[meteorite-list] WWND?

[Dark Matter]

What would Nininger Do?

I apologize if I offended anyone about appreciating Dr. Moore's
message to the list. Often we forget just who is lurking here from
around the globe. When I saw a message from Carleton Moore, I
cross-checked the email address just in case, the read Eric's reply
just a half-hour later.

Being "some professor in a office somewhere that you have never met,"
I do carry a particular respect for those shoulders upon whose we
stand. With the recent loss of Brian Mason on December 3rd, I guess I
was just feeling old and wishing there was more respect for those
scientists who didn't just change the field of meteoritics forever,
but actually first discovered the the wonderful facts that so interest
us in these special stones, and make us return day after day to this
Meteorite List.

Brian Mason's obituary in the Washington Post concluded with a quote
from me that expressed a similar experience eight year ago.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/12/08/AR2009120804129.html

Having being "mentored" by the likes of David New, Chuck Lewis Tim
McCoy and others, I do worry about how many collectors believe the
mere ownership of meteorites is enough education about the science
behind meteorites.

All I wanted to convey in my reply to Eric and the List is that at any
moment, as we all experienced by the loss of Christian Anger, we can
loose the great personalities in our midst, and that sometimes we need
to savor the messenger and not stumble about whether or not the
content of the message is personally appropriate.

Thank you for your consideration.

-Martin
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Re: [meteorite-list] Mark Bostick?

[Dark Matter]

Hi  Walter,

Last I heard was that Mark had to pull out of meteorites to care for
someone, an elderly parent  or sibling maybe.

Oh, by the way, when you mentioned your three year accident
anniversary, I thought I'd tell you that before the accident, I bought
a smooth oriented Sikhote-Alin from your collection. After the
accident, I thought of sending it back to you, but instead I put it in
my center desk drawer. Whenever I needed a pen I opened the drawer,
saw the SA and thought about you and your daughter.

I think we both had and raised our kids while on this List, and I
remember discussion child rearing with you back at the turn of the
century. Our daughters are about the same age, and if you and your
daughter no longer need my daily drawer thoughts, I'd be happy to send
the SA to your daughter to continue her meteorite collecting.

Best,

Martin




On Sun, Feb 7, 2010 at 6:46 PM, Walter Branch  wrote:
> Hello Everyone,
>
> Can somebody tell me, whatever happened to meteorite collector and dealer
> Mark Bostick?
>
> -Walter Branch
> _
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Re: [meteorite-list] Cause of the current snow

[Dark Matter]

Yea. But I just wish Montana used the same sun as everyone else. It's
been balmy here and our snowpacks are at record lows.  There is green
grass out my window right now. Seeing bald mountains, unfrozen lakes,
and ice free rivers in Montana in February is a little unnerving. Not
to mention the college students in shorts and tee shirts. (I didn't
mean that how it sounded)

Ahh, but what about meteorites you say?

Here's a link that made the rounds four years ago.

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2006/03/060314170208.htm

As I see it, Tunguska was 1908, and Sikhote-Alin was 1947 so we are
about 24 years overdue for another big trundra melter.

-Martin



On Thu, Feb 11, 2010 at 1:55 PM, John higgins  wrote:
> I think the cause of the extremely cold winter is due to the extreme Solar 
> Minimum. The climate on Earth is directly affected by the activities of the 
> Sun. Look into solar cycles, and the effect on climate change, there is more 
> to it than you would think.
>
> John Higgins
>
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] PV and Iron stability

[Dark Matter]

Hi Robert and all,

My PV slice is still spotless.

Regarding the Widmanstatten pattern, remember back in '06, Tom
Phillips and I spent some time with his polisher and microscope. We
polished my slice to the point where we could see the plate boundaries
without any chemical etching. Other cool features were also visible.
Here's the link to Tom's article on the PV:

http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2006/September/Micro_Visions.htm

Best,

Martin





On Mon, Feb 15, 2010 at 11:52 AM, Robert Woolard
 wrote:
> Hello,
>
>   Thanks to everyone who responded to my question concerning the state of 
> their PV specimens. Stability was unanimous, with no one experiencing any 
> problems with rusting.  :-)
>
>   And that brings up a related question concerning stability that I might 
> should already know the answer to, but do not:
>
>   Is PV's apparent rust-resistance for at least the last 10+ years (and 
> hopefully many more) due SIMPLY to the fact that the specimens were recovered 
> so quickly, and were spared exposure to, and penetration of, water for 
> hundreds to thousands of years? And if so, are ALL freshly recovered irons 
> (or "metal veined" as in the case of PV) just inherently stable?
>
>   Or does inherent resistance to rusting vary from one meteorite to the next 
> based more on the exact, specific chemical makeup of the iron and any 
> particular find may or may not be prone to rusting regardless of how quickly 
> it was recovered?
>
>   Thanks in advance for any help with this,
>   Robert Woolard
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] More on Muchison.....

[Dark Matter]

Hi Shawn and all,

I've heard that a back-of-the-envelope calculation of the presolar
diamonds in meteorites could push the age limits to 10 billion years
ago. Not quite the Big Bang, but you can see it from there.

This number comes from the adding the age of our solar system (when
the diamonds were captured in our home material), to the age of a
star-centered solar system that could have created the diamonds in the
first place. Similar to a conceptual extension of the line in the
linked .pdf where it says, "For example, some small diamond crystals
in meteorites have high levels of heavy xenon isotopes that imply that
they originated from a supernova explosion."

Best,

Martin





On Tue, Feb 16, 2010 at 11:19 AM, Shawn Alan  wrote:
> Darren and List
>
> Thank you for the read up on Murchison meteorite on how scientist have 
> identified over 14,000 compounds and counting. While we are on the topic of 
> Murchison meteorite, I came across an article on line that points out these 
> interesting facts and finds on the Murchison as quoted from the article as 
> follows
>
> "Presolar grains are the oldest materials in the solar system," says Philipp 
> Heck of the University of Chicago.
> "The ages of the grains clearly indicate that they are older than the solar 
> system."
>  But just how old?
> Heck and his colleagues isolated 22 grains from the Murchison meteorite, 
> which is well-known for the
> organic material it contains, and measured how long the grains spent in 
> interstellar space before winding up
> in our nascent solar system. The implied grain ages, reported in a recent 
> paper of the Astrophysical Journal,
> appear to support a hypothesis that our solar system formed after a smaller 
> satellite galaxy crashed into the
> Milky Way around 6 billion years ago."..
>
> "From the isotope abundances, the researchers estimate that the majority of 
> grains spent between 3
> and 200 million years in interstellar space before falling into our molecular 
> cloud some 4.6 billion
> years ago."
>
>
> Here is the link to the article I found on line.
> http://www.astrobio.net/pdffiles/news_3202.pdf
>
> and if your up for a read, here is an article on the age of presolar SiC 
> grains found in Murchison meteorite.
>
> http://presolar.wustl.edu/ref/Gyngard09b.pdf
>
> Enjoy
> Shawn Alan
>
>
>
> [meteorite-list] Murchison-- chock full o' stuffDarren Garrison cynapse at 
> charter.net
> Tue Feb 16 00:25:30 EST 2010
>
>
> Previous message: [meteorite-list] West Texas Meteorite Hunt - February 15, 
> 2009
> Next message: [meteorite-list] West Texas Meteorite Hunt - February 15, 2009
> Messages sorted by: [ date ] [ thread ] [ subject ] [ author ]
>
> http://news.discovery.com/space/meteorite-crammed-with-millions-of-organic-compounds.html
>
> Meteorite Crammed with 'Millions' of Organic Compounds
>
> By Ian O'Neill | Mon Feb 15, 2010 04:52 PM ET
>
> A meteorite that hit the town of Murchison, Australia, hasn't quit giving up 
> its
> secrets.
>
> The Murchison meteorite is one of the most studied space rocks because many
> pieces were recovered after it was seen breaking up as it fell through the
> atmosphere in 1969. Approximately 100 kg of the carbonaceous chondrite was
> recovered.
>
> Carbonaceous chondrites are extremely important to scientists as they were
> formed from material that existed in the solar system's planet-forming disk of
> gas and dust. They are, quite literally, time capsules holding onto a 4 
> billion
> year old record of the birth of our solar system.
>
> In this case, the Murchison meteorite has given us another clue as to the
> abundance of organic chemicals that existed before the Earth had formed. In
> fact, this particular meteorite may have originated from material older than 
> our
> sun.
>
> "We are really excited. When I first studied it and saw the complexity I was 
> so
> amazed," said Dr Phillipe Schmitt-Kopplin, of the Institute for Ecological
> Chemistry in Neuherberg, Germany.
>
> "Meteorites are like some kind of fossil. When you try to understand them you
> are looking back in time."
>
> This new research made use of high resolution spectroscopic tools to identify
> the various compounds inside. Although this meteorite has provided scientists
> with vast amounts of information about specific carbon-based organics before,
> this was the first non-targeted study. In other words, the researchers weren't
> tracking down just one type of chemical, they did a broad analysis for all the
> chemicals it might contain.
>
> And what they found came as a shock, it appears that the primordial solar 
> system
> probably had a higher chemical diversity than present-day Earth.
>
> In this study, 14,000 specific compounds including 70 amino acids were
> identified. But this number appears to be the tip of the iceberg; the 
> meteorite
> probably contains millions of different organic compounds. More detailed
> analysis will now be carried out.
>
> But why is this important? To u

Re: [meteorite-list] Fake pallasites

[Dark Matter]

Hello James,

Any chance you can elaborate on who is "they" and if the fake
pallasite you are alluding to is Shirokovsky?

We are a global list that generally appreciates more background with
questions? Otherwise we have to write followup replies in order to
help find an answer for you.

Thanks,

Martin




On Thu, Feb 18, 2010 at 8:06 PM, James Balister  wrote:
> Are they still making fake pallasite's ?
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Re: [meteorite-list] Shirokovsky Psuedopallastites

[Dark Matter]

Here's another reference if you have a copy of Meteorite Mag:

The Shirokovsky object: Meteorite, terrestrial, or none of the above?
(Meteorite, Aug. 2003, Vol. 9, No. 3, pp. 5-6).

Best,

Martin



On Fri, Feb 19, 2010 at 7:27 PM, Timothy Heitz  wrote:
> Hi Paul,
>
> I thought it was fun to have a piece of the best Palawrong on the Planet:)
>
>
> There is  link on this page to a .pdf file about the Shirokovsky
> http://www.meteorman.org/Best_Palawrong.htm
>
>
> I have been working on this for years to find the best meteorwrongs on the
> Planet,
> it just goes to show that there are some good fakes out there.
> http://www.meteorman.org/Bestwrongs_index.htm
>
>
>
>
> Tim Heitz
>
>
> Midwest Meteorites
> http://www.meteorman.org
>
>
>
> - Original Message - From: "Paul Heinrich" 
> To: "Meteorite List" 
> Sent: Friday, February 19, 2010 6:56 PM
> Subject: [meteorite-list] Shirokovsky Psuedopallastites
>
>
>> Dark Matter wrote in "Fake pallasites" at
>> http://six.pairlist.net/pipermail/meteorite-list/2010-February/061171.html
>>
>> "Any chance you can elaborate on who is "they"
>> and if the fake pallasite you are alluding to is
>> Shirokovsky?"
>>
>> By the way, is anyone selling pieces of the Shirokovsky
>> Psuedopallastite?
>>
>> The only fragment that could find for sale is at
>> "Shirokovsky Pallasite 1,16 gms" at http://tiny.cc/SchirokovskyPallasite
>> and
>> http://tiny.cc/ShirokovskyPallasite2  or
>>
>> http://www.online-schmuck.biz/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=638&osCsid=02c4a2d3b6f48098f34f2a18b1d096c7
>>
>> http://www.online-schmuck.biz/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=636&osCsid=02c4a2d3b6f48098f34f2a18b1d096c7
>> where the seller is still under the delusion that it
>> is a real meteorite.
>>
>> Even though it is a fake, it seems like would be fun to have
>> a piece in one's collections given the way "minics" a type
>> of meteorite that normally lacks any meteorwrongs that can
>> be mistaken for it.
>>
>> Yours,
>>
>> Paul H.
>>
>>
>>
>>
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Re: [meteorite-list] Your top meteor sightings!

[Dark Matter]

Hi Dave,

This is the best one I've ever seen:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SwWc_eCkSyw

The smoke was quite colorful and lasted a long time. I saw it as it
flew across western Montana on its way to its closest earth approach
over Canada.

Best,

Martin




On Sat, Feb 20, 2010 at 1:33 PM, Dave Myers  wrote:
> Hi list,
>
> I have never been lucky enough to see a bolide, or fire-ball.
>
> But I have in my life seen 3 that were bright green, 2 That made a  loud 
> hissing or swishing noise. But this past november, I seen a very
> Bright white one start directly over head and head south east, as the bright 
> light burnt out, for a few tenths of a second, the object just glowed bright 
> red, went dim, and glowed about half as bright again, no tail.
>
> I would think this object made it through the lowest levels of the 
> atmosphere. Anyone ever had an encounter like that!
>
> Thanks
> Dave
>
>
>
>
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] Cleaning Sikhote Alin meteorites

[Dark Matter]

I've heard that talc blasting has been used. Like sand blasting but gentler.

-Martin



On Thursday, February 10, 2011, Jim Wooddell  wrote:
> Ruben and all,
>
> I've cleaned other types of rocks with a water jet tooth brush set up
> in the past.  It could have used a lot more pressure.  I've also
> baking soda blasted fine metal parts with my bead blaster.  A Dentist
> quality water jet would work very good, I would think. Do not know why
> that would not work for the irons???
>
> Jim
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Feb 10, 2011 at 7:04 PM, Matthew Martin
>  wrote:
>> I'm not positive on this one, but I believe their being tumbled.  I picked
>> up a piece of shrapnel in Tucson that had two weird looking spheres embedded
>> to it, and when I inquired about them I was told they were beads from the
>> cleaning process.  They came off with a little pressure.
>>
>> Aloha,
>>
>> Matt Martin
>> Meteorite Treasures
>>
>>
>>
>> Quoting Richard Montgomery :
>>
>>> Ruben, please attach a photo maybe?  All the SA's today recently arrive
>>> all soaked in black dirty t-fluid, quite a tussle.  My best specimens never
>>> were, and it's why they are my best and will forever remain in my
>>> collection.  I'd love to see the condition you are referring to.  Dremmel
>>> tool?
>>>
>>>
>>> - Original Message - From: "Ruben Garcia" 
>>> To: "Meteorite List" 
>>> Sent: Thursday, February 10, 2011 4:58 PM
>>> Subject: [meteorite-list] Cleaning Sikhote Alin meteorites
>>>
>>>
 Hi all,

 I just bought some very nice SA's but they are not cleaned like the
 others we are used to seeing. Anyone know how they clean SA
 meteorites?  I am quite sure it is not a wire brush  as the other
 SA's are cleaned in all the cracks and crevasses. A wire brush
 couldn't do that.




 --
 Rock On!

 Ruben Garcia

 Website: http://www.mr-meteorite.net
 Articles: http://www.meteorite.com/blog/
 Videos: http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=meteorfright#p/u
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>>>
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>>
>>
>>
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Re: [meteorite-list] Valera affidavit

[Dark Matter]

Here's some info on Valera I put together a while ago.

http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2006/August/Accretion_Desk.htm

Best,

Martin



On Saturday, February 26, 2011, martin goff  wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> Can anyone supply me with a decent copy of the original affidavit
> regarding the Valera fall?
>
> Cheers
>
> Martin
>
> --
> Martin Goff
> www.msg-meteorites.co.uk
> IMCA #3387
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Re: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of Day - March 20, 2011

[Dark Matter]

And while we're at this Bruderheim love fest, please allow me to make
my own shameless plug:

http://www.meteorite-times.com/accretion-desk/bruderheim-canada-bruderheim-timing-is-everything/

Happy reading!

Martin


On Sunday, March 20, 2011, Melodye Farmer  wrote:
> Very nice! Those are real keepers. I treasure my ASU Bruderheim. Do they come 
> with any labels?
> Michael Farmer
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Mar 20, 2011, at 3:15 AM, Michael Johnson  
> wrote:
>
>> http://www.rocksfromspace.org/March_20_2011.html
>>
>>
>> ---
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Re: [meteorite-list] grey fusion crust on a stony?

[Dark Matter]

Looks quite volcanic to me. Something low in density and from the earth.

The iron seems high, but the spectum from basalt to welded tufts can
be iron rich.

The crust part doesn't look very crusty to me.

Other thoughts?

Martin


On Tuesday, September 21, 2010, Michael Murray  wrote:
> Hi Eric, Pat, Martin, Steve D, Jason and any other interested parties on the 
> Met-List
> I managed to take a half-bad picture of the little grey stone in my earlier 
> post.  My excuses for such a bad photo are that it is tiny, so hard to 
> photograph even through the scope.  Also lighting is by the ring light on my 
> scope so the true color is not there.  Close though.  One thing I was hoping 
> to show with this picture is the cracks all over it.  Inside appears to be 
> somewhat of a root beer color outside is ash grey.
> Not sure if it is a meteorite but it is interesting to look at.  I found it 
> with my magnet rake.  The little stone is strongly attracted to a magnet.  It 
> has little silvery specks showing on the outside.  The whole stone looks like 
> it would crumble if handled but actually it is not that soft.
> Anyway, just thought you might want to see what I was so curious about.
> Thanks everyone for the help on the grey crust question.
> Mike in CO
> Here's the link:
> 
>
>
> On Sep 20, 2010, at 8:54 PM, Michael Murray wrote:
>
>
> Hi List,
>
>  A question for anyone that wouldn't mind helping me on this...Are there any 
> known grey crusted stony meteorites?  I'm talking the grey color of lead 
> almost.  And yes, it is a stone, not metal.
>
> Mike in CI
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Re: [meteorite-list] Hard Copy Meteorite Catalogs

[Dark Matter]

Way back in the past, the three best dealer's catalogs as far as
photography goes (in my opinion) were Bethany Sciences (don't shoot
the messenger), Michael Casper's mailings, and New England
Meteoritical. They all produced color catalogs of specimens. Alan Lang
also had a full color presentation of his collection pieces that
arrived with his listings,

There were others who used images, but these stand out in my memory.

Best,

Martin



On Tue, Sep 1, 2009 at 12:33 PM,  wrote:
> Mike...I'd recommend you find some photos that  were taken by those who
> found West Meteorites in Texas earlier this year. Any  meteorites that you 
> will
> probably find will probably look similar to  these...black and rounded etc.
> If you try to include a big variety of colors and  looks etc, I think you
> might confuse those who will be doing the looking.
> GeoZay
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] John's article on MT

[Dark Matter]

Hello Tom and All,

I don't want to let this torch passing milestone pass without a plug
for the genesis of Micro Visions. Back in May of 2006,

http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2006/May/Accretion_Desk.htm

This Accretion Desk article was like Tom's Greatest Hits to date. Then
37 installments of Micro Visions followed. Wow, what a ride.

