Re: [Marxism] Juan Cole: White Terrorism
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == I read several news sources this morning and saw nothing stating these things, either as fact or as rumor. Anybody have any idea where Cole got them? - Bill Fred Feldman quoted from Cole: And among the concerns that came to dominate him as he moved to the Right was the illegitimacy of the “Second Constitution� (the 14th Amendment, which bestows citizenship on all those born in the US, a provision right-wingers in Arizona are trying to overturn at the state level). Loughner also thought that Federal funding for his own community college was unconstitutional, and he was thrown out for becoming violent over the issue. He obviously shared with the Arizona Right a fascination with firearms, He is said to have used marijuana, but that says nothing about his politics; it could be consistent with a form of anti-government, right-wing Libertarianism. Send list submissions to: Marxism@lists.econ.utah.edu Set your options at: http://lists.econ.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Role of the Army
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == I thought that the argument was 1. If the army is (generally, in all but the most revolutionary circumstances - i.e. the Red army under Trotsky) the enemy of the people. 2. How could anyone, of any gender or sexual preference, be defended if they choose to join? What happens AFTER they join is a totally different question. Not an unimportant one, no - but let's try to deal with first things first. - Bill Peggy Dobbins wrote: == Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == On Thu, Nov 4, 2010 at 6:26 PM, Dan d.koech...@wanadoo.fr wrote: The Army is the enemy of the people. For goodness sake, the armed forces are a pretty critical variable in any societal transformation, forward as well as backward, and stabilization whichever direction. The People have no hope if The Army is always and by definition the enemy of the people. Does someone think 'the proletarian state' is sans army? How then could they be for the working class as the ruling class? This is why trusting peace and justice to a spirit above or the spirit within is always just smelling the incense whoever buys it for or from the guru. Send list submissions to: Marxism@lists.econ.utah.edu Set your options at: http://lists.econ.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
[Marxism-Thaxis] Free Ebook Service Of Interest (Was U of C Ebooks)
Have you looked at http://a.rg.org There is a strong focus on postmodernist heroes, but a fruitful supply of materials on Marxism, Frankfurt School authors, etc. There is no search mechanism, but you can click on Library and then search alphabetically by author. You can sign up for a daily new additions newsletter. I think that rg.org is not a producer per se but an aggregator, as well as an indicator to others willing to laboriously scan a work. I've noted that items requested often show up a few days later! To date, only Verso has issued a formal cease and desist request. - Bill Ralph Dumain wrote: University of California Press has made a whole collection of e-books available online, many of them in their entirety for free. I'm oting just a few such books on Marxism ( a few realated topics) of interest: ___ Marxism-Thaxis mailing list Marxism-Thaxis@lists.econ.utah.edu To change your options or unsubscribe go to: http://lists.econ.utah.edu/mailman/listinfo/marxism-thaxis
Re: [Marxism] [microsound] 2010 Left Forum: the Sunday sessions
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == Louis Proyect wrote: I have big plans for this: 1. videos from events like the Left Forum or other such events in the Big Apple. 2. interviews with people like David Harvey. 3. A video class on introduction to socialism that will be starring yours truly. If you do get into this - and I really hope that you do (I'm sure that you will find lots of people in the area willing to help) please play attention to the sound issues. I noted in an email to the list last October that a lot of what shows up on YouTube and elsewhere is recorded (by well-meaning people) in flat-wall classrooms or lecture halls with no sound absorption, and as a result have a high degree of reverb and are almost impossible to hear. Jeff had this response... - Actually the reason is because they placed the recording microphone somewhere in the room, rather than on the podium in front of the speaker's mouth (or equivalently, using a feed from the sound board). The sound quality was ruined before it even got digitized. -- May require finding some left-oriented sound recording experts! And then, of course, there is the issue of adding subtitles for the comrades in France, Germany, Brazil, Spain, Japan, Belarus, Norway, India, etc. [insert smiley here] - Bill Send list submissions to: Marxism@lists.econ.utah.edu Set your options at: http://lists.econ.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Moderators Please! Was 9/11 truther burp
