[MBZ] OT - charging R134a systems
The van is not blowing ICE COLD AIR. It's blowing 68F, not cold. It was COLD when it was new in 1997.I hooked up the guages, and read low side of 28 and high of 160 at 1600-2000 RPM. Does it need more refrigerant, have too much, or is something else wrong? Ambient temp is 104F. Also, after some time on the road, 20-30 minutes, when you shut down the car, we hear gurgling or boiling sounds from the evaporator area. What is it trying to tell me? -- OK Don 2001 ML320 2012 Passat TDI DSG 1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] OT - charging R134a systems
High side should be in the 240 psi range for that OAT. 104(OAT)x2+32 Russ W. On 7/29/2012 15:14, OK Don wrote: The van is not blowing ICE COLD AIR. It's blowing 68F, not cold. It was COLD when it was new in 1997.I hooked up the guages, and read low side of 28 and high of 160 at 1600-2000 RPM. Does it need more refrigerant, have too much, or is something else wrong? Ambient temp is 104F. Also, after some time on the road, 20-30 minutes, when you shut down the car, we hear gurgling or boiling sounds from the evaporator area. What is it trying to tell me? ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] OT - charging R134a systems
So, add more R134a? On Sun, Jul 29, 2012 at 4:00 PM, Russ Williams rawil...@eatel.net wrote: High side should be in the 240 psi range for that OAT. 104(OAT)x2+32 Russ W. On 7/29/2012 15:14, OK Don wrote: The van is not blowing ICE COLD AIR. It's blowing 68F, not cold. It was COLD when it was new in 1997.I hooked up the guages, and read low side of 28 and high of 160 at 1600-2000 RPM. Does it need more refrigerant, have too much, or is something else wrong? Ambient temp is 104F. Also, after some time on the road, 20-30 minutes, when you shut down the car, we hear gurgling or boiling sounds from the evaporator area. What is it trying to tell me? __**_ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- OK Don 2001 ML320 2012 Passat TDI DSG 1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] OT - charging R134a systems
The chart at http://dodgeram.org/tech/repair/HVAC/R134a.htm says 135 psi. ? ? ? ? The calculator here says 134 - http://www.csgnetwork.com/r134apresstempconv.html My pressure is higher ? ? ? ? On Sun, Jul 29, 2012 at 4:03 PM, OK Don okd...@gmail.com wrote: So, add more R134a? On Sun, Jul 29, 2012 at 4:00 PM, Russ Williams rawil...@eatel.net wrote: High side should be in the 240 psi range for that OAT. 104(OAT)x2+32 Russ W. On 7/29/2012 15:14, OK Don wrote: The van is not blowing ICE COLD AIR. It's blowing 68F, not cold. It was COLD when it was new in 1997.I hooked up the guages, and read low side of 28 and high of 160 at 1600-2000 RPM. Does it need more refrigerant, have too much, or is something else wrong? Ambient temp is 104F. Also, after some time on the road, 20-30 minutes, when you shut down the car, we hear gurgling or boiling sounds from the evaporator area. What is it trying to tell me? __**_ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- OK Don 2001 ML320 2012 Passat TDI DSG 1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager -- OK Don 2001 ML320 2012 Passat TDI DSG 1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] OT - charging R134a systems
I just drove the van, the AC got down to 52F while driving 45mph or so. Then I took the ML out for fuel, and saw that it got to 37F over the same route. MUCH more comfortable in the (now) 108F temp. On Sun, Jul 29, 2012 at 4:07 PM, OK Don okd...@gmail.com wrote: The chart at http://dodgeram.org/tech/repair/HVAC/R134a.htm says 135 psi. ? ? ? ? The calculator here says 134 - http://www.csgnetwork.com/r134apresstempconv.html My pressure is higher ? ? ? ? On Sun, Jul 29, 2012 at 4:03 PM, OK Don okd...@gmail.com wrote: So, add more R134a? On Sun, Jul 29, 2012 at 4:00 PM, Russ Williams rawil...@eatel.netwrote: High side should be in the 240 psi range for that OAT. 104(OAT)x2+32 Russ W. On 7/29/2012 15:14, OK Don wrote: The van is not blowing ICE COLD AIR. It's blowing 68F, not cold. It was COLD when it was new in 1997.I hooked up the guages, and read low side of 28 and high of 160 at 1600-2000 RPM. Does it need more refrigerant, have too much, or is something else wrong? Ambient temp is 104F. Also, after some time on the road, 20-30 minutes, when you shut down the car, we hear gurgling or boiling sounds from the evaporator area. What is it trying to tell me? __**_ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- OK Don 2001 ML320 2012 Passat TDI DSG 1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager -- OK Don 2001 ML320 2012 Passat TDI DSG 1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager -- OK Don 2001 ML320 2012 Passat TDI DSG 1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] OT - charging R134a systems
