Re: [MBZ] Will 617 and 603 operate at compression of 15 bar
why would anybody do that? Talking about compression, here is a vid of someone killing a 240D http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wTdC3LC2lW0mode=relatedsearch= rather sad to watch :'( Loren Faeth wrote: When I checked the compression on my SDL at 330k miles, I used my cheapo tester and a sun tester. I had trouble getting repeatable readings with the cheapo. With the sun, I was able to get repeatable readings in the 425psi range. I didn't believe any reading until I could get within 1-2 psi three times in a row. I tested with a cold engine with I think 4 compression strokes per cylinder. You need to use several compression strokes, 3-4, to get a true reading, because ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Will 617 and 603 operate at compression of 15 bar
On Fri, 23 Nov 2007 08:24:55 +0200 Peter Merle [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Regardless of the number of compression cycles if there is additional volume in the guage that will lower the effective compression ration and hence the peak pressure reading. Additional volume before the check valve does effect the peak reading. Additional volume after the check valve does not, as long as you use enough compression cycles to bring the gauge up to the true peak reading. Anyone have the OEM Motometer compression guage? No, sorry. Just wonder where the check valve is. Good question. Craig ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Will 617 and 603 operate at compression of 15 bar
Peter Merle wrote: Good point Mitch , sorry have been away for a while. The guage has the check valve at the instrument end of a pipe about a foot long. Now you've got me wondering about the Harbor Freight gauge that I haven't used yet. I hope that each threaded adapter has its own check valve, but I can't remember for sure. All of my gasser gauges have a weak springed Schrader valve right at the face of the 14mm threaded piece. I have a couple of adapters for 10mm and 12mm threads which don't have their own check valves, but their internal volume is maybe 0.1 to 0.2 cc, and gasser combustion chambers are twice as large as IDI diesel chambers, so I've always assumed the effect was small. Mitch. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Will 617 and 603 operate at compression of 15 bar
When I checked the compression on my SDL at 330k miles, I used my cheapo tester and a sun tester. I had trouble getting repeatable readings with the cheapo. With the sun, I was able to get repeatable readings in the 425psi range. I didn't believe any reading until I could get within 1-2 psi three times in a row. I tested with a cold engine with I think 4 compression strokes per cylinder. You need to use several compression strokes, 3-4, to get a true reading, because the reading is taken of compressible gas mixture. Pressure varies with volume. adding the gauge and hose adds volume, thus the reason to used several compression strokes. At 12:23 AM 11/22/2007, you wrote: Good point Mitch , sorry have been away for a while. The guage has the check valve at the instrument end of a pipe about a foot long. I have a revcently overhauled engine to try my hands on and check it out. Peter -Original Message- From: Mitch Haley [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 13 November 2007 14:34 To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] Will 617 and 603 operate at compression of 15 bar Peter Merle wrote: Hi, yes starting hot is not that great. Strange that it doesn ot use oil ( my two 617's used a lot of oil before compression dropped to low levels) and the fact that the pressures are even all round. Makes me wonder if the gauge has too much air volume between the check valve and the combustion chamber, thereby lowering the compression ratio. Do you have a known good mbz diesel handy to try the gauge on? Mitch. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com Loren Faeth ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Will 617 and 603 operate at compression of 15 bar
Talking about compression, here is a vid of someone killing a 240D http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wTdC3LC2lW0mode=relatedsearch= rather sad to watch :'( Loren Faeth wrote: When I checked the compression on my SDL at 330k miles, I used my cheapo tester and a sun tester. I had trouble getting repeatable readings with the cheapo. With the sun, I was able to get repeatable readings in the 425psi range. I didn't believe any reading until I could get within 1-2 psi three times in a row. I tested with a cold engine with I think 4 compression strokes per cylinder. You need to use several compression strokes, 3-4, to get a true reading, because ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Will 617 and 603 operate at compression of 15 bar
Regardless of the number of compression cycles if there is additional volume in the guage that will lower the effective compression ration and hence the peak pressure reading. Anyone have the OEM Motometer compression guage? Just wonder where the check valve is. Peter -Original Message- From: Loren Faeth [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 22 November 2007 19:46 To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] Will 617 and 603 operate at compression of 15 bar When I checked the compression on my SDL at 330k miles, I used my cheapo tester and a sun tester. I had trouble getting repeatable readings with the cheapo. With the sun, I was able to get repeatable readings in the 425psi range. I didn't believe any reading until I could get within 1-2 psi three times in a row. I tested with a cold engine with I think 4 compression strokes per cylinder. You need to use several compression strokes, 3-4, to get a true reading, because the reading is taken of compressible gas mixture. Pressure varies with volume. adding the gauge and hose adds volume, thus the reason to used several compression strokes. At 12:23 AM 11/22/2007, you wrote: Good point Mitch , sorry have been away for a while. The guage has the check valve at the instrument end of a pipe about a foot long. I have a revcently overhauled engine to try my hands on and check it out. Peter -Original Message- From: Mitch Haley [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 13 November 2007 14:34 To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] Will 617 and 603 operate at compression of 15 bar Peter Merle wrote: Hi, yes starting hot is not that great. Strange that it doesn ot use oil ( my two 617's used a lot of oil before compression dropped to low levels) and the fact that the pressures are even all round. Makes me wonder if the gauge has too much air volume between the check valve and the combustion chamber, thereby lowering the compression ratio. Do you have a known good mbz diesel handy to try the gauge on? Mitch. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com Loren Faeth ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Will 617 and 603 operate at compression of 15 bar
