[neonixie-l] Re: Possibly offtopic - Vintage MV1 LEDs for sale

['AnubisTTP' via neonixie-l]

Yes, that $265 price is in 1969 dollars, the MV2 was insanely expensive 
when it was released. The MV2 was not really usable as an indicator 
though... it can only be seen in a darkened room. The only evidence I have 
ever found of them being used was in scientific experiments in the late 
1960s. I have not been able to pin down a good price for what MV1s sold for 
in single quantities, but a 1968 price list I read listed them at $18 
dollars each in quantites of 1000. It is my understanding that most of the 
assembly for these was done by hand... I have read accounts that say the 
dies were placed in the LEDs manually with a pair of tweezers.

The ones I am selling are not in the original packaging, they were found in 
a plastic sack with the word "MV1" written on it in marker. I also checked 
them under a microscope and they have the same die and internal 
construction as an MV1 I have that was still in it's original Monsanto 
packaging.

On Thursday, April 12, 2018 at 4:29:31 PM UTC-4, Terry Kennedy wrote:
>
>
>
> Do you know what the list price for this was back in 1968? Your MV2 
> article says "a new MV2 was approximately $265 dollars in 1969". Was 
> that expressed in 1969 dollars, or in current dollars? If in 1969 dollars, 
> that was a HUGE sum - for the more youthful people here, you could buy any 
> one of a number of number of brand new mid-range cars (and even some sports 
> cars like the Opel GT were in that range) for the low $3000's, and a VW 
> Beetle was only $1699.
>
> How much of the production was hand assembly (you show several production 
> failures in your article)? Do you know if they ever automated the line any 
> further? I worked at a factory in the mid-1970's that produced bases for 
> crystal cans, and that was all done by hand although the leads were 
> purchased as pre-forms. One of the factory's biggest sellers was the base 
> for the Motorola 3.58MHz crystal that was used in many television sets.
>
> Moving back on-topic, are the ones you have for sale loose pieces, in the 
> original clamshell, or in the later plastic bag?
>

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Re: [neonixie-l] Possibly offtopic - Vintage MV1 LEDs for sale

['AnubisTTP' via neonixie-l]

These LEDs are very dim...they can be seen as a dot of light from about 2 
feet away in a normal indoor room, but sunlight renders them completely 
invisible. The only time I have ever seen them used in a piece of equipment 
was in a teletype tester as a panel indicator; the operator would have to 
flip up a cover to view the LEDs. Nobody is going to be building a 1000 
lumen flashlight from these!

On Thursday, April 12, 2018 at 11:09:44 AM UTC-4, Jens Boos wrote:
>
> This is pretty interesting. On the pictures on your website the LED looks 
> a bit dim. (But, having photographed my share of Nixie tubes, I know how 
> difficult it can be to get the brightness and all details right.) So I am 
> just wondering how bright this LED appears in person? Also, what current 
> does it draw?
>
> Cheers
> Jens
>

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[neonixie-l] Possibly offtopic - Vintage MV1 LEDs for sale

['AnubisTTP' via neonixie-l]

I am not sure if this is offtopic or not, if so, mods please remove. I have 
recently come into possession of a small quantity of Monsanto MV1 LEDs... 
the MV1 is the first commercially produced LED, released in 1968. I am 
selling these for $12 dollars each; I figured I would try selling them here 
before going to Ebay. The only one of these to come up on Ebay in the past 
6 months or so sold for $30 dollars, so this is quite a good deal. Contact 
me offlist at anubis#industrialalchemy.org (change pound to at symbol) if 
you are interested. I am located in the US, Paypal payment and 
international shipping are available.

Here is a link with more information about the Monsanto MV1 LED.

http://www.industrialalchemy.org/articleview.php?item=975

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[neonixie-l] Re: Cutting the front off a Burroughs SD-11 sphericular display

['AnubisTTP' via neonixie-l]

Wow, that digital sundial is very impressive, and does look like it works 
on the same principle. Building a larger digital display does seem like it 
could solve most of the problems of making your own symbols... get a bunch 
of surplus magnifiers, mount them in a frame, and drill a million holes in 
an opaque sheet with a CNC machine to make the pixel mask. The SD-11 has is 
a 30x30 matrix, which would mean finding 900 identical lenses somewhere to 
build something of the same resolution. Time to take up acrylic casting?


On Friday, January 19, 2018 at 8:23:25 AM UTC-5, redrok wrote:
>
>
> Hi Anubis;
>
> The operation is very related to the "Digital Sundials" 
> .
> I have one of the "Digital Sundials International" 
>  dials.
> It works very well. Of course it reads in local "Solar" time.
>
> I think the SD-11 works in a similar way.The sundial has a front surface 
> with vertical
> line and a similar shadow mask with lines and missing lines that form the 
> numbers.
> The sundial is unaffected by the vertical position of the sun, only to the 
> east/west motion.
>
> East lamp in the SD-11 has a 2 dimension mask of primary holes. One hole 
> for each pixel
> in the screen. Then a shadow mask with a hole positioned for each lamp to 
> form the characters.
>
> I wrote a program. years ago, to make the sundial in large size. Something 
> I could actually make.
> I suspect making a large display similar to the SD-11 would be much easier 
> to do.
> Possibly done with a PC board lithographic camera controlled with Gerber 
> codes.
>
> I can even see a CNC machine drilling holes in metal sheets.
>
> redrok
>

