Re: [meteorite-list] Auction Kings ( PROVENANCE COA's )

[mafer]

Yes Adam, provenance, COA, and ID cards can be very different things.
Saying I got some specimens from Adam, Greg, or any number of the great
people who do the collecting, purchasing, and classifying is never intended
as a COA, but, it does assure others that it's not from the driveway,
railway, or some cave somewhere. 




On 3:41:58 pm 03/24/12 Adam Hupe  wrote:
> I think collectors might be confusing COAs with ID cards.  We are
> lucky that ID cards suffice in the meteorite market most of the time. 
> As far as I know, nobody has passed off counterfeit ID cards from my
> collection yet.  This would be like poking a stick into a beehive as
> far as I am concerned.  The only COAs I have provided that were printed
> by myself were for crumbs or cutting dust encased in laminated
> collectors cards. The pieces were so small that I felt collectors would
> appreciate a little more assurance. They are also serialized with the
> certification statement on the back.
> The only other COAs I have provided came with some NWA 5000
> specimens.  These COAs came from an immensely-qualified independent
> grader.  I had no input whatsoever on how individual specimens would be
> graded since many factors were independently taken into account.   I
> have never graded any specimens myself.  I have however provided
> comments when I feel a special feature needs to be pointed out. The
> grades that came on my ID cards were provided by researchers approved
> by the Meteoritical Society's Nomenclature Committee and can be
> referenced in the Bulletin.  Despite popular belief, there are a few
> errors in the Bulletin so no system is perfect. 
>
> I hope this clears things up,
>
> Kind Regards,
>
>
> Adam
>
> 
> From: John higgins 
> To: "meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com"  tral.com>
> Sent: Friday, March 23, 2012 11:31 AM
> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Auction Kings ( PROVENANCE COA's )
>
> Hi Mike, Adam, and List,
> Interesting opinions.
>
> You guys touched on a major issue in the Meteorite Community, and
> there are parts of your statements I don't agree with. I would really
> like to share how I feel about the subject.
> First of all Mike you said,
>
> " I thought this was laughable for obvious
> reasons and a man who runs an auction house should know that 99% of
> COA's are not worth the paper they are printed on.  I can go outside,
> grab a rock from my driveway, and print up an official-looking COA for
> it."
>
> Mike with all due respect, I don't agree with this. Why would you try
> to knock a dealers reputation? For example a meteorite sold by Mike
> Farmer or Greg Hupe is worth more than a meteorite that is sold without
> any provenance or COA.
> For example lets say unknown dealer X is selling a Howardite, and
> well known dealer Y is selling the same Howardite. Who do you think is
> going to realize a higher price? The well know dealer.
> Now if that meteorite losses it's COA from the dealer who sold it,
> what happens? Usually the meteorite immediately looses value, how can
> you explain this if the COA is not worth the paper it's printed on?
> For example a meteorite said to be from from the Bob Hagg collection
> without Bob's paperwork has a much lower value than a meteorite from
> the Bob Hagg collection with his COA right?
> So please extrapolate exactly what you mean and how you come to this
> conclusion. I strongly disagree with your opinion. Much of the value in
> meteorites is locked up in the provenance and not the meteorite itself
> in my opinion.
> I think what is much too overlooked is that a meteorite dealers
> reputation is the most important factor in meteorite prices. That
> includes the following they create, the friends they make, impressions
> that collectors get all translate into value and that it why most
> collectors demand individual COA's be issued with each meteorite sold.
> I think this makes a lot of sense because the process it takes to build
> a good reputation takes years. The piece of paper adds value. Of course
> a paper from Hagg is worth more than a COA from Joe Schmo. But to say
> the paper has no value is the most insane thing I ever heard. How else
> would you know if your buying pedigree meteorites from dealers who
> stand for integrity, honor and strive to provide the customer the best
> experience. A lot of new comers think that the value is in the
> meteorite itself, and then when they try to sell them, they are greatly
> let down and wonder why their meteorites don't fetch the same price
> that the other more well known dealers get all day long. Because it
> comes down to more than just the meteorite itself and taking it for
> face value. You fail to consider the amount of friends the advanced
> dealers had made over the years, the networking they have done and the
> awareness they have created about their meteorite and the way they are
> presented. And most importantly the way they make their customers feel
> is the most important factor 

Re: [meteorite-list] EBay Issues?

[mafer]

I use a program called ccleaner and you can get it from download.com...works 
really well to clean browsers and garbage installing programs on windows leaves 
behind


On 10:20:39 pm 12/14/11 Adam Hupe  wrote:
> Thank you all once again.  I figured it out.  I cleared my browser
> cache and the problem went away.  Now back to more important things
> like meteorites.
>
> Happy Holidays,
>
> Adam
>
>
>
>
> - Original Message -
> From: Adam Hupe 
> To: Adam 
> Cc:
> Sent: Wednesday, December 14, 2011 2:05 PM
> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] EBay Issues?
>
> Thank you for reporting back to me.  I think the problem must be with
> my computer or browser. It is odd that it is only picking on eBay and
> PayPal stuff.
> I don't know what is going on.
>
> Oh Joy, more work.
>
> Kind Regards,
>
> Adam
>
>
>
>
> - Original Message -
> From: Adam Hupe 
> To: Adam 
> Cc:
> Sent: Wednesday, December 14, 2011 12:43 PM
> Subject: [meteorite-list] EBay Issues?
>
> Is anybody else having problems with eBay today. I can't seem to get
> auctions to sort by newly listed.  It keeps going back to best match. 
> I also cannot zoom in on anybody's images including mine.
> Kind Regards,
>
> Adam
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] EBay Issues?

[mafer]

Might be heavy traffic on you internet service. I have no problems up here

On 8:43:08 pm 12/14/11 Adam Hupe  wrote:
> Is anybody else having problems with eBay today. I can't seem to get
> auctions to sort by newly listed.  It keeps going back to best match. 
> I also cannot zoom in on anybody's images including mine.
> Kind Regards,
>
> Adam
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] AD-Ebay auctions ending super fresh LL4, Ureilite, Muonionalusta and more

[mafer]

 Please have a look at my auctions here:
http://www.ebay.com/sch/refamat/m.html?_dmd=1&_ipg=50&_sop=12&_rdc=1


Thanks
Mark

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Re: [meteorite-list] Hammer???

[mafer]

Get a lawyer Pete


On 6:14:46 pm 11/23/11  wrote:
> Hello List and Happy turkey day to all,
> Suppose someone gets really ticked off at his/her
> spouse and picks up a meteorite, bashing said spouse
> in the noggin, killing said spouse.
> Would this be a hammer or just a murder weapon?
> Both?
> Pete
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] AD - Auctions

[mafer]

http://www.ebay.com/sch/refamat/m.html?_dmd=1&_ipg=50&_sop=12&_rdc=1

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[meteorite-list] AD - Auctions

[mafer]

I have some auctions running. Might be of interest so take a look.
Thanks

Mark Ferguson

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Re: [meteorite-list] Question for dealers - accepting foreign checks in the US

[mafer]

It can be done, but watch out. In Kentucky, they can hold the funds for 90
days (and will blame everyone else for it) while they use YOUR money for
themselves.

I am sure other states have similar laws which allow theft like this.


On 4:45:22 pm 08/09/11 Michael Gilmer  wrote:
> Hi List,
>
> Quick question for the dealers : have you ever heard of a US bank
> accepting a check from an overseas bank?  Specifically, a check from
> India from an Indian bank that is affiliated with Bank of America, and
> the check in question will be drawn against Bank of America and can be
> deposited or cashed at any Bank of America?
>
> I ask because I received a request from an overseas customer and the
> request seems legit in other respects, but I am reluctant to deal with
> the kind of stuff where I have to walk in to the bank, speak to a
> supervisor and get it handled - it's a PITA and I'd rather just go
> through the drive-through and get my business done quick.  And unless
> this is some form of Cashier's Check, there is no telling how long it
> will take for a check like this to clear and the funds to become
> available.
>
> Best regards,
>
> MikeG
>
> --
> ---
> Galactic Stone & Ironworks - Meteorites & Amber (Michael Gilmer)
>
> Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com
> Facebook - http://tinyurl.com/42h79my
> News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516
> Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone
> EOM - http://www.encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com/collection.aspx?id=156
> 4
> --
> ---
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Re: [meteorite-list] First opal-like crystals discovered in meteorite

[mafer]

News to me, I must have slept through the part where opal can form crystals.

On 9:51:34 pm 08/03/11 Thunder Stone  wrote:
>
> List:
>
> Intersting,
>
> Greg S
>
>
> http://scienceblog.com/46855/first-opal-like-crystals-discovered-in-me
> teorite/
>
>
> First opal-like crystals discovered in meteorite
>
>
> Scientists have found opal-like crystals in the Tagish Lake
> meteorite, which fell to Earth in Canada in 2000. This is the first
> extraterrestrial discovery of these unusual crystals, which may have
> formed in the primordial cloud of dust that produced the sun and
> planets of our solar system 4.6 billion years ago, according to a
> report in the Journal of the American Chemical Society. Katsuo
> Tsukamoto and colleagues say that colloidal crystals such as opals,
> which form as an orderly array of particles, are of great interest to
> for their potential use in new electronics and optical devices.
> Surprisingly, the crystals in the meteorite are composed of magnetite,
> which scientists thought could not assemble into such a crystal because
> magnetic attractions might pack the atoms together too tightly. We
> believe that, if synthesized, magnetite colloidal crystals have
> promising potential as a novel functional material, the article
> notes. The formation of colloidal crystals in the meteorite implies
> that several conditions must have existed when they formed. First, a
> certain amount of solution water must have been present in the
> meteorite to disperse the colloidal particles, the report explains.
> The solution water must have been confined in small voids, in which
> colloidal crystallization takes place. These conditions, along with
> evidence from similar meteorites, suggest that the crystals may have
> formed 4.6 billion years ago. ___
> ___
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Re: [meteorite-list] Periodicity of Extinctions

[mafer]

I didn't realize wiki anything was a recognized science venue. I do use it
for spelling options and links though :)


Mark Ferguson 


On 8:56:08 pm 08/03/11 "E.P. Grondine"  wrote:
> Hi Richard, all -
>
> At least here on the meteorite list the peanut gallery is allowed to
> squeak.
> Amazing - There appear to be no mention of either Chicxulub or Shiva
> in the wikipedia article on extinctions:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extinction
>
> Apparently, they're all due to global warming now.
>
> When one of the larger YD craters is definitively proved, then
> obviously it will have to be co-incidental to the extinction that
> occurred then. And/Or it will have to be a Carbonaceous asteroid that
> hit. And of course the First Peoples detailed memories of those comet
> fragment impacts are simply fairy tales made up by retarded savages.
> My mistake! :p)
>
> Now since the Nemesis Hypothesis has been thoroughly disproved,
> perhaps you'll send Morrison a note suggesting that he update this
> piece:
> http://www.csicop.org/si/show/is_the_sky_falling
>
> in which he thoroughly endorsed the Nemesis Hypothesis as the
> standard paradigm, while damning Clube and Napier.
> http://ethomas.web.wesleyan.edu/ees123/crater_age_6.gif
>
> http://www.blackwellpublishing.com/paleobiology/figure.asp?chap=07&fig
> =Fig7-6&img=c07f006
>
> Aside from that, I am thoroughly enjoying the images of the fragments
> of 73P which are being posted to the MPML. I hope that some IR images
> of 73P's dust load come along shortly.
> good hunting,
> E.P. Grondine
> Man and Impact in the Americas
>
> PS - I tried to get some YD nanodiamonds from an excavator to sell to
> list participants, but he thought the commercialism would sully the
> science, and the preparation costs were too high.
>
>
>
>
>
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[meteorite-list] Ad: Auctions Ending in a couple hours

[mafer]

If your inclined, I have some auctions ending this afternoon.

http://shop.ebay.com/refamat/m.html?_dmd=1&_ipg=50&_sop=12&_rdc=1


Thanks for looking

Mark Ferguson

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Re: [meteorite-list] OT - Happy Crab Nebula Day!

[mafer]

I bet that the Chinese used their own calendar system.


On 5:44:32 am 07/05/11 MexicoDoug  wrote:
> Hi Mark,
>
> I meant "it ought to be Julian" in the sense that it is the Julian
> calendar system I believe is used by astronomers for dates before
> 1582, since we are by default dealing with the Holy Roman empire's
> calendar - "our calendar", which makes me believe the July 4 date all
> over the place by default would be Julian. Certainly not as a moral
> statement out of me of what calendar is superior! All calendars that
> work are fine with me! I like the Venusian-Mayan one a lot.
>
> Back to the question about the supernova that created the Crab
> Nebula, I still would guess it is JULIAN. I'm not sure if you are
> suggesting that Julian is being / has been dropped or if the date is
> Gregorian or none of the above - and just to observe it ;-) which is
> good advice, too. But knowing if I just Googled Meeus but couldn't
> find anything on Calendar usage in astronomy. I do recall screwing
> around with his algorithms and and dealing with royal pains in the
> butt made simple for his creative mind - using Julian day and date
> problems in his workbook style text, but it's been a very long time...
>
> I found this online from Fred Espenak of NASA who is the eclipse guru
> and has done many historical calculations, so it re-enforces that:
>
> "The Julian calendar is used for all dates up to 1582 Oct 04. After
> that date, the Gregorian calendar is used. Due to the Gregorian
> Calendar reform, the day after 1582 Oct 04 (Julian calendar) is 1582
> Oct 15 (Gregorian calendar). Note that Great Britain did not adopt
> the Gregorian calendar until 1752. For more information, see
> Calendars."
> ref: http://eclipse.gsfc.nasa.gov/SEhelp/calendar.html
>
> As to having a standard calendar, I couldn't agree more with you that
> it would simplify thing, but no matter how you deal with this as you
> mention it is always a headache for anyone who just wants to get
> answers quick. Even in the American colonies, all of the founding
> American fathers pretty much converted their birthdays since the new
> calendar was adopted here until the mid 1700's. I wonder how it felt
> to change everyone's birthday ... or I'm wondering if they actually
> kept celebrating on their Julian dates. Yes, here is meteorite-man
> Thomas Jefferson's design for his grave monument and epitaph, showing
> his birthday (O.S.) old system (Julian) of April 2, 1743.
>
> As to whoever did the specific conversions to determine the July 4,
> 1054 date from the ancient Chinese observations attributed to the
> Crab Nebula supernova ... they know :-(, but heck ... it happened a
> few thousand years earlier anyway, not when the light happened to
> reach Earth, yeah probably on a July 4 ... good cop-out to exit stage
> left
> http://www.hark.com/clips/mfrzzzplsb-stage-left
> ;-)
>
> Kindest wishes
> Doug
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: ma...@imagineopals.com
> To: MexicoDoug 
> Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
> Sent: Mon, Jul 4, 2011 11:32 pm
> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] OT - Happy Crab Nebula Day!
>
>
> The Gregorian calendar represents a generalized conversion so that
> things
> are easily kept in perspective between the sciences and the rest of
> the world. And thus, the terms Current Era (CE) and Before Current
> Era (BCE) have come into use and they do not represent Julian
> Calendar timelines.
>
> You could also add the Egyptian, Mayan, and Hebrew calendars if you
> really
> want to confuse the issue and there are those who seem to have
> obtained post grad degrees with methods to reconcile the various
> calendars so that
> all dates within each match up.
>
>
> And since some predate the Julian Calendar, which hold the superior
> claim?
> Which is the most easily used and more commonly used?
>
>
> BTW the Crab Nebula is one of the most beautiful of formations and
> one that
> many people have seen, even if they wouldn't recognize it.
>
>
>
> On 4:15:42 am 07/05/11 MexicoDoug  wrote:
> >
> >  It ought to be Julian since that was in effect ... or else all the
> >  references would have to say something about the re-adjustment of
> >  the date, but that's just an opinion! In astronomy, generally the
> >  1582 conversion is respected by astronomers if I recall - I.e.,
> >  before that time events are on the Julian Calendar, and afterwards
> >  Gregorian, even if they nation of the observation was still on the
> >  Julian date; usually that doesn't matter and by convention the
> >  expression I time I believe changes in 1582. Jean Meeus's
> >  incredibly useful books, if I had them would have an excellent
> >  discussion of the subject, but I don't have my references with me.
> >  Some other list member could look it up as Meeus'd be the expert.
> >
> >  Best wishes
> >  Doug
> >
> >  -Original Message-
> >  From: Patrick Wiggins 
> >  To: MeteorList 
> >  Sent: Mon, Jul 4, 2011 10:12 pm
> >  Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] OT - H

Re: [meteorite-list] OT - Happy Crab Nebula Day!

[mafer]

The Gregorian calendar represents a generalized conversion so that things
are easily kept in perspective between the sciences and the rest of the
world. And thus, the terms Current Era (CE) and Before Current Era (BCE)
have come into use and they do not represent Julian Calendar timelines.


You could also add the Egyptian, Mayan, and Hebrew calendars if you really
want to confuse the issue and there are those who seem to have obtained
post grad degrees with methods to reconcile the various calendars so that
all dates within each match up.


And since some predate the Julian Calendar, which hold the superior claim?
Which is the most easily used and more commonly used?


BTW the Crab Nebula is one of the most beautiful of formations and one that
many people have seen, even if they wouldn't recognize it.



On 4:15:42 am 07/05/11 MexicoDoug  wrote:
>
> It ought to be Julian since that was in effect ... or else all the
> references would have to say something about the re-adjustment of the
> date, but that's just an opinion! In astronomy, generally the 1582
> conversion is respected by astronomers if I recall - I.e., before
> that time events are on the Julian Calendar, and afterwards
> Gregorian, even if they nation of the observation was still on the
> Julian date; usually that doesn't matter and by convention the
> expression I time I believe changes in 1582. Jean Meeus's incredibly
> useful books, if I had them would have an excellent discussion of the
> subject, but I don't have my references with me. Some other list
> member could look it up as Meeus'd be the expert.
>
> Best wishes
> Doug
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Patrick Wiggins 
> To: MeteorList 
> Sent: Mon, Jul 4, 2011 10:12 pm
> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] OT - Happy Crab Nebula Day!
>
>
> I've often wondered and maybe someone here can answer.
>
> Since 1054 was long before the 1582 conversion from the Julian to
> Gregorian
> calendar, is the July 4 date that gets mentioned for the first
> sighting of
> supernova a Julian date or has it been converted to Gregorian?
>
> ???
>
> patrick
>
>
> On 04 Jul 2011, at 10:25, Gary Fujihara wrote:
>
> >  Cosmic Fireworks: On July 4, 1054, Chinese astronomers observed a
> "guest star"
> in the constellation Taurus, the result of a star exploding or going
> Supernova.
> At mag -6, SN1054 (Supernova of 1054) became about 4 times brighter
> than Venus,
> was visible in daylight for 23 days, and lasted a period of two
> years. Today we
> can still see remnants of SN1054 as the Messier Object 1 (M1) Crab
> Nebula.
> >
> >  http://bigkahuna-meteorites.com/_M1.jpg
> >
> >  Oh, and for those terrestrially bound in the USA, Happy Fourth of
> July!
> >
> >  Gary Fujihara
> >  Big Kahuna Meteorites (IMCA#1693)
> >  105 Puhili Place, Hilo, Hawai'i 96720
> >  http://bigkahuna-meteorites.com/
> >  http://shop.ebay.com/fujmon/m.html
> >  (808) 640-9161
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Re: [meteorite-list] Lahcen Ait Ha and Gary

[mafer]

Well done Said, Aziz, and Ali!