Good point Mitch , sorry have been away for a while. The guage has the check valve at the instrument end of a pipe about a foot long. I have a revcently overhauled engine to try my hands on and check it out. Peter -Original Message- From: Mitch Haley [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 13 November 2007 14:34 To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] Will 617 and 603 operate at compression of 15 bar Peter Merle wrote: Hi, yes starting hot is not that great. Strange that it doesn ot use oil ( my two 617's used a lot of oil before compression dropped to low levels) and the fact that the pressures are even all round. Makes me wonder if the gauge has too much air volume between the check valve and the combustion chamber, thereby lowering the compression ratio. Do you have a known good mbz diesel handy to try the gauge on? Mitch. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Will 617 and 603 operate at compression of 15 bar
Hi, yes starting hot is not that great. Strange that it doesn ot use oil ( my two 617's used a lot of oil before compression dropped to low levels) and the fact that the pressures are even all round. PEter -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 13 November 2007 02:52 To: mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] Will 617 and 603 operate at compression of 15 bar In a message dated 11/12/2007 2:22:28 A.M. US Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Did compression test on my 124 and I getting an even 15 bar all round. Had the gauge itself ( without non-return valve ) tested and it actually was slightly overreading ! The question is will these engine start and run well with such a low compression. Oil consumption is close to zero. Peter, I think you have answered your own question, the 603, with 6 cylinders, will start with good reliability, even though it is somewhat below the factory recommendation for overhaul. The 603, with fast acting glow plugs, would put less of a drain on the battery, and good cranking speed can be obtained, a critical factor in good starting. Curiously, I have found that one of the first clues that the MB diesel engine is nearing the overhaul point, is that it won't start at normal operating temperature without glowing. This was true of my 200D (66 with 243,000 miles on the odometer) my 240D (74 @110,000 miles,with bad rings due to the PO loaning it to some guy who drove it up a mountain without water) and my current diesel (79 300SD with 234,000 miles). The 79 had zero compression in one cylinder, the other four were about 240PSI, A broken ring ate the top land of the piston, but it would still start and run to the speed mark in top gear Two batteries in series were used towards the very end. The mileages quoted are when I overhauled the engines. Just my $0.02 Jim Friesen Phoenix AZ 79 300SD, 264 K miles 98 ML 320, 152 K miles ** See what's new at http://www.aol.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Will 617 and 603 operate at compression of 15 bar
Peter Merle wrote: Hi, yes starting hot is not that great. Strange that it doesn ot use oil ( my two 617's used a lot of oil before compression dropped to low levels) and the fact that the pressures are even all round. Makes me wonder if the gauge has too much air volume between the check valve and the combustion chamber, thereby lowering the compression ratio. Do you have a known good mbz diesel handy to try the gauge on? Mitch. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
[MBZ] Will 617 and 603 operate at compression of 15 bar
Did compression test on my 124 and I getting an even 15 bar all round. Had the gauge itself ( without non-return valve ) tested and it actually was slightly overreading ! The question is will these engine start and run well with such a low compression. Oil consumption is close to zero. Peter ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Will 617 and 603 operate at compression of 15 bar
In a message dated 11/12/2007 2:22:28 A.M. US Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Did compression test on my 124 and I getting an even 15 bar all round. Had the gauge itself ( without non-return valve ) tested and it actually was slightly overreading ! The question is will these engine start and run well with such a low compression. Oil consumption is close to zero. Peter, I think you have answered your own question, the 603, with 6 cylinders, will start with good reliability, even though it is somewhat below the factory recommendation for overhaul. The 603, with fast acting glow plugs, would put less of a drain on the battery, and good cranking speed can be obtained, a critical factor in good starting. Curiously, I have found that one of the first clues that the MB diesel engine is nearing the overhaul point, is that it won't start at normal operating temperature without glowing. This was true of my 200D (66 with 243,000 miles on the odometer) my 240D (74 @110,000 miles,with bad rings due to the PO loaning it to some guy who drove it up a mountain without water) and my current diesel (79 300SD with 234,000 miles). The 79 had zero compression in one cylinder, the other four were about 240PSI, A broken ring ate the top land of the piston, but it would still start and run to the speed mark in top gear Two batteries in series were used towards the very end. The mileages quoted are when I overhauled the engines. Just my $0.02 Jim Friesen Phoenix AZ 79 300SD, 264 K miles 98 ML 320, 152 K miles ** See what's new at http://www.aol.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
