Re: [mailop] Convincing clients of the importance of eMail recipient consent for mailing list subscriptions
Thanks Byron, for sharing your experience. I believe this is not an uncommon experience for mailing list operators, and the bots are, to put it mildly, a major nuisance indeed. I suspect that some of the bots may be trying to detect patterns in the confirmation codes that cmoe back through the eMail addresses that they actually do monitor, most likely with the intention of faking subscription confirmations with future subscribers that they nefariously add to the list. > We've required confirmed-opt-in for years. But a few months ago, I noticed > that our servers were sending out hundreds of 'confirmation required' > messages every day. They were going to obviously-bogus addresses, likely > submitted to our submission forms by bots. Without opt-in, all those bogus > addresses would be on our lists, inflating subscriber count, increasing > bounces, lowering server reputation, etc. As it was, even just the hundreds > of confirmation messages were beginning to impact server reputation, to the > point that I added simple 'captcha' tests which require a human response, > just to eliminate the bogus confirmation messages. Even after THAT, I find > that maybe 25-50% of the folks who ask to subscribe never respond to the > confirmation email. > > A list of 100 validated and interested folks is worth far more than a list > of 1000 "average users". > > > > On Mon, Nov 27, 2023 at 11:46AM Randolf Richardson, Postmaster via mailop < > mailop@mailop.org> wrote: > > > What have you found to be some of the best approaches to convince > > clients that the confirmed opt-in process is necessary for operating > > eMail lists? (The ethical aspects are pretty straight-forward.) > > > > Many marketing people seem to be terrified of the idea of users > > having to confirm their consent when subscribing to a mailing list > > (e.g., by following a unique link in an eMail message to complete the > > process). The marketers almost always say "it will be too > > complicated for the average user," and want to eliminate the > > confirmation step altogether (which is not an ethical approach from > > my perspective). > > > > Presenting legal aspects is quite convenient here in Canada > > (because > > of our anti-spam laws), and preventing inclusion in blacklists is > > another helpful motivator, but I'd prefer to find a ways that get > > mailing list operators to want to ensure that "every eMail recipient > > consented" without the begrudging "we do this because we have to" > > perspective. > > > > Thank you for your thoughts and ideas. > > > > Postmaster - postmas...@inter-corporate.com > > Randolf Richardson - rand...@inter-corporate.com > > Inter-Corporate Computer & Network Services, Inc. > > Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada > > https://www.inter-corporate.com/ > > > > > > ___ > > mailop mailing list > > mailop@mailop.org > > https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop > > > Postmaster - postmas...@inter-corporate.com Randolf Richardson - rand...@inter-corporate.com Inter-Corporate Computer & Network Services, Inc. Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada https://www.inter-corporate.com/ ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] [EXTERNAL] Re: Comcast issues?
Let me see if I can spot anything that might be causing this. Thanks folks -- Alex Brotman Sr. Engineer, Anti-Abuse & Messaging Policy Comcast > -Original Message- > From: mailop On Behalf Of Paul Ebersman via > mailop > Sent: Monday, November 27, 2023 2:20 PM > To: jarl...@mxroute.com > Cc: Mailop > Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: [mailop] Comcast issues? > > jarland> Anyone else seeing issues connecting to comcast.net MX servers > jarland> today? We've got emails piling up in queue and connection > jarland> failures all over. > > Nope. Not just you. > > Been backing up since at least 07:43am PST this morning, still clogged on my > server. > ___ > mailop mailing list > mailop@mailop.org > https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop__;!!CQl3mcH > X2A!HjQ1cJioF4kNYqe2Cc--yn5ZLShiEOMgs-aPJ_H_WZe4864n- > nPMCfX5orlMrqclEUen4Vy0JJz4KiPWt-0$ ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Convincing clients of the importance of eMail recipient consent for mailing list subscriptions
We've required confirmed-opt-in for years. But a few months ago, I noticed that our servers were sending out hundreds of 'confirmation required' messages every day. They were going to obviously-bogus addresses, likely submitted to our submission forms by bots. Without opt-in, all those bogus addresses would be on our lists, inflating subscriber count, increasing bounces, lowering server reputation, etc. As it was, even just the hundreds of confirmation messages were beginning to impact server reputation, to the point that I added simple 'captcha' tests which require a human response, just to eliminate the bogus confirmation messages. Even after THAT, I find that maybe 25-50% of the folks who ask to subscribe never respond to the confirmation email. A list of 100 validated and interested folks is worth far more than a list of 1000 "average users". On Mon, Nov 27, 2023 