Re: Have you been contacted via private email and discouraged from participating on the OpenOffice project?
Hello, The DocFou guys choose to split from the OO.o project. The communities are now separate. And users of LO are better served in LO forums, like AOO users are better served on the AOO forums and lists, and not the other way around. I guess you´re not implying that we should start accepting here questions from Thinkfree Office, KDE Office, LO or any other office suite. I think there is a misunderstanding. I wanted to say is the only: before the creation of LibreOffice/TDF http://de.openoffice.info was a forum for OpenOffice.org and(!) StarOffice (and StarOffice 5.2) and(!) NeoOffice and(!) OxygenOffice and(!) go-oo because we saw no reason to split the forum into separate forums. After the founding of LibreOffice there were receivables the focus of the Forum, to LibreOffice relocate and we declined, because _there is no reason for such a special role of LibreOffice_ and as long as LibreOffice and Apache OpenOffice are technically similar enough to questions in to answer a forum, we will do so. We are concerned about any content at http://de.openoffice.info office-software is derived from OpenOffice.org. When in doubt, apply the http://de.openoffice.info is independent. We do not let us be influenced by anyone in the past, and we will not do so in future. Not because of pressure or influence attempts, but also not because of (my) personal preference or sympathies. Independence is independence, and as moderator (and Admin) at http://de.openoffice.info i will preserve them. Greetings, Jörg
Re: AOO.Next IBM Priorities
Hello, From: Lei Wang [mailto:lei.wang.l...@gmail.com] No, this is property panel in the sidebar, not the sidebar framework. The sidebar framework looks like: http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/AOO_UX_Design_Exploration_-_Do cked_Task_Pane_Container_-_Tab_User_Interface_Design Unfortunately I am not a developer and do not understand exactly the difference. Let me ask because Rob wrote something of API: Is it possible to program via StarBasic later controls on the empty tab area? Greetings, Jörg
another XML file for the Consultants-Page
Hello, here is another XML file for an entry in: http://www.openoffice.org/bizdev/consultants.html Can someone please check and then add? Thank you. Greetings, Jörg XML-File: consultant nameUwe Altmann Unternehmensberatung/name countryDE/country practiceDeployment/practice practiceSupport/practice practiceDevelopment/practice practiceDocumentation/practice descriptionHelping small business customers since many years in using and optimizing IT solutions. This is done by careful requirements analysis, migration support, professional project management and continuous user support based on individual agreements./description websitehttp://www.altsys.de/website emailuwe.altm...@altsys.de/email phone+49 681 96 02 13 39/phone /consultant
Re: [ApacheCon] BoF session on AOO community
When we have something to announce you can expect to read it in official places. It won't be something we'll be hiding in strange corners of the web. That means if an employee identifies proposals on XING does not correspond to the opinion of the IBM? Not officially? I think that's a strange point of view. I think sentences like: heute mal eine ganz andere Anfrage, IBM als eine der Firmen, die sich im Apache OpenOffice Projekt engagiert, macht sich auch über ein Service Support Konzept im Rahmen von Apache OpenOffice Gedanken. [...] Ich würde gerne mehr darüber erfahren, wer im OpenOffice Umfeld aktiv ist und an einer Partnerbeziehung auf dieser Ebene mit IBM interessiert ist. are absolutely clear. But no problem, I will contact IBM directly. Thanks for your clarification. Greetings, Jörg
Re: [ApacheCon] BoF session on AOO community
If everything is absolutely clear to you then I don't know what you want clarifications on. But if you do have a question then just ask it, here or via private email if that is your preference. Hello Rob, Ok, thank you, I will send you a private email. Greetings, Jörg
Re: [ApacheCon] BoF session on AOO community