Thanks Tom and have fun with all your time off. I look forward to when
you come out of retirement or at least produce a Greatest Hits Volume
2.

CHEERS, and welcome aboard John!

Martin



On Fri, Sep 11, 2009 at 1:31 PM,   wrote:
> Hi list,  Be sure and check out John  Kashuba's Micro Vision article on
> this months Meteorite Times.
>
> Interesting article and great micrographs!
>
> Tom
>
> In a  message dated 9/11/2009 11:24:40 A.M. Mountain Daylight Time,
> p...@meteorite.com  writes:
> Greetings Everyone,
>
> The September issue of Meteorite-Times is  now up.
>
> Tom Phillips mentioned in a previous email to the list, he is  stepping
> down from writing the Micro-Vision article.  We'd like to take  this
> opportunity to thank Tom for all his time, effort, and for all the
> magnificent pictures he took for Micro-Visions.
>
> John Kashuba is now  writing the article and I'm sure most all of you are
> already familiar with  the quality work John does..  This is really a
> win-win for all of us as  now not only do we have John's great work, but
> now Tom will have the time to  update his gallery more often. Tom's
> already working on something for next  week.
>
> Thank you to all the other contributers  too!
>
> http://www.meteorite-times.com/meteorite_frame.htm
>
> Enjoy,
>
> Paul  and  Jim
>
>
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] Montana Fireball

[Dark Matter]

Hmmm

9:22 p.m. a fireball sighted.

11:04 p.m. A dead deer obstructed Highway 93.

11:50 p.m. A dead deer obstructed Foys Canyon Road.

A coincidence? I think not.

But seriously. This is all an hour or two from my house. I'll keep an
eye on the news.

BYW: a police blotter full of bear, moose, deer and dopes is just
another grand day here under The Big Sky.

-Martin




On Fri, Sep 18, 2009 at 10:12 AM, Meteorites USA  wrote:
> Hi List,
>
> 9:22 p.m. last night? - Someone saw what was described as a “big fireball”
> in the sky on the north side of Hash Mountain. Although the reporting party
> believed it to be an aircraft, all planes in the area were fully accounted
> for and all was well.
>
> http://www.flatheadbeacon.com/articles/article/car_versus_moose_and_a_mysterious_fireball/13066/
>
> Regards,
> Eric Wichman
> Meteorites USA
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Re: [meteorite-list] CAI and chondrules

[Dark Matter]

Hi All,

I think Jeff's answer was definitive in a boomerang way.

But wait there's more:

http://geosci.uchicago.edu/~grossman/MSD05.pdf

I studied this and other articles looking for the same answers as
those in the initial post.

I'm still looking.

The best I can do in my talks is to quote Don Brownlee when he penned
the following in a 2007 Stardust news update:

"One of the most remarkable particles found in the Stardust collection
is a particle named after the Inca Sun God Inti. Inti is collection of
rock fragments that are all related in mineralogical, isotopic and
chemical composition to rare components in meteorites called "Calcium
Aluminum Inclusions" or CAI's for short. CAI's are the oldest
materials that formed in the solar system and they contain a
remarkable set of minerals that form at extremely high temperature. In
addition to these same minerals, Inti also has tiny inclusions that
may have been the first generation of solids to condense from hot gas
in the early solar system. These include compounds of titanium,
vanadium and nitrogen (TiN and VN) as well as tiny nuggets of
platinum, osmium, ruthenium, tungsten and molybdenum. In certain
chemical environments and at high enough temperature in the early
solar system these exotic materials were the only solid materials that
could survive without being vaporized."

http://stardust.jpl.nasa.gov/news/news113.html

Finally, I have some pics of a rather large CAI in my Accretion Desk article at:

http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2008/march/Accretion_Desk.htm

Best,

Martin





On Thu, Oct 1, 2009 at 1:55 AM, MEM  wrote:
> I've my own collection of ideas as to how chondrules developed but will save 
> them for later.  As to CAIs and their presence in carbonaceous meteorites.  A 
> list member and I had this discussion some time ago and the answer may lie in 
> a process in the "T-Tauri" stage of stellar evolution.
>
> When the T-Tauri protostar goes thermonuclear it loses a mass through a high 
> solar wind output which sweeps a lot of the remaining unaccreted debris from 
> the inner solar system--we believe.  This is the foundation for our ability 
> to develop isotopic curves of regions based on distance from the sun and 
> explains the rocky inner planets and the gas giants much further out in the 
> solar system.  This probably is a player in chondrule formation. CAIs are 
> dated to about 2 million years older.
>
> Prior to the hydrogen fuel-burning stage, there was an ongoing fission 
> process which is the likely source for the short-lived isotopes such as 26Al. 
> While I can't lay my hands on the link, I recall some diagrams of a 
> particular phase of T-Tauri accretion where the dynamics were such that even 
> though the solar disk was being spun into a flat, thin, rotating disk, the 
> poles of the proto-sun were ejecting major mega streams of lighter, probably 
> charged particles-- mainly such as calcium, aluminum, carbon, helium, etc. 
> The particle streams resembled fountains spraying very high speed particles 
> many many AUs up and out of the plane of the ecliptic into two giant 
> hemispheres.
>
> If true, this tends to explain the Ort cloud formation and how CAIs were 
> available for inclusion in cometary-like carbonaceous meteorites along with 
> younger chondrules. It explains how CAIs predate the sun's fusion stage and 
> how they were able to skip the mega solar winds generated when the sun kicked 
> over to fusion from fission. Comets forming inside the Ort Cloud but outside 
> the ecliptical plane my be devoid of chondrules (possible example: Tagish 
> Lake)
>
> 1) supernova
> A super nova is theorized to be the catalyst for compressing enough dust 
> close enough for gravity to take over and condense the early initial solar 
> disk getting things spinning into a disk.
>> 2) few time later CAI formation
> Yes but a long time later, possibly explained under the T-Tauri pre-fusion 
> stage during the collapse of the solar disk.
> 3) at the same time collapse of nebula
> Yes but probably well after the accretion stage was under way.
> 4) 2My later condrule formation.
> Yes again
>> 5) at the same time proto-sun and proto-planetary formation
> Probably in connection with the fusion to fusion change-over and during the 
> interval before mega-solar wind swept out the lighter elements from the inner 
> solar system and stopped chondrule formation.
>> 6) ...
> There were probably at least 6 additional Mars sized planets else planetary 
> centers of accretion and some theorize 30 or more. One was accounted for by 
> our moons formation, another knocked Uranus on its side one or more 
> contributed to the asteroid belt. Someplace in the sequence comets formed 
> outside the mainstream goings on in the solar disk/system it self.
>
> Elton
>
> --- On Wed, 9/30/09, Francesco Moser  wrote:
>
>> From: Francesco Moser 
>> Subject: [meteorite-list] CAI and chondrules
>> To: "ZZ ML Meteorite-List" 
>> Date: Wednesday, September

Re: [meteorite-list] zoom feature... On Macs

[Dark Matter]

oops.

Note to self: Must read all emails before replying. If the answer is
easy, then someone else has already provided the answer to the list.

Now I have to go type that 100 times on my antikythera laptop.

-Martin



On Sun, Oct 11, 2009 at 9:29 AM, Dark Matter  wrote:
> Hi All,
>
> Macs have a screen zooming feature that is controlled by keyboard
> commands once turned on. Its settings are found in the universal
> access options in the system preferences.
>
> Best,
>
> Martin
>
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] zoom feature... On Macs

[Dark Matter]

Hi All,

Macs have a screen zooming feature that is controlled by keyboard
commands once turned on. Its settings are found in the universal
access options in the system preferences.

Best,

Martin



On Sat, Oct 10, 2009 at 10:56 PM, Michael Blood  wrote:
> Hi Michael,
>        Your wording implies there is a "magnifier" function in
> Macintosh computers. Can you tell me (us) where it is and how
> To use it - or is it a feature one must purchase seperately?
>        I believe list members would like to know, so, please respond
> On list.
>        Thanks, Michael
>
>
> On 10/10/09 8:46 PM, "Michael Murray"  wrote:
>
>> The new Windows Vista has a magnifier in it like that.  I have a
>> magnifier on my Mac too.  I agree, very cool.  I use them a lot.  I
>> just tried the ebay zoom on a chondrite.  Very nice too.
>> Thanks for sharing the info.
>> Mike in CO
>>
>>
>> On Oct 9, 2009, at 7:00 PM, Mike Miller wrote:
>>
>>> Hi all my wife just pointed the new (I think) feature on Ebay called
>>> zoom. When you are viewing a picture on Ebay just under the photo on
>>> the left hand side the button says zoom. Then after you click on it a
>>> box appears in the middle of the photo. Once you move your cursor to
>>> this box you get an incredible close up view of the photo. Very cool
>>> to get a close view of whatever you are looking to buy. Incredible for
>>> etched meteorites. Just in case some of you have not seen this feature
>>> yet. : )  Very cool if you ask me.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Mike Miller 230 Greenway Dr. Kingman Az 86401
>>> www.meteoritefinder.com
>>>     928-753-6825
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Re: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - November 6, 2009

[Dark Matter]

Thanks for the wonderful pics.

The Changxing fall is one near and dear to my heart. I secured a piece
of this "find" for my collection only to realize after trimming a few
thin slices off of it, that it was, in fact, a fall and I would not
have let it touch a saw blade for that silly reason alone.

The danger illustrated here is when one source is based on another,
based on another. It was the second edition of Meteorites A to Z that
alerted me to the situation with Changxing when its entry footnoted
the article also referenced in the RFS picture caption.

I mentioned this change in an Accretion Desk article I wrote back in
March of 2005 about the concept I call Find2Fall. Here's the link:

http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2005/March/Accretion_Desk.htm

Changxing is mentioned at the end of the article.

Best,

Martin



On Fri, Nov 6, 2009 at 2:19 PM, Michael Johnson
 wrote:
> http://www.rocksfromspace.org/November_6_2009.html
>
>
>
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] Fusion Crust on Irons

[Dark Matter]

Hi Eric,

Here are a few closeup pics of fusion crust on the iron named Bogou:

http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2009/august/Accretion_Desk.htm

Best,

Martin H.



On Tue, Nov 17, 2009 at 10:18 AM, Meteorites USA  wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> With all the talk about melting and twisting of metal on the Sikhote Alin
> meteorite it got me to wondering what very fresh fusion crust looks like on
> an iron meteorite. I mean like the day it fell fresh, and not like the
> Sikhote.
>
> Everyone here pretty much knows what fresh crust looks like on an ordinary
> chondrite, but are there any example photos of freshly fallen iron
> meteorites with very fresh fusion crust beside the Sikhote Alin meteorite?
>
> Regards,
> Eric Wichman
> Meteorites USA
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Re: [meteorite-list] Most witnessed falls in one year?

[Dark Matter]

Hi All,

In my October installment of the Accretion Desk, I highlighted one of
the many 1933 falls, namely the ultra rare aubrite named Pesyanoe. In
the opening paragraph, I mentioned that there were 18 falls in 1933.
That information was taken from book Meteorites A to Z.

Here's the link;

http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2009/october/Accretion_Desk.htm

Best,

Martin



On Sat, Nov 28, 2009 at 10:58 PM, Frank Cressy  wrote:
> Melanie, Greg and all,
>
> I think we have a ways to go to break the record.  In 1933 as many as 19 
> meteorites fell worldwide if you count 2 finds that were reported to have 
> been observed to fall in 1933 but were found later and are classified as 
> finds.  The second greatest number of falls occurred in 1868 when 13 falls 
> were witnessed and recovered worldwide.  In 1933 seven falls were witnessed 
> to fall in the US; Pasamonte, Cherokee Springs, Athens, Sioux County, and 
> Malaga plus Willard (b) and Elton which were found later, but are believed to 
> be 1933 falls.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Frank
>
>
>
> - Original Message 
> From: Greg Stanley 
> To: miss_meteor...@yahoo.ca; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
> Sent: Sat, November 28, 2009 9:16:24 PM
> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Most witnessed falls in one year?
>
>
> Melanie:
>
> I asked this same question earlier in the year; someone responded with some 
> numbers from past years, but I do not remember who.  I think we may break the 
> record though.
>
> Greg S.
>
> 
>> Date: Sat, 28 Nov 2009 18:10:41 -0800
>> From: miss_meteor...@yahoo.ca
>> To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
>> Subject: [meteorite-list] Most witnessed falls in one year?
>>
>> I have returned you lucky people!
>> Has the year 2009 set a new record for the greatest number of witnessed 
>> fireballs seen within one year? If not - what year has the most reported 
>> falls?
>>
>> ---
>> Melanie
>> IMCA: 2975
>> eBay: metmel2775
>> Known on SkyRock Cafe as SpaceCollector09
>>
>> Unclassified meteorites are like a box of chocolates... you never know what 
>> you're gonna get!
>>
>>
>>
>> __
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Re: [meteorite-list] Off Topic: Car Remote Security

[Dark Matter]

good grief

http://www.snopes.com/autos/techno/lockcode.asp


http://urbanlegends.about.com/od/automobiles/a/car_locks.htm


http://majorhitwaves.wordpress.com/2008/08/21/thursday-night-internet-hoax-hall-of-shame-30/

and so on...

-Martin



On Tue, Dec 1, 2009 at 3:43 PM, Meteorites USA  wrote:
> Hi list,
>
> This is off topic, but it's something I thought worthwhile to share with
> list members. Don't know how recent this is, but I received an email forward
> from a friend and figured I'd forward this to list members just as a heads
> up.
>
> --
> BEGIN FORWARDED EMAIL
> --
> How to Lock Your Car and Why
>
> I locked my car. As I walked away I heard my car door unlock. I went back
> and locked my car again three times. Each time, as soon as I started to walk
> away, I would hear it unlock again!  Naturally alarmed, I looked around and
> there were two guys sitting in a car in the fire lane next to the store.
>  They were o obviously watching me intently and there was no doubt they were
> somehow involved in this very weird situation.  I quickly chucked the errand
> I was on, jumped in my car and sped away. I went straight to the police
> station, told them what had happened and found out I was part of a new --
> and very successful -- scheme being used to gain entry into cars. Two weeks
> later, my friend's son had a similar experience.  While traveling, my
> friend's son stopped at a roadside rest area to use the bathroom. When he
> came out to his car less than five minutes later, someone had gotten into
> his car and stolen his cell phone, laptop computer, GPS navigator,
> briefcase...You name it. He called the police and since there were no signs
> of his car being broken into, the police told him he had been a victim of
> the latest robbery tactic: There is a device that robbers are using now to
> clone your security code when you lock your doors on your car using your
> key-chain locking device.  They sit a distance away and watch for their next
> victim.  They know you are going inside of the store, restaurant, or
> bathroom and that they now have a few minutes to steal and run. The police
> officer said to manually lock your car door-by hitting the lock button
> inside the car. That  way, if there is someone sitting in a parking lot
> watching for their next victim, it will not be you.  When you hit the lock
> button on your car upon exiting, it does not send the security code, but if
> you walk away and use the door lock on your key chain, it sends the code
> through the airwaves  where it can be instantly stolen. This is very real.
>  Be wise and aware of what you just read and please pass this note on. Look
> how many times we all lock our doors with our remote just to be sure we
> remembered to lock
> them  -- and bingo, someone has our code...and whatever was in our car.
> Snopes Approved -- Please share with everyone you know!!
>
>
> "never forget that a government, large enough to give us everything we want,
> is also large and powerful enough, to take everything we have..."
> --
> END FORWARDED EMAIL
> --
>
> Regards,
> Eric
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - December 19, 2009

[Dark Matter]

Darryl?



On Sat, Dec 19, 2009 at 7:01 AM, Michael Johnson
 wrote:
> http://www.rocksfromspace.org/December_19_2009.html
>
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[meteorite-list] Engineering Christmas

[Dark Matter]

Hi All,

Once again, it seems it has befallen upon me uphold the job of official Santa
Physics story reposter. So, in the true spirit of the season, here it
is yet again.

And as always, I have not checked the math.

Enjoy.

Martin


Engineering Christmas: Some points of contention.

There are approximately two billion children (persons under 18) in the
world. However, since Santa does not visit children of Muslim, Hindu,
Jewish or Buddhist religions, this reduces the workload for Christmas
night to 15% of the total, or 378 million (according to the Population
Reference Bureau). At an average (census) rate of 3.5 children per
household, that comes to 108 million homes, presuming that there is at
least one good child in each dwelling.

Santa has about 31 hours of Christmas to work with thanks to the
different time zones and the rotation of the earth, assuming he
travels east to west which seems logical. This works out to 967.7
visits per second. This is to say that for each Christian household
with a good child, Santa has about 1/1000th of a second to park the
sleigh, hop out, jump down the chimney, fill the stockings, distribute
the remaining presents under the tree, eat whatever snacks have been
left for him, get back up the chimney, jump into the sleigh and get on
to the next house. Assuming that each of these 108 million stops is
evenly distributed around the earth (which of course, we know to be
false, but will accept for the purpose of our calculations), we are
now talking about 0.78 miles per household; a total trip of 75.5
million miles, not counting bathroom stops or other breaks.

This requires that Santa's sleigh moves at 650 miles per second--3000
times the speed of sound. For purposes of comparison, the fastest
man-made vehicle, the Ulysses space probe, moves at a poky 27.4 miles
per second, and conventional reindeer can run at best 30 miles per
hour.

The payload of the sleigh adds another interesting element. Assuming
that each child gets nothing more than a medium sized Lego set (two
pounds), the sleigh is carrying over 500,000 tons, not counting Santa
himself. On land a conventional reindeer can pull about 300 pounds.
Even granting that the "flying" reindeer could pull ten times the
normal amount, the job just cannot be done with eight or nine of
them-- Santa would need 360,000 reindeer!

This increases the payload, not counting the weight of the sleigh,
another 54,000 tons or roughly seven times the weight of the Queen
Elizabeth (the ship, not the monarch).

4.600,000 tons traveling at 650 miles per second creates enormous air
resistance-- this would heat up the reindeer in the same fashion as
spacecraft re-entering the earth's atmosphere (which may explain
Rudolph's red nose). The lead pair of reindeer would absorb 14.3
quintillion joules of energy per second. In short, they would
instantaneously vaporize exposing the reindeer behind them to the same
friction and also creating deafening sonic booms in their wake. The
entire reindeer team would vanish within 4.26 thousandths of a second,
or right about the time Santa reached the fifth house on his trip.

