subject:"RE\: MI\-L 3D files \(is now VM vs. Engage3D\)"

RE: MI-L 3D files (is now VM vs. Engage3D)

2005-10-12 Thread Jakob Lanstorp

Hi Flavio,
 
I do not agree. To a lot of raster work VM is far superior to Engage3D.
 
Engage3D:
Has vector in 3D yes, but you have no database attached to it. It is only a DXF 
file and there is no interaction with the 3D object in the 3D window. Making it 
only a viewer. For this to be THE tool it must refer to z-coords in MapInfo 
tab, and this is not a possibility do to the MapInfo TAB 2D format (no z-coords 
for nodes). 
 
VM:
The raster is 2½D (only one z-coord for a x,y) yes. But this is a minor problem 
when doing DEM analysis on a 3D surface. The interpolation part of VM is very 
strong to but the need: break lines (this is possible in Enage3D surface). I am 
not aware of the interpolation in Engage3D except that kriging is not possible.
 
VM has not got any major release for a long time that is for sure. This is 
properly due previous owners of VM and to the work effort concentrated on 
converting MapInfo to .NET. But this off course won't help any VM users.
 
-If a customer need to go all the way from data collection, interpolation, 
viewing and analysis I will still recommend Vertical Mapper.
 
-If the customer and laser scanned DWF city models the want to display with 
MapInfo tab files on top I would recommend Engage3D.
 
If the z-coord is implemented in the TAB file and MapInfo.NET arrives I think 
both VM and Engage3D are close to be dead, since every one "pretty easy" would 
be able of construction a DirectX full interactive database vector 3D engine.
 
-Button line vector: we need a z-coord in the tab format to go real 3D beyond 
VIM and Engaged to day.
-Button line raster: When performing analysis, 2½ D will do fine. I don't 
recall any 3D-raster or vector analyse possibilities in Engage3D, only 
viewing..
 
 
Cheers,
Jakob Lanstorp
Software Consultant
Geographical Information & IT
 
COWI A/S
Odensevej 95
DK-5260 Odense S.
 
Tel   +45 6311 4900
Fax  +45 6311 4949
Mob +45 5050 8087
E-mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.cowi.dk  
http://www.cowi.com  



From: Flavio Hendry [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wed 10/12/2005 11:17
To: Jakob Lanstorp; Nicolas Labombarda; MapInfo-L@lists.directionsmag.com
Subject: RE: MI-L 3D files



Hi Jacob

Excuse, but I do not agree with you. VM is a joke compared to Engage 3D
in any sense, Engage 3D is "real 3D", VM is a 2.5D toy, no 3D at all.
And as well the handling of DEMs in Engage 3D is far (better: far far
far) superior. This is as well the feedback we get from our clients,
experienced with both products (as soon as they got Engage, VM was
gone ...). You should definitely have a look at the just released 2.0.

And: VM seems to me is a dead end, no further development since 3-4
years, and very limited in data size handling.

Mit freundlichem Gruss / Best Regards
Flavio Hendry


TYDAC NEWS http://www.tydac.ch/german/index.php?menu=News_actual

  Mit freundlichen Gruessen / Kind Regards
 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 TYDAC AG - http://www.tydac.ch
Geographic Information Solutions
 Luternauweg 12 -- CH-3006 Bern
   Tel +41 (0)31 368 0180 - Fax +41 (0)31 368 1860





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Message number: 18216

RE: MI-L 3D files (is now VM vs. Engage3D)

2005-10-12 Thread Kent Hargesheimer

Jakob:

If you'd consider something outside the MI world, check out Amber IQ from
AmberCore in Ottawa, Canada.  Some of their core team members were at
Northwood previously (who originally built VM for MapInfo).

They offer next generation GIS specifically designed for 3D analysis (and
more) with no file size limits.  It is fast, intuitive, and you can import
MapInfo format data directly.  They offer a free trial download at
http://www.ambercore.com.