at 11:46 AM Randolf Richardson, Postmaster via mailop < mailop@mailop.org> wrote: > What have you found to be some of the best approaches to convince > clients that the confirmed opt-in process is necessary for operating > eMail lists? (The ethical aspects are pretty straight-forward.) > > Many marketing people seem to be terrified of the idea of users > having to confirm their consent when subscribing to a mailing list > (e.g., by following a unique link in an eMail message to complete the > process). The marketers almost always say "it will be too > complicated for the average user," and want to eliminate the > confirmation step altogether (which is not an ethical approach from > my perspective). > > Presenting legal aspects is quite convenient here in Canada > (because > of our anti-spam laws), and preventing inclusion in blacklists is > another helpful motivator, but I'd prefer to find a ways that get > mailing list operators to want to ensure that "every eMail recipient > consented" without the begrudging "we do this because we have to" > perspective. > > Thank you for your thoughts and ideas. > > Postmaster - postmas...@inter-corporate.com > Randolf Richardson - rand...@inter-corporate.com > Inter-Corporate Computer & Network Services, Inc. > Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada > https://www.inter-corporate.com/ > > > ___ > mailop mailing list > mailop@mailop.org > https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop > ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Convincing clients of the importance of eMail recipient consent for mailing list subscriptions
On 2023-11-27 at 13:42:58 UTC-0500 (Mon, 27 Nov 2023 10:42:58 -0800) Randolf Richardson, Postmaster via mailop is rumored to have said: What have you found to be some of the best approaches to convince clients that the confirmed opt-in process is necessary for operating eMail lists? (The ethical aspects are pretty straight-forward.) Specifying it explicitly in service contracts and making absolutely sure that the customer is aware that failing to confirm opt-ins will result in immediate permanent service termination, and they may receive any data associated with their account shipped to them on physical media by request. That is obviously only possible with full management support. We've had exactly one misunderstanding of this in the past 15 years. As you say, the ethical aspects are clear and we have the luxury of being able to screen customers well. I expect this is only feasible for similar operations where mailing list hosting is not a free-standing offering, but only something we offer to our mailbox customers. -- Bill Cole b...@scconsult.com or billc...@apache.org (AKA @grumpybozo and many *@billmail.scconsult.com addresses) Not Currently Available For Hire ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Convincing clients of the importance of eMail recipient consent for mailing list subscriptions
Wasnt' there an article on how engagement rates for confirmed double opt-in vs unconfirmed were a LOT higher.. a few years back? I think if you can point to the higher engagement rates, that even with lower total subscribers you are more effective in your email marketing. Anyone have a link to that article, or was this something hidden at M3AAWG? -- Michael -- On 2023-11-27 11:04, Randolf Richardson, Postmaster via mailop wrote: Am 27.11.2023 um 10:42:58 Uhr schrieb Randolf Richardson, Postmaster via mailop: Many marketing people seem to be terrified of the idea of users having to confirm their consent when subscribing to a mailing list (e.g., by following a unique link in an eMail message to complete the process). The marketers almost always say "it will be too complicated for the average user," and want to eliminate the confirmation step altogether (which is not an ethical approach from my perspective). Tell them that not doing opt-in will make them spammers and that the servers of your company will be listed in blacklists, so you cannot reach anybody until that listing is expired. We already do this, and we refuse to host any eMail lists that are not confirming consent properly because of the ethics considerations, and for the very reason that you just covered. Without a confirmation, everybody can simply subscribe any address and that will be abused. I agree. What I'm trying to do is convince non-technical management to side with taking care to respect consent instead of siding with the marketing people who obviously don't care. In a way, this is a struggle between technical people who care about consent vs. marketing people who just want to advertise and use damage-control methods to clean up the mess (the marketers also seem to refuse to care about the ethics or the blacklists, and have the attitude that everyone's replaceable as long as they get what they want). Even the confirmation messages can already be used for mass mailing if an abuser submits the form many times for many addresses. Yes. There are ways to mitigate at least some of that, but these techniques are beyond the scope of what I'm asking for -- I'm trying to find ways to persuade management that the technical measures are necessary and must take precedence over what the marketers want. (Thanks for your prompt reply.) Postmaster - postmas...