Not that it matters, however since Santa, as a result of accelerating
from a dead stop to 650 miles per second in .001 seconds, would be
subjected to centrifugal forces of 17,500 Gs. A 250 pound Santa (which
seems ludicrously slim) would be pinned to the back of the sleigh by
4,315,015 pounds of force, instantly crushing his bones and organs and
reducing him to a quivering red-hot blob of goo. And yet, he returns
year after year.

Therefore, the rules of physics obviously don't apply to Santa and his
yearly mission. Speaking as an engineer, this guy must know something
about relativity that we have yet to discover.

HO, HO, OC.
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Re: [meteorite-list] Merry Christmas ! Harvey Nininger Signed book ending today! AD

[Dark Matter]

Hi John,

Interesting autograph. I have not seen a double signed Nininger like
that before.

However, I have seen, and in fact, own one myself, a double signed
Nininger book with two distinct signatures. Here's a pic:

http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2003/October/nininger.jpg

Also, since you have an interest in Nininger signings, here's an
inscription he wrote to Chuck Lewis that shows some of the wonderful
personality of H.H. himself. It's in one of my copies of Find a
Falling Star.

http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2003/December/ning_fafs_insc_best.jpg

To "some of the thrills..."

-Martin



On Wed, Dec 23, 2009 at 8:01 AM, John higgins  wrote:
> Merry Christmas all my meteorite friends! Harvey Nininger Signed book ending 
> today! AD
>
> Hello, first of all i would like to wish you all a very warm, Happy Merry 
> Christmas, lets make it a great one this year!
>
> I have some auctions ending today and tomorrow on E-bay
>
> First on the Agenda is Harvey Nininger Autographed book, it's an original 
> from 1952 that I purchased from the owner in Leipzig, Germany. Book is in 
> great shape, just little wear and tear on the top and bottom of jacket.
> There is a reserve, but to be honest, I think it's super low considering it 
> took me my whole life to find this one, and it's the only one I was ever able 
> to acquire. Not only did he sign, but he even dated this book! making it 
> incredibly rare, and who else in the world can say they own a original book 
> signed by the greatest meteorite researcher in history, and he signed it 
> twice! First in blue ink, then went over it again in black ink to make sure 
> it would stand the test of time, and on the specific date May 21, 1952. 
> Simply one of a kind.
> Also express shipping is free of course!
> Just a little side note of events that happened on this day in history:
> Famous people born on May 21st
> 427 BC Plato (philosopher)
> 1427 Albrecht Durer (painter, engraver, mathematician)
> 1688 Alexander Pope (poet)
> 1844 Henri Rosseau (artist)
> 1917 Raymond Burr (actor)
> 1921 Andre Sakharov (physicist, human rights activist)
> 1951 Al Franken (comedian)
> 1952 Mr T. (actor)
> 1956 Judge Reinhold (actor)
> 1972 Notorious BIG (rapper)
> Another thing:
> 1881 American Red Cross established.
> 1927 Charles Lindbergh completes the first solo flight across the Atlantic
>
>
> If you are interested you can find the auction here:
>
> http://cgi.ebay.com/Harvey-Nininger-autographed-book-Out-of-the-sky-1952_W0QQitemZ380190630961QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item588520a431
>
>
> And I also have Unclassified NWA meteorites ending tomorrow, all with free 
> shipping, currently all under cost!
> You can find them in my e-bay store Outer Space Rocks
>
> http://stores.ebay.com/Outer-Space-Rocks
>
> Thanks for looking!
> And Have a Great Day!
> John Higgins IMCA#9822
>
>
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] Christian Anger

[Dark Matter]

Christian was giant in our midst. I am honored to have spent time
talking with him over the years. Although I never met him in person,
our meteorite paths crossed so many times that I would routinely
consult him about historic specimens and the excitement of the hunt.

Here is a link to an Accretion Desk article where Christian and I
shared some of that excitement.

http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2006/July/Accretion_Desk.htm

When the Meteorite Times published a new issue, like clockwork I would
get an email from Christian comparing notes about the specimen I
highlighted. Here is his last email to me sent three days before his
death:


December 11, 2009

Hello Martin,

Truly, a super meteorite. I love it too.

Attached is a pic of my collection specimen 9.754 grams.

Best regards,

Christian

Ing. Christian Anger
Neustiftgasse 37
A-2405 Bad Deutsch Altenburg
AUSTRIA


You were a true gentleman and scholar of our sport. I will miss you.

Good-bye Christian.

Most sincerely,

Martin Horejsi
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Re: [meteorite-list] Haiti Relief Auction?

[Dark Matter]

Here's a past model:

http://www.aerolite.org/events/meteorite-raffle.htm

-Martin



On Wed, Jan 13, 2010 at 5:11 PM, Galactic Stone & Ironworks
 wrote:
> Hi List,
>
> The extent of the devastation in Haiti is great and it makes whatever
> problems most of us have pale by comparison.  If anyone is planning
> some kind of relief auction or sale, I would gladly donate a few
> specimens with the proceeds to go to the disaster relief.  I don't
> have any high dollar pieces to donate (mostly small stuff like
> micros), but anything would probably help.  I have my hands and plate
> full with my wife's medical problems at the moment, so I don't have
> the time to organize or host such an auction/sale, but I'll definitely
> donate something.
>
> Best regards and happy hunting,
>
> MikeG
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Re: [meteorite-list] Strewnfield or Strewn Field?

[Dark Matter]

Hi All,

If strewnfield is not one word (as it should be), then it will be
soon. Especially with our help.

But in today's vernacular, I suspect it is more like STRNFLD as in:

RUNTS! IANAL BUT CYA B4 U SRCH STRNFLD. WDYT?

Oh, and thanks for referencing my column Larry and Frank. I would love
to have the time again to put into the Strewnfields column again, but
it will be a while. I am, however, a new columnist for the journal The
Science Teacher (NSTA.org) with an installment titled Science 2.0.

In the mean time my monthly Accretion Desk is as much meteorite
writing as I have time for. Got to keep this fun, right?

B4N,

Martin




On Fri, Jan 15, 2010 at 6:57 PM, Frank Cressy  wrote:
> Hello all,
>
> I think it would be correct to use "strewnfield"...one word.
>
> When someone talks about a corn field, two words are used.  Another way to 
> say this is : "field of corn."
>
> If "strewn field" is the correct, would one also be correct in saying "field 
> of strewn"?  I don't think that works.
>
> So I think the correct usage should be "strewnfield" like Martin used to use 
> in his columns.
>
> Just my 2 cents,
>
> Frank
>
>
>
>
> 
> From: "lebof...@lpl.arizona.edu" 
> To: Meteorites USA 
> Cc: Meteorite-list 
> Sent: Thu, January 14, 2010 7:52:16 PM
> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Strewnfield or Strewn Field?
>
> Hi Eric:
>
> For about a year, this was a topic for the editors of Meteorite magazine.
> We decided to be consistent with strewnfield since we had the column "From
> the Strewnfields" by Martin Horejsi at the time (miss your articles in the
> magazine, Martin).
>
> Larry
>
>> Hi Listees,
>>
>> Thanks to you all who've written in with kind words and comments on my
>> new article a few days back titled "What is a Meteorite Strewnfield?" I
>> really appreciate your compliments. I hope you all enjoyed it. If you
>> haven't read it yet please do so. It's a good informative read, and even
>> has some pretty pictures too. ;)
>>
>> The reason for this email is to ask about proper use of the word(s)
>> strewnfield. While researching the article I noticed that the numerous
>> websites on the internet had 2 ways of spelling the it. Should it be
>> "Strewnfield" one word... or "Strewn Field" two seperate words?
>>
>> Every time I type in strewnfield in a search it comes up with "Did you
>> mean?" "strewn field" with a space. I've seen it described as "Strewn
>> field" on Wikipedia. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strewn_field Then in
>> the paragraph just below it reads "strewnfield" all one word again. To
>> make matters more confusing Encyclopedia Britannica has the word with a
>> hyphen i.e; strewn-field.
>> http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/569002/strewn-field Google
>> shows 67,500 results for the phrase "strewn field" and the same amount
>> for strewn-field" with a hyphen, meaning they don't recognize the
>> hyphen. Google also shows 23,700 results for the single word
>> "strewnfield". Not to mention the many articles and papers all over the
>> internet with ALL 3 ways of usage of the word.
>>
>> So which is it? or does it really matter?
>>
>> Regards,
>> Eric Wichman
>> Meteorites USA
>> www.meteoritesusa.com
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
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>
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] Allende and a new mineral called Tistarite......

[Dark Matter]

Hi Shawn,

I doubt it will change the value of Allende, but it is one of the
cooler new names for a discovery:

"The mineral is named after the composition "Ti" and the word "star,"
implying that this new refractory mineral is among the first solids
formed in the solar system."

-Martin


On Sat, Jan 16, 2010 at 3:02 PM, Shawn Alan  wrote:
> Hello List,
>
>
>
> A couple weeks ago I came across a letter on the internet published in the 
> American Mineralogist, Vol 94, pages 841-844, 2009 (here is a link to the 
> letter http://www.its.caltech.edu/~chima/publications/2009_AM_tistarite.pdf ) 
> and the topic was about a new mineral found in Allende, called Tistarite.
>
>
>
> Last month I purchased an Allende meteorite and since then been fascinated by 
> the thought that Allende is older then dirt, to be more exacted, 4.57 billion 
> years old. And to top it off, Allende has traces of nanodiamonds from near by 
> supernovas, making the fine-grain microscopic particles older then our solar 
> system.
>
>
>
> Now in 2009 from American Mineralogist I read that scientists have found a 
> new mineral only present in Allende meteorite, which is called Tistarite. My 
> question is how will this new mineral impact Allende meteorite in the science 
> and meteorite communities and what significance will it have on future 
> discoveries for new minerals?
>
>
>
> Thank you
> Shawn Alan
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Re: [meteorite-list] Some meteorite words

[Dark Matter]

Metor-Ick(y) = wholesale @ 5 cents/g in Tucson if you buy the whole box.

Meteorbisity = when one's collection cabinet shelves begin to sag
under the weight of unclassified NWAs.

Meteorgasim = oh, you'll know it when you have one.

and

MeteorId = the root psychology that makes us collect these things as
in Freud's id where, specifically, the id is the part of the human
personality that is made up of all our inborn biological urges that
seeks out immediate gratification (guided by the Pleasure Principle),
regardless of social values or consequences.

-Martin
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Re: [meteorite-list] Some meteorite words

[Dark Matter]

Oh, I get it...

Meteor Rights.

The right of the people to keep and bear meteorites, shall not be infringed.


-Martin
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[meteorite-list] If Yogi Berra collected meteorites

[Dark Matter]

HI All,

In need of another mental distraction from work, I noticed that a
famous Yogi Berra quote would apply to meteorite collection if
slightly tweeked. So with apologies to the great man himself, here are
some other variation that I think preserve some of the spirit of his
original mixed message.

I knew it would be my biggest piece until I got a bigger one.

Nobody goes to the Tucson show anymore. It’s too crowded.

It’s pretty expensive, but it doesn’t seem like it.

It was hard to purchase any specimens because everyone was too busy buying them.

An achondrite ain't worth a chondrite anymore.

You wouldn’t have won the eBay auction if I had outbid you.

If people don’t want to buy your meteorites, nobody’s going to stop them.

It ain’t your till it’s yours.

My collection has deep depth.

When deciding between two specimens, buy it.

If the specimen was perfect, it wouldn’t be.

Meteorites ain't what they used to be.

I never bought most of the things I did.

Ninety percent of meteorite collecting is half luck.


Best,

Martin
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Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Photography (Must read!)

[Dark Matter]

Hi All,

Actually there is a further concern here. Although when a lens is
stopped down to its max it does have the greatest depth of field, but
it is also not at its sweet spot for sharpness. Usually a stop or two
less than max provides the sharpest image the lens is capable of. Here
is more about this:

http://www.bobatkins.com/photography/technical/diffraction.html

Best,

Martin



On Wed, Jan 27, 2010 at 7:27 AM, John Gwilliam  wrote:
> Al is right on this one.  The higher the F-stop number, the greater the
> depth of field is, i.e more of a three dimensional object will be in focus.
>  The drawback to this is less light enters the lens thus requiring a longer
> shutter speed.  And, if your not careful, a background that is too close can
> be in focus as well.  There are many different ways to take good quality
> pictures of meteorites,  experimentation is the key.
>
> Best,
>
> John Gwilliam
>
> At 06:50 AM 1/27/2010, al mitt wrote:
>>
>> Hi Erik and all,
>>
>> I'd think just the opposite would be correct. A higher f-stop (f 22, 18
>> etc.) would create a better depth of field and the more open your iris is on
>> your camera (lower f stop, 1.8, 2.0 etc.) the less focused your items would
>> be. I think you just stated it backwards. Best!
>>
>> --AL Mitterling
>> Mitterling Meteorites
>>
>> - Original Message - From: "Erik Fisler" 
>> To: "meteorite-list" 
>> Sent: Tuesday, January 26, 2010 3:51 PM
>> Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Photography (Must read!)
>>
>>
>>
>> The third thing is auto-blending. For those of you who have SLR's you will
>> notice that shooting at a higher F-stop like F1.8 or F2.8 is a lot sharper
>> than shooting at a lower F-stop like F22. The problem is, you might have to
>> drop your F-stop to make sure the whole meteorite is in focus.
>>
>> __
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>> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
>
> Regards,
>
> John Gwilliam
>
> Some people are born on third base
> and go through life thinking they hit a triple.
>                                             [Bob Dylan]
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Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Photography (Must read!)

[Dark Matter]

Hmm, where to start

How about a couple general points:

First, a smaller aperture is a bigger number as it represents a ratio
of lens diameter to aperture opening. I believe that is expressed
backward in the previous post. Further a doubling or halving of the
shutter speed or ISO is the same as a one stop increase or decrease in
aperture.

Sports photogs use fast lens because in the Shutter speed/aperture/ISO
equation, more light = higher usable shutter speed at the same ISO.

Tele lenses compress the image FOV and have a narrower DOF than normal
or wide lenses.

The DOF works both ways-in front of prime focus and behind it.

A stopped down tele lens still has a short DOF and the background
would only be in focus if the DOF contained infinity.

 A lens wide open i.e. 2.8 can not be sharper than the lens stopped
down. Isolated elements in the photo are not the same as sharpness.

Macro lenses are designed to be flat field so when moving to the macro
world, the playing field changes, especially when using extension
tubes, bellows, or the like.

The optical physics are straight forward, but often mixed with human
interpretation of an image. But in the end, physics is physics.


-Martin




On Wed, Jan 27, 2010 at 11:14 AM, Meteorites USA  wrote:
> Erik is right, The higher f-stop of 22 will increase depth of field, not
> sharpness of focus. Though it's related, it's not quite the same. Your focus
> is not controlled entirely by f-stop, only the DOF and amount of light allow
> into the camera.
>
> This is why sports photographers use a low/large f-stop lens like f2.8
> lenses. The reason is simple, the smaller aperture only allow focus on a
> small area of the subject, blurs out the background and has a very shallow
> DOF which focuses (at distance) in the perfect zone, making the player seem
> in sharp focus. Simply stopping down to f22 you would be able to see
> everything behind the player, distracting the subject, and it would not be
> as sharp.
>
> The distance to the subject also plays a large part in DOF focus. DOF can be
> measured in percentages to give a better idea of the range of focus. If
> point A were 2 inches in front of your subject, and point D was the
> background, then points B to C would be the area in which your the photo
> would be in focus and directly related to your f-stop number. Shallower is
> sharper, sharper is smaller, i.e. f.2.8 is will be sharper than f22.
>
> When photographing meteorites, or anything, it's the same thing.
>
> Regards,
> Eric
>
>
>
> On 1/27/2010 5:50 AM, al mitt wrote:
>>
>> Hi Erik and all,
>>
>> I'd think just the opposite would be correct. A higher f-stop (f 22, 18
>> etc.) would create a better depth of field and the more open your iris is on
>> your camera (lower f stop, 1.8, 2.0 etc.) the less focused your items would
>> be. I think you just stated it backwards. Best!
>>
>> --AL Mitterling
>> Mitterling Meteorites
>>
>> - Original Message - From: "Erik Fisler" 
>> To: "meteorite-list" 
>> Sent: Tuesday, January 26, 2010 3:51 PM
>> Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Photography (Must read!)
>>
>>
>>
>> The third thing is auto-blending. For those of you who have SLR's you will
>> notice that shooting at a higher F-stop like F1.8 or F2.8 is a lot sharper
>> than shooting at a lower F-stop like F22. The problem is, you might have to
>> drop your F-stop to make sure the whole meteorite is in focus.
>>
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Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Photography

[Dark Matter]

Hi All,

While 2.8 does not seem all that fast, it is a standard speed for
macro/micro lens. However, the big guns for sports, news, and wildlife
routinely have 2.8 firepower with the 300 2.8 as the standard and even
a 400 2.8! 500s and 600s are available in f4. Ultra wides in the 2.8
range are also considered screamers.

The fastest lens I know of is Leica's 50mm F0.95

-Martin



On Wed, Jan 27, 2010 at 11:44 AM, Matson, Robert D.
 wrote:
> Hi Eric, Al, Erik,
>
>> Erik is right, The higher f-stop of 22 will increase depth of field
> ...
>
> Yes.
>
>> ... not sharpness of focus.
>
> Unless you have a very good lens, it will ALSO increase sharpness of
> focus for stationary objects.
>
>> This is why sports photographers use a low/large f-stop lens like
>> f2.8 lenses.
>
> (f/2.8 is actually not that fast a lens for a professional. f/1.4 is
> a fast lens.)
>
>> The reason is simple, the smaller aperture only allow focus on a
>> small area of the subject, blurs out the background and has a
>> very shallow DOF ...
>
> All of these points are true, but that's not the main reason sports
> photographers use low f/#. In sports photography, short exposure times
> are crucial so that action isn't blurred. This cannot be achieved at
> high f/# because the stopped-down lens doesn't let in enough light
> for a properly exposed image. That said, professional photographers
> usually do NOT use the fastest f-stop of a lens since the lens
> periphery has the maximum optical aberrations. An image (of a still
> object like a meteorite) taken at f/1.4 using an f/1.4 lens will
> rarely be as crisp as an image taken with the same lens at f/2.
>
> Best,
> Rob
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Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Photography (Must read!)

[Dark Matter]

Sorry, but it won't. The measures are small, but the optical physics are real.

http://www.kenrockwell.com/nikon/50-comparison/f-stops.htm

Best,

Martin




Eric wrote:

> An f/2.8 lens focused
> properly with the right settings will be just as sharp in the given DOF of a
> comparable photo/subject photographed at a slower/smaller f/22 aperture.
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Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Photography (Must read!)

[Dark Matter]

Agreed. Perception is often reality.

