Re: [MBZ] OT: Solar update

2017-05-31 Thread Jim Cathey via Mercedes 
Our farm had a hydraulic ram pump at one time for stock watering.  Pump is
still in the barn.  It takes a bit of water flow, but if you have it it'll
run 24x7 for decades.  There's only one moving part.

-- Jim
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Re: [MBZ] OT: Solar update

2017-05-31 Thread Curley McLain via Mercedes 
Does your pond have a fairly steady overflow?  If so: How about a 
hydraulic ram?  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydraulic_ram  In the 
tripics they build them out of bamboo.

https://www.amazon.com/Hydraulic-Ram-Pumps-Supply-Systems/dp/1853391727

http://www.watersanitationhygiene.org/References/EH_KEY_REFERENCES/WATER/Water%20Pumping/Ram%20Pumps/Hydraulic%20Ram%20Pump%20Manual%20(ITDG).pdf

http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-12-PVC-Hydraulic-Ram-Hydram-shtf-Water-Pump-Homestead-Off-Grid-Remote-/262713334824?hash=item3d2aef5c28:g:GxsAAOSwImRYNNPE

Curt Raymond via Mercedes <mailto:mercedes@okiebenz.com>
May 31, 2017 at 12:35 PM
Thats actually not a terrible idea. I've looked at some micro-hydro 
setups on ebay that I could produce a little power with. Again under 
the theory that 1-2 gallons an hour 24 hours a day would probably be 
plenty.
I'm thinking a 1/4hp 110v pump ought to do the job easy enough. This 
fall I'll start thinking about how/where to mount it. We've got a hand 
pump down there already, I should be able to tap off its intake. Maybe 
build a box that mounts to the 4x4s its on.

-Curt


From: Meade Dillon <dillonm...@gmail.com>
To: Curt Raymond <curtlud...@yahoo.com>; Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
Sent: Wednesday, May 31, 2017 1:25 PM
Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT: Solar update

OK, then you need a bigger dam with hydroelectric to run your pump to 
fill your water tank.


-
Max
Charleston SC

On Wed, May 31, 2017 at 12:51 PM, Curt Raymond <curtlud...@yahoo.com> 
wrote:


Any pump will need winterizing. The problem with a windmill is that 
the pond is down in a hole. Its man made, they dammed a stream to make 
the pond, its probably 30' below the surrounding fields. By the time I 
make enough tower to get significant wind I could have run power from 
the street.







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Meade Dillon via Mercedes <mailto:mercedes@okiebenz.com>
May 31, 2017 at 12:25 PM
OK, then you need a bigger dam with hydroelectric to run your pump to fill
your water tank.

-
Max
Charleston SC

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Curt Raymond via Mercedes <mailto:mercedes@okiebenz.com>
May 31, 2017 at 11:51 AM
Any pump will need winterizing. The problem with a windmill is that 
the pond is down in a hole. Its man made, they dammed a stream to make 
the pond, its probably 30' below the surrounding fields. By the time I 
make enough tower to get significant wind I could have run power from 
the street.
I like Mitch's idea of solar on the pump house but its another 
panel/charge controller and battery. Better to use 110v, its not a 
huge run, maybe 100 feet...

-Curt

From: Meade Dillon <dillonm...@gmail.com>
To: Curt Raymond <curtlud...@yahoo.com>; Mercedes Discussion List 
<mercedes@okiebenz.com>

Sent: Tuesday, May 30, 2017 7:05 PM
Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT: Solar update

How about a windmill?  Use the wind to drive the pump to fill the 
tank, have a powered version for back-up.


https://www.etsy.com/listing/257221071/build-your-own-windmill-diy-plans-water?_source=google_medium=cpc_campaign=shopping_us_b-craft_supplies_and_tools-tools_and_equipment_custom1=46053756-0188-4cd6-8794-323f32338a3c=CjwKEAjwsLTJBRCvibaW9bGLtUESJAC4wKw12UKmPkgbtgTis4ycOBxcHRYGsbSWeVoTYZAWBGw6SxoCKDTw_wcB

Hmm, may be a hassle to deal with winterizing, have to design it so 
easy to de-water for the winter.


-
Max
Charleston SC





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Meade Dillon via Mercedes <mailto:mercedes@okiebenz.com>
May 30, 2017 at 6:05 PM
How about a windmill? Use the wind to drive the pump to fill the tank,
have a powered version for back-up.

https://www.etsy.com/listing/257221071/build-your-own-windmill-diy-plans-water?_source=google_medium=cpc_campaign=shopping_us_b-craft_supplies_and_tools-tools_and_equipment_custom1=46053756-0188-4cd6-8794-323f32338a3c=CjwKEAjwsLTJBRCvibaW9bGLtUESJAC4wKw12UKmPkgbtgTis4ycOBxcHRYGsbSWeVoTYZAWBGw6SxoCKDTw_wcB

Hmm, may be a hassle to deal with winterizing, have to design it so 
easy to

de-water for the winter.

