Re: Online converters

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <59b36aac3ccvj...@waitrose.com>,
   Chris Newman  wrote:
> In article <59b2e89e73li...@torrens.org>,
>    Richard Torrens (lists)  wrote:
> > Has anyone found a file converter that will work with Netsurf?

> > I am looking for docx  to pdf.

> Techwriter will do that on a RISC OS machine.

The requsest was for something that worked with Netsurf!

Many years ago I bought Techwriter Professional. Didn't like the program
so stopped using it.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!
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Re: Online converters

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <3a8615b359.harr...@bazleyfamily.co.uk>,
   Harriet Bazley  wrote:
> On 30 Jan 2022 as I do recall,
>   Richard Torrens (lists) wrote:

> > Has anyone found a file converter that will work with Netsurf?
> > 
> > I am looking for docx  to pdf.
> > 
> I have this one bookmarked for XLSX to XLS, and it also seems to offer
> 'Word to PDF'.

> https://convertstandard.com/word2pdf.aspx

> Tested, and it works - with the proviso that the first time I tried to
> open the resulting PDF I was asked for a (non-existing) password, but it
> worked on the second attempt.

Thanks Harriet. I tried 15 other converters before asking - this one did
not turn up on a duckduckgo search before I gave up.

The page doesn't display well in Netsurf but the "Drop file here" box is
evident. It was a large (9MB) file and nothing appeared to happen. I had
nearly given up when Netsurf's download window appeared. Now down to 3656KB.

The download wes filetyped XML but has a /pdf name. But re-typing to pdf it
worked properly.

So yes, it works fine.

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and more!
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Online converters

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

Has anyone found a file converter that will work with Netsurf?

I am looking for docx  to pdf.

-- 
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http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!
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Mailto:

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

Not sure when it dates from, but some time ago Netsurf stopped handling a
mailto: responses properly.

For example I have a perl contact program which can return a mailto:
address. This does not get passed on. Try

http://www.torrens.org/cgi-bin/Contact.cgi?Contact=Contact&CheckVar=Netsf


This on ARMX6   5.27 (08-Jun-20)

I tried the bug tracker but there seem to be no instructions as to how to
use it.

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and more!
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Re: "Warning from Netsurf: Unknown"

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <20191104112318.oax3l5xs43fqr...@kyllikki.org>,
   Vincent Sanders  wrote:
> I have changed how all network errors are reported to be a proper
> error page instead of a popup. please can those affected (using CI
> builds) confirm that the new behaviour is more informative and works
> for them.

Nice one! 

Yes, the error "Couldn't resolve host name" is reported nicely.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: 3.9 Release

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <20190615175934.gh14...@kyllikki.org>,
   Vincent Sanders  wrote:
> A lot of features and bug fixes have happened since the 3.8 release so
> I am considering producing a 3.9 soon.

A (hopefully small) point:  for some time now Netsurf seems to be picking
up only the first css link.

On all my www pages I have two css links - the second one defines the
header and is ignored.

But great work what has been done. Thanks for that.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: SVG

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <5789dcef69...@timil.com>,
   Tim Hill  wrote:
> > It's also curious tha the text is truncated on the left margin as if
> > CSS left-margin has a negative value.

> You can try and decipher their CSS here:
> https://www.electronics-notes.com/parts/css/style.complete.min.css?go=6

> (The page in NetSurf is blank. Press f8 then use search and replace to
> change the } into }+newline and change the wrapwidth to 1024.)

Yes, I got that and had a quick look. Not an easy page to understand
without a lot of processing.

> There's a width of 1270px in there which may be responsible but I didn't
> cross-refer all the style and whatnot.

It cannot be a negative left-margin as negative values aren't allowed.

However - might Metsurf be calculating the margin and ending up with a
negative result?

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

SVG

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

How far has SVG rendering got?

sVGs are not common yet, but I met a page with some prsent, which don't
display properly:

https://www.electronics-notes.com/articles/antennas-propagation/dipole-antenna/folded-dipole.php

It's also curious tha the text is truncated on the left margin as if CSS
left-margin has a negative value.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

mailto:

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

Recent Netsurf seems to have a problem with indirect mailto: urls.

e.g
http://www.burwellness.co.uk/index.html
In the body there are two email buttons. These call a cgi program which
(if the calling button has sent a correct CheckVar) returns the relevant
URL in the form mailto:rich...@torrens.org

It is this indirect URL which now does not work. It's an anti-spam system
I have used for years and I have only recenly noticed it failing.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Image won't display

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <570714fc76bbai...@argonet.co.uk>,
   Brian  wrote:
> In article <570702972bli...@torrens.org>, Richard Torrens (lists)
>  wrote:
> > A very weird problem...

> > The page http://stronged.torrens.org/man/modes/syntaxmodefile.html which
> > I am writing. It has a line  > alt="clicklist/png" width="653" height="104"> But Netsurf won't display
> > the image. Chrome does it properly.

> > But http://stronged.torrens.org/man/modes/img/clicklist.png displays the
> > image!

> Not here, I'm getting 404 - Not Found

That is because I have changed the image name so that it does work!

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Image won't display

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <4e9f7074-3a2d-e7b2-3d74-175f46e71...@codethink.co.uk>,
   Michael Drake  wrote:
> On 12/06/18 14:07, Richard Torrens (lists) wrote:
> > A very weird problem...
> > 
> > The page
> > http://stronged.torrens.org/man/modes/syntaxmodefile.html
> > which I am writing. It has a line
> > 
> > But Netsurf won't display the image. Chrome does it properly.

> It's getting caught by NetSurf's ad blocking CSS.

> Looks like it matches the following selector.

>   img[src*="/click"]

> You can disable ad blocking in the preferences.

Thanks for the very speedy explanation! But if I want others to read the
page, I need to change the name...

Done.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Image won't display

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

A very weird problem...

The page
http://stronged.torrens.org/man/modes/syntaxmodefile.html
which I am writing. It has a line

But Netsurf won't display the image. Chrome does it properly.

But http://stronged.torrens.org/man/modes/img/clicklist.png
displays the image!

I am baffled.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Netsurf Disc Cache

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <56ef43aa6dnets...@avisoft.f9.co.uk>,
   Martin Avison  wrote:
> If anyone wants to try my small program which produces file and directory
> statistics for the disc cache, plus an obey file which if run will delete
> all empty directories, please email me.

Yes please.

I have, on a few occasions, simply deleted .Netsurf and
released several GB of space. Deleting the whole cache causes no
noticeable problem.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

URL crashes Netsurf

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

This URL

www.siemens-home.bsh-group.com/uk

causes Netsurf to totally crash on the ARMX6 with 5.23 (18-Feb-18). 

