[mochikit] Re: MochiKit Development
> Any developer who has been in this business for any length of time > should no better than to blindly use a library, no matter how cool, > unless: > A) they expect it to be actively developed in the forseeable future > B) they don't ever expect to want a new version of the library Just my 2 cents -- I get the distinct impression that the core development team uses MK in their commercial software, so they're motivated to patch the code as browsers change and strong user expectations develop. I would much rather MK stay lightweight and tight than bloat into some behemoth that offers 100 ways to do the same thing because someone thought it would be better to do it this "other way." Look at Windows(tm) for a shining example of active development. --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MochiKit" group. To post to this group, send email to mochikit@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/mochikit?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[mochikit] Re: MochiKit Development
On 7/18/07, Jason Bunting <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > I *am* curious as to the effort to get us to an official '1.4' release - > seemed like there was a bit of momentum a few weeks/months back to get all > bugs fixed and get it shipped, but then it seemed to die. I think that most or all of the bug fixes are done, IIRC it's a matter of auditing everything and making sure the docs are good. I've been really busy, and since MochiKit works as-is for us (svn trunk obviously doesn't bother me) I haven't needed to devote much time to it. I understand that this bothers some people, but I didn't develop MochiKit to do consulting and my company doesn't really do anything that would benefit from MochiKit being more popular. I also don't need a job and I haven't seen any AJAX conferences in interesting locations lately ;) > Other than that, I think MK is near-perfect and find it interesting how > people seem to feel that if a product/technology/etc. isn't constantly being > developed, it is somehow not that great or not worth using; if MochiKit > fulfills the measure of its creation (i.e. if its current state meets the > goals set out for its original design/purpose), then why does it need to be > continually developed? Some things just mature and are then good enough > unless major bugs pop up. That's more or less how I feel about it. I do plan on getting to a 1.4 release, but I've got all of these other internal releases to worry about before that happens :) -bob --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MochiKit" group. To post to this group, send email to mochikit@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/mochikit?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[mochikit] Re: MochiKit Development
On 18-Jul-07, at 1:42 PM, machineghost wrote: > But Mochikit is a WONDERFUL library. It's better than any other JS > library I've worked with, and I've tried a few. So I (and I imagine, > many others in the Mochikit community) would like to be able to user > the library with confidence that doing so will not screw me in the > end. This is why I believe active development is important for > Mochikit (as it is for any non-for-profit software library). I think you can rely on us to fix MochiKit problems we experience with our commercial software. There's not much overhead for you to isolate and fix problems in JavaScript. I don't think it's unreasonable to ask that you just "submit a patch" if you find something broken or lacking. If the patch is good, it's likely we'll apply it to MochiKit pretty quickly. Beau --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MochiKit" group. To post to this group, send email to mochikit@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/mochikit?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[mochikit] Re: MochiKit Development
"if MochiKit fulfills the measure of its creation (i.e. if its current state meets the goals set out for its original design/purpose), then why does it need to be continually developed?" 1) Nobody wants to tie themselves to a dead horse. In other words, nobody wants to take the time to learn Mochikit, use it heavily in their site, and then a year from now realize that they're up a proverbial creek without a paddle because the library's development is no longer active and newBrowserX doesn't work with it. And it's important to realize that to any new user evaluating a library, a "near-perfect" project which is no longer developed is indistinguishable from a dead project. 2) "AJAX"-style development has only even begun to happen on the web in the past couple of years. As a result, it's extremely premature to say that ANY JS library is "near-perfect", because there are undoubtedly numerous desired features still to come which we don't even know about yet (but will of course seem incredibly obvious and mandatory in retrospect). One example of this would be offline caching; with Google Gears coming soon offline JS functionality is going to become increasingly common, and I imagine anyone already using Mochikit is going to want to use wonderful Mochikit-style functions to work with it. However, as it currently stands, the only JS library with support for offline caching is (*shudder*) Dojo. Any developer who has been in this business for any length of time should no better than to blindly use a library, no matter how cool, unless: A) they expect it to be actively developed in the forseeable future B) they don't ever expect to want a new version of the library But with new browsers/versions of browsers constantly being released, and new ways of using Javascript constantly being discovered, it seems incredibly unlikely that B would apply to anyone using Mochikit, and so A is very relevant to most if not all developers. If I use Mochikit heavily but it isn't actively developed, and then: * IE8 comes out and breaks it, I'm screwed or * new interface feature X becomes popular and I need to implement it in my site, I'm screwed