Re: External Keyboard Recommendations
> Based on my 'research' the Freedom UBK is the one for me. The given page says its batteries last only around 80hours when on. Isn't it too short for a normal use ? ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
Re: External Keyboard Recommendations
On 6/24/08, Jeffrey Mark Siskind <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >Based on my 'research' the Freedom UBK is the one for me. It seems to >me it has a good smallness/usability ratio. I found a blog post about >it (in Swedish only I'm afraid) from a programmer (=used to typing) >who praised it. He used it with a palm device. Also, I seem to >remember someone mention using it with a N810 here on the list so it >should work. > > That might have been me. I have been using a Freedom Universal Bluetooth > Keyboard with my N810 since about January. I am very happy with it. As far > as > battery life, I have never noticed any problem. I can type into Emacs on the > N810 for at least 4 hours, while it is on WiFi or has a bluetooth connection > to my cellphone and not drain the battery. I charge my N810 every night and > basically it lasts for a whole day of use so long as I don't do compilations > etc. on it. The Freedom UBK runs on a pair of AAAs. They last for several > weeks/months of use. I keep a set of spares in my pocket. > > The crucial thing for me is that I keep my N810, a keyboard, and my > cellphone > (a Verizon RAZR 2 V9m on which I have the broadband access plan) in my > pocket > all of the time. That way I don't have to carry a laptop around. I have > Emacs > installed and I have a Debian sid chroot with LaTeX installed. I have three > different pocketable bluetooth keyboards: the Freedom UBK, an Elektex cloth > keyboard, and a Freedom Mini Duo. Each has its tradeoffs. > > Freedom Universal - This is the biggest of the three. It is by far the most > comfortable to type on. It is the only one that comes close to a normal > keyboard. But you need to be careful if you carry it in your pocket. If you > sit in certain kinds of chairs (narrow ones that have arms, particularly > airplane seats) with the keyboard in your pocket, it will put pressure on > the > keyboard and break it. I am on my second keboard for this reason. I am now > careful to always take keyboard out of my pocket when sitting. I also > usually > only carry this keyboard when I plan to do heavy typing. This keyboard runs > in > both SPP and HID mode. HID works out of the box with the N810 and SPP works > with the kbdd driver. Obviously HID is much better. > > Elektex - The is the most sturdy of the three for carrying in in your > pocket. > It won't break. And it folds/rolls up really small and flexible. Also runs > on > a pair of AAAs which last for weeks/months of use. But it only supports SPP. > I > had to write my own driver for it. (It is a patch for kbdd which is under > the > GPL. You can get it from the authors of kbdd.) The catch is that this > keyboard > only reliably detects single keypresses. No chording of shift/ctrl/alt with > other keys. So shift/ctrl/alt operate as prefix keys. And you have to adjust > your typing accordingly. Not so great for Emacs. The other thing is that > there > is no tactile or audio feedback on keypresses. So you have to type quite > determinately. Good for short messages but not great for long typing. > Finally, > the major issue is that after months of use, it got uncalibrated. (It > detects > the wrong position of touch for some of the keys.) It comes with software > for > recalibration but it only runs on certain cell phones and maybe Windows. The > protocol is proprietary (and I don't know it) so my driver doesn't support > it. > I haven't yet been able to recalibrate my keyboard. Until the recalibration > issue came up, I had been carrying this keyboard when I didn't anticipate > heavy use and the Freedom Universal when I did. > > Freedom Mini Duo - This is the smallest of the three. It supports both SPP > and > HID. HID works out of the box with the N810 and SPP works with the kbdd > driver. Obviously HID is better. I now carry this instead of the Elektex > when > I don't anticipate heavy use. It is small and comfortable to carry in your > pocket. And it comes with a pretty thickly padded protective case. It is so > small that it is not comfortable to type on for long text. But it is fine > for > short text. The problem with this keyboard is that it is discontinued. I > believe that they had quality control problems in manufacturing. I'm on my > second. My first stopped working after a few minutes/hours. And some of the > keys didn't work even before then. And I returned it under warranty. My > second > works. But some of the keys, while they work, are not mechanically sound > (i.e. the oilcan mechanism is partially depressed when not pressed). This > keyboard has internal rechargeable batteries that you recharge using a USB > cable. My first keyboard wouldn't recharge. I haven't yet tried to recharge > my > second keyboard as it hasn't run out yet. > > The good thing about the N810 is that you can set up the bluetooth to > automatically recognize multiple keyboards. I can easily switch between any > of > the above just by turning one off and another on. (You also need a men
External Keyboard Recommendations
