Re: [Nmh-workers] Setup help???
I'd never heard of cyrus-sasl before, but I'd been installing openssl for awhile (I forget why). Yeah, come to think of it, MH was never a reason I became tired of maintaining dependencies. B-) Cyrus-sasl is a package which provides an API to do various sorts of authentication supported by different protocols (like SMTP POP, which are what we care about in our case). You probably wouldn't have heard of it unless you're in the middle of that stuff. Hmm, as in inc will do the fetching for me (so that I won't need to use fetchmail anymore)? Oh wow, it does! (It's been a long time since I read the man page for inc B-) What are the limitations that you hinted at? inc can fetch email from POP server ... and in fact, it always had that capability going back maybe a few decades. It wasn't always compiled in, though (more recently we made it always be compiled in). I won't bore you with the exact technical details, but right now inc _can_ do encryption to the POP server _if_ you use a SASL mechanism that supports encryption (that's how I use inc). But most POP servers (including the one at gmail) use TLS for encryption which currently inc doesn't support. There is an option to make it work; people successfully use the -proxy switch to inc to run a program that does the TLS for you. So yeah, you can make it work, it's just not as integrated as I would prefer. In fairness I must point out that there are a number of nmh users who don't feel inc should fetch email from POP servers; they prefer using fetchmail or an equivalent. You can check the mailing list archives for the discussions about that; I don't think they're worth rehashing again. Obviously I don't agree with that view, but I would be remiss if I didn't mention it. --Ken ___ Nmh-workers mailing list Nmh-workers@nongnu.org https://lists.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/nmh-workers
Re: [Nmh-workers] Setup help???
On Fri, 03 May 2013 18:21:42 -0400 valdis.kletni...@vt.edu wrote: On Fri, 03 May 2013 14:54:39 -0700, Bob Carragher said: Hmm, as in inc will do the fetching for me (so that I won't need to use fetchmail anymore)? Oh wow, it does! (It's been a long time since I read the man page for inc B-) What are the limitations that you hinted at? For starters, if you currently rely on a fetchmail | procmail | rcvstore pipe to presort your mail into folders, that won't work (AFAIK). Nope, I use it at its most basic: fetch email from the POP server and dump it into /var/mail. Bob ___ Nmh-workers mailing list Nmh-workers@nongnu.org https://lists.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/nmh-workers
Re: [Nmh-workers] Setup help???
On Sat, 04 May 2013 10:21:26 -0400 Ken Hornstein k...@pobox.com wrote: I'd never heard of cyrus-sasl before, but I'd been installing openssl for awhile (I forget why). Yeah, come to think of it, MH was never a reason I became tired of maintaining dependencies. B-) Cyrus-sasl is a package which provides an API to do various sorts of authentication supported by different protocols (like SMTP POP, which are what we care about in our case). You probably wouldn't have heard of it unless you're in the middle of that stuff. Got it. Hmm, as in inc will do the fetching for me (so that I won't need to use fetchmail anymore)? Oh wow, it does! (It's been a long time since I read the man page for inc B-) What are the limitations that you hinted at? inc can fetch email from POP server ... and in fact, it always had that capability going back maybe a few decades. It wasn't always compiled in, though (more recently we made it always be compiled in). I won't bore you with the exact technical details, but right now inc _can_ do encryption to the POP server _if_ you use a SASL mechanism that supports encryption (that's how I use inc). But most POP servers (including the one at gmail) use TLS for encryption which currently inc doesn't support. There is an option to make it work; people successfully use the -proxy switch to inc to run a program that does the TLS for you. So yeah, you can make it work, it's just not as integrated as I would prefer. In fairness I must point out that there are a number of nmh users who don't feel inc should fetch email from POP servers; they prefer using fetchmail or an equivalent. You can check the mailing list archives for the discussions about that; I don't think they're worth rehashing again. Obviously I don't agree with that view, but I would be remiss if I didn't mention it. Okay, I see. Yeah, I would prefer to use the more integrated flows, so I'm not likely to switch off of fetchmail in this case. Thanks! Bob ___ Nmh-workers mailing list Nmh-workers@nongnu.org https://lists.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/nmh-workers
Re: [Nmh-workers] Setup help???