However, half the fun of this List is when the content spins from the
pedestrian to the academic.

Best,

Martin



On Wed, Jan 27, 2010 at 1:02 PM, Meteorites USA  wrote:
> Without seeming to endlessly argue with the data presented. I would like to
> point out the the sharpness examples in the link you provided are taken from
> a VERY small percentage of the overall image. In relation to the entire
> photo taken as a whole the sharpness of the image is comparable at any given
> area over an "average".
>
> Macro meteorite photography works the same way, and I would bet that 99% of
> people who view any photo don't look at such a small section of the entire
> photo. This is fine when shopping for a lens, but for most photos, frankly
> it does not matter much. Especially when talking about web galleries of
> images at 72 DPI. Now when talking about print resolution and sharpness
> that's a whole other topic. ;)
>
> Regards,
> Eric
>
>
>
> On 1/27/2010 11:49 AM, Dark Matter wrote:
>>
>> Sorry, but it won't. The measures are small, but the optical physics are
>> real.
>>
>> http://www.kenrockwell.com/nikon/50-comparison/f-stops.htm
>>
>> Best,
>>
>> Martin
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Eric wrote:
>>
>>
>>>
>>> An f/2.8 lens focused
>>> properly with the right settings will be just as sharp in the given DOF
>>> of a
>>> comparable photo/subject photographed at a slower/smaller f/22 aperture.
>>>
>>
>>
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] Fw: Rocks From Space

[Dark Matter]

Hi All,

I have a source for the second ed. of Rock from Space. I can get a few
copies for $30 plus $5 shipping if anyone is interested.

Email me off list.

Best,

Martin




On Sun, Jan 31, 2010 at 4:36 PM, Shawn Alan  wrote:
> Bernd and Listerites,
>
> I was able to put a hold on Rocks From Space: Meteorites and Meteorite 
> Hunters for $32 New, and it seems the book store still has more copies in 
> stock at that location. When I am done with work tomorrow ill jump on the 
> train and pick up my copy before I head to the gym.
>
> Shawn Alan
>
>
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[meteorite-list] AD: Rocks from Space book by O. R. Norton

[Dark Matter]

Hi All,

I have a few copies of second ed. of Rock from Space (paperback) left
if anyone is interested. Each copy is $30 plus $5 shipping in the US
(overseas is more). Paypal is fine.

Neither Amazon.com nor Borders has the book in stock, and you all know
the value is only going up. Plus, my price is less than retail.

Email me off list if interested. First come, first served.

Best,

Martin
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Re: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - February 2, 2010

[Dark Matter]

Looks at Geoff's eyes and Blaine's left hand. I'm sure a split second
after the picture was taken, Miss Meteorite Hunter was wondering where
her pistol went why her head hurts so bad.

On the other hand, if Blaine is trying exchange his life for an NWA,
well then good luck Blaine. Nice knowing ya.

-M
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Re: [meteorite-list] Matters Arising. When in Rome!

[Dark Matter]

Hi Tom,

Well, now I'm really in trouble.

I was reading your post thinking about those good old days polishing
meteorites under the blue Idaho sky, taking breaks to cover your porch
ankle-deep in brass, and I started to laugh.

"Whatcha laughing about dear?" My wife asks. So I started to read your
email out loud and she stops me. "You did what?"

You see, up until know, she probably thought that when one spend hours
polishing meteorites, one came home smelling like gun powder.

Cordite...Chondrite. Anyone could make that mistake. Right?

So anyway Tom, I'll have to get down your way again this summer. And
I'll bring along a couple new, um, pieces. And thanks. They arrived
today. Very nice!

Oh, and maybe the List could play word games with guns and meteorite names.

Let's see. How about:

Rifle, Colorado
(Guns &) Rose City Michigan?
Gunlock, Utah
Sharps, Virginia
Smithsonia (& Wesson), Georgia

Best,

Martin




On Wed, Feb 3, 2010 at 8:15 PM,   wrote:
> Hi List,  This is the first time I have  chimed in on one of these rants
> but here goes:
>
> The biggest mistake was  not the photo!  Heck, tourists love fake stage
> coach hold ups staged all  over Arizona.  They even have one in Knot's Berry
> Farm in California.   The photo was just for fun.
>
> The mistake that flipped switches was the  stereo type insult to gun
> owners/users.  That was a "Bad Post" and should  be apologized for!   Martin
> joined in, prior to the slam, in a light  hearted observation of the photo
> situation and I felt the post that started all  this was a slam to him as 
> well.
>
> I have cut and polished meteorites with  Martin.  During those visits we
> have occasionally practiced with  guns.  I must say that as meticulous as he
> is with meteorite matters he is  with guns.
>
> With his Glock he is an amazing shot!   ( I even  suspected professional
> competition!) Once again, every thing is meticulous with  him.  Absolute
> safety!!!
>
> I am not typical in any way either.  I  like assault rifles but then again,
> I have hundreds and hundreds of acres to  shoot them on.  I do not hunt.
> This winter I spent more on 55 gal  drums of wheat than on meteorites.  We
> are reestablishing wild turkey in  the area and for a time they need a little
> help.
>
> Last week hunters had a  cougar up a tree with hounds on my land.  I took
> pictures and made them let  it go.  (Email me for photos, I'm there with
> Daisy the "old girl"  hound.)
>
> My point is some what an agreement with every one.  We have  cultural
> differences so don't condemn and stereo type a culture you are a  visitor 
> in!!!
>
> I like Kentucky Bourbon, but I don't slam German  Octoberfest participants
> for drinking too much beer!
>
> The photo was just  giving the many tourists what they want.  The
> condescending, superior  sounding email post was poison, and worse, was 
> designed to
> be!
>
> Tom
>
> In a message dated 2/3/2010 7:40:18 P.M. Mountain Standard  Time,
> gee...@msn.com writes:
>
>
> I'm sorry folks, but some of you  need to get a life.  That photo was just
> plain fun.  The last thing  any of those folks in the photo (I only
> recognized Geoff Notkin) had in mind was  to start this.  Reallywhat a 
> pantload!
>
>
> Yes, I live in Arizona...yes, you're allowed to carry a weapon in
> Arizona...yes,  I've lived around guns my whole life...yes I own several of
> themyes, I enjoy  shooting them...yes, I understand gun safety rules and I
> wouldn't point a weapon  at anything I didn't intend to shoot, but PLEASE!
>
> I don't think  the objections to the photo had anything to do with "gun
> safety".  I think  it had more to do with a mindset that is basically 
> anti-gun.
>  It's as if  having a gun in the same photo that has a meteorite in it
> somehow taints the  meteorite and the people in it.  PLEASE!  It's hard to 
> tell
> from the  photo whether it's a real weapon or not.  I wish that it had been
> a bright  "day glow" green, plastic squirt gun, but you know what, I still
> think that  objections would still have been be raised.  Like I said, this
> all has to  do with a certain mindset.   Period.
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Re: [meteorite-list] Don't use putty!

[Dark Matter]

If the specimen is small and of garden variety chondrite, it may stick
just fine to a Nd magnet which can then be attached to something else.
Small irons, of course, work the best.

Here's a link to where I use a Nd magnet to hold specimens for photography.

http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2003/July/Accretion_Desk.htm

Best,

Martin



On Thu, Feb 4, 2010 at 8:32 AM, Richard Kowalski  wrote:
> I'm sure this will be a touchy subject, just as it is in the greater mineral 
> collector and curator field, but "Mineral Tack" is widely suggested. White 
> apparently isn't widely available any longer but blue should be available in 
> office supply stores.
>
> Here is one retailer selling what I am talking about.
>
> http://tinyurl.com/yl6yo8c
>
>
> Use it sparingly as a small ball behind the specimen, or on either end of a 
> small stick (toothpick) to support the specimen .
>
> Alternatively if you don't want to have anything "tacky" touching your 
> specimens, use some crumpled up some Aluminium foil to support the specimen.
>
> I'm assuming this is just for something like photography, so make sure 
> whatever you use is not visible from the camera.
>
> If you are talking long term display, an acrylic or metal stand is preferred.
>
> --
> Richard Kowalski
> Full Moon Photography
> IMCA #1081
>
>
> --- On Thu, 2/4/10, Erik Fisler  wrote:
>
>> From: Erik Fisler 
>> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Don't use putty!
>> To: "meteorite-list" 
>> Date: Thursday, February 4, 2010, 6:56 AM
>>
>> What should I use to prop up stones?
>>
>> [Erik]
>
>
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] Don't let them take away your guns... meteorites will be next!

[Dark Matter]

Hi Geoff,

What I would really like to know is how you managed to light the scene
while creating no shadows?

-Martin




On Thu, Feb 4, 2010 at 11:48 AM, Notkin  wrote:
> Jason posted:
>
>> My thoughts on the subject is that those were very stupid photographs.
>
>
> Dear Listees:
>
> Regarding the joke photo taken the other day: The owner of the 9 mm, and
> Libby, and myself all double checked that it was not loaded. We are all
> trained in firearm safety and know what we're doing. At no time was the
> pistol pointed at Blaine or myself. The photo was cleverly staged by Greg to
> make it appear as though the gun was aimed at us.
>
> Different people obviously have different views about firearm ownership.
> Some dealers in AZ choose to keep firearms in their show rooms to protect
> their valuable stock. That is perfectly legal in Arizona.
>
> Those of us working the show typically put in 12 to 14 hours per day, for
> about sixteen consecutive days. We try to blow off steam and have some fun
> in the evenings. Having a laugh does not involve putting our friends in any
> type of danger. I'm sorry that some List members were offended by the image.
>
> IMO, the 2010 gem show is considerably more interesting than a debate about
> firearms.
>
>
> Respectfully,
>
> Geoff N.
>
> www.aerolite.org
> www.meteoritemen.com
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Re: [meteorite-list] Arizona firearms.

[Dark Matter]

Hello all,

If Dr. Moore wants to share anything with this list, please let's all
consider it an honor to be in his virtual presence regardless of the
topic.

thank you,

Martin



On Fri, Feb 5, 2010 at 7:09 PM, Meteorites USA  wrote:
> I'm sure all of us are very sorry to here of such a tragedy, and our hearts
> go out to those families touched by such a devastating event, but I'm
> reasonably sure people do not wish to hear more of the "gun issue" on the
> meteorite list.
>
> Regards,
> Eric
>
>
> On 2/5/2010 5:36 PM, Carleton Moore wrote:
>>
>> A coincidence that when the first pistol picture was posted a gunman named
>> Redondo shot a Gilbert Arizona policeman in the head and killed him as well
>> as shooting at other police chasing and catching him and his partner.
>> Remember Arizona is a gun happy state.
>> __
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>>
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] Sober thought

[Dark Matter]

Hi All,

I considered many of these same issues and besides upgrading my slice
of Valera, and I dreamed of finding the dented skull of the unlucky
cow. And here in Montana, we take our cow skulls seriously. Just look
at our state quarter.

Here's the August 2006 Accretion Desk article I wrote about Valera:

http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2006/August/Accretion_Desk.htm

Best,

Martin #1



On Mon, Mar 9, 2009 at 8:17 PM, Darryl Pitt  wrote:
>
>
> One of the ironic details concerning Valera was the ranch owner's
> nonchalance over the event.  A physician, he reasoned that deaths
> necessarily resulted from rocks falling from the sky.  (Reasonable.)  It was
> a Venezuelan astronomy professor who realized the significance of the event
> and interviewed the family and ranch hands.
>
>  Valera's value has been compromised as a result of an initial inexpensive
> offering---an unimaginable absurdity.   (And I'm in-part to blame.)
>
>
>
> On Mar 9, 2009, at 9:26 PM, m...@mhmeteorites.com wrote:
>
>> Documentation is of the utmost importance. For example, I have photos of
>> the owner of Worden holding the piece, a pic of the garage roof and the car
>> that was smashed. I think I still have the cancelled check!
>>
>> A signed affidavit is always nice. I know Darryl Pitt provided that with
>> every chunk of Valera he sold.
>>
>> Matt
>> --Original Message--
>> From: impact...@aol.com
>> Sender: meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com
>> To: dar...@dof3.com
>> To: r...@nakhladogmeteorites.com
>> Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
>> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Sober thought
>> Sent: Mar 9, 2009 7:19 PM
>>
>> Hello,
>>
>> (I really meant to stay out of that discussion, but.)
>>
>> Yes, there were two Valera stones, one hammered a cow, the other one
>> simply
>> impacted the ground.
>> Now, when you buy a piece of Valera, how do you know that you are getting
>> a
>> piece of the cow-killer? No blood on it, I believe.
>>
>> And the question applies to most of the other "hammers" on the market. The
>> only probable exceptions being pieces with a bit of paint, red for
>> Peekskill or
>> Worden, yellow for one of the Park Forest. The rest.???
>>
>> I just sold a very nice slice of Valera, I most certainly did not present
>> it
>> as a hammer.
>>
>> Just my opnion.
>>
>> Anne M. Black
>> _http://www.impactika.com/_ (http://www.impactika.com/)
>> _impact...@aol.com_ (mailto:impact...@aol.com)
>> Vice-President, I.M.C.A. Inc.
>> _http://www.imca.cc/_ (http://www.imca.cc/)
>> 
>>
>> In a message dated 3/9/2009 7:02:34 PM Mountain Daylight Time,
>> dar...@dof3.com writes:
>> As it regards Venezuela's extraterrestrial hammering.Valera is a
>> two stone fall.
>>
>> ===
>>
>> On Mar 9, 2009, at 8:52 PM, Rob Wesel wrote:
>>
>>> Agreed, Valera is way under priced and underappreciated for a single
>>> stone fall...let alone a cow killer that is often sold with copies
>>> of the affidavit.
>>>
>>> Peekskill, Claxton, Sylacauga, maybe it's a U.S. thing, Valera
>>> should be in the mix.
>>>
>>> Rob Wesel
>>> http://www.nakhladogmeteorites.com
>>> --
>>> We are the music makers...
>>> and we are the dreamers of the dreams.
>>> Willy Wonka, 1971
>>>
>>>
>>> - Original Message - From: "Darryl Pitt" 
>>> To: 
>>> Sent: Monday, March 09, 2009 5:47 PM
>>> Subject: [meteorite-list] Sober thought
>>>
>>>

 Make that on the rocks

 As long as the only meteorite that has been extensively documented
 to have killed an animal sells for just $10/g (Valera)---any notion
 of a value-added for a hammering rests with the truly hammered

>>
>> **Need a job? Find employment help in your area.
>>
>> (http://yellowpages.aol.com/search?query=employment_agencies&ncid=emlcntusyelp0005)
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>>
>> Matt Morgan
>> Mile High Meteorites
>> http://www.mhmeteorites.com
>> P.O. Box 151293
>> Lakewood, CO 80215 USA
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] Field Museum Pritzker Collection

[Dark Matter]

Interesting.

And just last month I addressed the transition of the DuPont
collection to the Planetary Studies Foundation in my Accretion Desk
article on the Meteorite Times.

Meteorites 2.0
http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2009/february/Accretion_Desk.htm

Now I'll have to go visit this new blended collection and write an update.

Best,

Martin



On Tue, Mar 24, 2009 at 12:38 PM, JoshuaTreeMuseum
 wrote:
> Looks like the Field is going to almost double it's meteorite collection.
> 
>
> I've never posted a link, hope this works
>
> Phil Whitmer
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Re: [meteorite-list] 2008 TC3-- ureilite

[Dark Matter]

Hi Bernd,

At the press conference, it sounded like this particular stone was
fairly high in porosity (upwards of 40% of however such things are
measured) which in turn led it to easily break up into pieces of which
the largest found was 280g. Not necessarily that it would crumble in
your hands like Orgueil or Beerbelly.

That's what I heard anyway.

best,

Martin


On Wed, Mar 25, 2009 at 3:32 PM,   wrote:
> Hi Darren and List.
>
> "According his (= Dr Rumble) analysis, 2008 TC3 falls into a category
>  of very rare meteorites called ureilites, all of which may have originally
>  come from the same parent body."
>
> "Lead author Dr Jenniskens said: "This asteroid was made of a particularly
>  fragile material..."
>
>
> Fragile ureilites ... hmmm?!
>
>
> Best wishes,
>
> Bernd
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] Wanted : Micros of the following meteorites

[Dark Matter]

Hi Mike,

Sorry to mention this, but again, there is an error in your post. The
Benld meteorite is far from obscure. In fact, it is one of the more
famous of the so-called Hammer stones.

>From Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benld,_Illinois
On September 29, 1938 a meteorite landed in Benld, marking only the
third meteorite landing in Illinois since records were kept. The
meteorite was also one of the few known meteorites to strike a
man-made object, punching a hole in the roof of Edward McCain's garage
and embedding itself in the seat of his 1937 Pontiac Coupe. A
neighbor, Mrs. Carl Crum, was standing about fifty feet from the
impact and may be the individual who came closest to being struck by a
meteorite in history up to that time.[5] The meteorite and portions of
the car are now on display at the Field Museum of Natural History in
Chicago.[6]

Here's a wiki pic of the car's guts:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Benldmeteorite.jpg

And here's the classic pic of the car:
http://www.encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com/test/benld.jpg

Best,

Martin






On Tue, Apr 14, 2009 at 4:16 PM, Galactic Stone & Ironworks
 wrote:
> Hi Sterling!
>
> I stand corrected. LOL
>
> It's such an obscure fall that I am surprised anyone noticed.  :)
>
> BTW, where do you get your collection info?  (just curious)
>
>    Your chances of finding a micro of Benld are close
>> to zero, I'm afraid. 88 grams at Tempe; 4 grams at the
>> National Museum; 18.6 grams in the Dupont collection;
>> and 200 milligrams in the Gifhorn. Main mass at the Field.
>
> Best regards,
>
> MikeG
>
>
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] Wanted : Micros of the following meteorites

[Dark Matter]

Hi Mike,

Here is a link to the google books version of the Catalogue of
Meteorites. The book is/was also known as the blue book since its
first four editions had dark blue covers. This digital version will
give you some insight into the catalogue's contents.

http://books.google.com/books?id=mkdHJR35Q_8C&printsec=frontcover&dq=catologue+of+meteorites&ei=583lSZm2KoHCkAS1zrCOCQ

Best,

Martin
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Re: [meteorite-list] Best institutional tektite collections?

[Dark Matter]

Hi Phil,

The Smithsonian Natural HIstory Museum has a pretty good display. Here
are a couple pics of the tektite presentation:

http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2004/March/disp_impacts_b1.jpg

http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2004/March/disp_tektites_b.jpg

And there's a smidgen of tektites in the upper right corner of this
display in Hastings, Nebraska:

http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2008/october/display_high.jpg

Best,

Martin


On Sat, Apr 18, 2009 at 7:43 PM, Phil Morgan  wrote:
> Hello everyone,
> I was wondering where some of the better tektite collections are
> located and how much is on display.  I'm mostly interested in the US
> but feel free to include others.  Any suggestions?
>
> Thanks,
> Phil
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Re: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - April 25, 2009

[Dark Matter]

Great pic Bernd!

