Re: [opensuse] SuSE-watcher/ksmarttray
Would be nice if you could tell ksmarttray to update certain channels (most notably ~/suse/update/10.1 of course) when checking for updates. and probably using different words for similar thinbgs add to the mess. what are those channels? I already had problem undersdtanding what are the different inst-source (not even trying to know what are the different metadata systems) many things need to be simplified jdd -- http://www.dodin.net http://dodin.org/galerie_photo_web/expo/index.html http://lucien.dodin.net http://fr.susewiki.org/index.php?title=Gérer_ses_photos - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [opensuse] SuSE-watcher/ksmarttray
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Michael Schueller wrote: > Am Samstag, 3. Juni 2006 01:31 schrieb Pascal Bleser: >> It's very simple though, it just calls "smart update" on a >> regular basis (interval is hardcoded in the sources), checks the >> output and reports it. So it's a lot like SuSE-watcher. >> >> If someone with some KDE hacking skills would like to spend a >> little time on it, I think it's pretty easy to expand (it already >> does the dirty job of interfacing with smart)... or even use >> SuSE-watcher and copy/paste the ksmarttray code "smart update" >> output checking code into it. > > if anybody would patch the suse-watcher to check about new updates > with the smart engine, it would check the smart sources > (channels=sources > jpp) for updates. > If you then press the Button "Update now", the SuSE(Yast) Online > Update would appear, which has mostly different sources. > So it would only make sence when the hacked suse-watcher only checks > the suse update repo, and for all other sources you can use > ksmarttray... Well, obviously suse-watcher should also be modified to start "smart - --gui" instead of YOU (but that's really the easy part) ;) cheers - -- -o) Pascal Bleser http://linux01.gwdg.de/~pbleser/ /\\ <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> _\_v The more things change, the more they stay insane. -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.2 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFEgXFcr3NMWliFcXcRAnodAJ48K3m+vKubQhI8qgvcY0ExoofmxQCgiHXx CgNF28e5xSO/1hh7Ct+lO4Q= =RoCb -END PGP SIGNATURE- - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [opensuse] SuSE-watcher/ksmarttray
Pascal Bleser wrote: > Michael Schueller wrote: > >> Am Samstag, 3. Juni 2006 01:31 schrieb Pascal Bleser: > >>> It's very simple though, it just calls "smart update" on a > >>> regular basis (interval is hardcoded in the sources), checks the > >>> output and reports it. So it's a lot like SuSE-watcher. > >>> > >>> If someone with some KDE hacking skills would like to spend a > >>> little time on it, I think it's pretty easy to expand (it already > >>> does the dirty job of interfacing with smart)... or even use > >>> SuSE-watcher and copy/paste the ksmarttray code "smart update" > >>> output checking code into it. > >> if anybody would patch the suse-watcher to check about new updates > >> with the smart engine, it would check the smart sources > >> (channels=sources > jpp) for updates. > >> If you then press the Button "Update now", the SuSE(Yast) Online > >> Update would appear, which has mostly different sources. > >> So it would only make sence when the hacked suse-watcher only checks > >> the suse update repo, and for all other sources you can use > >> ksmarttray... > > Well, obviously suse-watcher should also be modified to start "smart > --gui" instead of YOU (but that's really the easy part) ;) > I would really *love* that! Since thursday I'm a new Smart lover, And the main reason I like it so much (besides the fact that it actually works perfectly ;-) is that it provides a distribution-independant solution. I think that this is good for general acceptance of Linux on the desktop. No need to re-invent the wheel everytime... What I would like to see that the SUSE specific channels you added to the package (thank you for that!) will be done in a separate package. So the distribution comes with a default package with the Smart tooling, and a separate package with all known additional distribution specific repositories. But first we need a KDE Smart gui :-) Regards Harry - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [opensuse] SuSE-watcher/ksmarttray
Op zaterdag 3 juni 2006 13:51, schreef Harry ten Berge: > What I would like to see that the SUSE specific channels you added to > the package (thank you for that!) will be done > in a separate package. So the distribution comes with a default package > with the Smart tooling, and a separate > package with all known additional distribution specific repositories. Perhaps, a new a channel can be created that provides seperate rpms for each possible channel. For now let's call this channel 'channels'. So this channel provides e.g. the rpms: - channel-kde - channel-suser-guru - channel-packman etc The idea behind this is to be able to add a channel using the command: smart --install channel- Although, I'm not sure that this will actually add the channel, it would be nice if this was possible. By creating a new project 'channels' on the build server, it would be possible for build server users to maintain the channel rpm. Just an idea, perhaps it works...? -- Richard Bos Without a home the journey is endless - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [opensuse] SuSE-watcher/ksmarttray