@inter-corporate.com Randolf Richardson - rand...@inter-corporate.com Inter-Corporate Computer & Network Services, Inc. Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada https://www.inter-corporate.com/ ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop -- "Catch the Magic of Linux..." Michael Peddemors, President/CEO LinuxMagic Inc. Visit us at http://www.linuxmagic.com @linuxmagic A Wizard IT Company - For More Info http://www.wizard.ca "LinuxMagic" a Registered TradeMark of Wizard Tower TechnoServices Ltd. 604-682-0300 Beautiful British Columbia, Canada This email and any electronic data contained are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. Please note that any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and are not intended to represent those of the company. ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] mailop Digest, Vol 40, Issue 38
Re: Anyone else seeing issues connecting to comcast.net MX servers today? We've got emails piling up in queue and connection failures all over. We have been seeing issue since about 10AM CT at Comcast. I have seen some consumers on the down detector sites say no e-mail since same time. Also saw AT&T, BellSouth and SBCGlobal have issues from 11AM - 11:30AM CT today. We send cooking and crafting content primarily for females. --- Stuart Hochwert shochw...@primecp.com Prime Publishing LLC 3400 Dundee Road, Suite 220 Northbrook, IL 60062 847-205-9375 Main | 847-513-6093 Direct -Original Message- From: mailop On Behalf Of mailop-requ...@mailop.org Sent: Monday, November 27, 2023 1:29 PM To: mailop@mailop.org Subject: mailop Digest, Vol 40, Issue 38 Send mailop mailing list submissions to mailop@mailop.org To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to mailop-requ...@mailop.org You can reach the person managing the list at mailop-ow...@mailop.org When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of mailop digest..." Today's Topics: 1. Re: Yahoo Feedback Loop (Mike Hammett) 2. Re: Convincing clients of the importance of eMail recipient consent for mailing list subscriptions (Marco Moock) 3. Re: Convincing clients of the importance of eMail recipient consent for mailing list subscriptions (Randolf Richardson, Postmaster) 4. Comcast issues? (jarl...@mxroute.com) 5. Re: Convincing clients of the importance of eMail recipient consent for mailing list subscriptions (Marco Moock) 6. Re: Comcast issues? (Paul Ebersman) -- Message: 1 Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2023 12:50:40 -0600 (CST) From: Mike Hammett To: Mike Hammett Cc: mailop Subject: Re: [mailop] Yahoo Feedback Loop Message-ID: <1143667006.2056.170039263.JavaMail.mhammett@Thunderfuck2> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Ah, I missed it because the "Original-Rcpt-To:" was a non-Yahoo domain. For future reference, that's the line in the header you're looking for. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions Midwest Internet Exchange The Brothers WISP - Original Message - From: "Mike Hammett via mailop" To: "mailop" Sent: Monday, November 27, 2023 8:50:37 AM Subject: [mailop] Yahoo Feedback Loop What do you do when someone keeps reporting conversations on a mailman mailing list that is opt-in only to Yahoo? It seems like they forgot they were on NANOG and are now reporting every message sent to it. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions Midwest Internet Exchange The Brothers WISP ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <https://list.mailop.org/private/mailop/attachments/20231127/e31ae6a9/attachment-0001.htm> -- Message: 2 Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2023 19:54:24 +0100 From: Marco Moock To: mailop@mailop.org Cc: rand...@inter-corporate.com Subject: Re: [mailop] Convincing clients of the importance of eMail recipient consent for mailing list subscriptions Message-ID: <20231127195424.7d1e7...@ryz.home.arpa> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Am 27.11.2023 um 10:42:58 Uhr schrieb Randolf Richardson, Postmaster via mailop: > Many marketing people seem to be terrified of the idea of users > having to confirm their consent when subscribing to a mailing list > (e.g., by following a unique link in an eMail message to complete the > process). The marketers almost always say "it will be too complicated > for the average user," and want to eliminate the confirmation step > altogether (which is not an ethical approach from my perspective). Tell them that not doing opt-in will make them spammers and that the servers of your company will be listed in blacklists, so you cannot reach anybody until that listing is expired. Without a confirmation, everybody can simply subscribe any address and that will be abused. Even the confirmation messages can already be used for mass mailing if an abuser submits the form many times for many addresses. -- Message: 3 Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2023 11:04:33 -0800 From: "Randolf Richardson, Postmaster" To: mailop@mailop.org Subject: Re: [mailop] Convincing clients of the importance of eMail recipient consent for mailing list subscriptions Message-ID: <6564e841.23674.76d4...@postmaster.inter-corporate.com>
Re: [mailop] [EXTERNAL] Re: Comcast issues?