A real stellar playground.

On a technical note, the large chondrule in the upper center looks
like a vicious Pacman with an eye and ear.

Best,

Martin



On Sat, Apr 25, 2009 at 6:02 AM,   wrote:
> http://www.rocksfromspace.org/April_25_2009.html
>
> __
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Re: [meteorite-list] When is a fall...?

[Dark Matter]

Hi all,

I considered this question from the other side once. Back in March of
2005, my Accretion Desk Column in the Meteorite Times was titled "
Find2Fall: When a Meteorite Find Becomes a Meteorite Fall.

It seem that there remains just a hint of a chance that in many falls,
the recovered specimen might not be from the witnessed fall. Unlikely,
but not non-zero especially since many stones are recovered days or
even weeks later.

Certainly it seem improbable that the phenomena of a fall would occur
over the location of another recent fall but it could happen.

But back to my point. In my article I highlight some examples where
for various reasons, it seemed funny to me to continue considering the
meteorite a find just because no witness came forward and reported the
fall.

Anyway, here's the link to the article.

http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2005/March/Accretion_Desk.htm

Best,

Martin



On Sat, Apr 25, 2009 at 2:50 PM, Galactic Stone & Ironworks
 wrote:
> Good question Mark.
>
> It may be splitting hairs, but there is a distinction that can be
> drawn here between a "fall" and a "witnessed fall" - one is usually
> considered synonymous with the other, but in my mind a "witnessed
> fall" implies a human observer witnessed part of the fall - either the
> bolide or the impact or both.
>
> Meteors/meteorites that are imaged with satellites or captured with
> radar should be considered "falls", but I wouldn't apply the term
> "witnessed fall" to them.  As a collector, I am being arbitrary, but I
> draw a distinction between falls witnessed by human eyes and falls
> imaged or tracked by technology alone.
>
> Ideally, a fall should be seen by human observers and radar or
> satellite - like Tagish Lake.
>
> Best regards,
>
> MikeG
>
>
>
>
> On 4/25/09, Mark Crawford  wrote:
>> I read a definition of a fall as being where the meteor is 'usually seen
>> as a fireball' before it lands and is recovered. Obviously, I thought,
>> it needs to be seen burning up - that's the very definition of a fall.
>>
>> I then considered that the definition would strictly be 'observed' to
>> fall. One could imagine a scenario where an object may not be witnessed
>> by the human eye, but which were otherwise recorded. *Pribram and
>> *Innisfree were recorded photographically; Pribram and (I think)
>> Innisfree were also witnessed by eye, but if they hadn't been I'd still
>> call them falls.
>>
>> Then I wondered about 2008 TC3. It was observed and projected to impact
>> earth, the landing area was calculated. Material was recovered. Now if
>> the KLM pilot hadn't seen the fireball, and if the putative Meteosat
>> image (*http://tinyurl.com/d4sna5) *hadn't appeared - would this still
>> be classed as a fall?
>>
>> When is a fall not a fall? :)
>>
>> Mark
>> **
>>
>> --
>> Mark's Meteorite Pages: http://meteorites.cc
>>
>> __
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>
>
> --
> .
> Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA)
> Member of the Meteoritical Society.
> Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network.
> Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and http://www.glassthrower.com
> ..
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Re: [meteorite-list] More on Mayo Belwa

[Dark Matter]

Hello Michael,

I have a 6g+ fragment of Mayo Belwa.

Here's a pic.
http://www.geocities.com/planetwhy/mayobelwa.jpg

best,

Martin



On Fri, Jun 12, 2009 at 6:12 PM, Michael Blood wrote:
> Thanks to Mike G. for the following:
> -
> " Mayo is a witnessed fall aubrite and the majority of it sits in the
> Nigerian Geological Survey Office.  Relatively little is in
> collections.  US Nat His in Washington has less than 200 grams and
> American Nat His in New York has about 600.  The Chicago Field Museum
> only has 15 grams.. it's one of those obscure falls of a single
> stone and the main mass is locked up.  You can probably count the
> private dealers in the entire world with this fall on one hand."
> -
>        While the bulk of this post is, to the best of my knowledge,
> Accurate, there is only one other dealer has ANY and she got it from me!
> (.6g) AND THAT IS THE ONLY PIECE I HAVE EVER SEEN (got it in a
> trade over a decade ago from a fellow with excellent reputation who dealt
> with the few "honest" dealers out there (there were only about 6 in
> Those days). Several have contacted me to inform me she had this .6g piece,
> But I already knew that. All of this happened so very long ago, I had no
> Idea the value of the piece I had.
>        However, I now have a 2 gram specimen that came from the Oscar
> Monnig Collection at TCU and INCLUDES THE CARD that came with it.
> If anyone has any interest or any idea what it is worth or would like to see
> The photo, please contact me off list.
>        Best wishes, Michael
>
>
>
>> From: Michael Blood 
>> Date: Fri, 12 Jun 2009 15:12:18 -0700
>> To: Meteorite List 
>> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Mayo Belwa Q
>>
>>  Re: Mayo Belwa
>>     Please contact me off list if you have any for sale or know
>> Anyone who does.
>>         Do you know why it is so very scarce and why it costs
>> So much?
>>         RSVP
>>         Thanks, Michael
>>
>>
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Re: [meteorite-list] Limerick contest winner

[Dark Matter]

Hi All,

I hope I'm not too late to jump in to this contest.

Here's my Limerick. I know its not much, only 6.9 grams, but hey, it
did fall 196 years ago!

http://www.geocities.com/planetwhy/limerick.jpg


Here's some great text from Peter Marmet's great website at

http://www.marmet-meteorites.com/id10.html

about the fall of the Limerick meteorite.


Fall of the Limerick meteorite, narrative of an eyewitness:

Friday morning, the 10th of September 1813, being very calm and
serene, and the sky clear, about nine o'clock, a cloud appeared in the
east, and very soon after I heard eleven distinct reports appearing to
proceed thence, somewhat resembling the discharge of heavy artillery.
Immediately after this followed a considerable noise not unlike the
beating of a large drum, which was succeeded by an uproar resembling
the continued discharge of musketry in line. The sky above the place
whence this noise appeared to issue became darkened and very much
disturbed, making a hissing noise, and from thence appeared to issue
with great violence different masses of matter, which directed their
course with great velocity in a horizontal direction towards the west.
One of these was observed to descend; it fell to the earth, and sank
into it more than a foot and a half, on the lands of Scagh, in the
neighbourhood of Patrick's Well, in the county of Limerick.

It was immediately dug up, and I have been informed by those that were
present, and on whom I could rely, that it was then warm and had a
sulphurous smell. It weighed about 17 lb., and had no appearance of
having been fractured in any part, for the whole of its surface was
uniformly smooth and black, as if affected by sulphur or gunpowder.

Six or seven more of the same kind of masses, but smaller, and
fractured, as if shattered from each other or from larger ones,
descended at the same time with great velocity in different places
between the lands of Scagh and the village of Adare.

One more very large mass passed with great rapidity and considerable
noise at a small distance from me; it came to the ground on the lands
of Brasky, and penetrated a very hard and dry earth about 2 feet. This
was not taken up for two days; it appeared to be fractured in many
places, add weighed about 65 lb.! Its shape was rather round, but
irregular.

N. S. Maskelyne, "Lecture Notes on Meteorites", Nature, 1875, vol. 12
(XII). p. 485 (text abridged).


Cheers,

Martin
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Re: [meteorite-list] Example of Lipping and direction stumper. TAKE 2

[Dark Matter]

Hi MT,

Back in July of 2003, I posted a collection of pics of oriented irons
known then as Taza in my Accretion Desk article:

http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2003/July/Accretion_Desk.htm


I highlighted a couple of fully lipped individuals also wondering how
such a feature could form. I believe it was Jim Tobin who suggested
that the iron was spinning like a wheel parallel to the direction of
travel and the lipping produced a "tire effect" around the surface
interior which, as is especially viewable in the specimen I nicknamed
"a bowl full of flowlines" seemed to have no directional orientation
in the usual way, and in fact, has much in common with the Allende pic
you posted.

Best,

Martin




On Sun, Jul 26, 2009 at 4:00 PM, McCartney
Taylor wrote:
> http://outofabluesky.com/images/stories/stoneymeteorites/allende12-7.jpg
>
> This is an Allende. I'm not sure I understand the orientation signs I see.
>
> I see a star flow line pattern which indicates this side is windward. But the 
> lipping on the NW side hints the side is leeward. So I'm a bit confused.
>
> Any ideas on alternate interpretations?
>
> -mt
>
>
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] International Brachinite Day - Hug your Brachinite!

[Dark Matter]

Hi Mike and All,

Back about seven years ago, I wrote an article about a brachanite
landing in my collection. But of course back then the pickings of such
things were few.

Here's the link:

http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2002/August/Accretion_Desk.htm

Best,

Martin



On Thu, Jul 30, 2009 at 2:37 PM, Galactic Stone &
Ironworks wrote:
> Hi List!
>
> To celebrate the 462nd annual International Brachinite Day, I thought
> I might share a few photos of my latest acquisition - NWA 5471.
>
> Many of you on the List have seen this meteorite before, but for those
> who have not, here is some background information on it...
>
> I received this 1.74 gram slice from Martin Altmann at Chladni's
> Heirs.  Thanks again Martin! :)
>
> Brachinite is very difficult to photograph because it's almost
> entirely composed of olivine - which is tricky to get proper lighting.
>
> Some research suggests that brachinites originate from the
> olivine-rich asteroid 289 Nenetta.  At first, it was thought that
> brachinites were Martian members of the Chassignite family - because
> Chassigny contains a similar amount of olivine. But oxygen isotopic
> age studies revealed that olivine is far too old to be Martian and it
> shows some affinities to the eucrite group.
>
> Brachinites are rather boring to look at under typical lighting, but
> it reveals it's true beauty under cross-polarized light - click on the
> following link to see :
>
> http://www4.nau.edu/meteorite/Meteorite/Brachinite.html
>
> Martin's description of this brachinite is apt -
>
> "Brachinites rank among the most enigmatic meteorites, they are
> primitive dunitic rocks, though their isotopes and petrology are so
> heterogeneous, that so far no satisfying theory about their origins
> and formation could have been established. Brachinites are exceedingly
> rare, the combined weights of all finds in history do not exceed
> 10kgs, making this class five times rarer than lunar meteorites. NWA
> 5471 is weakly shocked and moderately weathered. "
>
> This specimen is part of my new collecting strategy - nothing under 1
> gram unless it's Lunar or Martian. (or similarly cost-prohibitive).
> In the past, I would have been happy with a 100mg specimen.  This
> particular small slice is 1.746 grams.
>
> Photo links :
>
> http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/jj24/Meteoritethrower/Meteorites/brachinite/brach-1.jpg
>
> http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/jj24/Meteoritethrower/Meteorites/brachinite/brach-2.jpg
>
> http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/jj24/Meteoritethrower/Meteorites/brachinite/brach-3.jpg
>
> Best regards and clear skies,
>
> MikeG
> --
> .
> Michael Gilmer (Florida, USA)
> Member of the Meteoritical Society.
> Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com
> Personal Site - http://www.glassthrower.com
> FaceBook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone
> MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale
> Twitter - Twitter - http://twitter.com/GalacticStone
> eBay - http://shop.ebay.com/merchant/maypickle
> ..
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Re: [meteorite-list] Bogou Meteorite in the Accretion Desk

[Dark Matter]

Hello Mike, Frank and All,

I doubt our pieces of Bogou share a room at the Hotel Cureton.  My
piece came from a university collection that likely acquired the
specimen in the early 1970s. I suspect it originally came from either
the Smithsonian or directly from a museum in Africa. I think the
Smithsonian is most likely since that is where a majority of the mass
is housed, as well as the fact that many other small iron samples in
the university collection came with Smithsonian documentation.

I don't know if you have it, but here is the link to Met Bull 25 that
contains the Bogou entry. A wonderful little story.

http://tin.er.usgs.gov/meteor/docs/mb25.pdf

Best,

Martin



On Mon, Aug 10, 2009 at 7:39 PM, Mike Bandli wrote:
> Hi Frank,
>
> That piece is beautiful and the re-heated rim is incredible. I believe Jay 
> Piatek is the current and proud owner. I'm afraid to refinish or etch mine, 
> as it would risk losing what little of the frail fusion crust remains.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Mike Bandli
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Frank Cressy [mailto:fcre...@prodigy.net]
> Sent: Monday, August 10, 2009 6:17 PM
> To: Mike Bandli; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Bogou Meteorite in the Accretion Desk
>
>
> Hi Martin, Mike, and all,
>
> I've always liked Bogou too, probably because of the photo below from Al 
> Lang's site.  Unfortunately I don't have a specimen :-(
>
> http://www.nyrockman.com/museum/bogou-8.htm
>
> Al's etched part slice has a very cool heat-affected rim on it.  Of course 
> the question concernimg your specimens is:  Do they also have a heat-affected 
> rim?   and
> do you a). refinish and etch it to see, or b). leave as is.
>
> (Just thought I'd add another variable to the equation)
>
> Cheers,
>
> Frank
>
>
>
>
>
> 
> From: Mike Bandli 
> To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
> Sent: Monday, August 10, 2009 4:46:34 PM
> Subject: [meteorite-list] Bogou Meteorite in the Accretion Desk
>
> Hello Martin and All,
>
> http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2009/august/Accretion_Desk.htm
>
> It’s nice to see a witnessed iron on the Accretion Desk this month. It is 
> quite easy to forget that witnessed iron falls are incredibly rare. In fact, 
> according to the MetBull database, witnessed HED’s are more abundant than 
> irons at ~69 witnessed HED achondrites to ~49 witnessed irons. Even at that 
> number, iron falls are so highly prized by museums and institutions, that you 
> are lucky to find anything outside of Sikote-Alin, Udei Station, or the 
> occasional Boguslavka or Braunau.
>
> I was surprised to see that Martin’s piece has a ‘hack-saw’ cut job – 
> something I thought was unique to my piece of Bogou:
>
> http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2004-11/877141/Bogou-3.jpg
>
> I purchased my Bogou several years ago (ex. Cureton Collection) sight-unseen 
> and re-etching and cutting off the hack-saw marks and 'hanging chads' has 
> always been on my to-do list until I read Martin’s article. It is easy to 
> forget that those blemishes can actually help tell the story and human 
> interaction involved with particular specimens. In fact, I think a hacked-up 
> Bogou looks just fine now ☺
>
>
> Martin also reminds us of how delicate and rare -real- fusion crust on an 
> iron is. On Bogou, it is like the thin crust of a croissant and can easily 
> flake off if not handled properly:
>
> http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2004-11/877141/Bogou-2.jpg
>
>
> Finally, the ‘good’ side, showing the curvature of the specimen. One can only 
> imagine how impressive a full slice would be:
>
> http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2004-11/877141/Bogou-1.jpg
>
>
> Martin, I wonder if our specimens shared a jar with the Cureton Collection?
>
>
> 6 Irons Old,
>
> Mike Bandli
>
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] Question

[Dark Matter]

Hi Don,

Thanks for the list. Very interesting.

However, I need to check my records, but I honestly don't remember
paying more than $200,000 for the piece of Mooresfort I purchased from
Rob Elloitt a while back. (;- )

Here's the write-up on that one.

http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2005/May/Accretion_Desk.htm

Best,

Martin





On Wed, Aug 19, 2009 at 3:35 PM, Don Edwards wrote:
> Hi All,
>
> --- On Wed, 8/19/09, Greg Stanley  wrote:
>> I was wondering what was the most valuable single meteorite
>> - not scientific but the most value $/gram?
>>
>> Also, what is the most valuable type? Mars, Lunar or
>> other?  Do Lunar meteorites still have the most value?
>
> Just from my records of my collection, here are the most expensive $/gram:
>
> Calcalong Creek $367,650 (M Casper source)
> Mooresfort $48,475 (R Elliott source)
> Chassigny $27,015 (M Blood source)
> Lodran $25,500 (R Elliott source)
> Lafayette $17,361 (M Blood source
> Angra dos Reis $10,000
> Glenrothes $10,000
> Kobe $10,000
> Govermador Valadares $9582
> Wethersfield 1971  $8823
> Pomozdino $8631
> Forsbach $8333
> Serra de Mage $7683
> Darmstadt $7038
> Peramiho $6733
> Moore County $6463
> LA 002 $6015
> Wessely  $5813
> Sylacauga $5572
> Krahenberg  $4000
>
> I didn't include the DAG/DHO/NWA etc because those prices have changed 
> drastically over the years.
>
> Overall my average $/g: Lunar $1554; Martian $1325.
>
> Don
>
>
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] Question

[Dark Matter]

Hi Martin,

That logic would likely put Lost City of at the top of the most
expensive procurement cost for a meteorite location.

Best,

Martin



On Wed, Aug 19, 2009 at 6:13 PM, Martin
Altmann wrote:
>
> Seen the, how do you say, the procurement costs (?) I guess quite any
> Antarctic meteorite would be the most expensive one.
>
> Martin
>
>
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] question

[Dark Matter]

Hi Steve,

To add more opinionative fuel to the theoretical fire, the moment at
which any particular specimen becomes a class complete with type
specimen is the moment it is no longer so rare that it is alone in its
petrology or chemistry.

Therefore (and this is a job for SuperBernd), one might need to dip
down into the annals of those mysterious meteorites who have no peers.
Then choose the smallest TKW.

But, of course, all that work and artificial value could be undone in
just one split second. I'm glad I had not invested in CV3s on February
7th, 1969, or CM2s on September 27, 1969, or Shergottities on October
2, 1962.

Best,

Martin


On Wed, Aug 19, 2009 at 7:34 PM, steve
arnold wrote:
> 6 years ago right after the park forest fall,I was working with a small 
> college with a trade that netted me my .97 gram fragment of KAKANGARI K class 
> meteorite.I traded a 370 gram whole individual  of park forest to get that K 
> class piece.It is only one of three K class type's out there.So to me that is 
> the rarest class of meteorite out there.This has been  a most interesting 
> thread.It's nice to see when some lame brain is bashing me or someone 
> else.People have to learn to grow up.
>  Steve R. Arnold, Chicago!!
>
>
>
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] Question

[Dark Matter]

Hi All,

Just a thought, but maybe to add some realism here, we should only
consider a price as a valid entry in the contest where 1) the sample
that sold was equal to or more than one gram in mass, and 2) it
actually sold for the noted price with payment in hard currency (as
opposed to trade, etc.).

