Re: Local alternative to Re:
On Thu, Dec 01, 2011 at 02:36:10PM -0600, Derek Martin wrote: On Thu, Dec 01, 2011 at 02:27:54PM -0600, Derek Martin wrote: On Thu, Dec 01, 2011 at 08:31:21PM +0100, Salve Håkedal wrote: I'd like to have mutt put 'Sv:' instead of 'Re:' when I reply to messages, but can't find how to do it. Re: is not from English, it's from Latin (and therefore local to no one, since it's a dead language), and if I recall correctly it is actually specified in the RFCs. Indeed: http://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc2822.txt 3.6.5. Informational fields [...] The Subject: field is the most common and contains a short string identifying the topic of the message. When used in a reply, the field body MAY start with the string Re: (from the Latin res, in the matter of) followed by the contents of the Subject: field body of the original message. If this is done, only one instance of the literal string Re: ought to be used since use of other strings or more than one instance can lead to undesirable consequences. that is nice and clever but I think it would be much better to regard re as abbreviation of responsum - answer. As an abbreviation of res it would be highly redundant to the subject keyword and not explain why it is used in answers/followups only. Richard --- Name and OpenPGP keys available from pgp key servers pgpQCHy94jlmn.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Local alternative to Re:
On Sat, Dec 03, 2011 at 11:12:17AM +0100, Richard wrote: The Subject: field is the most common and contains a short string identifying the topic of the message. When used in a reply, the field body MAY start with the string Re: (from the Latin res, in the matter of) followed by the contents of the Subject: field that is nice and clever but I think it would be much better to regard re as abbreviation of responsum - answer. As an abbreviation of res it would be highly redundant to the subject keyword and not explain why it is used in answers/followups only. Bear in mind it's not really a new usage. The OED has several examples of re in English text going back to at least 1707, with Latin res as their etymology for it. They also mention a newer form (starting in the early 1900s) re., which they say probably results from reanalysis as showing an abbreviation for 'regarding'. -Dave Dodge
Re: Local alternative to Re:
On Thu, Dec 01, 2011 at 08:31:21PM +0100, Salve Håkedal wrote: Hi I'm Norwegian. I'd like to have mutt put 'Sv:' instead of 'Re:' when I reply to messages, but can't find how to do it. Try this in you .muttrc: set reply_regexp=^Sv:[ \t]* -- Ivo Engelhardt
Re: Local alternative to Re:
On Thu, Dec 01, 2011 at 08:31:21PM +0100, Salve Håkedal wrote: I'm Norwegian. I'd like to have mutt put 'Sv:' instead of 'Re:' when I reply to messages, but can't find how to do it. Re: is not from English, it's from Latin (and therefore local to no one, since it's a dead language), and if I recall correctly it is actually specified in the RFCs. Assuming I'm not wrong about that, localization is inappropriate and Mutt is correct to force using Re: in the subject line. Be lenient in what you accept, and strict in what you emit. -- Derek D. Martinhttp://www.pizzashack.org/ GPG Key ID: 0xDFBEAD02 -=-=-=-=- This message is posted from an invalid address. Replying to it will result in undeliverable mail due to spam prevention. Sorry for the inconvenience. pgpB2xfhQXoLi.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Local alternative to Re:
On Thu, Dec 01, 2011 at 09:01:46PM +0100, Ivo Engelhardt wrote: On Thu, Dec 01, 2011 at 08:31:21PM +0100, Salve Håkedal wrote: Hi I'm Norwegian. I'd like to have mutt put 'Sv:' instead of 'Re:' when I reply to messages, but can't find how to do it. Try this in you .muttrc: set reply_regexp=^Sv:[ \t]* This controls what mutt sees as replies (so that it does not generate re: re: re: ... subject lines), not what it uses itself for replies. -- Derek D. Martinhttp://www.pizzashack.org/ GPG Key ID: 0xDFBEAD02 -=-=-=-=- This message is posted from an invalid address. Replying to it will result in undeliverable mail due to spam prevention. Sorry for the inconvenience. pgp95wCko7wgd.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Local alternative to Re:
On Thu, Dec 01, 2011 at 02:27:54PM -0600, Derek Martin wrote: On Thu, Dec 01, 2011 at 08:31:21PM +0100, Salve Håkedal wrote: I'd like to have mutt put 'Sv:' instead of 'Re:' when I reply to messages, but can't find how to do it. Re: is not from English, it's from Latin (and therefore local to no one, since it's a dead language), and if I recall correctly it is actually specified in the RFCs. Indeed: http://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc2822.txt 3.6.5. Informational fields [...] The Subject: field is the most common and contains a short string identifying the topic of the message. When used in a reply, the field body MAY start with the string Re: (from the Latin res, in the matter of) followed by the contents of the Subject: field body of the original message. If this is done, only one instance of the literal string Re: ought to be used since use of other strings or more than one instance can lead to undesirable consequences. -- Derek D. Martinhttp://www.pizzashack.org/ GPG Key ID: 0xDFBEAD02 -=-=-=-=- This message is posted from an invalid address. Replying to it will result in undeliverable mail due to spam prevention. Sorry for the inconvenience. pgpNbbNIvKgH7.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Local alternative to Re:
On 2011-12-01, Derek Martin inva...@pizzashack.org wrote: On Thu, Dec 01, 2011 at 08:31:21PM +0100, Salve Håkedal wrote: I'm Norwegian. I'd like to have mutt put 'Sv:' instead of 'Re:' when I reply to messages, but can't find how to do it. Re: is not from English, it's from Latin (and therefore local to no one, since it's a dead language), Well, I suppose you could argue that it's more local to languages that use the latin aphabet than those that don't, and among them even more local to the romance or neo-latin launages. and if I recall correctly it is actually specified in the RFCs. I don't see it in RFC822 -- not sure where else to look. Assuming I'm not wrong about that, localization is inappropriate and Mutt is correct to force using Re: in the subject line. Be lenient in what you accept, and strict in what you emit. Personally, I don't care what people use as long as they don't start piling up like this: sv: re: sv: re: ax: er: tr: gq: The original subject here That's really annoying... -- Grant Edwards grant.b.edwardsYow! Jesus is my POSTMASTER at GENERAL ... gmail.com
Re: Local alternative to Re:
On Thu, Dec 01, 2011 at 08:40:43PM +, Grant Edwards wrote: Personally, I don't care what people use as long as they don't start piling up like this: sv: re: sv: re: ax: er: tr: gq: The original subject here And that is exactly why it IS specified in RFC 2822. -- Derek D. Martinhttp://www.pizzashack.org/ GPG Key ID: 0xDFBEAD02 -=-=-=-=- This message is posted from an invalid address. Replying to it will result in undeliverable mail due to spam prevention. Sorry for the inconvenience. pgpM6NQjDIuDQ.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Local alternative to Re:
On 2011-12-01, Derek Martin inva...@pizzashack.org wrote: On Thu, Dec 01, 2011 at 08:40:43PM +, Grant Edwards wrote: Personally, I don't care what people use as long as they don't start piling up like this: sv: re: sv: re: ax: er: tr: gq: The original subject here And that is exactly why it IS specified in RFC 2822. Doh! Don't know why I was looking at 822 and not 2822... -- Grant Edwards grant.b.edwardsYow! Awright, which one of at you hid my PENIS ENVY? gmail.com
Re: Local alternative to Re:
On Thu, Dec 01, 2011 at 02:44:01PM -0600, Derek Martin wrote: On Thu, Dec 01, 2011 at 08:40:43PM +, Grant Edwards wrote: Personally, I don't care what people use as long as they don't start piling up like this: sv: re: sv: re: ax: er: tr: gq: The original subject here And that is exactly why it IS specified in RFC 2822. Incidentally, while looking this up, I ran across a post which suggested that the intent behind specifying a specific string in the RFC was that it made two related problems simple: The first was the one you brought up, and the second is that mail clients can simply choose to *display* a localized version of 'Re:' instead of that string. The hueristic for doing so is greatly simplified if the token is standardized and invariable. Sadly, RFCs are very good at explaining WHAT to do (well, usually), but very often completely fail to address WHY to do it. I guess they'd be too long if they explained everything... -- Derek D. Martinhttp://www.pizzashack.org/ GPG Key ID: 0xDFBEAD02 -=-=-=-=- This message is posted from an invalid address. Replying to it will result in undeliverable mail due to spam prevention. Sorry for the inconvenience. pgpIswu5eK0qT.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Local alternative to Re:
On Thu, Dec 01, 2011 at 08:31:21PM +0100, Salve Håkedal wrote: I'm Norwegian. I'd like to have mutt put 'Sv:' instead of 'Re:' when I reply to messages, but can't find how to do it. Re: is not from English, it's from Latin (and therefore local to no one, since it's a dead language), and if I recall correctly it is actually specified in the RFCs. Assuming I'm not wrong about that, localization is inappropriate and Mutt is correct to force using Re: in the subject line. Be lenient in what you accept, and strict in what you emit. Hmm. Ok, then. But this is from /usr/share/doc/mutt/manual.txt.gz (Debian): 3.210. reply_regexp Type: regular expression Default: “^(re([\[0-9\]+])*|aw):[ \t]*” A regular expression used to recognize reply messages when threading and replying. The default value corresponds to the English Re: and the German Aw:. So it seems German is accepted by some people! -- Salve