Based on my 'research' the Freedom UBK is the one for me. It seems to me it has a good smallness/usability ratio. I found a blog post about it (in Swedish only I'm afraid) from a programmer (=used to typing) who praised it. He used it with a palm device. Also, I seem to remember someone mention using it with a N810 here on the list so it should work. That might have been me. I have been using a Freedom Universal Bluetooth Keyboard with my N810 since about January. I am very happy with it. As far as battery life, I have never noticed any problem. I can type into Emacs on the N810 for at least 4 hours, while it is on WiFi or has a bluetooth connection to my cellphone and not drain the battery. I charge my N810 every night and basically it lasts for a whole day of use so long as I don't do compilations etc. on it. The Freedom UBK runs on a pair of AAAs. They last for several weeks/months of use. I keep a set of spares in my pocket. The crucial thing for me is that I keep my N810, a keyboard, and my cellphone (a Verizon RAZR 2 V9m on which I have the broadband access plan) in my pocket all of the time. That way I don't have to carry a laptop around. I have Emacs installed and I have a Debian sid chroot with LaTeX installed. I have three different pocketable bluetooth keyboards: the Freedom UBK, an Elektex cloth keyboard, and a Freedom Mini Duo. Each has its tradeoffs. Freedom Universal - This is the biggest of the three. It is by far the most comfortable to type on. It is the only one that comes close to a normal keyboard. But you need to be careful if you carry it in your pocket. If you sit in certain kinds of chairs (narrow ones that have arms, particularly airplane seats) with the keyboard in your pocket, it will put pressure on the keyboard and break it. I am on my second keboard for this reason. I am now careful to always take keyboard out of my pocket when sitting. I also usually only carry this keyboard when I plan to do heavy typing. This keyboard runs in both SPP and HID mode. HID works out of the box with the N810 and SPP works with the kbdd driver. Obviously HID is much better. Elektex - The is the most sturdy of the three for carrying in in your pocket. It won't break. And it folds/rolls up really small and flexible. Also runs on a pair of AAAs which last for weeks/months of use. But it only supports SPP. I had to write my own driver for it. (It is a patch for kbdd which is under the GPL. You can get it from the authors of kbdd.) The catch is that this keyboard only reliably detects single keypresses. No chording of shift/ctrl/alt with other keys. So shift/ctrl/alt operate as prefix keys. And you have to adjust your typing accordingly. Not so great for Emacs. The other thing is that there is no tactile or audio feedback on keypresses. So you have to type quite determinately. Good for short messages but not great for long typing. Finally, the major issue is that after months of use, it got uncalibrated. (It detects the wrong position of touch for some of the keys.) It comes with software for recalibration but it only runs on certain cell phones and maybe Windows. The protocol is proprietary (and I don't know it) so my driver doesn't support it. I haven't yet been able to recalibrate my keyboard. Until the recalibration issue came up, I had been carrying this keyboard when I didn't anticipate heavy use and the Freedom Universal when I did. Freedom Mini Duo - This is the smallest of the three. It supports both SPP and HID. HID works out of the box with the N810 and SPP works with the kbdd driver. Obviously HID is better. I now carry this instead of the Elektex when I don't anticipate heavy use. It is small and comfortable to carry in your pocket. And it comes with a pretty thickly padded protective case. It is so small that it is not comfortable to type on for long text. But it is fine for short text. The problem with this keyboard is that it is discontinued. I believe that they had quality control problems in manufacturing. I'm on my second. My first stopped working after a few minutes/hours. And some of the keys didn't work even before then. And I returned it under warranty. My second works. But some of the keys, while they work, are not mechanically sound (i.e. the oilcan mechanism is partially depressed when not pressed). This keyboard has internal rechargeable batteries that you recharge using a USB cable. My first keyboard wouldn't recharge. I haven't yet tried to recharge my second keyboard as it hasn't run out yet. The good thing about the N810 is that you can set up the bluetooth to automatically recognize multiple keyboards. I can easily switch between any of the above just by turning one off and another on. (You also need a menu click to enable/disable the kbdd SPP driver.) In short, if you want a keyboard that you can carry sturdily in your pocket and be able to comfortably type long texts, unfortunately there is no current solution. The above three come closest
Re: External Keyboard Recommendations
En/na Hal Vaughan ha escrit: > I'll have to keep tabs on it and see when they get them back in stock. Don't count on it, it's been out of stock for months. It is possible that they get a different one though. > > Is that site a reliable one to order from -- judging from anyone's > experience here? I've placed 3 orders and up until now I had no problems with them. Delivery can take a long time (especially if they send part of the order via air-mail, quick, and the rest via ordinary mail, not so quick). Bye -- Luca ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
Re: External Keyboard Recommendations
> Theoretically, bluetooth drains the battery, but even a USB keyboard > has to use *some* juice, and I've used my bluetooth GPS receiver with > my N800 all day without draining the battery. I really don't think > that battery life is an issue. > That's good to know. Anyone with a different experience? > I've done a lot of research (articles, reviews) and online shopping, > and if I could afford it the one I would get would be the "Freedom > Universal Bluetooth Keyboard". It has the distinction of having > greater compatibility with more different devices, is sturdier and has > separate function keys, but also is slightly larger. The cheapest I've > found it is here: > Based on my 'research' the Freedom UBK is the one for me. It seems to me it has a good smallness/usability ratio. I found a blog post about it (in Swedish only I'm afraid) from a programmer (=used to typing) who praised it. He used it with a palm device. Also, I seem to remember someone mention using it with a N810 here on the list so it should work. Based on the different thoughts/experiences/opinions on this list I have decided to go for BT rather than USB. The point for me is to reduce the amount of stuff I need to carry when travelling and even a small USB dongle is still one extra thing to remember not to forget :) Thanks! /H ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