Those are the wrong charts. Either you've got a leak and lost some of the charge, or your compressor is about dead. http://m.instructables.com/id/How-to-Repair-Automotive-AC/step1/freon-check/ From this site, looks to me like you should try adding some more refrigerant. -- Max Dillon Charleston SC '95 E300 '87 300TD OK Don okd...@gmail.com wrote: The chart at http://dodgeram.org/tech/repair/HVAC/R134a.htm says 135 psi. ? ? ? ? The calculator here says 134 - http://www.csgnetwork.com/r134apresstempconv.html My pressure is higher ? ? ? ? On Sun, Jul 29, 2012 at 4:03 PM, OK Don okd...@gmail.com wrote: So, add more R134a? On Sun, Jul 29, 2012 at 4:00 PM, Russ Williams rawil...@eatel.net wrote: High side should be in the 240 psi range for that OAT. 104(OAT)x2+32 Russ W. On 7/29/2012 15:14, OK Don wrote: The van is not blowing ICE COLD AIR. It's blowing 68F, not cold. It was COLD when it was new in 1997.I hooked up the guages, and read low side of 28 and high of 160 at 1600-2000 RPM. Does it need more refrigerant, have too much, or is something else wrong? Ambient temp is 104F. Also, after some time on the road, 20-30 minutes, when you shut down the car, we hear gurgling or boiling sounds from the evaporator area. What is it trying to tell me? _ **_ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/; To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com; -- OK Don 2001 ML320 2012 Passat TDI DSG 1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager -- OK Don 2001 ML320 2012 Passat TDI DSG 1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager _ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] OT - charging R134a systems
Interesting! How would one know which R134a charts are right? Any way, from this chart, my pressures are low, but the center vent temp is about right. However, the ML's center vent temp is much lower. Makes one question ALL the charts! For vehicles currently running with freon R-134a only Outside-low side---High side--Center vent temp 100 F -40-50 psi ---200-250 psi 52-60 F 110 F -50-60 psi ---250-300 psi 68-74 F On Sun, Jul 29, 2012 at 6:11 PM, Max Dillon meadedil...@bellsouth.netwrote: Those are the wrong charts. Either you've got a leak and lost some of the charge, or your compressor is about dead. http://m.instructables.com/id/How-to-Repair-Automotive-AC/step1/freon-check/ From this site, looks to me like you should try adding some more refrigerant. -- Max Dillon Charleston SC '95 E300 '87 300TD OK Don okd...@gmail.com wrote: The chart at http://dodgeram.org/tech/repair/HVAC/R134a.htm says 135 psi. ? ? ? ? The calculator here says 134 - http://www.csgnetwork.com/r134apresstempconv.html My pressure is higher ? ? ? ? On Sun, Jul 29, 2012 at 4:03 PM, OK Don okd...@gmail.com wrote: So, add more R134a? On Sun, Jul 29, 2012 at 4:00 PM, Russ Williams rawil...@eatel.net wrote: High side should be in the 240 psi range for that OAT. 104(OAT)x2+32 Russ W. On 7/29/2012 15:14, OK Don wrote: The van is not blowing ICE COLD AIR. It's blowing 68F, not cold. It was COLD when it was new in 1997.I hooked up the guages, and read low side of 28 and high of 160 at 1600-2000 RPM. Does it need more refrigerant, have too much, or is something else wrong? Ambient temp is 104F. Also, after some time on the road, 20-30 minutes, when you shut down the car, we hear gurgling or boiling sounds from the evaporator area. What is it trying to tell me? _ **_ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/ http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/; To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.com http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com; -- OK Don 2001 ML320 2012 Passat TDI DSG 1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager -- OK Don 2001 ML320 2012 Passat TDI DSG 1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager _ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- OK Don 2001 ML320 2012 Passat TDI DSG 1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] OT - charging R134a systems