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[neonixie-l] Cutting the front off a Burroughs SD-11 sphericular display

['AnubisTTP' via neonixie-l]

The Burroughs SD-11 sphericular display has historically been a pretty 
mysterious device... it has incandescent bulbs and looks like a projection 
display, but produces numbers using a dramatically different system. 
Normally SD-11s are glued shut and can't be dissembled, but I had a damaged 
one so I sacrificed it to the screwdriver gods and took lots of pictures 
explaining how this very strange device works. Enjoy!

http://www.industrialalchemy.org/articleview.php?item=626

If someone could come up with a good way to make a replacement mask, it 
might even be possible to change the characters displayed on one of these. 
I don't think a laser printer with transparency paper will work for a 
sphericular display like it does for projection displays; the one I cut 
apart above has about 4500 tiny circles printed in a 1 inch square. One 
would need a very high resolution printer and good transparency film to 
pull that off...

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[neonixie-l] Re: Circuit diagram for the Russian A-201 polyatron?

[AnubisTTP]

I have read in multiple places that the screen electrode in the A201 is to 
prevent fouling of the anodes with sputter material from the cathodes. 

Regards
Richard Kline

On Saturday, February 16, 2013 7:16:00 AM UTC-5, Dekatron42 wrote:
>
> Hi All,
>  
> Does anyone have a circuit diagram for the Russian Polyatron A-201 that 
> they could share with me - I have the datasheet (a few different versions) 
> and also some information from other books but nothing that shows an actual 
> circuit with the A-201 in it. I can get it to work with whats in the 
> datasheets but i would like to find an instrument or a true application 
> that actually used them
>  
> /Martin
>

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[neonixie-l] Re: Circuit diagram for the Russian A-201 polyatron?

[AnubisTTP]

On Saturday, February 16, 2013 7:16:00 AM UTC-5, Dekatron42 wrote:
>
> Hi All,
>  
> Does anyone have a circuit diagram for the Russian Polyatron A-201 that 
> they could share with me - I have the datasheet (a few different versions) 
> and also some information from other books but nothing that shows an actual 
> circuit with the A-201 in it. I can get it to work with whats in the 
> datasheets but i would like to find an instrument or a true application 
> that actually used them
>  
> /Martin
>

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[neonixie-l] Re: Kopriso Nixie Watch third glimpse

[AnubisTTP]

The obvious solution is to geek out completely and make a dekatron
watch that tells time in metric! Use two A108s and divide the day into
10 hours of 100 minutes, then have the first tube display hours and
the second 10s of minutes. Sure, nobody is going to be able to read
the thing, but once you get to the point where you are seriously
talking about building a dekatron-based watch, I think all hope of
having a practical device has been thrown out the window already.

Ultimately building a dekatron watch is to doable though, to really
break people's brains you are going to have to build a watch out of
direct view beam switching tubes.

http://www.decadecounter.com/vta/articleview.php?item=1090

If someone manages to actually pull that off, they could probably
somehow tap their own lack of sanity as a power source...

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[neonixie-l] Re: IEEFD51 minitron

[AnubisTTP]

There is a datasheet for most of the common Aurora displays (including
the FFD51) on this page. The pinouts are, unfortunately, completely
different from the 3015-F.

http://www.decadecounter.com/vta/articleview.php?item=67

Regards
Richard Kline

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[neonixie-l] Re: Dud Dekatron Query

[AnubisTTP]

The EZ10B is filled with hydrogen and seems to be incredibly unstable,
of the 10 I have bought over the years, six were DOA and another one
failed in storage. The EZ10A is filled with argon and seems to fare
much better from what I have seen, although I have still had a few
show up outgassed from Ebay I have never had one fail in storage.
Strangely, the ECT100, which is another hydrogen filled counter made
by Elesta, seems to be stable; the 13 that I have handled have all
been fully functional.

Richard Kline

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[neonixie-l] Re: Dud Dekatron Query

[AnubisTTP]

I have bought around 100 OG3 tubes over the years and I would say that
about 25% of them have been duds, mostly from gas loss but some with
shorted cathodes and similar manufacturing errors. That said I have
never had an OG3 fail after it comes into my hands, as is common with
the 6909 and 6910. Apparently once the tubes are rescued from whatever
corrosive government surplus warehouse they were stockpiled in in
Russia, they hold up alright. The OG7 seems to have about the same
failure rate as the OG3, though I have had one of these tubes fail in
storage and I have never had an OG3 fail in storage The OG4 is rock
solid, I have never had one fail, and very few of them show up from
Russia with defects it seems. The more exotic Russian high-speeds (the
OG8 and A106 mainly) seem to have extremely high failure rates and
should be avoided by everyone except the dekatron completionist. Every
single OG8 I have bought, from multiple sellers over the past five
years, has been defective except for one. The A108 and A109 appear to
have about a 10% defect rate from the factory based on the lots I have
bought, but don't seem to fail in storage; at least I have never had
an A108 or A109 fail on the shelf and I have a number of them.

