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> Jonathan,
> >>  In brief, how would an Apple watch benefit me? Thanks much.
> >>
> >> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
> >> "Alone we can do so little; together we can do so much."
> >> -Helen Keller
> >> My e-Mail:
> >> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
> >>
> >> On 5/29/2024 1:22 PM, Jonathan C. Cohn wrote:
> >>> Apple Watch.
> >>> Sent from my iPhone
>  On May 29, 2024, at 1:05 PM, 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries <
> macvisionaries@googlegroups.com> wrote:
> 
>  Hi all,
>   I am considering some kind of medical device that can interface with
> the health app. Can't think off hand the names of these devices but
> something that can be useful in the event I have a medical emergency.
> Thanks.
> 
>  From E.T.'s Keyboard...
>  "Alone we can do so little; together we can do so much."
>  -Helen Keller
>  My e-Mail:
>  ancient.ali...@icloud.com
> 
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Re: Navigating Mail on Ventura

[Jonathan Cohn]

Well, as Herbie said, you can use the "move to linked item” command.
Another possibility is to set up hot spots for the message list and mailbox 
list.
If you want to get more complicated and make sure that mail is running, then a 
two or three line AppleScript should be able to do this.

Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On May 18, 2024, at 5:39 PM, 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hello,
>   What Voiceover commands are used in the mail app to move between the 
> mailbox and message tables? I want to find the equivalent braille commands to 
> use on a braille display. Thanks much.
> 
> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
> "Alone we can do so little; together we can do so much."
> -Helen Keller
> My e-Mail:
> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
> 
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Re: Browsing Time Machine

[Jonathan Cohn]

I have never been completely sure of the official way of doing this.
I do remember some discussion though.
1. Find the timeline areea by stop interacting and then going to the next
item .
2. The backup selection is a slider that can be navigated several ways.
ONce you find the date, then go back to your main finder area and find the
folder.

How you actually recover a selected folder or item, I am not 100  sure, but
I would expect a either the file menu or the contextual menu should have  a
selector for this.

BTW did you know there is now a universal Apple URL for all documentation
that includes historic items?
%

On Sat, May 11, 2024 at 5:55 PM 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries <
macvisionaries@googlegroups.com> wrote:

> Hello,
> When selecting this option from the status bar, how does one
> navigate the backup? I was trying to find a particular folder in the
> Finder. Thanks.
>
>  From E.T.'s Keyboard...
> "Alone we can do so little; together we can do so much."
>   -Helen Keller
> My e-Mail:
> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
>
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Re: Problem with numpad on Ventura

[Jonathan Cohn]

Ever since Single Letter QuickNav was created, VoiceOver would turn off 
QuickNav when interacting with  input elements and/or  Text Fields. It sounds 
like now that Single LetterQuickNav has been separated from arrow QuickNav that 
they decided to merge this toggle with the numpad commander. Personally I would 
want this to be a configurable option. I can’t play wit this as I am currently 
stuck on Mojave . I will probably purchase a new Macintosh in May or June  and 
have started to determine what system to purchase.
I will miss my 11 inch MacBook Air that I dubbed “Speedy” as it so outperformed 
my eMac.   .
Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Apr 28, 2024, at 1:56 PM, Herbie Allen  wrote:
> 
> My wife also has this issue in Sinoma 
> Sonoma so not just you. I haven’t noticed this as much as I’m not a big 
> Numpad Commander user and often use it as an actual num pad. Maybe they 
> figure that’s how people would want to use it? 
>> On Apr 28, 2024, at 08:52, Paul Hopewell  wrote:
>> 
>> Hello,
>> I am running the latest Ventura on my 1917 iMac. I use numpad commander on 
>> my Apple Magic keyboard with Numpad keys. I use the Numpad keys to navigate 
>> around my screen.
>> This all works OK except sometimes when I am entering data into an Edit 
>> field the numeric values on the Numpad get entered into the Edit area. This 
>> happens when I am editing data in 1 Password entries and often when I enter 
>> a password in Safari while logging onto a web site.
>> Do others encounter this problem? Any ideas on why this happens and what I 
>> need to do to fix it?
>> My use of the Numpad commander is habitual and I often forget to stop using 
>> it in the above cases.
>> Many thanks for any ideas.
>> Best …Paul Hopewell
>> 
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Macintosh vs iPad

[Jonathan Cohn]

I know this has been discussed before, but there are new system now I need to 
get a new primary  system and am considering if a iPad with keyboard might make 
more sense than a MacBook. 
I keep imagining that I will do some programming on the Macintosh, but 
realistically for personal use I end up only composing mail and simple 
documents, using the Agenda app and reading web pages. I believe all of these 
could be done quite well on an iPad.
Generally my programming ambitions are filled at work where I do some JAWS 
scripting either to narrow down issues or for clients. Also, these days I am 
trying to reduce my computer time.
For those that have both an iPad and a M1, M2 or M3 Mac, when do you feel the 
need to use the Mac instead of your iPad. When does the iPad seem particularly 
frustrating.
Thanks for your input!
Jonathan 

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Re: Not Responding Errors

[Jonathan Cohn]

I wonder if this is part of Apple’s response to preventing the Android to 
iMessage gateway product (perhaps called beeper) that Apple was having to lock 
down iCloud accounts. Perhaps there is code preventing multiple OS’s on the 
same hardware from access iCloud services.
This is entirely guesswork.

Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Apr 22, 2024, at 7:28 PM, 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
>   Further information. I find I cannot sign out of Apple ID as it just hangs 
> there making no progress.
> 
>   I welcome suggestions on how to address this, thanks.
> 
> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
> "Alone we can do so little; together we can do so much."
> -Helen Keller
> My e-Mail:
> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
> 
> On 4/21/2024 10:55 AM, 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries wrote:
>> Hello all,
>>After reinstalling Ventura 13.6.6, I am getting the Not Responding 
>> dialog. I'm surmising the Mail, Message, TV, and Music apps are trying to 
>> access my Apple ID credentials. From System settings, I can sign in and out 
>> just fine. So there must be a setting for this which I cannot find. Can use 
>> some guidance on this this, thanks.
>> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
>> "Alone we can do so little; together we can do so much."
>>  -Helen Keller
>> My e-Mail:
>> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
> 
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Re: pdf

[Jonathan Cohn]

You should stil be able to use the save  menu item and then you should be
able to open the doucment in your native PDF viewer.


On Fri, Apr 5, 2024 at 4:37 PM Herbie Allen  wrote:

> I wonder if you can do a Save As?
>
> > On Apr 5, 2024, at 15:02, Lorie McCloud  wrote:
> >
> > no. when I click on the link in the email Safari opens and I land in the
> document itself.
> >
> >> On Apr 2, 2024, at 4:52 PM, Herbie Allen 
> wrote:
> >>
> >> A PDF does not download any differently! You can just click on the link.
> >>
> >>> On Apr 2, 2024, at 16:24, Lorie McCloud  wrote:
> >>>
> >>> I bought a pdf book. What's the best way to download it using a Mac? I
> don't think it's possible to download it from a link in email is it? if I
> follow the link I land in the document.
> >>>
> >>> thanks.
> >>> Lorie
> >>>
> >>> Sent from my iPhone
> >>>
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Get Started in Seconds With Piezo 1.9 on MacOS 14.4

[Jonathan Cohn]

The first  Rogue Ameba application to not need special privileges is now 
available. 




https://weblog.rogueamoeba.com/2024/03/13/piezo-ark-update-launches/ 
<https://weblog.rogueamoeba.com/2024/03/13/piezo-ark-update-launches/> 
Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



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Fwd: Coming up Saturday: Voiceover for Mac Discussion Group

[Jonathan Cohn]

New York libraries monthly chat about VoiceOver and Macintosh is coming up 
again! This is usually a general chat with no specific agenda.

> From: "'Chancey Fleet' via Technology Programs at Andrew Heiskell Braille & 
> Talking Book Library" 
> Saturday March 30, 2 PM - 4 PM Eastern
> https://nypl.zoom.us/meeting/register/tZwpc-2hrzstHdJRTSfL_zzn6x3oNW9pUPZB 
> 
> Join us to discuss your questions, tips and tricks regarding Voiceover for 
> Mac!
> 
> 
> -- 
> Chancey S. Fleet
> Assistive Technology Coordinator
> Andrew Heiskell Braille and Talking Book Library
> (212) 621-0627
> 
> 
> 
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Re: GMail App on iPhone

[Jonathan Cohn]

Outlook for IOS is supposed to work with Gmail also. I have no idea if you need 
a Microsoft 360 account to use it. The read my emails function in Outlook is 
quite nice, though I don’t know if it works with Gmail accounts.

Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Mar 23, 2024, at 11:22 AM, 'Jason J.G. White' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> On 22/3/24 01:42, Jürgen Fleger wrote:
>> I don't like the conversations view in this App on my iPhone. But it 
>> seems it doesn't work to disable it in the settings. Whether it is 
>> enabled or disabled it always looks the same. 
> Note that you can configure Apple Mail to access Google's Gmail accounts. I 
> note this here in case you aren't already aware.
> 
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Re: M3 15-inch MacBook Air vs M3 14-inch MacBook Pro -- Comparison

[Jonathan Cohn]

Here is a summary from the tidbits article that might help you decide.
Do note that the MB pro computers do have a brighter display, but if you aren’t 
really using the display I would go for the top of the line AIR over the bottom 
of the line Pro.

https://tidbits.com/2024/03/04/new-m3-macbook-air-models-can-drive-two-displays/
 
<https://tidbits.com/2024/03/04/new-m3-macbook-air-models-can-drive-two-displays/>

Purchasing Decisions

These new MacBook Air models are compelling for anyone buying their first 
MacBook Air, but do they provide sufficient improvements to prompt an upgrade? 
It all depends on where you’re coming from.

If budget is paramount, you can save a little money by purchasing the M2 
MacBook Air for as little as $999, though adding memory or storage pushes you 
into a range similar to the M3 models.
If you’ve held onto an Intel-based Mac this long and are considering a MacBook 
Air, upgrade immediately to an M3 MacBook Air. The performance jump from any 
Intel-based Mac will knock your socks off, and the M3 models will enjoy a 
longer lifespan than their M2 counterparts.
For those—like me—with an M1 MacBook Air, the main reason to upgrade is if you 
need more performance than the M1 chip can provide. The M3 benchmarks show it 
to be 25% to 35% faster 
<https://nanoreview.net/en/cpu-compare/apple-m3-vs-apple-m1> than the M1, and 
Apple cites more specific examples with larger gains 
<https://www.apple.com/newsroom/2024/03/apple-unveils-the-new-13-and-15-inch-macbook-air-with-the-powerful-m3-chip/>.
 But if performance is a concern, also consider a MacBook Pro with an M3 Pro or 
M3 Max processor.
If you have an M2 MacBook Air, the M3’s performance gains of 10% to 20% 
<https://nanoreview.net/en/cpu-compare/apple-m3-vs-apple-m2>probably aren’t 
significant enough to warrant upgrading.
Regardless of what you have now, if you want to drive two external displays 
from a laptop, the M3 MacBook Air models are a great buy. They’re much cheaper 
than the M3 Pro MacBook Pro models you’d otherwise need that start at $1999 for 
the 14-inch MacBook Pro and $2599 for the 16-inch model.
    Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Mar 15, 2024, at 8:50 AM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi Dave,
> 
> I can only answer for myself, but here you go.  In 2017, I bought my one and 
> only MacBook Pro.  All my other Macs, including my current 2023 M1 have been 
> MacBook Airs.
> 
> Brad makes a strong case that for an extra $100, the MBP is the better 
> machine.  But I’ve always liked the smaller form factor and the lighter 
> weight of the MBA.  When I taught face-to-face, I had to carry my computer 
> with me around campus.  I also like to take it when I travel, so the smaller 
> and lighter, the better.  The MBA has always met my computing needs, but I’m 
> not an artist, graphic designer, etc.  I liked my MBP a lot, but I also 
> thought it was probably overkill for my use case.  So, in 2020, when the M1 
> chips came out, I went back to a MacBook Air.  That said, From the specs Brad 
>  sent last night, the difference in weight between the two seems pretty 
> negligible.  I was thinking I might upgrade to the M3 Air, but now I’m not 
> sure, either whether I will upgrade, or, if I do, which machine I’ll get.  My 
> current leaning is to just hold off and see what next year brings.
> Cheers,
> Donna
> 
>> On Mar 14, 2024, at 11:53 PM, Dave Carlson  wrote:
>> 
>> Brad,
>> Thanks for this. Saw it after my question post Air vs. Pro. But still I 
>> wonder the use case. I used to think that the Air was designed to pull 
>> everything it needed to run (programs/apps) from the Internet, so not 
>> needing to store anything large on the machine except for data and 
>> personalizations. Is that no longer the push?
>> 
>> Dave Carlson
>> Oregonian, Woodworker, Farfar, Engineer, Musician
>> dgcarlson0...@gmail.com
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On Mar 14, 2024, at 5:51 PM, Brad Snyder  wrote:
>> 
>> M3 15-inch MacBook Air vs M3 14-inch MacBook Pro -- Comparison... 
>> https://appleinsider.com/articles/24/03/13/m3-15-inch-macbook-air-vs-m3-14-inch-macbook-procomparison
>>  
>> <https://appleinsider.com/articles/24/03/13/m3-15-inch-macbook-air-vs-m3-14-inch-macbook-procomparison>
>> 
>> - Brad -
>> 
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Re: Installing Rogue Amoeba apps is about to get a lot easier ???

[Jonathan Cohn]

I looked for updates on this but could not find anything. I expect Apple needs 
to change something in their entitlements before per-app  sound grabbing can 
occur on the computer. Perhaps when the .4 update to Sonoma comes out we will 
hear more about this.

Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Mar 1, 2024, at 8:54 AM, 'Janina Sajka' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> Just wondering whether there's any update re Rogue Amoeba's dropping
> their dependency on hacking security settings. I've decided to update
> only afterwards.
> 
> Thanks!
> Janina
> 
> Jonathan Cohn writes:
>> This sounds like great news.
>> https://sixcolors.com/link/2024/01/installing-rogue-amoeba-apps-is-about-to-get-a-lot-easier/
>>  
>> <https://sixcolors.com/link/2024/01/installing-rogue-amoeba-apps-is-about-to-get-a-lot-easier/>
>>  
>> Installing Rogue Amoeba apps is about to get a lot easier
>> <https://weblog.rogueamoeba.com/2024/01/09/2024-status-report/>
>> I love Rogue Amoeba???s Mac audio utilities, but in the Apple silicon era, 
>> installing them has been pretty rough 
>> <https://sixcolors.com/link/2020/11/rogue-amoebas-apps-updated-for-m1-with-a-catch/>,
>>  due to Apple requiring multiple reboots and a visit to Recovery Mode to 
>> perform a dubious-sounding reduction to a Mac???s ???security policy.???
>> 
>> There is apparently great news on this front, however! Tucked into an 
>> otherwise perfectly nice summation of Rogue Amoeba???s year 
>> <https://weblog.rogueamoeba.com/2024/01/09/2024-status-report/>, CEO Paul 
>> Kafasis wrote:
>> 
>> We???ll soon be shipping updates that simplify things immensely. In fact, 
>> Airfoil, Audio Hijack, and Piezo will feature an installer-free setup that 
>> won???t even need your administrator password. Meanwhile, Loopback and 
>> SoundSource will use a new audio capture plugin called ARK that won???t 
>> require a single system restart. It???s going to be an incredible 
>> improvement to our user experience.
>> 
>> As someone who has had to reinstall Audio Hijack, Loopback, and SoundSource 
>> multiple times in the last few months??? this is pretty fantastic news. (How 
>> in the world will Audio Hijack not even require an administrator password?! 
>> 
>> 
>> )
>> 
>> This has been a real pain point for more than three years, so kudos to 
>> everyone (presumably both inside Apple and at Rogue Amoeba) who worked on 
>> the problem and found a solution that lets some of macOS???s most clever and 
>> useful utilities run without these issues.
>> 
>> ???Linked by Jason Snell
>> 
>> 
>>  Best wishes,
>> 
>> Jonathan Cohn
>> 
>> 
>> 
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> Janina Sajka (she/her/hers)
> Accessibility Consultant https://linkedin.com/in/jsajka
> 
> The World Wide Web Consortium (W3C), Web Accessibility Initiative (WAI)
> Co-Chair, Accessible Platform Architectures   http://www.w3.org/wai/apa
> 
> Linux Foundation Fellow
> https://www.linuxfoundation.org/board-of-directors-2/
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Re: Reading Xls files on my Mac?