The crash is total, no log file, Alt-Brk does nothing. Ctrl-Brk does do a
reset.

Does it happen to anyone else?

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Page which doed not display properly

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article ,
   Jim Nagel  wrote:
> Would be nice to add a colour for ...  to the HTML 
> mode in StrongEd so that JS would immediately jump out at you in a 
> page where "the html is terrible to decipher".

> I think somebody is working to update that mode but I can't remember 
> who.  Is it you, Tim?

Having got to grips with advanced Search and Replace, I have it in mind to
next get to grips with Modes. If so one thing I may well do is to update
the HTML mode.

But doing the script removal will highlight the scripts you are removing.
I have now written this up as an example:
http://stronged.torrens.org/man/search/examples/js.html

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Page which doed not display properly

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <56d5995dc6...@timil.com>,
   Tim Hill  wrote:
> With the luxury of a PC at my elbow, I tend to throw recalcitrant pages
> at it rather than try and decipher them. WYSIWYG page design tools, such
> as WordPress used to construct Richard's page

I woul point out that this Richard dos not use anything other than
StrongED!

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Page which doed not display properly

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <455569058123901cbf28cd87c0dab...@wingsandbeaks.org.uk>,
   Jeremy Nicoll - ml netsurf  wrote:
> > The page still does not display properly - so as I said, it is not a 
> > J/S
> > thing!

> That does not follow.  Maybe the code you removed was essential... and
> that WOULD make it a script issue.

If removing _all_ script from a page does not alter the way the page
displays, then the way it displays is nothing to do with the removed
script.

I would have thought that did not require explaining. Apologies for not
being clear enough.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Page which doed not display properly

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <56d58e70b8...@timil.com>,
   Tim Hill  wrote:
> In article <56d587af09li...@torrens.org>, Richard Torrens (lists)
>  wrote:
> > http://www.magheragenealogy.org/

> > Most of of the page's text does not display in Netsurf.

> > It is not a J/S thing. But the html is terrible to decipher!

> It is. The >26  tags would beg to differ.

> The best result from a page like that? 
> Menu > Page > Export > Text

I removed all "" bits with StrongED. - there are indeed
27!

The page still does not display properly - so as I said, it is not a J/S
thing!

And yes, there are various ways of readuing it!

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Page which doed not display properly

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

http://www.magheragenealogy.org/

Most of of the page's text does not display in Netsurf.

It is not a J/S thing. But the html is terrible to decipher!

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: mailto:

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <56ccf68de6...@timil.com>,
   Tim Hill  wrote:

> Coincidentally, I have just been adding 'munge' to
> http://timil.com/riscos and IME this conversion of a mailto link into
> entities seems enough to prevent harvesting by spammers. Or the ones that
> do are so useless it doesn't even reach me!
 
My script required a hidden variable be sent - the variable determines the
script action.

This system appears to defeat spammers - most of the email addresses that
have been spammed seem to have been harvested from computers by malware.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

mailto:

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

I think the response to mailto: may be broken!

I have a new site
http://www.burwellness.co.uk/
where there is a contact link - if you want to try it, it is the link under
Therapy Rooms to let

This calls a cgi-bin which returns the email address. This works on
Android/chrome and on Firefox, but not on Netsurf.

I've used this system before with Netsurf, so something seems to have
changed. The contact tab at the top uses the same cgi-bin but links to a
web page.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Validation

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <56abf12512...@timil.com>,
   Tim Hill  wrote:
> No, & won't work from your editor. It will work only in the Browser.

> The four amp version of the link above will be
> http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&source=hp&ie=ISO-8859-1&q=omeprazole+causes+bile+reflux&btnG=Google+Search

> And, buried in HTML, it works fine. It doesn't work in Pluto or StrongED
> though, so don't expect it to. They are happy with '&' and don't
> translate the '&'s as a browser does/has to.

Thhanks - I can't have dug dseep enough. But what a pain - I extract URLs
from NetSurf's URL bar using !Transfer2. It of course picks up the
unglyphed version.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Validation

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

I was trying to validate an html page using w3c validator. I could not!

The reason was that the page contains lots of links to Google searches
etc. e.g.
http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&source=hp&ie=ISO-8859-1&q=omeprazole+causes+bile+reflux&btnG=Google+Search";>

The validator complains about the & in there - it wants & but the link
with that in won't work.

So is this a fault in the validator - or something which should be
accomodated in NetSurf?

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Image/text alignment

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

I have been trying to get some .png images aligned with text using CSS. Is
there yet a way to do so in Netsurf?

img {vertical-align:"middle;" }
etc. do not work. 

The progress page
http://www.netsurf-browser.org/documentation/progress.html#CSSFeatures
says "in progress - Only implemented for table cells." 


This page seems to have been "Last updated 20 December 2012" - I know -
keeping documentation up to date seems nearly as much work as the
programming!

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: URL lengths

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <56a1aa7e00joh...@ukgateway.net>,
   John Williams  wrote:
> What is the maximum URL length (including POST data) that NetSurf can
> handle?

What may be relevant is the following entry from my web server error
logs:

2017-10-02 02:57:45: (response.c.553) file not found ... or so:  File name
too long
/YesThisIsAReallyLongRequestURLbutWeAreDoingItOnPurposeWeAreScanningForResearchPurposePleaseHaveALookAtTheUserAgentTHXYesThisIsAReallyLongRequestURLbutWeAreDoingItOnPurposeWeAreScanningForResearchPurposePleaseHaveALookAtTheUserAgentTHXYesThisIsAReallyLongRequestURLbutWeAreDoingItOnPurposeWeAreScanningForResearchPurposePleaseHaveALookAtTheUserAgentTHXYesThisIsAReallyLongRequestURLbutWeAreDoingItOnPurposeWeAreScanningForResearchPurposePleaseHaveALookAtTheUserAgentTHXYesThisIsAReallyLongRequestURLbutWeAreDoingItOnPurposeWeAreScanningForResearchPurposePleaseHaveALookAtTheUserAgentTHXYesThisIsAReallyLongRequestURLbutWeAreDoingItOnPurposeWeAreScanningForResearchPurposePleaseHaveALookAtTheUserAgentTHXYesThisIsAReallyLongRequestURLbutWeAreDoingItOnPurposeWeAreScanningForResearchPurposePleaseHaveALookAtTheUserAgentTHXYesThisIsAReallyLongRequestURLbutWeAreDoingItOnPurposeWeAreScanningForResearchPurposePleaseHaveALookAtTheUserAgentTHXYesThisIsAReallyLongRequestURLbutWeAreDoingItOnPurposeWeAreSc
 ann ->  

At which point the Web server (lighttpd) logs it as an error.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Pane scrolling and searching

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <5697c374a7li...@torrens.org>,
   Richard Torrens (lists)  wrote:
> http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/c/F207018

Oops! URL should have been 
http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/a?_ref=10

"Anglian" occurs within first and second panes.