Re: External Keyboard Recommendations
On Monday 23 June 2008, Luca Olivetti wrote: > En/na Mark ha escrit: > > Correct. There are some "roll-up" keyboards, but those aren't ideal > > for the reasons discussed, and I've never seen a hard plastic USB > > keyboard that folds up. > > There's this one (it's sold out but probably looking around you can > find it somewhere else): > http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.3731 > It's not much cheaper than a bt one though. > > Bye That looks a LOT like the iGo Stowaway and with the name, I wonder if it's not the same hardware for USB. For that price, I could deal with getting that and the iGo BT one so I could experiment. I don't to that with everything but for a writer, the keyboard is pretty important! I'll have to keep tabs on it and see when they get them back in stock. Is that site a reliable one to order from -- judging from anyone's experience here? Hal ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
Re: External Keyboard Recommendations
On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 4:06 PM, <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > => Correct. There are some "roll-up" keyboards, but those aren't ideal > => for the reasons discussed, and I've never seen a hard plastic USB > => keyboard that folds up. > > I've got one, and I love it. Mine is an older model, originally meant for use > with Palm Pilots. It has good tactile feel, and it folds to about the size of > a > paperback book, about 1/4 the size of a regular keyboard. > > >http://shopping.yahoo.com/p:Palm m500 Portable > Keyboard:1990808602;_ylt=AugU7IngGkyIhCUjhfLPxHKVI74F;_ylu=X3oDMTA4ZXVyOWdvBHNlYwNyZWNv > Is that USB? I *have* seen these - or something very similar - before, but I thought they just had the proprietary Palm connector. > This kind of model is very hard to find now, but there are many hard plastic > USB keyboards that fold in 1/2: > > >http://shopping.yahoo.com/p:Toshiba Targus Universal USB Portable > Keyboard:1993566256;_ylt=ApzxWJ9rOXGg9eKrQctpiO6VI74F;_ylu=X3oDMTA4ZXVyOWdvBHNlYwNyZWNv >http://www.matias.ca/foldingkeyboard/ > > > http://secure.tabletkiosk.com/tkstore/pc/viewPrd.asp?idcategory=24&idproduct=165 > > The others look interesting, but at those prices I think I'll just save up for the bluetooth keyboard. I can't imagine why anybody would use one of them with a regular laptop - the built-in keyboard would be better. Mark ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
Re: External Keyboard Recommendations
En/na Mark ha escrit: > > Correct. There are some "roll-up" keyboards, but those aren't ideal > for the reasons discussed, and I've never seen a hard plastic USB > keyboard that folds up. There's this one (it's sold out but probably looking around you can find it somewhere else): http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.3731 It's not much cheaper than a bt one though. Bye -- Luca ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
Re: External Keyboard Recommendations
In the message dated: Mon, 23 Jun 2008 15:53:14 MDT, The pithy ruminations from Mark on were: => On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 3:35 PM, Hal Vaughan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: => > => > From what I've seen, including links provided, the USB keyboards don't => > seem to be fold-up and from what I can tell in terms of mass-market => > (which we all know dictates what is made and sold), the suit-and-tie => > crowd tends to go for the latest and that's BT from most viewpoints. => > It doesn't need a wire or dongle. => > => => Correct. There are some "roll-up" keyboards, but those aren't ideal => for the reasons discussed, and I've never seen a hard plastic USB => keyboard that folds up. I've got one, and I love it. Mine is an older model, originally meant for use with Palm Pilots. It has good tactile feel, and it folds to about the size of a paperback book, about 1/4 the size of a regular keyboard. http://shopping.yahoo.com/p:Palm m500 Portable Keyboard:1990808602;_ylt=AugU7IngGkyIhCUjhfLPxHKVI74F;_ylu=X3oDMTA4ZXVyOWdvBHNlYwNyZWNv This kind of model is very hard to find now, but there are many hard plastic USB keyboards that fold in 1/2: http://shopping.yahoo.com/p:Toshiba Targus Universal USB Portable Keyboard:1993566256;_ylt=ApzxWJ9rOXGg9eKrQctpiO6VI74F;_ylu=X3oDMTA4ZXVyOWdvBHNlYwNyZWNv http://www.matias.ca/foldingkeyboard/ http://secure.tabletkiosk.com/tkstore/pc/viewPrd.asp?idcategory=24&idproduct=165 ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
Re: External Keyboard Recommendations
On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 3:53 PM, Mark <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I've done a lot of research (articles, reviews) and online shopping, > and if I could afford it the one I would get would be the "Freedom > Universal Bluetooth Keyboard". It has the distinction of having > greater compatibility with more different devices, is sturdier and has > separate function keys, Correction: that should have read "number keys" - it has the row of dedicated number keys across the top, but no dedicated fn keys. I have a folding IR keyboard for my PalmOS device (too bad the tablet doesn't have IR, but then there's no driver for it anyway), and I've found that having to hit a special key to get numerals is a PITA. It certainly brings touch-typing to a screeching halt. Mark ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
