Re: [maemo-developers] libosso svn up-to-date?

[Kimmo Hämäläinen]

On Tue, 2006-11-28 at 19:07 +0100, ext Johan Bilien wrote:
...
> > I've noticed that it's necessary to call osso_initialize() before using
> > any hildon-fm API. Is it also necessary to call it before using any part
> > of hildon-libs?
> 
> No that should not be necessary.
> 
> I'm a bit suprised you need to do it for hildon-fm, is that because of
> DBus-based gnome-vfs?

That's a negative, sir. At least I have written GnomeVFS programs
without osso_initialize. I guess osso_initialize would be only required
if some code uses Libosso functions.

BR, Kimmo
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Re: [maemo-developers] libosso svn up-to-date?

[Johan Bilien]

On Fri, Nov 24, 2006, Murray Cumming wrote:
> On Thu, 2006-10-05 at 13:01 +0200, Murray Cumming wrote:
> > On Wed, 2006-10-04 at 15:04 +0300, Kimmo Hämäläinen wrote:
> > > On Wed, 2006-10-04 at 14:58, ext Murray Cumming wrote:
> > > ...
> > > > Could you at least put together a one sentence description of what this
> > > > module does?
> > > 
> > > Ok, I'll put it to trunk. Damn, had to yield a little... :)
> > 
> > Thanks very much. That's usefully informative:
> > https://stage.maemo.org/viewcvs.cgi/maemo/projects/haf/trunk/libosso/README?view=markup
> > 
> > I am now one step closer to documenting what the Maemo modules are:
> > http://www.maemo.org/maemowiki/MaemoModules/2.0
> 
> I've noticed that it's necessary to call osso_initialize() before using
> any hildon-fm API. Is it also necessary to call it before using any part
> of hildon-libs?

No that should not be necessary.

I'm a bit suprised you need to do it for hildon-fm, is that because of
DBus-based gnome-vfs?

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<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
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Re: [maemo-developers] libosso svn up-to-date?

[Murray Cumming]

On Thu, 2006-10-05 at 13:01 +0200, Murray Cumming wrote:
> On Wed, 2006-10-04 at 15:04 +0300, Kimmo Hämäläinen wrote:
> > On Wed, 2006-10-04 at 14:58, ext Murray Cumming wrote:
> > ...
> > > Could you at least put together a one sentence description of what this
> > > module does?
> > 
> > Ok, I'll put it to trunk. Damn, had to yield a little... :)
> 
> Thanks very much. That's usefully informative:
> https://stage.maemo.org/viewcvs.cgi/maemo/projects/haf/trunk/libosso/README?view=markup
> 
> I am now one step closer to documenting what the Maemo modules are:
> http://www.maemo.org/maemowiki/MaemoModules/2.0

I've noticed that it's necessary to call osso_initialize() before using
any hildon-fm API. Is it also necessary to call it before using any part
of hildon-libs?

The README description doesn't really tell me either of these things:
"
Libosso is a wrapper library for user applications for
platform-specific,
frequently-used D-Bus services. Thus, it should not contain anything
that is not platform-specific -- ideally Libosso should not exist.
"

-- 
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Re: [maemo-developers] libosso svn up-to-date?

[Murray Cumming]

On Wed, 2006-10-04 at 15:04 +0300, Kimmo Hämäläinen wrote:
> On Wed, 2006-10-04 at 14:58, ext Murray Cumming wrote:
> ...
> > Could you at least put together a one sentence description of what this
> > module does?
> 
> Ok, I'll put it to trunk. Damn, had to yield a little... :)

Thanks very much. That's usefully informative:
https://stage.maemo.org/viewcvs.cgi/maemo/projects/haf/trunk/libosso/README?view=markup

I am now one step closer to documenting what the Maemo modules are:
http://www.maemo.org/maemowiki/MaemoModules/2.0

-- 
Murray Cumming
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
www.murrayc.com
www.openismus.com

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Re: [maemo-developers] libosso svn up-to-date?