-
Max
Charleston SC
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Curt Raymond v

Re: [MBZ] OT: Solar update

2017-05-31 Thread Floyd Thursby via Mercedes 
We were in Argentina staying at this little hotel and they had a small 
turbine in a stream that ran past the place.  They had a small dam (like 
just a foot high, the stream was pretty steep and ran a good amount) up 
about 150ft from the little turbine house and ran a 4" PVC pipe down to 
it.  Maybe 6ft of head on it?  That thing spun like crazy.  I'm not sure 
how much they were getting off it or if they had grid power too, but it 
looked way cool.


--FT


On 5/31/17 1:25 PM, Meade Dillon via Mercedes wrote:

OK, then you need a bigger dam with hydroelectric to run your pump to fill
your water tank.

-
Max
Charleston SC

On Wed, May 31, 2017 at 12:51 PM, Curt Raymond  wrote:


Any pump will need winterizing. The problem with a windmill is that the
pond is down in a hole. Its man made, they dammed a stream to make the
pond, its probably 30' below the surrounding fields. By the time I make
enough tower to get significant wind I could have run power from the street.




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--
--FT
Winston Churchill:
“Never give in--never, never, never, never, in nothing great or small, large or 
petty,
never give in except to convictions of honor and good sense.
Never yield to force; never yield to the apparently overwhelming might of the 
enemy.”


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Re: [MBZ] OT: Solar update

2017-05-31 Thread Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
Thats actually not a terrible idea. I've looked at some micro-hydro setups on 
ebay that I could produce a little power with. Again under the theory that 1-2 
gallons an hour 24 hours a day would probably be plenty.
I'm thinking a 1/4hp 110v pump ought to do the job easy enough. This fall I'll 
start thinking about how/where to mount it. We've got a hand pump down there 
already, I should be able to tap off its intake. Maybe build a box that mounts 
to the 4x4s its on.
-Curt


  From: Meade Dillon <dillonm...@gmail.com>
 To: Curt Raymond <curtlud...@yahoo.com>; Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
 Sent: Wednesday, May 31, 2017 1:25 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT: Solar update
   
OK, then you need a bigger dam with hydroelectric to run your pump to fill your 
water tank.

-
Max
Charleston SC

On Wed, May 31, 2017 at 12:51 PM, Curt Raymond <curtlud...@yahoo.com> wrote:

Any pump will need winterizing. The problem with a windmill is that the pond is 
down in a hole. Its man made, they dammed a stream to make the pond, its 
probably 30' below the surrounding fields. By the time I make enough tower to 
get significant wind I could have run power from the street.





   
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Re: [MBZ] OT: Solar update

2017-05-31 Thread Meade Dillon via Mercedes 
OK, then you need a bigger dam with hydroelectric to run your pump to fill
your water tank.

-
Max
Charleston SC

On Wed, May 31, 2017 at 12:51 PM, Curt Raymond  wrote:

> Any pump will need winterizing. The problem with a windmill is that the
> pond is down in a hole. Its man made, they dammed a stream to make the
> pond, its probably 30' below the surrounding fields. By the time I make
> enough tower to get significant wind I could have run power from the street.
>
>
>
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Re: [MBZ] OT: Solar update

2017-05-31 Thread Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
Any pump will need winterizing. The problem with a windmill is that the pond is 
down in a hole. Its man made, they dammed a stream to make the pond, its 
probably 30' below the surrounding fields. By the time I make enough tower to 
get significant wind I could have run power from the street.
I like Mitch's idea of solar on the pump house but its another panel/charge 
controller and battery. Better to use 110v, its not a huge run, maybe 100 
feet...
-Curt

  From: Meade Dillon <dillonm...@gmail.com>
 To: Curt Raymond <curtlud...@yahoo.com>; Mercedes Discussion List 
<mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
 Sent: Tuesday, May 30, 2017 7:05 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT: Solar update
   
How about a windmill?  Use the wind to drive the pump to fill the tank, have a 
powered version for back-up.

https://www.etsy.com/listing/257221071/build-your-own-windmill-diy-plans-water?_source=google_medium=cpc_campaign=shopping_us_b-craft_supplies_and_tools-tools_and_equipment_custom1=46053756-0188-4cd6-8794-323f32338a3c=CjwKEAjwsLTJBRCvibaW9bGLtUESJAC4wKw12UKmPkgbtgTis4ycOBxcHRYGsbSWeVoTYZAWBGw6SxoCKDTw_wcB

Hmm, may be a hassle to deal with winterizing, have to design it so easy to 
de-water for the winter.

