Re: [Mailman-Users] Help with Mailman and Sendmail

[Mark Sapiro]

David Abrahams wrote:
>
>Pardon me, but isn't the GID with which to execute cgi scripts?  Or
>are you saying that mailman's CGI scripts need to execute with the
>same GID as sendmail?  If so, why?


Mailman's CGI scripts must run as group 'mailman' (or whatever is
specified as the mailman group). Therefore, the wrappers are in the
mailman group and SETGID.

For security reasons (to prevent anyone from running a wrapper), the
wrappers check to be sure the original group of the caller was the
expected group. It's this expected GID that is set via the
--with-cgi-gid option to configure, but as you note, you are
installing a packaged Mailman (a FreeBSD port) so this really doesn't
apply, at least if the packager set it up right.

See


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Re: [Mailman-Users] Help with Mailman and Sendmail

[Mark Sapiro]

David Abrahams wrote:
>
>Say, if I really want to distinguish lists.mydomain.com from
>mydomain.com, is there any reason I can't still set up a virtual mail
>host and tack an automated updating of the virtusers file as shown in
>http://www.ddj.com/dept/architect/184413752?pgno=4 onto
>/usr/local/sbin/mailman.aliases ?


I think you'd be OK (I'm not particularly knowledgeable about sendmail
virtual domains). One word of caution; the article you refer to is
written for Mailman 2.0.x, not 2.1.x.

Note that if you were to put

POSTFIX_VIRTUAL_DOMAINS = ['lists.mydomain.com'] in mm_cfg.py, the
genaliases/list create/list delete process will maintain
data/virtual-mailman in the same manner as data/aliases and run
POSTFIX_MAP_CMD to update the virtual maps. POSTFIX_MAP_CMD could be
set up analogously to POSTFIX_ALIAS_CMD.

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Re: [Mailman-Users] New Mailman Installation - Can't Send Email toaNewList(reformatted)

[Mark Sapiro]

Jeff Salisbury wrote:
>>   
>Mark,  Ok, I added these lines at the end of the mm_cfg.py file:
>
>DEFAULT_URL_HOST = 'www.domain1.net'
>DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST = 'mail.domain1.net'
>VIRTUAL_HOSTS.clear()
>add_virtualhost(DEFAULT_URL_HOST, DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST)
>add_virtualhost(DEFAULT_URL_HOST, 'mail.domain2.net')


This doesn't work. You can't have two different Mailman virtual domains
with the same web domain (url_host). The

add_virtualhost(DEFAULT_URL_HOST, 'mail.domain2.net')

entry simply replaces the

add_virtualhost(DEFAULT_URL_HOST, DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST)

entry in VIRTUAL_HOSTS because they have the same url_host which is the
key in the dictionary entry so you wind up with with only the second
entry.

What this means is all lists created from the www.domain1.net domain,
at least via web create will wind up with mail.domain2.net as their
host_name. You may be able to work around this by changing (or at
least verifying) the host_name attribute on the list's admin General
Options page, but if you really have lists in domain1 and domain2, why
do you want to access the web interface via domain1 for all lists? Or
do you really want the second add_virtualhost to be

add_virtualhost('www.domain2.net', 'mail.domain2.net')


>Then, I ran the command below that refresh the mailman system:
>
>bin/withlist -l -a -r fix_url --
>
>Then, I verified that the file virtual-mailman had been populated.  
>Looks good so far...


OK, but are you sure the lists are in the correct domains in
virtual_mailman. The above withlist command will put all lists in the
DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST (mail.domain1.net) domain.


>Now, how do I restart or "refresh" the Postfix system?


If you ran bin/genaliases, that process should run the
POSTFIX_ALIAS_CMD (default '/usr/sbin/postalias') and POSTFIX_MAP_CMD
(default '/usr/sbin/postmap') commands which update aliases.db and
virtual-mailman.db which should be all you need.

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Re: [Mailman-Users] Help with Mailman and Sendmail

[David Abrahams]

David Abrahams <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

> Yep.  I was editing "boost.mc" so in /etc/mail I did
>
>   make boost.cf
>   cp boost.cf sendmail.cf
>   make restart

Problem solved: I was pointing sendmail at the wrong path for the
mailman.aliases file.  

[/etc/aliases was just a symlink to
/etc/mail/aliases, so I was pointing sendmail at
/etc/mail/mailman.aliases, but of course that was wrong.  I needed to
be specifying /etc/mailman.aliases.]

Anyway, thanks very much; it all seems to be working now.

Say, if I really want to distinguish lists.mydomain.com from
mydomain.com, is there any reason I can't still set up a virtual mail
host and tack an automated updating of the virtusers file as shown in
http://www.ddj.com/dept/architect/184413752?pgno=4 onto
/usr/local/sbin/mailman.aliases ?