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == Here's the thing - I only have so much time during the day to keep up with this very useful Marxmail, plus a few others, and some of the debates/discussions are complex and require close, careful reading and often take me off to other time-consuming directions and to other time-consuming sources. So why does the list allow 9/11 conspiracy dreck to creep in occasionally to waste everyone's time? (If I am speaking only for myself, sorry.) There a number of other discussion lists specifically focusing on 9/11 conspiracy theories, right? - Bill Thomas Bias wrote: == Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == Lookit, the whole lot of you all missed my point: it has nothing to do with what I personally think about 9/11 or the Kennedy assassination or whatever. It has to do with the 9/11 Truthers who are out there. I work with them; they are part of our antiwar coalition here in northwestern New Jersey, and I have to tell you, their role has been positive. Yes, I've had arguments with some of them about any number of things, including climate change, which I emphatically do NOT deny. But when the chips are down, and it's time to take action, they've been out there together with us to demand Out Now from Afghanistan and Iraq. I'm glad to see them at our Friday evening vigil. Are there nutbags among the 9/11 Truthers? Sure. Are there nutbags among us socialists? 'Fraid so. Did anyone promise that building a united front was neat and tidy? If someone did, that someone was misinformed! I completely agree with David, however: whether or not 9/11 was an inside job makes no difference to me. I have no doubt that the capitalist ruling class is morally capable of committing such a crime, because it has committed worse crimes in the past. It must be overthrown, no matter what one concludes about 9/11. Just for myself, however, I find the 9/11 Commission's report not to be any more plausible than the Warren Commission's. I don't know WHAT they're covering up, but they're covering SOMETHING up. They have not proven their case to me beyond a reasonable doubt, not even close. Tom -Original Message- From: marxism-bounces+biastg=embarqmail@lists.econ.utah.edu [mailto:marxism-bounces+biastg=embarqmail@lists.econ.utah.edu] On Behalf Of David Picón Álvarez Sent: Saturday, February 27, 2010 11:25 AM To: Thomas Bias Subject: Re: [Marxism] 9/11 truther burp == Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == This discussion is absolutely ridiculous. Let's concede all the claims, for the sake of the argument, of the people who believe the attack was some sort of false flag operation carried by the US state apparatus. My question is: ok, so what? Honest question here. The US bourgeoisie through its own machinations and state power kills far more people than that every month. Let's imagine that only 2m deaths are directly imputable to their actions since 2001 (yes, hard to imagine a figure that low, stay with me here). It would take 50 years of a WTC attack per month to reach those numbers. Why do we care about this again? In addition, we don't have to pretend we're structural engineers or specialists in aviation catastrophes to see the hand of the bourgeoisie in those deaths. We don't have to invent a conspiracy theory on who is responsible for the invasion of Iraq: we know; we don't have to invent a conspiracy theory on who is responsible for the invasion of Afghanistan: we know. Ditto for all the postcolonialist resource wars in Africa, etc, even if the relations are more tenuous and harder to track. So why are we caring about 4000 people who died about 8 years ago? Are they so much more important than Iraqis? I'd go into how I think at the root of many of these conspiracies there is a sort of insular sense that only the US has agency, that some third world foreigners couldn't have executed such a plan successfully, etc, but the fact is, it's absolutely irrelevant. Really, who cares? --David. Send list submissions to: Marxism@lists.econ.utah.edu Set your options at: http://lists.econ.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/biastg%40embarqmail.com Send list submissions to: Marxism@lists.econ.utah.edu Set your options at:
Re: [Marxism] glaciergate