Sorry!

> is an odd page - it has 6 lists within panes.

> I was searching for "Anglian" within the window and there were several
> occurrences. But as these are within the panes it is extremely difficult
> to know where they are!

> Also pane scrolling had a great tendency to misbehave. sometimes the
> mouse-wheel would scroll a pane, sometimes not. And sometimes the wrong
> pane would scroll!

> so I think it may be a useful test window.


> 3.8 (Dev CI #4246)
> ARMX6
> 5.23 (29-Jun-16)

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Pane srolling and searching

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/c/F207018
is an odd page - it has 6 lists within panes.

I was searching for "Anglian" within the window and there were several
occurrences. But as these are within the panes it is extremely difficult
to know where they are!

Also pane scrolling had a great tendency to misbehave. sometimes the
mouse-wheel would scroll a pane, sometimes not. And sometimes the wrong
pane would scroll!

so I think it may be a useful test window.


3.8 (Dev CI #4246)
ARMX6
5.23 (29-Jun-16)

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Page causes crash

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article ,
   Richard Porter  wrote:
> On 30 Oct 2017 Richard Torrens (lists) wrote:

> > This may not be a Netsurf thing, but it happens rarely on anything
> > other than Nersurf.

> > The whole of this ARMX6's networking crashes. The only way I have
> > found to recover is a reset.

> > I have found a page which seems to cause this fairly reliably:
> > http://www.alamy.com/stock-photo/water-vole-hole.html


> > Does this happen to anyone else?
> > RO 5.23 (29-Jun-16)
> > NS 3.8 (Dev CI #4238) and earlier versions for some time.

> Seems to load ok here (ARMX6, 5.23, #4214)

There may be a clue - some others report NS does not load the image.

Even when it doesn't cause the crash here the image doesn't display. So
some ARMX6 display the image - some don't.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Page causes crash

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

Thanks eveyone.

Proves it's not a Netsurf thing, or an ARMX6 thing, but it must be a clash
with something installed on my ARMX6.

I'll keep looking.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Page causes crash

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

This may not be a Netsurf thing, but it happens rarely on anything other
than Nersurf.

The whole of this ARMX6's networking crashes. The only way I have found to
recover is a reset.

I have found a page which seems to cause this fairly reliably:
http://www.alamy.com/stock-photo/water-vole-hole.html


Does this happen to anyone else?
RO 5.23 (29-Jun-16)
NS 3.8 (Dev CI #4238) and earlier versions for some time.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Page layout

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <480a239156@abbeypress.net>,
   Jim Nagel  wrote:
> Richard Torrens (lists) wrote on 26 Oct:
> > ... screen shot at http://photos.torrens.org/wv.jpeg
> > NetSurf is correctly using the  option but these don't
> > work properly. This on ARMX6 with  NS 3.7 (Dev CI #4207)

> Here on #4204 I can't get the Contacts page that you show in the 
> screenshot.  You must have got a dropdown from the "About us" button 
> (or somewhere) that I don't get here.

I had previously done a Qwant site search 
 contact site:watervoles.com

https://lite.qwant.com/?q=contact+site%3Awatervoles.com&t=web
and must have picked this page out of the history.

BTW: Qwant is a French search engine and is well worth investigating. I
have it set as Home page.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Page layout

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article ,
   Peter Young  wrote:
> >> http://watervoles.com

[Snip]

> Try it with Disable JavaScript unticked in Choices > Content. Here, 
> same computer and NS Dev CI 4234 it looks to me as it should do.
> http://pnyoung.orpheusweb.co.uk/wv.jpg

> Several of the tabs at the top don't work, though.

Indeed it displays properly with j/s on.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Page layout

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <56909be808li...@torrens.org>,
   Richard Torrens (lists)  wrote:
> I suspect the developers don't need more examples of pages that don't
> layout properly? But in case they do, try

> http://watervoles.com

The respnses here make me think others are not seeing the same thing, so
there is a screen shot at
http://photos.torrens.org/wv.jpeg

NetSurf is correctly using the  option but these don't work
properly.

This on ARMX6 with  NS 3.7 (Dev CI #4207)

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Page layout

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

I suspect the developers don't need more examples of pages that don't
layout properly? But in case they do, try

http://watervoles.com

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Experimental treeview search feature - a problem

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

I have just spotted a (hopefully small) problem - it's impossible to
delete items!

Select an item and assoon as the mouse pointer moves away from the window
or over the search box, the item is delelected.

Same thing happens if you press Menu!

#4211,  ARMX6 5.23

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Experimental treeview search feature

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <9fd418f6-1f08-b24e-3aff-5bfce9381...@codethink.co.uk>,
   Michael Drake  wrote:
> On 22/09/17 02:20, Harriet Bazley wrote:
> > Other thoughts: from a practical point of view, I think it would be
> > preferable if any active search were deleted when the window is closed.
> > Otherwise it gets a bit disconcerting when you go to reopen your
> > history/hotlist and there are only two or three entries visible, due to a
> > search you carried out earlier and have long since finished with -
> > particularly as the icon in question doesn't have the input focus when the
> > window reopens,

> I agree, it would be better to cancel the search when the window
> is closed.  Unfortunately the core doesn't know when the front
> end closes the window at the moment, so it's not straightforward
> to change that just yet.

> and clearing the old search string is a pain!

> Once the search field has focus, either ESC or CTRL+U should clear it.

Would a "clear" button make sense? Maybe a click on the search icon?

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Experimental treeview search feature

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <8e933e3d-f507-99c8-2fec-26a5ca310...@netsurf-browser.org>,
   Michael Drake  wrote:
> An experimental search feature has been added to the following:

>1. Hotlist viewer (bookmarks)
>2. Global history viewer
>3. Cookie manager window

> To use it, click in the area next to the search icon at the top
> of the window, and start typing.

A feature I have sometimes wished was present - it works fine (ARMX6 5.23).

Thanks.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: HTML's SUP

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <6867f785-ecfc-4839-aaf2-fa02655d1...@powys.org>,
   Tim Powys-Lybbe  wrote:
> Ah, that suggests that SUP works correctly within CSS but not within
> old-fashioned simple HTML, which is what I use.

No, they both work fine. See attached html version plus screenshot.

If they are not the same something must be different on your setup. Or
maybe the effect is less than you expect?

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!