-
Max
Charleston SC




   
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Re: [MBZ] OT: Solar update

2017-05-30 Thread Meade Dillon via Mercedes 
How about a windmill?  Use the wind to drive the pump to fill the tank,
have a powered version for back-up.

https://www.etsy.com/listing/257221071/build-your-own-windmill-diy-plans-water?_source=google_medium=cpc_campaign=shopping_us_b-craft_supplies_and_tools-tools_and_equipment_custom1=46053756-0188-4cd6-8794-323f32338a3c=CjwKEAjwsLTJBRCvibaW9bGLtUESJAC4wKw12UKmPkgbtgTis4ycOBxcHRYGsbSWeVoTYZAWBGw6SxoCKDTw_wcB

Hmm, may be a hassle to deal with winterizing, have to design it so easy to
de-water for the winter.

-
Max
Charleston SC
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Re: [MBZ] OT: Solar update

2017-05-30 Thread Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
Run 110v down to the pond to a 12v battery with a battery charger? Easier to 
push than to pull I think. We had a 110v pump up at the pond once that could 
suck that high but it took a lot of priming to get it to do so.
Theres maybe an 18' elevation change from the pond to the camp, we'll want to 
go up to the garage so another 10' or so...
-Curt

  From: Mitch Haley <mi...@mitchellhaley.com>
 To: Curt Raymond <curtlud...@yahoo.com>; Mercedes Discussion List 
<mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
 Sent: Tuesday, May 30, 2017 5:37 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT: Solar update
   
12v sump pump in a floating cage, feeding a 5/8" garden hose?
Naw, too much voltage drop running a 12v motor that far from the cabin...
Can you get a self priming 12v pump that can suck all the way from the pond?
Mitch. 

> On May 30, 2017 at 5:22 PM Curt Raymond via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
> wrote:
> Oh I should also mention that we're pulling from the pond, not a well so we 
> don't need the pump output we would otherwise.
> -Curt
>


   
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Re: [MBZ] OT: Solar update

2017-05-30 Thread Mitch Haley via Mercedes 
12v sump pump in a floating cage, feeding a 5/8" garden hose?
Naw, too much voltage drop running a 12v motor that far from the cabin...
Can you get a self priming 12v pump that can suck all the way from the pond?
Mitch. 

> On May 30, 2017 at 5:22 PM Curt Raymond via Mercedes  
> wrote:
> Oh I should also mention that we're pulling from the pond, not a well so we 
> don't need the pump output we would otherwise.
> -Curt
>

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Re: [MBZ] OT: Solar update

2017-05-30 Thread Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
The hassle of getting out the generator, getting it started, pumping the water, 
putting it away... We could set up a permanent generator station and in fact we 
probably will at some point but this should work with less energy input.
If you change your mindset from a normal household pump this idea works better, 
a lower capacity pump running longer to fill a larger tank that then gravity 
feeds. The goal here is not to have water running out of a tap but to be able 
to fill buckets from the porch and just bring them into the camp.
Oh I should also mention that we're pulling from the pond, not a well so we 
don't need the pump output we would otherwise.
-Curt

  From: OK Don via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
 To: Mercedes Discussion List <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
Cc: OK Don <okd...@gmail.com>
 Sent: Tuesday, May 30, 2017 5:10 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT: Solar update
   
Why not just run a small generator when you need to pump water? Should be
simpler than running a 115v motor from solar/batteries.

On Tue, May 30, 2017 at 11:10 AM, Craig via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
wrote:

> On Tue, 30 May 2017 07:09:04 -0700 Jim Cathey via Mercedes
> <mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>
> > LED lights have gotten there, IMHO.  I hope that all of your lighting is
> > non-incandescent.  If not, that'd help.  Fans and pumps you can't do
> > much about.
>
> What about the power-factor controllers for inductive loads?
>
>
> Craig
>
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-- 
OK Don

*“Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of
our people need it sorely on these accounts.”* – Mark Twain

"There are three kinds of men: The ones that learns by reading. The few who
learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence
for themselves."

WILL ROGERS, *The Manly Wisdom of Will Rogers*
2013 F150, 18 mpg
2012 Passat TDI DSG, 44 mpg
1957 C182A, 12 mpg - but at 150 mph!
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Re: [MBZ] OT: Solar update

2017-05-30 Thread Randy Bennell via Mercedes 
Back in the 50's cottagers on Lake of the Woods had water towers with 
big galvanized tanks on top (or had the tank on the roof of the 
cottage). They would use a gasoline engine powered pump to fill the tank 
periodically from the lake and then gravity would provide water in the 
cottage sink and shower etc. A further advantage was that the water got 
quite warm on a summer day so not much heating was required if one 
showered in the evening rather than the morning.