Kent Hargesheimer
Geographic Enterprises
http://www.geo-e.com
tel 919.341.1535
 

-Original Message-
From: Jakob Lanstorp [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: Wednesday, October 12, 2005 6:35 AM
To: Flavio Hendry; Nicolas Labombarda; MapInfo-L@lists.directionsmag.com
Subject: RE: MI-L 3D files (is now VM vs. Engage3D)

Hi Flavio,
 
I do not agree. To a lot of raster work VM is far superior to Engage3D.
 
Engage3D:
Has vector in 3D yes, but you have no database attached to it. It is only a
DXF file and there is no interaction with the 3D object in the 3D window.
Making it only a viewer. For this to be THE tool it must refer to z-coords
in MapInfo tab, and this is not a possibility do to the MapInfo TAB 2D
format (no z-coords for nodes). 
 
VM:
The raster is 2½D (only one z-coord for a x,y) yes. But this is a minor
problem when doing DEM analysis on a 3D surface. The interpolation part of
VM is very strong to but the need: break lines (this is possible in Enage3D
surface). I am not aware of the interpolation in Engage3D except that
kriging is not possible.
 
VM has not got any major release for a long time that is for sure. This is
properly due previous owners of VM and to the work effort concentrated on
converting MapInfo to .NET. But this off course won't help any VM users.
 
-If a customer need to go all the way from data collection, interpolation,
viewing and analysis I will still recommend Vertical Mapper.
 
-If the customer and laser scanned DWF city models the want to display with
MapInfo tab files on top I would recommend Engage3D.
 
If the z-coord is implemented in the TAB file and MapInfo.NET arrives I
think both VM and Engage3D are close to be dead, since every one "pretty
easy" would be able of construction a DirectX full interactive database
vector 3D engine.
 
-Button line vector: we need a z-coord in the tab format to go real 3D
beyond VIM and Engaged to day.
-Button line raster: When performing analysis, 2½ D will do fine. I don't
recall any 3D-raster or vector analyse possibilities in Engage3D, only
viewing..
 
 
Cheers,
Jakob Lanstorp
Software Consultant
Geographical Information & IT
 
COWI A/S
Odensevej 95
DK-5260 Odense S.
 
Tel   +45 6311 4900
Fax  +45 6311 4949
Mob +45 5050 8087
E-mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.cowi.dk <http://www.cowi.dk/> 
http://www.cowi.com <http://www.cowi.com/> 



From: Flavio Hendry [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wed 10/12/2005 11:17
To: Jakob Lanstorp; Nicolas Labombarda; MapInfo-L@lists.directionsmag.com
Subject: RE: MI-L 3D files



Hi Jacob

Excuse, but I do not agree with you. VM is a joke compared to Engage 3D
in any sense, Engage 3D is "real 3D", VM is a 2.5D toy, no 3D at all.
And as well the handling of DEMs in Engage 3D is far (better: far far
far) superior. This is as well the feedback we get from our clients,
experienced with both products (as soon as they got Engage, VM was
gone ...). You should definitely have a look at the just released 2.0.

And: VM seems to me is a dead end, no further development since 3-4
years, and very limited in data size handling.

Mit freundlichem Gruss / Best Regards
Flavio Hendry


TYDAC NEWS http://www.tydac.ch/german/index.php?menu=News_actual

  Mit freundlichen Gruessen / Kind Regards
 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 TYDAC AG - http://www.tydac.ch
Geographic Information Solutions
 Luternauweg 12 -- CH-3006 Bern
   Tel +41 (0)31 368 0180 - Fax +41 (0)31 368 1860





-
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Message number: 18216








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Message number: 18223

RE: MI-L 3D files (is now VM vs. Engage3D)

2005-10-12 Thread Flavio Hendry

hi Jakob

as follows:

> I do not agree. To a lot of raster work VM is far superior to
> Engage3D.

I don't know what you are using, but it seems it is not Engage 3D, as 
all you say is defintely wrong. Engage supports raster/grids in many 
formats and I can do almost anything with it: 3D (full, not a 2.5 view 
like in VM), many filters on grids, grid calculator, superior contour 
generator (best and fastest seen so far), slope, aspect, colouring, 
relief (in 2.0 amazing) and much more such as raster/vector overlays!!! 
there is nothing, absolutely nothing in VM that can compare.
  
