Re: [opencog-dev] Re: Should we encode the basic cognitive procedures (initial version at least) or they will spring out automatically?

2017-05-05 Thread Linas Vepstas 
On Fri, May 5, 2017 at 7:14 PM, Alex  wrote:

> *Actually at present I don't know any good reference, resource about
> symbolic machine learning - so - if anyone can provide it, mention it, then
> I would be really happy. *
>

I don't either. The best one I know of is this one
 https://arxiv.org/abs/1401.3372

--linas

>
>
>

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"opencog" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to opencog+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to opencog@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/opencog.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/opencog/CAHrUA34GJikpHq23z5tEzKpjsqGpiwAECt7O2tgk5QDMH5dXnw%40mail.gmail.com.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

Re: [opencog-dev] Re: Should we encode the basic cognitive procedures (initial version at least) or they will spring out automatically?

2017-05-05 Thread Linas Vepstas 
On Fri, May 5, 2017 at 6:50 PM, Alex  wrote:

>
> So, I am trying this encoding, but everythins is so slow for me.
>

Yes, it is for us all.

anyway, stop thinking of AGI as being "just like human but smarter" -- it
won't be that.

--linas

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"opencog" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to opencog+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to opencog@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/opencog.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/opencog/CAHrUA35eqOQ9J6ghEVgmSAa98-Hp%3DrdZPj%3DR5wrS18%3D-kjpqww%40mail.gmail.com.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

[opencog-dev] Re: Should we encode the basic cognitive procedures (initial version at least) or they will spring out automatically?

2017-05-05 Thread Alex 
Well - my endeavours are somehow marginal, because machine learning today 
is almost nothing more than applied statistics - it evaluates the 
parameters of the statistical models. By I am trying other kind of machine 
learning - symbolic, logical machine learning that learns symbolic 
knowledge. *Actually at present I don't know any good reference, resource 
about symbolic machine learning - so - if anyone can provide it, mention 
it, then I would be really happy. *

The other field that lacks development, is what I can call "*structural 
optimization*". E.g. one can imaginge complex business process/queue model 
that have service times, waiting times, availability ratios and so on. One 
can numerically optimize this model. But - we can imagine the structural 
transformation of this model in completely different business process. So - 
how to select the best model from the different structures - now just 
simlate those models and choose the best structure, but to do guided search 
(like gradient search in numerical optimization) towards the best 
structure/structural model? So - *if there are references in this field, 
then I would be more than happy to hear about them as well!*

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"opencog" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to opencog+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to opencog@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/opencog.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/opencog/4259343f-87c1-486d-81a1-5f8b24ae3263%40googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

[opencog-dev] Re: Should we encode the basic cognitive procedures (initial version at least) or they will spring out automatically?

2017-05-05 Thread Alex 
I just wanted to say that there are open questions both in the domain 
knowledge level (e.g. in math) and in the self-learning methodology (meta-) 
level. Humanity is solving those questions in step-by-step manner and AGI 
agents can join in this process as well. But those AGI agents should have 
some basic knowledge and some basic learning skills which they can improve 
during the interaction and existence process.

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"opencog" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to opencog+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to opencog@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/opencog.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/opencog/77b0222b-73ee-45bb-a7da-36ce52310d85%40googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

[opencog-dev] Re: Should we encode the basic cognitive procedures (initial version at least) or they will spring out automatically?

2017-05-05 Thread Alex 
No, my goal is to build AGI for the benefit of humanity and it is not 
chatbot for entertainment. Apparently, there will be different 
characters/personalities, e.g.:
- teacher that explores the pupils current knowledge, beliefs, reasoning 
styles, personality, motivational system and that provides exactly targeted 
information and explanations. Math teacher (from school to graduate level) 
can be good example.
- Math scientist that discovers, explains, publishes and implements new 
optimization algorithms
- legal QA system
- IT development system that can reengineer legacy code, recover 
specification from the the code, explore and explain code
and so on, so on

In each case the AGI agent should explore that she knows and what she does 
not know and then she should decide what knowledge is necessary and then 
gather those knowledge. She - the agent - should estimate each fact, piece 
of knowledge, how deep she understands this piece and if she does not 
understand then she should go out for further knowledge - she can read 
books, she can automatically post in forums and wait for replies, she can 
seek conversations with different agents of human beings. So - she starts 
with the minimum knowledge and basic understanding, self-learning 
capabilities and the she gets more knowledge, she deepns the notions "what 
is understanging", "how should I learn", "what are my emotions and 
motivations", "what are emotions and motivations of my students" and so on.