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Harry ten Berge wrote: > Pascal Bleser wrote: >> Michael Schueller wrote: Am Samstag, 3. Juni 2006 01:31 schrieb Pascal Bleser: > It's very simple though, it just calls "smart update" on a > regular basis (interval is hardcoded in the sources), checks the > output and reports it. So it's a lot like SuSE-watcher. > > If someone with some KDE hacking skills would like to spend a > little time on it, I think it's pretty easy to expand (it already > does the dirty job of interfacing with smart)... or even use > SuSE-watcher and copy/paste the ksmarttray code "smart update" > output checking code into it. if anybody would patch the suse-watcher to check about new updates with the smart engine, it would check the smart sources (channels=sources > jpp) for updates. If you then press the Button "Update now", the SuSE(Yast) Online Update would appear, which has mostly different sources. So it would only make sence when the hacked suse-watcher only checks the suse update repo, and for all other sources you can use ksmarttray... >> >> Well, obviously suse-watcher should also be modified to start "smart >> --gui" instead of YOU (but that's really the easy part) ;) >> > I would really *love* that! > > Since thursday I'm a new Smart lover, *g* yet another lover, smart sure is a busy h...er ;))) > And the main reason I like it so much (besides the fact that it actually > works perfectly ;-) is that it provides a distribution-independant solution. > I think that this is good for general acceptance of Linux on the > desktop. > No need to re-invent the wheel everytime... Absolutely, from that point of view, smart has a huge potential. While it will most probably never become the "default" package manager on all distributions, it is nevertheless available for all distributions, and you can use it everywhere. Same tool, same commands, and the same frontends. Actually, one could write a more capable GUI for package management, based on smart, which would work on any distribution. Personally, I'm rather focusing on smart on SUSE Linux, but the potential is there ;) > What I would like to see that the SUSE specific channels you added to > the package (thank you for that!) will be done in a separate package. > So the distribution comes with a default package with the Smart > tooling, and a separate package with all known additional distribution > specific repositories. - From a technical point of view, I would tend to agree. But not for the sake of end-users, at least for the less experienced. Installing smart on 10.1 currently already is pretty much jumping into hoops for beginners (especially when zypp doesn't work :\), mostly for installing python-rpm first (smart depends on it, and it's not installed by default). Then they have to install smart. Having to install another package (e.g. "smart-suse") will make the procedure even longer (and possibly more complex): http://spinink.net/2006/05/20/installing-smart-package-manager/ http://dev-loki.blogspot.com/2006/05/how-to-install-and-use-smart-on-suse.html http://www.desktoplinux.com/articles/AT3456783210.html Another option would be to write some good bash script that would handle all the nitty-gritty, and less experienced users would just need to run that. wget http://.../smart-install-suse.sh bash ./smart-install-suse.sh It would check for rpm-python, install it if it's not present, grab the latest smart RPM, and then the latest smart-suse RPM. Having to run a shell-script that you grab from the internet as root is certainly not the most secure way of doing things, but in the end, people have to trust those who build the packages anyway (but at least packages have signatures and checksums). Apart from that, I would have to split out another subpackage for things that were previously contained in the "main" package. That's going to be an issue for people who already have smart installed and upgrade to that version. I'm not sure I like it. > But first we need a KDE Smart gui :-) Well, yeah, possibly. Though that's not really high priority IMO. A good GUI, whatever the toolkit is, be it GTK2 or QT/KDE. Even though I use KDE as my desktop environment, I don't really care if the GUI uses GTK2, as long as its good. But I always use "smart --shell" so I won't care about that in the first place ;) cheers - -- -o) Pascal Bleser http://linux01.gwdg.de/~pbleser/ /\\ <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> _\_v The more things change, the more they stay insane. -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.2 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFEgY22r3NMWliFcXcRAtjoAJsExenzJqPh1mxBaKc8oMmekeIgHQCgsT1Q 5LGBxwcB2HB4cla+/Pf/8Wo= =FW4k -END PGP SIGNATURE- - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [opensuse] SuSE-watcher/ksmarttray
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1
Richard Bos wrote:
> Op zaterdag 3 juni 2006 13:51, schreef Harry ten Berge:
>> What I would like to see that the SUSE specific channels you added to
>> the package (thank you for that!) will be done
>> in a separate package. So the distribution comes with a default package
>> with the Smart tooling, and a separate
>> package with all known additional distribution specific repositories.