2 1/3



  

Redraw oddity

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

https://www.quora.com/Where-does-iPhoto-store-photos-locally

At first this displays a blank page. But wipe over it with another
window...

Does anyone else get the same behaviour?

 3.7 (Dev CI #4086) on ARMX6 5.23
(29-Jun-16)

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Change of email

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article ,
   Geoffrey Baxendale  wrote:
> In message <421ebf2956.thebears@thebe...@onetel.com>
>   Geoffrey Baxendale  wrote:

> > Hi,
> >
> > I am having to change my email address and can't get anywhere using the
> > netsurf site using the "users list" unsubscribe feature. It just says no
> > address given. Same with FF or Netsurf.
> >
> > Any ideas?
> >
> > TTFN
> OK, I have finally cracked it by using Chrome on my tablet. Still can't
> log in via Netsurf.

Looking at the headers one is:
List-Unsubscribe: ... 
 

So an email can be sent to unsub. Presumably the ?subject=subscribe
will subscribe. I'm changing my email so am trying it.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: history and hotlist not saved; CSS site

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <496fe1b4-8a09-4243-e65a-50b1381b7...@codethink.co.uk>,
   Michael Drake  wrote:
> On 23/11/16 09:58, Harriet Bazley wrote:
> > On 23 Nov 2016 as I do recall,
> >   Jim Nagel  wrote:
> >
> >> Does NetSurf not save its hotlist and history till the user quits the
> >> program?
> >>
> > No, it doesn't.

> As of CI build #4070, the hotlist file is saved shortly after URLs are
> added / removed.

> Cheers,

Excellent! A long-awaited chamnge. Thanks for the contiunuing good work.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Non-displaying page

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article ,
   Michael Drake  wrote:
> On 05/01/17 13:27, Richard Torrens (lists) wrote:
> > Is this a bug or a style fault on the page?

> The "body { visibility: hidden !important; }" style means "hide the
> whole page from view".  There is some JavaScript to unset it,
> revealing the page.

> It's daft, because the page won't display at all in any browser with
> JavaScript disabled.  In NetSurf, it doesn't work with JavaScript
> enabled because our JavaScript support is far from complete.

Thanks for the explanation. I don't know how can you hope to keep up with
such daft www programmers!

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Non-displaying page

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

Is this a bug or a style fault on the page?

http://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/health/popular-heartburn-drugs-may-increase-esophageal-cancer-risk/

The first 
  /* Will be removed by ChartBeat's async flicker control below */
  body { visibility: hidden !important; }
  

Remove this and the page displays. So I suspect it may not be a bug?

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Non-displaying page

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

http://employees.csbsju.edu/hjakubowski/classes/ch331/transkinetics/olinhibition.html

It's a css problem, as commenting out the css makes it visible.

Dunno if it's a bug or a fault in the css...

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: css

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <55d176ac00brian.jord...@btinternet.com>,
   Brian Jordan  wrote:
> I wonder if naming your stylesheet "...styles.css" might be at the root
> of this, if NetSurf already has a sheet with this, fairly common, name in
> a cache might it cause confusion? I try to use 'unguessable' names for my
> sheets, "...BJstyles.css" comes to mind.
> Just speculating.

A valid speculation - but if NS could not work out which styles.css
applied - it would be a bug would it not?

At probably the same time as this problem happened, Streetmap.co.uk went
totally wrong. That also was fixed by deleting the cache. Streetmap uses 3
different sheets, none called styles.css.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: css

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article ,
   Gavin Wraith  wrote:
> In message <55d122c0cdli...@torrens.org.uk>
>   "Richard Torrens (lists)"  wrote:

> >The latest Netsurf 3.6 (Dev CI #3739) appears to be ignoring css. Does
> >anyone else find this?

> I cannot say that I have noticed it. Can you give us a URL frinstance?

http://www.Torrens.org.uk/Sinclair/inside/

The first 3 links off that all contain

which should align all the images right amongst other css.

It did work fine and still does on Chrome - but there seems to be more
to it! I've just tried with earlier versions back to 3709 and none work. 

So I deleted Netsurf's cache - and it now works properly again! 

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

css

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

The latest Netsurf 3.6 (Dev CI #3739) appears to be ignoring css. Does
anyone else find this?

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

No-display page

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

http://www.petervis.com/Radios/sinclair-micromatic-pocket-radio/sinclair-micromatic-pocket-radio.html

Does not display. There is a lot of css at the start, then

body { visibility: hidden;
display:none }

which kills it! But should this happen?

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Site crashes NS

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <9396a3c255.c...@cdewhurst2010.btinternet.com>,
   Chris Dewhurst  wrote:
> On 20 Sep 2016 Richard Torrens (lists) [mailto: li...@torrens.org.uk] 
> wrote:

> > http://nosher.net

[Snip]

> Richard is it still crashing when you read this ?

Yes, it still crashes!

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Site crasher NS

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

http://nosher.net

Twice gives a window to accept certificate. On accepting second one, NS
dies.


3.6 (Dev CI #3714) and a few prevous. Does thisa happen to others?

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: !Cache

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <55bcdc22b0nets...@avisoft.f9.co.uk>,
   Martin Avison  wrote:
>  How does !Cache take account of NS choices? Disc cache is set to 1024MB.

> > What are the disadvantages of using a zip fine for Netsurf in !Cache.

> > This is on ARMX6. I'm aware that the lfau means that each block is
> > quite large. Not sure how large on a 250GB. There were lots of
> > directories in !Cache.

> I have raised this sort of thing before. I think you would find there
> were lots and lots of *empty* directories. Apparently on other FS such
> directories cause no problems! I even wrote a program to analyse the
> cache, and to create deletes for all empty directories. But I suspect it
> currently has bugs, and I got diverted to other things!

> I think my directory now (after deleting it all like you have in about
> April) is now about 168MB - which is under its 1024MB limit. It does seem
> to be using 6300 directories but only holds 1550 files! Still seems a
> directory overload to me.

There is cerainly a directory overload! 15 directories, each seems about 5
deep, so 75 in all!

At present, it seems each directory has one file in it, but I've not
checked all.

But I have replaced !Cache.Caches.Default.Netsurf with a zip archive
called Netsurf. This appeasrs to work fine, currently it's 492K - with 75
directories in it.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

!Cache

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

My SSD (250GB nominal) was running out - only about 6BG free.

So I deleted !Cache's Netsurf directory. Now 157GB.

Two questions:

How does !Cache take account of NS choices? Disc cache is set to 1024MB.

What are the disadvantages of using a zip fine for Nwtsurf in !Cache.