Richard Kline
http://www.decadecounter.com/

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[neonixie-l] Re: Clock project with ITS1A tube

[AnubisTTP]

An IN-6 might be an interesting choice, though I have not tried it
myself; all of the lots of IN-6s on Ebay right now are for silly-huge
quantities that only make sense if you are going to build a dot matrix
display. I only used the MTX90's because they don't seem to get much
use in projects and it was a nice change from perpetually swirling
INS-1s.

On Dec 9, 7:35 pm, MichaelB  wrote:
> Right, however these appear to be significantly larger than the
> finicky INS-1. Now, they may well be just as finicky, but I like the
> larger size for this and other applications.
>
> On Dec 9, 11:40 am, John Rehwinkel  wrote:
>
> > > I too am interested. Left a message on Brian's forum. I have some if
> > > the ITS1A's, but I'll have to scrounge for the MTX90's. Anybody know
> > > of any available?
>
> > If not, you could always just INS-1s or any other neon indicator.  The 
> > circuit just switches power to them, they're not used as thyratrons.
>
> > - John

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[neonixie-l] Clock project with ITS1A tube

[AnubisTTP]

I just completed a clock project that uses a tube I have been wanting
to build something out of for a long time, a Soviet-era ITS1A seven
segment display.

http://www.decadecounter.com/vta/articleview.php?item=1073

I did have a few tubeless kit versions of this clock for sale for $60,
but they sold out even before I had completed typing up the article
for the project. If there is any interest I could probably have some
more of them made but I can't supply the ITS1A tube or other tubes, so
a kit would only be useful to the small portion of the Nixie community
that already has some ITS1A tubes laying about.

Richard Kline
www.decadecounter.com

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[neonixie-l] Re: What on earth is this? Soviet VFD

[AnubisTTP]

These are EL displays, they work in the same manner as the EL wire
that is commonly available nowadays, but spread out flat instead of
rolled in a wire. The Russians made lots of different EL displays but
they do not often come up on Ebay for sale. This is one of the more
unusual types, the strange segment pattern allows the display to draw
Cyrillic alphanumeric characters. This one can do numbers too, though
the "4" character ends up kind of deformed looking.

Richard Kline
www.decadecounter.com

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[neonixie-l] Re: Large VFD 7 x 9 dot matrix displays not as they seem???

[AnubisTTP]

A disclaimer; I took the photo on the decadecounter.com website, and
the example provided to us by Terry Kennedy had the same manufacturing
errors as everyone else has noted. At the time I wrote the entry on
the website linked above, I was not aware that any other examples of
this display had the same manufacturing defects as mine, I just
assumed mine was the typical defective display that seems to come
mixed in with any large Russian surplus order. I will update the entry
on the decadecounter.com site with this information, since it appears
that my sample of this tube was not an anomalous example of the
device. My belief that the display was made in Russia was based on the
observations below as well as the linked image below showing an
earlier, definitely Russian made version of this display.

http://www.decadecounter.com/vta/pict14/udt3old.jpg

# The nipple is mounted to the face of the envelope with frit. I have
never seen this style of mounting in the myriad Japanese made VFDs I
have handled over the years, but I have seen it on a goodly portion of
the Russian-made flat VFDs, eg the ILC1 1/7 , P789, and ILM2-9MV.

# The date code is applied with a rubber stamp like the various
mid-90s Reflector made tubes available on Ebay, and it is in Cyrillic.
I can't say I have ever seen a Japanese VFD marked with a rubber
stamp, and I know I have never seen a Japanese display marked with
Cyrillic characters.

# Every Japanese flat VFD display I have ever seen has had lot
numbers, stencil numbers, etc, printed in the black material applied
to the back of the display. The black material on the back of the UDT
display I posses has zero markings, numbers ,or other such
information.

Knowing that all the displays were defective makes me believe even
less that they are Japanese in origin. It requires me to believe that
some random Japanese VFD manufacturer out there was stupid enough to,
eg, think that some equally random Russian VFD manufacturer could copy
their VFD, yet be stymied by a thin piece of sheet metal. Did this
Japanese manufacturer assume that the defect would somehow be missed
before the design went to the production floor? That the Russians
would not have access to diagonal cutter technology? There is
definitely something weird going on with these displays, but I just
can't buy that it was sabotage from a foreign manufacturer. Maybe it
is completely intentional, and the UDT3 is a failed attempt to make
some sort of "VU meter" style bargraph display. The seller on Ebay has
unloaded literally hundreds of these tubes over the past year, could
they 'all' be manufacturing mistakes?

It should be noted that I have been contacted by at least one Russian
reader of the site who confirmed that there is something very strange
going on with this display. He said that he was under the impression
the Reflector plant had closed three years ago and Russian nixie
collectors had not seen any Russian VFD displays dated later than
2003. All the other post-90's VFDs' I have seen from Russia have the
Reflector factory mark on them, but if the Reflector plant closed 3
years ago, where was this thing made?

Regards
Richard Kline
http://www.decadecounter.com

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