>
> Perhaps, a new a channel can be created that provides seperate rpms for each
> possible channel. For now let's call this channel 'channels'. So this
> channel provides e.g. the rpms:
> - channel-kde
> - channel-suser-guru
> - channel-packman
> etc
>
> The idea behind this is to be able to add a channel using the command:
> smart --install channel-
It's even easier to provide .channel files somewhere (like the .repo
files in the Build Service), and just do
smart channel --add http:///guru.channel
smart channel --add http:///packman.channel
etc...
I prefer the idea of a single-click installation of channels, with
.channel MIME handlers for firefox and konqueror/KDE that run a simple
script that runs "smart channel --add" on the file or URL.
Those .channel files are very simple and easy to create.
Here's an example for Packman:
- ---8<-
[packman]
name = Packman 3rd Party Package Repository
baseurl = http://packman.inode.at/suse/10.1
type = yast2
- ---8<-
- - [packman] is the channel's alias (unique identifier)
- - name is just a description
- - baseurl is self-explanatory ;)
- - type is the type of repository (rpm-md, yast2, apt-rpm, ...)
Note that it always holds the SUSE Linux version in the baseurl.
Maybe it would be worth adding a feature to smart to have it replace a
few predefined placeholders in .channel files before processing them, e.g.:
baseurl = http://packman.inode.at/suse/${distversion}
Setting the values for those predefined placeholders is very easy, that
can be done in /usr/lib/smart/distro.py (which is meant to include
distribution specific code and comes with the smart package).
Something like (in distro.py):
- ---8<---
placeholders['distversion'] = '10.1'
placeholders['distarch'] = 'i586'
placeholders['distcanonicalarch'] = 'i386'
placeholders['distoptarch'] = 'i686'
- ---8<---
or
- ---8<---
placeholders['distversion'] = '10.0'
placeholders['distarch'] = 'x86_64'
placeholders['distcanonicalarch'] = 'x86_64'
placeholders['distoptarch'] = 'x86_64'
- ---8<---
and add a patch to smart to parse and process ${...} placeholders in
.channel files.
That way you'd have the same .channel file and the same URL, no matter
what SUSE Linux version you're using.
(we'd need a ${distarch} as well)
I'll have a look if I find some time.
Note that from smart-0.41-24 on, I've written and applied a patch that
adds embedded mirror definition support in .channel files:
- ---8<-
[packman]
name = Packman 3rd Party Package Repository
baseurl = http://packman.inode.at/suse/10.1
type = yast2
mirror = http://packman.mirrors.skynet.be/pub/packman/suse/10.1
mirror = http://packman.rsync.zmi.at/suse/10.1
mirror = http://ftp.uni-erlangen.de/pub/mirrors/packman/suse/10.1
- ---8<-
If you decide to include that channel in your list of channels, smart
will also add the mirrors to smart's mirror configuration (smart mirror
- --show).
I've sent that patch upstream but as of now, only my smart RPM (>=
0.41-24) includes that feature. Note that the smart package that comes
with SL 10.1 does _not_ have support for such "mirror =" directives in
.channel files, but as smart ignores tags it doesn't understand, the
.channel file would still work, just not add the mirrors.
After a few download/install/upgrade runs, smart will recognize
automatically what mirror works best for you, and primarily use that one
from then on.
> Although, I'm not sure that this will actually add the channel, it would be
> nice if this was possible.
It's just a matter of adding a .channel file into /etc/smart/channels/
The next time you run smart (e.g. smart update, or smart install, or
smart whatever), it will detect that new .channel file and prompt you
whether you want to include it or not.
> By creating a new project 'channels' on the build server, it would be
> possible for build server users to maintain the channel rpm.
I'm afraid that's not feasible.