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == Sorry - I can't make any sense of this paragraph. What major new story? What is the reference to Enron meant to suggest? - Bill Shawn Redden wrote: But the fact that Mike Davis thinks that capitalist development has screwed the world doesn't in any way encourage me to disregard the major new story that the major scientific mouthpiece for the 'global warming' agenda has an e-mail log to hearkens back to Enron. Send list submissions to: Marxism@lists.econ.utah.edu Set your options at: http://lists.econ.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Asst. Moderator's Note (was A vial of poison ++)
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == Is it possible that the list and it's readers have again fallen into a trap? We have one venomous bastard trolling for contentious argument - always phrasing his replies as nastily as he can expecting that the responses will be as nasty, if not more so, so that he will have the fun of escalating. And in the long run, how many well-meaning contributors will decide, for good reason, to drop out and leave us without their insights to other struggles? Please, Moderators - a time out for Schanoes. A year sounds good. - Bill S. Artesian wrote: == Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == OK, one last post each? Sure, that gives the slandering poseur Gorojovsky one more opportunity to fire off another round of spittle from that squirt gun he calls a brain. [I presume it's OK if I address the poseur Gorojovsky in the manner, and tone, in which he addresses others who don't exactly jump on his bandwagon of patriotism...and lies? I apologize if that's an unwarranted assumption and hope the list will bear with me]. I've have said concretely, with references to Marx and without sighs and references to great crimes [see above reference to bandwagons and patriotism], all that needs to be said regarding the complexity of Marx's notions of progress and endorsement of nationalism. Nestor, covering himself with the names Marx, Engels, Lenin Trotsky, like a naked man caught in the street covers himself with somebody else's jacket, adds nothing, not an iota to an understanding of the issues, of the real positions, and of the real difficulties in the positions expressed, considered, discussed, and finally adopted by Marx...and Engels. Nothing is concrete for our great slandering reverse telescoper, because there are no definite social relations of production to the actual course of history-- none, Bismarck is Lincoln, Prussia is the North, the North is national unity, Prussia is national unity, the North is good, ergo Prussia is good, Prussia is supported, nationalism is good, separation of the specificity of the workers' struggle from the struggle for national unity is bad. That's the sum total and meaning of the slanderer Gorojovsky's supposed Marxism. Now I am one to think that things said offlist should remain offlist. Apparently our slandering, whining, poseur Gorojovsky does not agree. He makes references to my menaces. In the interests of truth in advertising let me explain. In of our more recent go-rounds, around 11/27/09, the slandering whining Gorojovsky accused me of supporting, facilitating, enabling mass murder, or mass murderers by imperialism due to a disagreement I expressed with his uncritical endorsement of nationalism [see above reference to bandwagons, patriotism, and lies]. I think his exact words were the Leftist objective allies of our mass murderers.Les intervened to say the discussion should be offlist. I agreed and responded to our greater whining Oz offlist, cautioning him to never say anything electronically he would not say to my face, and that if he ever got to NYC, to please look me up [as I would him if I ever get to Argentina], so I could offer him the opportunity to say such things to my face.I don't think there's any doubt about what I meant, and intended by guaranteeing he wouldn't like my response. So I couldn't care less whether or not the whining slanderer Gorojovsky sets foot anywhere in the world. It's what he says and does that counts. He wants to sell woof tickets?-- accusing people of being enablers of mass murder--- well, I'm buying. And in cash. - Original Message - From: Les Schaffer schaf...@optonline.net To: David Schanoes sartes...@earthlink.net Sent: Sunday, January 17, 2010 2:17 PM Subject: [Marxism] Asst. Moderator's Note (was A vial of poison ++) == Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == On 1/17/2010 1:43 PM, Néstor Gorojovsky wrote: This is just for the record ok, so lets close this set of threads for now, i think Nestor has had his say, anyone else, one last post each. Les Send list submissions to: Marxism@lists.econ.utah.edu Set your options at: http://lists.econ.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/wquimby%40embarqmail.com Send list submissions to:
Re: [Marxism] Books on the First International
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == I found the 3 volume history of the International by Julius Braunthal to be informative, plus rather entertaining, in a way, via his reminiscences of his (bureaucratic) participation in - and his lifelong contact with - the International movement. Here is a brief bio of Braunthal I lifted off the internet to illustrate this involvement. Born in Vienna 1891, died in Teddington, Great Britain 1972; writer, active in the international social democratic movement; member of the executive committees of the Sozialdemokratische Arbeiterpartei in Österreich (SDAP) and the Republikanischer Schutzbund; imprisoned and tried for high treason in 1934, expelled from Austria in 1935; lived in Belgium 1935-1936; settled in Great Britain in 1938; editor of the Tribune from 1937, the International Socialist Forum 1938-1948; secretary of the Committee of the International Socialist Conferences (COMISCO) 1949-1951, secretary-general of the Socialist International (SI) 1951-1956; author of the `History of the International' in three volumes, published between 1961-1971. It's titled simply History Of The International and the volumes are v. 1. 1864-1914.--v. 2. 1914-1943--v. 3. 1943-1968. (First volume appears in English in 1966.) If that's too much, or can't be found, try Lichtheims's Short History of Socialism starting with p. 157. (I'm pretty sure that it is in paperback.) (Published 1970) Naturally, conclusions by Braunthal and Lichtheim have been disputed, so read with the old open mind. More recent? I checked the central catalog for Ohio colleges and found only two other recent works. I have read neither, and the second is a product of the anti-Communist Hoover Institute. 1974 Novack, George Edward The first three Internationals, their history and lessons [by] George Novack, Dave Frankel [and] Fred Feldman Pathfinder Press 1966 Drachkovitch, Milorad The revolutionary internationals, 1864-1943 Published for Hoover Institution on War, Revolution, and Peace by Stanford University Press, 1966 - Bill Joonas Laine wrote: == Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == Hi, any recommendations for good histories of the First International..? I know about the Stekloff book on MIA, but I was looking for something that I could read on paper, and perhaps something that's more recent as well. Thanks! Send list submissions to: Marxism@lists.econ.utah.edu Set your options at: http://lists.econ.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/wquimby%40embarqmail.com Send list submissions to: Marxism@lists.econ.utah.edu Set your options at: http://lists.econ.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Trotsky lives -- Paul Le Blanc reviewsRobertService's biography.
== Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == Oh, cut the crap. Posting a review of a book in question IS NOT automatically a personal endorsement of a book, and there is not a single word in Dogan's message suggesting that he supports the review as an honest assessment of an honest book. If you want to be the list's pit bull I suggest that you campaign for it. In the meantime I reject your self nomination. - Bill S. Artesian wrote: == Rule #1: YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. == I'm criticizing the presentation of the review which you present, and uncritically, as an honest assessment of an honest book. (snip) Your posting the review of Losurdo's book contains more than just the attempt to inform list members. It includes an endorsement of the review. Send list submissions to: Marxism@lists.econ.utah.edu Set your options at: http://lists.econ.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Comp Help Needed - Reverb In Online Spoken Videos - Cure?
Yes, that helped a lot! Thanks Les! - Bill Les Schaffer wrote: Bill Quimby wrote: Is there anything I should do or can do to improve the sound quality on my end i listen to this stuff with headphones and its not a problem... i think it would sound worse on speakers, since your room will also highlight the low frequency stuff that Jeff pointed out. Les YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. Send list submissions to: Marxism@lists.econ.utah.edu Set your options at: http://lists.econ.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/wquimby%40embarqmail.com YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. Send list submissions to: Marxism@lists.econ.utah.edu Set your options at: http://lists.econ.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
[Marxism] Goldstone To Soeak At Brandeis ... Yeah, Right!