[Michael Kostrzewa (Nokia-M/Helsinki)]

On Wed, Oct 04, 2006 at 03:44:45PM +0300, ext Guillem Jover wrote:
> On Wed, 2006-10-04 at 14:36:24 +0300, ext Kimmo H?m?l?inen wrote:
> > On Wed, 2006-10-04 at 14:04, ext Murray Cumming wrote:
> > > On Wed, 2006-10-04 at 13:45 +0300, Kimmo H?m?l?inen wrote:
> > > > Yes, it does not tell the reasons for the changes (they are in
> > > > debian/changelog), but I'm too lazy to put those since you seem to be
> > > > the only one who is interested about Libosso changes ;)
> 
> I consider those two serve different purposes, ChangeLog (as in upstream)
> explains in detail up to the function and variable level what has been
> changed. And debian/changelog describes the packaging changes, and a
> summary of upstream changes if it's native package.

Also, consider that your release might one day land in a tar.gz file,
without any .svn record or server access. Or the module might be
migrated to another server/revision control system. 

ChangeLog is an established standard, I don't see a reason to break that
standard. Even if it's not usefull for you, consider that it might be
usefull for other X people. 

On a side note, I think we should work as close as possible (and that
includes work methodology) to open-source upstream standards. Our
osso-specific workflow bits (ie. debian packaging, the way releases are
being rolled out) should be considered as a second layer that might
change any day. 

Michael

> 
> > > At the moment, nobody (me included) knows what on earth libosso is. The
> > > README is empty, for instance.
> >
> > It's there just because automake complains otherwise.
> 
> That's because automake defaults to gnu strictness, if you are not
> following the GCS[0] you probably want:
> 
> AM_INIT_AUTOMAKE([foreign])
> 
> > 98% of Debian packages the README file is totally useless anyway.
> 
> On this one I disagree, if you have specific examples, please tell me
> or file bug reports.
> 
> > > ChangeLogs are one way to introduce people to what a module does and how
> > > it works, and how it is evolving. Not doing ChangeLogs because nobody
> > > cares about them would be almost a circular argument.
> 
> [ This snipped reordered ]
> > The code and API should be pretty self-explaining (yes, they're not,
> > that's why I'm working on new API).
> 
> > Well, just try to use the diff. The code is so simple that manually
> > writing some ChangeLog just seems stupid to me.
> 
> It's not about the code being simple, it's about having an offline
> history of what has been changed and how the code evolved. That's
> pretty useful when tracking down bugs for example.
> 
> 
> [0] 
> 
> regards,
> guillem
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Re: [maemo-developers] libosso svn up-to-date?

[Kimmo Hämäläinen]

On Wed, 2006-10-04 at 15:44, ext Guillem Jover wrote:
> On Wed, 2006-10-04 at 14:36:24 +0300, ext Kimmo Hämäläinen wrote:
> > On Wed, 2006-10-04 at 14:04, ext Murray Cumming wrote:
> > > On Wed, 2006-10-04 at 13:45 +0300, Kimmo Hämäläinen wrote:
> > > > Yes, it does not tell the reasons for the changes (they are in
> > > > debian/changelog), but I'm too lazy to put those since you seem to be
> > > > the only one who is interested about Libosso changes ;)
> 
> I consider those two serve different purposes, ChangeLog (as in upstream)
> explains in detail up to the function and variable level what has been
> changed. And debian/changelog describes the packaging changes, and a
> summary of upstream changes if it's native package.

I knew this, but if I only edit one file, then it's debian/changelog.
There is no upstream in this case, not even other developers...

> > > At the moment, nobody (me included) knows what on earth libosso is. The
> > > README is empty, for instance.
> >
> > It's there just because automake complains otherwise.
> 
> That's because automake defaults to gnu strictness, if you are not
> following the GCS[0] you probably want:
> 
> AM_INIT_AUTOMAKE([foreign])
> 
> > 98% of Debian packages the README file is totally useless anyway.
> 
> On this one I disagree, if you have specific examples, please tell me
> or file bug reports.