This is on ARMX6. I'm aware that the lfau means that each block is quite
large. Not sure how large on a 250GB. There were lots of directories in
!Cache.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Non-displaying page

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

http://employees.csbsju.edu/hjakubowski/classes/ch331/transkinetics/olinhibition.html
does not display. So I deleted all the browser-dependant rubbish in the
header and it dusplays OK. so something there is upsetting NetSurf.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Text drag & drop

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <5577741072joh...@ukgateway.net>,
   John Williams  wrote:
> > Somewhere between 3492 and 3507 the ability to mark text, drag and drop
> > elsewhere has been lost. Also the find text does not mark the finds.

> Absent in 3495. So that might correspond with:

> Apr 24 2016 1:35:32 PM
> 1. update risc os frontend for layout table - Vincent Sanders/cgit

> - from the changes page.

Drag and drop does still work - it's just that you now cannot see what you
are dragging!

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Text drag & drop

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

Somewhere between 3492 and 3507 the ability to mark text, drag and drop
elsewhere has been lost. Also the find text does not mark the finds.

This was very useful! I hope it's  temporary thing?

ARMX6, 5.23 (18-Mar-16)

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Weird page

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

http://www.thehowleytavern.co.uk/menu.html

The menu contents do not appear.

But if you view the page as text, and run that, all is well! So I can't
see what is causing the problem.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Unrecognized or bad HTTP Content

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

www.perryscider.co.uk

This causes NS 3460 to report
  Unrecognized or bad HTTP Content or Transfer-Encoding

Site works on Chrome, Browse. Causes Otter to crash.

Can't connect with Telnet

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Filtering webpages

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article ,
   Gavin Wraith  wrote:

> So many web pages these days are crammed with stuff put in by
> advertisers or third parties which upset the viewing experience,
> or which NetSurf is unable to render properly. The individual
> user is increasingly going to need tools to fight back, with
> which they can emasculate the page of all the clutter added in
> for statistical purposes, to add unwanted advertisements and
> pop-ups. The days of innocence are long over, so filtering of
> web pages is now a necessity.

NS has choices: 
Hide advertisements
Disable pop-up windows
Disable JavaScript

These, I would guess, tell it to ignore such content. It is then filtering
exactly as you seem to want!

So I guess you are asking for a throwback icon, to throw the source out to
an external editor, where it can be processed and returned back to NS?

This is perfectly possible within RISC OS. But I doubt that it is possible
in other OSes.

I hope the developers will contradict me and say it's totally possible -
but I have doubts!

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: 2 sites that don't!

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <145dff4755.ga...@wra1th.plus.com>,
   Gavin Wraith  wrote:
> I have a useful little Lua script, called noscript, for use with
> StrongED that strips out all the stuff between matching 
> and  tags. Here it is:

Useful: I have on occasion loked for the tags and deleted everything
between - it can be done with a StrongED search and replace. But the
script is easier.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: 2 sites that don't!

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article ,
   Grahame Parish  wrote:
> Not related to the problem with the sites, but I confirm that the 
> feeders work very well.  We have several cats with different dietary  
> requirements.

Thanks - but any other discussion, off-list I think!

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

2 sites that don't!

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

http://www.catbehaviourist.com/sure-feed-microchip-pet-feeder-review/

http://www.zooplus.co.uk/shop/cats/cat_bowls_feeders/feeders/programmable/479534?gclid=CImfsqu3x8oCFUORGwodHCUFYQ

Both display very badly. First site all text is hidden. The source is very
over-complicated, so I can't see why.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Very slow page rendering

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <000a3379.01eff490b...@smtp.freeola.net>,
   Peter Slegg  wrote:

> http://git.netsurf-browser.org/netsurf.git/tree/atari/gemtk/guiwin.c

> This page takes abut 20mins to download and render, Highwire browser
> takes about 6sec.


About 4 seconds here, ARMX6 and NS 3254

But our internet is very variable: when lots of households are on line, it
can be slow!

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Segfault: issue 2381

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <55240ff66dstuartli...@orpheusinternet.co.uk>,
   lists  wrote:
> In article <68193746bbf.07b8d...@davehigton.me.uk>,
>Dave Higton  wrote:
> > If any of you has seen NetSurf quit (the log shows a segfault)
> > when you clicked in the window, I'd recommend that you get one
> > of today's builds.  (Last time I looked, the latest was 3053.)

> Yes, I've just hit this problem. Unfortunatly none of the versions I have
> will even run. They crash out when I try to load them.

> This means I cannot get to the !NetSurf site or anywhere else.

Have a look at NetSurf$ChoicesSave(Macro) - probably
$.!Boot.Choices.WWW.NetSurf

I had a corrupted HotList which caused a similar problem. The Hotlist is
html, so can be inspected in StrongEd or whatever.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Weird link

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

http://www.oldstylesiamese.co.uk/kitten-list/adverts/male-female-old-style-kittens/

There is a link in the html which goes:

Website
http://www.arpegesiamesecats.co.uk";>www.arpegesiamesecats.co.uk

but pointing to it or clicking on it takes me to
http://www.emrys-siamese.co.uk/

This does not happen on firefox, and I can't see why Netsurf should do it!


This is with 3.4 (Dev CI #3005)

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

netsurf-users@netsurf-browser.org

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

Doing a list of genealogical notes, I wanted to space them out so there
was a blank line between each record. So I replaced each  by .

This does not work in Netsurf - but does in Firefox and Chrome

Is this a bug?

The page in question is
www.torrens.org.uk/Genealogy/Torrens/DataScot/sasines.html

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Error on Yahoo news

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <00110f20.031e94909...@smtp.freeola.net>,
   Peter Slegg  wrote:
> This url  uk.news.yahoo.com  just gives me the error

It strikes me that that is not a URL.

As this is a Netsurf list, do you mean http://uk.news.yahoo.com ? That
orks here. As does  https://uk.news.yahoo.com 

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Fail 2890 json

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <20150814072335.GB10674@somnambulist.local>,
   Daniel Silverstone  wrote:
> t is distinctly likely that current CI builds will cause issues.  We're
> undergoing a *huge* JS transition and forcing JS on while we do it.  If
> you encounter issues, turn JS off after loading your browser (note it
> will turn on again next time the browser loads).

This is extremely welcome news! Is surely is no small undertaking and I
wish you all the best of luck with it!

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: !Fetch_NS

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <6995e38e767.016fd...@davehigton.me.uk>,
   Dave Higton  wrote:
> 2) to fix the issue of the missing dot in the path starting with
>  because my definition of Root$Dir has no trailing dot.