> for this to be THE tool it must refer to z-coords in MapInfo tab

For 3-D vecotrs clearly as MI does not support 3D vectors. Where are 3D 
vectors in VM?

> interpolation part of VM is very strong to but the need

Engage (2.0) is as well here far better, i.e. it supports breaklines 
and huge files and has at least as many interpolation alogrythms as VM 
does.

> -If a customer need to go all the way from data collection,
> interpolation, viewing and analysis I will still recommend Vertical
> Mapper.

Engage is defintely superior as well here, see above.
  
> Mit freundlichem Gruss / Best Regards
> Flavio Hendry
> 
> 
> TYDAC NEWS http://www.tydac.ch/german/index.php?menu=News_actual
> 
>   Mit freundlichen Gruessen / Kind Regards
>  mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>  TYDAC AG - http://www.tydac.ch
> Geographic Information Solutions
>  Luternauweg 12 -- CH-3006 Bern
>    Tel +41 (0)31 368 0180 - Fax +41 (0)31 368 1860
> 



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Message number: 18226

RE: MI-L 3D files (is now VM vs. Engage3D)

2005-10-12 Thread Jakob Lanstorp

Well then I'm glad COWI sells both products :)

Did not get a changes to test version 2 of Engage3D. Did Encome get the
kriging interpolation add to the product ?

/Jakob

-Original Message-
From: Flavio Hendry [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: Wednesday, October 12, 2005 3:46 PM
To: Jakob Lanstorp; Nicolas Labombarda;
MapInfo-L@lists.directionsmag.com
Subject: RE: MI-L 3D files (is now VM vs. Engage3D)


hi Jakob

as follows:

> I do not agree. To a lot of raster work VM is far superior to 
> Engage3D.

I don't know what you are using, but it seems it is not Engage 3D, as 
all you say is defintely wrong. Engage supports raster/grids in many 
formats and I can do almost anything with it: 3D (full, not a 2.5 view 
like in VM), many filters on grids, grid calculator, superior contour 
generator (best and fastest seen so far), slope, aspect, colouring, 
relief (in 2.0 amazing) and much more such as raster/vector overlays!!! 
there is nothing, absolutely nothing in VM that can compare.
  
> for this to be THE tool it must refer to z-coords in MapInfo tab

For 3-D vecotrs clearly as MI does not support 3D vectors. Where are 3D 
vectors in VM?

> interpolation part of VM is very strong to but the need

Engage (2.0) is as well here far better, i.e. it supports breaklines 
and huge files and has at least as many interpolation alogrythms as VM 
does.

> -If a customer need to go all the way from data collection, 
> interpolation, viewing and analysis I will still recommend Vertical 
> Mapper.

Engage is defintely superior as well here, see above.
  
> Mit freundlichem Gruss / Best Regards
> Flavio Hendry
> 
> 
> TYDAC NEWS http://www.tydac.ch/german/index.php?menu=News_actual
> 
>   Mit freundlichen Gruessen / Kind Regards
>  mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>  TYDAC AG - http://www.tydac.ch
> Geographic Information Solutions
>  Luternauweg 12 -- CH-3006 Bern
>    Tel +41 (0)31 368 0180 - Fax +41 (0)31 368 1860
> 





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Message number: 18227

RE: MI-L 3D files (is now VM vs. Engage3D)

2005-10-12 Thread Flavio Hendry

interpolations as follows, optionally with breklines:
- inverse distance
- triangulation
- spatial neighbourhood with inverse distance
- minimum curvature
- density grid
- distance grid

no kriging.

