Re: [mythtv-users] Feature Idea - P2P Bad Idea
gLaNDix (Jesse Kaufman) wrote: Nick Rout wrote: If you want to share programs you have recorded with myth, do so outside the immediate myth environment. exactly ... does it really need to be integrated? up until now it really hasn't, and it works just fine with movies/shows downloaded via bittorrent (not that i'd know, of course ;) ...) if people really want to do that, they can fire up azureus, bitcomet, bit tornado, or any of the other many, many, many bittorrent clients and still use myth to view/organize them The point is to have a seemless environment to download/watch/organize content off the net the same as you have to watch over-the-air/cable/etc. The net is just another distribution channel. There is plenty of stuff out there (systm, From the Shadows, etc.) which is perfectly legal and distributed on the net. With cheap digital video cameras and software like iMovie, there will only be more coming. Look at podcasting if you've heard of that. Thousands of hours of audio programming being created by users and distributed over the net. One of the pvrs _will_ have an integrated way to get net content, you can be sure of that. If Myth doesn't have it, it'll be one more reason for people not to use it. I know that bittorrent has many legal uses. IMHO adding it in to mythtv would only serve bt's detractors. exactly, it's playing with fire ... sure, nothing may ever come of it, but i'm sure any developer wouldn't want to fork out the cash for a lawyer when it wasn't their idea in the first place ... This is exactly the kind of chilling of innovation the media companies want. They don't have to make a technology illegal if everybody pees themselves with fear when they come within arm's length of it. There's already enough legal content to make this argument invalid and there's only going to be more in the coming months/years. ___ mythtv-users mailing list mythtv-users@mythtv.org http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
Re: [mythtv-users] Feature Idea - P2P Bad Idea
On 7/7/05, Matt Grommes [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: One of the pvrs _will_ have an integrated way to get net content, you can be sure of that. If Myth doesn't have it, it'll be one more reason for people not to use it. Perhaps you're missing a large point here. Most of the developers of Myth don't care if you use it or not. They're working on it because they want to use it or they enjoy working on it. Yes, a larger user base provides better testing and some other benefits, but remember that this is not a commercial venture. This is Isaac's pet project that has taken off into something that many people want to use. He's happy to share that with those of us who want to use it. If you'd rather use something else, knock yourself out. I'm certainly not going to lose any sleep over it and I'm sure Isaac won't either. This is exactly the kind of chilling of innovation the media companies want. They don't have to make a technology illegal if everybody pees themselves with fear when they come within arm's length of it. There's already enough legal content to make this argument invalid and there's only going to be more in the coming months/years. The argument may be invalid, but that still doesn't stop any of those media companies from bringing a lawsuit against the Myth community/developers. They don't have to prove that anything illegal was done, they just have to force the defendant to pay fees (lawyer, etc) that are more than the defendant can afford. Maybe if you provide, up-front, the massive cash reserves that would be needed to defend that court case someone will consider developing this, but I doubt it. Until then, I think it's very clear that the majority of the folks involved with Myth don't wany any parts of any P2P app associated with Myth and Isaac has certainly made his views on that topic very clear on repeated occasions. It's his project. If you want to play with it, you play by his rules. If you don't like those rules, find another project. I know some of that message sounds pretty harsh. I don't intend it to be insulting or anything like that. It's just that this P2P discussion comes up frequently enough that it's getting annoying to me. It has been repeatedly made clear that the people behind Myth don't want this in the current environment so why does this discussion keep happening? ___ mythtv-users mailing list mythtv-users@mythtv.org http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
Re: [mythtv-users] Feature Idea - P2P Bad Idea
I know some of that message sounds pretty harsh. I don't intend it to be insulting or anything like that. It's just that this P2P discussion comes up frequently enough that it's getting annoying to me. It has been repeatedly made clear that the people behind Myth don't want this in the current environment so why does this discussion keep happening? because the list is found by a steady stream of new people and just like anything, people feel they are the first to make a connection between two memes. Truth be told, someone WAS the first, but there have been many others in the same footsteps. Maybe posting to the list should require a mandatory search of the archives before a submit is allowed? 8^) ___ mythtv-users mailing list mythtv-users@mythtv.org http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