This presumaby u=is something entirely local to you? The Settings file
initially says

| Set the download and installation directories
| **> You will need to modify these (and remove the | to activate)! <**
|Set Fetch_NS$Download$Dir Download.Netwerk.NetSurf
|Set Fetch_NS$Install$Dir Netwerk



Those must point to:
Fetch_NS$Download$Dir directory where you want the downloads to be saved

Fetch_NS$Install$Dir directory from which Netsurf is run.


the original paths are not very enlightening!

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

!Fetch_NS

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

Success!

curl 7.11.0 seems to be the latst version. It doesn't like ARMv7

Wget 1.15 i the latest version and works. I had an old wget!

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: !Fetch_NS

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <9f2fd6de54.pnyo...@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk>,
   Peter Young  wrote:
> Richard still hasn't told us which version of Fetch_NS he's trying to 
> run, which is highly relevant.

2.21, which runs fine on the RPC,

I quoted the line from the !Run file - which caklls a Taskwindow. On the
RPC, that TaskWindow opens as expected.

On the ARMX6, no such task window opens.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: !Fetch_NS

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

On 06 Jul, li...@torrens.org.uk wrote:
> I have installed a new version of 2.21, fresh from the zip file, and will
> now reset the ARMX6 and try again.


Same result... the error is returned from the BASIC program
!Fetch_NS.Resources.SetLatest

So I have emailed Frank for help.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: !Fetch_NS

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article ,
   Allan Bennett  wrote:
> In message <54dde90eceli...@torrens.org.uk>
>   "Richard Torrens (lists)"  wrote:

> > Has anyone got Fetch_NS running on an ARMX6?

> Yes, working here on ARMX6 and Armini. It did take some setting up, 
> though...

> On first run, you should be presented with a list of options, but I 
> never had much joy with this and resorted to modding the files in 
> !Boot.Choices.Fetch_NS.Settings.  Mostly self-explanatory. Mostly!

> I have !Wget in configure 'look at'.

The instructions do say you have to chose which transport: there are lines
in the !Run file to be commented in out as appropriate. I did that. The
transports are called, and start to work - in the background. They then
fail.

A task window is not opened: presumably this should only open when the
transport returns some output.

The error returned by wget says the filename is incorrectly formatted. At
Line 24!

I have installed a new version of 2.21, fresh from the zip file, and will
now reset the ARMX6 and try again.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

!Fetch_NS

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

Has anyone got Fetch_NS running on an ARMX6?

I have tried curl and wget. Neither does the job. Both do not open a task
window, so I cannot see progress and nothing appears to happpen. However
both cause an error window to open sometime after firing up.

With wget, the error is "Incorrectly formatted filename at line 24" but
what program is running is not stated and I have no idea where to look.

Later..
I have found that removing the Do from the line in !Run which reads:

TaskWindow "Do  LATEST 
.LATEST" -wimpslot 2048k -name "Fetch LATEST file data"
-quit

allows the taskwindow to open. I'll keep probing.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Google

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

If you let the search page loop run, you eventually get to a page "Google
has detected unusual traffic - are you a robot?"

Fill in the CAPTCHA and it loops again.

But maybe if they get enough loops they will notice... or pigs will fly!

On the page there is also a "why did this happen" link. That doesn't work
either!

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Google

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <3145b6c054.roger...@rogerarm.freeuk.com>,
   Roger Darlington  wrote:
> On 8 May 2015, Richard Torrens (lists) wrote:
> > Another way of using Google is, for example

> > http://www.google.co.uk/search?&q=Acacia

> > Just double click on the link. Works from Pluto, StronEd and anything else
> > which will launch a URL.

> But that doesn't work on Netsurf :-(
> It just oscillates the same :-(

> > Once on the search, you can delete the search term and type in another.
> > So it seems to be only from the first page. Weird!


Sorry, I've confused myself by togling JS once too many times.

The search script on my www site does work with JF off: Relevant bit is



http://www.google.com/custom>




 Search WWW




Save that as search/html, re-type is as faf (html) and use it

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Google

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

Another way of using Google is, for example

http://www.google.co.uk/search?&q=Acacia

Just double click on the link. Works from Pluto, StronEd and anything else
which will launch a URL.

Once on the search, you can delete the search term and type in another.
So it seems to be only from the first page. Weird!

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Google

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <20150508125407.ga2...@kyllikki.org>,
   Vincent Sanders  wrote:
> It has been reported in the tracker as bug number 2314. Google have
> changed the non javascript portion of their reply (the noscript entry)
> to comtain completely broken html that simply causes the browser to
> refresh and fail to work usefully.

> We cannot do anything about this in NetSurf itself and need Google to
> unbreak their noscript, If you can get anyone there to listen that
> would be good as I have been unable to find someone to contact. This
> affects all non javascript browser (or those with it turned off) and
> cannot be worked around.

I suspected as much ...

Writing a browser is a somewhat Herculean task and keeping it operating
with broken www sites is a never ending task.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Google

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <54c08ebfb1joh...@ukgateway.net>,
   John Williams  wrote:
> Or one of those "record your button presses and menu items" programs we
> used to  have in the olden days.

It's called KeyStroke, Alisdair Jørgensen, originally sold by Quantum
software, now PD. It could indeed record such a train of button presses on
menu items. I would Google a link for you but...

KeyStroke also comes with various add-ons. Probably a button bar.

I have a Search page on my own www site: I have just tried it and that
call to Google works.
www.torrens.org.uk/search.html



 --  Richard Torrens. http://www.Torrens.org.uk
for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats and more!

Google

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

Yesterday Google stopped working with Netsurf.

Has anyone any cures or suggestions?

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Hot List

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <0fc224ac3bf.03edd...@davehigton.me.uk>,
   Dave Higton  wrote:
> I've become aware over the years since then that the big difference
> between children and adults is their attitude.  No-one tells children
> that they can't learn, and so they go through all their childhood
> years learning at an astonishing rate.  Then something happens, and
> they persuade themselves (or each other) that learning is no longer
> possible.

True.  

But one thing age does teach you is judgement: it becomes far easier to
work out how much hassle the task is going to be, and that the reward is
not worth the hassle!

So you end up doing something else...

I gave up programming becasue it was too much hassle. Long ago (I'm now
71).

There are plenty of things I do enjoy learning about: except they tend
not to stick in my memory as much as of yore.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Hot List

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <20150429101112.GY23045@somnambulist.local>,
   Daniel Silverstone  wrote:
> I'm not sure it's very realistic to expect project maintainers to
> continue to support a platform which none of them run and which has no
> active maintainer to help -- where despite there clearly being a number
> of engineers who still run the project and who have the requisite
> skills, noone can be found to provide what little support would be
> needed to keep the project on-track.  But I suppose that's how platform
> support atrophies and is eventually removed.

You have a very valid point.