Mit freundlichem Gruss / Best Regards
Flavio Hendry


TYDAC NEWS http://www.tydac.ch/german/index.php?menu=News_actual

      Mit freundlichen Gruessen / Kind Regards
             mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
         TYDAC AG - http://www.tydac.ch
            Geographic Information Solutions
             Luternauweg 12 -- CH-3006 Bern
   Tel +41 (0)31 368 0180 - Fax +41 (0)31 368 1860



-Original Message-
From: "Jakob Lanstorp" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Flavio Hendry" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "Nicolas Labombarda" 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, 
Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2005 15:54:43 +0200
Subject: RE: MI-L 3D files (is now VM vs. Engage3D)

> Well then I'm glad COWI sells both products :)
> 
> Did not get a changes to test version 2 of Engage3D. Did Encome get
> the
> kriging interpolation add to the product ?
> 
> /Jakob
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Flavio Hendry [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> Sent: Wednesday, October 12, 2005 3:46 PM
> To: Jakob Lanstorp; Nicolas Labombarda;
> MapInfo-L@lists.directionsmag.com
> Subject: RE: MI-L 3D files (is now VM vs. Engage3D)
> 
> 
> hi Jakob
> 
> as follows:
> 
> > I do not agree. To a lot of raster work VM is far superior to 
> > Engage3D.
> 
> I don't know what you are using, but it seems it is not Engage 3D, as
> all you say is defintely wrong. Engage supports raster/grids in many 
> formats and I can do almost anything with it: 3D (full, not a 2.5
> view 
> like in VM), many filters on grids, grid calculator, superior contour
> generator (best and fastest seen so far), slope, aspect, colouring, 
> relief (in 2.0 amazing) and much more such as raster/vector
> overlays!!! 
> there is nothing, absolutely nothing in VM that can compare.
>   
> > for this to be THE tool it must refer to z-coords in MapInfo tab
> 
> For 3-D vecotrs clearly as MI does not support 3D vectors. Where are
> 3D 
> vectors in VM?
> 
> > interpolation part of VM is very strong to but the need
> 
> Engage (2.0) is as well here far better, i.e. it supports breaklines 
> and huge files and has at least as many interpolation alogrythms as
> VM 
> does.
> 
> > -If a customer need to go all the way from data collection, 
> > interpolation, viewing and analysis I will still recommend Vertical
> > Mapper.
> 
> Engage is defintely superior as well here, see above.
>   
> > Mit freundlichem Gruss / Best Regards
> > Flavio Hendry
> > 
> > 
> > TYDAC NEWS http://www.tydac.ch/german/index.php?menu=News_actual
> > 
> >   Mit freundlichen Gruessen / Kind Regards
> >  mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >  TYDAC AG - http://www.tydac.ch
> > Geographic Information Solutions
> >  Luternauweg 12 -- CH-3006 Bern
> >    Tel +41 (0)31 368 0180 - Fax +41 (0)31 368 1860
> > 



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Message number: 18229

RE: MI-L 3D files (is now VM vs. Engage3D And Amber)

2005-10-12 Thread Jakob Lanstorp

Yes, I know of the product but did not have the time to play with it yet.
 
It comes with a .NET kit for developers. A raster tool like Amber SDK could in 
the new MapInfo.NET (not the name..) be brought as close to MapInfo as Vertical 
Mapper. Leaving VM i a dark hole.
 
A guess for the future would be that VM would be replaced by a Amber 
implementation in MapInfo.NET
 
(only a guess, I know nothing:)
 
 
 
 
Jakob Lanstorp
Software Consultant
Geographical Information & IT
 
COWI A/S
Odensevej 95
DK-5260 Odense S.
 
Tel   +45 6311 4900
Fax  +45 6311 4949
Mob +45 5050 8087
E-mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.cowi.dk <http://www.cowi.dk/> 
http://www.cowi.com <http://www.cowi.com/> 



From: Kent Hargesheimer [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wed 10/12/2005 14:50
To: MapInfo-L@lists.directionsmag.com
Subject: RE: MI-L 3D files (is now VM vs. Engage3D)



Jakob:

If you'd consider something outside the MI world, check out Amber IQ from
AmberCore in Ottawa, Canada.  Some of their core team members were at
Northwood previously (who originally built VM for MapInfo).