From the Boston Globe 10/22/09 Brandeis University said yesterday that it will host a forum next month with South African Judge Richard Goldstone, the author of a fiercely controversial United Nations fact-finding report that accused Israeli forces as well as Palestinian fighters of committing war crimes in Gaza. In what is sure to be a heated debate, Goldstone will discuss his report for the first time with a senior Israeli political figure. Dore Gold, former Israeli ambassador to the United Nations, will respond to Goldstone in the forum and then both will take questions from the audience. Full article at http://www.boston.com/news/education/higher/articles/2009/10/22/brandeis_to_host_gaza_violence_forum/ Watch for the coming cancellation prompted by the Israeli lobby! - Bill YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. Send list submissions to: Marxism@lists.econ.utah.edu Set your options at: http://lists.econ.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Internationale in English (with lyrics)
Any idea when the video footage was made? And where? England, of course, from the police uniforms. - Bill marxist front wrote: Internationale (with lyrics) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5DTbashsKicNR=1 The British/Irish version of the Internationale sung by Alistair Hulett. Lal Salam (Red Salute) P (India) www.geocities.com/marxistfront marxistfr...@yahoo.co.in When I gave food to the poor, they called me a saint. When I asked why the poor were hungry, they called me a communist. --Dom Helder Camara * Add whatever you love to the Yahoo! India homepage. Try now! http://in.yahoo.com/trynew YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. Send list submissions to: Marxism@lists.econ.utah.edu Set your options at: http://lists.econ.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/wquimby%40embarqmail.com YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. Send list submissions to: Marxism@lists.econ.utah.edu Set your options at: http://lists.econ.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
[Marxism] More On the Republic Windows And Doors Struggle
Last Wednesday former CEO of Republic Windows Doors, Richard Gillman, was arrested at his Magnificent Mile condominium in Chicago and charged with a laundry list of crimes related to the liquidation of the company’s enterprise in Chicago last December. Among the eight felony counts detailed by Assistant State’s Attorney John Mahoney were money laundering, theft, organizing a continuing financial crime enterprise, and mail fraud. Gilman was subsequently taken into custody after Cook County Judge Peggy Chiampas set bail at $10 million. Last December, about 250 workers at Republic’s Chicago plant occupied the factory following its abrupt closing. At issue was the payment of unused vacation time, the immediate termination of health insurance, as well as the 60-days severance pay mandated by federal law in a mass layoff event. After six days of mounting working class support in the US and internationally, the occupation was defused though a deal brokered with Bank of America for an extension of credit to pay the workers back pay and to provide two months of health insurance coverage. See the full article at http://www.wsws.org/articles/2009/sep2009/repu-s16.shtml - Bill YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. Send list submissions to: Marxism@lists.econ.utah.edu Set your options at: http://lists.econ.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Moderator's note
Whatsa apst, please? - Bill Tom Cod wrote: Thank you! we don't need to have this become another apst. Date: Sun, 23 Aug 2009 14:48:53 -0400 From: l...@panix.com Subject: [Marxism] Moderator's note To: t...@hotmail.com Greg Butler has been unsubbed. YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. Send list submissions to: Marxism@lists.econ.utah.edu Set your options at: http://lists.econ.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/tcod%40hotmail.com _ Windows Live: Make it easier for your friends to see what you’re up to on Facebook. http://windowslive.com/Campaign/SocialNetworking?ocid=PID23285::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:SI_SB_facebook:082009 YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. Send list submissions to: Marxism@lists.econ.utah.edu Set your options at: http://lists.econ.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/wquimby%40embarqmail.com YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. Send list submissions to: Marxism@lists.econ.utah.edu Set your options at: http://lists.econ.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Pittsburgh Protests?
It's the G-20 meeting. See the G-20 page at http://www.g20.org/ From the site... Since 1999, the G-20 has contributed to strengthen the international financial architecture and to foster sustainable economic growth and development. The G-20 now has a crucial role in driving forward work between advanced and emerging economies to tackle the international financial and economic crisis, restore worldwide financial stability, lead the international economic recovery and secure a sustainable future for all countries. Papers report that they are looking for 4000 extra police from all over the country to control demonstrations. - Bill Tom Cod wrote: there's been a lot of traffic on a local activist list I sub to about protests planned for some kind of G-8 conclave set to occur in Pittsburgh? _ Hotmail® is up to 70% faster. Now good news travels really fast. http://windowslive.com/online/hotmail?ocid=PID23391::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WM_HYGN_faster:082009 YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. Send list submissions to: Marxism@lists.econ.utah.edu Set your options at: http://lists.econ.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/wquimby%40embarqmail.com YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. Send list submissions to: Marxism@lists.econ.utah.edu Set your options at: http://lists.econ.utah.edu/mailman/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