On Sun, 29 Jul 2012 19:11:35 -0400 Max Dillon meadedil...@bellsouth.net wrote: Those are the wrong charts. Either you've got a leak and lost some of the charge, or your compressor is about dead. http://m.instructables.com/id/How-to-Repair-Automotive-AC/step1/freon-check/ From this site, looks to me like you should try adding some more refrigerant. I agree. Is there a sight glass on the receiver? The gurgling Also, after some time on the road, 20-30 minutes, when you shut down the car, we hear gurgling or boiling sounds from the evaporator area. What is it trying to tell me? sounds like it's low. Craig ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] OT - charging R134a systems
Are different oils used with R134a systems? If so, which does Mercedes use? -Dave Walton On Jul 29, 2012, at 7:38 PM, OK Don okd...@gmail.com wrote: Interesting! How would one know which R134a charts are right? Any way, from this chart, my pressures are low, but the center vent temp is about right. However, the ML's center vent temp is much lower. Makes one question ALL the charts! For vehicles currently running with freon R-134a only Outside-low side---High side--Center vent temp 100 F -40-50 psi ---200-250 psi 52-60 F 110 F -50-60 psi ---250-300 psi 68-74 F On Sun, Jul 29, 2012 at 6:11 PM, Max Dillon meadedil...@bellsouth.netwrote: Those are the wrong charts. Either you've got a leak and lost some of the charge, or your compressor is about dead. http://m.instructables.com/id/How-to-Repair-Automotive-AC/step1/freon-check/ From this site, looks to me like you should try adding some more refrigerant. -- Max Dillon Charleston SC '95 E300 '87 300TD OK Don okd...@gmail.com wrote: The chart at http://dodgeram.org/tech/repair/HVAC/R134a.htm says 135 psi. ? ? ? ? The calculator here says 134 - http://www.csgnetwork.com/r134apresstempconv.html My pressure is higher ? ? ? ? On Sun, Jul 29, 2012 at 4:03 PM, OK Don okd...@gmail.com wrote: So, add more R134a? On Sun, Jul 29, 2012 at 4:00 PM, Russ Williams rawil...@eatel.net wrote: High side should be in the 240 psi range for that OAT. 104(OAT)x2+32 Russ W. On 7/29/2012 15:14, OK Don wrote: The van is not blowing ICE COLD AIR. It's blowing 68F, not cold. It was COLD when it was new in 1997.I hooked up the guages, and read low side of 28 and high of 160 at 1600-2000 RPM. Does it need more refrigerant, have too much, or is something else wrong? Ambient temp is 104F. Also, after some time on the road, 20-30 minutes, when you shut down the car, we hear gurgling or boiling sounds from the evaporator area. What is it trying to tell me? _ **_ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/ http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/; To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.com http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com; -- OK Don 2001 ML320 2012 Passat TDI DSG 1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager -- OK Don 2001 ML320 2012 Passat TDI DSG 1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager _ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- OK Don 2001 ML320 2012 Passat TDI DSG 1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] OT - charging R134a systems
Yes, question them, they are really just a guide. I agree that these center vent temps from the chart I posted are hooky. When I bought my first AC gauge it came with a chart, and it largely agrees with the car-specific charts for my Mercedes and our Infiniti. -- Max Dillon Charleston SC '95 E300 '87 300TD OK Don okd...@gmail.com wrote: Interesting! How would one know which R134a charts are right? Any way, from this chart, my pressures are low, but the center vent temp is about right. However, the ML's center vent temp is much lower. Makes one question ALL the charts! For vehicles currently running with freon R-134a only Outside-low side---High side--Center vent temp 100 F -40-50 psi ---200-250 psi 52-60 F 110 F -50-60 psi ---250-300 psi 68-74 F On Sun, Jul 29, 2012 at 6:11 PM, Max Dillon meadedil...@bellsouth.netwrote: Those are the wrong charts. Either you've got a leak and lost some of the charge, or your compressor is about dead. http://m.instructables.com/id/How-to-Repair-Automotive-AC/step1/freon-check/ From this site, looks to me like you should try adding some more refrigerant. -- Max Dillon Charleston SC '95 E300 '87 300TD OK Don okd...@gmail.com wrote: The chart at http://dodgeram.org/tech/repair/HVAC/R134a.htm says 135 psi. ? ? ? ? The calculator here says 134 - http://www.csgnetwork.com/r134apresstempconv.html My pressure is higher ? ? ? ? On Sun, Jul 29, 2012 at 4:03 PM, OK Don okd...