Hello Rob, *, -Original Message- From: Rob Weir [mailto:robw...@apache.org] I think the challenge is to change the thinking that says a project can only be successful if it raises money. Yes, you're right. But success is measured, in my opinion, in the dissemination of AOO, for private users *but also* for use in companies. In my experience this purpose, the work on the ground is essential. AOO must be present to the public and decision makers in companies already have AOO be seen as a real alternative to MS Office. This calls for talks as a relevant framework in Germany at Chamber of Commerce Events. I personally have several months ago on the phone with a German IBM manager and to illustrate the relevance of such things. What concerns me is not about money (or primarily to money), but about collaboration in the communitybecause IBM, I and the German community are parts of the international community. I have also read the demands of IBM, on XING, to create a partner network, and I think that's a good idea, but unfortunately I put demand on the fixed nothing concrete happens. Collaboration in the community is not a question of money but of doing and at the same time, this cooperation also key to the success of service providers, e.g. such under which: http://www.openoffice.org/bizdev/consultants.html are listed. Currently I am professionally e.g. in negotiations for a major consulting company, which either LO or AOO want to use (instead of MS Office) on hundreds or thousands of workplaces, but these companies want to see visible presence of AOO. Such companies want from me, as an expert, impartial advice and not the reference to other companies. For Germany, I would wish for the future practical cooperation of consultants like me, medium-sized businesses, large companies, such as IBM, and the community, for mutual success. I'm ready for this for a long time, and as many of the German community, but we must finally start real actions. LibreOffice is everywhere in Germany, but where are we? Where AOO is really visible in Germany? Besides exhibitions (e.g. CeBIT or as the LinuxTag in Berlin), were IHK meetings an important opportunity. In the next year it will be an event of FroDeV commercial users give (http://www.frodev.org/konferenz), I'm sure that LibreOffice will be there, but also Apache OpenOffice? greetings Jörg
Re: [ApacheCon] BoF session on AOO community
Hello, The ooo-marketing list is a great place to coordinate international campaigns. And we have a German list for local events, yes? Yes, we have a German list, but there can discuss only. The practical work but needs a lot of different things. First people, but also material things and not a case by case, but permanently. The German community is working on this, but it is also necessary here to address such things. I think. I think the consultants directory is the best option here. Unfortunately, no. It is necessary but not sufficient, because it takes more than just information. AOO business users need confidence in the AOO and this is growing with major partners. I see companies looking for AOO support, but they are sometimes too small to interest IBM. But they would be a good size for smaller companies. I'd love to be able to refer them to a local small company. In this case, please explain to me why IBM calls publicly to a partner network. see: https://www.xing.com/net/aoo/allgemeines-diskussionsforum-698796/partner-netzwerk-rund-um-apache-openoffice-41041065/ Or is that not a valid question? Sorry Rob, just the very real problem that I see is that IBM does not understand that small companies can help to open up markets *for IBM*. But because the small companies can, IBM should take care of it. It would be good if IBM would consider the experiences of the past which consist of OOo, SUN and Oracle. Here on the mailing list, not the place to talk about these things, but I and other experts know how to act would be to achieve a win-win-situation for IBM and small companies. This is not a pure IT question but an business question. (Note: I have studied business administration.) Suggestion: 1) Take one of the general overview presentations from ApacheCon and clean it up. Make it into the standard' AOO overview presentation. Put it on the marketing wiki. Get it translated into various languages. Maintain it so it remains current. 2) Start a wiki page to lists events-of-interest. List event, date, location, link to website, etc. Project members who are local to that event can volunteer to present there. Many are doable as a day trip. CeBit is in Hanover, 92 minutes from Hamburg on the ICE train, for example. 3) For critical events where there are no local project members we can check with other Apache members, from other projects, to see if they can help cover it. In return, maybe we help promote related projects at events we are able to attend. 4) If any critical conference is still not covered, then we look at other options. These things are true, but they are no real answer to the problems that I have tried to explain. It's not a problem of people, time or money, it is first a question broadest possible cooperation of all concerned. Not only for individual events, but rather strategically. Greetings Jörg
Re: [ApacheCon] BoF session on AOO community