We're getting into the very annoying potential legal issues of Novell
referencing (even indirectly) 3rd party repositories like mine or
Packman that include packages that.. well... you know: mad, lame,
mplayer, etc... ;)
So it
Re: [opensuse] SuSE-watcher/ksmarttray
Op zaterdag 3 juni 2006 15:45, schreef Pascal Bleser: > > The idea behind this is to be able to add a channel using the command: > > smart --install channel- > > It's even easier to provide .channel files somewhere (like the .repo > files in the Build Service), and just do > > smart channel --add http:///guru.channel > smart channel --add http:///packman.channel Not sure whether this is easier from a user perspective. In your case the user needs to remember the url pointing to the channel repository. In my proposal it is not needed to remember this. One could for example use smart's functionality to find the channel rpm. Once the correct rpm (providing the desired channel), just execute 'smart install channel-'. Or the more lazy type of user could execute 'smart install '**.' and have the channel installed that way. The only requirement is to have all channel rpms in a common place. Just like the rpmkey rpms that I maintain at the moment. Your proposal just a *.channel repository is easier from a packager perspective, as there is not rpm needed. The advantage of having the channel files in an rpm, is that those gets updated automatically when the corresponding channel file gets updated. This is the same for the rpmkey rpms. The best place to host those channel rpms are of course suse itself as they get than mirrored automatically. But as you already stated that might not be possible due to law implications. I think that the buildserver could build/create a channel rpm for each project and have those stored in a central place. This would be a good start. -- Richard Bos Without a home the journey is endless - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [opensuse] SuSE-watcher/ksmarttray
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Richard Bos wrote: > Op zaterdag 3 juni 2006 15:45, schreef Pascal Bleser: >>> The idea behind this is to be able to add a channel using the command: >>> smart --install channel- >> It's even easier to provide .channel files somewhere (like the .repo >> files in the Build Service), and just do >> >> smart channel --add http:///guru.channel >> smart channel --add http:///packman.channel > > Not sure whether this is easier from a user perspective. In your case the > user needs to remember the url pointing to the channel repository. In my > proposal it is not needed to remember this. One could for example use > smart's functionality to find the channel rpm. Once the correct rpm > (providing the desired channel), just execute 'smart install channel-'. > > Or the more lazy type of user could execute 'smart install '**.' and > have the channel installed that way. The only requirement is to have all > channel rpms in a common place. Just like the rpmkey rpms that I maintain at > the moment. That's correct, good point. I'd rather name them smart-channel-* though ;) > Your proposal just a *.channel repository is easier from a packager > perspective, as there is not rpm needed. > The advantage of having the channel files in an rpm, is that those gets > updated automatically when the corresponding channel file gets updated. This > is the same for the rpmkey rpms. Yep, you're right. > The best place to host those channel rpms are of course suse itself as they > get than mirrored automatically. But as you already stated that might not be > possible due to law implications. s/might/will/ I started a thread/discussion with the SUSE folks about that when openSUSE started. I was asking them whether it would be possible to do some refinements in YaST2, to have it fetch a list of repositories from, say, opensuse.org and propose them to the end-user as additional repos. It became pretty clear that it wouldn't be possible, because of ridiculous court rulings in the US and Germany (e.g. the Heise case), where "linking" to a resource that provides a package that under certain circumstances and/or jurisdictions would be.. well.. "attackable" in court, is already sufficient for potential trouble. The issue was a task to.. mm.. I think it was Adrian, to take it to Novell's legal dept, but there was never any feedback on it (and it was in November 2005). Dunno if anything came back about that.. Adrian ? > I think that the buildserver could build/create a channel rpm for each > project > and have those stored in a central place. This would be a good start. It won't be in a central place, unfortunately. It could be done for repositories that don't contain stuff like mad or lame (which discards my repository and Packman, at the very least), like latest mozilla.org packages, latest wine packages by Marcus, latest OpenOffice.org packages, etc... But the other ones must be hosted elsewhere. Note that this structure would make it possible to host the/my smart RPMs in the openSUSE Build Service. I was very reluctant to the idea, and I'm still pretty sure it is going to make things more difficult for end-users but well... dunno... I'll think about it ;) The point is that to install e.g. smart-channel-packman, you'll have to add the Packman repository in the first place, because it won't be hosted in the Build Service... chicken vs egg. cheers - -- -o) Pascal Bleser http://linux01.gwdg.de/~pbleser/ /\\ <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> _\_v The more things change, the more they stay insane. -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.2 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFEgg6Nr3NMWliFcXcRAoIOAJ4yZ9WwZeETZ7PI3fHXxeIyf6NwawCdHHXE eGOJ5MWTdQloP47EMOYOpiQ= =n6iJ -END PGP SIGNATURE- - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [opensuse] SuSE-watcher/ksmarttray