[Jonathan Cohn]

Hello,
I believe you stated .xls files, but Modern Excel uses .xlsx files. In any 
case, if you have access to both and if Excel is accessible enough  then you 
should probably use Exel just because then you won’t have a conversion to 
numbers.
Numbers does have its own quarks especially when editing formulas, but those 
might be improved in newer versions of the program.

Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Feb 19, 2024, at 4:01 PM, Maurice A. Mines  wrote:
> 
> Hi  which program will  work  the  best for this  Numbers? Or  Microsoft 
> exile?
> 
> Maurice Mines.
> 
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Re: Mac OS Calculator?

[Jonathan Cohn]

I did 3-4 tests with the calculator app and did not see any issues.
1. 12 + 5[enter] [command-c]
And then pasted the results in a terminal window 
I then did 
12/88[enter][command-c]
and the number in both cases was pasted successfully in a terminal window.

Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Feb 19, 2024, at 1:23 AM, Mohamed Fayed  wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> Hope my mail finds you well,
> 
> I wonder whether anyone here tried to use the default scientific calculator 
> that comes with Mac OS. You can access it via Applications/Calculator.app.
> 
> I’m trying to use it and copy and paste numbers from other apps, but copying 
> and pasting seams a bad idea with VoiceOver.
> 
> Any tips would be helpful especially since I want to take an exam that allows 
> only default calculators to be used. I’m using Mac OS Ventura 13.6.4.
> 
> Thank you so much 
> 
> Mohamed E. Fayed 
> 
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Re: connecting a braille display to a Mac

[Jonathan Cohn]

Generally when one connects a USB braille device to the Mac it just auto 
detects much like JAWS and NVDA now do.

Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Feb 9, 2024, at 5:17 PM, Lorie McCloud  wrote:
> 
> where are the options for this on a Mac? I’m looking in system settings in 
> accessability but haven’t foundit wouldn’t be in voiceover would it?
> 
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Re: Login Keychain

[Jonathan Cohn]

No, this is not file vault. By default keychains on now in the cloud and
then shared down to each machine. But since Apple is privacy counscious it
does ntot keep a decryption key for the keychain. So, your new computer is
asking for the password for one of your older computers in order to decrypt
the keychain so you can use it to fill in application and web passwords.


On Fri, Jan 26, 2024 at 5:04 PM 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries <
macvisionaries@googlegroups.com> wrote:

> Hello,
> While working to set up Ventura in another APFS volume, I
> encountered a request for a login keychain password. Is this buy chance
> related to file vault encryption? I normally do not have this feature
> enabled. Please enlighten me. Thanks.
>
>  From E.T.'s Keyboard...
> "Alone we can do so little; together we can do so much."
>   -Helen Keller
> My e-Mail:
> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
>
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Installing Rogue Amoeba apps is about to get a lot easier ↦

[Jonathan Cohn]

This sounds like great news.https://sixcolors.com/link/2024/01/installing-rogue-amoeba-apps-is-about-to-get-a-lot-easier/ Installing Rogue Amoeba apps is about to get a lot easier



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I love Rogue Amoeba’s Mac audio utilities, but in the Apple silicon era, installing them has been pretty rough, due to Apple requiring multiple reboots and a visit to Recovery Mode to perform a dubious-sounding reduction to a Mac’s “security policy.”There is apparently great news on this front, however! Tucked into an otherwise perfectly nice summation of Rogue Amoeba’s year, CEO Paul Kafasis wrote:We’ll soon be shipping updates that simplify things immensely. In fact, Airfoil, Audio Hijack, and Piezo will feature an installer-free setup that won’t even need your administrator password. Meanwhile, Loopback and SoundSource will use a new audio capture plugin called ARK that won’t require a single system restart. It’s going to be an incredible improvement to our user experience.As someone who has had to reinstall Audio Hijack, Loopback, and SoundSource multiple times in the last few months… this is pretty fantastic news. (How in the world will Audio Hijack not even require an administrator password?! )This has been a real pain point for more than three years, so kudos to everyone (presumably both inside Apple and at Rogue Amoeba) who worked on the problem and found a solution that lets some of macOS’s most clever and useful utilities run without these issues.—Linked by Jason Snell
		Best wishes,Jonathan Cohn






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Re: VMware Fusion/Player

[Jonathan Cohn]

I posted recently about  screen reader for terminal windows on the Mac. Would 
it be helpful for me to re-find that posting?

Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Dec 28, 2023, at 9:14 PM, 'Janina Sajka' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> Not me. Not enough room in my suitcase, which is when I need the Mac
> hosted Linux. I've a perfectly good native Linux in my office. I want
> the Linux VM for traveling.
> 
> 
> Anders Holmberg writes:
>> Hi!
>> I???d rather use an old laptop for such things.
>> Even for linux.
>> /A
>> 
>>> On 26 Dec 2023, at 17:31, 'Janina Sajka' via MacVisionaries 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Very interesting. Thanks for sharing that you're also unable to get the
>>> free license.
>>> 
>>> It turns out a lot of people have had issues with that, totally aside
>>> from any accessibility. I've wasted a lot of time trying to debug that.
>>> 
>>> Furthermore, I'm concerned that VMware's new owners aren't going to pay
>>> much attention to accessibility given as how they just fired all the
>>> accessibility people from VMware. Way to go Broadcom! You're clearly not
>>> in tune with how to sell in the U.S. and the E.U.
>>> 
>>> So, anyone want to make a wager on how long it will take them to learn
>>> and mend their ways?
>>> 
>>> Argh!
>>> 
>>> Janina
>>> 
>>> 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries writes:
>>>>  Yes that is what I determined is the issue. And I also can't get a new
>>>> license key (free) for Player.
>>>> 
>>>> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
>>>> "Alone we can do so little; together we can do so much."
>>>> -Helen Keller
>>>> My e-Mail:
>>>> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
>>>> 
>>>> On 12/22/2023 12:48 PM, 'Janina Sajka' via MacVisionaries wrote:
>>>>> You need Fusion 13 for VMware to work on Sonoma.
>>>>> 
>>>>> I'm still trying to resolve why I can't upgrade my license, but that's
>>>>> another issue.
>>>>> 
>>>>> hth
>>>>> Janina
>>>>> 
>>>>> Anders Holmberg writes:
>>>>>> Hi!
>>>>>> DOes it even work on an m1 Mac?
>>>>>> Or do you still have the intel?
>>>>>> /A
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 17 dec. 2023 kl. 01:40 skrev 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries 
>>>>>>> :
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Hello all,
>>>>>>>  Anyone using this app to run a Windows virtual machine on the Mac? 
>>>>>>> This broke under Sonoma where the VM will not start up. Thanks.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
>>>>>>> "Alone we can do so little; together we can do so much."
>>>>>>> -Helen Keller
>>>>>>> My e-Mail:
>>>>>>> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
>>>>>>> 
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Re: Ailing 2013 MacBook Air

[Jonathan Cohn]

Another possibility besides more resource intenvive software, is dust or
link buildup in the venting areas. If you have a nearby Apple store, there
is a good chance, that they will take the cover off the bak and blow out
accumulated dirt in the system for free.
If not, iFixIt should have the tools to open a Macbook, I believe they use
a five pointed bolt head to prevent random folks from opening the case.


On Fri, Dec 29, 2023 at 1:23 PM 'Janina Sajka' via MacVisionaries <
macvisionaries@googlegroups.com> wrote:

> Phil:
>
> I still use my 2013 era Mac Air. I am fully updated to Big Sur, the
> lates it seems there will ever be for those older machines.
>
> I can easily get my Air into a situations where the fans are running
> almost constantly. My solution is to minimize how many applications I
> keep open on the Air. There's an old saying about software expanding to
> take advantage of newer, more powerful hardware. I've always thought
> those fans are illustrating that old principle.
>
> Best,
> Janina
>
> Phil Halton writes:
> > I have an older MacBook Air from 2013 that is exhibiting a heck of a lot
> of fan activity these days. I upgraded to a MacBook Pro with the M3 Pro
> chip and I???m very happy with it but I???m trying to put some use to the
> old air. Last night I reinstalled the operating system after doing some
> first aid through disc utility And there???s still fan activity as far as I
> can tell. I reinstalled Catalina. I did not do a full erase and clean
> install, only a reinstall of the OS. I???m wondering, any ideas why all
> this fan activity is it aging Hardware? Or is it some kind of  Software
> problem, or even just data problems from years built up without ever
> erasing and reformatting. I???ll be glad to hear any ideas as to how I can
> bring this thing back to a reasonably good state of operation and if that
> means full of erasure and reinstall then I???d be willing to do that.
> Frankly I don???t see why this thing should be  choking on itself the way
> it is. Thanks for any advice.
> > Sent from my IPhone
> >
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> Janina Sajka (she/her/hers)
> Accessibility Consultant https://linkedin.com/in/jsajka
>
> The World Wide Web Consortium (W3C), Web Accessibility Initiative (WAI)
> Co-Chair, Accessible Platform Architectures http://www.w3.org/wai/apa
>
> Linux Foundation Fellow
> https://www.linuxfoundation.org/board-of-directors-2/
>
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Re: Using Parallels

[Jonathan Cohn]

As  strange as it seems, telling VoiceOver to use the CAPSLOCK key and
keeping VoiceOver running while in Windows might resolve this issue. It did
for me with VMWare 3 years ago.


On Fri, Dec 29, 2023 at 11:02 AM 'Matt Turner' via MacVisionaries <
macvisionaries@googlegroups.com> wrote:

> Hi folks.
> I still have and intel mac and wanted to get a new one in the new year.
> I’ve been playing with Parallels, and so far I like it.
> I just can’t seem to get the Caps lock key to work with Jaws or NVDA.
> Does Anyone have any idea?
>
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Re: Adding Fields in Contacts

[Jonathan Cohn]

Phonetic first name/Last name is for when Siri  does not correctly interpret 
the pronunciation of a name. For example my Daughter goes by G A B I in order 
for my siri requests to call / message her to work I put in a phonetic first 
name doubling the “b”. I believe however this messes up the alphabetic sorting 
of names. 

You of course could have multiple emails or addresses or phone numbers 
associated with a single contact, and you can even give a customized tag like 
“Summer Home” for these.
 
Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Dec 23, 2023, at 12:05 AM, 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hello all,
>   On the iPhone I have one contact for a business that has a person's name 
> with his email and the name of the company. I wish to add another name  and 
> his email address.
> 
>   I clicked add a field which brought up several choices. Can someone clarify 
> what for example, phonetic first name and pronuciation firest name would do? 
> And would I be able to add an email address to this new name? Thanks much.
> 
> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
> "Alone we can do so little; together we can do so much."
> -Helen Keller
> My e-Mail:
> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
> 
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Re: Uber app kills Voice Over on my iPhone

[Jonathan Cohn]

I had an equivalent problem with the Transit app. After scrolling through
4/5 busstops, VoiceOver would completely stop for that app. Killing the app
I would then get VoiceOver to speak again.
I will try deleteing the app and reinstalling.

On Tue, Dec 26, 2023 at 11:17 AM 'Janina Sajka' via MacVisionaries <
macvisionaries@googlegroups.com> wrote:

> For the record the problem has resolved itself sometime over the past 48
> hours. I hate problems that resolve themselves because one never learns
> anything from such situations. :)
>
>
> On the other hand, this was a serious showstopper when it was a problem.
> It made my iPhone useless while the problem was manifesting. I'm so glad
> I have a fallback Android phone which usefully mirrors the Uber data in
> realtime in the Android Uber app.
>
> Brad Snyder writes:
> > You might want to try restarting VoiceOver.
> > You can do this by asking Siri to turn VoiceOver off, then asking Siri
> to turn VoiceOver back on.
> > Sometimes cycling VoiceOver off and then back on corrects all kinds of
> issues.
> >
> > - Brad -
> >
> >
> >
> > On Dec 24, 2023, at 09:21, 'Janina Sajka' via MacVisionaries <
> macvisionaries@googlegroups.com> wrote:
> >
> > The only restart I know is long press of the power button followed by
> > double tap on screen, as Power Off is the default action on the menu
> > there. Note I also have no VO on this menu.
> >
> > I guess I need to reinstall the app because I am indeed on 17.2.1.
> >
> > Brad Snyder writes:
> > > My suggestion would be to restart your device.
> > > Also, make sure you are updated to the latest version of iOS, which is
> version 17.2.1.
> > > If the issue persists, delete the Uber app, and reinstall.
> > >
> > >
> > > - Brad -
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On Dec 22, 2023, at 14:59, 'Janina Sajka' via MacVisionaries <
> macvisionaries@googlegroups.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > Dear All:
> > >
> > > Beginning during an outing this past Wednesday, but then again Thursday
> > > I noticed that using Uber on my SE is crashing Voice Over. I can order
> > > the ride. The crash occurs when trip data is loaded. I still have
> speech
> > > as some of the data comes across, but it eventually dies fully.
> > >
> > > Strangely, receiving an incoming phone call reactivates VoiceOver, but
> > > only while the phone is ringing. Once answered or dismissed, I have no
> > > Voice Over output.
> > >
> > > Needless to say this is a showstopper for relying on Uber and my
> iPhone.
> > > Anyone else seen anything like this?
> > >
> > > Janina
> > >
> > > --
> > >
> > > Janina Sajka (she/her/hers)
> > > Accessibility Consultant https://linkedin.com/in/jsajka
> > >
> > > The World Wide Web Consortium (W3C), Web Accessibility Initiative (WAI)
> > > Co-Chair, Accessible Platform Architectures http://www.w3.org/wai/apa
> > >
> > > Linux Foundation Fellow
> > > https://www.linuxfoundation.org/board-of-directors-2/
> > >
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Re: Bug in Numbers

[Jonathan Cohn]

I believe numbers is not as fluid about moving between the Grid and the
formula editing box. I can't remember if I was able to use VO-J to jump
between them, or if I ended up setting up a VO hotspot. It also might be
worth while trying to turn off cursor tracking while in numbers.