Thanks folks, think we found the issue. I'm sure there's a bit of a backlog so it may take you a moment to get the results you're looking for. Please feel free to reach out directly (either to me, or our delivery-supp...@cable.comcast.com distro) in the future if you have such an issue. -- Alex Brotman Sr. Engineer, Anti-Abuse & Messaging Policy Comcast > -Original Message- > From: mailop On Behalf Of Paul Ebersman via > mailop > Sent: Monday, November 27, 2023 2:41 PM > To: Faisal Misle via mailop > Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: [mailop] Comcast issues? > > faisal> Yes, there's been a few reports elsewhere. As Laura commented > faisal> somewhere: > > laura> "Given the amount of mail I'm getting today I suspect it's just > laura> "All lines are busy. Please try again."" > > LOL. > > Yes, black friday/cyber monday are the annual "oh yeah, i'd been meaning to > unsubscribe from vendor X emails. thanks for the reminder." clogging of all > our > inboxes. > ___ > mailop mailing list > mailop@mailop.org > https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop__;!!CQl3mcH > X2A!Fb9y-BBL2iZ- > wKj7LXwbSiLCCRTVh6I9IhyPw2fA9jHthBJUw9zbIx4rsCqYhOnrGAIPHWxgFA_FTM > ZiliM$ ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Comcast issues?
faisal> Yes, there's been a few reports elsewhere. As Laura commented faisal> somewhere: laura> "Given the amount of mail I'm getting today I suspect it's just laura> "All lines are busy. Please try again."" LOL. Yes, black friday/cyber monday are the annual "oh yeah, i'd been meaning to unsubscribe from vendor X emails. thanks for the reminder." clogging of all our inboxes. ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Convincing clients of the importance of eMail recipient consent for mailing list subscriptions
After the years of harassment I’ve endured by being subscribed to hundreds of thousands of mailing lists that are not double opt in, I’d say just casually toss my email into their mailing list and watch me convince them by way of harassment. I’m so far beyond asking nicely, my sanity wasn’t in short supply but it’s long gone. On 2023-11-27 12:42, Randolf Richardson, Postmaster via mailop wrote: What have you found to be some of the best approaches to convince clients that the confirmed opt-in process is necessary for operating eMail lists? (The ethical aspects are pretty straight-forward.) Many marketing people seem to be terrified of the idea of users having to confirm their consent when subscribing to a mailing list (e.g., by following a unique link in an eMail message to complete the process). The marketers almost always say "it will be too complicated for the average user," and want to eliminate the confirmation step altogether (which is not an ethical approach from my perspective). Presenting legal aspects is quite convenient here in Canada (because of our anti-spam laws), and preventing inclusion in blacklists is another helpful motivator, but I'd prefer to find a ways that get mailing list operators to want to ensure that "every eMail recipient consented" without the begrudging "we do this because we have to" perspective. Thank you for your thoughts and ideas. Postmaster - postmas...@inter-corporate.com Randolf Richardson - rand...@inter-corporate.com Inter-Corporate Computer & Network Services, Inc. Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada https://www.inter-corporate.com/ ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Comcast issues?
Yes, there's been a few reports elsewhere. As Laura commented somewhere: "Given the amount of mail I'm getting today I suspect it's just "All lines are busy. Please try again."" On Mon, Nov 27, 2023, at 8:01 PM, Jarland Donnell via mailop wrote: > Anyone else seeing issues connecting to comcast.net MX servers today? > We've got emails piling up in queue and connection failures all over. > ___ > mailop mailing list > mailop@mailop.org > https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Comcast issues?