So basically: * if the web changes, and Mochikit doesn't, I'm screwed In both cases, I would have been better off using a different library from the start, instead of Mochikit. But Mochikit is a WONDERFUL library. It's better than any other JS library I've worked with, and I've tried a few. So I (and I imagine, many others in the Mochikit community) would like to be able to user the library with confidence that doing so will not screw me in the end. This is why I believe active development is important for Mochikit (as it is for any non-for-profit software library). Jeremy On Jul 18, 8:16 am, "Jason Bunting" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I *am* curious as to the effort to get us to an official '1.4' release - > seemed like there was a bit of momentum a few weeks/months back to get all > bugs fixed and get it shipped, but then it seemed to die. > > Other than that, I think MK is near-perfect and find it interesting how > people seem to feel that if a product/technology/etc. isn't constantly being > developed, it is somehow not that great or not worth using; if MochiKit > fulfills the measure of its creation (i.e. if its current state meets the > goals set out for its original design/purpose), then why does it need to be > continually developed? Some things just mature and are then good enough > unless major bugs pop up. > > Jason Bunting > > > > > -Original Message- > > From: mochikit@googlegroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On > > Behalf Of tobyclemson > > Sent: Wednesday, July 18, 2007 5:56 AM > > To: MochiKit > > Subject: [mochikit] MochiKit Development > > > Hi, > > > I was just wondering whether anyone knew the status of the MochiKit > > project - is it still being developed beyond bugfixes or has > > development come to a halt. I was using it last year when I was a > > Systems Development Intern and I'd like to use it in some personal > > projects but if development is not going to continue I might switch to > > something different with similar capabilities. > > > Thanks, > > Toby > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > > Version: 7.5.476 / Virus Database: 269.10.8/904 - Release Date: 7/16/2007 > > 5:42 PM > > No virus found in this outgoing message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.476 / Virus Database: 269.10.8/904 - Release Date: 7/16/2007 > 5:42 PM --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MochiKit" group. To post to this group, send email to mochikit@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/mochikit?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[mochikit] Re: MochiKit Development
On 18 juil, 17:16, "Jason Bunting" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I *am* curious as to the effort to get us to an official '1.4' release - > seemed like there was a bit of momentum a few weeks/months back to get all > bugs fixed and get it shipped, but then it seemed to die. It's all about voluntary work, so anything can happen :). Anyway I closed 2 bugs and did a bit of cleaning tonight. There's still one issue (http://trac.mochikit.com/ticket/248) but I don't manage to reproduce it and it doesn't seem very important. I also moved Controls.js out of trunk, in the autocompleter branch, until someone decides to revive it. -- Thomas --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MochiKit" group. To post to this group, send email to mochikit@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/mochikit?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[mochikit] Re: MochiKit Development
I *am* curious as to the effort to get us to an official '1.4' release - seemed like there was a bit of momentum a few weeks/months back to get all bugs fixed and get it shipped, but then it seemed to die. Other than that, I think MK is near-perfect and find it interesting how people seem to feel that if a product/technology/etc. isn't constantly being developed, it is somehow not that great or not worth using; if MochiKit fulfills the measure of its creation (i.e. if its current state meets the goals set out for its original design/purpose), then why does it need to be continually developed? Some things just mature and are then good enough unless major bugs pop up. Jason Bunting > -Original Message- > From: mochikit@googlegroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On > Behalf Of tobyclemson > Sent: Wednesday, July 18, 2007 5:56 AM > To: MochiKit > Subject: [mochikit] MochiKit Development > > > Hi, > > I was just wondering whether anyone knew the status of the MochiKit > project - is it still being developed beyond bugfixes or has > development come to a halt. I was using it last year when I was a > Systems Development Intern and I'd like to use it in some personal > projects but if development is not going to continue I might switch to > something different with similar capabilities. > > Thanks, > Toby > > > > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.476 / Virus Database: 269.10.8/904 - Release Date: 7/16/2007 > 5:42 PM > No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.476 / Virus Database: 269.10.8/904 - Release Date: 7/16/2007 5:42 PM --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MochiKit" group. To post to this group, send email to mochikit@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/mochikit?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
[mochikit] MochiKit Development
Hi, I was just wondering whether anyone knew the status of the MochiKit project - is it still being developed beyond bugfixes or has development come to a halt. I was using it last year when I was a Systems Development Intern and I'd like to use it in some personal projects but if development is not going to continue I might switch to something different with similar capabilities. Thanks, Toby --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MochiKit" group. To post to this group, send email to mochikit@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/mochikit?hl=en -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