Re: [mythtv-users] Feature Idea - P2P Bad Idea
On Thu, 07 Jul 2005 10:29:59 -0600 Matt Grommes wrote: gLaNDix (Jesse Kaufman) wrote: Nick Rout wrote: If you want to share programs you have recorded with myth, do so outside the immediate myth environment. exactly ... does it really need to be integrated? up until now it really hasn't, and it works just fine with movies/shows downloaded via bittorrent (not that i'd know, of course ;) ...) if people really want to do that, they can fire up azureus, bitcomet, bit tornado, or any of the other many, many, many bittorrent clients and still use myth to view/organize them The point is to have a seemless environment to download/watch/organize content off the net the same as you have to watch over-the-air/cable/etc. The net is just another distribution channel. There is plenty of stuff out there (systm, From the Shadows, etc.) which is perfectly legal and distributed on the net. With cheap digital video cameras and software like iMovie, there will only be more coming. Look at podcasting if you've heard of that. Thousands of hours of audio programming being created by users and distributed over the net. One of the pvrs _will_ have an integrated way to get net content, you can be sure of that. If Myth doesn't have it, it'll be one more reason for people not to use it. the conversation was not about getting content from elsewhere, it was about seeding copyrighted programs once you have recorded them. -- Nick Rout ___ mythtv-users mailing list mythtv-users@mythtv.org http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
Re: [mythtv-users] Feature Idea - P2P Bad Idea
The only thing I want to add to this is that although actively promoting stealing of copyrighted material is a terrible terrible idea for MythTV to become a part of we have to keep our minds open to the legal use. For example http://www.systm.org is an online TV show that is distributed over bittorrent. So long as any p2p software is geared towards allowing people to get that kind of content is fine. On Wed, 2005-04-06 at 13:54 -0400, dean collins wrote: Feature Idea - NEW __ I'm sitting here downloading a few torrents when an idea for a mytTV feature popped into my head (it's prolly because of the heat). The idea of combining a media sharing applet into mythTV based on the torrent model. In other words, as you're watching a particular TV channel, you become a seed where others can watch the same channel you're watching. As others connect to your server to watch the stream, they themselves become servers which others can connect to, and the video stream would remain intact so long as the original seed continued to watch a particular station. I don't know if I'm explaining this well, or if I am, if what I'm thinking is possible, but if it were, the idea of being able to increase the number of channels you have available to could be quite exciting. Just a thought -joe ___ mythtv-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.snowman.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users I agree with what everyone else posted about this in that it is a really bad idea to open Myth tv to P2P ?Cease and desist? orders. Having said that ? this feature is really similar to the Cybersky.tv software from germany, they have won quite a few cases in the EU courts recently because they don?t actually cache the content only pass it on. Like I said bad idea, we don?t have the funding to fight these court cases. Cheers, Dean ___ mythtv-users mailing list mythtv-users@mythtv.org http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users -- Evan Alter [EMAIL PROTECTED] SKYLIST Email Marketing Solutions that Deliver Service You Can Trust You are receiving this email message from a representative of SKYLIST, Inc. 13171 Pond Springs Road, Austin, TX 78729 Toll Free: 877.250.2922 To cease all communication with SKYLIST, visit http://www.skylist.net/unsubscribe or send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ mythtv-users mailing list mythtv-users@mythtv.org http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
Re: [mythtv-users] Feature Idea - P2P Bad Idea
Man... have to tread lightly here... I sure don't want MythTV in any crosshairs. -+- I Like My MythTV -+- (ooppss.. hope I don't get sued for that...) Evan Alter wrote: The only thing I want to add to this is that although actively promoting stealing of copyrighted material is a terrible terrible idea for MythTV to become a part of we have to keep our minds open to the legal use. For example http://www.systm.org is an online TV show that is distributed over bittorrent. So long as any p2p software is geared towards allowing people to get that kind of content is fine. On Wed, 2005-04-06 at 13:54 -0400, dean collins wrote: Feature Idea - NEW I'm sitting here downloading a few torrents when an idea for a mytTV feature popped into my head (it's prolly because of the heat). The idea of combining a media sharing applet into mythTV based on the torrent model. In other words, as you're watching a particular TV channel, you become a seed where others can watch the same channel you're watching. As others connect to your server to watch the stream, they themselves become servers which others can connect to, and the video stream would remain intact so long as the original seed continued to watch a particular station. I don't know if I'm explaining this well, or if I am, if what I'm thinking is possible, but if it were, the idea of being able to increase the number of channels you have available to could be quite exciting. Just a thought -joe ___ mythtv-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.snowman.