Re: External Keyboard Recommendations
On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 02:20:21PM -0700, Gary wrote: > > Here are some unanswered questions re USB vs BT keyboards; power > consumption? How many USB keyboards can be powered by AAA cells? OK. I admit it. My favourite keyboard (alphasmart, USB) needs AA cells -- three of them. But it lasts nine months between battery replacements. -- hendrik ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
Re: External Keyboard Recommendations
On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 3:35 PM, Hal Vaughan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > From what I've seen, including links provided, the USB keyboards don't > seem to be fold-up and from what I can tell in terms of mass-market > (which we all know dictates what is made and sold), the suit-and-tie > crowd tends to go for the latest and that's BT from most viewpoints. > It doesn't need a wire or dongle. > Correct. There are some "roll-up" keyboards, but those aren't ideal for the reasons discussed, and I've never seen a hard plastic USB keyboard that folds up. > However, someone did point out that BT drains the battery. I'm not sure > on that. I don't have enough experience to be sure. > Theoretically, bluetooth drains the battery, but even a USB keyboard has to use *some* juice, and I've used my bluetooth GPS receiver with my N800 all day without draining the battery. I really don't think that battery life is an issue. > ... > I can type pretty fast and have not seen a BT keyboard get behind me, > but I've got limited experience. > > So far if I can find the iGo Stowaway (and it looks like they're at > B&H), that is my preferred choice. I can fold it up small, which means > I can carry it and my N770 in a small case that might even fit in a > large pocket. A lot of people missed that not only do I want full > sized but small when folded. Yes, I want it all! > > > And, to all, yes, I do appreciate all the comments and suggestions. I'm > still musing on this. > > Hal I've done a lot of research (articles, reviews) and online shopping, and if I could afford it the one I would get would be the "Freedom Universal Bluetooth Keyboard". It has the distinction of having greater compatibility with more different devices, is sturdier and has separate function keys, but also is slightly larger. The cheapest I've found it is here: http://www.originalwirelessaccessories.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=UNIKEY&click=1641 ...or does somebody have a different opinion about that particular model? Mark ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
Re: External Keyboard Recommendations
On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 03:12:14PM -0600, Mark wrote: > On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 1:37 PM, Marius Gedminas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > The most important thing to remember > > is to use maemo-gtk-im-switch to re-enable the vkb *before* you unplug the > > USB keyboard. (That was about using USB keyboards with OS2006 on a Nokia 770.) > If you use a USB keyboard (and I hear a bluetooth keyboard does the > same thing), if you unplug the external keyboard the on-screen stylus > keyboard will no longer come up unless you reboot. It was not a problem with a Bluetooth keyboard and my N800. It was a problem with a USB keyboard and my N810. (The nice thing about USB and the N810 is that you don't need power injectors, "just" a female-to-female USB adapter.) I haven't tested the other combinations (and cannot test now, as the three AA batteries in my BT keyboard are dead, and I don't have a N800 any more). > (The thumb > keyboard will still come up if you press the center button on the > D-pad.) I believe this is for the N810 as well as the N800, and > probably the N770 as well. Is the solution for that to type > "maemo-gtk-im-switch osso-input-method" into xterm? maemo-gtk-im-switch doesn't exist in OS2008, so I don't know the solution. Marius Gedminas -- Si fractum non sit, noli id reficere. signature.asc Description: Digital signature ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
Re: External Keyboard Recommendations
On Monday 23 June 2008, Gary wrote: > Nobody's made a compelling argument for USB so let me take a guess > why they're suggesting it; > > 1. ubiquity. there 10 hojillion keyboards of every shape, size and > flavor out there, including compact units all the way up to high tech > fancy devices like the Virtual Laser Keyboard or custom keyboards > that cost over US$4000 (happy hacking). > > 2. cost. there are also several cheap USB keyboards available. > > 3. compact. i'd wager there are more compact USB keyboards than there > are compact BT keyboards but that's just a wild-ass guess. >From what I've seen, including links provided, the USB keyboards don't seem to be fold-up and from what I can tell in terms of mass-market (which we all know dictates what is made and sold), the suit-and-tie crowd tends to go for the latest and that's BT from most viewpoints. It doesn't need a wire or dongle. However, someone did point out that BT drains the battery. I'm not sure on that. I don't have enough experience to be sure. ... > Here are some unanswered questions re USB vs BT keyboards; power > consumption? How many USB keyboards can be powered by AAA cells? Are > you typing faster than BT can transfer your keystrokes? Does Bill > Gates have night terrors about Tux the penguin? I can type pretty fast and have not seen a BT keyboard get behind me, but I've got limited experience. So far if I can find the iGo Stowaway (and it looks like they're at B&H), that is my preferred choice. I can fold it up small, which means I can carry it and my N770 in a small case that might even fit in a large pocket. A lot of people missed that not only do I want full sized but small when folded. Yes, I want it all! And, to all, yes, I do appreciate all the comments and suggestions. I'm still musing on this. Hal ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