Customers don't come to IBM looking only for OpenOffice. I mean companies, not simple users. And these companies ask me if they should use AOO or LO and they look around in the market. These companies need my help, but they also need the confidence in the future of AOO and for many companies this is not a question of what the community is saying, but to say what its large community of partners (eg IBM). Views on the document of February 2012: http://ebookbrowse.com/symphony-apache-future-faq-02-2012-pdf-d359761565 and I tell you, that is the question many companies: When will The Apache OpenOffice IBM Edition on the market? They are looking for a bundle of software and services and OpenOffice might enter the discussions as a small part of the overall deal. We commonly work with business partners, subcontractors, etc., where specialized skills are needed. This includes partners large and small. But what IBM is doing in practice? It is your colleague who wrote the following: https://www.xing.com/net/aoo/allgemeines-diskussionsforum-698796/partner-netzwerk-rund-um-apache-openoffice-41041065/ and when I speak of, as a consultant for AOO, IBM I get no useful answer. That is the fact. Sorry, that's just the truth. I you can not post details here, but I mean what I say. I doubt the opportunities will flow from small companies to IBM. I do not, because it is grown in Germany OOo in business sector. The truth in this case is the OOo was as last in higher esteem than StarOffice and that was the merit of small German companies, not from Sun or Oracle. Or is that 'too much' truth? It would be good if IBM would consider the experiences of the past which consist of OOo, SUN and Oracle. And you might consider IBM's experience with Linux, where we invested over $1 billion into Linux development, but we don't sell Linux. But we're glad to work with partners on deals involving Linux. Yes, you're right. And many potential partners would be for the future of similar transactions with IBM wish regarding AOO. Statements in: https://www.xing.com/net/aoo/allgemeines-diskussionsforum-698796/partner-netzwerk-rund-um-apache-openoffice-41041065/ are correct, they need to be filled with life Again, sorry for my statements ... I know these are not issues for the list here, but there are important issues for small companies and consultants like me. And it should be important issues for IBM. Greetings Jörg
Re: The Impossible Question
Hello, -Original Message- From: Louis Suárez-Potts [mailto:lui...@gmail.com] On Behalf Ideas? What do you mean? Better design or more/better content? If you feel content, maybe even local resources would be useful. For example, I am since over 8 years moderator in the largest German speaking forum (for OOo / AOO / LO): http://de.openoffice.info (Notice: my nickname in this forum is Stephan) Greetings, Jörg
Entry in the consultants directory
Hello, a company has sent me his data that I pass here. Can you please make the entry in the consultant directory. Here are the data: consultant namein-put GbR - Das Linux-Systemhaus/name countryDE/country practiceDeployment/practice practiceSupport/practice practiceOthers/practice description in-put GbR has been offering consulting, migration, trainings and support for OpenOffice since 1995. /description websitehttp://www.in-put.de/website emailkont...@in-put.de/email phone+49(0)721 68032880/phone /consultant Greetings, Jörg
Re: Entry in the consultants directory
Hello, Here are the data: consultant namein-put GbR - Das Linux-Systemhaus/name countryDE/country practiceDeployment/practice practiceSupport/practice practiceOthers/practice description in-put GbR has been offering consulting, migration, trainings and support for OpenOffice since 1995. /description websitehttp://www.in-put.de/website emailkont...@in-put.de/email phone+49(0)721 68032880/phone /consultant Greetings, Jörg They have to change the name to Apache OpenOffice (TM). I dont see a problem. The company offers support for OpenOffice since 1995 and not support for Apache OpenOffice TM. Support for Apache OpenOffice TM the company offers *only* since 2011 (i think). OK, we can write: description in-put GbR has been offering consulting, migration, trainings and support for OpenOffice.org since 1995. / description but *incorrectly* is: description in-put GbR has been offering consulting, migration, trainings and support for Apache OpenOffice TM since 1995. / description Greetings, Jörg P.S. @Raphael, (sorry for german): Ich habe diese Firma bereits gebeten ihre Webseite zu überarbeiten und sie haben das *bereitwillig* getan. Weißt Du wie unangenehm es ist offlist Firmen unsere überpenible Rechtswahrnehmungspolitik zu erklären, wenn ich mir (stellvertretend für uns alle hier) anhören muß das nicht einmal kommerzielle Rechtsinhaber solchen Zeck treiben wie wir.