Unfortunately the realism would take much of the fun out of this, but
also much of the hype.

I rarely spend more than a thousand a gram for a specimen in the gram
or larger size.

Best,

Martin


On Wed, Aug 19, 2009 at 3:29 PM,  wrote:
> Greg,
> The highest documented price I find was on NWA 011. It sold at the Tucson gem 
> show back in Feb. 2003  for $119,000.00 per gram. At that time it was thought 
> to be from Mercury and was not paired yet. In May of 2004 a small piece was 
> offered  by "meteoritelab" .022 grams  for a bargain price of just $60,000.00 
> per gram on ebay. Half off. Wow. Carl
> --
> Carl or Debbie Esparza
> IMCA 5829
> Meteoritemax
>
>
>  Greg Stanley  wrote:
>>
>>
>> List:
>>
>> I was wondering what was the most valuable single meteorite - not scientific 
>> but the most value $/gram?
>>
>> Also, what is the most valuable type? Mars, Lunar or other?  Do Lunar 
>> meteorites still have the most value?
>>
>> Much Thanks,
>>
>> Greg S.
>>
>> _
>> Get back to school stuff for them and cashback for you.
>> http://www.bing.com/cashback?form=MSHYCB&publ=WLHMTAG&crea=TEXT_MSHYCB_BackToSchool_Cashback_BTSCashback_1x1
>> __
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Re: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - April 10, 2008

[Dark Matter]

Hi Mike and all.

Wonderful piece of Bruderheim.  One of my favorites. Here's a pic of
my specimen if interested:

http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2007/February/bruderheim1.jpg

However, upon further study of both your slice and that in Norton's
RFS book, to me, the pic in the book looks more like Millbillillie
then Bruderheim. The matrix of the picture you cited looks like it's
filled with plagioclase needles and crystals characteristic of a
glomeroporphyritic texture rather than that of an L6 chondrite. Also,
Millbillillie is known for an extremely thin overall crust while
Bruderheim often has a thick crust.

And of course most readers have likely noticed that the picture of
Bruderheim on page 189 looked a little too rich in chondrules. This
is, of course, because that picture is not Bruderhiem at all but
likely Moorabie, an L3 from Australia. How do I know this? Because the
exact same picture appears on page 188 with the presumed correct
caption.

My suggestion is to scale a frontal shot of your piece and try to
match the exact corner to one on the RFS pictured face. My eyeballed
attempt could not find a match.

Other thoughts?

Best,

Martin







On Thu, Apr 10, 2008 at 4:19 AM, <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> http://www.rocksfromspace.org/April_10_2008.html
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> **Planning your summer road trip? Check out AOL Travel Guides.
>  (http://travel.aol.com/travel-guide/united-states?ncid=aoltrv000316)
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Re: [meteorite-list] April Meteorite-Times now up (Thin section examination!)

[Dark Matter]

Amazing pictures as usual Tom. Thanks!

It is an honor to see your work since it seems every month you go
where no man has gone before. Ever.

Now I assume you didn't dismantle your son's Play Station 3 just to
get your wave plate? And as I recall, last time I was at your house,
you had a Wii.  Maybe there's something good hidden in there to hook
up to a microscope, and I know you have a screwdriver.

Cheers and thanks again for the amazing pics.

Martin



On Wed, Apr 9, 2008 at 7:49 AM,  <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hi List,  Each month I put a few images in  an article called Micro Visions.
>  This month I show the use of an  inexpensive wave plate for meteorite thin
>  section examination in cross polarized  light.  I have some very cool shots, 
> but
>  even better I have a series of 6  shots where I show one structure in bright
>  field, standard full cross polarized  light and then in rotation with the use
>  of this wave plate.
>
>  Please check  it out.
>
>  Tom Phillips
>
>  In a message dated 4/8/2008 12:17:09 P.M.  Central Daylight Time,
>  [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
>  Greetings  Everyone,
>
>  The April Meteorite-Times is now up.
>  http://www.meteorite-times.com/
>
>  Thank you again to all the  writers!
>
>  Paul and  Jim
>
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>
>
>
>
>  **Planning your summer road trip? Check out AOL Travel Guides.
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Re: [meteorite-list] Re-2: Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - April 10, 2008

[Dark Matter]

Hi Bernd,

Thanks for corrected correction.

I remember talking to Richard a few years ago about a couple picture /
caption issues in RFS, and I recall him saying something about the
proofs from the publisher do not have the pictures embedded in them so
all he can do is check the text of the pic without knowing for sure
what pic will end up above the caption.

Mislabeled pics, sideways pics and upsidedown pics are not rare in
meteorite pubs. But either way, I think the system is better than
having the captions many pages away and in need of a cross-reference
to a plate and page number just to identify what's in the pic (ala
Nininger).

Cheers,

Martin


On Thu, Apr 10, 2008 at 4:45 PM,  <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hi Martin, Mike and all,
>
>  "How do I know this? Because the exact same picture
>  appears on page 188 with the presumed correct caption"
>
>  I concur. Bruderheim is a beautiful chondrite. My partially crusted
>  part slice (6.2 gr) also comes from Mike Farmer and it looks pretty
>  much like Mike B's with those "rusty halos".
>
>  As for the captions in RFS, it depends on the edition we have. The
>  1998 edition still has the wrong cption while everything is properly
>  rendered in the 2001 (hardcover) edition.
>
>  Cheers,
>
>  Bernd
>
>  To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>  Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
>
>  __
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Re: [meteorite-list] Re-2: Rocks from Space Picture of the Day -April 10, 2008

[Dark Matter]

Hi Mike,

Since I don't have the hardcover RFS that Bernd said has the corrected
pic, maybe you could compare the correct Bruderheim pic to your slice.
Maybe it is in RFS after all, but just the hardcover ed.

Cheers

Martin



On Thu, Apr 10, 2008 at 11:26 AM, Mike Bandli <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Good catch, Martin! I never looked at the detail of that pic, but now that I
>  have, I agree. Bummer! Farmer's specimen card said 'Pictured in Norton's
>  RFS,' so I assumed the caption was correct in the book. Looks like it is the
>  book that is incorrect.
>
>  Michael Johnson, if you could delete that RFS reference in your RFSPOD April
>  10, 2008, that would be great.
>
>  Thanks!
>
>  Mike Bandli
>
>
>
>  -Original Message-----
>  From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>  [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dark
>  Matter
>  Sent: Thursday, April 10, 2008 9:48 AM
>  To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>  Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
>
>
> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Re-2: Rocks from Space Picture of the Day
>  -April 10, 2008
>
>  Hi Bernd,
>
>  Thanks for corrected correction.
>
>  I remember talking to Richard a few years ago about a couple picture /
>  caption issues in RFS, and I recall him saying something about the
>  proofs from the publisher do not have the pictures embedded in them so
>  all he can do is check the text of the pic without knowing for sure
>  what pic will end up above the caption.
>
>  Mislabeled pics, sideways pics and upsidedown pics are not rare in
>  meteorite pubs. But either way, I think the system is better than
>  having the captions many pages away and in need of a cross-reference
>  to a plate and page number just to identify what's in the pic (ala
>  Nininger).
>
>  Cheers,
>
>  Martin
>
>
>  On Thu, Apr 10, 2008 at 4:45 PM,  <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>  > Hi Martin, Mike and all,
>  >
>  >  "How do I know this? Because the exact same picture
>  >  appears on page 188 with the presumed correct caption"
>  >
>  >  I concur. Bruderheim is a beautiful chondrite. My partially crusted
>  >  part slice (6.2 gr) also comes from Mike Farmer and it looks pretty
>  >  much like Mike B's with those "rusty halos".
>  >
>  >  As for the captions in RFS, it depends on the edition we have. The
>  >  1998 edition still has the wrong cption while everything is properly
>  >  rendered in the 2001 (hardcover) edition.
>  >
>  >  Cheers,
>  >
>  >  Bernd
>  >
>  >  To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>  > [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>  >  Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
>  >
>  >  __
>  >  http://www.meteoritecentral.com
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>  >  Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
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Re: [meteorite-list] It was intuition ? OK ?

[Dark Matter]

Hi Mike and all,

I too am curious about some of the rare meteorites I see advertised on
ebay, and I look forward to reading something that demonstrates the
authenticity on these historic piece beyond the somewhat unnerving
statement that "This meteorite is guaranteed to be authentic or your
money back !!"

Over the years I have acquired a sizable portion of a world-class
collection among other special pieces and have above average knowledge
of material distribution, and of course, a vested interest in
preserving the reputation of the historic and valuable specimens.

For example, some recent ebay offerings included Bialystok and
Andover, two historic falls of extremely low distribution. Here are
the auction links.

http://cgi.ebay.com/Bialystok-Meteorite-Rare-Historic-Howardite-from-Poland_W0QQitemZ250229710427QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item250229710427

http://cgi.ebay.com/Andover-Maine-Meteorite-Witnessed-Fall_W0QQitemZ250229711253QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item250229711253

Representatives of both these localities are in my collection and I
have written about them in my Accretion Desk articles. Here are some
pictures:

http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2005/November/andover.jpg

http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2005/November/bailystok.jpg

http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2005/November/bailystok_number.jpg

Although I have not chased down all the total weight of the pieces of
Bailystok distributed over time, I have personally gone so far as to
contact the Humboldt museum (the original source of my piece and its
number) shed light on the distribution of this extremely rare and
historic howardite. Therefore, the appearance of half a gram of
Bailystok on ebay was somewhat extraordinary, only to be outdone by
its low selling price.

Andover is another matter. Its distribution is greater, but still few
have comparison. At $425/g for an L6, I hope there is more than an
Nininger quote to back up its provenience.

Other thoughts?

Martin



On Fri, Apr 11, 2008 at 8:04 PM, Mike Bandli <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Bob,
>
>  I'm sure there are a couple people on the list that benefit from your eBay
>  authenticity posts, but maybe you could set that time aside for doing a
>  little research as to where your 'Zulu Queen' meteorite really came from (if
>  it really is Zulu Queen). No sense it in pointing out other people's
>  authenticity issues if you can't back up your own.
>
>  Still waiting for an answer (the truth).
>
>  Kind regards,
>
>  Mike Bandli
>
>
>
>  -Original Message-
>  From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>  [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Bob Evans
>  Sent: Friday, April 11, 2008 3:47 PM
>  To: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
>
> Subject: [meteorite-list] It was intuition ? OK ?
>
>
>
> I guess it amuses me when I get a response from some idiot selling junk as
>  meteorites on ebay
>
>  Case in Point :
>  http://cgi.ebay.com/meteorites-and-collectables_W0QQitemZ110242519960QQihZ00
>  1QQcategoryZ3224QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
>
>  Response to my inquiry regarding authenticity :
>
>  Dear maccers531,
>
>  " your not going to like this but its intuition ive been studying them for
>  awhile now and i know what im doing because also when i check certain areas
>  i found stuff at i go back later and ive recovered what ever else new fell
>  around they are planetary and ill probably be told no its not real but i
>  know they are and if you do not like them send them back for a full refund
>  and also the magnet the look the fusion lets talk "
>
>
>  - deazombie
>
>  Duh !
>
>  Seems like all these people selling fakes one ebay  share the inability to
>  spell correctly and use proper grammar.
>
>  BE
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] It was intuition ? OK ?

[Dark Matter]

Martin A. wrote:

Point 1:
>  And on the other hand it would be a matter of price.
>  Theoretically, only theoretically, a dealer could let throw each historical
>  specimen into a microprobe and could do the same with a specimen in a famous
>  museums collection and could compare the values, to improve the
>  authenticity, but whether the collector would pay then the costs, if a 100
>  or 200$ piece would cost then 1000$, I doubt.
>

Point 2:
>  The dealers have to rate the provenience and to compare with other
>  specimens, they have a lot to loose.
>  Buying meteorites is to a certain degree a matter of trust, from the side of
>  the collectors.
>  >From side of the dealer it is a matter of his reputation.
>

Point 3:
>  If this isn't sufficient for a collector, then he simply shouldn't buy any
>  historic specimens, then he should collect desert meteorites, where the
>  provenance is of less than secondary importance and the value is determined
>  solely by the material itself.

Hello Martin,

The above three points express the essence of this issue as well as
demonstrate the potential for an exponential evolution of the problem.
So let's carry the implications of your points forward one more step:

Point 1: if you overtly tie price to provenience, an instantaneous
dilution of the trust between buyer and seller will occur now and
throughout the future. Imagine the choice between two 25g slices of
Ensisheim. One at $250 and one at $5000. They look similar, and once
purchased, can be claimed to be Ensisheim by the owner. The next sale
or trade of the specimen carries the weight of Ensisheim because those
involved have chosen to believe it is Ensisheim regardless of its
past. While this problem is alive and well with smaller pieces, once
the gram size (of this locality anyway) exceeds 10g, the specimen has
increased its importance as a representative of

Point 2: Overtly Tying provenience to dealer is even worse. I believe
this very discussion is addressing this very question, and while there
will always be a large factor in the equation for dealer reputation,
if the meteorite dealing landscape becomes as wild as used car lots,
then much of the novice and intermediate collecting market will be
wiped out. Yes, I know there is degree of this anyway, but imagine
Dealer Bob's Used Meteorites, buyer beware and a 10-day warranty on
provenience. Compare that to Bob The Meteorite Man's specimens that
come with stories, pictures, and a lifetime warranty on authenticity.

Point 3: Interesting idea. One or two more logical steps and local
rocks would make good collecting objects. Followed by concrete,
asphalt, and charcoal briquettes since many hot desert specimens still
require a considerable degree of trust of both science and seller.

The point of all of this is that there is a growing and documented
situation where the authenticity of rare material is in doubt. And
there are very few collectors who have experience with the material in
question, and I believe it is important for those very collectors to
be involved in this conversation.

Cheers,

Martin
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Re: [meteorite-list] It was intuition ? OK ?

[Dark Matter]

Hi Norbert and all,

I fully understand and appreciate the IMCA dilemma. However, the scope
of the specimens in question has now moved into both into the
collections of IMCA members and IMCA dealers.

Therefore, I believe this is now a serious IMCA issue since we have a
digital paper trail.

Cheers,

Martin
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Re: [meteorite-list] It was intuition ? OK ?

[Dark Matter]

Hi Mark and all,

Speaking of Mooresfort:

http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2005/May/Accretion_Desk.htm

Cheers,

Martin



On Sat, Apr 12, 2008 at 12:32 PM, Mark Grossman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> You can add Mooresfort to the list of samples that Bob Evans has offered for
>  sale (offered to me privately, not on eBay), and for which the information
>  he supplied was not verified by the source he quoted.  The source he quoted
>  was a highly respected meteorite dealer who said he never had any Mooresfort
>  samples.
>
>  Mark Grossman
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Re: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - April 15, 2008

[Dark Matter]

Unbelievable!

Tom, you really out did yourself on this one. Of course a little
credit to NWA 500 is due as well.

Do you know any more about the trapped solar wind? Is in the bubbles
or did it cause the bubbles?

Way cool!

-Martin



2008/4/15 Michael Johnson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> http://www.rocksfromspace.org/April_15_2008.html
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] what is the most primitve meteorite? or do we even know?

[Dark Matter]

Hi All,

Here's a link to Eric's site stating Vigarano as the (consistently)
oldest meteorite.

Maybe Eric can shed more light on his statement.

http://www.star-bits.com/VIGARANO.htm

If interested, here is a Meteorite Times article addressing my 61g
Vigarano slice and its acquisition.

http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2005/August/Accretion_Desk.htm

Cheers,

Martin



On Tue, Apr 15, 2008 at 5:43 AM,  <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> You're right Walter!  I don't know what can be measured as "ages" for
> pre-solar grains,other than their being classified by types, and rough ages
> of incorporation of the concretions (forming meteoroids which is of interest
> for the Solar System dymanics).  Who's measured the date of last supernova
> that left residue in our pre-Solar nebula?
>
>  Best wishes, great health,
>  Doug
>
>
>
>
>  -Original Message-
>  From: Walter Branch <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>  To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com;
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>  Sent: Tue, 15 Apr 2008 6:42 am
>  Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] what is the most primitve meteorite? or do we
> even know?
>
>
>  Hi Doug,
>
>  What about Tagish Lake?
>
>  -Walter Branch
>  
>  - Original Message - From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>  To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; 
>  Sent: Tuesday, April 15, 2008 6:33 AM
>  Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] what is the most primitve meteorite? or do we
> even know?
>
>
> > Hi L.A., Listees,
> >
> > Just the white powdery "CAI" material which represents a small
> >
>  fraction of > Allende is the old snuff ...
>
> >
> > There are probably other carbonaceous chondrites of types similar to
> >
>  the > "age" of Allende from the recent vast harvest of the deserts ... but
> I > think scientists have a hard time splitting the hairs of the first
> couple > of million years when they are just dealing with excess concretes
> that > never were cleaned during the construction of this whole cool
> neighborhood > of the Sun we live in.
>
> >
> > Bjurbole is a standard and older than the hills of the Solar Sytem,
> >
>  as > well ... at least a standard to judge others: the oldies must all be >
> aroound 4,566,500,000 years old. or maybe a million more.
>
> >
> > Telling the age of a meteorite is kind of challenging since they are
> >
>  > heterogenious. For example, a person is born and grows based on an >
> initial splitting of some strands of DNA. But if someone analyzed the > ends
> of your hair, the might find you older than all the men on the list > except
> Bob Haag and Ken (?), and Michael C. So how many inclusions > floating out
> there in places no one expects, I couldn't guess ... that are > older than
> old.
>
> >
> > Then, several listmembers may be older and know better,
> >
> > Best wishes and nice to see you posting,
> > Doug
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Leigh Anne DelRay <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
> > Sent: Tue, 15 Apr 2008 2:22 am
> > Subject: [meteorite-list] what is the most primitve meteorite? or do
> >
>  we > even know?
>
> >
> >
> >
> > Dear Listees~
> >
> > I was wondering if anyone knows what the oldest (as in
> > most primitive) meteorite is? I was thinking it was
> > Allende, b/c it is believed to be of extra-solar
> > origin, but is there another one that is more
> > primitive than that? Is there one that is older than
> > our own solar system?
> > Thanks for letting me pick your brains.
> > ~L.A. DelRay
> >
> >
> > >
> >
>  _
>
>
> > ___
> > Be a better friend, newshound, and
> > know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. >
> >
>  http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
>
> > __
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Re: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - April 15, 2008

[Dark Matter]

Hi All,

If you need some prints of Tom's work, check out:

http://www.cafepress.com/meteorites4sale

And don't forget to reread the story I wrote about Tom in the August
2006 issue of Meteorite Magazine. I think shots like those under
discussion exemplify why I titled the article "Zen and the Art of
Meteorite Microscopy"

cheers,

Martin



On Tue, Apr 15, 2008 at 9:04 AM, JKGwilliam <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I never cease to be amazed at not only Tom Phillips photographic talents but
> his artistic ones as well.  I need some prints of some of his work to hang
> in my house. Most meteorite related wall art is restricted to my office but
> in this case I would hang them anywhere in the house.  Simply amazing.
>
>  Best,
>
>  John Gwilliam
>
>
>
>  At 04:35 AM 4/15/2008, Michael Johnson wrote:
>
> > http://www.rocksfromspace.org/April_15_2008.html
> >
> > __
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> >
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Re: [meteorite-list] Tom Phillips Art

[Dark Matter]

Hi All,

My how time flies.