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users I agree with what everyone else posted about this in that it is a really bad idea to open Myth tv to P2P ?Cease and desist? orders. Having said that ? this feature is really similar to the Cybersky.tv software from germany, they have won quite a few cases in the EU courts recently because they don?t actually cache the content only pass it on. Like I said bad idea, we don?t have the funding to fight these court cases. Cheers, Dean ___ mythtv-users mailing list mythtv-users@mythtv.org http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
Re: [mythtv-users] Feature Idea - P2P Bad Idea
There is a huge difference between recording a show for your personal enjoyment or archiving, which is not really different to a vcr, and on the other hand rebroadcasting it via bittorrent. myth is primarily geared to organising the recording and viewing of live tv. That is only legal to the extent that it is fair use. Myth should not risk the wrath of the tv companies by becoming a vehicle for illegal torrenting. If you want to share programs you have recorded with myth, do so outside the immediate myth environment. If you introduced a facility within myth to automatically announce/seed a torrent the only conclusion that could be drawn is that you were going to use for an illegal purpose. I know that bittorrent has many legal uses. IMHO adding it in to mythtv would only serve bt's detractors. On Wed, 06 Jul 2005 15:31:13 -0500 Evan Alter wrote: The only thing I want to add to this is that although actively promoting stealing of copyrighted material is a terrible terrible idea for MythTV to become a part of we have to keep our minds open to the legal use. For example http://www.systm.org is an online TV show that is distributed over bittorrent. So long as any p2p software is geared towards allowing people to get that kind of content is fine. On Wed, 2005-04-06 at 13:54 -0400, dean collins wrote: Feature Idea - NEW __ I'm sitting here downloading a few torrents when an idea for a mytTV feature popped into my head (it's prolly because of the heat). The idea of combining a media sharing applet into mythTV based on the torrent model. In other words, as you're watching a particular TV channel, you become a seed where others can watch the same channel you're watching. As others connect to your server to watch the stream, they themselves become servers which others can connect to, and the video stream would remain intact so long as the original seed continued to watch a particular station. I don't know if I'm explaining this well, or if I am, if what I'm thinking is possible, but if it were, the idea of being able to increase the number of channels you have available to could be quite exciting. Just a thought -joe ___ mythtv-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.snowman.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users I agree with what everyone else posted about this in that it is a really bad idea to open Myth tv to P2P ?Cease and desist? orders. Having said that ? this feature is really similar to the Cybersky.tv software from germany, they have won quite a few cases in the EU courts recently because they don?t actually cache the content only pass it on. Like I said bad idea, we don?t have the funding to fight these court cases. Cheers, Dean ___ mythtv-users mailing list mythtv-users@mythtv.org http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users -- Evan Alter [EMAIL PROTECTED] SKYLIST Email Marketing Solutions that Deliver Service You Can Trust You are receiving this email message from a representative of SKYLIST, Inc. 13171 Pond Springs Road, Austin, TX 78729 Toll Free: 877.250.2922 To cease all communication with SKYLIST, visit http://www.skylist.net/unsubscribe or send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Nick Rout ___ mythtv-users mailing list mythtv-users@mythtv.org http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
Re: [mythtv-users] Feature Idea - P2P Bad Idea
Nick Rout wrote: If you want to share programs you have recorded with myth, do so outside the immediate myth environment. exactly ... does it really need to be integrated? up until now it really hasn't, and it works just fine with movies/shows downloaded via bittorrent (not that i'd know, of course ;) ...) if people really want to do that, they can fire up azureus, bitcomet, bit tornado, or any of the other many, many, many bittorrent clients and still use myth to view/organize them I know that bittorrent has many legal uses. IMHO adding it in to mythtv would only serve bt's detractors. exactly, it's playing with fire ... sure, nothing may ever come of it, but i'm sure any developer wouldn't want to fork out the cash for a lawyer when it wasn't their idea in the first place ... -g- ___ mythtv-users mailing list mythtv-users@mythtv.org http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