I'm not that bored.

> > > ChangeLogs are one way to introduce people to what a module does and how
> > > it works, and how it is evolving. Not doing ChangeLogs because nobody
> > > cares about them would be almost a circular argument.
> 
> [ This snipped reordered ]
> > The code and API should be pretty self-explaining (yes, they're not,
> > that's why I'm working on new API).
> 
> > Well, just try to use the diff. The code is so simple that manually
> > writing some ChangeLog just seems stupid to me.
> 
> It's not about the code being simple, it's about having an offline
> history of what has been changed and how the code evolved. That's
> pretty useful when tracking down bugs for example.

I think this 'offline usage' is rare enough use case to ignore
(especially with Libosso). The bugs are pretty simple to spot if the
code is simple and short (especially if you have access to SVN).

BR; Kimmo

> 
> 
> [0] 
> 
> regards,
> guillem
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Re: [maemo-developers] libosso svn up-to-date?

[Guillem Jover]

On Wed, 2006-10-04 at 14:36:24 +0300, ext Kimmo Hämäläinen wrote:
> On Wed, 2006-10-04 at 14:04, ext Murray Cumming wrote:
> > On Wed, 2006-10-04 at 13:45 +0300, Kimmo Hämäläinen wrote:
> > > Yes, it does not tell the reasons for the changes (they are in
> > > debian/changelog), but I'm too lazy to put those since you seem to be
> > > the only one who is interested about Libosso changes ;)

I consider those two serve different purposes, ChangeLog (as in upstream)
explains in detail up to the function and variable level what has been
changed. And debian/changelog describes the packaging changes, and a
summary of upstream changes if it's native package.

> > At the moment, nobody (me included) knows what on earth libosso is. The
> > README is empty, for instance.
>
> It's there just because automake complains otherwise.

That's because automake defaults to gnu strictness, if you are not
following the GCS[0] you probably want:

AM_INIT_AUTOMAKE([foreign])

> 98% of Debian packages the README file is totally useless anyway.

On this one I disagree, if you have specific examples, please tell me
or file bug reports.

> > ChangeLogs are one way to introduce people to what a module does and how
> > it works, and how it is evolving. Not doing ChangeLogs because nobody
> > cares about them would be almost a circular argument.

[ This snipped reordered ]
> The code and API should be pretty self-explaining (yes, they're not,
> that's why I'm working on new API).

> Well, just try to use the diff. The code is so simple that manually
> writing some ChangeLog just seems stupid to me.

It's not about the code being simple, it's about having an offline
history of what has been changed and how the code evolved. That's
pretty useful when tracking down bugs for example.


[0] 

regards,
guillem
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Re: [maemo-developers] libosso svn up-to-date?

[Kimmo Hämäläinen]

On Wed, 2006-10-04 at 14:58, ext Murray Cumming wrote:
...
> Could you at least put together a one sentence description of what this
> module does?

Ok, I'll put it to trunk. Damn, had to yield a little... :)

BR; Kimmo

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Re: [maemo-developers] libosso svn up-to-date?

[Murray Cumming]

On Wed, 2006-10-04 at 14:36 +0300, Kimmo Hämäläinen wrote:
> On Wed, 2006-10-04 at 14:04, ext Murray Cumming wrote:
> > On Wed, 2006-10-04 at 13:45 +0300, Kimmo Hämäläinen wrote:
> > [snip]
> > > Yes, it does not tell the reasons for the changes (they are in
> > > debian/changelog), but I'm too lazy to put those since you seem to be
> > > the only one who is interested about Libosso changes ;)
> > > 
> > > > By the way, most projects that I work with in the GNOME world just
> > > > copy/paste their ChangeLog entry into the commit comment.
> > > 
> > > I'll do that if Libosso is in Gnome someday :)
> > > 
> > > Btw. I've had exactly one patch from outside Nokia for Libosso and it
> > > was from you. Many thanks.
> > 
> > At the moment, nobody (me included) knows what on earth libosso is. The
> > README is empty, for instance.
> 
> It's there just because automake complains otherwise. The code and API
> should be pretty self-explaining (yes, they're not, that's why I'm
> working on new API). 98% of Debian packages the README file is totally
> useless anyway.