Thanks again,

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Re: [Mailman-Users] Help with Mailman and Sendmail

[David Abrahams]

Pierre Forget <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

> Hi,
>
> If it can help. I had problems installing and integrating with sendmail.
>
> Culprit was that it needs to know under which group sendmail is
> used. So, look carefully in your sendmail.cf (DefaultUser) and make
> sure you compile mailman with the switch to include this group for :
>
> --with-cgi-gid=group

Pardon me, but isn't the GID with which to execute cgi scripts?  Or
are you saying that mailman's CGI scripts need to execute with the
same GID as sendmail?  If so, why?

> and make an install user 

An install user?

> that is part of the mailman group to install
> the mailman software.

I installed mailman using a FreeBSD port, which means I don't get to
do most of those things manually; the port takes care of all that and
I don't get control between configure and make install.


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Re: [Mailman-Users] Help with Mailman and Sendmail

[David Abrahams]

Mark Sapiro <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

> David Abrahams wrote:
>>
>>Uh-huh.  But now I have all the products mentioned in step 5 except
>>for mailman.aliases.db.  I guess 2 out of 3 ain't bad, but... any
>>clues?
>
>
> If /etc/mailman.aliases is properly referenced in the sendmail
> configuration, the /usr/bin/newaliases command in the
> /usr/bin/newaliases script should create/update the
> /etc/mailman.aliases.db file.
>
> Did you remember "Run a make (or otherwise refresh sendmail.cf and then
> restart sendmail" from step 3?

Yep.  I was editing "boost.mc" so in /etc/mail I did

  make boost.cf
  cp boost.cf sendmail.cf
  make restart

Another problem I'm been having is the inability to get past the end
of 

  http://www.gnu.org/software/mailman/mailman-install/node40.html

i.e. 

 review the site list's configuration via the admin pages.
 You should also subscribe yourself to the site list. 


<20 minutes of flailing later>...oooh, http://my-domain/mailman/admin
works

I guess it would be good if the instructions would tell me how to find
that :)

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Re: [Mailman-Users] failed to send out message when posting to a list

[Mark Sapiro]

Jana Nguyen wrote:
>
>I'm using postfix with mailman and I can't post mail to the mailing list.
>I can subscribe to a list, both I and the owner of the mailing list get 
>an email notifications.  But I do not receive email when
>posting to any of the mailing list that I created.


Do you receive other people's posts? Do others receive yours?


>I've checked the duplication email option on the admin interface are 
>unchecked.


This is not what controls this. The option that controls receiving your
own posts is "not metoo".


>Error message in /var/log/maillog:
>
>
>Dec  3 16:44:25 portal spamd[2960]: prefork: child states: II
>Dec  3 16:44:25 portal postfix/pipe[6362]: 95A5629A96: 
>to=<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, relay=spamfilter, delay=1, status=sent (dummy)
>Dec  3 16:44:25 portal postfix/qmgr[14320]: 95A5629A96: removed
>Dec  3 16:44:25 portal postfix/pickup[14319]: 8C9A929B4D: uid=520 
>from=<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Dec  3 16:44:25 portal postfix/cleanup[6361]: 8C9A929B4D: 
>message-id=<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Dec  3 16:44:25 portal postfix/qmgr[14320]: 8C9A929B4D: 
>from=<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, size=2194, nrcpt=1 (queue active)
>Dec  3 16:44:25 portal postfix/smtp[6370]: 8C9A929B4D: 
>to=<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, relay=bigiron.ucsd.edu[132.239.131.209], 
>delay=0, status=sent (250 ok:  Message 1826098 accepted)
>Dec  3 16:44:25 portal postfix/qmgr[14320]: 8C9A929B4D: removed


I don't see an error. I see a message sent to a spam filter and removed
from the queue and then a message relayed to bigiron.ucsd.edu and then
removed from the queue


>I used to were able to post to list, but after I changed the 
>DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST to not to be the same as my DEFAULT_URL_HOST, it 
>stopped working.

If you didn't run fix_url on the list, changing DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST
should do nothing. If you did run fix_url or otherwise change the
list's host_name attribute, this will affect the domain of the
envelope sender of posts which may affect acceptance by the MTA, but I
don't see this in the log.


>The entry in my /usr/local/mailman/Mailman is:


I assume you mean /usr/local/mailman/Mailman/mm_cfg.py


>MTA = 'Postfix'
>
>SMTPHOST = 'localhost'
>SMTPPORT = 25
>POSTFIX_ALIAS_CMD = '/usr/sbin/postalias'
>POSTFIX_MAP_CMD = '/usr/sbin/postmap'
>
>DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST = 'nbirn.net'
>DEFAULT_URL_HOST = 'portal.nbirn.net'
>
>add_virtualhost(DEFAULT_URL_HOST, DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST)


Seems OK.

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Re: [Mailman-Users] mbox files

[Paul Tomblin]

Quoting Mark Sapiro ([EMAIL PROTECTED]):
> Note that there is such a script already in the distribution. It is
> bin/cleanarch  which as Stephen notes, may or may not work for you.