On 12:28:47 am 06/28/11 Said Haddany  wrote:
> Hi List,
> today the story of Gary and Lahcen Ait Ha came to an end ..verything
> is alright and fixed..As he promised,Lahcen Ait Ha has brought back
> Gary`s money to me today. So,Gary show us your smile,please :-)
> So i would like to thank  my Moroccan friends(Aziz Habibi and Ali
> Oulmah) who contributed to solve the problem.. best regards
>
> Said Haddany
> I.M.C.A # 8108
> Morocco
>
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[meteorite-list] Ad: Ebay Auctions

[mafer]

Greetings folks

On a regular note, I have some rare specks on auction if you care to check
them out.

I also have a small collections which does not include specks, but is
micros to thumbnails of good value.


You can see them here:

http://shop.ebay.com/refamat/m.html?_dmd=1&_ipg=50&_sop=12&_rdc=1

Thanks for looking

Mark Ferguson

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[meteorite-list] Ad: Ebay auctions ending this hour

[mafer]

Hi List members
I have some auctions ending this hour.

Have a look:

http://shop.ebay.com/refamat/m.html?_dmd=1&_ipg=50&_sop=12&_rdc=1


Thanks

Mark Ferguson
IMCA#4691

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Re: [meteorite-list] AD: Vintage Petrographic microscope.

[mafer]

Where were you with this for sale 10 years ago..what a nice scope


On 5:40:25 am 06/14/11 "Steve Schoner"  wrote:
> To all,
>
> My friend has a real nice petrographic microscope for sale.  It is
> made with exceptional optics and has first order red, quartz wedge, and
> other accessories in its hard wood case.
> I have a similar hand held vintage scope and these you will find that
> these are superior instruments.
>
> Link:
>
> http://www.thinsections.com/microscope
>
> Steve Schoner
> www.petroslides.com
> IMCA 4470 Founding Member Emeritus
>
> 
> Mom Is 55, Looks 30...
> Her clever $5 wrinkle therapy angers Botox Doctors. Find Out How!
> http://thirdpartyoffers.netzero.net/TGL3341/4df6e66f5ff4f450dbbst06duc
> __
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> hives.html
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Re: [meteorite-list] Illinois, Indiana, Ohio glacial deposits

[mafer]

You and that guy from Alberta Canada should collaborate on a video for
moraine searching



Mark Ferguson

On 4:25:27 am 06/13/11 Dave Myers  wrote:
> Dear List, and Norm,
>
> WOW!
>
> In this thread the only 2 things that has been said that is
> counter-productive for anyone just getting started in the search for
> meteorites is,
> Norm's   disrespectful comments! (for 1)  "This
> is one of those stories with "to good to be true" overtones." 

>     Norm I
> have been on the list for 3.5-4 years, I was brought up and raised to
> be respectful to other people in this small farming town.You
> do not know anything about me...so why would you make a comment
> like that!
>
> The second comment by you is compairing the glacier area of ( NE WA.)
> to that of OHIO-INDIANA)    WHAT???  That is like compairing the
> moon to mars !
>
> Norm, for the past 35 years out of my 51, I have been a amateur
> Archaeologist, I have found over 450 artifacts in 4 counties in south
> west Ohio, I can Identify each and everyone, I have recorded all my
> finds. I have discovered 20 village sites!
>
> And for the past 35 years, I have been an amateur geologist, I can
> Identify the common rock typs that are Igneous, sedimentary and
> metamorphic.
> My favorite rocks to collect are the "one of a kind," metamorphic
> rocks, and the basalts with  subporphyritic texture.(like what is
> found in some achondrites)
> So if i may, let me tell you all about the morianes in Ohio and
> Indiana.
> On top of of the rocks(morians) is 8-10 inch's. of a sandy soil.
> (thats is where after 6 years of searching I found my 1st meteorite
> 4-9-2011)
> There are not that many glacier rocks, But a few, But also since 4-9.
> I found 2 fluted clovis points, in the same mix(there 10-14,000 years
> old). and 40ty other artifacts in this 8-10' of soil.
>
> Now when I walk the hill side it gets very rocky, the soil now is
> only 4-6"deep on the moriane, But guess what in  this rocky
> area is where I found my second banged-up chondrite! (which is
> different from the 1st!) and my third un-fluted paleo point, about 12
> feet away!
>
> Now let me tell you a secret I have discovered after walking these
> rolling hills (morianes) for 35 years. Less  then 10% of the rocks
> even in the rocky areas are brown or black!  What color are  fresh
> chondrites.Black, what color are weathered chondrites,
> "BROWN"
>
> So to  all new meteorites hunters, If you can spot the brown marbles
> in a bag of mixed multi-colored marbles, you can find meteorites even
> in the rocky hill side of a morianein ohio,indiana, and
> Illinoise that is.
>
> Now back to what I found, yes I am only guessing about there age,
> most of my UNWA stones are slices, end cuts of have very black fusion
> crust on them. What I found looks more weathered, So yes I still may
> be very wrong to there age.
>
> Also the glacier ice was 2-5 miles high, the bull-dozer moriane piles
> are at the bottom of the ice, How long did it take the ice to build
> befor its advance south, 100,150,000,YEARS? how many meteorites were
> traped in the ice during that time frame.  ?  So Norm, I was not
> talking about the meteorites on the ground before the glacier came, 
> But common sense tells me that any meteorites IN THE ICE, when the
> ice melts, WILL BE ON TOP OF THE MORIANE.
>
> NOW FOR THE "ID" COMMENTS!
>
> 20 DEALERS ON HERE SALE, unwa-chondrites, I have got them and other
> meteorites from 4 of you. (they are 100%) gurenteed to be meteorites?
>
> So for what I know about rocks, in my area, and the pictures of what
> you all sold me,  know that they are real meteorites!
>
> Now, after 6 years of searching for meteorites, only after 4-9-2011
> Have I found 2 stones that, look like chondrites. There is now doubt
> that are both chondrites. There are "NO OTHER ROCKS ON EARTH, THAT
> LOOK LIKE a L or H chondrite!  so they do not have to be ID, but yes
> they do need to get classifide.
>
>
> Wow, I cannot waite to here the comments after I post photos of my 3
> possiable achondrites I found on the same glacier morian. LOL
>
>
>
> Here are photos of the glacier moraine I am hunting, The 1st 4 photos
> are the more rocky hill side, the other photos are the top of the
> morine that have little rocks showing where I found the 1st meteorite
>
>
> http://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.233863486630644.81086.102
> 09843157&l=601eb88043
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>  
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>  
>
>
> - Original Message 
> From: Norm Lehrman 
> To: Dave Myers 
> Cc: "meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com"  tral.com>
> Sent: Fri, June 10, 2011 9:08:35 AM
> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Illinois, Indiana, Ohio glacial deposits
>
> All,
>
> I fear this thread may be counter-productive for any that are just
> getting started in the search for meteorites.  The glacier angle is,
> in this case, thin ice.  First, Antarctica is a very special case: 
> in general glacial morai

[meteorite-list] Ad

[mafer]

I have listed some of my little rare micros on ebay as well as a small
collection of extras I has.

Need to generate a little money until I find employment again.

Thanks for looking

http://shop.ebay.com/refamat/m.html?_dmd=1&_ipg=50&_sop=12&_rdc=1



Mark Ferguson

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Re: [meteorite-list] 99 Luft-bottles - sitting in my cabinet drawer

[mafer]

I use vials too, but because I don't have a display cabinet, I keep them in
cigar boxes.


On 2:47:03 am 04/29/11 Michael Gilmer  wrote:
> Hi Martin,
>
> Thanks for the kind words.  Now that you mention it, it is sort of
> "steampunkish", I like that.  :)
>
> Unfortunately, nobody ever gets to see this collection of vials.  The
> drawers stay hidden inside my specimen cabinet.  At one time, I had
> the little vials out on a display shelf, and I loved how that looked.
> But, over time, the number of vials grew beyond what the little shelf
> could hold.  I would have installed another shelf, but now that my
> grandson turned two, I figured it was best to pick them up and keep
> them stored safely away - out of his curious reach.  All it took was
> for me to imagine him bumping into the shelf and dozens of little
> glass vials falling onto the floor and breaking, with hammer falls and
> exotic crumbs scattered all over the room.  LOL
>
> Best regards,
>
> MikeG
>
> --
> -
> Galactic Stone & Ironworks - Meteorites & Amber
>
> Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com
> Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone
> News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516
> Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone
> EOM - http://www.encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com/collection.aspx?id=156
> 4
> --
> --
>
>
>
> On 4/28/11, Dark Matter  wrote:
> >  Hi Mike,
> >
> >  The bottles and corks makes me think of what happens when a 21st
> >  century meteorite collection collides with a steampunk enthusiast.
> >
> >  A great retro display!
> >
> >  -Martin
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >  On Thu, Apr 28, 2011 at 6:52 PM, Michael Gilmer
> >  wrote:
> >
> >>  Hi List,
> >>
> >>  I finished converting my micromount storage from 3ml glass vials
> >>  to 5ml glass vials - the latter have a larger storage capacity
> >>  and have a wider neck to accomodate larger fragments.  I keep
> >>  most of my tiny frags, crumbs, and dust in these glass vials.  As
> >>  of now, I have 2 drawers filled with about 48 bottles each - this
> >>  holds the majority of my micromount inventory.  On average, each
> >>  vial will hold about 2-5g of material, depending on the size of
> >> the fragments.
> >>  I like these small bottles because they are air-tight, compact,
> >>  and they let me see the contents at a glance.  I also like the
> >>  "old school" look of glass with corks.
> >>
> >>  On the right is the NWA drawer, which holds all of my NWA micros.
> >>  On the left is the drawer that holds named finds and falls (or
> >>  non-NWA Saharans)
> >>
> >>
> >
>
>
> --
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[meteorite-list] (AD) Ebay Auctions

[mafer]

Greetings List
I have some aution ending really soon, check them out here:
http://shop.ebay.com/refamat/m.html?_nkw=&_armrs=1&_from=&_ipg=50&_sop=12

Mark Ferguson


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[meteorite-list] Ad

[mafer]

Should you be interested, I have some auctions ending today and can be seen
here:


http://shop.ebay.com/refamat/m.html?_nkw=&_armrs=1&_from=&_ipg=50&_sop=12

Thanks
Mark Ferguson

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[meteorite-list] AD:Auctions Ending Tomorrow

[mafer]

Greetings list.

Check out my auctions if you are interested

http://shop.ebay.com/refamat/m.html

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[meteorite-list] OT: I have always said, "show me the bones"

[mafer]

http://www.palaeo-electronica.org/2009_1/149/index.html

This article explores a very good sampling which will put an end to the K-T
boundary impactor theory.

I have said all along, show me bones just below or at that boundary, but no
one has. The best evidence was some 15 cm below and that was tracks. Fossil
bones seem to fall off the rock record meters below the K-T boundary. This
does support some "experts" who find decreasing species count towards the
end of the Cretaceous. Instead, we find bones well above the K-T boundary
and well within the reach of the "predicted" blast and flash from the
impactor. No need for nuclear winter thoughts here like might be presented
for China.


It is because of all the other "experts" (almost all of whom are not
palaeontologists, and many are in fact, astrophysicists! who know nothing
at all about dinosaurs or fossils and used micro-marine fossils and
calculations to substantiate their claims) that all the world now believes
a large impactor killed off all the dinosaurs.


This my friends is a prime example of camp science.
Where people divide themselves into camps to support what "must be the
answer", without mind you, a concerted effort by all members to present a
cautious and responsible accounting to the general populace. Even though
there were very real and solid science behind those that found no evidence
to prove an impactor killed all the dinosaurs off, the world was convinced
by non-palaeontologists that the impactor did kill them off.

Let us hope that follies like this happen no more, because egg on the face
of world class scientists just helps those who believe in young earth.


Thanks

Mark Ferguson


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Re: [meteorite-list] Not Weston?!

[mafer]

wrong image by an uninformed reporter who took lots of photos?
Doubt that is an H4

On 11:58:41 am 01/18/11 drtanuki  wrote:
> Dear List,
>   It appears that this is not Weston as labeled;maybe not even a
> meteorite?
> http://www.thedailyweston.com/news/weston-meteor-was-almost-lost-scien
> ce
>
> Comments anyone?
>
> Dirk Ross...Tokyo
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Re: [meteorite-list] Paleogene Dinosaurs ???

[mafer]

guess that shoots down a lot of ideas about that K-T boundary event that
killed dinosaurs with fire storms and blast waves.



On 2:34:16 pm 01/15/11 "Paul H."  wrote:
> A new paper about the direct dating of dinosaur bones,
> has been published online in advanced of its publication
> in “Geology.” It is:
>
> Fassett, J. E., L. M. Heaman, and A. Simonetti, 2011, Direct
> U-Pb dating of Cretaceous and Paleocene dinosaur bones,
> San Juan Basin, New Mexico. Geology, first published
> on January 5, 2011,  doi:10.1130/G31466.1
>
> http://geology.gsapubs.org/content/early/2011/01/05/G31466.1.abstract
> http://geology.gsapubs.org/content/current
>
> Based on such dating, they argue that within the area of what
> is now New Mexico, dinosaurs survived the K-P impact and
> became extinct within the Paleogene.
>
> Yours,
>
> Paul Heinrich
> __
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Re: [meteorite-list] You may want to check out this auction!

[mafer]

And only $81.00 for shipping!!! What a deal from "The Vortex Man"


On 1:13:30 pm 01/12/11 Adam Hupe  wrote:
> Wow, they are smoke and pet free.  I bet museums will be scampering
> to get one. He stated, "don't be fooled by imitations."  It is kind
> of like saying if you eat one hamburger, you can have another one
> free or if you don't know where you are going, you could end up
> somewhere else.  It reminds me of the infamous "Galaxy Meteorites".
> I thought some of the auctions houses were pretty descriptive but
> this guy's Sedona-Arizona, UFO, Alien, Red, Rock Votex, Stone Geodes
> take the prize.
> Best Regards,
>
> Adam
>
>
>
>
> - Original Message 
> From: John Teague 
> To: Meteorite List ; Rock Hounds
> I ; Rock&Fossils  roups.com>
> Sent: Wed, January 12, 2011 4:13:20 AM
> Subject: [meteorite-list] You may want to check out this auction!
>
> I did not want to be the only one that had a shot a getting these!
>
> Sikhote-Alin Meteorite Basic Information
> http://cgi.ebay.com/Sedona-Arizona-UFO-Alien-Red-Rock-Vortex-Stone-GEO
> DES-/330518468773?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4cf46f98a5
>
>
> John in even snowier Knoxville
>
>
> __
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Re: [meteorite-list] Happy holidays!

[mafer]

Merry Merry and Happy New Year


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Re: [meteorite-list] Missle or Aircraft Controversy Resolved?

[mafer]

even old missiles like the Nike left the launch rail at multi-mach
speeds...the chances of an ATC seeing it long enough to think it might be a
problem are slim since it would have been at a close to vertical climb. The
military would have been instructed to just ignore or watch it, depending
on their individual functions. Since it looks like it might have been off
Point Magoo, I'd suspect it was a Navy test shot.




On 8:48:30 pm 11/10/10 "Galactic Stone & Ironworks"  
wrote:

> Hi List,
>
> If this was truly a ballistic missile, wouldn't it show up on the
> radars of every air-traffic control tower and weather doppler for
> hundreds of miles around?  It doesn't seem like an epic investigation
> to reconcile the known air-traffic in the area at the time and any
> radar signatures that were detected.  A plane and a missile would have
> very different flight paths, so it should be relatively easy (for
> qualified persons) to determine what it is.
>
> Let's pretend this contrail was a bolide trail instead.  Where is the
> nearest doppler station?
>
> Best regards,
>
> MikeG
>
> --
> Mike Gilmer - Galactic Stone & Ironworks Meteorites
>
> Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com
> Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone
> News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516
> Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone
> Meteorite Top List - http://meteorite.gotop100.com
> EOM - http://www.encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com/collection.aspx?id=156
> 4
> --
> -
>
>
>
> On 11/10/10, Count Deiro  wrote:
> >  Dear List,
> >
> >  Those of us who insisted the subject trail was from a missle
> >  appear to have some heavy duty support.  This has just been
> > released internationally.
> >  But Doug Richardson, the editor of Janes Missiles and
> >  Rockets, examined the video for the Times of London and said he
> > was left with little doubt.
> >  "Its a solid propellant missile," he told the Times. "You can
> >  tell from the efflux [smoke]."
> >
> >  Richardson said it could have been a ballistic missile launched
> >  from a submarine or an interceptor, the defensive anti-missile
> >  weapon used by Navy surface ships---
> >
> >  Regards,
> >
> >  Count Deiro
> >  IMCA 3536
> >
> >
> >  __
> >  Visit the Archives at
> >  http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html
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> >
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Re: [meteorite-list] Not a missile -- a jet contrail

[mafer]

Naw, Meg W.

On 6:19:35 pm 11/10/10 Ted Bunch  wrote:
> Not a meteorite, Nancy Pelosi.
>
> Ted
>
>
> On 11/10/10 10:55 AM, "Chris Spratt"  wrote:
>
> >  Probably a fed up meteorite leaving Earth for the Moon or Mars.
> >
> >  Chris. Spratt
> >  Victoria, BC
> >  __
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>
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] BLM and Forest Service Maps...

[mafer]

I can only agree...it's a black market around the world


On 5:40:17 pm 11/04/10 michael cottingham  wrote:
>
> Hello,
> I live with the Gila National Forest starting in my backyard and know
> very well the policies the Forest Service and BLM use in map revising.
> Starting about 30 years ago all government agencies were directed to
> delete every archeological and historical site OFF the maps where ever
> possible. Old trails going to cliff dwellings and archeological sites
> were left off the maps starting in the late 70's. Trails were rerouted
> away from sites as well. Looting and mindless destruction of these
> sites were the reasons. One way to find these sites is to find OLD
> Forest Service maps from the 1940's to the 1960's. I collect these old
> maps for my area and it is unbelievable what has been left out.  In one
> map alone...when comparing to a modern map, over 300 archeological
> sites have been omitted!  I am not saying this is badand since the
> world has changed in a lot of bad ways it makes since.
> Best Wishes
> Michael Cottinghamhttp://stores.ebay.com/voyage-botanica-natural-histo
> ry
>
> __
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> hives.html
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> 
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Re: [meteorite-list] AD - shame on you!