@gmail.com wrote: So, add more R134a? On Sun, Jul 29, 2012 at 4:00 PM, Russ Williams rawil...@eatel.net wrote: High side should be in the 240 psi range for that OAT. 104(OAT)x2+32 Russ W. On 7/29/2012 15:14, OK Don wrote: The van is not blowing ICE COLD AIR. It's blowing 68F, not cold. It was COLD when it was new in 1997.I hooked up the guages, and read low side of 28 and high of 160 at 1600-2000 RPM. Does it need more refrigerant, have too much, or is something else wrong? Ambient temp is 104F. Also, after some time on the road, 20-30 minutes, when you shut down the car, we hear gurgling or boiling sounds from the evaporator area. What is it trying to tell me? _ **_ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/; http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/;; To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.com; http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com;; -- OK Don 2001 ML320 2012 Passat TDI DSG 1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager -- OK Don 2001 ML320 2012 Passat TDI DSG 1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager _ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com _ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- OK Don 2001 ML320 2012 Passat TDI DSG 1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager _ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] OT - charging R134a systems
On Sun, 29 Jul 2012 18:38:09 -0500 OK Don okd...@gmail.com wrote: Interesting! How would one know which R134a charts are right? Any way, from this chart, my pressures are low, but the center vent temp is about right. However, the ML's center vent temp is much lower. Makes one question ALL the charts! For vehicles currently running with freon R-134a only Outside-low side---High side--Center vent temp 100 F -40-50 psi ---200-250 psi 52-60 F 110 F -50-60 psi ---250-300 psi 68-74 F The other charts seem to be showing the evaporator temperature versus pressure. Note that the lower the pressure on the low side of the system, the lower the evaporator temperature will be. HOWEVER, lower pressures will mean lower amounts of freon, which will transport less heat. Thus, in a given system you may not see the lower temperatures because the system is really trying to transport more heat than the amount of freon for those lower temperatures will be able to transport. I hope that's clear. So, for a given system, it's a balancing act between how much freon you have versus how much heat you are trying to transport. But I think you still need more freon. Craig ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] OT - charging R134a systems
Yes, Mercedes 124 calls for a low viscosity oil, someone here posted it last summer. I think the viscosity is determined by the compressor. Then there is the mineral oil versus PAG oil debate... -- Max Dillon Charleston SC '95 E300 '87 300TD Dave Walton walton.d...@gmail.com wrote: Are different oils used with R134a systems? If so, which does Mercedes use? -Dave Walton On Jul 29, 2012, at 7:38 PM, OK Don okd...@gmail.com wrote: Interesting! How would one know which R134a charts are right? Any way, from this chart, my pressures are low, but the center vent temp is about right. However, the ML's center vent temp is much lower. Makes one question ALL the charts! For vehicles currently running with freon R-134a only Outside-low side---High side--Center vent temp 100 F -40-50 psi ---200-250 psi 52-60 F 110 F -50-60 psi ---250-300 psi 68-74 F On Sun, Jul 29, 2012 at 6:11 PM, Max Dillon meadedil...@bellsouth.netwrote: Those are the wrong charts. Either you've got a leak and lost some of the charge, or your compressor is about dead. http://m.instructables.com/id/How-to-Repair-Automotive-AC/step1/freon-check/ From this site, looks to me like you should try adding some more refrigerant. -- Max Dillon Charleston SC '95 E300 '87 300TD OK Don okd...@gmail.com wrote: The chart at http://dodgeram.org/tech/repair/HVAC/R134a.htm says 135 psi. ? ? ? ? The calculator here says 134 - http://www.csgnetwork.com/r134apresstempconv.html My pressure is higher ? ? ? ? On Sun, Jul 29, 2012 at 4:03 PM, OK Don okd...@gmail.com wrote: So, add more R134a? On Sun, Jul 29, 2012 at 4:00 PM, Russ Williams rawil...