Re: Local alternative to Re:
On Thu, Dec 01, 2011 at 10:59:04PM +0100, Salve Håkedal wrote: On Thu, Dec 01, 2011 at 08:31:21PM +0100, Salve Håkedal wrote: I'm Norwegian. I'd like to have mutt put 'Sv:' instead of 'Re:' when I reply to messages, but can't find how to do it. Re: is not from English, it's from Latin (and therefore local to no one, since it's a dead language), and if I recall correctly it is actually specified in the RFCs. Assuming I'm not wrong about that, localization is inappropriate and Mutt is correct to force using Re: in the subject line. Be lenient in what you accept, and strict in what you emit. Hmm. Ok, then. But this is from /usr/share/doc/mutt/manual.txt.gz (Debian): 3.210. reply_regexp [...] So it seems German is accepted by some people! Yeah, likely explanation: Thomas (the previous Mutt maintainer) is German, and probably added this before RFC 2822 was published. But note that this does not conflict with anything I wrote, particularly, Be lenient in what you accept, but be strict in what you emit. Many e-mail clients allow/have localized versions of the string; they violate the spec, but you still have to be able to deal with them. Mutt should still SEND Re: in all cases. (I would argue the default value should be changed, but I don't care enough to file a bug for it.) -- Derek D. Martinhttp://www.pizzashack.org/ GPG Key ID: 0xDFBEAD02 -=-=-=-=- This message is posted from an invalid address. Replying to it will result in undeliverable mail due to spam prevention. Sorry for the inconvenience. pgpM48h0XByWj.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Local alternative to Re:
* Salve Håkedal schrieb am 01. Dez. 2011: Hmm. Ok, then. But this is from /usr/share/doc/mutt/manual.txt.gz (Debian): 3.210. reply_regexp Type: regular expression Default: “^(re([\[0-9\]+])*|aw):[ \t]*” A regular expression used to recognize reply messages when threading and replying. The default value corresponds to the English Re: and the German Aw:. So it seems German is accepted by some people! Hmm... Aw is the abbreviation for Antwort an not for Answer? Funny... :-) Andreas
Re: Local alternative to Re:
Ave Salve! Salve Håkedal schrieb am 01.12.2011 um 22:59 (+0100): /usr/share/doc/mutt/manual.txt.gz (Debian): 3.210. reply_regexp Type: regular expression Default: “^(re([\[0-9\]+])*|aw):[ \t]*” A regular expression used to recognize reply messages when threading and replying. The default value corresponds to the English Re: and the German Aw:. So it seems German is accepted by some people! Close to 100 million :) -- Michael Ludwig
Re: Local alternative to Re:
* On 01 Dec 2011, Derek Martin wrote: Incidentally, while looking this up, I ran across a post which suggested that the intent behind specifying a specific string in the RFC was that it made two related problems simple: ... the second is that mail clients can simply choose to *display* a localized version of 'Re:' instead of that string. The hueristic for doing so is greatly simplified if the token is standardized and invariable. Agreed, and FWIW my 'subjectrx' patch makes that possible. It enables any kind of regex-based subject munging that affects only message display, including this: subjectrx '^([rR][eE]|[Aa][wW]):' Sv: I mainly use this patch for erasing those [MailingListName] tags that some list owners find indispensible. This patch is part of the patch queue at https://bitbucket.org/dgc/mutt-dgc/ if you want to try it. It depends on the 'replacelist' patch which precedes it. To me, re: is more metadata than text. You'd rarely catch any speaker of English saying it aloud. -- David Champion • d...@uchicago.edu • IT Services • University of Chicago
Re: Local alternative to Re:
2/12 -11, Michael Ludwig wrote: Ave Salve! God morgen Mikkel! Salve Håkedal schrieb am 01.12.2011 um 22:59 (+0100): /usr/share/doc/mutt/manual.txt.gz (Debian): 3.210. reply_regexp Type: regular expression Default: “^(re([\[0-9\]+])*|aw):[ \t]*” A regular expression used to recognize reply messages when threading and replying. The default value corresponds to the English Re: and the German Aw:. So it seems German is accepted by some people! Close to 100 million :) 100 million German mutt users! Mein Gott!! As far as I know, I'm the only Norwegian! -- Salve -- Michael Ludwig