Re: Problems sign in consultants directory
Hello, Here is the updated version: http://www.openoffice.org/bizdev/consultant-submission.html I split out the XML instructions from the main part, and added an example of a non-XML submission. yes, that's much better - small change, big impact ;-) But one more request a consultant asked me why in: http://www.openoffice.org/bizdev/consultant-submission.html at practice the entry training is not appears, but in: http://www.openoffice.org/bizdev/consultants.html (see second row in table) I think there is a discrepancy. Greetings, Jörg
Re: Apache OO General Questions
Hello, From: Eike Rathke [mailto:o...@erack.de] What I want to say is that we're getting nowhere with pointing fingers. yes, indeed. Only this is not a one-way street. For example, i will never forget what the FSF said against AOO: http://www.fsf.org/news/openoffice-apache-libreoffice and I'm watching very very attentively what the TDF is doing - in the past and currently. Yes, I am (since 8 years) only a simple member of the community and not a real developer, but that's my opinion. Greetings, Jörg
Problems sign in consultants directory
Hello, I now have sent an invitation to 41 companies relating to an entry in the directory: http://www.openoffice.org/bizdev/consultants.html And I got the first reply: Listings must be submitted to the ooo-dev mailing list as patches to the file consultants.xml nicht Ihr Ernst, oder? No problem in this individual case, because I offered my personal help, but I think it may seem too complicated for some users even having to create an XML file. What can we do? For example, i could write a macro for AOO with an input dialog, which simplifies the creation of the XML file. But I need a few days time. Hints? Greetings, Jörg
Re: Problems sign in consultants directory
Hello, This is covered in the instructions here: If you are not familiar with XML, please submit the equivalent information in a post to the ooo-dev list and we can help you format it for submission. But your listing will appear faster if it is submitted in the proper form. Reference: http://www.openoffice.org/bizdev/consultant-submission.html Yes, but ... i think this reference is perhaps not the totally appropriate assistance. Please consider two things: - not all speak english well and want to post on mailing-lists - in our invitation we actually ask others to help us (yes, I think offer services for AOO is help for us) - not vice versa. A form with Javascript to form the XML might be useful sometime, but it is possible that the XML schema might change based on feedback we receive during this initial phase of submissions. So it might be better to wait. OK. Greetings, Jörg
Re: Problems sign in consultants directory
i think this reference is perhaps not the totally appropriate assistance. Please consider two things: - not all speak english well and want to post on mailing-lists I understand. We can add translations of that page if you think it would help. But the mailing list post is required as part of the process. A listing in the consultants directory is not a right. It is not guaranteed. It requires review by the PMC, and the PMC does its work openly on the ooo-dev list. The submittor does not need to subscribe to ooo-dev, but they do need to submit there listing here. So even if we find ways to automate this, we would want to ensure that any automation sends a copy of the submission to ooo-dev. OK, but it is necessary that each user writes itself? In my invitation, I had noted additionally: Should you have any questions, you can contact me personally at. I shall help you. In my opinion it should be possible that the people write me and I will send their data to the mailinglist. *Not* in *all* cases, but in cases where it is necessary. Or is this a problem? Greetings, Jörg
Re: question about consultants page
Hello Rob, *, From: Rob Weir [mailto:robw...@apache.org] Submissions are welcome. Fine, thanks. Here are my data: consultant nameJörg Schmidt, IT- und Unternehmensberatung/name countryDE/country practiceDeployment/practice practiceSupport/practice practiceDevelopment/practice practiceOthers/practice descriptionconsulting, migration (planning, implementation, project-care), programming (extensions, macros), trainings (for managers and end users), support (end users, installation, install customization)/description websitehttp://www.jm-schmidt.de/website emaili...@jm-schmidt.de/email phone /phone /consultant or online: http://www.calc-info.de/files/joerg_schmidt.xml We should think of consultant-submission.html as a living document. Yes. That is also my opinion. I am offering commercial support for OpenOffice.org (consulting, migration, programming, trainings) since 6 years. (in germany) Greetings, Jörg
Re: Consultants Directory: Update and Help Needed
Hello Rob, From: Rob Weir [mailto:robw...@apache.org] So areas where I could use help: 1) Reviewing the non-English legacy consultants for relevant ones who should be invited. German, French, Italian and Spanish volunteers are especially needed. If you can help I can send you a spreadsheet of the websites and an English version of my invitation note. Maybe 30 or so per language. I think I can help you with the german consultants. I already know most of the german consultants personally, for example, all on: http://www.frodev.org/dienstleister Greetings, Jörg
Re: [VOTE] Apache OpenOffice Community Graduation Vote
hello, Rob Weir wrote: [...] Am I authorized to vote? If so then: [x] +1 Apache OpenOffice community is ready to graduate from the Apache Incubator. greetings Jörg
bug in AOO 3.4.0?