Re: External Keyboard Recommendations
On Jun 23, 2008, at 5:12 PM, Mark wrote: > On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 1:37 PM, Marius Gedminas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote: > >> The most important thing to remember >> is to use maemo-gtk-im-switch to re-enable the vkb *before* you >> unplug the >> USB keyboard. > > If you use a USB keyboard (and I hear a bluetooth keyboard does the > same thing), if you unplug the external keyboard the on-screen stylus > keyboard will no longer come up unless you reboot. (The thumb > keyboard will still come up if you press the center button on the > D-pad.) I believe this is for the N810 as well as the N800, and > probably the N770 as well. Is the solution for that to type > "maemo-gtk-im-switch osso-input-method" into xterm? This only applies to USB keyboards. ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
Re: External Keyboard Recommendations
On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 2:59 PM, Henrik Frisk <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hi, > > I've been following this thread with some interest since I'm been > looking around for a while for a keyboard for my n810. If I understand > it correctly, most of you suggest a USB keyboard rather than a > Bluetooth. Is battery time the primary reason? > > I'm still somewhat confused when it comes to what exactly is needed to > connect a keyboard to the n810. Do I need a specially soldered cable > or will a micro type A -> Female type A USB cable be enough (= gender > change to the USB cable included with the n810)? > > Thanks, > > /Henrik > I doubt that battery life would be the primary reason. I think it's more a matter of reliability and cost. The USB ones are also larger and more finger-friendly (but less portable). I have seen at least one teensy USB "finger keyboard" that is similar to a qwerty smartphone keyboard. I don't find that useful, but some might. You don't need a custom cable if you can find an adapter that will allow you to plug your keyboard into your tablet. I made my own cable because it cost me nothing and puts a little less stress on that tiny jack than one big molded adapter would. It's a good idea to test to be certain, but in my case the colors on the inner conductors matched up perfectly between the two completely different cables I spliced together to make my adapter. "It's not rocket science." :-) Mark ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
Re: External Keyboard Recommendations
Nobody's made a compelling argument for USB so let me take a guess why they're suggesting it; 1. ubiquity. there 10 hojillion keyboards of every shape, size and flavor out there, including compact units all the way up to high tech fancy devices like the Virtual Laser Keyboard or custom keyboards that cost over US$4000 (happy hacking). 2. cost. there are also several cheap USB keyboards available. 3. compact. i'd wager there are more compact USB keyboards than there are compact BT keyboards but that's just a wild-ass guess. Here are a few arguments in favor of Bluetooth keyboards. 1. wireless. in fact, the spec is designed not to interfere with 802.11; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bluetooth#Air_interface Only downsize I can see of a BT board; vendor support. if the maker goes away, so does your warranty, etc. Same could be said for the virtual laser WiFi toilet seat cover you just bought on eBay or the $10k Dvorak headmount retina burning plutonium powered apparatus that you bought from a Silicon Valley black market smuggler. Here are some unanswered questions re USB vs BT keyboards; power consumption? How many USB keyboards can be powered by AAA cells? Are you typing faster than BT can transfer your keystrokes? Does Bill Gates have night terrors about Tux the penguin? That said, I'd recommend both the Apple BT keyboard (big, not foldable, but built like a brick shithouse) or the Nokia SU-8W (small, could be fragile or sturdy but I've been careful with mine, folds up to roughly same size as N770 or N800 but a bit thicker -- fits perfectly in a camera bag I use to hold both). -Gary ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
Re: External Keyboard Recommendations
On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 1:37 PM, Marius Gedminas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > The most important thing to remember > is to use maemo-gtk-im-switch to re-enable the vkb *before* you unplug the > USB keyboard. If you use a USB keyboard (and I hear a bluetooth keyboard does the same thing), if you unplug the external keyboard the on-screen stylus keyboard will no longer come up unless you reboot. (The thumb keyboard will still come up if you press the center button on the D-pad.) I believe this is for the N810 as well as the N800, and probably the N770 as well. Is the solution for that to type "maemo-gtk-im-switch osso-input-method" into xterm? > Personally, I've discovered that using the on-screen virtual keyboard > was more convenient (for me) than lugging around extra cables, > keyboards, and assembling everything. > The onscreen keyboard works great for anything except extended typing or working in the command line. I find it very cumbersome in those cases. Also, for anyone with an N800, fennec (Firefox 3 alpha) is completely unusable because it doesn't interact with the onscreen keyboard - a hardware keyboard is mandatory. Mark ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
Re: External Keyboard Recommendations
