Re: MD: recompressing (was MiniDisc Your Music)
I have several MDs of assorted jazz that were downloaded from MP3.com as 128K MP3's. I've used CoolEdit 2000 to decompress and play them via S/PDIF (TOSlink) to the MDS-PC recorder. I've noticed very few artifacts that I can attribute to the MDs ATRAC encoding. The biggest problem with 128K MP3 in general seems to be in the treble; it sometimes it sounds almost like a recording made with a cheap microphone. This sound is there when I play the file directly from the computer and the MD faithfully reproduces this problem. MDs made from CDs or LPs do not exhibit this. My opinion is that the additional audible damage incured when recording from 128K MP3s to MD is miniscule. Factors such as choice of MP3 decoder and type of connection between the PC and MD probably have far more of an audible effect than the ATRAC artifacts.. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
MD: recompressing (was MiniDisc Your Music)
Don Capps asked, | This is the kind of thing I just don't understand. ... If you take | an MP3, RA, WM, LA, or any OTHER type of compressed audio file you care to | name, and record that file to minidisc, it has just been compressed again. | Data has been lost not once but twice. This simply HAS to have deleterious | effects on fidelity. Someone else brought that up just a couple weeks ago. You aren't recompressing compressed data; you are compressing the decom- pressed output of a previous compression. The various codecs have overlap in what they consider expendable; they are not orthogonal to one another. If you record the output of a 12:1 MP3 file to MD at 5:1, the result will be worse than 12:1, but it won't be as bad as 60:1. Try it for yourself. By the same token, re-ATRACking an MD track results in something a little worse than 5:1, but not in 25:1. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: recompressing (was MiniDisc Your Music)
On Tue, 20 Feb 2001 10:50:17 -0600 (CST), "David W. Tamkin" [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If you record the output of a 12:1 MP3 file to MD at 5:1, the result will be worse than 12:1, but it won't be as bad as 60:1. Try it for yourself. By the same token, re-ATRACking an MD track results in something a little worse than 5:1, but not in 25:1. I have not conducted this test, but I have been told by those that have, that you can re-record MD in ANALOG about 8x before you will hear audible degradation. If so, I don't see the issue the mp3 ... it should sound just fine (if you liked it to start with). -jts Arlington, TX - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: recompressing (was MiniDisc Your Music)
* "David W. Tamkin" [EMAIL PROTECTED] on Tue, 20 Feb 2001 | If you record the output of a 12:1 MP3 file to MD at 5:1, the result will be | worse than 12:1, but it won't be as bad as 60:1. Try it for yourself. And may in fact be undetectable, depending on the MP3 encoder and decoder used. | By the same token, re-ATRACking an MD track results in something a little | worse than 5:1, but not in 25:1. IIRC it takes five analog generations before degradation becomes noticeable, and ten or more before audio quality is reduced below acceptable levels (ie, audio casette). -- Rat [EMAIL PROTECTED]\ Happy Fun Ball contains a liquid core, Minion of Nathan - Nathan says Hi! \ which, if exposed due to rupture, should PGP Key: at a key server near you! \ not be touched, inhaled, or looked at. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: recompressing (was MiniDisc Your Music)
From: "David W. Tamkin" [EMAIL PROTECTED] You aren't recompressing compressed data; you are compressing the decompressed output of a previous compression. The various codecs have overlap in what they consider expendable; they are not orthogonal to one another. David, I'm not sure exactly what you mean by the statement : "You aren't recompressing compressed data; you are compressing the decompressed output of a previous compression." As I understand it, in MP3 compression (as in MD compression) data is thrown away...ie: lost forever. Hence the term "lossy compression". The data thrown away in the compression process is gone, never to be recovered again. Now, I am aware that converting an MP3 back into a .wav file produces a VERY large file similar in size, if not exactly the same size as the original .wav file. But I was under the impression that this was accomplished by use of an interpolative filter which essentially "guesses" how the file should look when reconstructed. Am I wrong about this? Now, as to what degree of compression occurs when that file is then rencoded to MD, here I will have to confess complete ignorance. But I venture to say that at least SOME additional data is lost, thereby compromising fidelity that much further. Don C. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: recompressing (was MiniDisc Your Music)
Don Capps wrote: But I venture to say that at least SOME additional data is lost, thereby compromising fidelity that much further. The point that David, Ratman and others have tried to make to you is that yes this is some additional compression when you record MP3 files on to MD, but the compression is not a direct multiple of each compression scheme. The important point is that they have tried to make is that the lose involved is too small to be audible by the human ear. The perfect example they gave was making copies of MDs. The original loss is the most significant. After that they (I assume that some of the people making the statements have actually tried this at home) notice no audible difference for several generations. To actually "see" this you would have to be able to "look" at the bits after decoding the MP3 or MD. The wave files of a decoded MP3 files is probably a good example. You are "putting stuff back" so to speak. larry - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