@eatel.net wrote: High side should be in the 240 psi range for that OAT. 104(OAT)x2+32 Russ W. On 7/29/2012 15:14, OK Don wrote: The van is not blowing ICE COLD AIR. It's blowing 68F, not cold. It was COLD when it was new in 1997.I hooked up the guages, and read low side of 28 and high of 160 at 1600-2000 RPM. Does it need more refrigerant, have too much, or is something else wrong? Ambient temp is 104F. Also, after some time on the road, 20-30 minutes, when you shut down the car, we hear gurgling or boiling sounds from the evaporator area. What is it trying to tell me? _ **_ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/; http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/;; To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.com; http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com;; -- OK Don 2001 ML320 2012 Passat TDI DSG 1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager -- OK Don 2001 ML320 2012 Passat TDI DSG 1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager _ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com _ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- OK Don 2001 ML320 2012 Passat TDI DSG 1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager _ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com _ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] OT - charging R134a systems
Does oil escape with a leak or is it left behind? In other words - can I just add refrigerant or do I need to add oil as well? -Dave Walton On Jul 29, 2012, at 7:58 PM, Max Dillon meadedil...@bellsouth.net wrote: Yes, Mercedes 124 calls for a low viscosity oil, someone here posted it last summer. I think the viscosity is determined by the compressor. Then there is the mineral oil versus PAG oil debate... -- Max Dillon Charleston SC '95 E300 '87 300TD Dave Walton walton.d...@gmail.com wrote: Are different oils used with R134a systems? If so, which does Mercedes use? -Dave Walton On Jul 29, 2012, at 7:38 PM, OK Don okd...@gmail.com wrote: Interesting! How would one know which R134a charts are right? Any way, from this chart, my pressures are low, but the center vent temp is about right. However, the ML's center vent temp is much lower. Makes one question ALL the charts! For vehicles currently running with freon R-134a only Outside-low side---High side--Center vent temp 100 F -40-50 psi ---200-250 psi 52-60 F 110 F -50-60 psi ---250-300 psi 68-74 F On Sun, Jul 29, 2012 at 6:11 PM, Max Dillon meadedil...@bellsouth.netwrote: Those are the wrong charts. Either you've got a leak and lost some of the charge, or your compressor is about dead. http://m.instructables.com/id/How-to-Repair-Automotive-AC/step1/freon-check/ From this site, looks to me like you should try adding some more refrigerant. -- Max Dillon Charleston SC '95 E300 '87 300TD OK Don okd...@gmail.com wrote: The chart at http://dodgeram.org/tech/repair/HVAC/R134a.htm says 135 psi. ? ? ? ? The calculator here says 134 - http://www.csgnetwork.com/r134apresstempconv.html My pressure is higher ? ? ? ? On Sun, Jul 29, 2012 at 4:03 PM, OK Don okd...@gmail.com wrote: So, add more R134a? On Sun, Jul 29, 2012 at 4:00 PM, Russ Williams rawil...@eatel.net wrote: High side should be in the 240 psi range for that OAT. 104(OAT)x2+32 Russ W. On 7/29/2012 15:14, OK Don wrote: The van is not blowing ICE COLD AIR. It's blowing 68F, not cold. It was COLD when it was new in 1997.I hooked up the guages, and read low side of 28 and high of 160 at 1600-2000 RPM. Does it need more refrigerant, have too much, or is something else wrong? Ambient temp is 104F. Also, after some time on the road, 20-30 minutes, when you shut down the car, we hear gurgling or boiling sounds from the evaporator area. What is it trying to tell me? _ **_ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/; http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/;; To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.com; http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com;; -- OK Don 2001 ML320 2012 Passat TDI DSG 1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager -- OK Don 2001 ML320 2012 Passat TDI DSG 1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager _ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com _ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- OK Don 2001 ML320 2012 Passat TDI DSG 1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager _ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com _ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] OT - charging R134a systems