So - the essence of my question was this - should we encode these basic 
capabilities or can be just automatically translate all the wikipedia (or 
largers corpus) into Atomspace and wait till those basic skills - 
understanding, self-learning - emerge? My guess is that we should provide 
basic skills and ignite self-learning process. Actually - that is exactly 
how humanity develops. There is no corpus in the world that fully explains 
what understanging is, how to solve the problems of epistemology, what 
types of emotions humans have and so on. There is no such corpus and I 
guess there will never be full answers. So - we should replicate the path 
of humanity that approachs those questions in step-by-step manner and 
sometimes are content with the partial answers that can or may not converge 
to something that can be called truth.

So, I am trying this encoding, but everythins is so slow for me.

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"opencog" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to opencog+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to opencog@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/opencog.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/opencog/cbe42e21-7f16-4073-981b-cfc75a644a17%40googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

Re: [opencog-dev] Contributing to OpenCog

2017-05-05 Thread 'Nil Geisweiller' via opencog 

Great wikipage containing what you're looking for and more

http://wiki.opencog.org/w/Background_Publications

Nil

On 05/05/2017 08:47 PM, Pranav Deshpande wrote:

Hello and thank you for the reply. I will start reading the book as you
suggest, Could you please send me the electronic draft?
Also, based on my current Github repo, which part do you think is
appropriate for me to contribute to?

Regards,
Pranav

On Friday, May 5, 2017 at 10:07:41 PM UTC+5:30, Nil wrote:

Hi,

On 05/05/2017 05:14 PM, Pranav Deshpande wrote:
> I would like to contribute to OpenCog. What aspects of AI and ML do I
> need to know to contribute; or can I just get started? I wanted some
> guidance.

it all depends on what you'd like to do, if you desire to go to the
bottom of it I think knowing probability and logic (say predicate
logic)
is very good. Having a broad culture about AI helps too, including
theoretical stuff like Solomonoff induction. Ben and Linas would
probably tell you that category theory is helpful :-) (I know too
little
about it and I've started reading "Category Theory for the Siences").
More directly linked to the OpenCog design you may want to read

https://www.amazon.com/Engineering-General-Intelligence-Part-Cognitive/dp/9462390266/



if you'd rather not spend money on it we can provide you an electronic
draft that is essentially like the book. The wiki itself is full of
information, browse it at will.

Regarding programming languages, the core is in C++ and it supports
Scheme, Python and Haskell as binding languages.

You don't necessarily need to know all that to contribute though,
reading the wiki and giving your feedback, correcting when you can is
very helpful.

Nil

>
> Regards,
> Pranav
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
> Groups "opencog" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it,
send
> an email to opencog+u...@googlegroups.com 
> .
> To post to this group, send email to ope...@googlegroups.com

> .
> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/opencog
.
> To view this discussion on the web visit
>

https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/opencog/8f8a1f5f-1415-4ac1-9bf6-2c45829b8bd2%40googlegroups.com



>

>.

> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout
.

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
Groups "opencog" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send
an email to opencog+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com
.
To post to this group, send email to opencog@googlegroups.com
.
Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/opencog.
To view this discussion on the web visit
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/opencog/f8c5d7e8-a68e-4db6-a859-526be6001bff%40googlegroups.com
.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.


--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"opencog" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to opencog+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to opencog@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/opencog.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/opencog/281a2d9f-47a0-0e18-8931-5f470b1ec869%40gmail.com.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

Re: [opencog-dev] Contributing to OpenCog

2017-05-05 Thread Pranav Deshpande 
Hello and thank you for the reply. I will start reading the book as you 
suggest, Could you please send me the electronic draft?
Also, based on my current Github repo, which part do you think is 
appropriate for me to contribute to?

