Re: [POSSIBLE SPAM] People that CC mailing lists

2013-02-15 Thread Alexander Gattin 
On Wed, Feb 13, 2013 at 11:15:43AM -0500, Mark H.
Wood wrote:
>   h!  HTML mail is punishable by death

with this being the default

-- 
With best regards,
xrgtn


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Re: [POSSIBLE SPAM] People that CC mailing lists

2013-02-13 Thread David Woodfall 

On (13/02/13 11:15), Mark H. Wood  put forth the proposition:

On Tue, Feb 12, 2013 at 09:17:43PM -0500, Brandon McCaig wrote:

Some mailing lists don't require a subscription so you should use
'g' to reply to those lists so even unsubscribed participants get
the messages. Other lists insist that you /don't/ reply to
everyone and only reply to the list so for those you should use
'L'. Which one is appropriate will depend on the list rules. It
can be hard to keep it straight if you mostly lurk...


Not for the first time, I find myself wishing for a Geek Code -like
header to encode all the many mailing-list rules and preferences, so
that UAs could give us more help in conforming to local standards.

 h+HTML mail is required
 h HTML mail is encouraged
 h- HTML mail is discouraged
 h! HTML mail is punishable by death


Well I certainly approve of the the last one ;-)

Re: [POSSIBLE SPAM] People that CC mailing lists

2013-02-13 Thread Andre Klärner 
On Wed, Feb 13, 2013 at 11:15:43AM -0500, Mark H. Wood wrote:
> Not for the first time, I find myself wishing for a Geek Code -like
> header to encode all the many mailing-list rules and preferences, so
> that UAs could give us more help in conforming to local standards.

Well, so why doesn't one come up with a standard to encode the rules
alltogether in the email-headers? We already got List-Id:, List-Post: so
why shouldn't be there a List-Unsubscribed-Participants: that gets filled
with the list of the people that listed "List-Subscribed: no" in their
post? And once one is at this there could also be List-ContentType: with
e.g. "text/plain:wrap=72,text/enriched,text/folded" so that linewraps are
done according to the liking of the (hopefully) full list.

Implementing this should be quite trivial for most MUA as they are open
source and most non-opensourced would probaply not implement is anyway.

Regards, Andre

-- 
Andre Klärner


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Re: [POSSIBLE SPAM] People that CC mailing lists

2013-02-13 Thread Mark H. Wood 
On Tue, Feb 12, 2013 at 09:17:43PM -0500, Brandon McCaig wrote:
> Some mailing lists don't require a subscription so you should use
> 'g' to reply to those lists so even unsubscribed participants get
> the messages. Other lists insist that you /don't/ reply to
> everyone and only reply to the list so for those you should use
> 'L'. Which one is appropriate will depend on the list rules. It
> can be hard to keep it straight if you mostly lurk...

Not for the first time, I find myself wishing for a Geek Code -like
header to encode all the many mailing-list rules and preferences, so
that UAs could give us more help in conforming to local standards.

  h+HTML mail is required
  h HTML mail is encouraged
  h-HTML mail is discouraged
  h!HTML mail is punishable by death

-- 
Mark H. Wood, Lead System Programmer   mw...@iupui.edu
There's an app for that:  your browser


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Re: [POSSIBLE SPAM] People that CC mailing lists

2013-02-12 Thread s. keeling 
Incoming from Brandon McCaig:
> On Sun, Feb 10, 2013 at 07:32:13AM +, Russell L. Harris wrote:
> > 
> > Is there a command other than "g" which is appropriate when
> > replying to a group?
> 
> Some mailing lists don't require a subscription so you should use
> 'g' to reply to those lists so even unsubscribed participants get
> the messages.

I disagree.  If you subscribe, you're in.  You'll get responses in
your $inbox.  If you don't wish to subscribe, keeping up is UP TO YOU,
but that's hardly difficult.  You can get to the contents of debian-
users with a web browser.  I assume mutt-users too.  Gmane offers a
free web interface to much of this stuff too.  Google "site:blah" can
fill in many details.