Well, it seems that you have to be smart enough to know how to read the gauges! The outer ring of numbers is labled R134a and is green. The next inner ring is black, and labled psi. Turns out that the green ring corresponds to the pressures on the charts I referencd, while the black psi numbers correspond to the chart Max referenced. Either way, I now have an over charge but have dropped the project for today. From the center vent numbers on Max's chart the system is working as well as can be expected. The ML is working like you would expect a Mercedes to! On Sun, Jul 29, 2012 at 6:38 PM, OK Don okd...@gmail.com wrote: Interesting! How would one know which R134a charts are right? Any way, from this chart, my pressures are low, but the center vent temp is about right. However, the ML's center vent temp is much lower. Makes one question ALL the charts! For vehicles currently running with freon R-134a only Outside-low side---High side--Center vent temp 100 F -40-50 psi ---200-250 psi 52-60 F 110 F -50-60 psi ---250-300 psi 68-74 F On Sun, Jul 29, 2012 at 6:11 PM, Max Dillon meadedil...@bellsouth.netwrote: Those are the wrong charts. Either you've got a leak and lost some of the charge, or your compressor is about dead. http://m.instructables.com/id/How-to-Repair-Automotive-AC/step1/freon-check/ From this site, looks to me like you should try adding some more refrigerant. -- Max Dillon Charleston SC '95 E300 '87 300TD OK Don okd...@gmail.com wrote: The chart at http://dodgeram.org/tech/repair/HVAC/R134a.htm says 135 psi. ? ? ? ? The calculator here says 134 - http://www.csgnetwork.com/r134apresstempconv.html My pressure is higher ? ? ? ? On Sun, Jul 29, 2012 at 4:03 PM, OK Don okd...@gmail.com wrote: So, add more R134a? On Sun, Jul 29, 2012 at 4:00 PM, Russ Williams rawil...@eatel.net wrote: High side should be in the 240 psi range for that OAT. 104(OAT)x2+32 Russ W. On 7/29/2012 15:14, OK Don wrote: The van is not blowing ICE COLD AIR. It's blowing 68F, not cold. It was COLD when it was new in 1997.I hooked up the guages, and read low side of 28 and high of 160 at 1600-2000 RPM. Does it need more refrigerant, have too much, or is something else wrong? Ambient temp is 104F. Also, after some time on the road, 20-30 minutes, when you shut down the car, we hear gurgling or boiling sounds from the evaporator area. What is it trying to tell me? _ **_ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/ http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/; To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.com http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com; -- OK Don 2001 ML320 2012 Passat TDI DSG 1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager -- OK Don 2001 ML320 2012 Passat TDI DSG 1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager _ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- OK Don 2001 ML320 2012 Passat TDI DSG 1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager -- OK Don 2001 ML320 2012 Passat TDI DSG 1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] OT - charging R134a systems
Oil escapes, oily spot will mark the leak... -- Max Dillon Charleston SC '95 E300 '87 300TD Dave Walton walton.d...@gmail.com wrote: Does oil escape with a leak or is it left behind? In other words - can I just add refrigerant or do I need to add oil as well? -Dave Walton On Jul 29, 2012, at 7:58 PM, Max Dillon meadedil...@bellsouth.net wrote: Yes, Mercedes 124 calls for a low viscosity oil, someone here posted it last summer. I think the viscosity is determined by the compressor. Then there is the mineral oil versus PAG oil debate... -- Max Dillon Charleston SC '95 E300 '87 300TD Dave Walton walton.d...@gmail.com wrote: Are different oils used with R134a systems? If so, which does Mercedes use? -Dave Walton On Jul 29, 2012, at 7:38 PM, OK Don okd...@gmail.com wrote: Interesting! How would one know which R134a charts are right? Any way, from this chart, my pressures are low, but the center vent temp is about right. However, the ML's center vent temp is much lower. Makes one question ALL the charts! For vehicles currently running with freon R-134a only Outside-low side---High side--Center vent temp 100 F -40-50 psi ---200-250 psi 52-60 F 110 F -50-60 psi ---250-300 psi 68-74 F On Sun, Jul 29, 2012 at 6:11 PM, Max Dillon meadedil...