Almost 98% of debian packages are useless, I guess. But really, I'll
take a description from anywhere - it doesn't have to be a README.

> > ChangeLogs are one way to introduce people to what a module does and how
> > it works, and how it is evolving. Not doing ChangeLogs because nobody
> > cares about them would be almost a circular argument.
> 
> Well, just try to use the diff. The code is so simple that manually
> writing some ChangeLog just seems stupid to me.
> 
> > It's your module, but it would help me.
> 
> Just ask me if you have questions (and I'll look the answers from the
> code).

Could you at least put together a one sentence description of what this
module does?

-- 
Murray Cumming
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
www.murrayc.com
www.openismus.com

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Re: [maemo-developers] libosso svn up-to-date?

[Kimmo Hämäläinen]

On Wed, 2006-10-04 at 14:04, ext Murray Cumming wrote:
> On Wed, 2006-10-04 at 13:45 +0300, Kimmo Hämäläinen wrote:
> [snip]
> > Yes, it does not tell the reasons for the changes (they are in
> > debian/changelog), but I'm too lazy to put those since you seem to be
> > the only one who is interested about Libosso changes ;)
> > 
> > > By the way, most projects that I work with in the GNOME world just
> > > copy/paste their ChangeLog entry into the commit comment.
> > 
> > I'll do that if Libosso is in Gnome someday :)
> > 
> > Btw. I've had exactly one patch from outside Nokia for Libosso and it
> > was from you. Many thanks.
> 
> At the moment, nobody (me included) knows what on earth libosso is. The
> README is empty, for instance.

It's there just because automake complains otherwise. The code and API
should be pretty self-explaining (yes, they're not, that's why I'm
working on new API). 98% of Debian packages the README file is totally
useless anyway.

> ChangeLogs are one way to introduce people to what a module does and how
> it works, and how it is evolving. Not doing ChangeLogs because nobody
> cares about them would be almost a circular argument.

Well, just try to use the diff. The code is so simple that manually
writing some ChangeLog just seems stupid to me.

> It's your module, but it would help me.

Just ask me if you have questions (and I'll look the answers from the
code).

BR, Kimmo
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Re: [maemo-developers] libosso svn up-to-date?

[Murray Cumming]

On Wed, 2006-10-04 at 13:04 +0200, Murray Cumming wrote:
> On Wed, 2006-10-04 at 13:45 +0300, Kimmo Hämäläinen wrote:
> [snip]
> > Yes, it does not tell the reasons for the changes (they are in
> > debian/changelog), but I'm too lazy to put those since you seem to be
> > the only one who is interested about Libosso changes ;)
> > 
> > > By the way, most projects that I work with in the GNOME world just
> > > copy/paste their ChangeLog entry into the commit comment.
> > 
> > I'll do that if Libosso is in Gnome someday :)
> > 
> > Btw. I've had exactly one patch from outside Nokia for Libosso and it
> > was from you. Many thanks.
> 
> At the moment, nobody (me included) knows what on earth libosso is. The
> README is empty, for instance.
> 
> ChangeLogs are one way to introduce people to what a module does and how
> it works, and how it is evolving. Not doing ChangeLogs because nobody
> cares about them would be almost a circular argument.
> 
> It's your module, but it would help me.

Sorry to go on about this, but for people wishing to start enjoying the
wonders of ChangeLogs, this script is very useful. It creates a
ChangeLog entry that already lists the changed files and functions, so
you can just write the explanatory text:
http://www.gnome.org/~fherrera/patches/prepare-ChangeLog.pl
 
-- 
Murray Cumming
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
www.murrayc.com
www.openismus.com

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Re: [maemo-developers] libosso svn up-to-date?