Oh.  I wish I'd discovered this about 8 hours ago.

Oh well, file it away for next time.

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Re: [Mailman-Users] Another archive questions

[Mark Sapiro]

Paul Tomblin wrote:

>I noticed that the messages.html files only have 6 digits in them.  Does
>that mean that it will break when we reach 999,999 messages?  I'm already
>up over 300,000 on one of my lists.

It will go to 7 or more digits as required by the sequence number, but
even if it didn't, it probably wouldn't matter as the rolled over
numbers wouldn't be in the same (default=monthly, max=yearly) archive
volume.

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Re: [Mailman-Users] Help with Mailman and Sendmail

[Mark Sapiro]

David Abrahams wrote:
>
>Uh-huh.  But now I have all the products mentioned in step 5 except
>for mailman.aliases.db.  I guess 2 out of 3 ain't bad, but... any
>clues?


If /etc/mailman.aliases is properly referenced in the sendmail
configuration, the /usr/bin/newaliases command in the
/usr/bin/newaliases script should create/update the
/etc/mailman.aliases.db file.

Did you remember "Run a make (or otherwise refresh sendmail.cf and then
restart sendmail" from step 3?

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Re: [Mailman-Users] mbox files

[Mark Sapiro]

Stephen J. Turnbull wrote:
>
>I think the better approach is to do just what you did, and make a
>site-specific script to do From-munging.  Of course there's nothing
>wrong with putting them in a contrib section in the distribution; my
>worry is about changing bin/arch.


Note that there is such a script already in the distribution. It is
bin/cleanarch  which as Stephen notes, may or may not work for you.

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Re: [Mailman-Users] Help with Mailman and Sendmail

[David Abrahams]

Mark Sapiro <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

> David Abrahams wrote:
>>
>>Heh, and even if I do that, I don't end up with a
>>/usr/local/sbin/mailman.aliases.
>
>
> You have to create /usr/local/sbin/mailman.aliases with execute
> permission and containing
>
> /bin/cp /usr/local/mailman/data/aliases /etc/mailman.aliases
> /usr/bin/newaliases


Oh!  The substitution of that word "containing" for the post's "with"
made all the difference. :)

I read "create this file with these commands" as, "use these commands
to create /usr/local/sbin/mailman.aliases"

> It is the
>
> POSTFIX_ALIAS_CMD = '/usr/bin/sudo /usr/local/sbin/mailman.aliases'
>
> That tells the process to run that file in order to update system
> aliases from the /usr/local/mailman/data/aliases that the process
> creates/updates.

Sure.

> 2) You put in mm_cfg.py
>
> MTA='Postfix'
> POSTFIX_ALIAS_CMD = '/usr/bin/sudo /usr/local/sbin/mailman.aliases'
>
> What this does is it tells Mailman's bin/genaliases and list
> creation/deletion processes to run Mailman/MTA/Postfix.py as part of
> the process to deal with aliases. This in turn updates data/aliases (a
> fixed file name) and then invokes POSTFIX_ALIAS_CMD to update the
> system aliases. That command runs the script in
> /usr/local/sbin/mailman.aliases (as root) to copy the aliases to
> /etc/mailman.aliases (This is necessary because of point 1. in the
> post at
> )
> and run /usr/bin/newaliases to update Sendmail's database.
>
> Now Mailman aliases are being automatically maintained in
> /etc/mailman.aliases, but none of this actually happens until step 5.
> of the above post's instructions.

Uh-huh.  But now I have all the products mentioned in step 5 except
for mailman.aliases.db.  I guess 2 out of 3 ain't bad, but... any
clues?

> Does this help?

Pretty good, thanks, but still a mystery lurks.  Where's
mailman.aliases.db?

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[Mailman-Users] Another archive questions

[Paul Tomblin]

I noticed that the messages.html files only have 6 digits in them.  Does
that mean that it will break when we reach 999,999 messages?  I'm already
up over 300,000 on one of my lists.

I know, we'll all be communicating by neural implant by then.

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Re: [Mailman-Users] mbox files

[Stephen J. Turnbull]

Paul Tomblin writes:

 > Is there any way to make arch smarter about "^From " lines?

Yes, but it's not a good idea to put it in the distribution, at least
not without a lot of careful hedging about and making it an option
defaulting to off.  You can't even being sure that From_ lines will be
consistent within a single mbox.  See

http://www.jwz.org/doc/content-length.html

I think the better approach is to do just what you did, and make a
site-specific script to do From-munging.  Of course there's nothing
wrong with putting them in a contrib section in the distribution; my
worry is about changing bin/arch.

IMHO YMMV

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Re: [Mailman-Users] mbox files

[Paul Tomblin]

Oh yeah, one other minor issue with arch - in January of 2000, my list got
some messages with a year of "100", as in "^Date: Sat, 1 Jan 100 16:58:49
-0500 (EST)".  arch files them all under today's date. It would be nice if
arch could handle those, but I'm not holding my breath in expectation
since it's not likely to affect anybody else for 94 years or so.