On Mon, Dec 25, 2023 at 7:18 AM Brandon Olivares 
wrote:

> I’ve been experiencing this bug in Numbers for a while now. Sometimes when
> I go into a spreadsheet, I can’t navigate any of the cells. Interacting
> with the table just results in it making an error noise any time I try to
> go in any direction, as if there’s nothing in the document, but there
> clearly is.
>
> Only if I restart Numbers does it work again, but it keeps happening.
>
> Are others experiencing this? I’ve had it for a while now and thought I’d
> wait to see if it was fixed, but it’s still happening.
>
> Is there any workaround or something I’m doing wrong?
>
> Thanks,
> Brandon
>
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Re: What's going on with Audio Hijack.

[Jonathan Cohn]

A kernel extension is code  that  modifies the kernel, When CMU created the 
Mach kernel ( a little like the Linux kernel,… ) it provided the ability to add 
extensions to extend driver functionality. Apparently Rogue amoeba software 
requires this to get to the underlying audio streams. Apple discourages kernel 
extensions for the past 4 or 4 versions, since they can have full access to 
everything in your computer. But since there are various products that depended 
on kernel extensions, Apple provides a way for a user to still allow these 
extensions to run.
HTH!
  
Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Dec 15, 2023, at 12:42 PM, Anders Holmberg  wrote:
> 
> Hi!
> I try to upgrade to Audio hijack 4.3  And get this message.
> You now need to adjust your system’s settings to allow ACE to run. In the 
> Mac's “Recovery” environment, you’ll modify the System Security Policy to 
> match the settings pictured below.
>   A security policy with “Reduced Security” selected, and the “Allow user 
> management of kernel extensions” checkbox turned on. image
> To access the “Recovery” environment, shut down your Mac, then press and hold 
> the Power button until “Loading startup options” appears.
> Very frustrating.
> How to accomplish this.
> Can it be done with a bluetooth keyboard.
> Bless.
> 
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Re: locating Video

[Jonathan Cohn]

There was a discussion of this about a month ago. One possible answer is photos.
What happens if you look at the storage area in settings?

Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Dec 8, 2023, at 11:14 AM, 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
>   On the iPhone in the About area, a video is listed. Where is the actual 
> video located? I looked in both the TV app and Photo viewer but cannot find 
> it. Thanks much.
> 
> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
> "Alone we can do so little; together we can do so much."
> -Helen Keller
> My e-Mail:
> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
> 
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Re: clicking buttons on my Mac

[Jonathan Cohn]

Check what your cursor tracking setting is at.
VO-shift-F3  I have had issues when this is not on.
Also,   VO-SPace is a “activate” which is quite similar to a click but is not a 
click. You can try VO-Shift-space to force a mouse click. I believe with 
VO-space you don’t need to be concerned about mouse location, but with 
vo-shift-space you do
Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Dec 3, 2023, at 11:48 PM, Lorie McCloud  wrote:
> 
> I’ve been having trouble clicking buttons on websites using Safari on my new 
> Mac. I can have the button in focus. I even press vo-command-f5 to make sure 
> I’m really there but I try to. click it and nothing happens. I click using 
> vo-space as I always have. what setting might I need to check in the vo 
> utility to facilitate this action? I’ve tried it on a couple of sites sith no 
> luck so I don’t think it’s just that one site.
> 
> thanks.
> Lorie
> 
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Re: Old dinosaur looking to upgrade

[Jonathan Cohn]

Well, I implied the M2 vs M3 debate.
Right now only Mac Book Pros have the M3 series of chips, the AIR  still come 
with M2.
The MacBookPro do have a display that is twice as bright if you have vision 
that can take advantage of that.

All of the MacBooks’s power buttons double as touch ID, so if you have enough 
dexterity to use the power button then you shouldn’t need to have touch ID on 
the keyboard.
That being said, if you are not traveling with the computer then getting a 
MacMini might be a good idea. You can hook up a very inexpensive display or the 
Studio display and get as powerful a system without paying for a keyboard 
and/or display  that you don’t plan to use. 

Generally, unless you manage what’s is open on your system, having more shared 
memory will be more important than  additional cores which is what the M3 is 
giving you. 
If you are doing sound processing or visual processing then you might need the 
extra processing of the M3. If you are doing eMail and Web browsing or small 
business accounting, I would expect putting the cost difference between a AIR 
with M2 and a Pro with M3 would better be placed in shared memory or additional 
storage.
  

Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Dec 2, 2023, at 8:35 AM, Phil Halton  wrote:
> 
> Jonathan, thanks for answering. Do you have anything more substantial to say 
> about the reasons why you would suggest the air over the MacBook Pro? For 
> example how about my question concerning the  M2 chip in the MacBook Air 
> versus the M3 chip in the MacBook Pro? And also about the touch ID sensor on 
> the external keyboards?
> Sent from my IPhone
> 
> 
>> On Dec 1, 2023, at 8:52 PM, Jonathan Cohn  wrote:
>> 
>> I would suggest getting a top of the line AIR instead of a base model 
>> MacBook Pro. They should be about the same price but the additional memory 
>> and storage will probably be more beneficial then Ray tracing or a few more 
>> cores in  the processor.
>> But then I’m still running a 2015 Mac Book Air 11.
>> 
>>  Best wishes,
>> 
>> Jonathan Cohn
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On Dec 1, 2023, at 12:21 PM, Phil Halton >> <mailto:philh...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> I currently use a MacBook Air 2013 and maybe it's the season, but I'm 
>>> thinking of upgrading. I'm looking at a base model MacBookPro 14 inch with 
>>> the m3 chip. I'm not a power user anymore so I'm thinking this will do fine.
>>> I'm just wondering about a few things such as, is the M2 chip in the 15 
>>> inch MacBookAir that much less powerful than the M3 in the MacBookPro, and 
>>> is the Air worth considering?
>>> Then there is the external keyboard question. I need an external to 
>>> minimize the impact on carpal tunnel and the Magic keyboards seem to have 
>>> some  features like touch ID, and keypad. I don't need the keypad, but the 
>>> touch ID might be useful. Is touch ID worth the extra money? Currently I 
>>> get by just fine with an old external apple keyboard with no features, but 
>>> I don't know what the newest machines are like and what might be a real 
>>> benefit.
>>> I'd appreciate any helpful information you can give me on the latest and 
>>> greatest from Apple Macs.
>>> 
>>> Sent from my IPhone
>>> 
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>&g

Re: Old dinosaur looking to upgrade

[Jonathan Cohn]

I would suggest getting a top of the line AIR instead of a base model MacBook 
Pro. They should be about the same price but the additional memory and storage 
will probably be more beneficial then Ray tracing or a few more cores in  the 
processor.
But then I’m still running a 2015 Mac Book Air 11.

Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Dec 1, 2023, at 12:21 PM, Phil Halton  wrote:
> 
> I currently use a MacBook Air 2013 and maybe it's the season, but I'm 
> thinking of upgrading. I'm looking at a base model MacBookPro 14 inch with 
> the m3 chip. I'm not a power user anymore so I'm thinking this will do fine.
> I'm just wondering about a few things such as, is the M2 chip in the 15 inch 
> MacBookAir that much less powerful than the M3 in the MacBookPro, and is the 
> Air worth considering?
> Then there is the external keyboard question. I need an external to minimize 
> the impact on carpal tunnel and the Magic keyboards seem to have some  
> features like touch ID, and keypad. I don't need the keypad, but the touch ID 
> might be useful. Is touch ID worth the extra money? Currently I get by just 
> fine with an old external apple keyboard with no features, but I don't know 
> what the newest machines are like and what might be a real benefit.
> I'd appreciate any helpful information you can give me on the latest and 
> greatest from Apple Macs.
> 
> Sent from my IPhone
> 
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Re: Reading Terminal Windows with VoiceOver

[Jonathan Cohn]

There is also a dedicated SR for for the terminal. I heard about it but I have 
not  actually tried it out at all.  We discussed it at the NY Public Library 
Mac VoiceOver discussion that occurs monthly on Saturdays.
Apple Vis link below:
https://www.applevis.com/blog/announcing-tdsr-command-line-screen-reader-macintosh-gnulinux
Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Nov 30, 2023, at 8:20 AM, 'Jason J.G. White' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> 
> On 30/11/23 07:28, Kelly Ford wrote:
>> Does anyone have a suggestion on how to read Terminal windows with VoiceOver 
>> on the Mac a line at a time?
> While interacting with the terminal widget, VO-Up/Down-Arrow should read the 
> text a line at a time.
> 
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Re: VoiceOver and Text Editing with Mac OS 14 Betas

[Jonathan Cohn]

Hi Kelly,
Historically this list refrains from talking about beta  There is a group
on groups.io that does discuss VoiceOver and beta issues, I believe it is
called public beta users.
I personally have not been able to run a beta on a Macintosh for two years
as my hardware is too old right now.
I'd be interested in hearing more about editing issues, since  Mac have
been using a text edit control inherited from Next OS that allows one to
create a personallized set of key commands, and this framework seems to be
less supported recently.
Best Wishes,
Jonathan Cohn software.

On Fri, Nov 17, 2023 at 8:14 AM Kelly Ford  wrote:

> Hello,
>
> Is anyone else running the beta builds of Mac OS 14 and finding issues
> when editing text?  For example, I open some text files in TextEdit and use
> the arrow keys to try and read/edit. VoiceOver isn’t reading anything.
>
> This also happens when I use the Feedback app to submit a bug report to
> Apple. I can press VO+a to read the full text field but moving by word,
> character and line with arrows and such is not working.
>
> Text input and editing is working correctly in the Mail app.
>
> Kelly
>
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Re: I've tried multiple times to reset a HomePod. Help please

[Jonathan Cohn]

That sounds essentially like what we did, I believe timing is important though. 
Also, somehow my wife was able to get the HomePod to recognize her iPhone 
hotspot in addition to our home network, then anytime our provider messes with 
the router, she is still able to manage the HomePod and redirect it to the home 
network without rebooting or resetting.
I wish I could give more details, but I’m not sure how she managed this.
Also, HomePods take longer to reset to factory than you would expect.

Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Nov 4, 2023, at 4:58 PM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> As I’ve said, I’ve tried multiple times to reset a HomePod with no luck.  
> I’ve unplugged it, left it unplugged for a minute, the, plugged it in, and 
> pressed down on the play button, but it doesn’t reset.  Am I doing something 
> wrong?  Is there some new trick with the update to IOS 17?
> TIA,
> Donna
> 
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Re: Microsoft teams and VO, will it work together?

[Jonathan Cohn]

Sorry one more point on Teams, with the Macintosh turn off cursor tracking for 
best results. There are a few places where a pop-up gets triggered by a focus 
event to bring up a menu. Specifically, the Name tag in a conversation will pop 
up choices of Call / Private Chat /who knows what else if you don’t have cursor 
tracking off and the VO cursor is on this label.

Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Oct 23, 2023, at 12:37 PM, Maurice A. Mines  wrote:
> 
> Hi  all  the  subject line  says  it. All.  A monthly meeting that  I  attend 
> ether  in  person  or remotely has given  notice that  they are  dropping 
> Zoom  and  switching to  Microsoft teams. Is. Anyone  using  teams with  VO?
> 
> Maurice Mines.
> 
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Re: A question about accessibility of Microsoft teams on an M2 MacBook Pro, 2022

[Jonathan Cohn]

There are two versions of Teams, so it gets a little confusing. 
The business version integrates into One Drive and has good accessibility 
features including AI based auto transcriptions.
Teams on Windows is making a transition from an Electron App to a WebView2 app. 
I have no idea how this matches up with the Mac version.

Some basic keystrokes (assuming that command replaces control on the Macintosh 
versions.)
1. command-shift-J join meeting that you received an announcement about.
2. command-shift-M mute/unmute 
3. command+shift+O toggle video 
command+shift+K raise hand 
command+shift+L list people with raised hands 
command+shift+f  move to list of conversations or teams or feed events.
command+/ Enter search field 
command+? list all short cut keys 
command+shift+h hangup 
HTH 

Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Oct 23, 2023, at 9:30 AM, Maurice A. Mines  wrote:
> 
> Hello everyone, a meeting that I’ve been attending for a very long time. The 
> host has decided that she wants to go in a different direction. She wants to 
> use Microsoft teams is this even usable with voiceover? I am wanting to make 
> certain that it is and if it’s not, how do I address it? Definitely looking 
> for some suggestions and potential answers. I’m doing this for before I have 
> the problem. I have the balance of the week this out.? Please feel free if 
> this is not white chain to the left to write me at the email address that is 
> listed in my signature.  Thanks for reading this, and have an excellent day. 
> Please note that this is being dictated to the phone so somethings might not 
> come out the way they should. 
> Sent from my iPhone. 
> Email, Nfb, presidentdeafbl...@maurice-amines.com email personal 
> min...@me.com. Voice,  text number 661-868-9647.
> Fax number  661-449-3746.
> 
> 
> President, National Federation of the blind DeafBlind division. IP relay 
> number 661-249-9715.
> Vice President national Federation of the blind of California Bakersfield 
> chapter.
> amateur radio, call sign, kd0iko.
> 
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Re: iCloud Drive

[Jonathan Cohn]

Hello,
I didn’t have a share item in the context menu on my system. I looked at the 
menu that opens when the share button in the toolbar is pressed.
It is also in the file menu=>Share where for me it is the first item.
Good Luck!

Jonathan Cohn



> On Oct 21, 2023, at 6:20 PM, Lorie McCloud  wrote:
> 
> where do I find that? I can’t find it in the context menu related to the file 
> I want to share. I arrow down to “share” and press vo-space. then I hear”add 
> people.” if I press vo-space on that I can arrow right and get: “choose how 
> you’d like to send you invitation.” and then: “messages, mail and copy link. 
> I think airdrop is after that. first time I did that it worked but now 
> pressing vo-space on “copy llink” doesn’t seem to do anything. is thetre 
> another way to access this?
> 
> thanks.
> Lorie
>> On Oct 21, 2023, at 4:01 PM, Jonathan Cohn > <mailto:jon.c.c...@gmail.com>> wro
>> The Share File option seems to do this.
>> 
>>  Best wishes,
>> 
>> Jonathan Cohn
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On Oct 17, 2023, at 9:41 PM, Lorie McCloud >> <mailto:lorice...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> is there a way to share links to files in iCloud Drive dropbox style? I’m 
>>> playing around with the share option in the context menu trying to find it. 
>>> this is on a Mac running Catalina.
>>> 
>>> thanks.
>>> Lorie
>>> 
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Re: iCloud Drive

[Jonathan Cohn]

The Share File option seems to do this.

Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Oct 17, 2023, at 9:41 PM, Lorie McCloud  wrote:
> 
> is there a way to share links to files in iCloud Drive dropbox style? I’m 
> playing around with the share option in the context menu trying to find it. 
> this is on a Mac running Catalina.
> 
> thanks.
> Lorie
> 
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Re: HTML question.

[Jonathan Cohn]

No,There are two primary component in an HTML document 

and 
 
The entire document is started with the 
doctype tag which Visual Studio code should add automatically and then
you surround both the  and 

If you are using visual studio code I suggest the following process.
1. press ctrl-N to create a new document.
2. Immediately press command-S to save it as foo.html where foo is the name of 
the document you want.
3. Enter  (VSC will then add a 
 4. Press enter twice and then up arrow and add in a  (again) VSC will  
automatically add the  immediately after the 
5. Now add in your  and 
6. Go to the top and press < and VSC will say !doctype or something close to 
that press enter and VSC will complete that code.