Hi, I've been following this thread with some interest since I'm been looking around for a while for a keyboard for my n810. If I understand it correctly, most of you suggest a USB keyboard rather than a Bluetooth. Is battery time the primary reason? I'm still somewhat confused when it comes to what exactly is needed to connect a keyboard to the n810. Do I need a specially soldered cable or will a micro type A -> Female type A USB cable be enough (= gender change to the USB cable included with the n810)? Thanks, /Henrik On 6/23/08, Marius Gedminas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 10:37:28PM +0300, Marius Gedminas wrote: >> Personally, I've discovered that using the on-screen virtual keyboard >> was more convenient (for me) than lugging around extra cables, >> keyboards, and assembling everything. >> >> Heck, since then I've discovered that I'd rather use the on-screen vkb >> than get off my backside and go pull out an Apple Wireless Bluetooth >> keyboard from the desk drawer. >> >> These days I often prefer the on-screen virtual keyboard because I'm too >> lazy to slide the N810's hardware keyboard out. > > I should perhaps clarify that I'm a heavy vim user, and in vim thinking > is more important than typing. > > Marius Gedminas > -- > Photons have energy, and trying to cram too many into too small of a space > can > cause a black hole to form, which is, needless to say, not a desirable trait > for an optical computer. > -- http://scottaaronson.com/blog/?p=261#comment-13693 > ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
Re: External Keyboard Recommendations
On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 10:37:28PM +0300, Marius Gedminas wrote: > Personally, I've discovered that using the on-screen virtual keyboard > was more convenient (for me) than lugging around extra cables, > keyboards, and assembling everything. > > Heck, since then I've discovered that I'd rather use the on-screen vkb > than get off my backside and go pull out an Apple Wireless Bluetooth > keyboard from the desk drawer. > > These days I often prefer the on-screen virtual keyboard because I'm too > lazy to slide the N810's hardware keyboard out. I should perhaps clarify that I'm a heavy vim user, and in vim thinking is more important than typing. Marius Gedminas -- Photons have energy, and trying to cram too many into too small of a space can cause a black hole to form, which is, needless to say, not a desirable trait for an optical computer. -- http://scottaaronson.com/blog/?p=261#comment-13693 signature.asc Description: Digital signature ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
Re: External Keyboard Recommendations
On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 11:41:16AM -0600, Mark wrote: > The reason I asked about USB host mode on the N770 is that I don't see > any "USB Control" or similar apps for OS2006. A further search comes > up with this: http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=6802 > and this: http://osdir.com/ml/handhelds.maemo.user/2006-04/msg00141.html > so USB host mode does work with the N770, but may not be as easy as > with the later models, and may require flashing a different version of > the OS. USB host mode works for the N770, without any need to flash nonstandard OSes or kernels. All you need is to solder up a non-standard USB power injector. I've done that: http://mg.pov.lt/blog/n770-usb-power.html The original instructions come from Thoughtfix: http://tabletblog.com/2006/01/usb-power-injector-2.html Some people have also reported success with using a powered USB hub, but AFAIU this relies on finding a hub that explicitly violates the USB spec (by supplying power to the uplink port) or something like that. Also, while reading this thread I noticed a mention of walking around in the woods. Not a lot of power sockets in the woods. I'm sure USB Control could be ported to OS2006, but until that happens you'd have to gain root and issue cryptic shell commands. The old Maemo wiki had them described somewhere[1]. The most important thing to remember is to use maemo-gtk-im-switch to re-enable the vkb *before* you unplug the USB keyboard. Another thing to remember is that the 770 doesn't support keyboard LEDs, so don't test whether everything works by repeatedly pressing CapsLock and waiting for the little LED to light up. [1] http://test.maemo.org/maemowiki/HowTo_SetupKeyboard You can ignore most of it (the Bluetooth bits or how to define a custom keyboard layout with xmodmap), but the bits about maemo-gk-im-switch are relevant, and the bits about matchbox's kbdconfig are useful. Personally, I've discovered that using the on-screen virtual keyboard was more convenient (for me) than lugging around extra cables, keyboards, and assembling everything. Heck, since then I've discovered that I'd rather use the on-screen vkb than get off my backside and go pull out an Apple Wireless Bluetooth keyboard from the desk drawer. These days I often prefer the on-screen virtual keyboard because I'm too lazy to slide the N810's hardware keyboard out. HTH, Marius Gedminas -- If you are good, you will be assigned all the work. If you are real good, you will get out of it. signature.asc Description: Digital signature ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
Re: External Keyboard Recommendations
On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 12:41 PM, Mark <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Yes, portability is a big issue. Unfortunately, for me price is an > even bigger issue, and I can't afford to pay 2/3 of what I paid for > the tablet just for a folding bluetooth keyboard. > > The reason I asked about USB host mode on the N770 is that I don't see > any "USB Control" or similar apps for OS2006. A further search comes > up with this: http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=6802 > and this: http://osdir.com/ml/handhelds.maemo.user/2006-04/msg00141.html > so USB host mode does work with the N770, but may not be as easy as > with the later models, and may require flashing a different version of > the OS. Well, if your still interested in getting a USB kb, I'd highly recommend the 2366: http://cgi.ebay.com/USB-PS-2-Super-Mini-2366-Small-Multimedia-Keyboard_W0QQitemZ150261711024QQihZ005QQcategoryZ4706QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem Cheap, small, works. HTH -- GROG! ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