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[Mailman-Users] failed to send out message when posting to a list

[Jana Nguyen]

Hi,

I'm using postfix with mailman and I can't post mail to the mailing list.
I can subscribe to a list, both I and the owner of the mailing list get 
an email notifications.  But I do not receive email when
posting to any of the mailing list that I created.

I've checked the duplication email option on the admin interface are 
unchecked.  Error message in /var/log/maillog:


Dec  3 16:44:25 portal spamd[2960]: prefork: child states: II
Dec  3 16:44:25 portal postfix/pipe[6362]: 95A5629A96: 
to=<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, relay=spamfilter, delay=1, status=sent (dummy)
Dec  3 16:44:25 portal postfix/qmgr[14320]: 95A5629A96: removed
Dec  3 16:44:25 portal postfix/pickup[14319]: 8C9A929B4D: uid=520 
from=<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Dec  3 16:44:25 portal postfix/cleanup[6361]: 8C9A929B4D: 
message-id=<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Dec  3 16:44:25 portal postfix/qmgr[14320]: 8C9A929B4D: 
from=<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, size=2194, nrcpt=1 (queue active)
Dec  3 16:44:25 portal postfix/smtp[6370]: 8C9A929B4D: 
to=<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, relay=bigiron.ucsd.edu[132.239.131.209], 
delay=0, status=sent (250 ok:  Message 1826098 accepted)
Dec  3 16:44:25 portal postfix/qmgr[14320]: 8C9A929B4D: removed


I used to were able to post to list, but after I changed the 
DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST to not to be the same as my DEFAULT_URL_HOST, it 
stopped working.
The entry in my /usr/local/mailman/Mailman is:

MTA = 'Postfix'

SMTPHOST = 'localhost'
SMTPPORT = 25
POSTFIX_ALIAS_CMD = '/usr/sbin/postalias'
POSTFIX_MAP_CMD = '/usr/sbin/postmap'

DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST = 'nbirn.net'
DEFAULT_URL_HOST = 'portal.nbirn.net'

add_virtualhost(DEFAULT_URL_HOST, DEFAULT_EMAIL_HOST)

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Re: [Mailman-Users] mbox files

[Paul Tomblin]

Quoting Mark Sapiro ([EMAIL PROTECTED]):
> Paul Tomblin wrote:
> >slowed my computer down to a crawl.  I gave up and used the mbox splitter
> >awk program I found in the list archives and I'm now building the archives
> >500 messages at a time.  Hope that works.
> 
> 
> It should.
> 
> Also, you can effectively do the same thing without breaking up the
> mbox by using the --start= and --end= options on bin/arch. See
> 
>  bin/arch --help

Is there any way to make arch smarter about "^From " lines?  First pass
through the archive, I ended up with a bazillion messages in the archive
for today, all with "No subject" because it was treating any line like
"^From " as the start of a message.  It would be nice if it recognized the
difference between real mbox start-of-message "^From " and just random
lines from some list member.

I suspect that this probably isn't generically possible.  I made use for
the fact that real mbox start-of-message lines have the listname in the
"^From " line, and made my mbox splitter awk script put a ">" in any
"^From " line that didn't have the listname in it.

So far (on message 30,000), it has only given me one "No subject" line in
the archive, but that's because somebody actually put a real
start-of-message line in his message because he was complaining about slow
message delivery and copied the whole message header.

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for there you have been, there you long to return." -- Leonardo da Vinci.
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Re: [Mailman-Users] Help with Mailman and Sendmail

[Pierre Forget]

Hi,

If it can help. I had problems installing and integrating with sendmail.

Culprit was that it needs to know under which group sendmail is used. 
So, look carefully in your sendmail.cf (DefaultUser) and make sure you 
compile mailman with the switch to include this group for :

--with-cgi-gid=group

and make an install user that is part of the mailman group to install 
the mailman software.

If you try to send an email to the list, it may show you under which 
group sendmail is using. This helped me.


Pierre Forget


Quoting David Abrahams <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:

>
> Hi,
>
> I'm trying to follow the directions for integrating Mailman with
> Sendmail, but I think they may be incomplete.  It looks like there
> were orginally some instructions directed at installations like mine
> (a few users, a few mailing lists, *one* computer), and they were
> entirely replaced by instructions for installations where an entire
> host could be dedicated to serving mailman lists.  There are oblique
> references to how much easier the mm-handler method is than the
> alternative "maintaining lists of aliases" but no details about what
> that alternative involves.
>
> I don't mind going the mm-handler way if it's more scalable, so I
> pointed a separate domain, lists.boost-consulting.com, at my server.
> But now I have to learn about virtual hosting with sendmail and figure
> out how to integrate my .mc file with the supplied mailman.mc and have
> the respective settings that are different only apply to the intended
> hosts.  I don't know too much about sendmail (or email protocols in
> general, really), so this is turning into a big and risky project.  Is
> there anyone here who can help me get this stuff configured without
> bringing my email system to its knees for too long?
>
> Thanks in advance,
>
> --
> Dave Abrahams
> Boost Consulting
> www.boost-consulting.com
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Re: [Mailman-Users] mbox files

[Mark Sapiro]

Paul Tomblin wrote:
>
>The problem is that I have 250,000 articles in this mbox file, so when I
>tried to arch it, arch ended up using over 1Gb of swap space, and it
>slowed my computer down to a crawl.  I gave up and used the mbox splitter
>awk program I found in the list archives and I'm now building the archives
>500 messages at a time.  Hope that works.