RISC OS needs a good browser: its probable that if it had one, more people
would use it.

But it looks like most of us who use NS on RO are users, not programmers.
I have done a little programming, long ago. C I have no understanding of
at all. I have looked a C source code as one of our motor controllers was
programmed, and the source was in C. It left me colder than cold...

Maybe you, Daniel, or one of the other programmers should write a request
to comp.sys.acorn.programmer to see if you can interest anyone there in
joining the team. There may well be someone who is capable, could be
interested, but does not subscribe to this list.

I'd do it myself, but am in no position to know how easy it will be, or
what sort of things are involved.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Hot List

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

Could you change the saving of the hot list?

At present it only saves when NS is quit - a pain if you have just made
changes and NS quits1

It either needs a Menu Item: Save Hot List or it should save automatically
when changed.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Raspberry-Pi B+ problem

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article ,
   Chris Dewhurst  wrote:
> Hi Richard,

> Not sure if the below will help but you could give them a try, even if 
> to eliminate from your enquiries.

> (1) On my R-Pi sometimes Netsurf gets stuck in a loop of redirecting 
> itself to its home page. Quitting Netsurf and deleting the folder:

> SDFS::16GbPi.$.!Boot.Resources.!Scrap.ScrapDirs.ScrapDir.WWW

> (or wherever the WWW folder resides in your !Boot folder)

> then restarting Netsurf cures it.

Excellent! Thanks.

I renamed SDFS::RISCOSpi.$.!Boot.Choices.WWW.NetSurf
to .NetSurfX

NetSurf then started fine
then I quit Netsurf and started moving the old files back.

The problem was a corrupted Hotlist in there. It was 7M and most of that
was junk looking very much like a memory dump.

The section immediately after the hotlist was a load of lines such as

(27736.96) render/html_object.c html_object_free_objects 651: object
0x67ea3858

which is clearly dumped from Netsurf.


Deleting all the junk after the final  of the hotlist proper, nothing
has been lost.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Raspberry-Pi B+ problem

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article ,
   Jeremy Nicoll - ml netsurf  wrote:
> Why do you think that 'Disc error' is beng reported falsely?

The disk verifies fine every time.

DiscKnight usually reports "Disc good". Or on occasion it can find and
repair a fault such as a broken map.

> I find it hard to believe that whatever detects such things would be
> making spurious reports.

Which makes me think it's a timing problem.

ROOL first diagnosed that I had a faulty R-Pi. So I had it replaced. The
second one is the same.

This is the second µSD supplied by ROOL.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Raspberry-Pi B+ problem

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <5473e1e3dbch...@chris-johnson.org.uk>,
   cj  wrote:
> In article <5473d22af9li...@torrens.org.uk>,
>    Richard Torrens (lists)  wrote:
> > I have Reporter running: this gives me no clues. It reports
> > *Filer_run  !Netsurf.

> > Then after the Alt-Break, it lists a whole host of output, stopping at
> >  [Appl/0B2039C4] RMEnsure Iconv 0.04 Error 16_10F iconv support requires
> > the Iconv module 0.04 or newer
> >  ** WimpError ** from Window Manager
> >   Error  : &050DEAD0
> >   Message: Press Stop to terminate Unknown.

> Can it be assumed that the 'whole host' corresponds to the Netsurf
> !Run file up to the point where it tries to rmensure Iconv?

Yes, exactly as the !Run file.

> The unknown may be the !Run obey file itself or Iconv trying to
> initialise.

I thought Iconv might be corrupt, replaced it. No change.

> The implication is that you haven't changed Netsurf or any of its
> support modules. 

a working NetSurf stopped working for no apparent reason. So I tred a
completely new one. It now has RunImage dated December 4th - I think
that's 2425.

> From the error message you are running a fairly old
> version. What actual versions are you running? What compatibility
> mode are you running the Pi in?

I have just tried all 3 modes. It makes no difference.

I also tried executing (via a StrongED task window) the !Run file step by
step. This gives a "Window Manager is currently in use" after
/.KickNS
and after
Run .!RunImage %*0 2>.WWW.NetSurf.Log

First is thrown back to the Task Window, second is a Wimp error Box.

Netsurf doesn't run, but machine does not freeze.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: Raspberry-Pi B+ problem

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <253e6ecc5d1.033bd...@davehigton.me.uk>,
   Dave Higton  wrote:
> On Wed, 10 Dec 2014 12:41:02 + (GMT) Richard Torrens wrote:

> [snip]
> > I have had the SD card replaced, and th eR-Pi itself. I have also
> > almost entirely eliminated the power supply as a problem.

> What about the power supply cable?  Have you eliminated that too?

> Your problems look very much as if they are caused by low power supply
> voltage.  Can you measure what voltage appears within the RPi?

> Dave

I measured 5.16v, stable, on the expansion pins of the B+. It showed no
variation as thePi was used.

I also fitted a 3,000µF capacitor actoss these pins.

The extra capacitor had no perceptible effect.

So it certainly doesn't look like supply problems. Unless the voltage
tolerance on the supply is incredibly tight.

Netsurf was working for quite some time with no sign of any trouble.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Raspberry-Pi B+ problem

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

I have a  problem running NetSurf on a R-Pi B+

It used to work. Then, one day, stopped running. I made no change to the
R-Pi at the time.

However the B+ appears to be extremely unreliable: "Disc error" keeps
being reported. Usually falsely - but sometimes ther is a corruption, so I
thin something may have been corrupted. But what?

I have had the SD card replaced, and th eR-Pi itself. I have also almost
entirely eliminated the power supply as a problem.

When I run Netsurf, it goes into a continuous hour-glassing loop.
alt-break stops it.

I have Reporter running: this gives me no clues. It reports
*Filer_run  !Netsurf.

Then after the Alt-Break, it lists a whole host of output, stopping at
 [Appl/0B2039C4] RMEnsure Iconv 0.04 Error 16_10F iconv support requires
the Iconv module 0.04 or newer
 ** WimpError ** from Window Manager
  Error  : &050DEAD0
  Message: Press Stop to terminate Unknown.

I have replaced Netsurf with a completely new update. No change. I have
replaced Iconv and several other modules. No joy!

So0 has anyone any idea of what is happening, or what I should do next?
It's the "Unknown" that's looping.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

R-Pi B+ RISC OS problems

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

Netsurf won't run here: during loading it gives an error:
"Memory exhausted whilst loading URL file."

Memory isn't exhausted: I suspect there is another problem which is being
wrongly errored.

So where and what is the "URL file" so I can check it?

This is with recent Netsurf and back quite a way. So I think it is a
problem with the file - not with the memory!