Re: External Keyboard Recommendations
On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 10:34 AM, Hal Vaughan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > The only problem with those is that they don't fold up. I'm looking at > taking this with me in the woods and through the more natural parks of > the area and even when I go up in the mountains, so I want something > that folds up that I can stuff in a small (as small as possible) case > with my N770. > Yes, portability is a big issue. Unfortunately, for me price is an even bigger issue, and I can't afford to pay 2/3 of what I paid for the tablet just for a folding bluetooth keyboard. The reason I asked about USB host mode on the N770 is that I don't see any "USB Control" or similar apps for OS2006. A further search comes up with this: http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=6802 and this: http://osdir.com/ml/handhelds.maemo.user/2006-04/msg00141.html so USB host mode does work with the N770, but may not be as easy as with the later models, and may require flashing a different version of the OS. Mark ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
Re: External Keyboard Recommendations
On Monday 23 June 2008, you wrote: > On Sun, Jun 22, 2008 at 3:39 PM, Hal Vaughan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > I had to shelve a lot of what I was doing and now I'm at the point > > where I want to get an external keyboard to replace the iGo one I > > have, which is cramped. > > I have a compact Gyration wireless USB keyboard that I've been using > with my N800, which works great but is a little inconvenient because > you still have the wire for the receiver, but it's hanging free with > the weight of the receiver on the end. The other thing is that there > apparently are no mouse drivers in the tablet OS, so the mouse > doesn't work. I've been looking for a reasonably priced bluetooth > keyboard, but such a thing apparently doesn't exist. So, I think the > best option is one of the small USB keyboards, like this: > http://www.cyberguys.com/templates/SearchDetail.asp?productID=7599 or > this: > http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp? >EdpNo=1388872&CatId=142 . The only problem with those is that they don't fold up. I'm looking at taking this with me in the woods and through the more natural parks of the area and even when I go up in the mountains, so I want something that folds up that I can stuff in a small (as small as possible) case with my N770. > The roll-up keyboards are great if you have a solid flat surface on > which to set them, but I tend to want/need to use it on my lap or > other soft, uneven surfaces. Also, it would be a simple matter on one > of the rigid units to rig up a holder on the keyboard itself for the > tablet. Yeah, I figured a folding keyboard that comes out flat would be just perfect because all I need is a place to sit and type, not a flat surface. > Do the 770s have USB host mode? There's no point in discussing > anything USB if they don't. I don't know. Anyone know? Hal ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
Re: External Keyboard Recommendations
On Sun, Jun 22, 2008 at 3:39 PM, Hal Vaughan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I had to shelve a lot of what I was doing and now I'm at the point where > I want to get an external keyboard to replace the iGo one I have, which > is cramped. I have a compact Gyration wireless USB keyboard that I've been using with my N800, which works great but is a little inconvenient because you still have the wire for the receiver, but it's hanging free with the weight of the receiver on the end. The other thing is that there apparently are no mouse drivers in the tablet OS, so the mouse doesn't work. I've been looking for a reasonably priced bluetooth keyboard, but such a thing apparently doesn't exist. So, I think the best option is one of the small USB keyboards, like this: http://www.cyberguys.com/templates/SearchDetail.asp?productID=7599 or this: http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=1388872&CatId=142 . The roll-up keyboards are great if you have a solid flat surface on which to set them, but I tend to want/need to use it on my lap or other soft, uneven surfaces. Also, it would be a simple matter on one of the rigid units to rig up a holder on the keyboard itself for the tablet. Do the 770s have USB host mode? There's no point in discussing anything USB if they don't. Mark ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
Re: External Keyboard Recommendations
ext Hal Vaughan wrote: > I had to shelve a lot of what I was doing and now I'm at the point where > I want to get an external keyboard to replace the iGo one I have, which > is cramped. I know several people strongly recommended the iGo > Stowaway (not the Ultra Slim, but the regular one), however, within the > past few months, iGo has gone over to all power supplies and such. I'm > trying to find a Stowaway, but the only dealer with one on Amazon has > poor ratings and the dealers I checked through Google that have them in > stock (or claim to) don't have good ratings either. One does say it's > not in stock and they'll order it, but the people at iGo don't have > anymore, so I don't trust that. > > Yes, I'm trying eBay. We'll see. > > So any recommendations on external keyboards? What I liked about the > Stowaway was that it didn't just fold in half, so it'd fold to smaller > than my N770 and carrying both in a small case would be easy. And, > even more importantly, from what I hear, it felt like a "real" keyboard > when in use. I'm a writer and I don't