[mafer]

I wonder how many of the do-gooders would give a $1.00 bill to the school
if they found it on their lot


just saying

On 2:28:23 am 09/22/10 Pete Pete  wrote:
>
>
> Hi, Steve and List,
>
> Would that apply to municipal roads, too?
>
> My perspective, which will likely be argued wrong, is it's public
> land...
> Cheers,
> Pete
>
>
>
>
>
> >  Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2010 14:20:13 -0700
> >  From: steve.dunk...@yahoo.com
> >  To: tricottetc...@live.com; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
> >  Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] AD - shame on you!
> >
> >  If you have a meteorite found on the school parking lot it belongs
> > to the school! Was the school or local government paid for the
> > stone?schools by law are state land and the state would be the owner.
> >  Give it back to the school. Steve
> >  On Tue Sep 21st, 2010 4:46 PM EDT The Tricottet Collection wrote:
> >
> >>
> >> Dear list,
> >>
> >> I have several specimens with in situ pictures available for sale
> >> or trade: * Villalbeto de la Pena, full slice of 3.3 grams
> >> * Holbrook fragments from 2007 find featured in Meteorite magazine
> >> (~40 grams) * Ash Creek stone of 5.5 grams
> >> * Ash Creek stone of 29.2 grams
> >> * Mifflin crusted fragment of 1.2 grams, found on Iowa Grant
> >> School parking lot
> >> Also 15 shergottites, paired with NWA 2975 (total 6+ grams)
> >>
> >> most pictures here: http://www.thetricottetcollection.com/catalog_m
> >> et.html
> >>
> >> Thank you
> >> A.M.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> The Tricottet Collection of Natural History Specimens
> >> (Minerals, Fossils & Meteorites)
> >> www.thetricottetcollection.com
> >> Facebook: The Tricottet Collection
> >> Twitter: TricottetColl
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> __
> >> Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-
> >> archives.html
> >> Meteorite-list mailing list
> >> Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
> >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >  __
> >  Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-
> > archives.html
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Re: [meteorite-list] Saw Blades

[mafer]

Hi List

I don't often weigh in on subjects, but cutting irons has long been an issue.

The best I've seen cutting any metal, is a bandsaw. And, if money isn't an
object, check out the custom made saws for opal slicing. Might be an answer
in those for quantity cutting with a little modification.


Mark Ferguson



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Re: [meteorite-list] Fwd: New Lunars

[mafer]

good for rock collections, what a diverse range of rocks. sure didn't see
anything that came from beyond the surface of the earth though.


On 4:43:06 pm 04/23/10 Dennis Miller  wrote:
>
> Wow! I'm not sure where this guy lives, but I would assume that he
> resides close to a river bank!  I have about 18 tons of that stuff in
> my back yard! Ha! Actually I gave Bob Haag a coaster that I made
> out of a river rock that looks more lunar that this fella's stuff...
> We can just hope that a future meteorite fan doesn't get burned.
> Dennis
>
> P.S. If anyone searching in Livingston happens to search the Rock
> Church Cemetery, my Wife would like a photo of F.Hugh Livingston
> And maybe Grace Livingston's gravesite.  They are her Great Great
> Grandparents.  Thanks!
>
>
>
>
>
> >  From: cyna...@charter.net
> >  To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
> >  Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2010 10:34:33 -0500
> >  Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Fwd: New Lunars
> >
> >  On Fri, 23 Apr 2010 08:48:26 -0500, you wrote:
> >
> >> http://uncometeorites.shutterfly.com/
> >>
> >
> >  Well, the guy DOES appear to be a lunar-tic, so he may be on to
> >  something! __
> >  Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-
> > archives.html
> >  Meteorite-list mailing list
> >  Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
> >  http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
> _
> The New Busy is not the old busy. Search, chat and e-mail from your
> inbox. http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?ocid=PID28326::T
> :WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WM_HMP:042010_3
> __
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[meteorite-list] anyone in CO check out the rock that fell from the sky with a woosh?

[mafer]

Just watched the video on MSN and wondered if anyone in CO has checked this
out.


http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp=36147346�

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[meteorite-list] forgot to change the subject line

[mafer]

shows ya what coffee can do vs tea...don't drink coffee so I don't wake up
s fast... sorry for the misleading subject line

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Re: [meteorite-list] L'aigle and other meteorite names... just how do you say it?

[mafer]

http://www.upi.com/Science_News/Resource-Wars/2010/03/19/Study-Climate-stress-killed-dinosaurs/UPI-49171269025560/



Study: Climate stress killed dinosaurs
Published: March. 19, 2010 at 3:06 PM
By STEFAN NICOLA, UPI Europe Correspondent

BERLIN, March 19 (UPI) -- Severe climate change, and not a meteorite, was
the main reason behind the mass extinction of the dinosaurs and other
species 65 million years ago, a new study concludes.


Conducted by scientists from Germany, Switzerland and the United States,
the study takes into account climate, geological and paleontological data
collected during several drillings near Brazos River in Texas.


"We have come up with completely new data that are poised to change the
interpretation of this time in history," one of the scientists, Michael
Prauss of Berlin's Free University, told United Press International in a
telephone interview Friday. "The main reason for the mass extinction were
massive climatic changes that began long before the meteorite hit."


This directly contrasts a study published this month in the journal
Science, which claims that a meteorite crashing into Earth at Chicxulub on
Mexico's Yucatan Peninsula was the sole cause for the mass dying and that
no climate shifts occurred ahead of the meteorite impact.


"These claims have to at least be questioned now in light of the new
findings," he said, adding that the meteorite impact "brought additional
stress into an already stressed system. But it was only the last straw."


Together with Gerta Keller, a paleontologist at Princeton University, and
other scientists from Germany and Switzerland, Prauss concluded that severe
climate change -- periods of extreme warming and cooling coupled with sea
level changes -- started roughly 1 million years before the meteorite hit.


The climate shifts, likely sparked by severe volcanic activity in the
Deccan Traps in what now is India, became more extreme as years passed. The
meteorite impact only worsened an already catastrophic climate, Prauss
said.


Then began Earth's biggest mass dying. The extinction wiped out more than
half of all species on the planet, including the dinosaurs, bird-like
pterosaurs and large marine reptile. It cleared the way for the success
story of the mammals.


If the vast majority of climate scientists is to be believed, humans are
currently facing a similarly crucial junction.


While Prauss didn't want to compare the climate change forecast for the
next centuries to that of the the Cretaceous-Tertiary era, he said mankind
is technically able to survive dinosaur-era-like climate stress.


"Because of his intellect, man is able to adapt to a changing climate," he
said. "But he has to take concrete measures to adapt, to protect himself,
and he has to take them early on before it's too late."



© 2010 United Press International, Inc. All Rights Reserved.


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[meteorite-list] Martian-Fossil-Meteorite-containing-fossil

[mafer]

 
http://cgi.ebay.com/Martian-Fossil-Meteorite-containing-fossil-BV-HC-RBC_W0QQitemZ130365214796QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item1e5a5f504c




inventiveness usually captures someone sometime

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Re: [meteorite-list] Death Star Story - Link corrected

[mafer]

Isn't this a little fun speculating since in all probability all our last
names will be historic nomenclature by the time anything from this object
reaches us?


Of course, it spoils and dashes all the hopes of those hoping for then end
of the world in two years?


Mark Ferguson


On 5:26:06 pm 01/07/10 countde...@earthlink.net wrote:
> Sterling, Larry and List,
>
> So, am I right in assuming that a GRB as close as a 1000 parsecs
> would result in the production of massive amounts of nitrous oxides in
> the atmosphere ...and ...and... we will laugh ourselves to death?
> Guido
>
> -Original Message-
> > From: lebof...@lpl.arizona.edu
> > Sent: Jan 7, 2010 6:46 AM
> > To: "Sterling K. Webb" 
> > Cc: countde...@earthlink.net, meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
> > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Death Star Story - Link corrected
> >
> >
> > Hi Sterling:
> >
> > Thanks for researching that. This is the problem of a press release
> > that is not followed up with what probably actually went on at the
> > actual session where the paper was presented.
> >
> > Larry
> >
> >
> >>  Dear Count, and Listoids,
> >>
> >>  Another story:
> >>  http://www.popsci.com/technology/article/2010-01/star-verge-supern
> >> ova-could-threaten-life-earth
> >>
> >>  And another:
> >>  http://www.spacedaily.com/reports/T_Pyxidis_Soon_To_Be_A_Type_Ia_S
> >> upernova_999.html
> >>
> >>  And another:
> >>  http://www.astronomy.com/asy/default.aspx?c=a&id=8944
> >>
> >>  All taken from the same press release, you will note.
> >>
> >>  And all equally in error about The End Of All Life As
> >>  We Know It. It's a math mistake: "However, Dr. Sion's
> >>  calculations were challenged by Prof. Alex Fillipenko
> >>  who said that Sion had possibly miscalculated the
> >>  damage that could be caused by a T Pyxidis supernova.
> >>  He had used data for a far more deadly gamma-ray burst
> >>  (GRB) exploding 3,260 light-years from Earth, not a
> >>  supernova, and T Pyxidis certainly isn't expected to
> >>  produce a GRB. According to an another expert,
> >>  "A supernova would have to be 10 times closer [to Earth]
> >>  to do the damage described."
> >>  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T_Pyxidis
> >>
> >>  Information about nearby supernovas of the recent past:
> >>  http://science.nasa.gov/headlines/y2003/06jan_bubble.htm
> >>
> >>  The truth is a supernova would be disastrous at 25 light
> >>  years away (not 3260). 50 light years away and it would
> >>  cause some damage, although it's hard to say how much.
> >>  100 light years away and it would be the action movie of
> >>  all time but you might worry that you sat too near to the
> >>  screen. There are two kinds (strengths) of supernovas. For
> >>  the Big One, I'd want to sit further away than the 300 Light
> >>  Year Line
> >>
> >>  But 3260 light years? Fergettabouttit!
> >>
> >>  Now, I can go to bed without worrying about a darn
> >>  Supernova...
> >>
> >>  It's always something.
> >>
> >>
> >>  Sterling K. Webb
> >>  --
> >> 
> >>  - Original Message -
> >>  From: 
> >>  To: 
> >>  Sent: Thursday, January 07, 2010 1:18 AM
> >>  Subject: [meteorite-list] Death Star Story - Link corrected
> >>
> >>
> >>>
> >>>  Sorry List,
> >>>  Here is corrected link re previous Death Star post.
> >>>  Count Deiro
> >>>
> >>>  http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/2795981/Supernova-may-w
> >>> ipe-out-the-Earth.html
> >>>  __
> >>>  http://www.meteoritecentral.com
> >>>  Meteorite-list mailing list
> >>>  Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
> >>>  http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
> >>
> >>  __
> >>  http://www.meteoritecentral.com
> >>  Meteorite-list mailing list
> >>  Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
> >>  http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
> >>
> >
> >
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] new fall RICH friday 13 / 11/2009; ; 21.25 cmt

[mafer]

could there be a "cloud" of objects that Earth's orbit flys through?

On November 15, 5:33 pm michael cottingham  wrote:
> That is Great News  Go Get em!
>
> Michael Cottingham
> On Nov 15, 2009, at 10:22 AM, habibi abdelaziz wrote:
>
> >  hi guys
> >  each time of this year october and november we have a fall,
> >  it look it's a cyclique falls with the rotation of earth in a
> >  precise time and space with a small incertitude of a month,
> >
> >  it fells over rich 20 km north est,
> >
> >  ITS CONFIRMED ?  more news to fallow,
> >
> >  thanks
> >  aziz habibi
> >
> >
> >   habibi aziz
> >  box 70 erfoud 52200 morroco
> >  phone. 21235576145
> >  fax.21235576170
> >
> >
> >
> >  __
> >  http://www.meteoritecentral.com
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> >  http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorites & Competition

[mafer]

I liked the comment about suits siting around a board table like is done
with oil and gold. That is such an one sided way of doing commerce (some
old fuddy siting at a table with his country's flag in his hand agreeing to
pay x dollars for a commodity that he makes so much anyway, he could care
less how it affects those at the bottom of the wage scales, where is the
free enterprise, yet men just like this run our lives. Keeping that
mentality out of meteorites goes a long long way, and dealing with the
principles (those who actually find the meteorites) will do more for
keeping the science and hobby alive than most could see. I find it harsh
and wrong to pay a middleman a high price when he has undercut or misled
the finder. By the same token, without some middlemen, we wouldn't have
many finds and they would have been dumped on the ground as a waste of time
and the strewn field forgotten about.

Keeping things real and in perspective are important.

Mark Ferguson



On November 15, 7:03 pm "Galactic Stone & Ironworks"  
wrote:

> Well said Eric.  I agree 110%.
>
> You said it much better than I did in my reply.
>
> There are two sides to everything, especially in the realm of
> business.  And that is a core issue here - we are not just dealing
> with collecting, science, or trading.   There is a marriage of
> personal collecting, science, and business for profit at work in the
> meteorite world.  Different people are drawn to meteorites for a wide
> variety of reasons.  No single group can represent all of those
> interests.  Speaking just for myself, the IMCA does not represent me,
> but I do appreciate the good work they do to maintain the integrity of
> the market.
>
> I don't like the idea of a bunch of suits sitting around a table and
> contriving reasons to expand their influence.  Whenever that happens,
> the average person is one who ends up losing out.  IMO, the  meteorite
> market polices itself very well.  This List is a good example of that
> fact - despite some of the complaints about some of the personalities
> involved.  If a meteorite is stolen, it is announced quickly on this
> List.  If a trader misrepresents a specimen or pulls a scam, this List
> will hear about it. If the scammer is an IMCA member, then there is
> recourse.  If the scammer uses PayPal, then there is recourse.  If the
> scammer uses eBay, then there is recourse as well.  People who are
> dishonest in their practices are quickly labelled as such and their
> reputations are ruined in this small world of meteorites.   I can
> think of at least 2 major meteorite players who have become "persona
> non grata" during my short time of about 2 years on this List.   In
> addition to this List, we have at least 2 other meteorite discussion
> forums that are active with high traffic - and all of them are
> populated by IMCA and MS members (and a bunch of good folks who aren't
> members of either group).  The same people who are not welcome on this
> List would find themselves unwelcome in those places as well.
>
> I do think the meteorite market needs more consistency and structure,
> but we don't need an invitation-only club to make the decisions.
>
> Best regards and clear skies,
>
> MikeG
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On 11/15/09, Meteorites USA  wrote:
> >  Hi Adam,
> >
> >  I'm curios what you mean by "corporate involvement" when it
> >  concerns meteorites? With regards to the IMCA I am in partial
> >  agreement, and believe they are a good organization, and needed in
> >  this industry. But some restraint needs to be had with regard to
> >  the influence that these types of groups have. Historically
> >  speaking such groups tend to lean toward their own motives over
> >  time. There has been no organization in the history of man that
> >  has not given in, at least partially, to the temptation such
> > influence.
> >  If you mean some sort of sponsorship of certain outreach and
> >  educational programs geared toward teaching children and young
> >  adults about astronomy and meteorites then I'm game. But if
> >  corporate involvement means losing the personality and integrity
> >  of the meteorite world through increased tampering by larger
> >  groups and politically or profit motivated companies who might in
> >  future times limit the publics access to meteorites then I'm not
> > for that at all. This is a slippery slope...
> >  My personal beliefs are that people should have free access to the
> >  knowledge and information that meteorites and astronomy provides.
> >  The word "corporate" to me means restrictive for profit, and an
> >  example would be the corporate mentality of profit before people.
> >  I'm not necessarily referring to monetary profit, but rather to
> >  the increased influence particular groups may have over access to
> >  knowledge and information through the study of meteorites by
> >  individuals and the limited access that some scientific
> >  institutions have applied to certain collections. Collections tha

Re: [meteorite-list] Pitiful excuse for a meteorite hunter Carl Esparza

[mafer]

Mike, I'm unsure what he's hunting, meteorites or vehicles...might want to
look into lowjack or something.

Never can tell, eh?

Mark

On July 17, 5:56 pm Michael Farmer  wrote:
>
> Hello list, I was forwarded an email that Carl Esparza, proud IMCA
> member, sent to some other Arizona residents.
>
> IMCA, do you approve of your members, supposedly the people of the
> highest integrity he, he,he he, stooping to spying on other people? Is
> there any action that can be taken on this matter.
>
> This shows how pitiful some of these people are, too lazy to do their
> own homework, and so deceitful that they will resort to pitiful spying
> on other list members rather than do their homework.
> This type of crap is EXACTLY why you are not welcome.
>
> Take this hint, learn how to hunt meteorites and stop trying to worm
> your way in. It takes work to find a meteorite, not scams.
>
> "Hello, Would any of you fellow Arizonians share with me off-List
> what kind of vehicle Mike Farmer drives. Hint- I have been hunting the
> Benson area Fall and don't know what kind or color of cars to look for.
> I promise to share results if any. Thank you. Carl Esparza
> IMCA 5829
> Meteoritemax"
>
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[meteorite-list] Auctions ending a couple days

[mafer]

I have a few auctions up on Ebay if your interested.

http://shop.ebay.com/merchant/refamat_W0QQ_nkwZQQ_armrsZ1QQ_fromZQQ_sopZ12


Mark Ferguson

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Re: [meteorite-list] Tunguska Questions

[mafer]

Good question Eric

But, in such a location that is forested, or was until the forest was
flattened, I'd suspect that activities by creature would be much less than
the yearly fall of needles and leaves, freezing and thawing, rain and wind.
with rain and wind causing the most relocation or covering up of impactites
and their craters or resting spots.