Hello, i think there is ab bug in calc 3.4. when i have a calc-file, that is saved with password-protection, and i use file-save under (Datei - Speichern unter in a german AOO) and de-select the password-option in the save-dialog, the file is saved, but the password ist not removed. The search function in the issue tracker (http://www.openoffice.org/qa/issue_handling/submission_gateway.html#application) does not work, so i was not looking there. greetings Jörg please have also a look on: http://de.openoffice.info/viewtopic.php?f=3t=53793
Re: press announcement for AOO 3.4
Hello, Rob Weir schrieb: I'm talking about final sign-off. Of course, normal Apache principles apply here. Our work is done openly, on the mailing lists. Transparency is important. OK The fact that we have consumer users does not mean that project members can issue press releases without review and approval of the PMC and Press@. Yes, You say absolutely correct. But .. ... limit is the fact that it is the local user activity is not only on national issues of language software, but _it also requires the specific local labor_. That's what I mean. Yes. But as mentioned above, it would be better if you first started a thread here on ooo-dev making a proposal for a press release, describing in high-level terms the purpose and content. OK, thanks. I don't see it as a bad thing. OK. but still it is not quite the same as the work within AOO / ASF Groups outside of AOO have some advantages, e.g., they can raise funds, hire developers, issue press releases, etc. Members of such groups can also be members of the Apache OpenOffice project. Of course, their are benefits of working entirely within the AOO project. I have to think about it for now. Greetings Jörg P.S. Please Rob: I have worked for more than 6 years in the german OOo community and I work professionally continue for OpenOffice - only it's hard for me to understand how the ASF works and here to find my place. Please understand that my English is not the best, and it is sometimes difficult for me to express myself accurately. Thank you.
Re: press announcement for AOO 3.4
Hello, Rob Weir schrieb: We have no formal project subdivisions that have authority to issue their own press releases. OK, clear. (i did not know before) How could it be otherwise that we would want a press release about the project/product in the name of the project not to be reviewed by the project? I had sketched out a way. At the same time I am aware that this way at ASF is currently not possible. OK, no problem. However: Rob, I think we are discussing something and I think also contribute to the AOO community something to the development of ASF. And who knows ... perhaps in the future there will be subdivisions. Greetings Jörg
press announcement for AOO 3.4
Hello, I think in particular this AOO (Apache OpenOffice) more at the market, or in public, must be present. Because now the release/publication of the final version of Apache OpenOffice 3.4 approaches it is a matter press announcements to prepare for it. 1. Is an international press announcement already in preparation? This would be good as a basis for national or local press announcements. 2. How is the Lazy Consensus for national or local press announcements? I think that this in the national communities must be created, because national particularities are to be considered (i mean in the minds of local users). greetings Jörg
Re: press announcement for AOO 3.4
Hello Rob, *, Rob Weir schrieb: Apache has some rules and restrictions related to press releases, etc., from podlings under incubation. See this page: http://incubator.apache.org/guides/branding.html OK I have read this. I have read the particular point publicity activities: Podlings MUST coordinate with the Apache Public Relations Committee on all publicity activities by a podling. question: Is it possible to Apache Public Relations Committee a draft of a German press release to be transmitted so that confirms this? My reading of this is we cannot just assume lazy consensus but we need to reach out to pr...@apache.org and coordinate with them on any formal publicity activities. Do I understand correctly that we e.g. _german_ press reports are to discuss pr...@apache.org? Who understands German at pr...@apache.org? I understand that you have coordinate said, but coordinate needs discuss. And for e.g. Germany, Austria, Switzerland, we need german-language press releases. Here is an example of a press release from de-OOo from the year 2010: http://openoffice.org/projects/de/lists/dev/archive/2010-06/message/15 However, there are also a range of informal activities that do not require this additional review, like blog posts, announcements to the ooo-announce list, social media campaigns, etc. These could be discussed on the list. OK, but that's not what i mean and what we need first for the national information of users. Let me say it clearly: AOO is in a difficult situation and we should do everything to keep ex-OOo users and attract new users for AOO. AOO is initially a product for end users and not for it-specialists and end users need information such as in magazines (for example http://www.heise.de/ct/inhalt/), and magazines need national-language press releases. greetings Jörg