like laptops and, when possible, > prefer a natural keyboard (yeah, like I'm going to find a folding > bluetooth natural keyboard!), so what I'd rather do is just find a good > keyboard to go with my N770 so I can head for the park or go down by > the river and be poetical in poetic places. ;-) > > So any recommendations on bluetooth external keyboards since the > Stowaway seems to have been taken off the market? Or anyone want to > sell theirs if it's in good condition? > I have good experience with Apple wireless bluetooth keyboard. http://www.apple.com/keyboard/ It is not so small than these mobile keyboards but it has full size keyboard feeling with reasonable size to carry with. Kate > I finally have time to do more than bust my tail at my computer while > wrestling with Perl, C++, or Java code and I just want to get out, but > I like being able to stop and write when I take breaks, so a good > keyboard with a good feel to it is a big deal to me. > > Thanks! > > Hal > ___ > maemo-users mailing list > maemo-users@maemo.org > https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users > > ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
Re: External Keyboard Recommendations
On Sun, Jun 22, 2008 at 11:34:04PM +0100, Matt Emson wrote: > Hal Vaughan wrote: > > So any recommendations on [...] external keyboards since the > > Stowaway seems to have been taken off the market? > > Yes, buy a OTG dongle and go USB. Bluetooth is a PITA. USB works really What is an OTG dongle, and where do I get one? (I'm in Canada) My favourite keyboard is USB -- an Alphasmart. (Aside from feeling good, it has approximately a 1 megabyte memory for storing your text until you get to a computer, and its battery life under normal use is about 9 months.) It would be good to use with the N800. > well. The adapter will cost you less than $10 is you shop around, the > keyboard - well, however much you are willing to pay. The world is your > oyster. I've personally got a wired micro keyboard, bought from Maplin > in the UK, and have also used a Logitech wireless USB keyboard. I would > never in a million years use Bluetooth now. > > M > ___ > maemo-users mailing list > maemo-users@maemo.org > https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
Re: External Keyboard Recommendations
Matt's right, don't use BT. I'm using one of two KB's both are USB. One's a roll-up plastic/rubber one, nice to take on the road, and the others a "normal" US 101 key. Don't have a wireless one to play with, but would not use Bluetooth since it drains the battery. HtH, Denis On Sun, Jun 22, 2008 at 4:34 PM, Matt Emson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hal Vaughan wrote: > > So any recommendations on [...] external keyboards since the > > Stowaway seems to have been taken off the market? > > Yes, buy a OTG dongle and go USB. Bluetooth is a PITA. USB works really > well. The adapter will cost you less than $10 is you shop around, the > keyboard - well, however much you are willing to pay. The world is your > oyster. I've personally got a wired micro keyboard, bought from Maplin > in the UK, and have also used a Logitech wireless USB keyboard. I would > never in a million years use Bluetooth now. > > M > ___ > maemo-users mailing list > maemo-users@maemo.org > https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users > ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
Re: External Keyboard Recommendations
Hal Vaughan wrote: > So any recommendations on [...] external keyboards since the > Stowaway seems to have been taken off the market? Yes, buy a OTG dongle and go USB. Bluetooth is a PITA. USB works really well. The adapter will cost you less than $10 is you shop around, the keyboard - well, however much you are willing to pay. The world is your oyster. I've personally got a wired micro keyboard, bought from Maplin in the UK, and have also used a Logitech wireless USB keyboard. I would never in a million years use Bluetooth now. M ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
External Keyboard Recommendations
I had to shelve a lot of what I was doing and now I'm at the point where I want to get an external keyboard to replace the iGo one I have, which is cramped. I know several people strongly recommended the iGo Stowaway (not the Ultra Slim, but the regular one), however, within the past few months, iGo has gone over to all power supplies and such. I'm trying to find a Stowaway, but the only dealer with one on Amazon has poor ratings and the dealers I checked through Google that have them in stock (or claim to) don't have good ratings either. One does say it's not in stock and they'll order it, but the people at iGo don't have anymore, so I don't trust that. Yes, I'm trying eBay. We'll see. So any recommendations on external keyboards? What I liked about the Stowaway was that it didn't just fold in half, so it'd fold to smaller than my N770 and carrying both in a small case would be easy. And, even more importantly, from what I hear, it felt like a "real" keyboard when in use. I'm a writer and I don't like laptops and, when possible, prefer a natural keyboard (yeah, like I'm going to find a folding bluetooth natural keyboard!), so what I'd rather do is just find a good keyboard to go with my N770 so I can head for the park or go down by the river and be poetical in poetic places. ;-) So any recommendations on bluetooth external keyboards since the Stowaway seems to have been taken off the market? Or anyone want to sell theirs if it's in good condition? I finally have time to do more than bust my tail at my computer while wrestling with Perl, C++, or Java code and I just want to get out, but I like being able to stop and write when I take breaks, so a good keyboard with a good feel to it is a big deal to me. Thanks! Hal ___ maemo-users mailing list maemo-users@maemo.org https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