Mark Ferguson

On May 15, 5:16 pm Meteorites USA  wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> In regard to Tunguska and bioturbation.
>
> Paul H's post on bioturbation brings up an interesting question. The
> first expedition led by Leonid Kulik to Tunguska in 1927 to study the
> devastation and search for meteorites happened 19 years AFTER the
> event in 1908, (He had an earlier expedition in 1921 but wasn't
> successful in reaching the epicenter until 1927).
>
> 19 years is a LONG time for meteorites in the forested and swampy
> environment full of little critters, insects, and plants that could
> bury any stones. How deep can meteorites be buried in 19 years of
> snow, rain storms, mudslides, spring melt, critters, ants, termites,
> and other animals?
> Could bioturbation be one cause for the failed attempts to recover
> meteorites at Tunguska?
>
> You also have to take into account Leonid Kulik's mindset at the
> time. He was thinking that meteorites would be directly beneath the
> blast at the epicenter. Which made sense. Would he be looking for
> meteorites 10-40 miles away from the epicenter? He attributed the
> circular swampy bogs to craters formed by the meteorite impacts,
> which unfortunately turned out to be incorrect. Did he search for
> meteorites only under the epicenter? How far from the epicenter did
> his search area expand?
> Were there other expeditions to Tunguska to search in the 10-40 mile
> ring from the epicenter?
>
> Most scientists believe that the sheer force and energy of the blast
> at Tunguska event vaporized every trace of the meteoroid explaining
> that this is why there are no fragments to be recovered. This
> obviously makes sense, but would EVERYTHING be vaporized?
>
> Take a look at the "accepted" theory of Chixulub and the extinction
> of the dinosaurs. This widely accepted theory is now being
> challenged. Perhaps we should look at Tunguska again, in a new light.
>
> I am just wondering something out loud here about the Tunguska event.
> Yesterday I sent a load of links and questions and surprisingly got
> no response. Come on, this is the largest meteorite related blast in
> recent recorded history. So I'll will ask again.
>
> Is it possible that there are in fact meteorites that survived the
> Tunguska event by being blasted away much further from the epicenter
> than previously thought?
>
> Below is a copy of my post about some questions I had on Tunguska in
> yesterday's post.
>
> ---ORIGINAL POST-
>
> Hi Listees,
>
> Recently there's been more interest in the Tunguska event. More
> scientists are trying to explain it, and some are even looking at a
> lake near the blasts epicenter believing that this is the missing
> crater. http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/6239334.stm
>
> Photo of Lake Cheko:
> http://a52.g.akamaitech.net/f/52/827/1d/www.space.com/images/070626_la
> ke_cheko_02.jpg
>
> A witness in Vanovara (36 Miles SE of the epicenter) said in O.
> Richard Norton's "Rocks From Space"
>
> "The crash was followed by noise like stones falling from the sky, or
> guns firing."
>
> and
>
> "when I lay on the ground I covered my head because I was afraid that
> stones might hit it."
>
> We all know too well that witness reports aren't ideal information but
> useful anyway. But, how would this person know to say that there was a
> "noise like stones falling" unless that were the case? Or did the
> witnesses report become tainted after countless interviews? How many
> times was this witness interviewed?
>
> I know people have searched for meteorites under and around the
> epicenter area. But what if this was a stony meteoroid, and the
> explosion blasted meteorite pieces 30-50 miles away. The devastation
> this explosion caused is evidence that it was one hell of a blast and
> was on par with a nuclear explosion.
>
> YouTube Video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EiXpp-i442s
>
> Donald Yoemans (JPL) states in the History Channel video that this
> blast was 15 megatons of equivalent energy "roughly 1000 times that
> of the Hiroshima blast."
>
> VERY COOL ARTIST RENDERING: http://svidea.us/misha/image/tunguska2.jpg
>
> Photos of Devastation:
> http://astro.wsu.edu/worthey/astro/html/im-meteor/tunguska-photo.jpg
> http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/ad/Tunguska.png
> http://www.wilsonsalmanac.com/images1/tunguska3.jpg
> http://www.world-mysteries.com/sci_tu3.gif
> Artist Rendering: http://aura.gaia.com/photos/34/338910/large/tunguska
> -1.jpg
> Area Map: http://www.world-mysteries.com/sci_tunguska1.gif
> Blast Damage Area: http://www.world-mysteries.com/sci_tu2.gif
>
> When you factor i

[meteorite-list] AD - ebay

[mafer]

I have some auctions up if your interested!

http://shop.ebay.com/merchant/refamat

Mark Ferguson

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[meteorite-list] AD - ebay auctions ending

[mafer]

Dear List Members,

I have some auctions ending this weekend of some cutting specks of historic
and rare falls.

If you would like to check them out:
http://shop.ebay.com/merchant/refamat_W0QQ_nkwZQQ_armrsZ1QQ_fromZQQ_mdoZQQ_sopZ12


Mark Ferguson


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Re: [meteorite-list] West TX slices-big surface area, oriented stone

[mafer]

Greetings All!

I have some auctions ending in a couple hours if your interested

Thx
Mark

http://shop.ebay.com/merchant/refamat




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Re: [meteorite-list] Lucky Canadian Meteorite!

[mafer]

She's a grad student, there's no chance she'll stay good looking once she 
gets her post hole digger degree.
- Original Message - 
From: "Mike Groetz" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: "Meteorite List" 
Sent: Sunday, November 30, 2008 10:22 AM
Subject: [meteorite-list] Lucky Canadian Meteorite!


 What are the chances of surviving atmospheric passage, landing on a 
frozen lake (not going to the bottom) and be recovered and admired by a 
young girl that looks like that?

 Geesh! I'm jealous.
Mike G.



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No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com
Version: 8.0.176 / Virus Database: 270.9.11/1820 - Release Date: 11/29/2008 
6:52 PM


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Re: [meteorite-list] Dealers posting eBay auction announcements

[mafer]

On September 30, 6:48 pm "michael cottingham" 
> There is no way I am going to put a $500.00 specimen out on ebay for
> 0.99 cents, without multiple announcements for the week. I am not in
> the business to give meteorites away for nothing.
>
> I hope this helps some
>
> Best Wishes
>
> Michael Cottingham


That cuts Michael, cuts real deep...:)

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[meteorite-list] spmeone had a great 4th sometime, what a photo!

[mafer]

http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc47/imagineopal/meteor.jpg
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Re: [meteorite-list] Moldavite Update

[mafer]

Greetings Doug and List

There may be a non-destructive test that isn't as costly as a microprobe
for tektites.

XRF was used by the Geology & Archaeology departments at WWU to check a
flake (known artifact) against normally prepard XRF samples for composition
similarities (for tracing the source outcropping of the material that flake
was made of). This proved to be a viable alternative to destructive testing
of artifacts, as long as exact results were not required and a relatively
flat surface could be presented to the XRF and the sample would fit into
the recepticle. It was thought that XRD would also work as well, given the
same restrictions.

Many universities would have these devices, as opposed to those that have
microprobes. And it would be a matter of setting up a database with known
trace elements/minerals and look for the same in the XRD or XRF results.


Just a thought.

Mark Ferguson


 


On July 21, 8:55 pm [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> John G. wrote:
> > Since moldavites are made basically of the same material as green
> > pop bottles, checking the refractive index of a faceted stone
> > wouldn't turn  up anything suspicious...looking for new technology
> > to tell the  difference between the fakes and the real stones.
>
> Hola John, List,
> Not as easy as looking at a Shirokovsky 'pallasite', either, where
> just one fake is well known.  This seems a lot scarier than getting a
> "synthetic" diamond in place of a "real" one since an appreciation of
> history is what makes the glass authentic for the owner, like a
> winning game ball, and for the sake of  science a confidence in it
> being of tektite origin necessary for future ability to study
> composition of a real sample is at stake.
> In the case of tektites, unless you have the ability to make
> non-destructive measurements with expensive microprobes, I guess the
> technique of choice will need to hinge on the difference tektites
> have over  man-made glasses: low water content.
>
> Water has major IR absorbance peaks at 3550, 3425, 3295, 1630 and
> 1455 /cm. An appropriately set IR analyzer at one or more of these
> frequencies ought to be able to able to make a positive
> identification vs. other  glasses (and confirming your refractive
> index wouldn't hurt at all).  While  I've never done these types of
> IR measurements in glasses, it would seem that  all you just need to
> watch out for would be humidity, and to know your sample  path length
> reasonably.  Other tests would rely more on variable criteria
> depending on recognizing characteristics of the fake, sometimes easy,
> but  sometime not. Tektites should yield about 0.001% to 0.03% water,
> with  moldavites a very typical 0.01% (100 ppm).  I don't know what %
> water  recast glass from coke bottles, etc., but I am guessing it
> would be much higher  unless great pressures and long times in the
> casting furnace were  used.  Anyone know the solubility of water in
> glass at melt  conditions?  I'm guessing - 10 - 100 times that
> amount? Saludos, Doug (where the neighborhood streets are still a
> grid of rivers, in  the aftermath of the fight between Emily  and our
> mountains.   Emily lost decisively as her Eye passed 80 km south.)
> It is  refreshing to see water under the USD 50,000,000 bridge we
> just built over the  otherwise dry riverbed.  The collosal "bridge"
> is a copy of the  one in Rotterdam for our inland city nicknamed
> "City of Mountains" nestled in  the Sierra Madre:).
> __ Meteorite-list mailing
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Re: [meteorite-list] WD-40

[mafer]

Hello Nicholas and list

Here is the email I got back from the people who make it.

Dear Mark,

WD-40 does not contain any water.

Best regards,

Eva Zabowski
Consumer Relations
WD-40 Company
__
Now, this isn't an endorsment to use it, or to negate anything already
said. Its just what the maker says.

Which kinda re-enforces the MSDS on the product.

As far as evaporation goes, well, thats a known from deck treatments which
contain parafins (mineral oils) which evaporate in about 18 months
according to the US Forestry Department (I attended a seminar years ago).

So, its also safe to think that opther products may have limited lifespans
if they contain any parafins as well. 


Got some good info going here folks!
I'm happy with the results and will munch on some chocolate cookies as I
digest the info, thanks


Mark Ferguson

On June 2, 6:41 pm Nicholas Gessler <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Some old memories of WD-40 from my museum conservation days.
> But you had better check these out with from source:
>
> It is made from fish oil.
> It contains a lacquer, which remains after the oils depart, which
> might be helpful for meteorite preservation but
> which "gums up" fine lubricating jobs like clocks and watches.
>
> Of course, any moisture that does creep in underneath a lacquer will
> find a most hospitable
> environment for rust.
>
> It shouldn't be too difficult to build an acrylic or plexi enclosure
> from which air might be
> purged and replaced by inert nitrogen.  Nylon fittings are available
> at most hardware stores.
>
> Cheers,
> Nick
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] WD-40

[mafer]

This is interesting and I should address this with the makers then since
the MSDS states that WD-40 is made from naptha and hydrotreated heavy
mineral oil.

It may be the accessory ingredients which are "inert" which cause this
problem.

I'll get back to the list once I have an answer from the company. 
But, I like your gun oil idea also. But am worried about the smell. How
does it react with poly bags and the styrene type storage/display boxes?


Mark

On June 2, 4:59 pm AL Mitterling <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hi Mark and all,
>
> WD40 is basically kerosene but refined. We had discussions many years
> back about this oil for use on meteorites. What was determine back
> then if I remember right, was that some batches of WD40 were OK but
> others batches contained more water in it. People had both good luck
> and bad luck depending if they got a batch with water in it or not.
>
> If it is made from Kerosene then I can understand why it could
> contain water (every burn a kerosene heater? Humidity goes up!). I
> just know that some people who used it had rusting problems with it.
> I personally use Sheath gun oil as it displaces moisture very well.
> It smells terrible but seems to work good. Any oil used SHOULD NOT
> CONTAIN CHLORIDES as those will cause major rusting problems.
>
> Perhaps someone more knowledgeable than me can address this issue.
>
> --AL
>



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[meteorite-list] WD-40

[mafer]

Greetings List

For the longest time now, I have heard that WD-40 contains water and must
not be used on meteorites. 

Well, I got an email about its uses and decided to follow up since its
susposed to stand for "water displacement - 40th formula". Pretty much,
that was the chemist's intentions too!

So, upon aquiring a MSDS for the aerosol, I see that there is indeed, no
water in it. There is a hydrotreated heavy mineral oil, and this is what
may be throwing people off. Hydrotreated oils (according to my chemist here
at the refinery) means that an oil is treated with hydrogen to remove
sulfurs. And it does not involve water.


So my question to all those that say it does have water in it, how does
water displace water?


I believe WD-40 is a possible safe treatment from what I can find out for
meteorites.


Any comments?

Mark Ferguson

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[meteorite-list] Fireball

[mafer]

Happy Thanksgiving List

Just curious if any news of a fireball or meteorite was reported for south
central Kentucky yesterday (Nov 24). 

I was driving west on the Cumberland Pkwy and at 17:56 I saw a fireball,
not terribly large or colorful, but very bright. No noticable smoke trail,
it was getting dark, but saw the extinguish point and a possible "puff" of
smoke like maybe it might have burst. but then the background of storm
clouds obsured everything. 

It did appear to be entering at a very steep angle.
Just wondering if anything has come to light.

Mark

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Re: [meteorite-list] The Soggy-Bottom Boys

[mafer]

Hi List
Hope you guys realize that in the deep south, theres another "gopher" and
hit taint a rodent. Might want to take into account the southern vernacular
so folks don't misunderstand and go after youse for ettin a critter thats
on that thar fedral list.


Kentucki good ol'boy

On November 24, 5:57 pm JKGwilliam <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Mr Freeman,
> I certainly hope you aren't insinuating that your gophers are better
> tasting than those here in the REAL Soggy Boggy Bottom Land.  Our
> fire roasted gophers have been rated "number one" and we have the
> statistics to prove it.  Just ask all of our returning customers.
> We're not trying to make a profit on our BBQd rodents, we only want
> to recover our costs from doing research about preserving and
> documenting gopher villages. Recently, we found out that GV244
> (Gopher Village 244) and GV 251 are probably one and the same.
> However, the truth may never be told because some gopher hunter don't
> report the real locations of their finds.
> Soggy-Boggy-Bottom Boy#2
>
> PS...our soggy bottoms are also rated #1
>
> At 07:55 AM 11/24/2004, David Freeman wrote:
> > Dear List, Soggy-Bottom Boys;
> > I am truly moved by your candor!  Bernd made the point, and you
> > have successfully satirized the foolishness of a couple very
> > non-important issues. I offer a strong heartfelt "BRAVO" to Bernd,
> > Dave, the two Johns, and would like to be on the dapper dan list
> > and share gopher with you all's! ...or at least engage the
> > intellectual stimulating conversationif any arises there
> > delbert! Mine are not any better than u'ns, my river rocks that is,
> > Green River has  soggy bottoms  and wonderfully tasty gophers too,
> > Dave F.
> >
> > JKGwilliam wrote:
> >
> >> I think this gets my vote for "Post of the Week!  Thanks to Dave
> >> for offering to share his Soggy Bottom-Boggy-Bottom meteorites
> >> with us.  I have personally seen these wonderful stones and can
> >> attest to their pedigree...they are real Soggy-Boggy-Bottoms.
> >>
> >> Uh.speaking of that EX of yours Dave.uhdo
> >> you have a phone number for her;-)
> >>
> >> JKG
> >>
> >> At 10:14 PM 11/23/2004, DNAndrews wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> >>>
>  When you think one or more of our list members is a "a little
>  bit off or just plain whacky", then think again when one
>  compares such folks to the seller, buyer and believers of this
> >>> crap.
> >>> I'm usually just a lurker, but all this "Soggy-Boggy-Bottom"
> >>> Meteorite stuff has me in an uproar.  Maybe they want to just
> >>> share a "gopher-on-a-stick" or sing into a can .  It just makes
> >>> me just want to know why exactly they are here on this list
> >>> cramming their crapola down our throat.  Stellar grainswhat
> >>> rock doesn't have those. For any "Soggy-Bottom Meteorites"...just
> >>> come to my house.  I have an entire backyard full of those
> >>> critters and would very much like to get rid of them.  Come on
> >>> and haul them off at NO charge. My EX expected me to landscape
> >>> the backyard with all these Martian and Lunar wonders, but she
> >>> left and...oh wellnever got done.  Now they are taking up
> >>> room for OUR garden and I'll give them all away for free  No
> >>> million-dollars-per-gramabsolutely free.  Get them out of my
> >>> yard and they are yours for FREE  No offer refused...
> >>> Can we get back on track to METEORITES instead of who has the
> >>> best eBay rating and talking about RIVER rocks!?!?!?!?!?!  That's
> >>> exactly what the Soggy-Bottom-Boys are sellingcommon river
> >>> rocks. For me and Bernd
> >>> Dave (Might as well sue me too shisters )
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> __
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> >>> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> __
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> >>
> >
>
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] Elma Status?

[mafer]

fulguritic? given a sighting of a smoking trail and smoldering pieces of
"basaltic" glass with sand inside, sounds like some atmospheric event

- Original Message -
From: Adam Hupe <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2003 2:22 PM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Elma Status?


> Hi Mike, Mike and List,
>
> The Elma material is definitely not a meteorite, so to speak.  It could
> prove to be just as or more interesting to the scientific community.  The
> jury is still out on exactly what this material is or how it was created.
> The initial lab results created more questions than answers. As has been
> reported this material consist of sand incased in a basaltic glass shell.
> The materials in the glass are not separated into swirls so what ever
> created these objects had a huge amount of energy and the glass was
quenched
> very rapidly. Experiments are being conducted to see how these might have
> been created.  We should have more answers by next week.  This is looking
> more like an X-files episode than a meteor sighting.  For now, we are
> keeping an open mind regarding this material.
>
> All the best,
>
> Adam and Greg Hupe
>
>
>
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Michael Farmer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "Mike Groetz" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; "Meteorite List"
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2003 1:35 PM
> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Elma Status?
>
>
> > Mike, forget about this one, there is not a chance in hell that a
> meteorite
> > was recovered there.
> > Mike Farmer
> > - Original Message -
> > From: "Mike Groetz" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > To: "Meteorite List" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2003 12:35 PM
> > Subject: [meteorite-list] Elma Status?
> >
> >
> > > Everyone-
> > >Is this all said and done with or is the jury still
> > > out with any maybe's?
> > > Thanks,
> > > Mike
> > >
> > > __
> > > Do you Yahoo!?
> > > Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software
> > > http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com
> > >
> > > __
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> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
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Re: [meteorite-list] Cool Eisen-shale - Off Topic

[mafer]

you should see the word for RF (radio frequency), its literally a string of
words describing what it is
Mark
- Original Message -
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Cc: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Thursday, July 24, 2003 6:00 PM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Cool Eisen-shale - Off Topic


> Bernd,
>
> Being from the hills myself...my natural dumb-looked-on-my-face response
would
> be something like...
>
> "So, collecting meteorites is like collecting long, but different
German
> words...then trading them on occasion when you have part-word duplicates?"
>
> At least Mark Twain thought so. The German words really are scary looking.
I'm
> always inpressed with anyone who knows more than plane yold inglish like
me.
>
> As always Bernd...thanx for sharing!
>
> John
>
>
>
> > Hi Walter, Bob, Norbert and List,
> >
> > Gotta get this off my chest before heading for the bunk:
> >
> > > The German term would be "Scheinmeteorit" - alles klar ;-?
> >
> > Does this translate back into English like that:
> >
> > "all-clear shining meteorite" ???
> >
> > >  "Schrecklicheschlackestienen" sounds familiar, too,
> >
> > Oh, I see: "shriekly slagstons"
> >
> > > although you won't find it in any dictionary...
> >
> > So let's publish one ... "it's now or never" ...
> >
> > Where have I heard these words before ? :-))
> >
> > Enjoying my first day of summer our vacations here !
> >
> > Off to bed before it's too led ... sorry "late" ...
> >
> > Bernd
> >
> > P.S.: After visiting Germany, Mark Twain once wrote
> > in 1879 about "The Awful German Language":
> >
> > "These things are not words, they are alphabetical processions.
> > And they are not rare; one can open a German newspaper any
> > time and see them marching majestically across the page - and
> > if he has any imagination he can see the banners and hear the
>
> > music, too. They impart a martial thrill to the meekest subject.
> > Whenever I come across a good one, I stuff it and put it in my
> > museum. In this way I have made quite a valuable collection.
> > When I get duplicates, I exchange with other collectors, and thus
> > increase the variety of my stock.
> >
> > From: A Tramp Abroad (by Mark Twain)
> >
> >
> > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >
> >
> > __
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>
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] Gelatinous Blobs found in Oakville

[mafer]

Just like the nerve gas foopah in Utah?
- Original Message -
From: tracy latimer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Thursday, July 24, 2003 4:38 PM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Gelatinous Blobs found in Oakville


> Oh, for Pete's sake... having watched the paranoid delusions develop on
> Zetatalk about "Planet X", and the Natinal Gubbmint Conspeeracee to
conceal
> mind-altering Chemtrails, I hereby stamp this one with the Flying Pig
award
> for Dumbness.
>
> "Government conspiracy coverup -- film at 11."
>
> Tracy Latimer
>
> >From: "Adam Hupe" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >Subject: [meteorite-list] Gelatinous Blobs found in Oakville
> >Date: Thu, 24 Jul 2003 15:01:12 -0700
> >
> >Dear List Members,
> >
> >This might explain Earl from Oakville's email.  Oakville is very much
like
> >"Area 51" according to these reports and it is only 14 miles from Elma.
> >Black helicopters and Biological Warfare seemed to be popular subjects in
> >Oakville.  These are must see web-site links below:
> >
> >
> >http://www.rense.com/ufo/flubber.htm
> >
> >http://www.zetatalk.com/theword/tword05m.htm
> >
> >http://www.chemtrailcentral.com/unsolved.shtml
> >
> >http://www.mt.net/~watcher/blobs.html
> >
> >
> >All the Best,
> >
> >Adam
> >
> >
> >
> >__
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> >[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
>
> _
> Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE*
> http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail
>
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] [Fwd: Apparent Meteorite Lands In Elma High School Lot]

[mafer]

At least it would be close to me this time.