Regards,
Pranav

On Friday, May 5, 2017 at 10:07:41 PM UTC+5:30, Nil wrote:
>
> Hi, 
>
> On 05/05/2017 05:14 PM, Pranav Deshpande wrote: 
> > I would like to contribute to OpenCog. What aspects of AI and ML do I 
> > need to know to contribute; or can I just get started? I wanted some 
> > guidance. 
>
> it all depends on what you'd like to do, if you desire to go to the 
> bottom of it I think knowing probability and logic (say predicate logic) 
> is very good. Having a broad culture about AI helps too, including 
> theoretical stuff like Solomonoff induction. Ben and Linas would 
> probably tell you that category theory is helpful :-) (I know too little 
> about it and I've started reading "Category Theory for the Siences"). 
> More directly linked to the OpenCog design you may want to read 
>
> https://www.amazon.com/Engineering-General-Intelligence-Part-Cognitive/dp/9462390266/
>  
> if you'd rather not spend money on it we can provide you an electronic 
> draft that is essentially like the book. The wiki itself is full of 
> information, browse it at will. 
>
> Regarding programming languages, the core is in C++ and it supports 
> Scheme, Python and Haskell as binding languages. 
>
> You don't necessarily need to know all that to contribute though, 
> reading the wiki and giving your feedback, correcting when you can is 
> very helpful. 
>
> Nil 
>
> > 
> > Regards, 
> > Pranav 
> > 
> > -- 
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google 
> > Groups "opencog" group. 
> > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send 
> > an email to opencog+u...@googlegroups.com  
> > . 
> > To post to this group, send email to ope...@googlegroups.com 
>  
> > . 
> > Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/opencog. 
> > To view this discussion on the web visit 
> > 
> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/opencog/8f8a1f5f-1415-4ac1-9bf6-2c45829b8bd2%40googlegroups.com
>  
> > <
> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/opencog/8f8a1f5f-1415-4ac1-9bf6-2c45829b8bd2%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email_source=footer>.
>  
>
> > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. 
>

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"opencog" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to opencog+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to opencog@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/opencog.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/opencog/f8c5d7e8-a68e-4db6-a859-526be6001bff%40googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

Re: [opencog-dev] Contributing to OpenCog

2017-05-05 Thread 'Nil Geisweiller' via opencog 

Hi,

On 05/05/2017 05:14 PM, Pranav Deshpande wrote:

I would like to contribute to OpenCog. What aspects of AI and ML do I
need to know to contribute; or can I just get started? I wanted some
guidance.


it all depends on what you'd like to do, if you desire to go to the 
bottom of it I think knowing probability and logic (say predicate logic) 
is very good. Having a broad culture about AI helps too, including 
theoretical stuff like Solomonoff induction. Ben and Linas would 
probably tell you that category theory is helpful :-) (I know too little 
about it and I've started reading "Category Theory for the Siences"). 
More directly linked to the OpenCog design you may want to read 
https://www.amazon.com/Engineering-General-Intelligence-Part-Cognitive/dp/9462390266/ 
if you'd rather not spend money on it we can provide you an electronic 
draft that is essentially like the book. The wiki itself is full of 
information, browse it at will.


Regarding programming languages, the core is in C++ and it supports 
Scheme, Python and Haskell as binding languages.


You don't necessarily need to know all that to contribute though, 
reading the wiki and giving your feedback, correcting when you can is 
very helpful.


Nil



Regards,
Pranav

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
Groups "opencog" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send
an email to opencog+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com
.
To post to this group, send email to opencog@googlegroups.com
.
Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/opencog.
To view this discussion on the web visit
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/opencog/8f8a1f5f-1415-4ac1-9bf6-2c45829b8bd2%40googlegroups.com
.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.


--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"opencog" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to opencog+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to opencog@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/opencog.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/opencog/179e51ff-a222-702f-f2e1-cfeead33b6b6%40gmail.com.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.