[Murray Cumming]

On Wed, 2006-10-04 at 13:45 +0300, Kimmo Hämäläinen wrote:
[snip]
> Yes, it does not tell the reasons for the changes (they are in
> debian/changelog), but I'm too lazy to put those since you seem to be
> the only one who is interested about Libosso changes ;)
> 
> > By the way, most projects that I work with in the GNOME world just
> > copy/paste their ChangeLog entry into the commit comment.
> 
> I'll do that if Libosso is in Gnome someday :)
> 
> Btw. I've had exactly one patch from outside Nokia for Libosso and it
> was from you. Many thanks.

At the moment, nobody (me included) knows what on earth libosso is. The
README is empty, for instance.

ChangeLogs are one way to introduce people to what a module does and how
it works, and how it is evolving. Not doing ChangeLogs because nobody
cares about them would be almost a circular argument.

It's your module, but it would help me.

-- 
Murray Cumming
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
www.murrayc.com
www.openismus.com

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Re: [maemo-developers] libosso svn up-to-date?

[Kimmo Hämäläinen]

On Wed, 2006-10-04 at 13:37, ext Murray Cumming wrote:
> On Wed, 2006-10-04 at 13:11 +0300, Kimmo Hämäläinen wrote:
> > On Wed, 2006-10-04 at 12:37, ext Murray Cumming wrote:
> > > Is the source in the maemo svn for libosso up to date?
> > 
> > Yes.
> > 
> > > I am surprised that there are no recent ChangeLog entries:
> > > https://stage.maemo.org/svn/maemo/projects/haf/trunk/libosso/ChangeLog
> > 
> > That's because I only use debian/changelog. ('svn diff' is enough, I
> > think.)
> 
> OK. Thanks. That is a little odd. Looking at debian/changelog, it would
> be nice if it mentioned what files and functions were changed, as you'll
> tend to see for projects such as GKT+.
> 
> I don't understand the comment about svn diff.

I meant that 'svn diff' allows you to see what files and functions were
changed. For example:
svn diff
https://stage.maemo.org/svn/maemo/projects/haf/tags/libosso/1.18-1/
https://stage.maemo.org/svn/maemo/projects/haf/tags/libosso/1.19-1/

Yes, it does not tell the reasons for the changes (they are in
debian/changelog), but I'm too lazy to put those since you seem to be
the only one who is interested about Libosso changes ;)

> By the way, most projects that I work with in the GNOME world just
> copy/paste their ChangeLog entry into the commit comment.

I'll do that if Libosso is in Gnome someday :)

Btw. I've had exactly one patch from outside Nokia for Libosso and it
was from you. Many thanks.

BR, Kimmo

> > 
> > > and I have a build error [1]:
> > > 
> > > osso-init.c: In function `add_to_if_hash':
> > > osso-init.c:519: warning: passing arg 2 of `g_list_append' discards
> > > qualifiers from pointer target type
> > > osso-init.c:538: warning: passing arg 2 of `g_list_append' discards
> > > qualifiers from pointer target type
> > > osso-init.c: In function `_msg_handler_rm_cb_f':
> > > osso-init.c:709: error: assignment of read-only member `handlers'
> > > osso-init.c:736: error: assignment of read-only member `handlers'
> > > make[2]: *** [osso-init.lo] Error 1
> > > make[2]: Leaving directory `/home/murrayc/cvs/maemo/libosso/src'
> > > make[1]: *** [all-recursive] Error 1
> > > make[1]: Leaving directory `/home/murrayc/cvs/maemo/libosso'
> > > make: *** [all] Error 2
> > > *** error during stage build of libosso: Error running make   *** [6/8]
> > 
> > It compiled for me, but I have probably different environment...
> > Patches are welcome, as always! :)
> > 
> > BR; Kimmo
> > 
> > > [1] though my compiler might be different because I'm trying once more
> > > (stupidly) with scratchbox 1.0.5, because I need it for another
> > > codebase, and I can't have two scratchboxes on one PC.
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Re: [maemo-developers] libosso svn up-to-date?