[mythtv-users] Feature Idea - P2P Bad Idea
Feature Idea - NEW I'm sitting here downloading a few torrents when an idea for a mytTV feature popped into my head (it's prolly because of the heat). The idea of combining a media sharing applet into mythTV based on the torrent model. In other words, as you're watching a particular TV channel, you become a seed where others can watch the same channel you're watching. As others connect to your server to watch the stream, they themselves become servers which others can connect to, and the video stream would remain intact so long as the original seed continued to watch a particular station. I don't know if I'm explaining this well, or if I am, if what I'm thinking is possible, but if it were, the idea of being able to increase the number of channels you have available to could be quite exciting. Just a thought -joe ___ mythtv-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.snowman.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users I agree with what everyone else posted about this in that it is a really bad idea to open Myth tv to P2P Cease and desist orders. Having said that this feature is really similar to the Cybersky.tv software from germany, they have won quite a few cases in the EU courts recently because they dont actually cache the content only pass it on. Like I said bad idea, we dont have the funding to fight these court cases. Cheers, Dean ___ mythtv-users mailing list mythtv-users@mythtv.org http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
RE: [mythtv-users] Feature Idea - P2P Bad Idea
Exactly, as I said in the original email - we are just asking for trouble if we go down that path. Dean -Original Message- From: PAUL WILLIAMSON [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, April 06, 2005 2:37 PM To: dean collins Subject: Re: [mythtv-users] Feature Idea - P2P Bad Idea It already exists. It won't ever (at least in today's society) be implemented into the main myth code. Look for torrentocracy. We (myth users) don't need the MPAA or RIAA looking over our shoulders more than they probablyt already are. Paul [EMAIL PROTECTED] 04/06/05 1:54 PM Feature Idea - NEW I'm sitting here downloading a few torrents when an idea for a mytTV feature popped into my head (it's prolly because of the heat). The idea of combining a media sharing applet into mythTV based on the torrent model. In other words, as you're watching a particular TV channel, you become a seed where others can watch the same channel you're watching. As others connect to your server to watch the stream, they themselves become servers which others can connect to, and the video stream would remain intact so long as the original seed continued to watch a particular station. I don't know if I'm explaining this well, or if I am, if what I'm thinking is possible, but if it were, the idea of being able to increase the number of channels you have available to could be quite exciting. Just a thought -joe ___ mythtv-users mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.snowman.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users I agree with what everyone else posted about this in that it is a really bad idea to open Myth tv to P2P 'Cease and desist' orders. Having said that - this feature is really similar to the Cybersky.tv software from germany, they have won quite a few cases in the EU courts recently because they don't actually cache the content only pass it on. Like I said bad idea, we don't have the funding to fight these court cases. Cheers, Dean ___ mythtv-users mailing list mythtv-users@mythtv.org http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
Re: [mythtv-users] Feature Idea - P2P Bad Idea
On Wednesday 06 April 2005 9:54 am, dean collins wrote: I don't know if I'm explaining this well, or if I am, if what I'm thinking is possible, but if it were, the idea of being able to increase the number of channels you have available to could be quite exciting. The last two words of your Subject says it all. Quite exciting indeed, as the police knock down your door. -- __Jsa_ ___ mythtv-users mailing list mythtv-users@mythtv.org http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
Re: [mythtv-users] Feature Idea - P2P Bad Idea
On Wednesday 06 April 2005 11:37 am, John Andersen wrote: On Wednesday 06 April 2005 9:54 am, dean collins wrote: I don't know if I'm explaining this well, or if I am, if what I'm thinking is possible, but if it were, the idea of being able to increase the number of channels you have available to could be quite exciting. The last two words of your Subject says it all. Quite exciting indeed, as the police knock down your door. Dean: Your mail reader's quoting style made it appear YOU were the originator of this Idea. You should fix that, because to any proper mail reader your post looks like the originator. 1) No RE: in the subject 2) No indicator of what is quoted text 3) No In Reply to header All of these are signs of a defective mail package, and peaking at your headers confirms it. Sorry if it appears by my reply I was attributing this Idea to you. -- __Jsa_ ___ mythtv-users mailing list mythtv-users@mythtv.org http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