It should.

Also, you can effectively do the same thing without breaking up the
mbox by using the --start= and --end= options on bin/arch. See

 bin/arch --help

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San Francisco Bay Area, Californiabetter use your sense - B. Dylan

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Re: [Mailman-Users] mbox files

[Paul Tomblin]

Quoting Mark Sapiro ([EMAIL PROTECTED]):
> (which uses listname.mbox/listname.mbox by default). You could actually
> do it in the other order, but the --wipe option needs to be on the
> first command, or if the existing archives match the existing
> listname.mbox, you could just do
> 
>   bin/arch listname archives/private/listname.mbox/old.mbox
> 
> to add the old ones.
> 
> Note that there are pros and cons to all the above having to do with
> changing message numbers - hence, changing message URLs - in the
> archive which will invalidate saved URLs now or in the future.

The problem is that I have 250,000 articles in this mbox file, so when I
tried to arch it, arch ended up using over 1Gb of swap space, and it
slowed my computer down to a crawl.  I gave up and used the mbox splitter
awk program I found in the list archives and I'm now building the archives
500 messages at a time.  Hope that works.

-- 
Paul Tomblin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://blog.xcski.com/
Using vi is kind of like having sex.  The first time to use it, it's kind
of awkward, but after using for a while you start to get good at it and
enjoy it.  -- Eric Merkel 
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Re: [Mailman-Users] mbox files

[Mark Sapiro]

Paul Tomblin wrote:

>Does the /var/lib/mailman/archives/private/listname.mbox directory have to
>contain just one file, or can I break it up by year or something to make
>them more managable?


It can contain as many files as you want organized however you want,
but the one named listname.mbox is the only one accessable via the
web, and it is the one that new posts are added to.


>I had my mailman lists on my home server, but a few years ago I moved them
>to a virtual private server.  Because the disk space was limited there, I
>started trimming down the listname.mbox files down to just the previous
>two years worth.  But now I've moved them again, this time to a colo box
>where I have more disk space than I know what to do with.  I want to
>restore the old archives.  Can I just dump the old mbox file in the same
>directory as the current archives and do a "arch listname"?  Or will I
>have to run "arch" once for the old file and once for the listname.mbox
>file?


You will need to run

  bin/arch --wipe listname archives/private/listname.mbox/old.mbox

followed by

  bin/arch listname

(which uses listname.mbox/listname.mbox by default). You could actually
do it in the other order, but the --wipe option needs to be on the
first command, or if the existing archives match the existing
listname.mbox, you could just do

  bin/arch listname archives/private/listname.mbox/old.mbox

to add the old ones.

Note that there are pros and cons to all the above having to do with
changing message numbers - hence, changing message URLs - in the
archive which will invalidate saved URLs now or in the future.

See

and

for more on this.


>Will "arch" handle the case where there is a bit of overlap between two
>files (the files from my home system go from 1999 to mid-2005, and the
>ones on my VPS go from the beginning of 2005 to the present)?


Actually, I think it will (i.e. I think it doesn't archive the same
Message-ID: twice), but this may exacerbate any message renumbering
issue.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>   The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, Californiabetter use your sense - B. Dylan

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Re: [Mailman-Users] Help with Mailman and Sendmail

[Mark Sapiro]

David Abrahams wrote:
>
>Heh, and even if I do that, I don't end up with a
>/usr/local/sbin/mailman.aliases.


You have to create /usr/local/sbin/mailman.aliases with execute
permission and containing

/bin/cp /usr/local/mailman/data/aliases /etc/mailman.aliases
/usr/bin/newaliases

>It seems like something needs to
>tell newaliases about /etc/mailman.aliases, and the only thing I see
>in the instructions that could do it is a later step:


It is the

POSTFIX_ALIAS_CMD = '/usr/bin/sudo /usr/local/sbin/mailman.aliases'

That tells the process to run that file in order to update system
aliases from the /usr/local/mailman/data/aliases that the process
creates/updates.