> Other lists insist that you /don't/ reply to everyone and only reply
> to the list

That's my preference.

> ... so for those you should use 'L'. Which one is appropriate will
> depend on the list rules. It can be hard to keep it straight if you
> mostly lurk...

Lurkers should be on their own.  I feel no responsibility for them.
I'm not trying to be mean.  I often lurk myself.  However, I do try
not to abuse lists and their policies/preferences.

> IIRC, we're supposed to only reply to the list for mutt-users,
> but I see that isn't being done in this thread and nobody is
> getting upset so perhaps I am mistaken. :)

It's not very much upsetting.  It's more just an annoyance.  mutt can
handle this problem.  Why aren't $supposed_offenders using mutt's
power as they should and could be?!?  Meh.  I can handle Cc:s easily.
It's just that I wish I didn't have to.  Bug splatter on the
windshield.  Not a problem.  Carry on.


-- 
Any technology distinguishable from magic is insufficiently advanced.
(*) :(){ :|:& };:
- -


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Re: [POSSIBLE SPAM] People that CC mailing lists

2013-02-12 Thread Brandon McCaig 
On Sun, Feb 10, 2013 at 07:32:13AM +, Russell L. Harris wrote:
> Please tell me if I am using the wrong command when attempting
> to reply to a mail list regarding a message on the list.  I am
> running Mutt on Debian Squeeze.
> 
> In order to reply to your message, I press "g" (for "group
> reply"), and Mutt generates the following header pair:
> 
> To: David Woodfall 
> Cc: mutt-users@mutt.org
> 
> Is there a command other than "g" which is appropriate when
> replying to a group?

Some mailing lists don't require a subscription so you should use
'g' to reply to those lists so even unsubscribed participants get
the messages. Other lists insist that you /don't/ reply to
everyone and only reply to the list so for those you should use
'L'. Which one is appropriate will depend on the list rules. It
can be hard to keep it straight if you mostly lurk...

IIRC, we're supposed to only reply to the list for mutt-users,
but I see that isn't being done in this thread and nobody is
getting upset so perhaps I am mistaken. :) In that case,
undelievered apologies to anyone that doesn't get this and should
have.

Regards,


-- 
Brandon McCaig  
Castopulence Software 
Blog 
perl -E '$_=q{V zrna gur orfg jvgu jung V fnl. }.
q{Vg qbrfa'\''g nyjnlf fbhaq gung jnl.};
tr/A-Ma-mN-Zn-z/N-Zn-zA-Ma-m/;say'



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Re: [POSSIBLE SPAM] People that CC mailing lists

2013-02-11 Thread Cameron Simpson 
On 10Feb2013 07:32, Russell L. Harris  wrote:
| * David Woodfall  [130210 00:45]:
| > I've a few mailing lists where people don't send to the mailing list
| > instead they CC it. In which case when I reply to the list mutt
| > doesn't recognise it as a list and I have to do a normal reply and
| > manually put in the mailing list address in the send field.
| ...
| > I guess the other way is to nag people into using a proper email
| > client :)
| 
| Please tell me if I am using the wrong command when attempting to
| reply to a mail list regarding a message on the list.  I am running
| Mutt on Debian Squeeze.
| 
| In order to reply to your message, I press "g" (for "group reply"),
| and Mutt generates the following header pair:
| 
| To: David Woodfall 
| Cc: mutt-users@mutt.org
| 
| Is there a command other than "g" which is appropriate when replying
| to a group?

David has discovered that his config was wrong. It doesn't matter whether
the list is named in To or CC. Remain calm.
-- 
Cameron Simpson 

From the back of the research lab, the sound of a large metallic pile of
loose objects collapsing, accompanied by a loud "Aaaaiiieeyyrrgghhh!!" from
George. A few seconds of silence, then: "I'll have to call you back."