They offer next generation GIS specifically designed for 3D analysis (and
more) with no file size limits.  It is fast, intuitive, and you can import
MapInfo format data directly.  They offer a free trial download at
http://www.ambercore.com.

Kent Hargesheimer
Geographic Enterprises
http://www.geo-e.com
tel 919.341.1535


-Original Message-
From: Jakob Lanstorp [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, October 12, 2005 6:35 AM
To: Flavio Hendry; Nicolas Labombarda; MapInfo-L@lists.directionsmag.com
Subject: RE: MI-L 3D files (is now VM vs. Engage3D)

Hi Flavio,

I do not agree. To a lot of raster work VM is far superior to Engage3D.

Engage3D:
Has vector in 3D yes, but you have no database attached to it. It is only a
DXF file and there is no interaction with the 3D object in the 3D window.
Making it only a viewer. For this to be THE tool it must refer to z-coords
in MapInfo tab, and this is not a possibility do to the MapInfo TAB 2D
format (no z-coords for nodes).

VM:
The raster is 2½D (only one z-coord for a x,y) yes. But this is a minor
problem when doing DEM analysis on a 3D surface. The interpolation part of
VM is very strong to but the need: break lines (this is possible in Enage3D
surface). I am not aware of the interpolation in Engage3D except that
kriging is not possible.

VM has not got any major release for a long time that is for sure. This is
properly due previous owners of VM and to the work effort concentrated on
converting MapInfo to .NET. But this off course won't help any VM users.

-If a customer need to go all the way from data collection, interpolation,
viewing and analysis I will still recommend Vertical Mapper.

-If the customer and laser scanned DWF city models the want to display with
MapInfo tab files on top I would recommend Engage3D.

If the z-coord is implemented in the TAB file and MapInfo.NET arrives I
think both VM and Engage3D are close to be dead, since every one "pretty
easy" would be able of construction a DirectX full interactive database
vector 3D engine.

-Button line vector: we need a z-coord in the tab format to go real 3D
beyond VIM and Engaged to day.
-Button line raster: When performing analysis, 2½ D will do fine. I don't
recall any 3D-raster or vector analyse possibilities in Engage3D, only
viewing..


Cheers,
Jakob Lanstorp
Software Consultant
Geographical Information & IT

COWI A/S
Odensevej 95
DK-5260 Odense S.

Tel   +45 6311 4900
Fax  +45 6311 4949
Mob +45 5050 8087
E-mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.cowi.dk <http://www.cowi.dk/>
http://www.cowi.com <http://www.cowi.com/>



From: Flavio Hendry [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wed 10/12/2005 11:17
To: Jakob Lanstorp; Nicolas Labombarda; MapInfo-L@lists.directionsmag.com
Subject: RE: MI-L 3D files



Hi Jacob

Excuse, but I do not agree with you. VM is a joke compared to Engage 3D
in any sense, Engage 3D is "real 3D", VM is a 2.5D toy, no 3D at all.
And as well the handling of DEMs in Engage 3D is far (better: far far
far) superior. This is as well the feedback we get from our clients,
experienced with both products (as soon as they got Engage, VM was
gone ...). You should definitely have a look at the just released 2.0.

And: VM seems to me is a dead end, no further development since 3-4
years, and very limited in data size handling.

Mit freundlichem Gruss / Best Regards
Flavio Hendry


TYDAC NEWS http://www.tydac.ch/german/index.php?menu=News_actual

  Mit freundlichen Gruessen / Kind Regards
 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 TYDAC AG - http://www.tydac.ch
Geographic Information Solutions

RE: MI-L 3D files (is now VM vs. Engage3D)

RE: MI-L 3D files (is now VM vs. Engage3D)

RE: MI-L 3D files (is now VM vs. Engage3D)

RE: MI-L 3D files (is now VM vs. Engage3D)

RE: MI-L 3D files (is now VM vs. Engage3D)

RE: MI-L 3D files (is now VM vs. Engage3D And Amber)

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