>  3. We have to tell sendmail about the new alias file.
>
>  in /etc/mail/sendmail.mc find this line:
>  define(`ALIAS_FILE', `/etc/aliases')dnl
>  and change it to:
>  define(`ALIAS_FILE', `/etc/aliases,/etc/mailman.aliases')dnl
>  Run a make (or otherwise refresh sendmail.cf and then restart sendmail
>
>  Now when we run newaliases, it will rebuild both alias files.
>
>Am I missing something?  I feel like I'm groping around in the dark
>here.


Here's what happens:

1) You create /usr/local/sbin/mailman.aliases with execute permission
and containing

/bin/cp /usr/local/mailman/data/aliases /etc/mailman.aliases
/usr/bin/newaliases

This will actually be run later.

2) You put in mm_cfg.py

MTA='Postfix'
POSTFIX_ALIAS_CMD = '/usr/bin/sudo /usr/local/sbin/mailman.aliases'

What this does is it tells Mailman's bin/genaliases and list
creation/deletion processes to run Mailman/MTA/Postfix.py as part of
the process to deal with aliases. This in turn updates data/aliases (a
fixed file name) and then invokes POSTFIX_ALIAS_CMD to update the
system aliases. That command runs the script in
/usr/local/sbin/mailman.aliases (as root) to copy the aliases to
/etc/mailman.aliases (This is necessary because of point 1. in the
post at
)
and run /usr/bin/newaliases to update Sendmail's database.

Now Mailman aliases are being automatically maintained in
/etc/mailman.aliases, but none of this actually happens until step 5.
of the above post's instructions.

3) You add /etc/mailman.aliases to Sendmail's configuration so Sendmail
will use that file.

You do the other steps as outlined in the post.

Does this help?

-- 
Mark Sapiro <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>   The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, Californiabetter use your sense - B. Dylan

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[Mailman-Users] mbox files

[Paul Tomblin]

Does the /var/lib/mailman/archives/private/listname.mbox directory have to
contain just one file, or can I break it up by year or something to make
them more managable?

I had my mailman lists on my home server, but a few years ago I moved them
to a virtual private server.  Because the disk space was limited there, I
started trimming down the listname.mbox files down to just the previous
two years worth.  But now I've moved them again, this time to a colo box
where I have more disk space than I know what to do with.  I want to
restore the old archives.  Can I just dump the old mbox file in the same
directory as the current archives and do a "arch listname"?  Or will I
have to run "arch" once for the old file and once for the listname.mbox
file?

Will "arch" handle the case where there is a bit of overlap between two
files (the files from my home system go from 1999 to mid-2005, and the
ones on my VPS go from the beginning of 2005 to the present)?



-- 
Paul Tomblin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://blog.xcski.com/
Things which do you no good in aviation: Altitude above you.
Runway behind you.  Fuel in the truck.  Half a second ago.
Approach plates in the car. The airspeed you don't have.
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Re: [Mailman-Users] Help with Mailman and Sendmail

[Mark Sapiro]

David Abrahams wrote:

>Mark Sapiro <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
>> Look at the 'automated' method referred to in the FAQ. You may decide
>> you don't need to go the mm-handler route.
>
>Heh, first hurdle:
>
>The instructions at
>http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/2004-June/037518.html
>start with
>
>  Create /usr/local/sbin/mailman.aliases with these commands:
>
>  /bin/cp /home/mailman/data/aliases /etc/mailman.aliases
>  /usr/bin/newaliases
>
>but I have no /home/mailman/, nor any /usr/local/mailman/data/aliases
>(which is what I suppose is intended) on my system.


After you set MTA = 'Postfix' in mm_cfg.py and run bin/genaliases, the
Mailman aliases will be put in /usr/local/mailman/data/aliases, before
the POSTFIX_ALIAS_CMD is run by the genaliases process. Then as lists
are created/deleted, /usr/local/mailman/data/aliases will be
maintained automatically.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>   The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, Californiabetter use your sense - B. Dylan

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Re: [Mailman-Users] Help with Mailman and Sendmail

[David Abrahams]

David Abrahams <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

> Mark Sapiro <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
>> Look at the 'automated' method referred to in the FAQ. You may decide
>> you don't need to go the mm-handler route.
>
> Heh, first hurdle:
>
> The instructions at
> http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/2004-June/037518.html
> start with
>
>   Create /usr/local/sbin/mailman.aliases with these commands:
>
>   /bin/cp /home/mailman/data/aliases /etc/mailman.aliases
>   /usr/bin/newaliases
>
> but I have no /home/mailman/, nor any /usr/local/mailman/data/aliases
> (which is what I suppose is intended) on my system.
>
> Perhaps /usr/local/mailman/data/aliases should contain
>
>   ## mailman mailing list
>   mailman:"|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman post mailman"
>   mailman-admin:  "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman admin mailman"
>   mailman-bounces:"|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman bounces mailman"
>   mailman-confirm:"|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman confirm mailman"
>   mailman-join:   "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman join mailman"
>   mailman-leave:  "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman leave mailman"
>   mailman-owner:  "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman owner mailman"
>   mailman-request:"|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman request mailman"
>   mailman-subscribe:  "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman subscribe mailman"
>   mailman-unsubscribe:"|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman unsubscribe mailman"
>
> ?