Re: press announcement for AOO 3.4
Hello, Rob Weir wrote: question: Is it possible to Apache Public Relations Committee a draft of a German press release to be transmitted so that confirms this? You say press release, but who do you think is issuing the press release? What entity? Apache OpenOffice (or 'incubator AOO'), but there must also be a national entity for national or local press releases. Are you talking about a real press release that goes out via a wire service? No. Or just an something on our website that says Press Release on it? Not only. I also mean e.g. press releases in the form of Emails. Also, the purpose of the review and approval is not to fine tune your German grammar. But Apache does have an interest in making sure that trademarks are used correctly and that required podling disclaimers are included, etc. Yes, this ist also reasonable. And most of all, Press@ is here to help. They have expertise and contacts that can help us get out our message. And what can the german AOO-community do? Can we send drafts of press releases to Press@... to discuss it? And for e.g. Germany, Austria, Switzerland, we need german-language press releases. When we release AOO 3.4 it will be on many more languages. We'll need to coordinate the press activities. Yes, clear. But what about national issues, e.g. the future of (OOo) / AOO in the Munich city council? You know the LiMux project: http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/LiMux I don't see a problem with that. I see a problem if for month users being not informed enough and (OOo)/AOO constantly users loses. You not? And I see a problem if it is for beginners so difficult to understand the workings of Apache. Many of us who are not developers want to work for the success of AOO, but do not always understand ways of working. This is the challenge in all languages, right? This special press message, yes, but not all. greetings Jörg
Re: Apache Disavows Team OpenOffice.org e.V.
Hello, Martin Hollmichel wrote: obviously there was not too much knowledge about the former role of Team OpenOffice.org and the relationship among Team OOo and Apache is not really defined right now. I hope the header of this message does not mean that no further communication between Apache and Team OOo is desired ? I dont know this, but i hope there is communication between TeamOOo e.V. and users. I wrote an email (on 13.10.2011) to vorst...@teamopenoffice.de (your email m...@openoffice.org in CC) and got no answer. Why? No interest in communication? Greetings Jörg
Re: Apache Disavows Team OpenOffice.org e.V.
Hello, Martin Hollmichel wrote: sorry, for not answering yet, our bandwidth is bit overloaded in the moment, we come back to your email soon, In the moment? Oh no, this is shortened. I have written numerous emails to Team OOo e.V. and members of Team OOo e.V. (and one Fax to), _since November 2010_ - i never got real answers. I ask this again: WHY? What is the self understanding of Team OOo e.V.? It is not my fault if these questions sound unpleasant. Greetings Jörg
Re: [PROPOSAL] Set up of ooo-dev-ja at incubator.apache.org
Hello, Dave Fisher schrieb: if you mix everything like user questions and answers, marketing, QA et cetra on only *one ML*, you will alienate the poor users. But it seems to be the way it is. so ... I wish you all the best. I understand your concerns about mixing marketing with users. What are the other categories besides marketing that users should be shielded from? Translation? We've been mentored to only have additional lists for good reason and with careful consideration of the community and our oversight responsibilities to the ASF. It is very, very simple. The list us...@de.openoffice.org is a list ONLY for german-speaking users. This users a _not Community-members_ but only users and this users cannot write questions in english. The list us...@de.openoffice.org is a support-list for users, not a list to coordinate the activity of the project-members. OK, we can replace us...@de.openoffice.org by a german forum but the users just like us...@de.openoffice.org, and it would be better to have a German-language forum AND a german USERS-list. Greetings Jörg -- www.calc-info.de