- Original Message -
From: John Gwilliam <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Rob Wesel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Cc: Greg Hupe <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; Adam Hupe <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Wednesday, July 16, 2003 6:40 PM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] [Fwd: Apparent Meteorite Lands In Elma High
School Lot]


> I'd guess that if anyone is working on this "new meteorite" they're not
> going to show their hole card by going public with their plans. Just think
> how nice it might be to work a new strewn field without it becoming a
> circus like Park Forest.
>
> Best,
>
> John
>
>
> At 06:27 PM 7/16/03 -0700, Rob Wesel wrote:
> >Are the Hupes in on this, Elma is their backyard? For that matter it's my
> >backyard too but I'm not very enthusiastic about the story.
> >--
> >Rob Wesel
> >--
> >We are the music makers...and we are the dreamers of the dreams.
> >Willy Wonka, 1971
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >__
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>
>
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] Origin of the Moon& God

[mafer]

Don't you just hate when you get put on the spot like that? Doesn't matter
how much you love them.

Thats why meteorites are so cool, they don't ask questions, just keep them
in a good environment and they last a long time without changing.
Mark

- Original Message -
From: John Gwilliam <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: ari machiz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, July 11, 2003 11:16 AM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Origin of the Moon& God


>
> It's sort of like this.  My wife, who is a business professional,  usually
> comes home from a day of shopping and drags me up to the bedroom to see
the
> new clothes she had bought. Invariably, she will put on one of here new
> dresses, and ask, "Honey, does this dress make me look fat?"
>
> No matter which way you answer the question, it's the wrong answer.  Dead
> wrong.  You see, if I say "yes", then I'm deader than a grasshopper in a
> chicken coop.  If I say "no", then the rest of the day is trashed after
her
> first question fired back at me..."so, what's that supposed to mean?"
>
> Have a Good Weekend,
>
> John
>




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Re: [meteorite-list] Meteoric water?

[mafer]

Most current geology profs state that volcanic action accounts 
for most of earth's water since there isn't other sources which don't leave 
questions as to where other elements went. But of course, these profs can be 
wrong. 

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Howard Wu 
  
  To: meteorite-list 
  Sent: Sunday, July 06, 2003 1:02 PM
  Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Meteoric 
  water?
  
  Sounds alittle like Venus, earth without the moon
   
  HWu"Sterling K. Webb" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
  
  Hi, 
Dave,There is long standing debate as to the source of the Earth's 
waters.Did all this H2O come from interior outgassing, primordial solar 
nebulae,early heavy atmosphere, water delivery by comets? by meteorites? 
and so on.One hears (on this list especially) references to the notion 
that theEarth is essentially made from planetesimals which were 
essentially madefrom asteroidal rubble which were made from... You get 
the idea: that youcan approximate the Earth by just piling up sufficient 
jillions of tons ofchondrites. This is a very common notion in 
cosmology, even today.But if the Earth were nothing but compressed 
chondrites (and irons forthe core), it would have H2O oceans 200 to 300 
kilometers deep, theatmosphere would contain 100 to 200 bars of carbon 
dioxide, the carboncontent of the Earth would be 1000 times greater than 
it is, with a graphitesurface and diamonds everywhere! Doesn't sound 
familiar.Everybody's geological textbook has a reference to a 1950 study 
by Rublythat is the standard source for the notion that the Earth's 
water isendogenous, but what he actually said is that all the proposed 
sources forwater only account for half of the Earth's water.And, 
water is removed throughout geologic time. It is lost by a varietyof 
atmospheric mechanisms (like photo dissociation in the high 
atmosphereand the escape of the hydrogen), so that however much water 
the Earth hasnow, it had to have had more in the far past, which only 
makes the problemworse.Anyway, cosmological geologists are always 
looking for more water fortheir model of the early Earth, so they've 
leaped on the "just a pile ofchondrites" model, with way too much water, 
and assumed that somehow 99% ofit was "lost." Nobody is very specific 
about just how you lose 99% of aplanet's water and dead silent about how 
you lose 99.9% of a planet's CARBONfor which there is no imagined 
removal mechanism whatsoever.Assumptions like these have a way of just 
sort of sliding along fromdecade to decade until everybody accepts them 
as true simply because theydon't think about them anymore.Does that 
help? Or make it worse?Sterling K. 
Webb--David 
Freeman wrote:> Dear List, Geologic Associates;> I came 
across the term "meteoric water" while reading up on pre-cambrian> 
iron formations. Then, there was a relation to more modern/later 
times> meteoric waters.> Does this have any relationship to 
meteorites? Guess I am at maximum> absorption level 
presently.> Thank you in advance for any input,> Dave 
Freeman>> 
_Meteorite-list 
mailing 
list[EMAIL PROTECTED]http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
  
  
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Re: [meteorite-list] Interesting item on eBay web site item#2182222677: Meteorite

[mafer]

I sent the gut a message informing him of his errors and what he needed to
do if he really wanted that kind of money after its been proven to be a
meteorite.
He's just trying to cash in on the recent Ill. meteorite stuff I'm sure,
hoping to catch some unwitting careless person on Ebay.

Too funny really

Mark
- Original Message -
From: Mark Miconi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Tom aka James Knudson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; meteorite-list
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Thursday, July 03, 2003 8:12 PM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Interesting item on eBay web site
item#218677: Meteorite


> Seems this seller could have spent more time paying attention in spelling
> class...or perhaps had one of the teachers check his work. NOTHING says
> UNprofessional more than misspelled words, bad grammar and poor sentence
> structure.
>
> Besides the fact it looks like a lump of coal.
>
> Mark M.
> - Original Message -
> From: Tom aka James Knudson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: meteorite-list <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sent: Thursday, July 03, 2003 1:56 PM
> Subject: [meteorite-list] Interesting item on eBay web site
item#218677:
> Meteorite
>
>
> > Hey List, they just keep getting better! This one has been tested, by a
> high
> > school teacher! A bargain at $15,000
> > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=218677
> > Thanks, Tom
> > The proudest member of the IMCA 6168
> > ..
> > >
> > > Title of item: Meteorite
> > > Seller: dbresky
> > > Starts: Jul-03-03 00:00:00 PDT
> > > Ends: Jul-13-03 00:00:00 PDT
> > > Price: Starts at $15,000.00
> > > To bid on the item, go to:
> > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=218677
> > >
> > >
> > > Item Description:
> > > Found Huron County. In 1964.
> > >
> > > Weight- 3lbs 4.2oz
> > > Hieght- 4 1/2in
> > > Width- 3 1/2in
> > > Diameter- 12in
> > > Color- Dark Brown/Black
> > > Texture- Smooth surface (greasy feel), Very hard like quartzite/metal.
> > >
> > > Also known as Maganite.
> > > Has some Magnetic Proporties.
> > >
> > > Laker High School geology class cut a small chunk off for testing.
> > > Paul Beachy (geolgy teacher) later confirmed it to be a Meteorite.
> > >
> > > Visit eBay, The World's Online Marketplace TM at http://www.ebay.com
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > __
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> > [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
> >
>
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] meteorite-list--------- PSEUDO DEALERS AND PSEUDO JUDGING

[mafer]

Well, psuedo/bona fide dealers, and collection shufflers and trade fanatics,
we're all, on this list interested in meteorites and thats how we should
view it.
Mark
- Original Message -
From: Adam Hupe <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Thursday, July 03, 2003 4:12 PM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] meteorite-list- PSEUDO DEALERS AND
PSEUDO JUDGING


> Dear List,
>
> I guess I must be a meteorite dealer and a used car dealer too.  I have
sold
> over seven of my personal used cars the past few years trying to reduce
> overhead and the headaches of both insurance and maintenance.  I do not
> think this qualifies me as a used car dealer.  Just a thought.
>
> All the best,
>
> Adam
>
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Tim Heitz" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "'David Freeman'" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; "'meteorite-list'"
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sent: Thursday, July 03, 2003 3:52 PM
> Subject: [meteorite-list] meteorite-list- PSEUDO DEALERS AND
PSEUDO
> JUDGING
>
>
> > Hello Dave and List,
> >
> > A dealer is one who sells.
> >
> > My wife said to me in 1997 in Feb. at the Tucson show. It looks to me
> > like they are all selling meteorite to each other are they all dealers.
> >
> > My answer was yes.
> >
> > Dave you must have noticed this too, because you did a cartoon once
> > showing just that.
> >
> > A TRUE DEALER is one who sells, that's it.
> >
> > Part time or full time, classified, unclassified, long term , short
> > term, fair pricing, PRICE FIXING what the market will bear, material
> > prepared, material not prepared, its an open market.
> >
> > Let's not kid ourselves
> >
> >
> >
> > Take Care,
> > Tim Heitz
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of David
> > Freeman
> > Sent: Thursday, July 03, 2003 1:31 PM
> > To: meteorite-list
> > Subject: Spam Alert: [meteorite-list] PSEUDO DEALERS AND PSEUDO JUDGING
> >
> > Dear List;
> > A recent post seemed to repeatedly shuffle my quaff.  How do we
> > classify a dealer and why?   If a person sells a few meteorites for
> > money to buy more meteorites to add to his collection, is that a dealer?
> >
> >   If a person like myself who sells a kilo or two a year to promote the
> > hobby and make a buck (not much more than that) is that a dealer?  Do we
> >
> > have to make a living, or a substantial part of our income from
> > meteorites to be judged a true dealer?  Seems to me that anyone who
> > "deals" is a dealer.  Suppose in the old times to some of us, sell three
> >
> > and get the forth one for free.
> > Any comments welcomed.
> > Works for me,
> > Dave Freeman
> > (no big deal)
> > WMA sales professional of the year
> >
> >
> > __
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> >
> >
> >
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>
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Re: [meteorite-list] Dealer Refunds

[mafer]

Hi Walter and List

This thread has been a great topic to help define and refine selling
practices. I personally like giving a few days for the person to examine the
item, but a month, and things become too dicey. The topic also allows
dealers to view and review the thought processes that protect sellers best
in just such situations, without harming customers down the road. In all,
the market place should become more sophisticated and safe for both seller
and buyer when such practices are put into place. There will always be the
buyer who feels cheated no matter what you do. Small minds just can't
comprehend some things like market swings, so we deal with them the best we
can. If this means we loose that customer, maybe they shouldn't weren't
meant to be anyway, and some dealer will be the focus of their displeasure.
Most dealers will suffer this sometime. Threads like this give the arguments
needed to defend one's actions.
Mark

- Original Message -
From: Walter Branch <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Saturday, June 28, 2003 12:06 PM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Dealer Refunds


> Hi List,
>
> Not me either (#498)!
>
> The more I think about it, under the circumstances which Steve described,
no
> way would I refund this person.
>
> This has been a thought provoking thread for me.  It has made me think
hard
> about a recent transaction I have had.
>
> -Walter
>
>
> --
> www.branchmeteorites.com
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Rob Wesel" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sent: Saturday, June 28, 2003 2:13 PM
> Subject: [meteorite-list] Dealer Refunds
>
>
> > I started to suggest the refund was a good idea, then further thought
> > changed my mind. The instigation for that change of thought was Park
> Forest.
> > If one buys a meteorite when it first comes out, that is part of the
what
> > you are buying...hype. To be the first kid on the block with a new
> meteorite
> > comes with a price. It was worth $30 per gram in the first week, the
> market
> > said so. Half that now well too bad, the drop in price was inevitable.
> >
> > Steve worked his ass off in Park Forest so just, just, don't
> >
> > I think is about time this dealer/buyer stands up for him/herself and
> > submits some sort of explanation.
> >
> > A strong, and plausible, assumption has been made by Gregory below and I
> > would hate for it to be incorrect. It could ruin someone's reputation.
> >
> > So, to the buyer of Steve's material, cowboy-up now and stop the
> > predictions, others could be hurt by your cowardess.
> >
> > If you stay silent, then only 500+ people on the list are going to have
to
> > say "it's not me".
> >
> > In closing...it's not me...499+ to go.
> >
> > --
> > Rob Wesel
> > --
> > We are the music makers...and we are the dreamers of the dreams.
> > Willy Wonka, 1971
> >
> >
> >
> > - Original Message -
> > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > Sent: Saturday, June 28, 2003 10:39 AM
> > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Re: Dealer Refunds
> >
> >
> >
> > So, Steve.the question we're ALL naturally wondering about:
> >
> > From the extant pieces of this jigsaw puzzle, we know that the customer
in
> > question is a "pseudo-dealer", and is always complaining when/if the
price
> > of meteorites fall.   I suspect most listees might be able to think of
> > someone on the list who qualifies on both counts.  Despite the lack of
> class
> > evident from the original refund request, it would also probably be
> > problematic for you to deliberately compromise this person's
> > anonymity.so if you don't post something to tell us we're wrong,
we'll
> > assume we're right.;-)
> >
> >Gregory
> >
> >
> >
> > __
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>
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Re: [meteorite-list] Expensive?

[mafer]

Hello Steve and List
While not being any where near even a good and knowledgeable 
collector yet. I do notice things, and the 10% increase in collectors over a few 
months has been born out on Ebay alone. I have been selling opal on Ebay since 
97, and although not real active right now, saw sellers increase from 5, back 
then, where I was listing a full 1/4 of the opal rough seen on Ebay, to well 
over 75 dealers off and on. Many of whom are past customers. The markets tend to 
create themselves when theres a hobby involved (or a fad, for those who read 
business rags) and when you add the daily increase in internet users, 
meteoritics can see possibly 2-3 new collectors every two months or less( I 
would see a new opal buyer about once a month year round). You will also see 
there is a definite cycle to spending on Ebay. The summer being a slow period 
for opals anyway, and prices for more common meteorites could nose-dive and 
people expect the rarer types to follow suit.
Theres a lot of hub-bub about whats coming out of the White 
House regarding economics, and much will affect the little guy. Haven't seen a 
program in the last 30 yrs that didn't cause the little guy to hold on to his 
pennies just a little bit harder each time one was announced. Once the fod from 
on high is in effect and people figure ways to live with or around it, prices 
will change due to new hobbyists and surplus money. Of course, theres always 
surplus money where its hard to stop horticulturists of certain plants that have 
a high resale value and collections are a great way to launder and invest money 
without tax people seeing it.
 
Mark
 
 

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  
  Sent: Thursday, June 26, 2003 11:32 
  PM
  Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] 
  Expensive?
  Sterling asked:    The interesting 
  question is: how much longer will a general declinein meteorite prices 
  continue? Is it a lull? A temporary dip? Are-adjustment? A momentary 
  oversupply? A slide? Was there a "bubble"? Isthis 
  "normal"?***Hello List,I was told that Glen 
  Huss sold out when he did, back in the 1980s, because he, as the foremost 
  expert in the field of marketing meteorites at the time, was confident that 
  the market had reached it's peak and couldn't go any higher.I agree 
  with Adam, add 10% growth (not to mention 100% or 1000% growth) to the number 
  of active collectors and watch the demand outpace the supply very 
  quickly.  The reason prices have been falling in the last 3 or 4 years is 
  that the supply increased 1000% a year compared to probably a flatline in the 
  demand side.  I actually am surprised that prices haven't dropped 
  lower.  Will the values rise in the future?  Who knows, 
  probably.  Will they go lower before going higher?  Who knows, 
  maybe.  But maybe not.  Ask me in 5 years and I will be in a better 
  position to tell you.Steve Arnold 

[meteorite-list] While on the subject of pricing

[mafer]

Hi List

Was wondering, if there is so much Hoba around, why is it sp pricey? Is most
of it locked up in museums and not available?

Thanks
Mark



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Re: [meteorite-list] Pasamonte ("corkscrewing" meteorites)

[mafer]

Hi Steve and list

Not being familiar with aerodynamics and such, I can't speak with authority,
but can pose the question of that caused by the "wash" of the item traveling
through an atmosphere. If anyone has ever seen a rocket launched (the
smaller ones such as I worked with years ago, nike hercules), they often
have a convoluted and twisted trail simply from the speed at which they
travel through the atmosphere and the resulting remix of atmosphere behind
them (because of the displacement of air). This effect is often seen in wind
tunnel tests which is done on purpose using smoke to better see the tail
wash and turbulences cause at higher velocities.
Just a idea
Mark
- Original Message -
From: Steve Schoner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Marco Langbroek <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; meteorite list
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, June 16, 2003 9:13 AM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Pasamonte ("corkscrewing" meteorites)


> Well then, if meteors cannot corkscrew what about
> those that appear to break off and change direction
> slightly in the lumionous phase?
>
> If they can do that, then corkscrewing caused by a
> flat surface spiraling in the same phase is not out of
> the question.
>
> I am certain that I read in some of the Nininger notes
> that the Pasamonte fireball did appear to "corkscrew"
> and it was not the train, but the fireball itself.
>
> Steve Schoner/AMS
>
>
>
> --- Marco Langbroek <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
> >
> > - Original Message -
> > From: "Steve Schoner" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >
> >
> > > I think that a person took a famous photo of the
> > > Pasamonte fireball as it was happening with a
> > camera.
> > > According to him, and Nininger who reported it, it
> > > corkscrewed in flight.
> > >
> > > Steve Schoner/AMS
> >
> > Hi Steve and others,
> >
> > I am not convinced by the Pasamonte photograph, as
> > it is pertinent to know
> > how this photograph came about. At first, it is
> > likely that this photograph
> > does not show the Pasamonte fireball as is assumed,
> > but rather the extremely
> > bright persistent train it left. This was argued in
> > 1950 by C.C. Wylie in
> > Pop. Astronomy, for good reasons.
> >
> > The photograph was taken by a ranch foreman. He was
> > inside the house when
> > allerted by a bright flash outside. He picked up his
> > camera, went outside to
> > a spot with clear view, and took the picture. He
> > actually opened the shutter
> > while still walking.
> >
> > I want to point out:
> >
> > 1. That it is clear that this thus is a picture that
> > was not taken from a
> > steady tripod, but with a handheld moving camera
> > with the shutter opened
> > while the camera was moved. Hence, the corkscrew
> > appearance in the picture
> > is at least partly, if not whole, an artifact of the
> > camera movement while
> > the exposure was made;
> >
> > 2. Given the sequence related, it is likely that it
> > pictures the bright
> > persistent train rather than the fireball itself.
> >
> > - Marco Langbroek / Dutch Meteor Society
> >
>
>
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[meteorite-list] Its My Day

[mafer]

Hi List

Just have to do a little bragging today, hope I don't or didn't snipe
someone's special day and I appologize in advance if I did. But just have to
let you great people know that I graduated today (took my 1st college level
class in 1976) with a Bachelors in Geology. No need for replies or gifts.
Just being able to share it with people I wish to associate with is prize
enough. Of course, if anyone happened to have a opening for an entry level
position, I am looking for employment.
Mark



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Re: [meteorite-list] Ot ebay reporting?