It was exactly two years ago that Tom and I were choosing our favorite
pictures of his to post in my Accretion Desk column introducing him
and his work to the masses.
http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2006/May/Accretion_Desk.htm

After a photo career detour to the Coast to Coast AM radio show
webpage for the UFO crowd:
http://www.coasttocoastam.com/gen/page1857.html

And another C2C submission:
http://www.coasttocoastam.com/gen/page1261.html

And yet another:
http://www.coasttocoastam.com/gen/page2037.html


Tom took off in June with his own column in the Meteorite Times:
http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2006/June/Micro_Visions.htm


And then, of course, the natural progression is an entire photo
gallery devoted to his work:
http://www.meteorite.com/meteorite-gallery/


And then Tom was a winner in the Zeiss Contest MicroImages 2007:
http://www.zeiss.de/c12567be0045acf1/ContentsFrame/d6ea562032304237c1257361003284f4


And then, just as with all good museums, there's a gift shop:
http://www.cafepress.com/meteorites4sale


And of course the spin-offs:
http://www.download.com/Amazing-Meteorites-Screensaver-2/3000-2400_4-10817913.html
and
http://www.zazzle.com/meteorite_sau_001_thin_section_postage-172107245526871351

But my question is if this 2005 abstract is the first public
appearance in the science realm of Tom's work?
www.lpi.usra.edu/meetings/metsoc2005/pdf/5068.pdf

And of course, any guesses as to what could be next?

Cheers,

Martin
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Re: [meteorite-list] what is the most primitve meteorite?

[Dark Matter]

Hi Alex,

Ahhh Krymka. One of my favorites.

Here's a pair of pics of my slice:

http://www.meteorite.com/MT_links/2003/March/1krymka.jpg

http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2002/December/2specimen01.jpg

I got to visit Semarkona at the Smithsonian. It is a spiritual
experience. I sent my pics to Joel in NZ for a Meteorite! article back
in 1998 and have yet to make new ones. Those were back in the film
days.

Cheers,

Martin



On Tue, Apr 15, 2008 at 6:00 PM, Alexander Seidel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Has any SEMARKONA [Indian fall of 1940, type LL3.0 (S2)] ever been 
> distributed to private collectors??? I very much doubt so. One of
>  the "next best" primitive meteorites from Jeff´s first category,
>  which has surely arrived at the collector´s scene, is the KRYMKA
>  meteorite [Ukrainian fall of 1946, LL3.1 (S3)].
>
>  Yep, got my piece of this wonderful, pristine meteorite. :-)
>  Alex
>  Berlin/Germany
>
>
>  > 1) It means that the meteorite was relatively unaffected by secondary
>  > processes that occurred on asteroids, including thermal metamorphism,
>  > melting, shock effects, and aqueous alteration.  These meteorites are
>  > the chondrites whose chondrules, CAIs, matrix, and presolar grains
>  > are in the most pristine condition.  In this sense, the most
>  > primitive ordinary chondrite is Semarkona. There are several very
>  > primitive carbonaceous chondrites, including Acfer 094,  Adelaide,
>  > ALHA 77307, and a few CR chondrites.  Most of the meteorites people
>  > have mentioned in this thread are not particularly primitive by this
>  > definition.
>
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] New meteorite fall in India, read it and enjoy

[Dark Matter]

Sounds fishy to me. It's got some pretty serious heat capacity to
require such cooling time at only 900g.

Also, the site's picture of a meteorite is actually a composite image
of the nucleus of Comet Wild 2, the one from which Stardust captured
particles.

http://stardust.jpl.nasa.gov/photo/wild2.html

-Martin



On Tue, May 27, 2008 at 12:05 PM, Michael Farmer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> http://www.timesnow.tv/NewsDtls.aspx?NewsID=8908
>
> I wonder if a meteorite fell, or if this is a total
> crock of %$$%
> Michael Farmer
>
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] New meteorite fall in India, read it and enjoy

[Dark Matter]

Hi Larry and All,

Cool thing about the image in question is that there are two well
formed footprints on the comet nucleus. Affectionately known as "right
foot" and "left foot", they are easily visible in the higher
resolution picture in the lower left at:

http://stardust.jpl.nasa.gov/highres/jets_release_03_12_04_1.jpg

Cheers,

Martin

On Tue, May 27, 2008 at 1:57 PM,  <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hi Martin:
>
> Beat me by 3 minutes on the ID for the "meteorite" image that they show!
>
> Larry
>
> On Tue, May 27, 2008 12:53 pm, Dark Matter wrote:
>> Sounds fishy to me. It's got some pretty serious heat capacity to
>> require such cooling time at only 900g.
>>
>> Also, the site's picture of a meteorite is actually a composite image
>> of the nucleus of Comet Wild 2, the one from which Stardust captured
>> particles.
>>
>> http://stardust.jpl.nasa.gov/photo/wild2.html
>>
>>
>> -Martin
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Tue, May 27, 2008 at 12:05 PM, Michael Farmer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> http://www.timesnow.tv/NewsDtls.aspx?NewsID=8908
>>>
>>>
>>> I wonder if a meteorite fell, or if this is a total
>>> crock of %$$% Michael Farmer
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> __
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>
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] largest stone slice known

[Dark Matter]

My guess is one of the Rio Limay slices.

i.e.
http://www.nyrockman.com/pages/riolimay11.9kg.htm

Cheers,

Martin



On Wed, May 28, 2008 at 9:47 PM, mckinney trammell
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> what is the largest surface-area stone meteorite slice
> known with PIX?
>
>
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] Weston - TKW (in collections)

[Dark Matter]

Here's another piece. Third picture down at:

http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2006/March/Accretion_Desk.htm
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Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Place Name Photos

[Dark Matter]

Hello,

I am slowly getting back into the meteorite swing of things (new job,
new town), and have a few more gallery images yet to post. If you are
one of the kind ones who sent me a pic and I've have not posted it,
just send a quick reminder so I can locate you previous email.

If you have a meteorite place sign, please email it to me at my
[EMAIL PROTECTED] address. Please tell me what it is, who you
are, and if you DO NOT want your name posted as the person who
submitted the sign.

Thanks,

Martin



On Thu, Jun 5, 2008 at 11:13 AM, Paul Harris <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hi Elton,
>
> That was Martin Horejsi.
> http://www.meteorite-times.com/gallery/thumbnails.php?album=1
>
> Paul
>
>
> Mr EMan wrote:
>>
>> WHo is the duantless individual that was collecting and publishing road
>> signs from places where meteorites have fallen?
>> Elton
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Re: [meteorite-list] Happy 10th Birthday Portales Valley

[Dark Matter]

Hi Bernd and All,

For a close up view of PV, check out Tom's Micro Visions article on
it. I suspect that piece might be the PV with the finest polish in the
world.

Thanks Tom!

-Martin



On Sat, Jun 14, 2008 at 9:55 PM,  <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Mike Farmer writes:
>
> "I found one stone, and bought many more for a total of more than 15 kilos."
>
> and: "Happy Birthday to one of my favorite meteorites"
>
>
> A very enthusiastic Mike Farmer sent me this mail on Wed, 22 Jul 1998:
>
> "Bernd, I just returned from the UofA where most of the analysis is being 
> done.
>  They loved this piece. It is quite obvious that this chondrite was smashed in
>  a huge shock event and metal flowed into the stone crushed pieces. I wish 
> they
>  were all this nice! I had to pay over $...*/ gram for this slice and I will 
> try
>  to get another since it is so incredible."
>
> * amount canceled by me because I don't know if Mike wants to keep this 
> private
>
> Best wishes from the happy owner of  an 11.5-gram metal-poor slice (M. 
> Farmer),
> a 3.9-gram metal-rich slice (M. Blood) and a PV thin section (M. Farmer),
>
> Bernd
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] Happy 10th Birthday Portales Valley

[Dark Matter]

Sorry, forgot the link:

http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2006/September/Micro_Visions.htm

happy viewing.




On Sat, Jun 14, 2008 at 7:12 PM, Dark Matter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hi Bernd and All,
>
> For a close up view of PV, check out Tom's Micro Visions article on
> it. I suspect that piece might be the PV with the finest polish in the
> world.
>
> Thanks Tom!
>
> -Martin
>
>
>
> On Sat, Jun 14, 2008 at 9:55 PM,  <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> Mike Farmer writes:
>>
>> "I found one stone, and bought many more for a total of more than 15 kilos."
>>
>> and: "Happy Birthday to one of my favorite meteorites"
>>
>>
>> A very enthusiastic Mike Farmer sent me this mail on Wed, 22 Jul 1998:
>>
>> "Bernd, I just returned from the UofA where most of the analysis is being 
>> done.
>>  They loved this piece. It is quite obvious that this chondrite was smashed 
>> in
>>  a huge shock event and metal flowed into the stone crushed pieces. I wish 
>> they
>>  were all this nice! I had to pay over $...*/ gram for this slice and I will 
>> try
>>  to get another since it is so incredible."
>>
>> * amount canceled by me because I don't know if Mike wants to keep this 
>> private
>>
>> Best wishes from the happy owner of  an 11.5-gram metal-poor slice (M. 
>> Farmer),
>> a 3.9-gram metal-rich slice (M. Blood) and a PV thin section (M. Farmer),
>>
>> Bernd
>>
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[meteorite-list] Am I missing something here?

[Dark Matter]

Hi All,

Twice in the past few days, I found myself staring at the screen in
confused disbelief. The two statements in sales ads:


"a yet unclassified CO3"

and

"absolutely rare type L3.05 !"

just seem to me to border on absurdity. How can a unclassified
specimen be identified by its classification?

And if we carry petrological grade to the hundredths, then
theoretically we could have over 1500 ordinary chondrite designations
not to mention all the transitional possibilities. I fail to see how
that level of hypothetical opinionated hair splitting could do any
good...except for ebay sales ads that is.

Just an evening though when I should be working on something else.

Cheers,

Martin
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Re: [meteorite-list] Am I missing something here?

[Dark Matter]

Hello Jeff and All,

Thank you very much for the thorough and thoughtful reply. I certainly
would not disagree with you on such matters.

Now I'm curious if refinement in classification will be made for
Krymka (like Alex):
http://www.meteorite.com/MT_links/2003/March/1krymka.jpg

Bishunpur:
http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2005/December/bishunpur.jpg

and what about carbonaceous chondrites like Leoville, currently a
CV3.0 I believe:
http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2004/December/leo_cai.jpg

And thanks to Svend for his clarification.

Martin
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Re: [meteorite-list] Meteors and Meteorites an Historic Archive now available online

[Dark Matter]

WOW! Really! WOW!

One of my fav's

http://www.meteoritehistory.info/WARD/WCCONT.HTM

Excellent job Eric and thank you very much!

-Martin




On Fri, Aug 8, 2008 at 1:05 PM, Eric Hutton <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> http://www.meteoritehistory.info/
>
> Meteors and Meteorites an Historic Archive
>
> Originally published as three CDs and a DVD this website provides over 9,800
> pages
> of information on the subject taken from old journals and books.
> Each page is presented as a "photocopy" of the original page. In the few
> places
> where the information is maintained more up to date elsewhere there are
> links,
> such as the UK and Ireland Meteroite page, and those to W. F. Denning.
> But essentially you have the content of the CDs, minus the "magnify" option
> on each page.
>
> Enjoy.
>
> Eric S. Hutton
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Re: [meteorite-list] Steal of a Lifetime: Mirko's NWA 5411 (on EBay)

[Dark Matter]

Wow Bernd. Good score.

I just measured the mega chondrule in my slice of Alfianello, Italy
slice. It is 11mm x 8mm and almost dead center in the face, and pretty
much all alone.

A pic can be seen if you scroll down to Alfianello in my article at
the Accretion Desk:

http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2005/August/Accretion_Desk.htm

Is there really a 48mm chondrule in Djati-Pengilon? Got a pic of it
anywhere? Can a whole meteorite be a single chondrule? Where did the
list come from?

Cheers, and thanks.

Martin
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Re: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - August 30, 2008

[Dark Matter]

Nice Picture. Thanks.

The RFS page texts suspects L6. The enlarged picture suggests a
possible L5. Frankly, I'd put my bet on an L4.

Cheers,

Martin



2008/8/30 Michael Johnson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> http://www.rocksfromspace.org/August_30_2008.html
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Re: [meteorite-list] Rocks from Space Picture of the Day - September 18, 2008

[Dark Matter]

Hi Mark,

That would be the Smithsonian Natural History Museum in Washington DC.

The display of iron meteorites at that NHM has a unique 3-D graph
showing the relationship between the various classes of iron
meteorites such as the IV A in the discussed picture. The
silvery-white dot on the pedestal shows the position of this meteorite
in the overall classification scheme.

Here is a pic showing the Gibeon insitu. The etched end section is in
on the far right center.
http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2004/March/disp_irons_etched.jpg

If I can find a pic of the graph, I'll post it.

Cheers,

Martin

On Thu, Sep 18, 2008 at 5:02 AM, Mark Crawford <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> From which NHM?
>
> Mark
>
> Quoting [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
>
>> http://www.rocksfromspace.org/September_18_2008.html
>>
>>
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] This day in meteorite history [Canon City]

[Dark Matter]

Hi All,

There are three pics of the Canon City meteorite in my October
Accretion Desk article in the Meteorite Times at:

http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2008/june/Accretion_Desk.htm

The pic of the 53g piece has wood scars on its crust.

Cheers,

Martin




On Mon, Oct 27, 2008 at 9:30 PM, Greg Catterton
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> The Canon City Meteorite
> On the evening of Oct. 27, 1973, a meteorite hurtled through the sky in Canon 
> City, Colo. It landed on a garage, tearing a six-inch hole in the roof and 
> leaving a two-inch gash in the garage's cement floor. The meteorite, which 
> weighed 1.4 kg at the time of impact, was classified as a chondrite, a stony 
> meteorite that is the most common type to hit Earth. According to scientist 
> Glenn Huss, who was director of the American Meteorological Laboratory at the 
> time, the Canon City meteorite originated 60 million miles away, in an 
> asteroid belt.
>
> At the time, it was only the third meteorite in Colorado to be discovered 
> shortly after landfall. Upon impact, the meteorite broke into four large 
> pieces and more than 50 fragments. A 2001 report named the Canon City 
> meteorite as only one of 35 meteorites to hit a man-made structure in the 
> United States.
>
>
>
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Face

[Dark Matter]

Hi All,

Speaking of "The Scream" in a meteorite, I noticed the same thing in
Willamette.

Here is my Accretion Desk article on the topic. I also have a
Sikhote-Alin that holds a "Scream" that is pictured as well.

http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2006/November/Accretion_Desk.htm

Happy viewing.

Martin




On Mon, Nov 3, 2008 at 5:39 PM, ensoramanda <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hi All,
>
> My new meteorite face reminds me of an alien face from a tv program or film
> many years back. Anyone else seen this or remember something similar? I just
> can't recall where I've seen it and yet it seems so familiar...it's been
> bugging me ever since I saw it.
>
> see here
>
> http://i117.photobucket.com/albums/o43/LaburnumStudio/campos/campoface2.jpg
>
> Graham Ensor UK
>
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] WANTED - Holbrook from AMNH

[Dark Matter]

Hi All,

I think its not only amazing that the AMNH took the time to hand-label
approximately 2000 small individuals from the same fall, but each each
numbered Holbrook was weighed and formally entered into the 1935 AMNH
Meteorite Collection Catalogue (from where my ballpark figure of 2000
numbered individuals came from). And all this is beyond the fact that
Holbrook will forever hold a firm place in American meteorite history,
as well as meteorite shower science.

Further, since the numbered Holbrooks were collected immediately after
the fall, an AMNH numbered specimen guarantees that the individual is
"fresh" and as found shortly after the 1912 fall.

Here is a link to a pic of some of the numbered Holbrook individuals
in my collection resting on a copy of the 1935 AMNH meteorite
collection catalogue:

http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2002/November/3holbrook_amnh_numbers.jpg


And here is link to my Accretion Desk article about the The Arthur
Ross Hall of Meteorites in the American Museum of Natural History in
New York City:

http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2006/October/Accretion_Desk.htm


Just an FYI: I did see a few AMNH numbered Holbrooks offered by Bob
Summerfield at his Astronomy to Go  when he displayed his wears at a
exhibitor booth at a science conference in Boston earlier this year. I
cannot remember if I bought them all but it's worth a shot asking.

Cheers,

Martin




On Mon, Nov 10, 2008 at 2:48 PM, Pat Brown <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hi Arnaud and fellow listoids,
>
> Why have these small Holbrooks with AMNH labels become so popular? I have 2 
> (which are not for sale) that I bought from ET about 15 years ago for very 
> little. There was one in Michael Blood's auction in Tucson this year that 
> brought good money, was weighed to the nearest milligram and placed in a 
> membrane box.
>
> Pat Brown
> Scientific Lifestyle Meteorites
> Engineer by vocation, meteorite hunter when on vacation
>
>
> --- On Mon, 11/10/08, Arnaud Mignan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>> From: Arnaud Mignan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> Subject: [meteorite-list] WANTED - Holbrook from AMNH
>> To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
>> Date: Monday, November 10, 2008, 12:22 PM
>> Hello,
>>
>> I'm looking for some small Holbrooks from AMNH - Please
>> contact me off-list if you have some for sale or trade
>> For trade, I have for example:
>> Viedma full slice of 132g (there must be less than 10 full
>> slices existing)
>> Juancheng individual of 93g (with secondary FC)
>> Lost City part slice with FC of 0.42g (Schwade/Smithsonian)
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Arnaud
>>
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Re: [meteorite-list] Geology.com Monthly Meteorite Column - December

[Dark Matter]

Bravo Geoff! Very well done.

I appreciate your condensed and to the point presentation of meteorite
collecting in a nutshell.

I have a presentation on meteorites at the National Science Teachers
Association's national conference in New Orleans this coming spring.
I'll be covering more about meteorites than collecting them, but when
I've done such things in the past, collecting seems to be a primary
interest of those who attend a session about meteorites. I intend to
steer the attendees to your geology.com meteorite collecting article.