At this point you have a completely empty HTML basic file.
All of the paragraph headings links and other HTML content that is visible to 
the end user should go between the 

and  the 


Of course, if you want you could create a template.html that has your basic 
structure in it and then open it and immediately do a save as with what you 
plan to create.
Have fun and good luck!



Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Oct 4, 2023, at 9:40 AM, Jessica Moss  wrote:
> 
> Ok, thank you so much, one question though: if I’m going to start something 
> with multiple links, paragraphs, lists, etc, is the 
> 
>  closing tag a must when dealing with each individual section?
> 
>> On Oct 3, 2023, at 4:57 PM, 'Jason J.G. White' via MacVisionaries 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> I would suggest using the W3C’s HTML validator. It should be available in an 
>> extension for your preferred editor.
>> It’s also available in HomeBrew via the vnu package. You can then run it 
>> from a MacOS terminal.
>>  
>> From: mr.robertcole via MacVisionaries 
>> Date: Tuesday, October 3, 2023 at 15:27
>> To: Email Groups 
>> Subject: Re: HTML question.
>> 
>> Hi,
>> I noticed a few errors.
>> First, the following two lines should be at the end of the document.
>> 
>> 
>> This represents the end of the code.
>>  
>> Second, your link should look like this.
>> http://www.google.com <http://www.google.com/>”> Google Web Page 
>> 
>> 
>>  
>> I used Google as an example. The  means line break.
>>  
>> Good luck!
>> Rob
>>  
>>  
>>  
>> 
>> 
>> On Oct 3, 2023, at 2:31 PM, Jessica Moss > <mailto:junglebookfa...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>>  
>> I’m still in the process of learning HTML, which I’ve been attempting 
>> through W3Schools, and have a document started that I’m slowly trying to 
>> build out in text edit.
>>   I’ve tested what I’ve attempted to write in VS code, which continuously 
>> says “no problems,” and Codepen.io <http://codepen.io/> which tells me there 
>> are missing tags, and the Href section needs double quotes, even after I’ve 
>> entered them.
>>   I’m still in the beginning stages of this, so to me, what I’m about to 
>> share with you looks write, but would appreciate anyone’s feedback, and why 
>> I’m getting 2 different types of results.
>>  
>>  
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>  
>> My First Heading
>>  
>> My first paragraph.
>>  
>> 
>> 
>> Jessica Website
>> • List Element 1
>> • List Element 2
>>  
>> Jessica Website
>> •
>> Test
>> < h1 > the Tom Robinson Case  did Tom Robinson actually rape Mayella 
>> Ewell, or was this simply a case of racial injustice? 
>> http://tomsdefense.com <http://tomsdefense.com/> 
>>  
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Re: 8 gigs or 16? Memory.

[Jonathan Cohn]

Hello,
Because of the way browsers work, having a single thread  per a tab, moving 
from an M1 to an M2 will probably not change your performance issues there. Of 
course there are many types of web site designs, from static to very dynamic. 
Some sites use HTML5  canvas and JAVASCRIPT to present animations that can be 
quite intense on that single CPU being used to handle the page, and yet canvas 
is totally inaccessible to screen readers unless there is a static content that 
is hidden behind / inside the canvas. 
What I am trying to say is that sometimes using ad blockers or performance 
enhancing software like stop the madness might provide much release with your 
busy indications. If you don’t feel like adding an application that has a 
browser extension, just turning off JS (easier done in firefox than in safari) 
might be enough for you to access the information you are searching for.
Music is more of a concern though. Is this in the store section? 
  
Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Sep 16, 2023, at 9:25 PM, Traci Duncan  wrote:
> 
> I get them on Safari daily and often in music.
> 
> 😞 Traci
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Sep 16, 2023, at 1:37 PM, Kelly Ford  wrote:
>> 
>> Maybe I missed it but where are you getting the not responding messages?
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On Sep 16, 2023, at 1:34 PM, Traci Duncan  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Ok guys, then you are probably recommending…
>>> 
>>> Apple M2 chip with 8‑core CPU, 10‑core GPU, 16‑core Neural Engine, and the 
>>> 16GB unified memory? 512mb ssd.
>>> 
>>> Sheesh, this is $1599! Thank goodness, I have my current model to trade in. 
>>> They will give me $440 for it.
>>> 
>>> This really better stop the not responding messages. Lol!
>>> 
>>> Appreciate the recommendations,
>>> Traci
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>>>> On Sep 16, 2023, at 11:20 AM, Herbie Allen  wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> I agree with brad.
>>>> 
>>>>> On Sep 16, 2023, at 13:11, Traci Duncan  wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> Hi all, I was just doing a little more reading on MacBook Air M2, and a 
>>>>> buying guide suggests upgrading to a 16 gig memory isn’t necessary for 
>>>>> the average user. What are your thoughts on this?
>>>>> 
>>>>> My MacBook Air from 2011 lasted me ten years, before I considered buying 
>>>>> new. This 2020 model I am using, I’m disappointed to feel the need to 
>>>>> purchase new now.
>>>>> 
>>>>> So, in short, this m2 model I’m considering, I want it to last me a good 
>>>>> while. :)
>>>>> 
>>>>> Thanks for your input.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Traci
>>>>> 
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Re: Concerned about the future Mac accessibility

[Jonathan Cohn]

What are you talking about, VoiceOver for Mac with the Mail application has 
always respected using the goto header functions.

Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Sep 7, 2023, at 3:18 PM, 'Andrew Lamanche' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> I agree and I use the same tactic: Windows is superior on web navigation and 
> even email when it comes to newsletters where you can swiftly and reliably 
> navigate through headings and links and activate them - a difficult if not 
> impossible task in Apple mail.
> 
> Andrew
> 
>> On 7 Sep 2023, at 18:32, lenron brown  wrote:
>> 
>> I hate web Browsing on the mac. Most other things I am good with. I
>> use both platforms for different reasons, even having a 2023 MBP 14
>> with max chip. I still use my windows computers as my daily drivers. I
>> like my mac for vocr and logic, and a few other things. Some things
>> can just be slower on a mac  when it comes to page navagation and a
>> couple other things, I just would rather not deal with it.
>> 
>> On 9/7/23, Mohamed Fayed mailto:m10fa...@gmail.com>> 
>> wrote:
>>> Hi,
>>> 
>>> I’ve lately switched from 2016 15” MBP to 2023 M2Max 16””. The gain in
>>> performance is tremendous and you will notice it.
>>> 
>>> For issues related to “mail is not responding”, it occurs when you make the
>>> exact keystrokes, but Voiceover continues within a significantly shorter
>>> duration.
>>> 
>>> For web browsing, Safari nowadays is pretty bad. This is not related to VO.
>>> You may try Google Chrome or MS Edge instead.
>>> 
>>> Windows on Apple Silicon is significantly faster. If there is a chance to
>>> get to Apple Silicon device, and try it yourself, that would be great.
>>> 
>>> The issue that annoys me the most is VO stops talking. It is on Mac and iOS.
>>> I hope they fix it soon.
>>> 
>>> Hope that helps,
>>> 
>>> Mohamed E. Fayed
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> On 7 Sep 2023, at 8:01 PM, Dave Carlson  wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> My biggest gripe with Mac OS and VO is web browsing. It’s awful compared
>>>> to Windows with JAWS or NNVDA. It is the main reason I would seriously
>>>> consider going back to Windows if/when it’s time to get a new laptop.
>>>> I use DuckDuckGo as my browser now to get away from that annoying “Safari
>>>> is Busy” message that cripples my productivity.
>>>> 
>>>> So I’m on the fence about switching back to Windows, but if VO on the Mac
>>>> does not improve over time (and I doubt that it will) I might just flip a
>>>> coin on the decision.
>>>> 
>>>> Dave Carlson
>>>> Woodworker, Musician, Oregonian, Engineer,  Farfar
>>>> dgcarlson0...@gmail.com
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> On Sep 7, 2023, at 9:23 AM, Traci Duncan  wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> Hi all, it seems like we are having more than a few messages on this list
>>>> about the disappointment in Mac’s VoiceOver performance.
>>>> 
>>>> Are quite a few of you thinking of switching back to windows? Or are a lot
>>>> of you overall still happy with the VoiceOver experience?
>>>> 
>>>> I think I am mostly curious about this, because I have been talking about
>>>> updating my MacBook Eyre. I guess part of me is beginning to wonder,
>>>> should I get a Windows laptop instead? I would be very disappointed to
>>>> spend $900 on a MacBook Air, and still have a lot of performance issues.
>>>> 
>>>> What are your guises thoughts?
>>>> 
>>>> Thank you,
>>>> From Traci's MBA20.
>>>> 
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Re: Voice Over problem

[Jonathan Cohn]

i don’t know what your issue is but usually in Mohavi,  VO-command-F2 will list 
the size of the current window.
Perhaps you have a couple of stock keys? 

Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Aug 31, 2023, at 2:51 PM, Michael Shelman  wrote:
> 
> When trying to use vo on my M1 laptop running ventura when i have the vo keys 
> pressed vo is constantly repeating the location of the vo window as "3.5 
> inches down and 2.2 inches right of the left corner of the window." Also I 
> can start vo with Cmd-F5 but pressing again doesn't shut it down - it just 
> shows F5 in the window.
> 
> Any help?
> 
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Re: Computer training

[Jonathan Cohn]

Hello,
I believe the DC public library system has a Mac VoiceOver training class. 
I was going to suggest Mac For the Blind but that might have been the courses 
you were thinking of since their last announcement was about 6  months ago.

https://macfortheblind.com <https://macfortheblind.com/>
I guess you have more need then quick answers to questions that this list can 
provide?
Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Aug 23, 2023, at 5:19 PM, Rebecca Sabo  wrote:
> 
> Dear all,
> I need some computer training asap.  I know the mack training is closed .  
> Where else can I look for some trying or is their anyone this list could help 
> me ?
> Thanks 
> Becky 
> 
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Re: Editing PDF's with Voiceover

[Jonathan Cohn]

The process of turning an inaccessible PDF document into a document that can be 
reviewed by a screen reader is called tagging.
With tagging you can also indicate if an item is a heading or list item or a 
paragraph.
Depending on how well the OCR does, tagging to that level might be difficult 
for a blind person.
Certainly Adobe Acrobat (which I believe can be obtained for about $5/month) 
can do tagging, but there are also non Adobe product that can do this. 
Obviously the best solution is to start with a word or in-design document and 
then convert it to a PDF. When one does things this way, most of the editors 
styles will get directly converted into the appropriate tag in the PDF
Also, I believe that Pnema solutions has a cloud based service that uses AI to 
better convert scanned text into a usable pdf using AI for spelling corrections 
and detecting font changes that might indicate  headers.
 
Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Aug 3, 2023, at 7:43 PM, Jessica Moss  wrote:
> 
> Over the last few months, I’ve been getting PDF’s via e-mail which have 
> mostly been news letters from the clients the company I work with 
> audits/remediates for accessibility, and I check over them to make sure 
> everything is readable.
>  However, some of these I’ve been noticing have been scanned, but not 
> proofread, because they are so riddled with spelling errors, which while this 
> is technically not considered an accessibility violation, some of them are so 
> bad they make the document borderline unreadable if you’re reading it with a 
> screen reader.  However, I’m only using Adobe Acrobat Reader, and am 
> wondering how doable the process to go through via Voiceover and edit these 
> would be before I consider purchasing a license to do this.  Has anyone done 
> this who could give me some pointers?
> 
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Re: Can I connect my HomePod to my mobile hot spot

[Jonathan Cohn]

Answer is after the question… 
> On Aug 3, 2023, at 10:02 PM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> Looks interesting, but I don’t see how it repeats your home SSID.  Definitely 
> worth further investigation, though. Thanks!
You would set it up with that information before leaving. Then when you get to 
the hotel you have this device talk to the hotel network and all of your 
devices talk to this one. The difficulty comes when you have one of those 
hotels that brings up a web page asking you to follow their conditions. My 
understanding is that you initially accept that with your computer and then 
make this router look like your computer to the hotel network.
Of course the other question is how accessible is their control interface.
I’ll be buying one of these for my next trip, but I don’t have any plans until 
possibly the end of the year.

>  
> 
>> On Aug 3, 2023, at 7:50 PM, Jonathan Cohn  wrote:
>> 
>> OK, I decided to look this up now.
>> 
>> Here is a quick video of the device.
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LUILw91hiEY&t=23s 
>> <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LUILw91hiEY&t=23s>
>> 
>> And here is a  link to it at Amazon.
>> https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08MKZXGBy 
>> <https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08MKZXGBy>
>> If you want to listen to a bunch of nerds discussing how wonderful it is it 
>> is the last segment of this weeks Accidental Tech Podcast. 
>> https://atp.fm/546 <https://atp.fm/546>
>> •  Post-show: [Some] weird things that Casey does 7 of 7 which is probably 2 
>> hours into the podcast.
>>  
>>  Best wishes,
>> 
>> Jonathan Cohn
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On Aug 3, 2023, at 1:59 PM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries 
>>> mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com>> 
>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi Brad,
>>> 
>>> That is what I had to do when I wanted to connect to a hotel network.  But 
>>> I figured that had something to do with their network.  Apple really ought 
>>> to make it easier to change networks, especially on the HomePod mini.  
>>> They’re so small that they’re great for travel, but having to reset them 
>>> both when you reach your destination and when you return home is a pain.
>>> Cheers,
>>> Donna
>>> 
>>>> On Aug 3, 2023, at 8:51 AM, Brad Snyder >>> <mailto:wb...@swbell.net>> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> My understanding is that to change the wifi network, you have to reset the 
>>>> HomePod to factory settings, and start over.
>>>> That is what I had to do when I changed my home wifi network.
>>>> I’ve never tried it, but it wouldn’t surprise me if the HomePod will not 
>>>> connect to your iPhone hotspot.
>>>> 
>>>> - Brad -
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> On Aug 3, 2023, at 08:41, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries 
>>>> mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com>> 
>>>> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> Hi all,
>>>> 
>>>> Well, I guess you can tell by now that we’re having internet issues. Lol
>>>> 
>>>> Joe’s post yesterday got me to thinking.  Is there some way to connect a 
>>>> HomePod to my iPhone’s mobile hot spot?  I’ve googled it, and it looks 
>>>> like if I click on the Homepod in the Home app, there should be an option 
>>>> that says Move to that would allow me to tell it to switch networks.  But 
>>>> I do not see a move option.  Running IOS 16.6.
>>>> TIA,
>>>> Donna
>>>> 
>>>> -- 
>>>> The following information is important for all members of the Mac 
>>>> Visionaries list.
>>>> 
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>>>> 
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>>>> 
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>>>> <http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/>
>>>> --- 
&g

Re: Can I connect my HomePod to my mobile hot spot

[Jonathan Cohn]

OK, I decided to look this up now.

Here is a quick video of the device.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LUILw91hiEY&t=23s

And here is a  link to it at Amazon.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08MKZXGBy
If you want to listen to a bunch of nerds discussing how wonderful it is it is 
the last segment of this weeks Accidental Tech Podcast. 
https://atp.fm/546
•  Post-show: [Some] weird things that Casey does 7 of 7 which is probably 2 
hours into the podcast.
 
Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Aug 3, 2023, at 1:59 PM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi Brad,
> 
> That is what I had to do when I wanted to connect to a hotel network.  But I 
> figured that had something to do with their network.  Apple really ought to 
> make it easier to change networks, especially on the HomePod mini.  They’re 
> so small that they’re great for travel, but having to reset them both when 
> you reach your destination and when you return home is a pain.
> Cheers,
> Donna
> 
>> On Aug 3, 2023, at 8:51 AM, Brad Snyder  wrote:
>> 
>> My understanding is that to change the wifi network, you have to reset the 
>> HomePod to factory settings, and start over.
>> That is what I had to do when I changed my home wifi network.
>> I’ve never tried it, but it wouldn’t surprise me if the HomePod will not 
>> connect to your iPhone hotspot.
>> 
>> - Brad -
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On Aug 3, 2023, at 08:41, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi all,
>> 
>> Well, I guess you can tell by now that we’re having internet issues. Lol
>> 
>> Joe’s post yesterday got me to thinking.  Is there some way to connect a 
>> HomePod to my iPhone’s mobile hot spot?  I’ve googled it, and it looks like 
>> if I click on the Homepod in the Home app, there should be an option that 
>> says Move to that would allow me to tell it to switch networks.  But I do 
>> not see a move option.  Running IOS 16.6.
>> TIA,
>> Donna
>> 
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Re: Can I connect my HomePod to my mobile hot spot

[Jonathan Cohn]

Hello,
I was listening I believe to the Accidental Tech Podcast this week where it was 
mentioned about travel wireless hot spots. These are designed to connect to a 
hotel network and provide your home SSID and password.
I believe the vendor was TP.
I’ll look tomorrow to see if I can find the reference.

Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Aug 3, 2023, at 1:59 PM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi Brad,
> 
> That is what I had to do when I wanted to connect to a hotel network.  But I 
> figured that had something to do with their network.  Apple really ought to 
> make it easier to change networks, especially on the HomePod mini.  They’re 
> so small that they’re great for travel, but having to reset them both when 
> you reach your destination and when you return home is a pain.
> Cheers,
> Donna
> 
>> On Aug 3, 2023, at 8:51 AM, Brad Snyder  wrote:
>> 
>> My understanding is that to change the wifi network, you have to reset the 
>> HomePod to factory settings, and start over.
>> That is what I had to do when I changed my home wifi network.
>> I’ve never tried it, but it wouldn’t surprise me if the HomePod will not 
>> connect to your iPhone hotspot.
>> 
>> - Brad -
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On Aug 3, 2023, at 08:41, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi all,
>> 
>> Well, I guess you can tell by now that we’re having internet issues. Lol
>> 
>> Joe’s post yesterday got me to thinking.  Is there some way to connect a 
>> HomePod to my iPhone’s mobile hot spot?  I’ve googled it, and it looks like 
>> if I click on the Homepod in the Home app, there should be an option that 
>> says Move to that would allow me to tell it to switch networks.  But I do 
>> not see a move option.  Running IOS 16.6.
>> TIA,
>> Donna
>> 
>> -- 
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>> Visionaries list.
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Re: Accessible free hosting

[Jonathan Cohn]

What application are you trying to demonstrate? I believe most hosting 
providers do provide a free trial.

Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Jul 26, 2023, at 7:54 AM, Nebojsa Tasic  wrote:
> 
> Hello,
> 
> 
> Do you have experience with free web hostings? Could you recommend me one 
> that is accessible?
> 
> I tried 000webhost and infinity. 000webhost is not fully accessible and 
> Infinity has some limitations / header location cannot be set and POST method 
> is not allowed.
> 
> I don't need it for a serious purpose, just to show the application to 
> someone.
> 
> 
> Thanks in advance.
> 
> Best.
> 
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Re: Comments/corrections accepted on my answer to a question about writing AT scripts and accessible apps for MacOS

[Jonathan Cohn]

Hello,
There are two permissions that are required for any serious “VOiceOver” 
scripting.

The first is in the general pane of VoiceOver utility.
“Allow VOiceOver to be controlled with AppleScript.”
This would allow you to do things lie:
tell application "VoiceOver"
tell commander
perform command "open notification center"
end tell
end tell

This is AppleScript code that I am showing here.
One could do essentially the same thing with a compiled Objective C or Swift 
programming language using Apple Events It is telling the commander module of 
the application “VOiceOver” to perform a  command.
This includes most (all?) of the commands you can find when reviewing the 
commander area of VOiceOver or found in the VO-H-H help command. Don’t try 
interactive commands here like “item chooser”, they will hang and you can’t 
actually proceed with the script.

The second function you already partially mentioned was the accessibility 
permissions in the security pane of System (Settings/Preferneces0 this  
permission allows one application to control the UI Elements of another 
application.
Dropbox used to use this to put a flag next to a dropbox folder in the finder, 
and there are a few other applications that use it. Keyboard Maestro also makes 
extensive use of the UI Elements interface in controlling Mac applications.
There are about 40 specific types of ui elements but one can always do 
get all UI Elements of WIndow 1 of system application “Mail” or some close 
equivalent.
Also of course, most long standing Apple applications have their own apple 
events defined that can allow direct manipulation of the application.

For ex…ample the below is code sample from a script I was using to close 
notifications. I gave up on it after a while.
set NotificationUI  to getUI("NotificationCenter")
using terms from application "System Events"
try
set aWin to window 1 ofNotificationUI
tell application "NotificationCenter" to activate
on error
OpenNotifications()
set aWin to window 1 of NotificationUI
end try
set aWin to window 1 of NotificationUI
set notContainer to UI element 1 of scroll area 1 of aWin

set LotificationList to UI elements of notContainer
set i to 1
repeat until i > (count of LotificationList)
set anElement to item i of LotificationList
set ActionInfo to the name of every action of anElement
perform action closeAction of anElement
end repeat 
.
The above lines would probably fail, since not all notifications have a close 
action. But if it did work it would close all notifications in the notification 
center.
I haven’t run this code in about 2 years, but I believe it still works with 
Ventura.
 Jonathan Cohn



> On Jul 13, 2023, at 9:41 AM, Doug Lee  wrote:
> 
> I received an inquiry this morning asking about writing assistive technology 
> scripts and/or more accessible
> apps for MacOS. I wrote the following rather involved response, as more of an 
> expert in Windows than in Mac
> spaces; so I welcome corrections or comments here, and told my contact I 
> would do so.
> 
> =
> 
> I actually consider your question to amount to two questions:
> 1. Is it harder to write AT scripts under MacOS than on Windows? and
> 2. Is it harder to write an accessible app on MacOS than on Windows?
> 
> I do consider it much harder to do assistive technology (AT) scripting for 
> Mac than for Windows, but the
> reasons are complicated and subject to inaccuracy because that's not my area 
> of best expertise. That said,
> I'll tell you what I can. Same for the second question, which I'll tackle 
> after the first.
> 
> 1. AT scripting on MacOS vs Windows:
> 
> On Windows, AT scripting is accomplished within each screen reader, where it 
> is possible anyway:
> * For JAWS, it's JAWS scripting.
> * For NVDA, it's add-ons in Python.
> * For Narrator, I don't know of anything possible yet - though I was told 
> years ago this would happen.
> The ease of learning how to do AT scripting, then, depends on the screen 
> reader. NVDA and JAWS vary in how
> and how much they document how to do this, but both do provide significant 
> documentation.
> 
> There is sort of an alternative to all that, which is making individual apps 
> "self-voicing." RS Games and
> QC, an alternative gaming platform, are examples of this. In general this is 
> often frowned upon though,
> because it leaves all the major interface choices to the AT developer more 
> than to the individual user.
> 
> On MacOS, we mostly just have one screen reader - VoiceOv

Re: More strange Mac mail behaviors.

[Jonathan Cohn]

1. What  mailbox do you have selected.
2. If you type command-shift-F (Mailbox search) is there anything in that
text entry field (if so clear it out)
3. Look for items about filter in the view menu of your mail applicaiton. I
believe command-option-L toggles filters on and off, but I might be off in
what the second modifier key is.



On Thu, Jul 6, 2023 at 9:32 PM Jessica Moss 
wrote:

> Ok, so after doing a lot of digging, and having to do a lot of exploring
> with mailbox behaviors, which I’m not familiar with, I found out my setting
> to move deleted messages to trash folder somehow got switched to “none”
> which makes no sense.  So after switching it back to gmail/trash, things
> seem to finally be fixed.
>
> On Jul 6, 2023, at 3:57 PM, Herbie Allen  wrote:
>
> Did you do anything in the Mail account settings?
>
> On Jul 6, 2023, at 14:47, Jessica Moss  wrote:
>
> This happens regardless of whether I restart mail or not.  Also, How do I
> check to see if I have messages marked as deleted or not?
>   I wouldn’t think anything has changed, since I honestly don’t know how
> to/have any desire to change how messages behave for this vary reason, so
> I’m really stumped on how this happened.
>
> On Jul 6, 2023, at 3:29 PM, matthew dyer 
> wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> Whzat happens if you restart the mail app.  Also, do you have mail set to
> mark messages as deleted?  This is very strange.
>
> Matthew
>
>
>
> On Jul 6, 2023, at 3:18 PM, 'Dan Eickmeier' via MacVisionaries <
> macvisionaries@googlegroups.com> wrote:
>
> OH wow, that’s weird, Jess.  Have never had anything like that happen in
> mail where you can’t delete all messages, and having messages come back
> that you delete.  That’s interesting.
> Dan Eickmeier. Beamsville, Ontario Canada.  Amateur radio callsign: VA3ETS
> Twitter: http://twitter.com/va3ets Mastodon: @va3ets@mstdn.social
>
> On Jul 6, 2023, at 10:56 AM, Jessica Moss 
> wrote:
>
> Honestly, I have no idea, I just no that at this point, something has
> somehow happened where all my deleted messages are now coming back as soon
> as I delete them, and command+shift+delete no longer erases everything like
> it used to on either of my mailboxes.  This just randomly happened
> yesterday, without me having done anything to my settings, so have no idea
> what needs to be fixed, let alone what could have caused it.
>
> On Jul 6, 2023, at 10:41 AM, Jonathan C. Cohn 
> wrote:
>
> Are you perhaps, confusing filters and searches? If you do a search within
> all mail that it will look at every folder, including your deleted folder
> in some cases.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Jul 6, 2023, at 9:03 AM, Jessica Moss 
> wrote:
>
> I just noticed yesterday, and have no idea what brought this on, that
> when I launched my Apple mail, everything in my personal mailbox looked
> like it it had completely been erased.  However, everything within my work
> e-mailbox, which is also gmail-based, was still in tact.
> Then next thing I knew, Voiceover kept saying something about filters,
> upon mail being launched, which I never mess with, but figured I’d attempt
> to do so to see if I could recover them.  So after doing some playing
> around to see what would take, I somehow managed to get my mail back, but
> now on both sides, my erase-all command is now no longer working, and my
> messages are reappearing as fast as I delete them.  Does anyone know what I
> could’ve accidentally toggled on that I need to fix?
>
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Re: Reinstalling the operating system accessibly

[Jonathan Cohn]

I believe with Ventura and newer, there is a option in the finder to erase
all information in the data partition. This would be essentially like
puttting your Mac back into factory state.

On Tue, Jul 4, 2023 at 7:01 PM Steve Matzura  wrote:

> Wow, that'd be super if it's true. I also just made a USB installer
> drive, so I can just boot from that if I can get VoiceOver to run on
> that boot menu.
>
>
> On 7/4/2023 6:50 PM, 'Jason White' via MacVisionaries wrote:
> >
> > On 4/7/23 18:27, Steve Matzura wrote:
> >> Apple has a fine article on how to do this on an M1 or M2 Mac at:
> >>
> >>
> >>
> https://support.apple.com/guide/mac-help/macos-recovery-a-mac-apple-silicon-mchl82829c17/mac
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> , but the first thing you have to do is click a CONTINUE button you
> >> can't possibly do accessibly.
> > If I remember correctly, even the boot menu on an Apple Silicon Mac is
> > accessible with VoiceOver, so the button you're referring to may
> > indeed be accessible.
> >
>
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Re: Getting Google apps to open in Chrome

[Jonathan Cohn]

The stop the maddens application is supposed to be able to have specific URL’s 
go to specific browsers. I have yet to plunk down $10 to try it out. Perhaps 
AppleVis has a review?
 
Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Jun 11, 2023, at 6:51 PM, 'Mary Ward' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi.  I would like for Google apps like Google Sheets to open in Chrome.  But 
> I don’t want Chrome to be my default browser.  Is this possible?  I feel very 
> lost when I try to get Chrome and Apple products to work together.  If anyone 
> can help, I would appreciate it.
> 
> Thanks.
> 
> 
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Re: Latest stable version of firefox.

[Jonathan Cohn]

I was just talking with another accessibility professional today who told me 
that Firefox just released an entirely new accessibility model for their 
browser. He told me it works significantly better with JAWS.
Also, you should be able to have both Firefox standard and beta on the same 
computer with no conflicts.
Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On May 30, 2023, at 2:01 PM, Anders Holmberg  wrote:
> 
> Hi!
> I realize I don’t use the beta version of firefox.
> But the latest Firefox update in combination with the latest Ventura update 
> has issues.
> I get a lot of VOiceOver restarts on some pages when I navigate.
> I have written to apple about it so I guess they will ask me for logs and 
> such.
> Anyone else has issues with this?
> I wonder if I have activated something that could cause the issue.
> Things has worked quite well before so I can not realize I have on something 
> that restarts VoiceOver.
> Bless.
> /A
> 
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Re: Apple Mail on Ventura: where are On My Mac mail boxes stored?

[Jonathan Cohn]

I seem to remember Tim saying   you can open time machine while in Mail and 
that will work. Hopefully I am not hallucinating. For a lot of internal access 
to files Macintosh does not directly name the related folders on disk the same 
as in the application. This might be a security feature or for performance 
reasons, but it sure is frustrating for end users just trying find a penny in 
the hay stack of files on a modern Macintosh.
So in summary, start mail start time machine and see if you can actually get a 
history that way.
   
Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Jun 1, 2023, at 4:35 PM, Paul Hopewell  wrote:
> 
> Hello,
> Does anyone know where On My Mac mail boxes are stored on Ventura? I have 
> looked in library/mail and can see mail boxes such as Inbox, Sent, Archive 
> and so on but cannot find any of the mail boxes I created under On My Mac. I 
> need to know this so that I can hopefully recover a deleted On My Mac mail 
> box from time machine.
> Many thanks for any help … Paul Hopewell
> 
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Re: Editing favorites in Safari?

[Jonathan Cohn]

Hello,
I believe you can copy and paste them. I am not running Ventura but I went to 
the bookmarks menu and then clicked on Edit Bookmarks.
In this listing I could move to a book mark and then press command-X and then 
move to another bookmark and press command-V. This caused the cut bookmark to 
appear after the bookmark it was pasted onto.
If you paste a bookmark onto a bookmark folder than it does go into that 
folder. 
I also had luck copy and pasting bookmarks if you want to be a little more 
cautions. 
I first tried in the Show Bookmarks panel, but this only seemed to be able to 
add bookmarks to the bottom of your bookmarks list.

Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On May 22, 2023, at 9:35 AM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi Ron,
> 
> Yes, that is correct. I’m just not sure how to reorder them.
> Thanks,
> Donna
> 
>> On May 22, 2023, at 7:59 AM, 'Ron S' via MacVisionaries 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi Donna, although I haven't done this, I think the bookmarks you want to 
>> use with the keys 1 to9 have to be in positions 1 to 9 in the top level of 
>> the bookmarks folder, ie the first nine  bookmarks.
>> Ron.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On 22 May 2023, at 13:39, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi all,
>>> 
>>> I know I should know the answer to this, but I’ve completely forgotten.
>>> 
>>> I want to reorder my favorite bookmarks, so that the ones I use most are 
>>> first in the list, and I can thus access them with CMD-Option 1, 2, etc.  
>>> How do I go about that?
>>> TIA,
>>> Donna
>>> 
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Re: iCloud Mail Server Settings

[Jonathan Cohn]

Does not show up for Gmail accounts either. I believe there are AppleScript 
objects for the Mail accounts, perhaps they still show up there. Are you 
interested in migrating a non-Apple device? 

 Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On May 17, 2023, at 8:00 PM, 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hello,
>   In Mail settings for my primary iCloud account, I am not seeing  the server 
> setting under the Server tab. What happened to them? How can I get them to 
> show up? Perhaps I should create a new account? Thanks.
> 
> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
> "Those who make peaceful revolution impossible
> will make violent revolution inevitable."
> --John F. Kennedy
> My e-Mail:
> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
> 
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Re: reader in IOS

[Jonathan Cohn]

Hello, it is now a bit hidden in the lower left  (assuming your address bar is 
at the bottom)
I believe you need to click on a site button first. I might be slightly 
mistaken, my phone just lost power so I can’t check.
 
Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On May 10, 2023, at 10:00 PM, Lorie McCloud  wrote:
> 
> if I’m in Safari on my phone, where’s the reader? seems like it used to be 
> near the top of the screen to the right but I couldn’t find it when I was on 
> this site that’s very hard to read without it.
> 
> thanks.
> Lorie
> 
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Re: Noticing Consistent Problems with Voiceover and Refreshable Braille with IPHONE and IPAD

[Jonathan Cohn]

Hello,
I hope you realize this is a list of Apple users and not a place where Apple 
actively monitors. I have noticed a few of these items you mention, though I am 
unable at this point to truly verify since I am running hardware that is too 
old to use on the current OS.
The Grade1/Grade2 translation issues causing gibberish when moving back to edit 
something is definitely something I have seen. Before reporting to 
accessibility@apple. <mailto:accessibil...@apple.com>com, I suggest you give 
very specific process of what to do to get the bug.
Something like typing 
“This is a test of Grade 2 translation.”
2. Click on the routing key of the r above grade and 
3. Press the “ER” contraction. 
Route cursor to end.
Expected result are
Actual Results are

It would be wonderful if you let un know if you get any feedback on your 
reports.
Jonathan Cohn



> On Apr 22, 2023, at 12:56 PM, roni mathew  wrote:
> 
> Apple Technical Support Requests:
> 
> 
> E. When attempting to use the braille display keyboard  to open controls or 
> app features, like clicking "share" button within Safari, notes, email  or 
> other apps, the sharing options are on-screen, but the braille display 
> navigation does not reflect the pop-up of share options, unless one slides a 
> finger across the touchscreen to bring voiceover focus to the pop-up options.
> This is also the case when navigating within any page of content; for some 
> reason, the cursor gets stuck on a line of text or other control. Unless one 
> slides a finger along the screen to push the cursor past this point, or jumps 
> to top and bottom of file with the perkins braille keyboard, the navigation 
> keys will not move the cursor past the area where it is stuck.
> 
> From. Sometimes, the numbersign does not appear in the document  after being 
> typed in contracted braille, resulting in numbers translated as letters.
> 
> 
>> On Apr 22, 2023, at 12:40 PM, roni mathew  wrote:
>> 
>> Hello, not sure if this is appropriate for this list, however I thought I'd 
>> ask.
>> I have been compiling a set of consistently noted issues I encounter while 
>> using a braille display and Voiceover with my  Iphone or Ipad.  I will post 
>> these found so far, in case anyone has insight into resolution/work-around.
>> 
>> 
>> Thank you all, and be blessed.
>> 
>> Roni Mathew
>> 
>> 
>>> On Apr 22, 2023, at 11:10 AM, Matthew Dyer  
>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi,  That should VO+CMD+space.  Sorry about that.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> On 4/21/2023 3:32 PM, ilovecountrymusic...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>> Hi,
>>>> 
>>>> I usually press VO+N which brings up the list of notifications and press 
>>>> enter on it which will then allow me to press VO+shift+space to bring up 
>>>> the acctions menu and deal with it.  HTH.
>>>> 
>>>> Matthew
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> -Original Message-
>>>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com  On 
>>>> Behalf Of Lorie McCloud
>>>> Sent: Friday, April 21, 2023 2:55 PM
>>>> To: via MacVisionaries 
>>>> Subject: Re: Notification times out before I can take an a hi, ction
>>>> 
>>>> I also have trouble with this. sometimes we have to try 2 or 3 times 
>>>> before we can get it to work. I don’t have a solution but I do have the 
>>>> same problem.
>>>> 
>>>>>> On Apr 21, 2023, at 1:49 PM, Marlene Kramer 
>>>>>>  wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> Hi,
>>>>> On the several occasions I have attempted to obtain help from Apple 
>>>>> Accessibility in the past several months, the screen share has failed 
>>>>> because the notification times out before I can take the necessary 
>>>>> actions.
>>>>> Is there any way to solve this problem?
>>>>> Thanks. Marlene.
>>>>> 
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>>>>

Re: Redirecting Just VoiceOver Audio From Apple TV

[Jonathan Cohn]

I am having a similar problem. For me, I get no audio on Apple-plus and 
Disney-Plus programming since moving to my new home.
I also use an Apple TV 4K with a TLC 4k TV hooked up to a sound bar using 
HDMI-R to connect the sound bar to the TV.
 
Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Apr 21, 2023, at 8:32 PM, Kelly Ford  wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> For some reason, if my Apple TV is not playing media, VoiceOver speech is 
> often not played. I don’t think it is a problem with my Apple TV itself but 
> rather the Samsung TV and how it sends audio to a sound bar I have connected.
> 
> Anyway, does anyone know if you can direct just the VoiceOver audio to a 
> different sound source from the Apple TV?  I was thinking of setting up a 
> specific speaker for just this or trying even a Bluetooth headset.
> 
> Kelly
> 
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Re: Sending a Link from iCloud

[Jonathan Cohn]

I believe you want this option found in the accounts area of the Mail 
preferences in Mojave 
Send large attachments with Mail Drop
Here is some additional documentation:
Send large email attachments using Mail Drop
You can use Mail Drop to send files that exceed the maximum size allowed by 
your email account 
<https://support.apple.com/guide/?platform=mac&product=mail&vanityname=email-account-types&version=15.0&locale=en_US&topicid=GLOSC623D0F2&type=ddm&platformOSVersion=12.0&aside=true>
 provider. Mail Drop uploads large attachments to iCloud, where they’re 
encrypted and stored for up to 30 days.

If you have an iCloud account and you’re signed in to iCloud when you click 
Send, Mail automatically sends the attachments using Mail Drop. Mail Drop 
attachments don’t count against your iCloud storage.

If you don’t have an iCloud account, or if you’re not signed in, Mail asks you 
whether to use Mail Drop (to always use Mail Drop select “Don’t ask again for 
this account”).

If a recipient uses Mail in OS X 10.10 or later, the attachments are included 
in your message. For other recipients, your message includes links for 
downloading the attachments, and their expiration date.

You can turn Mail Drop on or off for an account. Choose Mail > Preferences, 
click Accounts, select the account, click Account Information, then select or 
deselect “Send large attachments with Mail Drop.”

See the Apple Support article Mail Drop limits 
<https://support.apple.com/HT203093>.


Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Apr 20, 2023, at 9:11 PM, 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> Drive
>   Either from Mac or Windows, how to send a link to a file? The file is too 
> large to attach to an email. Thanks.
> 
> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
> "Those who make peaceful revolution impossible
> will make violent revolution inevitable."
> --John F. Kennedy
> My e-Mail:
> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
> 
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Re: How to create a mail box for sharing between IOS and Mac/OS

[Jonathan Cohn]

Hello Paul,
Since you are running under a private domain it is hard to tell what your Mail 
service provides. For all IMAP services, you can  have as many folders as you 
like.
So, you could certainly create a Archive - Paul folder but then the “archive” 
action  will just move your mail to the Archive folder and not your specific 
folder.

In MacOS, if you add the Archive folders to favorites, then you could quickly 
move the message to the "Archive - Paul” folder with the command-Control-number 
keystroke. I believe the IOS move action tries to guess a location, and might  
take advantage of favorite folders, but I have not played with that. If Mail 
had the same level of support for Shortcut actions as it does for AppleScript 
events, then you would be able to create a shortcut in the shortcuts app to 
move an item to the appropriate mail box.

Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Apr 14, 2023, at 2:00 PM, Paul Hopewell  wrote:
> 
> Hello,
> I am running the latest versions of IOS and Mac/OS. I have an archive mail 
> box which is shared between IOS and Mac/OS. This now contains mail some of 
> which is archived relating to me and some of which is archived relating to my 
> wife. This single mail box is becoming difficult to manage. I would like to 
> have separate mail boxes for my archive and my wife’s archive.
> Is there any way to do this?
> Many thanks for any tips.
> Paul Hopewell
> 
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Re: Need some help

[Jonathan Cohn]

Hello Mary,
My reading from your last message is that you want to know why there is a cut 
command in the Edit menu of Finder and yet it does not work.
This is for consistency sake, when one creates a program in MacOs, the system 
provides some default menus.
The Apple, Application, File, Edit Window and Help menus are available in in 
all applications, and most of the items within those menus are also standard 
and have default positions. All the developer can do is disable items that are 
not relevant like cut in the Finder, or copy and cut when nothing is selected.

Every Macintosh since 1991 has had an Edit menu with Cut Copy and Paste in that 
order and for probably the last 20 years, the Undo and Re-Do commands were 
added above the cut command. If you look at the Edit menu in the finder it 
should say, cut dimmed, this means that the cut operation is not currently 
available.

Cheeers! 
Jonathan Cohn



> On Apr 13, 2023, at 8:28 PM, 'Mary Ward' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> I don’t know why I am still seeing cut command x in the edit menu of my 
> Finder.  I am running Ventura 13.3.1.  Am I somehow doing something wrong?  
> Anyway, I do know to copy and move files and do it all the time.  I just 
> don’t understand why I see cut in the edit menu in the finder.  It seems sort 
> of weird.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>> On Apr 13, 2023, at 7:23 PM, 'Devin Prater' via MacVisionaries 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> The commands are correct. Command C to copy. Command + Option + V to move 
>> instead of paste.
>> 
>> On 4/13/2023 5:43 PM, Rebecca Sabo wrote:
>>> Hi ,
>>> Maybe I was not clear.  I want to cut a document and move it to a folder.  
>>> What is the command for it?  I tried doing a command x and it did not do 
>>> it.  I do not no if I did something wrong.
>>> Thanks
>>> Becky
>>> 
>>>> On Apr 13, 2023, at 4:17 PM, Herbie Allen  wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> Command C to copy and Command Option V to move to the folder.
>>>> 
>>>>> On Apr 13, 2023, at 17:14, Rebecca Sabo  wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> Hi all,
>>>>> I was wondering what is the command to cut a document to move it to a 
>>>>> folder in documents?  Thanks
>>>>> Becky Sabo
>>>>> 
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Re: tabs in Safari on an iPhone

[Jonathan Cohn]

I believe there is an option in the options to expire tabs after a time period.

Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Mar 20, 2023, at 9:23 PM, Lorie McCloud  wrote:
> 
> I was in the middle of filling out a form on my phone when I did the wrong 
> kind of gesture or something and ran into all these tabs of places I’ve been. 
> I’d rather that didn’t happen again. is there a way to set Safari on the 
> phone so that doesn’t happen? if not, how do I make them go away?
> 
> thanks.
> Lorie
> 
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Re: corrections in Safari

[Jonathan Cohn]

I assume you are talking about entries in the search/address bar.

Here is some Apple documentation, does this help?
on your Mac, use Search preferences to change how you search the web and how 
search results are presented. To change these preferences, choose Safari > 
Preferences, then click Search.

Open Safari for me 
Option
Description
Search engine
Choose the search engine you want Safari to use for web searches.
Include search engine suggestions
Ask the search engine for search suggestions based on search terms you enter. 
The search engine may record your search terms.
Include Safari Suggestions
Get Safari Suggestions 
<https://support.apple.com/guide/?platform=mac&product=safari&vanityname=safari-suggestions&version=16.0&locale=en_US&topicid=GLOSCB5B9B69&type=ddm&platformOSVersion=12.0&aside=true>
 as you type in the Smart Search field 
<https://support.apple.com/guide/?platform=mac&product=safari&vanityname=smart-search-field&version=16.0&locale=en_US&topicid=GLOS5A7C4A65&type=ddm&platformOSVersion=12.0&aside=true>.
 Safari search includes suggestions from the internet, Music, the App Store, 
movie showtimes, locations nearby, and more. To learn more, choose Apple menu  
> System Preferences, click Spotlight , then click About Search & Privacy.
Open Spotlight preferences for me 

Enable Quick Website Search
Record information about your searches within a website to expedite later 
searches on that site. You can then search within that website by entering the 
name of the site, followed by your search term, in the Smart Search field.
Click Manage Websites to see or remove websites for which Safari recorded Quick 
Website Search information.
Preload Top Hit in the background
Start to load a webpage as soon as it’s determined to be a top search hit based 
on your bookmarks and browsing history.
Show Favorites
Show your favorite websites below the Smart Search field when you click in the 
field while viewing a webpage.
See also
Go to websites using Safari on Mac
 
<https://support.apple.com/guide/?platform=mac&product=safari&vanityname=go-to-websites&version=16.0&locale=en_US&topicid=IBRW1005&type=ddm&platformOSVersion=12.0>Find
 what you’re looking for using Safari on Mac
 
<https://support.apple.com/guide/?platform=mac&product=safari&vanityname=find-what-youre-looking-for&version=16.0&locale=en_US&topicid=SFRID73436CB&type=ddm&platformOSVersion=12.0>

Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Apr 1, 2023, at 10:27 PM, Lorie McCloud  wrote:
> 
> I was looking for some info on cbd gummies. I typed it into the search engine 
> in Safari on my Mac and it put in a correction to what it thought I was 
> trying to type. I tried it in Firefox and that didn’t happen. is there some 
> setting I can change in Safari so it won’t try to correct me?
> 
> thanks.
> Lorie
> 
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Re: Safari debug and videos

[Jonathan Cohn]

Hello,
Autoplay is a feature fully embedded into the system preferences for a few 
years now.
First open your safari settings and then click on the web sites tab.
In the first table is an item “auto play”, this will then show a list of active 
tabs nd customized sites. Each will have three choices:
1. Never autoplay  
2. Auto play always 
3. Don’t autoplay with sound.

I believe however you were complaining bout the messages 
This add will end in 5 seconds.
This is a “live region message”
Live regions can be turned off in  VoiceOver utility in the web area 
the specific control is "Enable Live Regions “ 
Note, if you disable live regions, then  some status updates that get sent to 
screen reader users like the gmail announcement that you deleted a message or 
the contents in a web chat  the other  will no longer auto speak. You can use 
an activity to customize this if you need that level of control.

Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Mar 22, 2023, at 1:21 PM, Traci Duncan  wrote:
> 
> Hi, after doing a little more Googling, the debug menu may not be available 
> for Ventura. If it is, it might be in the developer’s menu.
> 
> *Sighs, guess this won’t solve my ad video countdown. 
> 
> Traci
> 
> 
>> On Mar 22, 2023, at 8:06 AM, Dave Carlson > <mailto:dgcarlson0...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>> 
>> Tracey,
>> 
>> Just tried this, but cannot find the new debug menu anywhere. Should it 
>> appear to the right of the help menu? Not sure what to the right and on top 
>> means.
>> 
>> Dave Carlson
>> Farfar, Oregonian, Engineer, Woodworker, Musician
>> dgcarlson0...@gmail.com <mailto:dgcarlson0...@gmail.com>
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On Mar 22, 2023, at 7:57 AM, Traci Duncan > <mailto:our4p...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>> 
>> Hi all, in my continued quest to stop videos from playing and Voiceover 
>> counting down this ad will stop in so many seconds, I came across this idea. 
>> What do you think?
>> 
>> From Mac World. 
>> Safari has a debug menu that can be used to stop autoplaying video, but 
>> first we need to activate the debug menu using Terminal.
>> 
>> defaults write com.apple.Safari IncludeInternalDebugMenu 1
>> 
>> Close Terminal, and reopen Safari. You’ll see a new option at the righthand 
>> end of the top menu bar: Debug. Click this, then select Media Flags > 
>> Disallow Inline Video.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> That’s it! (If you want to get rid of that Debug menu option, go back to 
>> Terminal and enter
>> 
>> defaults write com.apple.Safari IncludeInternalDebugMenu 0
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Thanks,
>> Traci
>> 
>> 
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Re: howto clear notifications on mac?

[Jonathan Cohn]

There are actually two types of notifications, dialogs and
THe dialogs notifications can be reached with VO-N as already discussed in this 
thread, but there are also notifications available from the VO-O command which 
has two components notifications and widgets.
In either case, once the VO cursor is over  the notification text you can bring 
up actions which might be 
Clear
Close
Expand
 Accept Decline reply  depending on the specific notification. Close and clear 
seem to do the same thing and expand is for “stacks of notifications where more 
than one notification came from the same application.
I had started writing an AppleScript to clear all notifications, but then 
started making it too complicated especially since there can be more 
notifications than what you see.

Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Mar 18, 2023, at 11:20 AM, 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
>   After pressing VO plus n, press VO plus command plus space. Then press 
> enter on the close button. Repeat if you have more than one.
> 
> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
> "Those who make peaceful revolution impossible
> will make violent revolution inevitable."
> --John F. Kennedy
> My e-Mail:
> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
> 
> On 3/18/2023 7:59 AM, christopher moore wrote:
>> Hello,
>> Anyone know how to clear notifacations?  I’ve read some articles, but they 
>> seem to rely on hovering over them with the mouse.  Any workarounds using VO?
>> Chris
> 
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Re: Sound is always loud on my AirPods when connected to Mac.

[Jonathan Cohn]

Yes, you can adjust the sound on the AIRPODS Pro 2 with this gesture. If you 
feel the stem of the AirPods there is an area that is slightly flattened. It 
has the following function
1. Single tap Play/Pause / answer  / hang up 
2. Double tap Skip forward usually to next item you are listening to. 
3. Triple tap skip back 
4. Swipe up or down adjust volume. 


The taps produce a clicking sound in the ear and the swipes a soft beep.

Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Mar 18, 2023, at 3:34 PM, Jessica Moss  wrote:
> 
> That’s what I thought.  That’s what I eventually had to end up doing as well, 
> since nothing else worked.
>  Supposedly, according to an article I’ve found, you’re supposed to be able 
> to adjust the volume of the AirPods themselves by putting your thumb on the 
> stems, and swiping up or down from the sensors, but I’ve never been able to 
> make that work.
> 
> 
>> On Mar 18, 2023, at 12:08 PM, christopher moore  wrote:
>> 
>> Hello Jessica,
>> I use the f11 and f112 keys to adjust the volume.
>> Chris
>> 
>>> On Mar 14, 2023, at 4:29 PM, Jessica Moss  wrote:
>>> 
>>> I’ve just connected my AirPods Second Generation to my M1 Mac, and the 
>>> sound is blaring loud, no matter how much I decrease my output volume.
>>> I’ve never had this problem on my iPhone, although I’ve never found a way 
>>> to adjust the volume of the AirPods themselves independently, only by using 
>>> the volume buttons on the phone.  Is this what I’m stuck doing on the Mac 
>>> as well, changing the overall system volume whenever I want to listen to 
>>> them?
>>> 
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Re: Link or button not activated.

[Jonathan Cohn]

Hello,
InMonterray at least when I use the mouse mouse toggle key combination the 
mouse will usually move to my VO cursor  before activating  I have used this 
functionality in a few instances.
The  key combination is VO-shift-command-space. You might want to be a little 
more careful and turn off cursor tracking and actually use the route mouse to 
VO cursor. 
 
Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Mar 14, 2023, at 2:46 PM, Anders Holmberg  wrote:
> 
> Hi!
> I am trying to confirm a payment on a page here in Sweden.
> Everything has worked fine until this crappy  go to payment button.
> I can not activate it and I can’t drag the pointer to the VoiceOver cursor 
> either.
> I guess this is something that you might have experienced so I am wondering 
> if any of you might have an idea on what I could do?
> I might try a mouse if I could find my mouse here.
> Blessings.
> /A
> 
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Re: Navigating app store

[Jonathan Cohn]

Hello,
I hadn’t looked at this in a bit. It seems on the Mac, that one needs to turn 
off some of the cursor tracking in order to view all the details about an App. 
I once had a link to aa web page that used JS to query Apple Store / App Store 
/ iTunes store and gave a much cleaner interface. I don’t know if this site 
still exists and I could not find anything in my history.  But perhaps you can 
search mailing list archives and find my reference to this.

Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Mar 7, 2023, at 6:45 PM, Traci Duncan  wrote:
> 
> Hi all, How do I get into the app’s description? It seems like my only option 
> is to get it or purchase it. I’ve tried interacting deeper and deeper, but 
> this doesn’t open up the description, reviews, etc.
> 
> Thanks,
> Traci
> 
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Re: About contacts

[Jonathan Cohn]

Which version of MacOS are you running? I have not been able to upgrade to 
Ventura since I am using a 2015 MacBook AIR. In this system, there is a 
Internet Accounts area in the System Settings program. For each type of 
Internet account that you have, there is a list of features to enable 
synchronizing that account with your Macintosh. One of these checkboxes is 
Contacts. 
So a lot of folks have the opposite problem that you do where they have 
contacts coming from Google and iCloud for the same person. Apparently Ventura 
has a tool to reduce this duplication.
Jonathan 
  
Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Feb 22, 2023, at 1:03 PM, Rebecca Sabo  wrote:
> 
> Hi all,
> Some reason when I open contacts on my mack , it shows no contacts.  How do I 
> get my contacts back on my computer?
> Thanks 
> Becky 
> 
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Re: Info for saving items

[Jonathan Cohn]

OK.
First if you hit tab twice from the file name area you should get to a “where 
popup menu”.  If you open this there will be several choices.
For more choices, there is a “disclosure “"show more options disclosure 
triangle that is one more tab stop away.  When clicked this will expose a panel 
much like a finder window. 
Also, all of the keyboard shortcuts listed in the “Go” menu of the finder will 
work to move to specific directories, like “command-shift-O” to select the 
documents folder. 
If you need even more flexibility there is a long standing program called 
Default folder X  that adds flexibility. This program has been around for over 
20 years, but I have never used it, so I am not positive it is usable with 
VOiceOver.


"  
Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Feb 22, 2023, at 1:50 PM, Rebecca Sabo  wrote:
> 
> Hi John,
> I am still having trouble saving documents .  Some reason the document wants 
> to keep saving in iCloud.  I do not want the item to go their.  How do I 
> change it so the item goes to my documents ?
> Thank you 
> Becky Sabo 
> 
>> On Jan 9, 2023, at 7:34 PM, John Panarese > <mailto:jpanar...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>> 
>> Command-s will save a document that has not been saved yet. Where it 
>> saves depends on a few different factors. Generally speaking, it will go 
>> into your Documents folder of your Home Folder. However, if you are using 
>> iCloud Drive and are using a Word Processor that saves to iCloud, the file 
>> could end up in an iCloud subfolder of that app. For example, the Pages 
>> folder in your iCloud Drive. You can direct where you want the document to 
>> be saved in the save dialog though.
>> 
>> 
>> Take Care
>> 
>> John D. Panarese
>> Director
>> Mac for the Blind
>> Tel, (631) 724-4479
>> Email, j...@macfortheblind.com <mailto:j...@macfortheblind.com>
>> Website, http://www.macfortheblind.com <http://www.macfortheblind.com/>
>> 
>> APPLE CERTIFIED SUPPORT PROFESSIONAL and Trainer
>> 
>> AUTHORIZED APPLE STORE BUSINESS AFFILIATE
>> 
>> MAC and iOS VOICEOVER TRAINING AND SUPPORT
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On Jan 9, 2023, at 9:24 PM, Rebecca Sabo >> <mailto:beckyas...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi all,
>>> I am trying to save a document .  What is the command for saving a document 
>>> and how Dows it go into my documents ?
>>> Thanks Becky 
>>> 
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Re: Firefox accessibility team.

[Jonathan Cohn]

Yes,I have communicated with them on the A11Y Slack instance. One of the 
original NVDA developers now works on accessibility for the Mac. But your best 
bet is to open a case in the Firefox bugzilla site.

https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/home
Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Feb 9, 2023, at 12:27 PM, Anders Holmberg  wrote:
> 
> Hi!
> Is there such a beast as an accessibility team for firefox?
> I am very very happy with the browser most of the time but I have glitches I 
> think the ff team should know.
> Thanks.
> /A
> 
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Re: Web site compatibility issues with Safari?

[Jonathan Cohn]

I find Firefox to be a little slower than Safari for the rotor and item 
choosers but generally otherwise works well. The fact that focus follows the 
voiceover cursor can still cause issues on some web sites, and i find that if 
one turns off cursor tracking then the VO-Spac operation is not always 
performed where it should be.

 
Best  wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Feb 5, 2023, at 3:51 PM, Karen Lewellen  wrote:
> 
> What is the latest on Firefox and voiceover?
> For me personally, I dislike the idea of chrome on my machine, although 
> someone  did add it after safari failed with a task.
> 
> 
> 
> On Sun, 5 Feb 2023, Brandon Olivares wrote:
> 
>> Safari’s been dicey for me too, but I don’t like Chrome enough to switch 
>> completely. However several websites I’ll only use in chrome, like 
>> QuickBooks Online for example.
>> 
>>> On Feb 5, 2023, at 9:33 AM, Dave Carlson  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Yes,
>>> That happened to me a couple weeks ago with a web page, and now I can’t 
>>> remember which. But it was consistent and switching to MS-Edge it worked. 
>>> Agree that Safari is beginning to show cracks in its foundation. I’ve 
>>> switched back and forth for several months and finally have set Edge to be 
>>> my default browser and I find a more uniform browsing experience.
>>> 
>>> Dave Carlson
>>> Woodworker, Musician, Oregonian, Engineer,  Farfar
>>> dgcarlson0...@gmail.com
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Feb 5, 2023, at 6:13 AM, 'Jason J.G. White' via MacVisionaries 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Several times recently, I’ve encountered errors from Web applications 
>>> (e.g., a “get” operation was submitted instead of a “put” operation, or a 
>>> message stating that too many errors occurred after submitting a form). 
>>> This only happens with Safari; all is fine if I use Google Chrome instead, 
>>> and it has happened across multiple Web sites.
>>> I’m running Mac OS Ventura 13.2. Are others noticing the same? I’ve read 
>>> elsewhere that Safari is behind Mozilla Firefox and Google Chrome in Web 
>>> standards support, so this isn’t entirely surprising, but I’ve noticed it 
>>> more lately.
>>> 
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Re: Apple watch sometimes prematurely ends sleep tracking

[Jonathan Cohn]

Donna,
Wow, you are lucky. I might have turned off Taptic time, because it always 
seemed to go off when I didn’t want it and never when I did. I have an Apple 
Watch SE, since  did not feel the need for an always on display or a blood 
oxygen monitor. 
Just to make sure I understand your process
1. Tap the watch face once. (when I do this the watch usually  speaks the time 
followed  by the temperature)
2. After a brief pause double tap the face. (Now the watch switches into the 
Weather app.

I’d really like to be able to have this work for concerts and lectures. At home 
I can easily put headphones on, wake up my phone and check time by waking my 
phone  up. 

Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn


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Re: What does Selection Replaced Mean

[Jonathan Cohn]

This usually means that some kind of auto completion has occurred. So if you 
typed “Jo” and VOiceOver prompts you for “jonathan Freely”  it has not really 
put “Jonathan Freely” into the text field yet, but if you press tab or comma  
then the Macintosh will put the email information in for jonathan Freely and 
will remove what you had typed.

Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Jan 26, 2023, at 11:29 PM, Fazil M.  wrote:
> 
> Hi, Group.
> When I am in the address bar in Safari or in ‘To Field’ in Mail and type a 
> few letters, , VoiceOver says ‘selection replaced’, does it mean that 
> VoiceOver gets rid off what I typed and replaces it with something else, or 
> it means something different?
> Thanks!
>  
> 
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Re: Weird Login Stuff with Ventura.

[Jonathan Cohn]

You don't perhaps have your Macintosh configured to unlock with your Apple 
watch? If so, I suggest turning that off and back on again. I have had issues 
with this after upgrading on several occasions. 

Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Jan 25, 2023, at 5:32 PM, Violet Gill  wrote:
> 
> Hello, no, I didn’t try that I will try and see what happens. Will it always 
> do this? or is there something I can do that will bring it back to how it 
> usually works.  
> 
> thank you.
> Violet.  
> She/her.
> 
>> On Jan 25, 2023, at 17:13, 'E.T.' via MacVisionaries 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>>    Or just clicking the mouse or trackpad to get focus back on the password 
>> entry. Did you try to find anything in system information?
>> 
>> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
>> "Those who make peaceful revolution impossible
>> will make violent revolution inevitable."
>> --John F. Kennedy
>> My e-Mail:
>> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
>> 
>>> On 1/25/2023 1:57 PM, Brad Snyder wrote:
>>> Yes, Ventura has some weird issues with the logon screen. Try toggling 
>>> VoiceOver off, and then back on again. I find that usually helps.
>>> - Brad -
>>> On Jan 25, 2023, at 15:46, Violet Gill  wrote:
>>> Hello. I’m Writing In Regards to Mac OS Ventura 13.2. I just upgraded from 
>>> The Last version of Monterey since most of the bugs may have been fixed and 
>>> I felt it was the right time to update. However, there is a weird issue 
>>> that I’m experiencing at login. VO will say installer progress and the 
>>> authenticating and I can not enter my password I have never faced this 
>>> before and it is strange. I’m wondering if there is a fix for this. Thank 
>>> you and I hope all of you have a positive day or night.
>>> Violet.
>>> She/her.
>> 
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Re: M1 MacBook question.

[Jonathan Cohn]

Hello,
At least before last week’s announcement, the MacBook Air was slightly better 
than the low end MacBookPro.  All of the M1/M2 MacBook computers should respond 
very closely when doing accessibility audits of WEB sites. If you come across a 
web site that does not perform well with the lowest end M1 based Macintosh I 
shudder to think how it would perform against a Chrome Book unless the web site 
has bugs related to Safari or MacOS.