[mafer]

Just a side note to legal animal parts. One of the parks, might be in Nambia
but it just excapes me right now, has had a program to eliminate the killing
of elephants and rhinos by tranqing them and cutting off horns and tusks,
there by, keeping the animal from being killed by poachers. This also serves
as a source of income for the park.
Mark
- Original Message -
From: Sterling K. Webb <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: David Freeman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Cc: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>;
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, June 13, 2003 5:14 PM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ot ebay reporting?


> Hi,
>
> You will note that nowhere in her listing does the seller claim that
she
> is selling elephant ivory, only "ivory." Ivory, of course, is any
mammalian
> tooth that's big enough to bother with. Since these pieces are 34mm in
> diameter, it could be any critter with teeth that big.
>
> The sale of elephant ivory is legal in the US if the ivory was
imported
> before the ban commenced on 01-01-1973. I recently purchased a piece of
> "legal" elephant ivory on eBay, a slab 1/8" x 5/8" x 4-1/2", for $16.50.
It
> came with papers like a pedigree dog, xerox of the import permit (with
> date), affidavits from transferring sellers, the cutter, etc., all ready
for
> me to wave in the face of the Feds when they bust down the door with their
> no-knock warrant, searching for pachyderm teeth.
>
> Walrus and especially mammoth ivories, which is by definition "fossil"
> ivory, are much more expensive for some reason ($40 and $100,
respectively,
> for a piece the size mentioned above). Whale ivory would be more expensive
> if you could find it.
>
> My guess is that the eBay seller is pitching water buffalo ivory,
which
> is cheap, plentiful, not endagered as a species, and easily obtainable in
> Australia.
>
> So, what did I buy "real" ivory for? Not for a decorative purpose nor
an
> embellishment. I cut a bridge saddle for a super rare high quality guitar.
> (The bridge saddle is that little strip of material the six strings rest
> over before they are pinned down to the bridge; it and it alone transfers
> the string sound to the face of the guitar, and nothing does that job like
> ivory.) I even managed to use only half of the piece of ivory, so I have
> enough left over for another bridge saddle, if I ever find another guitar
> good enough to deserve it.
>
>
> Sterling K. Webb
> --
--
>
> David Freeman wrote:
>
> > Dear List;
> > Yup, antique, and/or pre early 70's is pre embargo (think it was 73).  I
> > have some.
> >
> > I seem to remember in the news in the past month or two that certain
> > African nations are again able to sell (through government outlets) new
> > ivory.  The logic (through the UN...the most logical entity I
> > know...Not), decided if the elephants were already poached and the ivory
> > (numbering in the thousands of tons) was already harvested and the
> > crooks paid with their lives that it was ok for the starving country to
> > sell the ivory to help them out, instead of burning the large warehoused
> > collections.   I want to think that some of the moneys generated were
> > earmarked to go back in to protection and game preserve work.
> > Now if you want ivory, get some of the Mammoth ivory, or Walrus or other
> > "old" ivories that can be had rather reasonably.
> >
> > So, depends when it was harvested and where
> > .
> > Dave F. (who was really honored to carve a small piece of pre embargo
> > elephant ivory.)
> >
> > [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> >
> > >
> > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
> > >
> > >> Is it not illegal to sale ivory on ebay?
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > I believe that there is a "cut-off" date of when the ivory items were
> > > produced.  Since ivory was (unfortunately) a highly popular and
> > > commercial product for jewelry for so long, and so many exquisite
> > > antiques and family heirlooms, etc, existed before international
> > > efforts to ban it came along, I don't believe it is illegal to sell
> > > "antique" ivory.  Only stuff produced since the bans have been enacted
> > > - and I'm not sure exactly when that was.  (But I betcha somebody will
> > > come along momentarily;-)
> > >
> > >Gregory
>
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] Re: Please Unsubcribe...

[mafer]

ahhh, love it, yeah, like you'd really want nwa 869, 267 and 
dofar 020 with a side dish of ghubara, the rest are nibbles

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  
  To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  
  Sent: Tuesday, June 10, 2003 11:17 
  PM
  Subject: [meteorite-list] Re: Please 
  Unsubcribe...
  Michael Blood:
  I have a strange phenomenon wherein I have received onlythe 
posts of Gregory since 2:53 PMYou are now in My 
  Power.  Send me all your meteorites.  
     G 

Re: [meteorite-list] impressed

[mafer]

as long as you don't trip us up and make us divulge obscure and trivial
knowledge that even Ben Stein doesn't know
- Original Message -
From: Tom aka James Knudson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: meteorite-list <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, June 09, 2003 10:42 PM
Subject: [meteorite-list] impressed


> Hello All, one thing that impress's me so much about this list is the
> accumulated knowledge of the list members! It would seem that there is
> nothing that can not be answered by at least one list member on any
subject
> known to man! Whether it is about Avoirdupois or the proper use of the
word
> acute, ect., it just does not matter, someone knows!
> Thanks, Tom
> The proudest member of the IMCA 6168
>
>
>
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[meteorite-list] standards

[mafer]

Hey list, ran across this and thought of those folks here that 
follow space missions. Kinda off topic, but interesting
 
JUST A QUESTION OF STANDARDS 

 

 

 
 
 Does the statement, "We've always done it that way" ring any 

bells...? 

 

The US standard railroad gauge (distance between the rails) is 4 

feet, 8.5 inches. That's an exceedingly odd number. 

 

Why was that gauge used? 

 

Because that's the way they built them in England, and English 

expatriates built the US Railroads. 

 

Why did the English build them like that? 

 

Because the first rail lines were built by the same people who 

built the pre-railroad tramways, and that's the gauge they used. 

Why did "they" use that gauge then? 

 

Because the people who built the tramways used the same jigs and 

tools that they used for building wagons, which used that wheel spacing. 


 

Okay! Why did the wagons have that particular odd wheel spacing? 

 

Well, if they tried to use any other spacing, the wagon wheels 

would break on some of the old, long distance roads in England, because 


that's the spacing of the wheel ruts. 

 

So who built those old rutted roads? 

 

Imperial Rome built the first long distance roads in Europe (and 

England) for their legions. The roads have been used ever since. 

 

And the ruts in the roads? 

 

Roman war chariots formed the initial ruts, which everyone else 

had to match for fear of destroying their wagon wheels. Since the chariots 


were made for Imperial Rome, they were all alike in the matter of wheel 


spacing. 

 

The United States standard railroad gauge of 4 feet, 8.5 inches is 

derived from the original specifications for an Imperial Roman war 

chariot. And bureaucracies live forever. 

 

 So the next time you are handed a spec and told we have always 

done it that way and wonder what horse's ass came up with that, you may be 


exactly right, because the Imperial Roman war chariots were made just wide 


enough to accommodate the back ends of two war horses. 

 

 

 

Now the twist to the story... 

 

When you see a Space Shuttle sitting on its launch pad, there are 

two big booster rockets attached to the sides of the main fuel tank. These 


are solid rocket boosters, or SRBs. The SRBs are made by Thiokol at their 


factory in Utah. The engineers who designed the SRBs would have preferred 


to make them a bit fatter, but the SRBs had to be shipped by train from 


the factory to the launch site. 

 

The railroad line from the factory happens to run through a 

tunnel in the mountains. The SRBs had to fit through that tunnel. The 


tunnel is slightly wider than the railroad track, and the railroad track, 


as you now know, is about as wide as two horses' behinds. 

 

So, a major Space Shuttle design feature of what is arguably the 

world's most advanced transportation system was determined over two 

thousand years ago by the width of a Horse's ass. 

 

 

Re: [meteorite-list] avoirdupois ?

[mafer]

Hi Tom
the use of avoirdupois measure is almost restricted to things other than
rock. What is common is the gram.
1 ounce avoir. equals 28.35 grams, 1 ounce troy equals 31.103 grams. What we
use is grams and kilograms (and of course, some sellers use pounds to help
those who can't quite grasp metric). Now, I understand that the opal dealers
use troy ounces in Australia, and that may be a standard outside of North
America (or better stated as a convention and not a rule) since, as defined
by the gemmological groups, one ounce equals 141 carats for gem weights
(this is a standard now, they decided to round it off to an whole number as
it used to be 141.75 carats to an ounce) and if you multiply 5 carats to a
gram times 28.35 grams to an ounce you get 141.75 carats. So, this standard
leaves out troy weights (which are typically used for precious metals)
altogether.
Thats the history in a nutshell. So, basicly, to make it simple after all
that, we don't use either really, just grams and kilograms and the ounces
are left out of the picture just so there isn't a problem.

Mark
- Original Message -
From: Tom aka James Knudson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: meteorite-list <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Sunday, June 08, 2003 10:28 PM
Subject: [meteorite-list] avoirdupois ?


> Hello List, This is meteorite related, it may not seem to be, but take it
> from me it is! I am so confused, do we use Avoirdupois or what? I was
doing
> a conversion and was given a few choices and do not know for sure? Can
some
> one explain this to me?
> Thanks, Tom
> The proudest member of the IMCA 6168
>
>
>
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[meteorite-list] shameless ad

[mafer]

Hi List

Got some auctions going, mostly very small micros of some rather old and
rare meteorites if your interested.

http://cgi6.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewSellersOtherItems&userid=refamat&c
ompleted=0&sort=3&since=-1&include=0&page=1&rows=25


Thanks
Mark



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Re: [meteorite-list] Park Forest Chondrules

[mafer]

Hi Greg, Steve and List

Most use a petrological microscope. These have built into them a polarizer
and analyzer, a Bertrand lens, a condenser with flip concentrator and
adjustable diaphragm, and a graduated, rotating stage for measuring angles
and a slot for various plates (such as 1/4 wave , quartz wedges ect). These
are the main differing parts for optical analysis from a regular microscope.
There are many brands available, but I understand that some aren't as
desirable as others because of how or what they are built with.

If all your interested in is seeing the crystal structure, you can actually
use any compound microscope (maybe like the one you have) and just add the
polarizer and analyzer which are linear polarizing filters, one goes above
the specimen, the other below and they are oriented at 90 degrees to each
other to provide maximum extinction (darkening).
 I picked up a used and incomplete Vickers off Ebay and restored it to
usefulness by adding the missing parts (not original by any means, the stage
is a zeiss and the lower polarizer is actually a camera polarizer which fit
my lens holder and the abbe condenser I'm not sure of the make off hand). I
think theres only one lens which is a Vickers, the rest are by various
manufacturers and this makes for  a minor problem as each has to be focused
individually. But it works and does what its suppose to do and I was able to
do this for under $250, which I felt was a fair price since used through
dealers once can expect to pay a $1000 or more for a simple petrological
scope and on ebay they usually go for over 400. And new, they start around
5-10k and go up quickly from there.

Hope that helps
Mark



- Original Message -
To: Greg Redfern <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Cc: Meteorite-List <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, May 27, 2003 12:58 AM
Subject: RE: [meteorite-list] Park Forest Chondrules


> Greg,
>
> I purchased a new off brand microscope on e-Bay a few years agp for
> around $260 and using used photographic filters, built my own cross
> linear polarizer. It works well, however the MBC-10 that Michael
> Blood offers on his website as well as Jim Tobin's polarizer are
> definitely on my wish list.
>
> Steve
>
>
> --- Greg Redfern <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > Steve, Bernd. List,
> >
> >  What microscope do you use to view meteoritic specimens? I am
> > looking for
> > recommendations for purchase.
> >
> > Thanks.
> >
> > All the best,
> > Greg Redfern
> > 2003 NASA Solar System Ambassador
> > http://www.jpl.nasa.gov/ambassador/
> > IMCA #5781
> > www.meteoritecollectors.org
> > Meteoritical Society
> > www.meteoriticalsociety.org
> >
> >
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of
> > Steve
> > Witt
> > Sent: Sunday, May 25, 2003 6:07 PM
> > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > Cc: Meteorite-List
> > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Park Forest Chondrules
> >
> >
> > Bernd,
> >
> > I just spent a while at the microscope, (first time since March 26,
> > shame on me), and I'm seeing exactly what you're talking about. The
> > vast majority, (app 90%+) in my slices anyway, have the same
> > orientation. Another thing I'm seeing that's really neat is that
> > the
> > bars in the barred olivine chondrules seem not to be running in a
> > straight line as I'm used to seeing, but rather have a swirl, again
> > following the shock orientation! Gotta get more time at the 'scope.
> > Hope to post a link to some images later.
> >
> > thanx,
> > Steve
> >
> >
> > --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> > > Hello Listees,
> > >
> > > Although the entry in Met.Bull. 87, 2003 says that there are no
> > > visible chondrules in hand sample, one of my specimens from
> > > Steve Witt does have a few easily discernible chondrules. Now,
> > > assuming they are really chondrules, the astonishing thing about
> > > them is that they are all slightly oval and seem to show a
> > > preferred
> > > orientation (as if they were "going with the flow" of the dark
> > > parts
> > > of the matrix material). Any comments?
> > >
> > > Best wishes,
> > >
> > > Bernd
> > >
> > >
> > > __
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> > > [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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> >
> >
> >
> > =
> > Steve Witt
> > IMCA #9020
> >
> > http://www.meteoritecollectors.org
> >
> > __
> > Do you Yahoo!?
> > The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
> > http://search.yahoo.com
> >
> > __
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>
>
>
> =
> Steve Witt
> IMCA #9020
>
> http://www.meteoritecollectors.org
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] New Swiss fall!!

[mafer]

Congrats!!!

I'm sure you have a special display all ready for her!
Best to all
Mark
- Original Message -
From: Julien Courtois <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Saturday, April 12, 2003 1:23 PM
Subject: [meteorite-list] New Swiss fall!!


> Hello all
>
> A wonderfull new fall arrived on earth today April 12th, 2003 08:37 local
> time
>
> Name: Eloïse (Emilie)
> TKW: 3.185 kg
> Composition: about 80% water, otherwise mostly complex carbon chemistry
> Temperature: almost constant 37°C
> Remark: IT'S A GIRL !!
>
> Sorry no trade or sale, we'll keep for us!
>
> Regards,
>
> Julien
>
>
>
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] density????

[mafer]

Hello Tom and list

Calculating the density of a meteorite will only tell you the density of
that meteorite, not what its components are. Most rock types are specified
as to specific gravity, but thats for a pure element, not a composite like a
meteorite or even granite. And thats because a meteorite is made up of many
elements and even the irons will give a density calculation which isn't for
iron or nickel.
Hope this helps somewhat. But its going to leave you asking more questions,
so think on.
Mark
- Original Message -
From: Tom aka James Knudson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: meteorite-list <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, March 24, 2003 2:19 PM
Subject: [meteorite-list] density


> Hello List, is there anyone out there that can tell me how to calculate
> density of meteorites or rocks?
> Thanks, Tom
> The proudest member of the IMCA 6168
>
>
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] new LL3?

[mafer]

Hi Matt and list
Thats a nice one to be sure.
Could you imagine a thin section of it??
Mark
- Original Message -
From: Matt Morgan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Meteorite-List <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, March 17, 2003 8:09 PM
Subject: [meteorite-list] new LL3?


> Hi all:
> Since the list is so quiet, I thought I would post an image of a new,
> possible LL3.??? This is pretty darn nice inside, although it leaves
> something to be desired on the exterior. Isn't beauty on the inside
though?
> Have a look...
> http://www.mhmeteorites.com/images/ll3-high.jpg (700 k)
> http://www.mhmeteorites.com/images/ll3-med.jpg (350 k)
>
>
> ===
> Matt Morgan
> Mile High Meteorites
> http://www.mhmeteorites.com
> PO Box 151293
> Lakewood, CO 80215 USA
> FAX: 303-763-6917
>
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] Re:[meteorite-list]question

[mafer]

Hi Robert and list
I can't comment yet on the polish as I don't believe I have a 
large enough piece or stone that isn't already polished, but I'm getting great 
results on my thin sections with 1000 grit. I use a two part epoxy, they only 
have to be resistant to yellowing and uv degradation and of course, clear. Super 
glue is hygroscopic which means it wants to attrack water over time (unless 
they've gotten a better formula) and it will become brittle and loose adhesion 
(they learned this the hard way in implantable pacemaker assembly).
Opticon is good, but its a tad expensive, as is the uv curable 
epoxies. I currently am trying a clear fly rod 2 part epoxy which seems to give 
good results. It has a added feature in which it is somewhat flexible which most 
other epoxies aren't.
Mark

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  robert jackson 
  To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  
  Sent: Tuesday, March 11, 2003 5:33 
  PM
  Subject: [meteorite-list] 
  Re:[meteorite-list]question
  
  Question 1.  How do the dealers get that 
  great polish on the L 6 stones they sell. I take my slices and go up through 
  600 and maybe 800 then still don't get that great finish. Is it 
  diamond
  Question 2.  I've been making up some thin 
  sections. Using the lap on a facetor. Does pretty good job. Several have 
  come out great on the polarized microscope. But the glues that you use on the 
  slide. Super glue is not so good. Opticon is best so far, any 
  ideas.
  Haven't posted in a long time, Bob Jackson, 
  Riverside.

Re: [meteorite-list] Use of magnets for meteorite hunting

[mafer]

Hi Robert and list

I'm curious about this latent magnetic field. If its anything like that used
for paleomag, of what real interest is it except that the meteorite came
from a body large enough to develope a magnetic field which, if my
understanding of magnetics is fair enough would only tell you the body
developed a field. And this may be debatable if there was enough heat around
the area where the meteorite came from that the field isn't "set in stone"
because of a major impact or something ripped the parent body apart (as may
be the case with irons and mesosiderites and such). If the rock is still
plastic when this occurs, the field is subject to many other factors and may
not even represent the parent body's field anyway.
Mark
- Original Message -
From: Matson, Robert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 'rochette' <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, March 04, 2003 10:41 AM
Subject: [meteorite-list] Use of magnets for meteorite hunting


> Hi Pierre and List,
>
> Here's my take on the use of magnets to search for meteorites.
> If you're a novice meteorite hunter -- by all means use them!
> Hobbling a beginner by removing this basic tool from his
> arsenal is unfair, unrealistic, and completely unnecessary.
> It's hard enough making that first find -- doing so without
> a magnet will just make it take that much longer.
>
> As for disturbing the latent magnetic field of some ordinary
> chondrite, the reality is that no one is ever going to spend
> the money to measure it for your meteorite.  No one.  The
> evidence?  There are hundreds of thousands if not millions of
> recovered meteorites in the world's collections today.  On a
> percentage basis, what fraction of those were found without
> the use of a magnet (well over 95%) and what fraction of those
> have been analyzed magnetically (less than 0.1%)?  The point
> I'm trying to make is that anyone really interested in the
> latent magnetic fields of meteorites has far more material
> already at their disposal than they could ever have time or
> money to test.
>
> That said, I do not believe a magnet is especially useful
> to a veteran meteorite hunter (who isn't searching a known
> strewnfield).  Indeed, as Pierre and others have argued,
> dependence on a positive magnet response may eliminate
> some of the rarer and more scientifically valuable
> specimens.  I still carry one with me, but I rarely use
> it any longer.  My eyes are a better discriminator.
>
> So to me it really boils down to a non-issue.  When meteorite
> hunters are first starting out, they'll use a magnet until
> they have a few dozen ordinary chondrite finds.  Sure, they'll
> magnetically "kill" these finds, but their mounting success
> will eventually wean them from their magnets at about the
> time that over-dependence on them would hurt hunters more
> than help them.  --Rob
>
> P.S.  Perhaps a compass can be used as a "weaning" device?
> It generates a minimal magnetic field, and yet is sensitive
> enough to detect most H- and L-chondrites.
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] Use of magnets for meteorite hunting

[mafer]

Hi Tom and list
But what about those that are covered by surface soil deposited by wind and
water after the fall?
I, too, have not been in a known strewn field, but it seems to me that with
the santa ana's of southern Cal, rocks could both be covered and uncovered
many times over the years.