Regarding future topics, I often intersect the path of professional
geologists when it comes to two main topics One is whether something
is a meteorite or not (almost always a no-brainer-not, of course), and
the second is in their desire to know where a meteorite comes from in
space, and how a particular space rock can be paired with its parent
body in space.

Oh, nice Harrison slice. Where'd you get it? (;- )

Best,

Martin





On Wed, Dec 3, 2008 at 3:18 PM, Notkin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Dear Listees:
>
>
> The December episode of my monthly science column "Meteorwritings" is live
> on Geology.com:
>
> http://geology.com   and click on the Imilac photo
>
> -- or --
>
> http://geology.com/meteorites/value-of-meteorites.shtml
>
>
> December's feature is a guide to buying and collecting meteorites, aimed
> primarily at the novice. However, we took a set of a brand new, original
> photographs for the column, and I'd particularly like to invite you to view
> the 1.3 kg Sikhote-Alin with natural hole. Has to be one of the best I've
> ever seen.
>
> As always, comments are gratefully received. As the primary purpose of this
> column is to introduce meteorites and meteorite collecting to a general
> audience, I'd also welcome suggestions for future column topics that might
> appeal to a geologically-minded readership. The January column will be about
> impactites, so we've already got that one covered.
>
>
> Thank you for reading and best wishes from Tucson,
>
> Geoff N.
>
> www.aerolite.org
> www.campometeorites.com
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Re: [meteorite-list] Martin Horejsi's The Accretion Desk Souslovo, Russia

[Dark Matter]

Hi Tom,

Thanks for reading it. Normally I pass on recent finds for my
collection, but the shape and story of Souslovo was too good to skip.

I made up the term "Toolbox Meteorite" (not to be confused with NASA's
Toolkit "Meteorite" that should be arriving any time now). I needed a
name for meteorites that are used as tools, whether doorstops,
paperweights, or wheelchocks prior to entering our collection.
However, I have seen a few continue on as tools even after entered
into a meteorite collection catalog, usually in the role of a
doorstop.

Tom, I wish I still lived close to you. I think you would have a blast
scoping Souslovo with all its chondritic oddities.

Best,

Martin



On Tue, Dec 9, 2008 at 9:20 PM,  <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Every one who has not checked out Martin's  article in December Meteorite
> Times is missing out on a way cool article.   I had never heard the term "Tool
> Box Meteorite".  It that a Martin  original???
>
> Anyway,  It's got it all, great photos, cool  story and a wonderful
> meteorite.  Thanks  Martin!
>
> http://www.meteorite-times.com/meteorite_frame.htm
>
> Tom  Phillips
>
> **Make your life easier with all your friends, email, and
> favorite sites in one place.  Try it now.
> (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp&icid=aolcom40vanity&ncid=emlcntaolcom0010)
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Re: [meteorite-list] Toolbox Meteorite

[Dark Matter]

Hi Mike,

I'd love to see a pic of Mike's beer bottle opener. Now you've got me
curious. I have some SA individuals around here that are about the
right size. I'm going to grab a six-pack and see if I can find an
opener.

I remember showing this meteorite (
http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2006/March/s-a2b.jpg ) to a
friend at the Tucson Show and she said something like, "Oh, that would
make a nice hook. It could go on your wall and you could hang your
coat on it." I guess that would make it a toolbox meteorite as well
(;- )

-Martin

On Wed, Dec 10, 2008 at 10:08 AM, Mike Bandli <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Martin and All,
>
> I never considered the 'Toolbox' sub-genre of meteorites. Very well done and 
> interesting!
>
> Though not a historical one, one of my favorite 'Toolbox' meteorites is Mike 
> Jensen's Sikhote Alin beer bottle opener. I always search the bins in Tucson 
> for one, but I think Mike Jensen holds the only one in existence. It also 
> allows one to employ the ultimate geek pick-up line: "Excuse me, Miss, allow 
> me to open that Coors Light with my meteorite for you."
>
> Best,
>
> Mike Bandli
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] Toolbox Meteorite

[Dark Matter]

Bravo Frank! Your list and quotes are wonderful.

I do indeed have Blackwell. It appeared in my November 2005 Accretion
Desk article. Here is part of the text from its caption:

"Blackwell fell in 1906, and only a single 2.38kg stone was recovered.
Blackwell, in classic meteorite stereotyping served as a doorstop for
more than quarter century before being elevated to its proper stature.

Further adding to the US history of this slice is fact it passed
through the famous J. M. DuPont Meteorite Collection on its way to me.
Even more, I believe the painted specimen number gracing the
thumbprinted edge of crust on this slice is from the American Museum
of Natural History in New York City. I did not see Blackwell
referenced in the AMNH meteorite collection catalog, but the one I was
reading was the C. A. Reed 1935 edition. Then I realized that at the
time of publication, the Blackwell meteorite was still back in
Oklahoma holding open a door."

And here is a link to its pic:
http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2005/November/blackwell.jpg

Thanks,

Martin




On Wed, Dec 10, 2008 at 1:54 PM, Frank Cressy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hello all,
>
> Nininger found several toolbox meteorites such as Arispe (anvil), Maimi 
> ("deadman" on a fence), Toluca (hammer stones to make morters) etc.
>
> He hit the jackpot though when he searched the Plainview strewn field. He 
> found a stone used to keep the chicken coop door closed, stones used as 
> weights in a pork barrel, and used as a weight on a milk crock cover.  The 
> best Plainview tool, in my opinion, was a stone used to get a bull's 
> attention.  Of this, Nininger wrote, " he went to the cow shed and from a 
> crossbeam he took a small fist-sized meteorite." The farmer said,  "I've been 
> keeping this around to take after my bull with...My bull has a pretty mean 
> disposition but when he goes on a rampage I only need to hit him once with 
> this, somewhere around the head, and he quites right down."
>
> Sounds like this was a very useful tool!
>
> LaPaz also notes a couple of meteorite tools.  The 1,375-pound La Caile, 
> France, meteorite was used by the people of the village for two centuries as 
> a seat in front of their church.  LaPaz mentions the Rafruti, Switzerland 
> iron meteorite, which appears to be a seasonal tool.   The finder used it as 
> a footwarmer, apparently heating it nightly before putting in his bed.
>
> Of course, there's also Blackwell, used for years as a doorstop before being 
> liberated.  I believe Martin has a piece of this in his toolbox collection.
>
> Enjoy,
>
> Frank
>
> --- On Wed, 12/10/08, Mike Bandli <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> From: Mike Bandli <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Toolbox Meteorite
> To: "Dark Matter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
> Date: Wednesday, December 10, 2008, 11:56 AM
>
> Re: Mike Jensen's Bottle Opener
>
> It's gone from his site, but you can still see it via the Way Back Machine
> here (scroll all the way to the bottom of the page):
>
> http://web.archive.org/web/20070728160656/jensenmeteorites.com/Sikhote.htm
>
> Cheers,
>
> Mike Bandli
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Dark Matter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "Mike Bandli" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
> Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2008 11:33:00 AM GMT -08:00 US/Canada Pacific
> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Toolbox Meteorite
>
> Hi Mike,
>
> I'd love to see a pic of Mike's beer bottle opener. Now you've got
> me
> curious. I have some SA individuals around here that are about the
> right size. I'm going to grab a six-pack and see if I can find an
> opener.
>
> I remember showing this meteorite (
> http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2006/March/s-a2b.jpg ) to a
> friend at the Tucson Show and she said something like, "Oh, that would
> make a nice hook. It could go on your wall and you could hang your
> coat on it." I guess that would make it a toolbox meteorite as well
> (;- )
>
> -Martin
>
> On Wed, Dec 10, 2008 at 10:08 AM, Mike Bandli <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
>> Martin and All,
>>
>> I never considered the 'Toolbox' sub-genre of meteorites. Very
> well done and interesting!
>>
>> Though not a historical one, one of my favorite 'Toolbox'
> meteorites is Mike Jensen's Sikhote Alin beer bottle opener. I always search
> the bins in Tucson for one, but I think Mike Jensen holds the only one in
> existence. It also allows one to employ the ultimate geek pick-up line:
> "Excuse 

Re: [meteorite-list] Souslovo

[Dark Matter]

Wonderful Pics  John. Thanks for sharing them with us.

As I pointed out in the article, Souslovo is a very busy meteorite
with macroscopic oddities everywhere one looks.

Best,

Martin

On Wed, Dec 10, 2008 at 7:16 PM, Jerry Flaherty <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> John, always learn something from your beautiful posts
> - Original Message - From: "Kashuba" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: 
> Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2008 7:13 PM
> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Souslovo
>
>
>> List,
>>
>> For anyone interested - I've taken a half dozen thin section pictures of
>> Souslovo L4 and posted them here:
>>
>> http://johnkashuba.com/Pages/Meteorite%20Pages/Pictures/SouslovoL4.htm
>>
>> - John
>>
>> John Kashuba
>> Ontario, California
>>
>>
>>
>> __
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Re: [meteorite-list] Toolbox Meteorite Clarification?

[Dark Matter]

Hi Tom,

I think another caveat might be that the Toolbox meteorite needed to
be used "as is" rather than pounded into a more desired shape. Just a
thought that knocks the wind out of a thousand years of irons.

If you cannot grow it, you must mine it. Unless, that is, you want to
wait around for it to fall from the sky.

Oh, and regarding the fern-based hat holder, I think I could find
plenty of enjoyment having a hot desert dinner plate displayed here.

Best,

Martin

On Wed, Dec 10, 2008 at 4:51 PM,  <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> It seems that for a meteorite to be a "Toolbox"  it's utilitarian life must
> of been started prior to it being "discovered" as a  meteorite.  Any use after
> it is known is merely a novelty.  I have a  12.5 Kg NWA sitting on a fern
> stand, it makes a great place to put my hat.   I can't imagine Martin would 
> want a
> slice of it for his new  collection!
>
> Martin,  It's your call!
>
> Tom
>
> In a  message dated 12/10/2008 4:32:27 P.M. Mountain Standard Time,
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]  writes:
> You so need to get out more, Mike ;-)
>
> Mike Bandli  wrote:
>> It also allows one to employ the ultimate geek pick-up line:  "Excuse me,
> Miss, allow me to open that Coors Light with my meteorite for you."
>>
>
> --
> Mark's Meteorite Pages:  http://meteorites.cc
>
> __
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Re: [meteorite-list] Real or Bogus?

[Dark Matter]

http://www.earthtothemoon.com/ap_11_lunar_dust.html


-Martin




On Fri, Dec 12, 2008 at 8:15 AM, Mike Bandli  wrote:
> Hello Mike G,
>
> I can vouch for this item and tell you that it is the real deal. There have 
> been several presentations made with swatches of BetaCloth or other materials 
> stained with lunar dust. Florian has been the primary supplier of these 
> presentations and it is all legit. You can read more about his presentations 
> on the collectSPACE.com forums.
>
> I might note that stained hardware and artifacts are the only legal way to 
> own lunar material from the Apollo missions.
>
> Owning several lunar meteorites, I could care less about buying 10 grains of 
> Apollo lunar glass. BUT... what makes this artifact desirable (to me, anyway) 
> is that it is an authentic artifact from Apollo 11 - the 'grail' of human 
> exploration.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Mike Bandli
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Michael Gilmer" 
> To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
> Sent: Friday, December 12, 2008 6:43:36 AM GMT -08:00 US/Canada Pacific
> Subject: [meteorite-list] Real or Bogus?
>
> Hi ladies and gentlemen (and friends watching at home!) -
>
> It's time to play America's favorite game - "REAL OR BOGUS?"
>
> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=320324463986
>
> Today's offering comes from the intrepid world of eBay. Here we see
> something billed as real moon dust that was recovered from Neil
> Armstrong's camera magazine.
>
> So, I have to ask everyone who is playing - REAL OR BOGUS?
>
> (If I was a gambling man, I'd say BOGUS)
>
> Regards and clear skies,
>
> MikeG
>
> .
> Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA)
> Member of the Meteoritical Society.
> Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network.
> Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and http://www.glassthrower.com
> MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale
> ..
>
>
>
>
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[meteorite-list] Santa Physics...again for 2008

[Dark Matter]

Hi All,

It seems it has befallen upon me to hold the job of official Santa
Physics story reposter. So, in the true spirit of the season, here it
is yet again.

And as usual, I have not checked the math.

Enjoy.

Martin






Engineering Christmas: Some points of contention.

There are approximately two billion children (persons under 18) in the
world. However, since Santa does not visit children of Muslim, Hindu,
Jewish or Buddhist religions, this reduces the workload for Christmas
night to 15% of the total, or 378 million (according to the Population
Reference Bureau). At an average (census) rate of 3.5 children per
household, that comes to 108 million homes, presuming that there is at
least one good child in each dwelling.

Santa has about 31 hours of Christmas to work with thanks to the
different time zones and the rotation of the earth, assuming he
travels east to west which seems logical. This works out to 967.7
visits per second. This is to say that for each Christian household
with a good child, Santa has about 1/1000th of a second to park the
sleigh, hop out, jump down the chimney, fill the stockings, distribute
the remaining presents under the tree, eat whatever snacks have been
left for him, get back up the chimney, jump into the sleigh and get on
to the next house. Assuming that each of these 108 million stops is
evenly distributed around the earth (which of course, we know to be
false, but will accept for the purpose of our calculations), we are
now talking about 0.78 miles per household; a total trip of 75.5
million miles, not counting bathroom stops or other breaks.

This requires that Santa's sleigh moves at 650 miles per second--3000
times the speed of sound. For purposes of comparison, the fastest
man-made vehicle, the Ulysses space probe, moves at a poky 27.4 miles
per second, and conventional reindeer can run at best 30 miles per
hour.

The payload of the sleigh adds another interesting element. Assuming
that each child gets nothing more than a medium sized Lego set (two
pounds), the sleigh is carrying over 500,000 tons, not counting Santa
himself. On land a conventional reindeer can pull about 300 pounds.
Even granting that the "flying" reindeer could pull ten times the
normal amount, the job just cannot be done with eight or nine of
them-- Santa would need 360,000 reindeer!

This increases the payload, not counting the weight of the sleigh,
another 54,000 tons or roughly seven times the weight of the Queen
Elizabeth (the ship, not the monarch).

4.600,000 tons traveling at 650 miles per second creates enormous air
resistance-- this would heat up the reindeer in the same fashion as
spacecraft re-entering the earth's atmosphere (which may explain
Rudolph's red nose). The lead pair of reindeer would absorb 14.3
quintillion joules of energy per second. In short, they would
instantaneously vaporize exposing the reindeer behind them to the same
friction and also creating deafening sonic booms in their wake. The
entire reindeer team would vanish within 4.26 thousandths of a second,
or right about the time Santa reached the fifth house on his trip.

Not that it matters, however since Santa, as a result of accelerating
from a dead stop to 650 miles per second in .001 seconds, would be
subjected to centrifugal forces of 17,500 Gs. A 250 pound Santa (which
seems ludicrously slim) would be pinned to the back of the sleigh by
4,315,015 pounds of force, instantly crushing his bones and organs and
reducing him to a quivering red-hot blob of goo. And yet, he returns
year after year.

Therefore, the rules of physics obviously don't apply to Santa and his
yearly mission. Speaking as an engineer, this guy must know something
about relativity that we have yet to discover.

HO, HO, HO.
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Re: [meteorite-list] Molina de Segura, Spain meteorite fall Christmas Eve 1858

[Dark Matter]

Hi Dirk,

Thanks for the link. Molina is near and dear to my heart. Here is an
article I wrote about my collection piece of Molina, and it prior
ownership including that of the collection of the famous Dr. Urey.

http://www.meteorite-times.com/Back_Links/2004/October/Accretion_Desk.htm

Best,

Martin



On Thu, Dec 25, 2008 at 8:05 PM, drtanuki  wrote:
> Dear List Members,
>
>  An interesting article about the Molina de Segura fall in Spain on Christmas 
> Eve 1858.
>
> Spain's Biggest Meteorite Strike Remembered 150 Years On
> ScienceDaily (Dec. 24, 2008) — Early on Christmas Eve, 1858 "people who in 
> the streets, on pathways and in the fields saw a magnificent ball of fire 
> appear, which shone with a brilliant, blinding light and all the colours of 
> the rainbow, obscured the light of the moon and descended majestically from 
> the sky".
>  For the whole story go to the link:
>
> http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/12/081224094630.htm
>
>  Best Regards, Dirk Ross...Tokyo
> h
>
>
>
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] Hodges Sylacauga Stone ( was What makes a hammer ahammer?

[Dark Matter]

Hi Robert,

I've yet to see the original mass except in pictures. There are plenty
of historic pics of the incident and the intruder if one does a google
image search. Interestingly, it seems that the core sample under
discussion is still floating in googles memory on this link:

http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.nyrockman.com/auction-2007/cp/sylacauga2.65g-cp.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.nyrockman.com/tucson-auction-2007.htm&usg=__BF3-jLFO0Us68kh3JzoNcuAhTFw=&h=119&w=145&sz=33&hl=en&start=28&sig2=KJYJDUh44g_uk4H8JzwIWQ&um=1&tbnid=_s-V363F_dw6CM:&tbnh=78&tbnw=95&ei=Ri5hSfrxLJ-0sQOQnLmHDQ&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dsylacauga%2Bmeteorite%26start%3D20%26ndsp%3D20%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26client%3Dsafari%26rls%3Den-us%26sa%3DN

This thread is a little painful for me since I remember being on the
phone with Steve #1 as the slice of Sylacauga was active but ending in
the King auction. There was another bidder (or two) I was up against
going after Sylacauga. I finally bowed out knowing I would regret it
someday. Well, that day is today.

Back to my beer...

Martin


> -Original Message-
> From: meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com
> [mailto:meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of Robert
> Woolard
> Sent: Sunday, January 04, 2009 12:21 PM
> To: meteorh...@aol.com
> Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
> Subject: [meteorite-list] Hodges Sylacauga Stone ( was What makes a hammer
> ahammer?
>
> Steve, Michael and all,
>
>  Thanks for the additional information, Steve. Dr. King's quote does seem
> to put a different light on things.
>
>  Just out of curiosity, has ANY member here ever seen THE stone (the "Holy
> Grail" of hammers I guess) in person? (Perhaps you, Martin with your
> exceptional interest in historical specimens?? ... I did see your Met. Times
> article where you discuss your Top 10 Smithsonian meteorites and you listed
> a slice of their Sylacauga specimen).  Does any member live close enough to
> it at the Alabama Museum of Natural History to give us a report and/or some
> photos? There doesn't seem to be very many listed anywhere on the
> Internet at least that I can find. I'm sure a lot of us would love to
> see some high quality photos of it!
>
>  Best,
>  Robert Woolard
> )
>
>
>
>
>
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