On Thu, 02 May 2013 21:52:08 -0400 Ken Hornstein k...@pobox.com wrote: My apologies! It's version 1.3-1 (pretty ancient, I guess, but that's what's tied to my version of Ubuntu -- something else I need to update). Okay, yeah, that explains a lot. There are some other features in nmh 1.5 that you might be interested in as well (the web page has details on the hilights). The nmh home page is here: http://www.nongnu.org/nmh/ Also, you _CAN_ always compile nmh on your own; we did try to make that as easy as possible. You shouldn't need to be a programmer to do it. There really shouldn't be too much in terms of system dependencies as long as your OS is relatively new (and by relatively, I mean, within a decade). Then my OS (Ubuntu 10.04) will work. B-) I've avoided building my own installs because I got tired of maintaining dependencies, the main advantage (for me) of using Ubuntu. (It used to be so easy: install GNU, then install X, then install a couple of etc. software like MH and emacs. B-) Yes, the version I'm using doesn't allow me to configure the Sender: field, which was the first thing I try. NMH gives me the following error message: whom: illegal header line -- Sender: I wasn't aware that it was NMH that adds in the Sender: field. I thought it was sendmail. AFAIK, sendmail will never add a Sender: field. MH (and as a consequence, nmh) had a very strong idea that your host's FQDN and local user account matched your email address; if it saw a mismatch between that and your supplied From: header, it would add a Sender: field. That's finally been corrected as of 1.5. Now you can add a Sender: if you wish, but otherwise nmh will treat what you put in your draft as gospel. Funny -- I was thinking of downloading the NMH source and hacking it to stop it doing that, and then I read on some webpage that it was sendmail that did that. (Bad information!) I'm really looking forward to version 1.5! In fact, my fix (as I mentioned in the other followup on this thread, and after a lot of googling) was to reconfigure sendmail to remap my local (illegal) address to dnc2...@gmail.com instead. It looks like from your other message that you're using spost. While there are a lot of strong opinions on how you should configure nmh for sending email (see the mailing list archives), I will point out that you don't even need to use sendmail at all; you can configure nmh to have post simply submit outgoing mail to the gmail SMTP server. That would make it behave like every other mail program on the planet. Doing that would also require 1.5, though (and you'd need to compile nmh with Cyrus-SASL and TLS support). I wasn't aware I was using spost. (Actually I wasn't aware of the existence of an NMH package program called spost before.) Not having to use sendmail has appeal, although I would still need it for the incoming email that I fetch from GMail. Though I suspect that there's a way to do that as well without needing sendmail. (Ah, never needing sendmail again! B-) Thanks! Bob ___ Nmh-workers mailing list Nmh-workers@nongnu.org https://lists.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/nmh-workers
Re: [Nmh-workers] Setup help???
Then my OS (Ubuntu 10.04) will work. B-) I've avoided building my own installs because I got tired of maintaining dependencies, the main advantage (for me) of using Ubuntu. (It used to be so easy: install GNU, then install X, then install a couple of etc. software like MH and emacs. B-) I know what you mean. I think in terms of external dependencies we aren't so bad (although if you want to submit email to gmail, you'll need cyrus-sasl and openssl, but those are becoming more and more standard nowadays). Funny -- I was thinking of downloading the NMH source and hacking it to stop it doing that, and then I read on some webpage that it was sendmail that did that. (Bad information!) Just curious ... where did you read that? AFAIK sendmail won't add a Sender header, but I could be wrong ... definitely in your case nmh was doing it, as you've discovered. I wasn't aware I was using spost. (Actually I wasn't aware of the existence of an NMH package program called spost before.) Well, if you don't have a postproc in your .mh_profile, then I guess you're using the sendmail MTS. You can look in mts.conf for that. We've cleaned that up, but that's probably post-1.5 (but it shouldn't be needed for this problem). Not having to use sendmail has appeal, although I would still need it for the incoming email that I fetch from GMail. Though I suspect that there's a way to do that as well without needing sendmail. (Ah, never needing sendmail again! B-) You could probably do that with inc, the nmh tool designed for that :-). Might need some finessing with the current limitations on inc, though. But it should be doable. --Ken ___ Nmh-workers mailing list Nmh-workers@nongnu.org https://lists.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/nmh-workers
Re: [Nmh-workers] Setup help???
First off ... you didn't mention a crucial piece of information: the version of nmh you're running. This has generally worked, although (because I use sendmail) this adds the line Sender: laptop-userID@ISP This makes me think you're running something older than the latest version of nmh. Starting with 1.5, nmh will no longer create Sender: header automatically; in fact, if you really want one, you have to add it yourself. Also, there's a much cleaner way of configuring your local identity that works better with more modern configurations (like yours). Nmh 1.5 was released last June, so it's not exactly brand-spanking new. --Ken ___ Nmh-workers mailing list Nmh-workers@nongnu.org https://lists.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/nmh-workers
Re: [Nmh-workers] Setup help???
Thanks for the reply, Jerrad! I had looked through that before, and tried several of the options, but none of them worked. The problem was always with sendmail. Even when I used the draft_from option with the masquerade directive, sendmail would insert the dreaded X-Authentication-Warning: field into the header. However, I did finally resolve the issue -- by getting sendmail itself to do what I wanted (masquerading as gmail.com and remapping my local address as dnc2...@gmail.com). Bob On Wed, 01 May 2013 23:05:26 -0400 Jerrad Pierce belg4...@pthbb.org wrote: See the man page for mh-tailor which describes the mts.conf options for the address masquerading you wish to do. ___ Nmh-workers mailing list Nmh-workers@nongnu.org https://lists.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/nmh-workers
Re: [Nmh-workers] Setup help???