Am Sunday 04 June 2006 00:34 schrieb Pascal Bleser: > Richard Bos wrote: > > Op zaterdag 3 juni 2006 15:45, schreef Pascal Bleser: > >>> The idea behind this is to be able to add a channel using the command: > >>> smart --install channel- > >> > >> It's even easier to provide .channel files somewhere (like the .repo > >> files in the Build Service), and just do > >> > >> smart channel --add http:///guru.channel > >> smart channel --add http:///packman.channel > > > > Not sure whether this is easier from a user perspective. In your case > > the user needs to remember the url pointing to the channel repository. > > In my proposal it is not needed to remember this. One could for example > > use smart's functionality to find the channel rpm. Once the correct rpm > > (providing the desired channel), just execute 'smart install > > channel-'. Or the more lazy type of user could execute 'smart > > install '**.' and have the channel installed that way. The only > > requirement is to have all channel rpms in a common place. Just like the > > rpmkey rpms that I maintain at the moment. > > That's correct, good point. > I'd rather name them smart-channel-* though ;) > > > Your proposal just a *.channel repository is easier from a packager > > perspective, as there is not rpm needed. > > The advantage of having the channel files in an rpm, is that those gets > > updated automatically when the corresponding channel file gets updated. > > This is the same for the rpmkey rpms. > > Yep, you're right. > > > The best place to host those channel rpms are of course suse itself as > > they get than mirrored automatically. But as you already stated that > > might not be possible due to law implications. > > s/might/will/ > > I started a thread/discussion with the SUSE folks about that when > openSUSE started. I was asking them whether it would be possible to do > some refinements in YaST2, to have it fetch a list of repositories from, > say, opensuse.org and propose them to the end-user as additional repos. > > It became pretty clear that it wouldn't be possible, because of > ridiculous court rulings in the US and Germany (e.g. the Heise case), > where "linking" to a resource that provides a package that under certain > circumstances and/or jurisdictions would be.. well.. "attackable" in > court, is already sufficient for potential trouble. > > The issue was a task to.. mm.. I think it was Adrian, to take it to > Novell's legal dept, but there was never any feedback on it (and it was > in November 2005). > Dunno if anything came back about that.. Adrian ? The problem is that this decisions needs to be made for each software seperatly. For example it is very unlikely that this would be ever possible with DeCSS, but there are maybe chances for other stuff like mp3 playback. This will of course take much resources for each package at the legal department :/ bye adrian -- Adrian Schroeter SUSE Linux Products GmbH, Maxfeldstr. 5, 90409 Nuernberg, Germany email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [opensuse] SuSE-watcher/ksmarttray
Op zondag 4 juni 2006 00:34, schreef Pascal Bleser: > > I think that the buildserver could build/create a channel rpm for each > > project and have those stored in a central place. This would be a good > > start. > > It won't be in a central place, unfortunately. In my phrase above, I referred to the projects that are build on the buildserver. I mean if the packages are allowed to be build on the buildserver, they are allowed to be distributed by by opensuse. Or are these 2 different animals? If all sofrtware build on the buildserver is allowed to be distributed by novell/opensuse, than it is also possible to create smart channel files/rpms for each of the projects hosted on the buildserver. Once an rpm is created it can be stored/movedto a common directory on the buildserver. > It could be done for repositories that don't contain stuff like mad or > lame (which discards my repository and Packman, at the very least), like > latest mozilla.org packages, latest wine packages by Marcus, latest > OpenOffice.org packages, etc... > > But the other ones must be hosted elsewhere. See above. It's about the software provided via the buildserver. At the end it may result in 2 'smart-channel' repositories. One at the buildserver and another 1 hosted somewhere else, providing smart-channel rpms that are not possible to host on the buildserver. > Note that this structure would make it possible to host the/my smart > RPMs in the openSUSE Build Service. > I was very reluctant to the idea, and I'm still pretty sure it is going > to make things more difficult for end-users but well... dunno... I'll > think about it ;) > > The point is that to install e.g. smart-channel-packman, you'll have to > add the Packman repository in the first place, because it won't be > hosted in the Build Service... chicken vs egg. No, it will be different. Assume that there are 2 smart-channel directories (buildserver, and e.g. at packman). You should include those 2 channels by default in your smart rpm. The only thing the user now has to do to add packman is: smart install smart-channel-packman and packman is added :) In the same swing, one can execute: smart install smart-channel-bs-home:rbos (bs = buildserver) ps: is this discussion okay to be held here (opensuse = community) or should it be moved to somewhere else? -- Richard Bos Without a home the journey is endless - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [opensuse] SuSE-watcher/ksmarttray