Mark
- Original Message -
From: Tom aka James Knudson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Rafael B. Torres <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>;
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>;
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, March 04, 2003 3:02 PM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Use of magnets for meteorite hunting


> Hello List, It seems to me, a beginner, that you can use a magnet to find
> the first meteorite then all the searching in the area should be done
> without one. After the first find you would know what you are looking for.
> Then if it turns out to be a strewn field they can test one of the others
> for all the magnetic stuff? If your first find turns out to be the only
one,
> Bummer! I personally like a magnet just because I am to lazy to keep
bending
> over and picking up rocks! ( not to mention the pain in the back by the
end
> of the hunt)
>
> Thanks, Tom
> The proudest member of the IMCA 6168
> - Original Message -
> From: Rafael B. Torres <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>;
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sent: Tuesday, March 04, 2003 3:32 PM
> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Use of magnets for meteorite hunting
>
>
> > Hello Robert, I truly agree with you, right now I dont have 1,800
dollars
> > for a magnet, instead I could use that money for meteorite training,
thus
> > harming the magnetic field history of the first meteorites, but after
that
> I
> > would be able to have more non-harmed meteorites. Even with magnets
> > meteorite searching is difficult for starters like me, so I think I
first
> > need some field training and then I can do it only with my eyes. I think
I
> > have now a good plan for a meteorite expedition, THANKS TO ALL THOSE
> PEOPLE
> > WHO HAVE HELPED ME..thanks a lot Michael¡... =0)
> >
> >
> >
> > =0)
> > Rafael B. Torres
> > Space Collection 2001
> > http://www.geocities.com/rafael_blando
> >
> >
> >
> > _
> > The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months FREE*
> > http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail
> >
> >
> > __
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> > [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
> >
>
>
>
> __
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>



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Re: [meteorite-list] Tatahouine - Pronounciation & MOH Hardness?

[mafer]

Hi Anne, Jeff and list
 
It is by no accident that Luke Skywalker lives on Tatahouine. 
Lucas borrowed the name from that town because they shot the Tatahouine scenes 
near there. So, I would suspect that the pronounciation in the movie would be 
very close to the actual pronounciation if not exact.
Mark

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  
  Sent: Sunday, March 02, 2003 11:11 
  PM
  Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Tatahouine 
  - Pronounciation & MOH Hardness?
  In a message dated 3/2/2003 11:45:35 PM Mountain Standard 
  Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  writes:
  tatar-who-eneNo 
  RJust  TA  TA  OO ENE  (very 
  easy)  :-)Sorry, I don't know about the 
  hardness. Anne BlackIMCA #2356www.IMPACTIKA.come-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 

Re: [meteorite-list] What weather!

[mafer]

Hi David

Weathering is a rating on how bad the elements have been to a meteorite
after it has arrived on Earth. W-0 being no weathering and W-4 being the
worst. Its interesting how meteorites found in different parts of the world
can "weather" so well, while others only need a sniff of moisture and they
start to degrade. But its all relative to the localities climate. Nantans
are bad about rusting (they don't come from a nice dry climate like the
Sahara's do.
Weathering appears, from just what I have read about it, an adoption (and
major modification of), of an effect noted in the late early to mid 20th
century, in volcanic glass. Especially that used for tools by native
peoples. The glass would develope a "rind" which when "calibrated" for local
conditions, could be used to date the tools. The rind developed from
moisture around the glass, (and in extreme cases, devitrification occurs,
but I'm not 100% sure that UV radiation from the sun doesn't also play a
role). So, by noting the amounts of products (like oxides and sulfides, but
not limited to the metals) to parent materials (like nickel and iron), one
can impart a ranking based on the decomposition of the meteorite.
Although I have a few books right here (including Dodd's Meteorites from my
schools library) none go into weathering other than mentioning it.
And so, I hope I've given you a good answer and my information is sound. I'm
confident of the actual rating sequence (0 being least and 4 being worst).
And, since its not used as a dating tool, it can be expanded to be a general
rating world wide.
Mark
- Original Message -
From: David Freeman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: meteorite-list <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, February 28, 2003 9:47 PM
Subject: [meteorite-list] What weather!


> Dear List;
> Could or would anyone like to offer any short explanation of  the
> different weathering grades.  W1 to W 4, which is freshest, and any
> criteria for each?  I am too tired and lazy to hunt up the information
> at the moment.
> Thank you in advance,
> Dave Freeman
>
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] All Stars

[mafer]

Hi Rand

I just want to say that its not wrong to think and act as you do, quite the
reverse really and you don't have to defend your actions. Your moral
convictions speak for themselves, don't they. But, I do have to admire your
support of your wife. I have known a couple ms victims and they didn't
always have the support of their spouse. All these spouses could see was the
loss, not the gain from knowing and living with that person. They would look
back with saddness at what they had..What a shame for them to be sad over a
past that was filled with good times.

Hers to you and your wife for living a good life.

Mark
- Original Message -
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Thursday, February 27, 2003 7:06 PM
Subject: [meteorite-list] All Stars


> Hi everybody.  This is Rand.  No, I'm not a scientist.  I don't work for
NASA.
> I'm not a mathematician. I don't have a collection of meteorites.  I'm not
> wealthy by any means. I'm just a regular, average guy trying to figure
things
> out the best I can.  So far I've spent 18.5 years as an enlisted man in
the
> U.S. Army.  How ironic!  I despise war.  I have a profound respect for
life and
> the environment.  I saw a military career as an excellent opportunity for
me to
> provide for my family.  I served in the war zone, but not as a combatant.
I
> served in a combat support hospital in the Arabian Desert providing humane
> treatment for fellow soldiers and prisoners of war alike.  Recently I was
> almost deployed again. Officials deemed it best that I stay home this
time.  I
> concur with their decision.  My wife, Gina is severely disabled in
advanced
> stages of multiple sclerosis.  She needs me here.
> I'd like to share something with the list.  One night my wife lay in her
bed
> watching television.  Observing the performers on screen she said, "I wish
I
> could be a star."  I responded, "You ARE a star!"  Right now as you fight
this
> disease with all of your determination, You are a star! As you raised our
> children and worked to supplement our income, You were a star! As you
aided
> your parents, their lives dwindling in their twilight, you were a star.
As you
> continue your life, doing the very best you can do, you will continue on
as a
> star!
> So are YOU ALL STARS!  Each of you in your own way!  Here in this list we
have
> people from many walks of life, from countries around the world. Whatever
your
> strengths may be, in each or your distinct assemblage of personality
traits and
> talents, as you do your bestYou are ALL STARS!  I'm honored to be
among
> your associates.  Rand Kluge
>
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[meteorite-list] Look alikes

[mafer]

Hi List
This is very off topic, but funny. I was checking out Mark B's photos and
have to tell you that I hope to be at the Denver show if only to meet
everyone, especially Bill Mason. I am going to get a hat and take my picture
wearing dark glasses and be Bill's double. Our beards are very similar as
well as the general features of our faces and I think it would be fun to see
how many people would get us confused. Bill, I hope you don't take offense,
I'm just very surprised at how we look similar and got a good laff out of
it.
Best wishes
Mark Ferguson



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Re: [meteorite-list] oldest collector

[mafer]

I was up on one of the rivers feeding into the Frasier River in Canada last
summer and found a chunk of rock that for about an half hour had me thinking
it might be a meteorite, that is til I found a whole ledge of the
stuffsome kinda fun though
Mark
- Original Message -
From: John Divelbiss <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: almitt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Thursday, January 23, 2003 7:36 PM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] oldest collector


> Hello Al and others,
>
> I have been at collecting for about 4 years after finding some of the most
> convincing meteorwrongs you'll ever see. Someday I'll get them up on web
for
> you all to see. It turned out to be a rocky-like slag that had a lot of
flux
> in it from oldtime smelting. Melted surfaces with cupped features,
ball-like
> surface features that looked like chondrules, etc...might fool many early
> collectors. Amigo Bob (Haag) finally gave me the bad news. I actually
> studied, watched auctions, etc. for about a year before I started buying.
>
> I wonder how many other folks start out by finding a meteorwrong? Quite a
> few I would bet.
>
> As for Arizona...I visited once in 1962...but my parents drove right by
the
> crater. Too bad.
>
> John
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "almitt" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sent: Thursday, January 23, 2003 9:14 PM
> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] oldest collector
>
>
> > Hi All,
> >
> > Looks like we have some old collectors out there errr.I mean
> people that have
> > collected for quite some time. My first collection piece was from
> Meteor(ite) Crater
> > in the 1960's. Probably 1965 or 1966. Went to the crater as a kid. They
> sold Canyon
> > Diablo Meteorite oxide (shale) on a card. I still have the cards which
are
> purple,
> > reddish in color and say "From Outer Space" showing a meteor in flight
> with the oxide
> > glued in the center of the fireball. It has information about the impact
> on the back.
> > I can't say that I really got serious about collecting until the 1980's
> though. I did
> > make an effort to obtain a iron meteorite from Meteor(ite) Crater in
1979
> but they
> > didn't like the idea of selling iron meteorites to just anyone, so I
> settled for a
> > larger chunk of iron oxide which I still have in my collection. After
that
> I got
> > serious. Thank-you Robert Haag! Also Thank-you Blaine Reed!
> >
> > John Sinclair wrote about the attractions around Tucson. I agree with
him
> on all of
> > his well suggested places. One such place he mentioned was Tombstone and
> the shoot out
> > at the O.K. Corral. There was also another infamous shoot out at that
> location (1996?)
> > which another list member no doubt has not soon forgot :-)
> >
> > --AL Mitterling
> >
> >
> > __
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> > [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
> >
>
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] NWA's and Catalogue of Meteorites

[mafer]

Hi Lance
I was informed by Dean Bessey that the CR2's come from a 
strewn field collectively identified as NWA801 and NWA852 and may well be 
paired. Doesn't really clear up things does it?

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Lance 
  Wozniak 
  To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  
  Sent: Thursday, January 23, 2003 6:56 
  PM
  Subject: [meteorite-list] NWA's and 
  Catalogue of Meteorites
  
  I have two questions that I have been meaning to ask the 
  list for a while now.
   
  First question: I like to use my new reference "Catalogue of 
  Meteorites" by Monica Grady to zero in on what is known of particular 
  meteorites. I am aware of the section in the back listing Sahara's and 
  subgroups Acfer, Dar al Gani etc., but what happened to 
  all the NWA's? There must be a thousand of them that seem to be unaccounted 
  for.
   
  Second question: I have two CR2's, one NWA 801 and one NWA 
  852. They look like the same meteorite in all respects and I believe come from 
  the same location. Are these considered paired? Does any one know if their are 
  any distinguishing characteristics between the two or does either one have 
  more value than the other for some reason.
   
  Thanks,
  Lance Wozniak
   

Re: [meteorite-list] Oldest Collector

[mafer]

Great story!!!
Lets hope that other new collectors take heed to it.
Mark
- Original Message -
From: James Tobin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Meteorite List <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, January 21, 2003 8:28 PM
Subject: RE: [meteorite-list] Oldest Collector


>
> Hi Alan,
> 1963, that's when I sent my first piece of basalt to Denver. I received a
> nice card, a couple leaflets, and a copy of "When a Comet Strikes the
> Earth" back in the mail. I still have all those items. I quickly stopped
> collecting basalt so the little book helped. Look forward to hearing from
> some more of the oldtimers.
> Jim Tobin
>
> > [Original Message]
> > From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > To: meteorite-list <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > Date: 1/21/03 7:38:14 PM
> > Subject: [meteorite-list] Oldest Collector
> >
> >
> > Dear List,
> >
> > With the terrable news about Steve and the comment made that he has been
> > looking for meteorites since before Bob, I was wondering who on the list
> has
> > been collecting meteorites for the longest?  Or who knowes someone who
> has been
> > collecting for a long time --  Steve Schoner, Bob Haig, Russ Kempton.
> >
> > I bought my first meteorite on 05-28-94, actually a gift from my wife,
> although
> > I did have an interest in them before this time.
> >
> > Alan Gayda
> >
> >
> >
> > __
> > Meteorite-list mailing list
> > [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
>
>
> Jim Tobin
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> The Meteorite Exchange
>
>
>
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] Dinosaurs Experienced Climate Changes Before K-T Collision

[mafer]

Hi Sarah And List

I don't know that it hasn't been found in S.A. But South America is the
stomping grounds for some top level geologists of many fields, not just
paleo. But I do know that the layers in which bone is found has been
correlated to those found elsewhere. The problem with an impactor causing a
global kill off of dinosaurs is the lack of good evidence. With the
exception of this finding in New Mexico, all others to date have proved to
be reworked bones, and the New Mexico may well prove in the long run to be
so as well. My background is geology (last year at Western Washington
University for a bac) and I have followed the dinosaur extinctions for some
time now. My personal feeling is that one day, it will all fall together and
be seen that mammals will be found to be, once again, the bane of ground
nesting animals that lay eggs. This was true for the terror birds of South
America and my gut instinct is that it will also be found to be the problem
with the dinosaur decline. I feel that egg nests need to be really closely
examined for mammal teeth and marks (a hard enough task in itself since they
are very small , like the size of a pin head in the early Cretaceous). Not
trying to take away from an impactor which, evidence does seem to support,
wiped out a very large amount of marine life forms as well as terrestrial
life, but birds survived, and thats a crucial item not to be overlooked in a
planet killer, since birds are  one of the easier forms to kill.  And a
global covering of acid rain, as suggested, would have harmed birds very
easily.
It could be that birds (coelursaurs ) could also have had a part in the
extinction of dinosaurs. Lots to speculate on, little evidence to date. But,
plenty of people who are interested, so one day, I feel there will be some
answers, not all, but some.
Mark

- Original Message -
From: Jensan Scientifics/ Sci-Mall <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, January 21, 2003 6:41 PM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Dinosaurs Experienced Climate Changes Before
K-T Collision


> Hi Mark,
>
> You do seem to know alot about science.  I do not know what your
> background is... but maybe you would enlighten me?
>
> I am curious as to why there has been no K/T found in South America.
>
> Is it just that they do not have good geologists, or no one just hasn't
> figured it out yet.
>
> Sarah
>
> Jensan Scientifics/ Science Mall
>
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> >
> > HI List
> >
> > This is exactly why the findings in New Mexico are a problem. In the
past,
> > when bones had been found at and above the K-T Boundary layer, they
have,
> > after much analysis, been found to be "reworked" meaning they were
deposited
> > there after being exposed and moved from somewhere else. These bones in
New
> > Mexico will most likely prove to be the same, and not deposited at the
time
> > of impact as claimed. I believe (I haven't recieved an answer from the
> > author yet) that the fossils will be found to be mixed, dis-articulated
and
> > not an indication for extinction as claimed by the press.
> > But this still needs to be checked in the paper itself as the abstract
is
> > far to vague and what the abstract covered was the chrono tags for the
> > sandstone/K-T layer, not the fossils themselves.
> > Mark
> >
> > - Original Message -
> > From: E.P. Grondine <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > Sent: Tuesday, January 21, 2003 12:07 PM
> > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Dinosaurs Experienced Climate Changes
Before
> > K-T Collision
> >
> > > Hi -
> > >
> > > the acid rain generated by the compounds from the
> > > soils in the area where the largest chunk hit -
> > > Chixulub (sp?)
> > >
> > > of course, the first thing which happened is that all
> > > surface animals with lungs had them ruptured by the
> > > blast wave - and then you had global fires, another
> > > source of compounds for acid or caustic rains -
> > >
> > > fossilization requires an undisturbed "quiet:
> > > environment - and its not likely that anything like
> > > that existed anywhere on the Earth after this series
> > > of comet fragments impacted -
> > >
> > > best wishes -
> > > ep
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> > > > What acid rain do you refer to? This is an impactor,
> > > > not a volcanic
> > > > eruption. Acid rain would have to be supplied with
> > > > large quantities of
> > > > nitrous and sulfuric compounds in order to cause any
> > > > damage. So far as I
> > > > know, no significant (if any) acid spikes are noted
> > > > from any deep ice
> > > > corings for any recent impact event (last 30,000
> > > > yrs) so this is not a
> > > > reason for lack of dinosaur (note that I have never
> > > > mentioned any other type
> > > > of fossil bone) fossils close to the K-T Boundary.
> > > > Mark
> > > > - Original Message -
> > > > From: E.P. Grondine <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > > > To: <[EMAIL PROT

Re: [meteorite-list] Dinosaurs Experienced Climate Changes Before K-T Collision

[mafer]

HI List

This is exactly why the findings in New Mexico are a problem. In the past,
when bones had been found at and above the K-T Boundary layer, they have,
after much analysis, been found to be "reworked" meaning they were deposited
there after being exposed and moved from somewhere else. These bones in New
Mexico will most likely prove to be the same, and not deposited at the time
of impact as claimed. I believe (I haven't recieved an answer from the
author yet) that the fossils will be found to be mixed, dis-articulated and
not an indication for extinction as claimed by the press.
But this still needs to be checked in the paper itself as the abstract is
far to vague and what the abstract covered was the chrono tags for the
sandstone/K-T layer, not the fossils themselves.
Mark


- Original Message -
From: E.P. Grondine <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, January 21, 2003 12:07 PM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Dinosaurs Experienced Climate Changes Before
K-T Collision