Thanks for the response, Ken! On Thu, 02 May 2013 08:56:03 -0400 Ken Hornstein k...@pobox.com wrote: First off ... you didn't mention a crucial piece of information: the version of nmh you're running. My apologies! It's version 1.3-1 (pretty ancient, I guess, but that's what's tied to my version of Ubuntu -- something else I need to update). This has generally worked, although (because I use sendmail) this adds the line Sender: laptop-userID@ISP This makes me think you're running something older than the latest version of nmh. Starting with 1.5, nmh will no longer create Sender: header automatically; in fact, if you really want one, you have to add it yourself. Also, there's a much cleaner way of configuring your local identity that works better with more modern configurations (like yours). Nmh 1.5 was released last June, so it's not exactly brand-spanking new. I very much look forward to using 1.5, then! Yes, the version I'm using doesn't allow me to configure the Sender: field, which was the first thing I try. NMH gives me the following error message: whom: illegal header line -- Sender: I wasn't aware that it was NMH that adds in the Sender: field. I thought it was sendmail. In fact, my fix (as I mentioned in the other followup on this thread, and after a lot of googling) was to reconfigure sendmail to remap my local (illegal) address to dnc2...@gmail.com instead. Happily, I was able to do this without needing to reconfigure NMH (although I recognize that the sendmail solution is really a hack, and that the configurability you describe with the 1.5 version of NMH would by far be preferred). Bob ___ Nmh-workers mailing list Nmh-workers@nongnu.org https://lists.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/nmh-workers
Re: [Nmh-workers] Setup help???
My apologies! It's version 1.3-1 (pretty ancient, I guess, but that's what's tied to my version of Ubuntu -- something else I need to update). Okay, yeah, that explains a lot. There are some other features in nmh 1.5 that you might be interested in as well (the web page has details on the hilights). The nmh home page is here: http://www.nongnu.org/nmh/ Also, you _CAN_ always compile nmh on your own; we did try to make that as easy as possible. You shouldn't need to be a programmer to do it. There really shouldn't be too much in terms of system dependencies as long as your OS is relatively new (and by relatively, I mean, within a decade). Yes, the version I'm using doesn't allow me to configure the Sender: field, which was the first thing I try. NMH gives me the following error message: whom: illegal header line -- Sender: I wasn't aware that it was NMH that adds in the Sender: field. I thought it was sendmail. AFAIK, sendmail will never add a Sender: field. MH (and as a consequence, nmh) had a very strong idea that your host's FQDN and local user account matched your email address; if it saw a mismatch between that and your supplied From: header, it would add a Sender: field. That's finally been corrected as of 1.5. Now you can add a Sender: if you wish, but otherwise nmh will treat what you put in your draft as gospel. In fact, my fix (as I mentioned in the other followup on this thread, and after a lot of googling) was to reconfigure sendmail to remap my local (illegal) address to dnc2...@gmail.com instead. It looks like from your other message that you're using spost. While there are a lot of strong opinions on how you should configure nmh for sending email (see the mailing list archives), I will point out that you don't even need to use sendmail at all; you can configure nmh to have post simply submit outgoing mail to the gmail SMTP server. That would make it behave like every other mail program on the planet. Doing that would also require 1.5, though (and you'd need to compile nmh with Cyrus-SASL and TLS support). --Ken ___ Nmh-workers mailing list Nmh-workers@nongnu.org https://lists.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/nmh-workers
[Nmh-workers] Setup help???
Can someone please point me to resources or provide a simple How-To for configuring NMH (and related systems, like sendmail)? My setup: * Laptop running (Ubuntu 10.04) Linux. * My public address is dnc2...@gmail.com. -- I want all my email to appear to come from this address. I have set From: and Reply-To: fields in my components and other configuration files. However, I have problems with the generated Sender: field (see below). -- I use fetchmail to POP email from this address. (I mention this only in case it changes the setup.) * I send mail when connected to my ISP, but fetch/POP mail whenever I'm connected to the Internet. It would be nice to be able to use NMH to send mail whenever I'm connected to the Internet, but I will settle for continuing to use the Google web interface for that. * I added to /etc/hosts a FQDN that I don't normally send email to (mit.edu) because some mailers reject email that comes from foo@localhost or foo@localhost.localdomain. I didn't add ISP because then any email I send to foo@ISP appears to be for a local user; also laptop-userID@ISP is taken. This has generally worked, although (because I use sendmail) this adds the line Sender: laptop-userID@ISP to all my message headers. In the last few years, more and more mail providers are keying off this as an indication of spam, and in recent weeks my email doesn't even reach some recipients at all (not even deposited in their spam folder). This *should* be a relatively common use case amongst NMH users, so I have to believe that the setup for it should be straightforward. I am the only user of this laptop, so if it is necessary to hard-code the sender's ID and/or hostname, then I would be willing to do that. Can anyone help, or point to help? Thank you! Bob ___ Nmh-workers mailing list Nmh-workers@nongnu.org https://lists.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/nmh-workers
Re: [Nmh-workers] Setup help???
See the man page for mh-tailor which describes the mts.conf options for the address masquerading you wish to do. ___ Nmh-workers mailing list Nmh-workers@nongnu.org https://lists.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/nmh-workers