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Adrian Schröter wrote: > Am Sunday 04 June 2006 00:34 schrieb Pascal Bleser: >> Richard Bos wrote: ... >>> The best place to host those channel rpms are of course suse itself as >>> they get than mirrored automatically. But as you already stated that >>> might not be possible due to law implications. >> s/might/will/ >> >> I started a thread/discussion with the SUSE folks about that when >> openSUSE started. I was asking them whether it would be possible to do >> some refinements in YaST2, to have it fetch a list of repositories from, >> say, opensuse.org and propose them to the end-user as additional repos. >> >> It became pretty clear that it wouldn't be possible, because of >> ridiculous court rulings in the US and Germany (e.g. the Heise case), >> where "linking" to a resource that provides a package that under certain >> circumstances and/or jurisdictions would be.. well.. "attackable" in >> court, is already sufficient for potential trouble. >> >> The issue was a task to.. mm.. I think it was Adrian, to take it to >> Novell's legal dept, but there was never any feedback on it (and it was >> in November 2005). >> Dunno if anything came back about that.. Adrian ? > > The problem is that this decisions needs to be made for each software > seperatly. For example it is very unlikely that this would be ever possible > with DeCSS, but there are maybe chances for other stuff like mp3 playback. > This will of course take much resources for each package at the legal > department :/ OK, now I get it, I thought it was some blessing of linking to repositories that provide packages that ... Note, I'm not talking about building and hosting packages like mad in the Build Service, that's another topic. cheers - -- -o) Pascal Bleser http://linux01.gwdg.de/~pbleser/ /\\ <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> _\_v The more things change, the more they stay insane. -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.2 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFEgrvTr3NMWliFcXcRAt6RAJ9D4OIo6wlZvW0i/2dalPanLIiRsACghrRB 4+vYtnShfR5o3U9rvzzCtjU= =WFob -END PGP SIGNATURE- - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [opensuse] SuSE-watcher/ksmarttray
On Sun, Jun 04, 2006 at 12:54:11PM +0200, Pascal Bleser wrote: > Note, I'm not talking about building and hosting packages like mad in > the Build Service, that's another topic. ... and another list houghi -- This openSUSE mailinglist is about the community. All discussion about the community is welcome.If you have a techical question just subscribe via this email address: [EMAIL PROTECTED], post your original email again there, and you will get a straight answer. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [opensuse] SuSE-watcher/ksmarttray
Am Sunday 04 June 2006 12:54 schrieb Pascal Bleser: > Adrian Schröter wrote: > > Am Sunday 04 June 2006 00:34 schrieb Pascal Bleser: > >> Richard Bos wrote: > > ... > > >>> The best place to host those channel rpms are of course suse itself as > >>> they get than mirrored automatically. But as you already stated that > >>> might not be possible due to law implications. > >> > >> s/might/will/ > >> > >> I started a thread/discussion with the SUSE folks about that when > >> openSUSE started. I was asking them whether it would be possible to do > >> some refinements in YaST2, to have it fetch a list of repositories from, > >> say, opensuse.org and propose them to the end-user as additional repos. > >> > >> It became pretty clear that it wouldn't be possible, because of > >> ridiculous court rulings in the US and Germany (e.g. the Heise case), > >> where "linking" to a resource that provides a package that under certain > >> circumstances and/or jurisdictions would be.. well.. "attackable" in > >> court, is already sufficient for potential trouble. > >> > >> The issue was a task to.. mm.. I think it was Adrian, to take it to > >> Novell's legal dept, but there was never any feedback on it (and it was > >> in November 2005). > >> Dunno if anything came back about that.. Adrian ? > > > > The problem is that this decisions needs to be made for each software > > seperatly. For example it is very unlikely that this would be ever > > possible with DeCSS, but there are maybe chances for other stuff like mp3 > > playback. This will of course take much resources for each package at the > > legal department :/ > > OK, now I get it, I thought it was some blessing of linking to > repositories that provide packages that ... > > Note, I'm not talking about building and hosting packages like mad in > the Build Service, that's another topic. Yes, I understood that, but there seems no to be much difference between linking and building it legal wise. -- Adrian Schroeter SUSE Linux Products GmbH, Maxfeldstr. 5, 90409 Nuernberg, Germany email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [opensuse] SuSE-watcher/ksmarttray