> Hi -
>
> the acid rain generated by the compounds from the
> soils in the area where the largest chunk hit -
> Chixulub (sp?)
>
> of course, the first thing which happened is that all
> surface animals with lungs had them ruptured by the
> blast wave - and then you had global fires, another
> source of compounds for acid or caustic rains -
>
> fossilization requires an undisturbed "quiet:
> environment - and its not likely that anything like
> that existed anywhere on the Earth after this series
> of comet fragments impacted -
>
> best wishes -
> ep
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> > What acid rain do you refer to? This is an impactor,
> > not a volcanic
> > eruption. Acid rain would have to be supplied with
> > large quantities of
> > nitrous and sulfuric compounds in order to cause any
> > damage. So far as I
> > know, no significant (if any) acid spikes are noted
> > from any deep ice
> > corings for any recent impact event (last 30,000
> > yrs) so this is not a
> > reason for lack of dinosaur (note that I have never
> > mentioned any other type
> > of fossil bone) fossils close to the K-T Boundary.
> > Mark
> > - Original Message -
> > From: E.P. Grondine <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > Sent: Thursday, January 16, 2003 12:50 PM
> > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Dinosaurs Experienced
> > Climate Changes Before
> > K-T Collision
> >
> >
> > > The bones would not have survived the acid rain
> > long
> > > enough to be fossilized.  Same goes for bones in
> > the
> > > process of fossilization.
> > >
> > > ep
> > >
> > >
> > > --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> > > > Hi Ron and list
> > > >
> > > > The fact is that dinosaur fossils are not found
> > at
> > > > the k-T boundary. One has
> > > > to go 9-10 ft at best, below the boundary to
> > find
> > > > dinosaur bones in any of
> > > > the beds that contain dinosaur fossils. This
> > > > represents a substantial period
> > > > of time prior to the impact layer. This is why
> > it is
> > > > argued against. No one
> > > > has yet to find dinosaur bones at or immediately
> > > > below the boundary.
> > > > Mark
> > > > - Original Message -
> > > > From: Ron Baalke <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > > > To: Meteorite Mailing List
> > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > > > Sent: Wednesday, January 15, 2003 8:41 AM
> > > > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Dinosaurs
> > Experienced
> > > > Climate Changes Before
> > > > K-T Collision
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I have read many of the popular theories on
> > the
> > > > extinction events argued
> > > > in
> > > > > > this message, and to be frank, the fact
> > remains
> > > > that dinosaurs, in
> > > > general,
> > > > > > were on the decline.
> > > > >
> > > > > The dinosaurs may have well been on gradual
> > > > decline prior to the impact,
> > > > but
> > > > > even if that is the case, that does not
> > contradict
> > > > their abrupt
> > > > > disappearance at the time of impact.
> > > > >
> > > > > > As far as an impacter causing the
> > extinction.
> > > > I'm
> > > > > > skeptical, for then, how do the mammals,
> > > > marsupials, and birds, all
> > > > > > non-burrowing, survive a "world affecting"
> > > > impact.
> > > > >
> > > > > I don't find it strange at all that the large
> > > > animal species at the top
> > > > > of the food chain (ie: dinosaurs) were the
> > most
> > > > adversely affected by the
> > > > impact.
> > > > > The smaller species or the more mobile
> > (mammals,
> > > > birds, reptiles, etc.)
> > > > had a
> > > > > better chance of survival in the aftermath.  A
> > > > large number of the smaller
> > > > animals
> > > > > did go extinct as well at the time of the
> > impact,
> > > > but some were able to
> > > > survive.
> > > > >
> > > > > Ron Baalke
> > > > >
> > > > > __
> > > > > Meteorite-list mailing list
> > > > > [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
> http://www.pairlist.net/m

Re: [meteorite-list] Dinosaurs Experienced Climate Changes Before K-T Collision

[mafer]

Hi Ron

on Fassett's abstract

Lot of assumptions here that paleontologists would be cautious to make.
Theres also a lack in the abstract about what condition the bones are in the
sandstone. He also states that there are layers, indicating multiple events
occurred in the formation of the layer(s) with no comment about the layers
themselves, i.e. depositional environment, events between layers ect. His
main thrust is the paleomag tags, apparently his specialty. Bones are only
mentioned really as an aside to his main argument. He also does not go into
relational ages of the dinosaurs except to say that these Lazarus dinosaurs
could have hatch 1 to 2 yrs after the impactor event. This is an extreme
stretch on his part and will catch a lot of criticism from all scientific
fields dealing with animals. He's pretty much overstretched his knowledge of
animal behavior and will be shot down for that alone. His dating techniques
are limited to the paleomag and no typing of species of the bone was
mentioned to verify that they were indeed species known to be present (new
species would not count) in the late Cretaceous. I find his work very flawed
for what he's claiming, and very unscientific outside of the paleomag data.
Mark

- Original Message -
From: Ron Baalke <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Meteorite Mailing List <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, January 17, 2003 8:28 AM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Dinosaurs Experienced Climate Changes Before
K-T Collision


> >
> > As for Fassett's discovery, he presented his findings at the previous to
> > last GSA convention in Boston. You can probably find his abstracts on
the
> > web.
>
>
> Found the abstract. Here it is:
>
> http://gsa.confex.com/gsa/2001AM/finalprogram/abstract_25767.htm
>
> Fassett is proposing the mature dinosaurs were killed off by the impact,
but the
> recently laid eggs provided a survival sanctuary, and they later
> hatched from one to two years later.
>
> Ron Baalke
>
> __
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Re: [meteorite-list] Wrong Listing

[mafer]

Hi Greag and list
Don't pass up his shipping charges...talk about astronomical..
- Original Message -
From: Greg Redfern <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Meteorite-List <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Cc: Ken Newton <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Thursday, January 16, 2003 8:39 PM
Subject: [meteorite-list] Wrong Listing


>
> Good Evening List (and Ken)
>
>
> Check out this ebay listing "a "BIG" 480 gram DAG 400 Meteorite $1
> Item # 2154458835"  and the email I sent in response is below. I will let
> you know of the response.
>
> Sir,
>
>This is NOT a specimen of DAG 400. DAG 400 is a lunar meteorite and
your
> specimen is clearly not of lunar origin as DAG 400 is dark gray and has no
> chodrules or visible matrix as your specimen displays. Please research
your
> specimen and correct your listing.
>
> All the best,
>
> Greg Redfern
> IMCA #5781
> www.meteoritecollectors.org
>
>
> __
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> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Re: [meteorite-list] Dinosaurs Experienced Climate Changes Before K-T Collision

[mafer]

Hi List
My spelling took a turn tonite it seems.
for the worse. Must be these math classes I have to take. Just no
correlation between proper spelling and mathematical logic(I won't even
mention the spell checker!)
Mark
- Original Message -
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Cc: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Thursday, January 16, 2003 8:42 PM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Dinosaurs Experienced Climate Changes Before
K-T Collision


> Hi Matt
> That must be realatively new, but then my books date dated by a couple
> years. But to be truthful, the coelursaurs  actually survived any
extinction
> and are fluishing today as we speak.
> Mark
> - Original Message -
> From: Matt Morgan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: Meteorite-List <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sent: Thursday, January 16, 2003 2:52 PM
> Subject: RE: [meteorite-list] Dinosaurs Experienced Climate Changes Before
> K-T Collision
>
>
> > Mark:
> > This is not entirely true. This is location dependent, for example in
New
> > Mexico (San Juan Basin) you can find them right below (inches below the
Ir
> > anomaly..which is "off the scale") and ABOVE the K-T boundary. Yes, I
said
> > "above" the impact layer.  This has been an enigma, but Jim Fassett
(USGS)
> > has provided some compelling evidence (in the form of geochemistry) that
> the
> > hadrosaur femur he found, was NOT remowrked from sediments below.  He
> termed
> > these survivors "Lazarus" dinosaurs and speculated they may have
survived
> > well into the Paleocene.
> > Jim is giving a talk here in Denver sometime in April.
> > 
> >
> > Something to think about...
> > Matt Morgan
> >
> > ===
> > Matt Morgan
> > Mile High Meteorites
> > http://www.mhmeteorites.com
> > PO Box 151293
> > Lakewood, CO 80215 USA
> > FAX: 303-763-6917
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of
> > [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > Sent: Wednesday, January 15, 2003 10:54 AM
> > To: Ron Baalke
> > Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Dinosaurs Experienced Climate Changes
> > Before K-T Collision
> >
> >
> > Hi Ron and list
> >
> > The fact is that dinosaur fossils are not found at the k-T boundary. One
> has
> > to go 9-10 ft at best, below the boundary to find dinosaur bones in any
of
> > the beds that contain dinosaur fossils. This represents a substantial
> period
> > of time prior to the impact layer. This is why it is argued against. No
> one
> > has yet to find dinosaur bones at or immediately below the boundary.
> > Mark
> > - Original Message -
> > From: Ron Baalke <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > To: Meteorite Mailing List <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > Sent: Wednesday, January 15, 2003 8:41 AM
> > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Dinosaurs Experienced Climate Changes
Before
> > K-T Collision
> >
> >
> > > >
> > > > I have read many of the popular theories on the extinction events
> argued
> > in
> > > > this message, and to be frank, the fact remains that dinosaurs, in
> > general,
> > > > were on the decline.
> > >
> > > The dinosaurs may have well been on gradual decline prior to the
impact,
> > but
> > > even if that is the case, that does not contradict their abrupt
> > > disappearance at the time of impact.
> > >
> > > > As far as an impacter causing the extinction. I'm
> > > > skeptical, for then, how do the mammals, marsupials, and birds, all
> > > > non-burrowing, survive a "world affecting" impact.
> > >
> > > I don't find it strange at all that the large animal species at the
top
> > > of the food chain (ie: dinosaurs) were the most adversely affected by
> the
> > impact.
> > > The smaller species or the more mobile (mammals, birds, reptiles,
etc.)
> > had a
> > > better chance of survival in the aftermath.  A large number of the
> smaller
> > animals
> > > did go extinct as well at the time of the impact, but some were able
to
> > survive.
> > >
> > > Ron Baalke
> > >
> > > __
> > > Meteorite-list mailing list
> > > [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > > http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > __
> > Meteorite-list mailing list
> > [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
> >
> >
> > __
> > Meteorite-list mailing list
> > [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
> >
>
>
>
> __
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>



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Re: [meteorite-list] Dinosaurs Experienced Climate Changes Before K-T Collision

[mafer]

The main item that no one seems to point out in lit is the fact that mammals
could have caused the dino decline. They did a number (according to paleo
types) on the monster pred birds of South America. But didn't cuase the
demise of the Moas or Elephant Birds. Strange inded the problems one comes
up against.
But this is all so off topic (except the K-T Boundary parts). And I'm
curious as to why no one has used a magnometer on these lake sites.
Mark
- Original Message -
From: Sterling K. Webb <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: E.P. Grondine <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Cc: Meteorite List <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Thursday, January 16, 2003 7:57 PM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Dinosaurs Experienced Climate Changes Before
K-T Collision


> Hi,
>
> Good point, E.P.! Also, think about all those nasty little
> mammals that love to gnaw on bones. Hyena Heaven! And nobody to
> chase'em off. I remember the corny african movies of my childhood
> that showed the "elephant graveyard." Just envision the "dinosaur
> graveyard."
>
>
> Sterling
> --
> "E.P. Grondine" wrote:
>
> > The bones would not have survived the acid rain long
> > enough to be fossilized.  Same goes for bones in the
> > process of fossilization.
> >
> > ep
> >
> > --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> > > Hi Ron and list
> > >
> > > The fact is that dinosaur fossils are not found at
> > > the k-T boundary. One has
> > > to go 9-10 ft at best, below the boundary to find
> > > dinosaur bones in any of
> > > the beds that contain dinosaur fossils. This
> > > represents a substantial period
> > > of time prior to the impact layer. This is why it is
> > > argued against. No one
> > > has yet to find dinosaur bones at or immediately
> > > below the boundary.
> > > Mark
>
>
> __
> Meteorite-list mailing list
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
>



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Re: [meteorite-list] Dinosaurs Experienced Climate Changes Before K-T Collision

[mafer]

Hi Matt
That must be realatively new, but then my books date dated by a couple
years. But to be truthful, the coelursaurs  actually survived any extinction
and are fluishing today as we speak.
Mark
- Original Message -
From: Matt Morgan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Meteorite-List <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Thursday, January 16, 2003 2:52 PM
Subject: RE: [meteorite-list] Dinosaurs Experienced Climate Changes Before
K-T Collision


> Mark:
> This is not entirely true. This is location dependent, for example in New
> Mexico (San Juan Basin) you can find them right below (inches below the Ir
> anomaly..which is "off the scale") and ABOVE the K-T boundary. Yes, I said
> "above" the impact layer.  This has been an enigma, but Jim Fassett (USGS)
> has provided some compelling evidence (in the form of geochemistry) that
the
> hadrosaur femur he found, was NOT remowrked from sediments below.  He
termed
> these survivors "Lazarus" dinosaurs and speculated they may have survived
> well into the Paleocene.
> Jim is giving a talk here in Denver sometime in April.
> 
>
> Something to think about...
> Matt Morgan
>
> ===
> Matt Morgan
> Mile High Meteorites
> http://www.mhmeteorites.com
> PO Box 151293
> Lakewood, CO 80215 USA
> FAX: 303-763-6917
>
> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent: Wednesday, January 15, 2003 10:54 AM
> To: Ron Baalke
> Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Dinosaurs Experienced Climate Changes
> Before K-T Collision
>
>
> Hi Ron and list
>
> The fact is that dinosaur fossils are not found at the k-T boundary. One
has
> to go 9-10 ft at best, below the boundary to find dinosaur bones in any of
> the beds that contain dinosaur fossils. This represents a substantial
period
> of time prior to the impact layer. This is why it is argued against. No
one
> has yet to find dinosaur bones at or immediately below the boundary.
> Mark
> - Original Message -
> From: Ron Baalke <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: Meteorite Mailing List <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sent: Wednesday, January 15, 2003 8:41 AM
> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Dinosaurs Experienced Climate Changes Before
> K-T Collision
>
>
> > >
> > > I have read many of the popular theories on the extinction events
argued
> in
> > > this message, and to be frank, the fact remains that dinosaurs, in
> general,
> > > were on the decline.
> >
> > The dinosaurs may have well been on gradual decline prior to the impact,
> but
> > even if that is the case, that does not contradict their abrupt
> > disappearance at the time of impact.
> >
> > > As far as an impacter causing the extinction. I'm
> > > skeptical, for then, how do the mammals, marsupials, and birds, all
> > > non-burrowing, survive a "world affecting" impact.
> >
> > I don't find it strange at all that the large animal species at the top
> > of the food chain (ie: dinosaurs) were the most adversely affected by
the
> impact.
> > The smaller species or the more mobile (mammals, birds, reptiles, etc.)
> had a
> > better chance of survival in the aftermath.  A large number of the
smaller
> animals
> > did go extinct as well at the time of the impact, but some were able to
> survive.
> >
> > Ron Baalke
> >
> > __
> > Meteorite-list mailing list
> > [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
> >
>
>
>
> __
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> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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>
>
> __
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Re: [meteorite-list] thin section holder

[mafer]

Hi Mike
Try this site
http://www.lakeside-products.com/html/petrographic.html

Mark
- Original Message - 
From: tett <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: meteorite list <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Thursday, January 16, 2003 3:40 PM
Subject: [meteorite-list] thin section holder


> List,
> 
> Can anyone direct me on where to get small thin section cases?
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Mike Tettenborn
> 
> 
> __
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Re: [meteorite-list] Dinosaurs Experienced Climate Changes Before K-T Collision

[mafer]

What acid rain do you refer to? This is an impactor, not a volcanic
eruption. Acid rain would have to be supplied with large quantities of
nitrous and sulfuric compounds in order to cause any damage. So far as I
know, no significant (if any) acid spikes are noted from any deep ice
corings for any recent impact event (last 30,000 yrs) so this is not a
reason for lack of dinosaur (note that I have never mentioned any other type
of fossil bone) fossils close to the K-T Boundary.
Mark
- Original Message -
From: E.P. Grondine <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Thursday, January 16, 2003 12:50 PM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Dinosaurs Experienced Climate Changes Before
K-T Collision


> The bones would not have survived the acid rain long
> enough to be fossilized.  Same goes for bones in the
> process of fossilization.
>
> ep
>
>
> --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> > Hi Ron and list
> >
> > The fact is that dinosaur fossils are not found at
> > the k-T boundary. One has
> > to go 9-10 ft at best, below the boundary to find
> > dinosaur bones in any of
> > the beds that contain dinosaur fossils. This
> > represents a substantial period
> > of time prior to the impact layer. This is why it is
> > argued against. No one
> > has yet to find dinosaur bones at or immediately
> > below the boundary.
> > Mark
> > - Original Message -
> > From: Ron Baalke <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > To: Meteorite Mailing List
> > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > Sent: Wednesday, January 15, 2003 8:41 AM
> > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Dinosaurs Experienced
> > Climate Changes Before
> > K-T Collision
> >
> >
> > > >
> > > > I have read many of the popular theories on the
> > extinction events argued
> > in
> > > > this message, and to be frank, the fact remains
> > that dinosaurs, in
> > general,
> > > > were on the decline.
> > >
> > > The dinosaurs may have well been on gradual
> > decline prior to the impact,
> > but
> > > even if that is the case, that does not contradict
> > their abrupt
> > > disappearance at the time of impact.
> > >
> > > > As far as an impacter causing the extinction.
> > I'm
> > > > skeptical, for then, how do the mammals,
> > marsupials, and birds, all
> > > > non-burrowing, survive a "world affecting"
> > impact.
> > >
> > > I don't find it strange at all that the large
> > animal species at the top
> > > of the food chain (ie: dinosaurs) were the most
> > adversely affected by the
> > impact.
> > > The smaller species or the more mobile (mammals,
> > birds, reptiles, etc.)
> > had a
> > > better chance of survival in the aftermath.  A
> > large number of the smaller
> > animals
> > > did go extinct as well at the time of the impact,
> > but some were able to
> > survive.
> > >
> > > Ron Baalke
> > >
> > > __
> > > Meteorite-list mailing list
> > > [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > >
> >
> http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > __
> > Meteorite-list mailing list
> > [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >
> http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
>
>
> __
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> Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now.
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[meteorite-list] ebay

[mafer]

Hi List
I have a few smaller fragments, fairly common ending today if your
interested. Not rare at all, sorry.
Mark


http://cgi6.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewSellersOtherItems&userid=refamat&c
ompleted=0&sort=3&since=-1&include=0&page=1&rows=25



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Re: [meteorite-list] Dinosaurs Experienced Climate Changes Before K-T Collision

[mafer]

Hi Ron and list

The fact is that dinosaur fossils are not found at the k-T boundary. One has
to go 9-10 ft at best, below the boundary to find dinosaur bones in any of
the beds that contain dinosaur fossils. This represents a substantial period
of time prior to the impact layer. This is why it is argued against. No one
has yet to find dinosaur bones at or immediately below the boundary.
Mark
- Original Message -
From: Ron Baalke <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Meteorite Mailing List <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Wednesday, January 15, 2003 8:41 AM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Dinosaurs Experienced Climate Changes Before
K-T Collision


> >
> > I have read many of the popular theories on the extinction events argued
in
> > this message, and to be frank, the fact remains that dinosaurs, in
general,
> > were on the decline.
>
> The dinosaurs may have well been on gradual decline prior to the impact,
but
> even if that is the case, that does not contradict their abrupt
> disappearance at the time of impact.
>
> > As far as an impacter causing the extinction. I'm
> > skeptical, for then, how do the mammals, marsupials, and birds, all
> > non-burrowing, survive a "world affecting" impact.
>
> I don't find it strange at all that the large animal species at the top
> of the food chain (ie: dinosaurs) were the most adversely affected by the
impact.
> The smaller species or the more mobile (mammals, birds, reptiles, etc.)
had a
> better chance of survival in the aftermath.  A large number of the smaller
animals
> did go extinct as well at the time of the impact, but some were able to
survive.
>
> Ron Baalke
>
> __
> Meteorite-list mailing list
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
>



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