Heh, and even if I do that, I don't end up with a
/usr/local/sbin/mailman.aliases.  It seems like something needs to
tell newaliases about /etc/mailman.aliases, and the only thing I see
in the instructions that could do it is a later step:

  3. We have to tell sendmail about the new alias file.

  in /etc/mail/sendmail.mc find this line:
  define(`ALIAS_FILE', `/etc/aliases')dnl
  and change it to:
  define(`ALIAS_FILE', `/etc/aliases,/etc/mailman.aliases')dnl
  Run a make (or otherwise refresh sendmail.cf and then restart sendmail

  Now when we run newaliases, it will rebuild both alias files.

Am I missing something?  I feel like I'm groping around in the dark
here.

-- 
Dave Abrahams
Boost Consulting
www.boost-consulting.com
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Re: [Mailman-Users] Help with Mailman and Sendmail

[David Abrahams]

Mark Sapiro <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

> Look at the 'automated' method referred to in the FAQ. You may decide
> you don't need to go the mm-handler route.

Heh, first hurdle:

The instructions at
http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/2004-June/037518.html
start with

  Create /usr/local/sbin/mailman.aliases with these commands:

  /bin/cp /home/mailman/data/aliases /etc/mailman.aliases
  /usr/bin/newaliases

but I have no /home/mailman/, nor any /usr/local/mailman/data/aliases
(which is what I suppose is intended) on my system.

Perhaps /usr/local/mailman/data/aliases should contain

  ## mailman mailing list
  mailman:"|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman post mailman"
  mailman-admin:  "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman admin mailman"
  mailman-bounces:"|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman bounces mailman"
  mailman-confirm:"|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman confirm mailman"
  mailman-join:   "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman join mailman"
  mailman-leave:  "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman leave mailman"
  mailman-owner:  "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman owner mailman"
  mailman-request:"|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman request mailman"
  mailman-subscribe:  "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman subscribe mailman"
  mailman-unsubscribe:"|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman unsubscribe mailman"

?

-- 
Dave Abrahams
Boost Consulting
www.boost-consulting.com
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Re: [Mailman-Users] Help with Mailman and Sendmail

[David Abrahams]

Mark Sapiro <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

> David Abrahams wrote:
>>
>>Mark, thank you!  This looks a *lot* easier than what I was trying to
>>do, and perhaps the post even implies that what I was trying to do
>>won't work:
>>
>>  "many people cannot use David Champion's mm-handler due to shared
>>   use of domains"
>>
>>(what exactly does he mean by "shared use of domains?")
>
>
> He means a given domain which is the recipient domain for both list
> mail and at least some non-list mail.  mm-handler works best if the
> lists have their own domain which doesn't receive non-list mail.

So I gathered.  That's what I was doing by trying to designate
lists.boost-consulting.com as the domain for mailman.  I think I'd
still like to maintain that separation in case I need to switch to
mm-handler someday.

> Then Sendmail is configured so all the mail to
> that domain goes to mm-handler for delivery to Mailman. If there are
> other, non-list addresses in the same domain, they have to be handled
> via their own aliases 'ahead of' mm-handler. 

Oh, so every regular user in that domain needs to be dealt with via an
alias somehow?

> If there are a lot of these, the problem of handling the non-list
> addresses becomes larger than the problem of handling list mail via
> aliases without mm-handler.
>
> Of course, there are other MTAs (e.g., Exim) that can be configured to
> determine whether an address should be routed to Mailman by examining
> the Mailman file system to determine if a particular name is a Mailman
> list, 

Yeah, we tried exim but failed to make exim to do SMTP AUTH via the
same saslauthd that was being used for Cyrus, and the exim list was of
little help to us, so we had to give up on it.

> but with Sendmail, the easier way is probably the method
> referenced in the FAQ.

Thanks.  If I hack up a Python script for this purpose I will post it
here.

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Re: [Mailman-Users] Help with Mailman and Sendmail

[Mark Sapiro]

David Abrahams wrote:
>
>Mark, thank you!  This looks a *lot* easier than what I was trying to
>do, and perhaps the post even implies that what I was trying to do
>won't work:
>
>  "many people cannot use David Champion's mm-handler due to shared
>   use of domains"
>
>(what exactly does he mean by "shared use of domains?")


He means a given domain which is the recipient domain for both list
mail and at least some non-list mail.

mm-handler works best if the lists have their own domain which doesn't
receive non-list mail. Then Sendmail is configured so all the mail to
that domain goes to mm-handler for delivery to Mailman. If there are
other, non-list addresses in the same domain, they have to be handled
via their own aliases 'ahead of' mm-handler. If there are a lot of
these, the problem of handling the non-list addresses becomes larger
than the problem of handling list mail via aliases without mm-handler.