* Pascal Bleser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [Jun 04. 2006 00:35]: > > I started a thread/discussion with the SUSE folks about that when > openSUSE started. I was asking them whether it would be possible to do > some refinements in YaST2, to have it fetch a list of repositories from, > say, opensuse.org and propose them to the end-user as additional repos. Actually, we were working on this functionality for 10.1 but didn't have time to finish it. The current .repo/.channel thread gives us quite good input for an actual implementation for 10.2 > > It became pretty clear that it wouldn't be possible, because of > ridiculous court rulings in the US and Germany (e.g. the Heise case), > where "linking" to a resource that provides a package that under certain > circumstances and/or jurisdictions would be.. well.. "attackable" in > court, is already sufficient for potential trouble. So you won't see SuSE/Novell offering such external links. However, we will support a standard way of repository linking in the future. Klaus - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [opensuse] SuSE-watcher/ksmarttray
On Tue, Jun 06, 2006 at 01:38:51PM +0200, Klaus Kaempf wrote: > So you won't see SuSE/Novell offering such external links. However, > we will support a standard way of repository linking in the future. Here I am telling everybody it is SUSE not SuSE and then I see people from SUSE writing SuSE instead of SUSE. :-( houghi -- This openSUSE mailinglist is about the community. All discussion about the community is welcome.If you have a techical question just subscribe via this email address: [EMAIL PROTECTED], post your original email again there, and you will get a straight answer. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [opensuse] SuSE-watcher/ksmarttray
Hi, On Tue, 6 Jun 2006, houghi wrote: On Tue, Jun 06, 2006 at 01:38:51PM +0200, Klaus Kaempf wrote: So you won't see SuSE/Novell offering such external links. However, we will support a standard way of repository linking in the future. Here I am telling everybody it is SUSE not SuSE and then I see people from SUSE writing SuSE instead of SUSE. :-( I can't see any difference. ;-)) Cheers -e -- Eberhard Moenkeberg ([EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED]) - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [opensuse] SuSE-watcher/ksmarttray
On Jun 06, 06 20:16:55 +0200, houghi wrote: > On Tue, Jun 06, 2006 at 01:38:51PM +0200, Klaus Kaempf wrote: > > So you won't see SuSE/Novell offering such external links. However, > > we will support a standard way of repository linking in the future. > > Here I am telling everybody it is SUSE not SuSE and then I see people from > SUSE writing SuSE instead of SUSE. :-( Within SUSE, there is a secret brotherhood of traditionalists called SuSE. :-) please have mercy, Jw. -- o \ Juergen Weigert paint it green! __/ _===.===_ | [EMAIL PROTECTED] wide open suse_/_---|\/ \ | 0911 74053-508 (tm)__/ (//\ (/) | __/ _/ \_ vim:set sw=2 wm=8 - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [opensuse] SuSE-watcher/ksmarttray
On 2006-06-06 20:16:55 +0200, houghi wrote: > Here I am telling everybody it is SUSE not SuSE and then I see people from > SUSE writing SuSE instead of SUSE. :-( > you are so wrong: it is S.u.S.E. scnr darix -- openSUSE - SUSE Linux is my linux openSUSE is good for you www.opensuse.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [opensuse] SuSE-watcher/ksmarttray
Juergen Weigert wrote: On Jun 06, 06 20:16:55 +0200, houghi wrote: On Tue, Jun 06, 2006 at 01:38:51PM +0200, Klaus Kaempf wrote: So you won't see SuSE/Novell offering such external links. However, we will support a standard way of repository linking in the future. Here I am telling everybody it is SUSE not SuSE and then I see people from SUSE writing SuSE instead of SUSE. :-( Within SUSE, there is a secret brotherhood of traditionalists called SuSE. :-) please have mercy, Jw. specially working on SuSEConfig and SuSEFirewall2 :-) jdd -- http://www.dodin.net http://dodin.org/galerie_photo_web/expo/index.html http://lucien.dodin.net http://fr.susewiki.org/index.php?title=Gérer_ses_photos - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [opensuse] SuSE-watcher/ksmarttray
On Tue, Jun 06, 2006 at 08:16:55PM +0200, houghi wrote: > On Tue, Jun 06, 2006 at 01:38:51PM +0200, Klaus Kaempf wrote: > > So you won't see SuSE/Novell offering such external links. However, > > we will support a standard way of repository linking in the future. > > Here I am telling everybody it is SUSE not SuSE and then I see people from > SUSE writing SuSE instead of SUSE. :-( In the end, we do not care anymore. Everyone knows what is meant. Ciao, Marcus - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[opensuse] SuSE-watcher/ksmarttray (was: Package management tool confusion)
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Michael Schueller wrote:
> Am Freitag, 2. Juni 2006 21:52 schrieb Marcus Meissner:
>>> On a side note: do you know if there are plans to develop a KDE
>>> native updater applet?