[Murray Cumming]

On Wed, 2006-10-04 at 13:11 +0300, Kimmo Hämäläinen wrote:
> On Wed, 2006-10-04 at 12:37, ext Murray Cumming wrote:
> > Is the source in the maemo svn for libosso up to date?
> 
> Yes.
> 
> > I am surprised that there are no recent ChangeLog entries:
> > https://stage.maemo.org/svn/maemo/projects/haf/trunk/libosso/ChangeLog
> 
> That's because I only use debian/changelog. ('svn diff' is enough, I
> think.)

OK. Thanks. That is a little odd. Looking at debian/changelog, it would
be nice if it mentioned what files and functions were changed, as you'll
tend to see for projects such as GKT+.

I don't understand the comment about svn diff.

By the way, most projects that I work with in the GNOME world just
copy/paste their ChangeLog entry into the commit comment.

> 
> > and I have a build error [1]:
> > 
> > osso-init.c: In function `add_to_if_hash':
> > osso-init.c:519: warning: passing arg 2 of `g_list_append' discards
> > qualifiers from pointer target type
> > osso-init.c:538: warning: passing arg 2 of `g_list_append' discards
> > qualifiers from pointer target type
> > osso-init.c: In function `_msg_handler_rm_cb_f':
> > osso-init.c:709: error: assignment of read-only member `handlers'
> > osso-init.c:736: error: assignment of read-only member `handlers'
> > make[2]: *** [osso-init.lo] Error 1
> > make[2]: Leaving directory `/home/murrayc/cvs/maemo/libosso/src'
> > make[1]: *** [all-recursive] Error 1
> > make[1]: Leaving directory `/home/murrayc/cvs/maemo/libosso'
> > make: *** [all] Error 2
> > *** error during stage build of libosso: Error running make   *** [6/8]
> 
> It compiled for me, but I have probably different environment...
> Patches are welcome, as always! :)
> 
> BR; Kimmo
> 
> > [1] though my compiler might be different because I'm trying once more
> > (stupidly) with scratchbox 1.0.5, because I need it for another
> > codebase, and I can't have two scratchboxes on one PC.
-- 
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Re: [maemo-developers] libosso svn up-to-date?

[Kimmo Hämäläinen]

On Wed, 2006-10-04 at 12:37, ext Murray Cumming wrote:
> Is the source in the maemo svn for libosso up to date?

Yes.

> I am surprised that there are no recent ChangeLog entries:
> https://stage.maemo.org/svn/maemo/projects/haf/trunk/libosso/ChangeLog

That's because I only use debian/changelog. ('svn diff' is enough, I
think.)

> and I have a build error [1]:
> 
> osso-init.c: In function `add_to_if_hash':
> osso-init.c:519: warning: passing arg 2 of `g_list_append' discards
> qualifiers from pointer target type
> osso-init.c:538: warning: passing arg 2 of `g_list_append' discards
> qualifiers from pointer target type
> osso-init.c: In function `_msg_handler_rm_cb_f':
> osso-init.c:709: error: assignment of read-only member `handlers'
> osso-init.c:736: error: assignment of read-only member `handlers'
> make[2]: *** [osso-init.lo] Error 1
> make[2]: Leaving directory `/home/murrayc/cvs/maemo/libosso/src'
> make[1]: *** [all-recursive] Error 1
> make[1]: Leaving directory `/home/murrayc/cvs/maemo/libosso'
> make: *** [all] Error 2
> *** error during stage build of libosso: Error running make   *** [6/8]

It compiled for me, but I have probably different environment...
Patches are welcome, as always! :)

BR; Kimmo

> [1] though my compiler might be different because I'm trying once more
> (stupidly) with scratchbox 1.0.5, because I need it for another
> codebase, and I can't have two scratchboxes on one PC.
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