Re: [POSSIBLE SPAM] People that CC mailing lists

2013-02-11 Thread Chris Green 
On Mon, Feb 11, 2013 at 11:46:34AM +1300, Chris Bannister wrote:
> On Sun, Feb 10, 2013 at 09:31:23AM +, Chris Green wrote:
> > On Sun, Feb 10, 2013 at 07:32:13AM +, Russell L. Harris wrote:
> > > * David Woodfall  [130210 00:45]:
> > > > I've a few mailing lists where people don't send to the mailing list
> > > > instead they CC it. In which case when I reply to the list mutt
> > > > doesn't recognise it as a list and I have to do a normal reply and
> > > > manually put in the mailing list address in the send field.
> > > ...
> > > > I guess the other way is to nag people into using a proper email
> > > > client :)
> > > 
> > > Please tell me if I am using the wrong command when attempting to
> > > reply to a mail list regarding a message on the list.  I am running
> > > Mutt on Debian Squeeze.
> > > 
> > If you have the list in your .muutrc 'subscribe' and or 'lists' commands
> > then the correct way to reply to the list is L[ist reply].
> 
> 'L' works when there is a List-Post header, so no need for a subcribe or
> list command.
> 
Yes, but not every mailing list has such a header.

-- 
Chris Green

Re: [POSSIBLE SPAM] People that CC mailing lists

2013-02-10 Thread Chris Bannister 
On Sun, Feb 10, 2013 at 09:31:23AM +, Chris Green wrote:
> On Sun, Feb 10, 2013 at 07:32:13AM +, Russell L. Harris wrote:
> > * David Woodfall  [130210 00:45]:
> > > I've a few mailing lists where people don't send to the mailing list
> > > instead they CC it. In which case when I reply to the list mutt
> > > doesn't recognise it as a list and I have to do a normal reply and
> > > manually put in the mailing list address in the send field.
> > ...
> > > I guess the other way is to nag people into using a proper email
> > > client :)
> > 
> > Please tell me if I am using the wrong command when attempting to
> > reply to a mail list regarding a message on the list.  I am running
> > Mutt on Debian Squeeze.
> > 
> If you have the list in your .muutrc 'subscribe' and or 'lists' commands
> then the correct way to reply to the list is L[ist reply].

'L' works when there is a List-Post header, so no need for a subcribe or
list command.

-- 
"If you're not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people
who are being oppressed, and loving the people who are doing the 
oppressing." --- Malcolm X

Re: [POSSIBLE SPAM] People that CC mailing lists

2013-02-10 Thread Chris Green 
On Sun, Feb 10, 2013 at 07:32:13AM +, Russell L. Harris wrote:
> * David Woodfall  [130210 00:45]:
> > I've a few mailing lists where people don't send to the mailing list
> > instead they CC it. In which case when I reply to the list mutt
> > doesn't recognise it as a list and I have to do a normal reply and
> > manually put in the mailing list address in the send field.
> ...
> > I guess the other way is to nag people into using a proper email
> > client :)
> 
> Please tell me if I am using the wrong command when attempting to
> reply to a mail list regarding a message on the list.  I am running
> Mutt on Debian Squeeze.
> 
If you have the list in your .muutrc 'subscribe' and or 'lists' commands
then the correct way to reply to the list is L[ist reply].

-- 
Chris Green

Re: [POSSIBLE SPAM] People that CC mailing lists

2013-02-09 Thread Russell L. Harris 
* David Woodfall  [130210 00:45]:
> I've a few mailing lists where people don't send to the mailing list
> instead they CC it. In which case when I reply to the list mutt
> doesn't recognise it as a list and I have to do a normal reply and
> manually put in the mailing list address in the send field.
...
> I guess the other way is to nag people into using a proper email
> client :)

Please tell me if I am using the wrong command when attempting to
reply to a mail list regarding a message on the list.  I am running
Mutt on Debian Squeeze.

In order to reply to your message, I press "g" (for "group reply"),
and Mutt generates the following header pair:

To: David Woodfall 
Cc: mutt-users@mutt.org

Is there a command other than "g" which is appropriate when replying
to a group?

RH