jarland> Anyone else seeing issues connecting to comcast.net MX servers jarland> today? We've got emails piling up in queue and connection jarland> failures all over. Nope. Not just you. Been backing up since at least 07:43am PST this morning, still clogged on my server. ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Convincing clients of the importance of eMail recipient consent for mailing list subscriptions
Am 27.11.2023 um 11:04:33 Uhr schrieb Randolf Richardson, Postmaster via mailop: > > Without a confirmation, everybody can simply subscribe any address > > and that will be abused. > > I agree. What I'm trying to do is convince non-technical > management to side with taking care to respect consent instead of > siding with the marketing people who obviously don't care. Tell them about the abuse and ask them if they like that other can subscribe them to hundreds of mailing lists that they are not interested in. Don't they like it? Tell them that confirmation is a way to prohibit that. > In a way, this is a struggle between technical people who care about > consent vs. marketing people who just want to advertise and use > damage-control methods to clean up the mess (the marketers also seem > to refuse to care about the ethics or the blacklists, and have the > attitude that everyone's replaceable as long as they get what they > want). Tell them that annoying advertisement doesn't make people buy products. Much better advertising is to only advertise to the people interested. They need to understand that sending mails to people who don't like to receive them doesn't make them buy something - instead they blacklist you servers and other customers that are interested in your mail don't receive it anymore. ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
[mailop] Comcast issues?
Anyone else seeing issues connecting to comcast.net MX servers today? We've got emails piling up in queue and connection failures all over. ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Convincing clients of the importance of eMail recipient consent for mailing list subscriptions
> Am 27.11.2023 um 10:42:58 Uhr schrieb Randolf Richardson, Postmaster > via mailop: > > > Many marketing people seem to be terrified of the idea of > > users having to confirm their consent when subscribing to a mailing > > list (e.g., by following a unique link in an eMail message to > > complete the process). The marketers almost always say "it will be > > too complicated for the average user," and want to eliminate the > > confirmation step altogether (which is not an ethical approach from > > my perspective). > > Tell them that not doing opt-in will make them spammers and that the > servers of your company will be listed in blacklists, so you cannot > reach anybody until that listing is expired. We already do this, and we refuse to host any eMail lists that are not confirming consent properly because of the ethics considerations, and for the very reason that you just covered. > Without a confirmation, everybody can simply subscribe any address and > that will be abused. I agree. What I'm trying to do is convince non-technical management to side with taking care to respect consent instead of siding with the marketing people who obviously don't care. In a way, this is a struggle between technical people who care about consent vs. marketing people who just want to advertise and use damage-control methods to clean up the mess (the marketers also seem to refuse to care about the ethics or the blacklists, and have the attitude that everyone's replaceable as long as they get what they want). > Even the confirmation messages can already be used for mass mailing if > an abuser submits the form many times for many addresses. Yes. There are ways to mitigate at least some of that, but these techniques are beyond the scope of what I'm asking for -- I'm trying to find ways to persuade management that the technical measures are necessary and must take precedence over what the marketers want. (Thanks for your prompt reply.) Postmaster - postmas...@inter-corporate.com Randolf Richardson - rand...@inter-corporate.com Inter-Corporate Computer & Network Services, Inc. Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada https://www.inter-corporate.com/ ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Convincing clients of the importance of eMail recipient consent for mailing list subscriptions
Am 27.11.2023 um 10:42:58 Uhr schrieb Randolf Richardson, Postmaster via mailop: > Many marketing people seem to be terrified of the idea of > users having to confirm their consent when subscribing to a mailing > list (e.g., by following a unique link in an eMail message to > complete the process). The marketers almost always say "it will be > too complicated for the average user," and want to eliminate the > confirmation step altogether (which is not an ethical approach from > my perspective). Tell them that not doing opt-in will make them spammers and that the servers of your company will be listed in blacklists, so you cannot reach anybody until that listing is expired. Without a confirmation, everybody can simply subscribe any address and that will be abused. Even the confirmation messages can already be used for mass mailing if an abuser submits the form many times for many addresses. ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Yahoo Feedback Loop