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: My wish: To be able to save just the HTML file

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <541d749f.2040...@fastmail.fm>,
   Vesa Paatero  wrote:
> Hi,

> My wish for Netsurf developers is a simple one: To be able to save just 
> the HTML file of a web page with link references intact. Currently, 
> Netsurf always saves the whole web page, i.e. the HTML file with links 
> changed to point to the associated files saved into a directory 
> automatically created for them. I imagine it would be relatively easy to 
> enable saving just the HTML page, yet it currently can't be done ... or 
> if it can be done, please let me know.

> Thanks for considering it!

> Vesa

Very easy to do:

f8  edit the html in StrongED of whatever editor you use.
f3  in StrongED: save the page.

I don't think anything needs to be done in NS!

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

BoxConvert?

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

I can confirm that the latest build allows the page to display.

What Netsurf should do with the line
">Top of page
I leave to others ... it's never going to do the right thing locally, so
as long as it doesn't stop display I think it's unimportant what happens.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: BoxConvert?

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article
,
   Chris Young  wrote:
> a) When did this start?

I haven't updated NS for a while so don't know when it started!

> b) Can you post one of the faulty pages here, or upload it in a way in
> which it can be downloaded without the SSI being parsed?

After a bit more experimenting, it is caused by the line:

">Top of page

Two pages in the attached archive: one contains the line, one does not.

NS clearly isn't going to do anything sensible with this - but at present
it causes the page not to load at all.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!


new.zip,A91
Description: application/riscos

BoxConvert?

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

What does the message BoxConvert mean? It's obscure to say the least!

I now (3.2 (Dev CI #1959)) get it on every local www page I run. Which is
a pain - as I cannot then check a www page before uploading.

I suspect it may be because I use SSI on my www pages: they contain, for
example
 
and
 Page Information
 Document URL: 
 Page first published 30th July 2005
 Last modified: 
 
 © 2005- 4QD

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: MousAxess

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <20140207124551.ga5...@parsifal.org.uk>,
   John-Mark Bell  wrote:
> I sense you're missing my point: if the issue is not reported in the
> issue tracker, it will not cross the radar of the developers. Discuss
> what you want, where you want, but the only sure way of ensuring that a
> developer is aware of the issue is to report it on the issue tracker.

I first posted here to ascertain that it was indeed an issue and not
something peculiar to my set-up.

But reporting to the bug-tracker is not easy. Too many hoops to jump
through, I think. Although I could see no instructions as to what to do
next.

I would be happy to email such. I am not prepared to log in and work out
how to report when it is unclear how to do so!

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: MousAxess

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <53d63f0cd7brian.jord...@btinternet.com>,
   Brian Jordan  wrote:
> In article <53d63916ddli...@torrens.org.uk>,
>    Richard Torrens (lists)  wrote:

> [Snip]

> > Well I went there, then to the next page. How do I report a bug?

> > Life's too short to open accounts and log in or to work out complicated
> > routines, sorry.

> > If someone else can do this, there are 3 log at
> > http://www.torrens.org.uk/documents/Logs/

> If you haven't yet done so, I'll post yours along with one of my own
> which is a log of I crash I provoked when scrolling with the menu button.

Thanks.

It's definitely MoussAxess related. I now do 
RMKill Moussaxess
before surfing - if I remember!

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: MousAxess

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <20140207125751.gb5...@parsifal.org.uk>,
   John-Mark Bell  wrote:
> > > That's http://bugs.netsurf-browser.org/ of course.
> > 
> > Well I went there, then to the next page. How do I report a bug?

> You log in, click the "Report Issue" link, fill in the form, and click
> "Submit Report".

That page, at the bottom has a link: bug reporting interface.

That takes me to http://bugs.netsurf-browser.org/mantis/my_view_page.php

which has no "Report Issue" link...

I suspect the key is the "my_view_page" bit. It probably only works for
logged-in members

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: MousAxess

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <53d5cd2686t...@netsurf-browser.org>,
   Michael Drake  wrote:
> In article <53d4c22179li...@torrens.org.uk>,
>    Richard Torrens (lists)  wrote:

> > I hav found Netsurf very inclined to crash. It feels like it's caused
> > bey switch bounce, usually from the menu button. But removing MouseAxess
> > seems to stop it.

> Please could someone who is seeing this crash file a bug report with a
> Log file attached. Otherwise it is unlikely ever to be investigated.

> Cheers,

> That's http://bugs.netsurf-browser.org/ of course.

Well I went there, then to the next page. How do I report a bug?

Life's too short to open accounts and log in or to work out complicated
routines, sorry.

If someone else can do this, there are 3 log at
http://www.torrens.org.uk/documents/Logs/

Netsurf crashes erratically, but this appears to be caused by MouseAxess.
It is associated with use of the menu button, for instance to scroll the
window. 

It is not new - though recent releases may be more sensitive. I have
noticed it most on an Iyonix (5.18). That's out of action, I write now on
an RPC (4.39 (28 Apr 2004) [Kernel 6.80]) where the Logs were generated.

These 3 logs were vry close together: it's not difficult to cause it, but
I still have no clue as to the exact button/drag sequence.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

MousAxess

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

Is anyone else here using MouseAxess with NetSurf?

I hav found Netsurf very inclined to crash. It feels like it's caused bey
switch bounce, usually from the menu button. But removing MouseAxess seems
to stop it.

I have not found any other programs which crash like this...

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Site crashes NS

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

www.bsbi.org.uk
seems to consistently crash NS (3.1 (Dev CI #1543)) without displaying a
thing.

Can anyone else get this site?

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Bed page display

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

http://www.cornishworkshop.co.uk/hammerhandle.html

is a series of nested tgbles.

The text overwrites, all on one line, with no proper wrapping in the cells.

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!

Re: streetmap.co.uk

[Richard Torrens (lists)]

In article <535b3bc356j...@jaharrison.me.uk>,
   John Harrison  wrote:

> > ... Streetmap hasn't changed recently...

> It has!  

> I use it regularly and the behaviour changed (as per my previous posting)
> about a week ago.

Alright - I should have been more spoecific. There has been no change in
Streetmap's behaviour when used the way I outlined.

I've just updated to 3.1 (Dev CI #1257) and Streetmap (used the way I
said) behaves exactly as it always has.

But if javascript is on - then it does not work at all, doesn't display
the "No javascript" message and doesn't progress (no change there
either!)... Maybe this is your problem?

Support at Streetmap were very helpful: I contacted them some while ago,
when they changed to the new version, and was assured that the old version
would remain.

So whatever's happened is not a Netsurf thing...

-- 
Richard Torrens.
http://www.Torrens.org.uk for genealogy, natural history, wild food, walks, cats
and more!