Of course, there are other MTAs (e.g., Exim) that can be configured to
determine whether an address should be routed to Mailman by examining
the Mailman file system to determine if a particular name is a Mailman
list, but with Sendmail, the easier way is probably the method
referenced in the FAQ.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>   The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, Californiabetter use your sense - B. Dylan

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Re: [Mailman-Users] Installing Mailman with Qmail +VPopmail and using virtual domains

[Dark Servant]

2006/12/2, Dustin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>
> I am reposting a request for help that I posted earlier in regards to
> setting up Mailman with VPopmail and Qmail.   So far, my request has gone
> unresponded to and I would really appreciate some assistance.
>
> I have been searching everywhere for like some sort of tutorial on how to
> set this up.  The manual is very vague on how to handle virtual domains.
> [...]
>
>
I set it up using this tutorial:
http://nick.vargish.org/clues/qmail-vpopmail-mailman.html
worked well

David
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Re: [Mailman-Users] Help with Mailman and Sendmail

[David Abrahams]

David Abrahams <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

> All that said, the follow-up post really gives me pause:
> http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/2004-June/037543.html
>
> Is that a legitimate worry?

Whoops, I now see that by "this perl script" he's referring to
mm-handler.

Thanks.

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Re: [Mailman-Users] Help with Mailman and Sendmail

[David Abrahams]

Mark Sapiro <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

> Look at the 'automated' method referred to in the FAQ. You may decide
> you don't need to go the mm-handler route.

Mark, thank you!  This looks a *lot* easier than what I was trying to
do, and perhaps the post even implies that what I was trying to do
won't work:

  "many people cannot use David Champion's mm-handler due to shared
   use of domains"

(what exactly does he mean by "shared use of domains?")

All that said, the follow-up post really gives me pause:
http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/2004-June/037543.html

Is that a legitimate worry?

-- 
Dave Abrahams
Boost Consulting
www.boost-consulting.com
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Re: [Mailman-Users] Help with Mailman and Sendmail

[Mark Sapiro]

David Abrahams wrote:
>
>I'm trying to follow the directions for integrating Mailman with
>Sendmail, but I think they may be incomplete.  It looks like there
>were orginally some instructions directed at installations like mine
>(a few users, a few mailing lists, *one* computer), and they were
>entirely replaced by instructions for installations where an entire
>host could be dedicated to serving mailman lists.  There are oblique
>references to how much easier the mm-handler method is than the
>alternative "maintaining lists of aliases" but no details about what
>that alternative involves.


It involves maintaining a set of aliases in /etc/aliases for each list
such as

## mailman mailing list
mailman:"|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman post mailman"
mailman-admin:  "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman admin mailman"
mailman-bounces:"|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman bounces mailman"
mailman-confirm:"|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman confirm mailman"
mailman-join:   "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman join mailman"
mailman-leave:  "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman leave mailman"
mailman-owner:  "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman owner mailman"
mailman-request:"|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman request mailman"
mailman-subscribe:  "|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman subscribe mailman"
mailman-unsubscribe:"|/usr/local/mailman/mail/mailman unsubscribe
mailman"

This can be done automatically. See

and the post to which it refers.



>I don't mind going the mm-handler way if it's more scalable, so I
>pointed a separate domain, lists.boost-consulting.com, at my server.
>But now I have to learn about virtual hosting with sendmail and figure
>out how to integrate my .mc file with the supplied mailman.mc and have
>the respective settings that are different only apply to the intended
>hosts.  I don't know too much about sendmail (or email protocols in
>general, really), so this is turning into a big and risky project.  Is
>there anyone here who can help me get this stuff configured without
>bringing my email system to its knees for too long?


Look at the 'automated' method referred to in the FAQ. You may decide
you don't need to go the mm-handler route.

-- 
Mark Sapiro <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>   The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, Californiabetter use your sense - B. Dylan

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[Mailman-Users] Help with Mailman and Sendmail

[David Abrahams]

Hi,

I'm trying to follow the directions for integrating Mailman with
Sendmail, but I think they may be incomplete.  It looks like there
were orginally some instructions directed at installations like mine
(a few users, a few mailing lists, *one* computer), and they were
entirely replaced by instructions for installations where an entire
host could be dedicated to serving mailman lists.  There are oblique
references to how much easier the mm-handler method is than the
alternative "maintaining lists of aliases" but no details about what
that alternative involves.

I don't mind going the mm-handler way if it's more scalable, so I
pointed a separate domain, lists.boost-consulting.com, at my server.
But now I have to learn about virtual hosting with sendmail and figure
out how to integrate my .mc file with the supplied mailman.mc and have
the respective settings that are different only apply to the intended
hosts.  I don't know too much about sendmail (or email protocols in
general, really), so this is turning into a big and risky project.  Is
there anyone here who can help me get this stuff configured without
bringing my email system to its knees for too long?

Thanks in advance,

-- 
Dave Abrahams
Boost Consulting
www.boost-consulting.com
--
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