Ah, I missed it because the "Original-Rcpt-To:" was a non-Yahoo domain. For future reference, that's the line in the header you're looking for. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions Midwest Internet Exchange The Brothers WISP - Original Message - From: "Mike Hammett via mailop" To: "mailop" Sent: Monday, November 27, 2023 8:50:37 AM Subject: [mailop] Yahoo Feedback Loop What do you do when someone keeps reporting conversations on a mailman mailing list that is opt-in only to Yahoo? It seems like they forgot they were on NANOG and are now reporting every message sent to it. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions Midwest Internet Exchange The Brothers WISP ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
[mailop] Convincing clients of the importance of eMail recipient consent for mailing list subscriptions
What have you found to be some of the best approaches to convince clients that the confirmed opt-in process is necessary for operating eMail lists? (The ethical aspects are pretty straight-forward.) Many marketing people seem to be terrified of the idea of users having to confirm their consent when subscribing to a mailing list (e.g., by following a unique link in an eMail message to complete the process). The marketers almost always say "it will be too complicated for the average user," and want to eliminate the confirmation step altogether (which is not an ethical approach from my perspective). Presenting legal aspects is quite convenient here in Canada (because of our anti-spam laws), and preventing inclusion in blacklists is another helpful motivator, but I'd prefer to find a ways that get mailing list operators to want to ensure that "every eMail recipient consented" without the begrudging "we do this because we have to" perspective. Thank you for your thoughts and ideas. Postmaster - postmas...@inter-corporate.com Randolf Richardson - rand...@inter-corporate.com Inter-Corporate Computer & Network Services, Inc. Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada https://www.inter-corporate.com/ ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Yahoo Feedback Loop
It appears that Mike Hammett via mailop said: >-=-=-=-=-=- >-=-=-=-=-=- > >What do you do when someone keeps reporting conversations on a mailman mailing >list that is opt-in only to Yahoo? > >It seems like they forgot they were on NANOG and are now reporting every >message sent to it. I just unsubscribe them. Life is too short. If they want to resub, that's up to them. I host a list of very non-technical folk dancers, and get spam reports every once in a while. Sometimes they complain and say they didn't report the mail as spam but sorry,really you did, I have the report right here. R's, John ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Yahoo Feedback Loop
> On Nov 27, 2023, at 10:13 AM, Mike Hammett via mailop > wrote: > > But on a mailman list with thousands of subscribers, I don't necessarily know > who did it. Actually the report includes the email address of the reporter; I just received it too, and I can tell you who it is if you want to hit me up offlist (sending this part to the list so folks know to look at the report). Anne --- Anne P. Mitchell, Esq. Email Law & Policy Attorney CEO Institute for Social Internet Public Policy (ISIPP) Author: Section 6 of the CAN-SPAM Act of 2003 (the Federal email marketing law) Creator of the term 'deliverability' and founder of the deliverability industry Author: The Email Deliverability Handbook Board of Directors, Denver Internet Exchange Dean Emeritus, Cyberlaw & Cybersecurity, Lincoln Law School Prof. Emeritus, Lincoln Law School Chair Emeritus, Asilomar Microcomputer Workshop Counsel Emeritus, eMail Abuse Prevention System (MAPS) ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Yahoo Feedback Loop
But on a mailman list with thousands of subscribers, I don't necessarily know who did it. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions Midwest Internet Exchange The Brothers WISP - Original Message - From: "Larry Smith" To: mailop@mailop.org, "Mike Hammett" Sent: Monday, November 27, 2023 9:19:05 AM Subject: Re: [mailop] Yahoo Feedback Loop Hmmm, my way of dealing with this behavior is on the first incident send them a personal, hey, you signed up for this mailing list warning, second incident bump them from the list with the option they can sign back up, third incident drop them and ban from coming back. -- Larry Smith lesm...@ecsis.net On Mon November 27 2023 08:50, Mike Hammett via mailop wrote: > What do you do when someone keeps reporting conversations on a mailman > mailing list that is opt-in only to Yahoo? > > It seems like they forgot they were on NANOG and are now reporting every > message sent to it. > > > > > - > Mike Hammett > Intelligent Computing Solutions > > Midwest Internet Exchange > > The Brothers WISP ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Yahoo Feedback Loop
Hmmm, my way of dealing with this behavior is on the first incident send them a personal, hey, you signed up for this mailing list warning, second incident bump them from the list with the option they can sign back up, third incident drop them and ban from coming back. -- Larry Smith lesm...@ecsis.net On Mon November 27 2023 08:50, Mike Hammett via mailop wrote: > What do you do when someone keeps reporting conversations on a mailman > mailing list that is opt-in only to Yahoo? > > It seems like they forgot they were on NANOG and are now reporting every > message sent to it. > > > > > - > Mike Hammett > Intelligent Computing Solutions > > Midwest Internet Exchange > > The Brothers WISP ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
[mailop] Yahoo Feedback Loop
What do you do when someone keeps reporting conversations on a mailman mailing list that is opt-in only to Yahoo? It seems like they forgot they were on NANOG and are now reporting every message sent to it. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions Midwest Internet Exchange The Brothers WISP ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