@bellsouth.netwrote: Those are the wrong charts. Either you've got a leak and lost some of the charge, or your compressor is about dead. http://m.instructables.com/id/How-to-Repair-Automotive-AC/step1/freon-check/ From this site, looks to me like you should try adding some more refrigerant. -- Max Dillon Charleston SC '95 E300 '87 300TD OK Don okd...@gmail.com wrote: The chart at http://dodgeram.org/tech/repair/HVAC/R134a.htm says 135 psi. ? ? ? ? The calculator here says 134 - http://www.csgnetwork.com/r134apresstempconv.html My pressure is higher ? ? ? ? On Sun, Jul 29, 2012 at 4:03 PM, OK Don okd...@gmail.com wrote: So, add more R134a? On Sun, Jul 29, 2012 at 4:00 PM, Russ Williams rawil...@eatel.net wrote: High side should be in the 240 psi range for that OAT. 104(OAT)x2+32 Russ W. On 7/29/2012 15:14, OK Don wrote: The van is not blowing ICE COLD AIR. It's blowing 68F, not cold. It was COLD when it was new in 1997.I hooked up the guages, and read low side of 28 and high of 160 at 1600-2000 RPM. Does it need more refrigerant, have too much, or is something else wrong? Ambient temp is 104F. Also, after some time on the road, 20-30 minutes, when you shut down the car, we hear gurgling or boiling sounds from the evaporator area. What is it trying to tell me? _ **_ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/;; http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/;;; To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.com;; http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com;;; -- OK Don 2001 ML320 2012 Passat TDI DSG 1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager -- OK Don 2001 ML320 2012 Passat TDI DSG 1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager _ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com _ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- OK Don 2001 ML320 2012 Passat TDI DSG 1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager _ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com _ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com _ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com _ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives
Re: [MBZ] OT - charging R134a systems
Some of the confusion stems from the fact that R12 has the same temperature and pressure on the low side (that is, in degrees F, 32 psi = 32 degrees). One of the reasons R12 was used in automobiles was that it's simple to see what the evaporator temperature is. R134a doesn't work like this. My gauge set has a temperature scale on it beside the pressure scale so it's easy to see what the evaporator temperature is. On systems with expansion valves, you will see quite low pressures when the valve is closed, but they will be higher when the valve is wide open. The pressure may not show the actual evaporator temperature as a result. On CCOT systems, it's even more complicated as the evaporator can contain liquid freon at times, and excess liquid freon collects in the accumulator (between evaporator and compressor) since there is a fixed orifice. GM typically uses CCOT systems, MB has tyipcally used a receiver/dryer and expansion valve, but I don't know what they use today. With a receiver/dryer, it's easy to tell if there is adequate freon, as you won't see bubbles in the sight glass during full load operation. No sight glass on CCOT systems, you have to use the pressure. Low pressure with boiling sounds in the evaporator is a new one for me, but I'd try adding freon first since it's cheap and easy. A bad compressor usually results in high low side pressure and no cooling -- and no heat in the condenser. Peter ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] OT - charging R134a systems
There is no debate about using mineral oil with R134a, it's not a good idea at all unless you want a new compressor soon -- it's not soluble in R134a and circulates poorly. Your choices are PAG or Ester oil, either of which work fine. Nipondenso requires PAG, don't remember the viscosity off the top of my heat but it's one of the standard ones. Not sure for other compressors, but PAG should be fine. Only caveat is that it absorbs LOTS of water when exposed to air, so you will need to replace the moisture scavenger (receiver/dryer or accumulator) if the system is open for more than a few minutes. Just the nature of the beast. Water makes hydrofluoric acid in R134a, you HAVE to keep the system quite dry. Also greatly reduces cooling when it freezes out in the expansion valve. Peter ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