 
Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Jan 24, 2023, at 7:44 PM, Herbie Allen  wrote:
> 
> It’s cheaper.
> 
>> On Jan 24, 2023, at 18:38, Jessica Moss  wrote:
>> 
>> That’s interesting, I wonder why my supervisor was trying to push so hard 
>> for me to get the MacBook Air over the pro then, aside from it supposedly 
>> having better battery life, and originally I’d asked the company to purchase 
>> for me, since one of my reasons for needing it was to audit their site, 
>> which doesn’t perform efficiently on my current machine, but the way they 
>> insist on running it currently and have for years, it won’t with anyone 
>> running an older computer system.
>> However, when I asked for the MacBook Pro, and gave my reasons, I later 
>> found out from my supervisor that they denied my request, but were willing 
>> to purchase a MacBook Air; however, he told me that he as well as another 
>> team member currently have them, and with them being company computers, the 
>> trackers they put on them cause them to become unstable and have been known 
>> to crash, so he’s encouraged me to try to purchase one on my own.  So with 
>> this being the case, I’m really trying to figure out what would be the 
>> better deal before I just take the plunge and buy one.
>> 
>>> On Jan 24, 2023, at 7:25 PM, 'Jason White' via MacVisionaries 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On 24/1/23 19:22, Jessica Moss wrote:
>>>> I was told the M1 MacBook Air actually has a better processor than the 
>>>> MacBook Pro, even though it has less ram, supposedly that wouldn’t make a 
>>>> huge difference.
>>>> Is this correct?
>>> 
>>> No, the M1 Pro and M1 Max processors in the 2021 MacBook Pro are better 
>>> than the M2 processor in the MacBook Air.
>>> 
>>> The recently released M2 Pro and M2 Max processors in the latest MacBook 
>>> Pro are even better, however. See appleinsider.com for discussion.
>>> 
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Re: Multiple windows of the same app navigation

[Jonathan Cohn]

First, in most applications you can open tabs these are like windows, except 
that they are all grouped together in one window. (Yes, terminal does allow 
tabs). The Apple standard way to create a tab is to press command-T. Then to 
switch between your tabs use control-tab, or if you have sight, there should be 
a “tab bar” at the top of the window that lists all your active tabs.
Also, when you put a window in full screen mode it ends up creating a separate 
“space”  for the window. There are  key strokes for switching between the 
spaces  and you can also create a trackpad  gesture to do that. a”Spaces” in 
MacOS is very similar to “Screens” in Windows 10. Are you aware of these? 
Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Jan 23, 2023, at 6:35 AM, Mohamed Fayed  wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> Hope my mail finds you well,
> 
> My inquiry is about opening multiple windows within the same application and 
> one of them is full screen.
> 
> Usually, I do some applications, e.g. terminal, in full screen to make the 
> line printed reasonable. And I open many windows, one per work and one per 
> study content and so on.
> 
> My issue is that when a window is in full screen, but others are not in full 
> screen, then I switch to another application, then get back, the application 
> focus is on the non-full screen window.
> 
> Another thing, when I switch to the application of multiple windows, then try 
> to use command+` to switch to the full screen window, it does not work!
> 
> Is there any explanation/fix for this ?!
> 
> Thank you so much,
> 
> Mohamed E. Fayed 
> 
> 
> 
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Re: When It Comes to iPhone, Are You All Thumbs?

[Jonathan Cohn]

Well, perhaps because I use a SE 2020  iPhone with orientation locked in 
portrait mode, I can’t imagine using multi finger typing except with braille 
screen input when the phone is now in landscape mode. I just tried typing with  
four fingers in the keyboard area and got nothing but junk.
That’s OK, I have my MacBook Air for real typing needs.

Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Jan 18, 2023, at 12:15 PM, Anders Holmberg  wrote:
> 
> Hi!
> I hold my phone in my right hand and use all my fingers on the left  to type, 
> except the left thumb which I push to the downside where the charging port is.
> /A
> 
>> 18 jan. 2023 kl. 07:55 skrev M. Taylor :
>> 
>> Hello All,
>> 
>> A friend of mine and I got into a discussion about how we type in iOS, when
>> sending text messages.
>> 
>> It started when she asked me if I use my thumbs to type.  Even though I know
>> that a great many people use their thumbs to enter text on iPhone,
>> personally I find the technique slow and awkward.
>> 
>> How do I enter text in iOS?
>> 
>> First, I keep my VoiceOver typing mode set to "Touch Typing."
>> 
>> Second, I use a folio case.  Not only does such a case cover the display
>> when not in use, it also provides a nifty way to balance the phone in one
>> hand, fingers-free.
>> 
>> When entering text, I open the case, kind of like a book, with the wallet
>> side to the left and the phone to the right.  I position the phone case in
>> the crook of my left hand (where the base of my thumb meets my hand) so that
>> the back of the phone, in the case of course, is resting against the palm of
>> my left hand, leaving all five digits on my left hand, free.  
>> 
>> The wallet side of the case acts as a kind of counter balance so that the
>> phone does not slip out of my hand, even when the phone is tilted, off-axis,
>> so to speak.
>> 
>> I use my left thumb to access the letters and numbers, located on the left
>> side of the onscreen keyboard and the index finger of my right hand, to
>> access the letters and numbers located on the right side of the onscreen
>> keyboard.
>> 
>> I hold the phone in the exact same way when using Slide-to-Type; except in
>> that instance, I use my right index finger, only.
>> 
>> Okay, that's my method for entering text on iPhone.  
>> 
>> How about you?  What technique do you use to enter text in iOS?
>> 
>> When it come to iPhone, are you all thumbs? (smile).
>> 
>> Mark
>> 
>> 
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Re: Need some computer help

[Jonathan Cohn]

The first thing to do is figure out why you are getting complaints about not 
being logged in. Open up System Preferences (System Settings did replace this 
in Ventura) and then open the Internet accounts tab.
This should give you a table with all the Mail/Cloud accounts that your 
computer knows about.
If any of these are having issues when they are selected in VO a new dialog box 
will come up and ask you to sign into that account.
This will probably fix your contacts not being synced, and might fix the 
interruptions too.
 
Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Jan 8, 2023, at 4:27 PM, Rebecca Sabo  wrote:
> 
> Hi all,
>>> I am trying to use my mack computer more.  I have some questions to ask all 
>>> of you or someone on this list can help me.  First of all my contacts are 
>>> not sink with my computer.  Also I have some attachments that were sent to 
>>> me in pdf.  How do you open them and read them with voice over?  Finally I 
>>> was trying to watch some videos that my sister gave me.  I am playing them 
>>> than my computer stops playing it in the middle and starts over, and also 
>>> it keeps asking me to log in also .  How do I fix these problem.
> Thanks 
> Becky 
> 
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Re: Mac newbie curious about app recommendations

[Jonathan Cohn]

Well, AppleVis.com does a reasonable job of reviewing apps for accessibilit, 
but every app has its own purpose and design paradigm and so may or may not be 
accessible.
BBEdit is supposed to be a wonderful editor of text files, with lots of power 
tools, but their text widget does not communicate with the Accessibility layer 
of MacOS, and so is (or at least 4 years ago was ) not usable by a voiceover 
user.
What are your ambitions with your Mac?

Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Jan 4, 2023, at 5:26 PM, Marlene Kramer  
> wrote:
> 
> hi,
> Mac newbie here, making slow but definite progress. I went to the AppStore 
> today for the first time, prompting the following question.
> are there recommended apps from the Mac store for the MacBook Air with which 
> I may not be familiar having come over from iOS? I realize a question like 
> this can generate a lot of highly individualized responses, but I am curious 
> to learn if there are some I should start learning.
> Best, Marlene.
> 
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Re: First Character Recognition in Lists

[Jonathan Cohn]

Well, in regard to first letter navigation, macOS generally has it, but it acts 
a bit differently then it does on other operating systems. If you type “N” 
twice quickly  on a windows computer it will go to the next item that has an N  
as the initial character. MacOS either never or very rarely will do this. 
Generally, I find that typing a specific character after a delay will always go 
to a specific item in the list in question, but it will not be the first one. 
If you continue to type it will generally get to the right result. For example 
in the develop menu of Safari there are several items that begin with disable 
but if I type “disable j” it will always land on “Disable javascript”. 
Perhaps in your case, however using either text expander or keyboard Maestro 
would be more efficient. I used to  have a random email signature AppleScript 
in my library. If you are interested in this, let me know and I will try to 
find it.
 
Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Dec 9, 2022, at 7:38 PM, 'Jason White' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> Write a bug report. Maybe Apple will fix it.
> 
> On 9/12/22 23:02, Bill Gallik wrote:
>> I’m having an issue navigating a list wherein I want to move into the list 
>> by typing the first character of list items so as to quickly move down into 
>> that part of said list.  As I’ve mentioned in prior e-mailings, I have a 
>> number of “signature tags” that I’ve created from “Quote of the Day” in 
>> prior days and now “Brainy Quotes.”  I save each daily quote in a text file 
>> in a dedicated folder and then create the signature tag matching that file 
>> name.  I’m inclined to keep these signature tags in alphabetical order so 
>> when I create such a tag that begins with a letter later in alphabetical 
>> order I’d like to be able to enter the list of signature names and enter the 
>> first letter so I’ll be placed in that region of the list.  That is not 
>> working consistently.
>> 
>> For example, the “Second Mouse” tag below is a bit down the list; yet if I 
>> wanted to create a tag such as “Wisdom Outweighs,” simply typing a “w” upon 
>> entering the signature list often does nothing at all.  The aggravating 
>> aspect of this is that SOMETIMES it works.  And to top it off, when I am in 
>> a folder and trying to locate a file in this manner it does work all the 
>> time.
>> 
>> Does anybody have any suggestions?
>> 
>> 
>> * * * * * * * * * * * *
>> - Bill from Ino, Wisconsin
>> - "The early bird may get the worm,"
>> - "But the second mouse gets the cheese!"
>> - Contributor Unknown
>> 
> 
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Re: Java script

[Jonathan Cohn]

In the developer tab you want to activate this item:
Disable JavaScript command-option-shift—J


Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Dec 7, 2022, at 5:01 PM, Lorie McCloud  wrote:
> 
> I’d like a little more info about how to disable java script. I went to the 
> console in the developer tab but I didn’t find a simple on or off and I don’t 
> understand what the items in that list do.
> 
> Thanks.
> Lorie
> 
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Re: Trying to learn more about pop-ups

[Jonathan Cohn]

I think the app “Stop the Madness” might help. I have heard  on  “The Talk 
Show” from John Grouper and a couple other places about this app, but have not 
tried it myself.
App Store review is:
https://apps.apple.com/us/story/id150714 
<https://apps.apple.com/us/story/id150714>
I wonder if it has been reviewed by AppleVis?

Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Dec 7, 2022, at 9:37 AM, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> Thanks for the reader mode suggestion.  I’ll give that a try.  For both the 
> websites that I’m finding most annoying, I did check in Settings and Pop-ups 
> are blocked.  That’s why I’m so perplexed.
> Cheers,
> Donna
> 
>> On Dec 7, 2022, at 8:30 AM, Herbie Allen  wrote:
>> 
>> Reader mode with Command Shift R will help on sites that have articles. If 
>> you have used it on the iPhone it works the same way on the Mac, only better 
>> as I have had some sneaky pop ups on the phone. Also, if you go to a website 
>> in Safari, open the the menu bar, and go to the
>> Safari Menu, go down and you will see an option that says settings for the 
>> site you. You can check its individual settings and see if pop ups are 
>> blocked.
>>> On Dec 7, 2022, at 08:20, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi all,
>>> 
>>> I’m trying to figure out how pop-ups work, and ultimately, what I need to 
>>> do so I never. See them.  I have not purchased the software that was 
>>> recommended earlier, that that is still on my list of possible solutions.  
>>> Here’s my question.  I have all the settings in Safari set to block 
>>> pop-ups, and not to notify me.  But some pop-ups still get around that.  
>>> How and why does that happen?  I’ve been looking around the internet, but 
>>> have not found an answer there, so I’m hoping someone on this list can 
>>> explain it.  Also, to Brad—I think it was you that uses po-up blocker— Does 
>>> it really work all the time?  I don’t mind spending the money, but if I do, 
>>> want to be rid of these stupid ads.
>>> Cheers,
>>> Donna
>>> 
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Re: some weirdnesses on my new Mac

[Jonathan Cohn]

Well, since Catalina MacOS has two APFS volumes for the system disk, one that 
is read only and has the operating system essential components and another that 
has data that will change.
Actually, looking at disk utility the volume that does not have “data” in the 
name has a snapshot in it so it could be that I am backward.
But MacOs does some auto mount magic to merge the readonly Applications folder 
with the editable Applications folder.
I have seen system messages like that from drop box in the past.  Are you using 
drop box? If so, then you can turn off drop box notifications, but I don’t 
remember exactly how.

Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Dec 6, 2022, at 10:52 PM, Raymond Foret Jr  wrote:
> 
> Okay,
> 
> I am noticing two occurances of my main hard drive on my Mac.  I can’t seem 
> to get rid of what appears to be a duplicate drive.
> 
> Second, I’m noticing system dialogs which always appear to be empty are 
> precent when I press VO+F1.  No matter what I do, I can’t seem to get rid of 
> them.
> 
> Any thoughts?  I’m using Ventura, the latest updates.
> 
> 
> Sincerely,
> The Constantly Barefooted Ray
> Still a very proud Mac, Xfinity Mobile and Apple TV user
> 
> 
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Re: Where is The Folder?

[Jonathan Cohn]

Once it  comes up in the Spotlight window, press command-i and you should get a 
finder info window about the file.
 In this window there should be a Where line.
For the file I searched, it said:
iCloud folder arrow documents arrow job search arrow …

So to find this, 
use command-shift-I in the finder to open the iCloud disk then find documents 
and open that.
Then find Job Search and open that.

Of course, I don’t expect your file will be in a folder called Job Search, 
unless you put it there intentionally. 
Best wishes,

Jonathan Cohn



> On Dec 5, 2022, at 7:33 PM, Fazil M.  wrote:
> 
> Yes, I did but is isn’t there.
> It is in the computer somewhere but I don’t know where.
> Thanks!
>  
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com  On 
> Behalf Of Brad Snyder
> Sent: Monday, December 05, 2022 3:56 PM
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: Where is The Folder?
>  
> Have you looked in your downloads folder.
> That's the first place I would look.
> 
> - Brad -
> 
> On Dec 5, 2022, at 17:12, Fazil M.  <mailto:mfa...@outlook.com>> wrote:
> 
> 
> Hi Group.
> I am listening to a novel.
> I got this novel in a zip file which I unzipped in a folder and there are 11 
> parts in this folder.
> I saved it in Document folder
> I have listened 7 parts so far and each time I have to struggle to find next 
> part after each completed part.
> Although I kept this folder in Document Folder, but I do not find this folder 
> reliably there.
> Each time I find the next part in a kind of hit and miss way.
> Now after finishing 7th part, I am unable to find 8th part because I am not 
> getting to the folder.
> How should I search for that folder?
> I heard that every file and folder can be found in Finder but I am sure I am 
> not doing something right.
> Your help is much appreciated.
> Thanks!
>  
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