RB

On 30/05/2017 4:10 PM, OK Don via Mercedes wrote:

Why not just run a small generator when you need to pump water? Should be
simpler than running a 115v motor from solar/batteries.

On Tue, May 30, 2017 at 11:10 AM, Craig via Mercedes 
wrote:


On Tue, 30 May 2017 07:09:04 -0700 Jim Cathey via Mercedes
 wrote:


LED lights have gotten there, IMHO.  I hope that all of your lighting is
non-incandescent.  If not, that'd help.  Fans and pumps you can't do
much about.

What about the power-factor controllers for inductive loads?


Craig

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Re: [MBZ] OT: Solar update

2017-05-30 Thread OK Don via Mercedes 
Why not just run a small generator when you need to pump water? Should be
simpler than running a 115v motor from solar/batteries.

On Tue, May 30, 2017 at 11:10 AM, Craig via Mercedes 
wrote:

> On Tue, 30 May 2017 07:09:04 -0700 Jim Cathey via Mercedes
>  wrote:
>
> > LED lights have gotten there, IMHO.  I hope that all of your lighting is
> > non-incandescent.  If not, that'd help.  Fans and pumps you can't do
> > much about.
>
> What about the power-factor controllers for inductive loads?
>
>
> Craig
>
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>
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>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
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>
>


-- 
OK Don

*“Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of
our people need it sorely on these accounts.”* – Mark Twain

"There are three kinds of men: The ones that learns by reading. The few who
learn by observation. The rest of them have to pee on the electric fence
for themselves."

WILL ROGERS, *The Manly Wisdom of Will Rogers*
2013 F150, 18 mpg
2012 Passat TDI DSG, 44 mpg
1957 C182A, 12 mpg - but at 150 mph!
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Re: [MBZ] OT: Solar update

2017-05-30 Thread Craig via Mercedes 
On Tue, 30 May 2017 07:09:04 -0700 Jim Cathey via Mercedes
 wrote:

> LED lights have gotten there, IMHO.  I hope that all of your lighting is
> non-incandescent.  If not, that'd help.  Fans and pumps you can't do
> much about.

What about the power-factor controllers for inductive loads?


Craig

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Re: [MBZ] OT: Solar update

2017-05-30 Thread Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
We've got 2 compact fluorescents, the range hood and the outdoor light, both of 
which I'll replace in July, everything else is LED. The first mantra of off 
grid is "conserve".
The LEDs in the beds are especially fantastic, 2W but plenty of light for 
reading.
-Curt

  From: Jim Cathey <jim.cathey...@gmail.com>
 To: Curt Raymond <curtlud...@yahoo.com>; Mercedes Discussion List 
<mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
 Sent: Tuesday, May 30, 2017 10:09 AM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT: Solar update
   
LED lights have gotten there, IMHO.  I hope that all of your lighting is 
non-incandescent.  If not, that'd help.  Fans and pumps you can't do much about.
-- Jim


   
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Re: [MBZ] OT: Solar update

2017-05-30 Thread Jim Cathey via Mercedes 
LED lights have gotten there, IMHO.  I hope that all of your lighting is
non-incandescent.  If not, that'd help.  Fans and pumps you can't do much
about.

-- Jim
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[MBZ] OT: Solar update

2017-05-30 Thread Curt Raymond via Mercedes 
Wanted to give you folks an update on the solar at camp. As a reminder we've 
got 2x 100w panels, 2x 35ah lead acid wheelchair batteries and 1x 110ah deep 
cycle battery.The charge controller is a 30a Windy Nation. Our solar siting is 
poor but improving as we do some logging, still need to cut some smaller spruce 
trees right next to the camp.
Drains, all are listed at 12v:Ceiling fan ~2aRange hood with light, 4a12v 
lights in bunks, 4x@.25a each so 1a12v light over sink, .5a110v light over 
table 2aoutside light, 1a
Total: 10.5a
That doesn't include cell phones, tablets, camera batteries, etc. In actual use 
I've never seen us go over 6a. I've never seen charging input go over 4a but 
I've never been there in high summer.
So far we're doing well, since we upgraded the system with the second panel and 
big battery last year we've never dipped under 12v even with the added load of 
the 12v lighting.
The 12v lights are fantastic, very little draw, no need for the inverter and 
our AA battery budget has dropped to almost zero. There are still some in use 
for flashlights but not many per year.
Dad bought an additional panel but we haven't installed it, a robin built a 
nest on the battery box and we didn't want to disturb her. We'll get to it in 
July. He wants to add another 110ah battery so we can run a water pump, its 
getting hard for my folks to lug water from the pond. Also on the list of 
projects is to run power to the garage for lighting, its pretty dark in there...
-Curt
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