>> Yes. We even have found a student who wants to do it ;)
>>
>> http://code.google.com/soc/suse/about.html
>>
>> Btw, the previous YOU watcher just run a commandline program
>> ("online_update")... It could be ported to just call "rug"... ;)
>
> How about patching the old SuSE-Watcher to just call smart ..
> That would be nice ;-)
That's what ksmarttray already does ;)
It's shipped as part of smart, in contrib/, and I package it as
"smart-ksmarttray".
It's very simple though, it just calls "smart update" on a regular basis
(interval is hardcoded in the sources), checks the output and reports
it. So it's a lot like SuSE-watcher.
If someone with some KDE hacking skills would like to spend a little
time on it, I think it's pretty easy to expand (it already does the
dirty job of interfacing with smart)... or even use SuSE-watcher and
copy/paste the ksmarttray code "smart update" output checking code into it.
At least it would be nice to do a simple config dialog for the update
interval (passing it from the command-line would be the easiest hack,
but probably not the most noob-friendly).
Note that as smart is written in Python, a neat solution would be to
code such a systray app (or kicker applet) in Python/QT or Python/KDE,
to directly use the smart API instead of forking "smart update" and
checking the output (although it works).
But then again, Python/QT/KDE has very, very few documentation :\
cheers
- --
-o) Pascal Bleser http://linux01.gwdg.de/~pbleser/
/\\ <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
_\_v The more things change, the more they stay insane.
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Re: [opensuse] SuSE-watcher/ksmarttray (was: Package management tool confusion)
Lørdag 03 juni 2006 01:31 skrev Pascal Bleser: > If someone with some KDE hacking skills would like to spend a little > time on it, I think it's pretty easy to expand (it already does the > dirty job of interfacing with smart)... or even use SuSE-watcher and > copy/paste the ksmarttray code "smart update" output checking code into it. > > At least it would be nice to do a simple config dialog for the update > interval (passing it from the command-line would be the easiest hack, > but probably not the most noob-friendly). > > Note that as smart is written in Python, a neat solution would be to > code such a systray app (or kicker applet) in Python/QT or Python/KDE, > to directly use the smart API instead of forking "smart update" and > checking the output (although it works). > But then again, Python/QT/KDE has very, very few documentation :\ Would be nice if you could tell ksmarttray to update certain channels (most notably ~/suse/update/10.1 of course) when checking for updates. I actually thought it did something like that - but after updating some channels manually I discovered a bunch of updates available ksmarttray hadn't told me about. Still pretty new Smart-user. Of course making an entire kde/qt port of the smart-gui would be very much appreciated also :) Martin / cb400f - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [opensuse] SuSE-watcher/ksmarttray (was: Package management tool confusion)
Am Samstag, 3. Juni 2006 01:31 schrieb Pascal Bleser:
> Michael Schueller wrote:
> > Am Freitag, 2. Juni 2006 21:52 schrieb Marcus Meissner:
> >>> On a side note: do you know if there are plans to develop a
> >>> KDE native updater applet?
> >>
> >> Yes. We even have found a student who wants to do it ;)
> >>
> >> http://code.google.com/soc/suse/about.html
> >>
> >> Btw, the previous YOU watcher just run a commandline program
> >> ("online_update")... It could be ported to just call "rug"...
> >> ;)
> >
> > How about patching the old SuSE-Watcher to just call smart ..
> > That would be nice ;-)
>
> That's what ksmarttray already does ;)
>
> It's shipped as part of smart, in contrib/, and I package it as
> "smart-ksmarttray".
>
> It's very simple though, it just calls "smart update" on a
> regular basis (interval is hardcoded in the sources), checks the
> output and reports it. So it's a lot like SuSE-watcher.
Hello Pascal,
yes, ksmarttray is a lot like the suse-watcher, but what i actually
wanted to say was, that there was, and is, a tool which has the
flexibility in handling different kinds of sources. Which is well
tested and accepted by the users.
So, whatever zmd wanted to make better, or will do better in futur,
this tool is simply not coming out of the comunity.
It is against the meaning of opensource, and in this way i can not
understand that NOVELL on on hand yells out OpenSource, and on the
other hand fiddles somthing together behind close doors.
It will never be accepted, and it will never be this well dokomented
then smart.
And this is a really bad Point.
At least in germany it´s like that.
When you buy somthing, even when it´s software, and it is not well
dokumented, you can give it back, because it not useable.
So, whatever the good thougts where, they should have never go this
way. They should have taken something out of the comunity where
they can say "we know that it´s working, and here you will find
documentation about".
Thats my point of this
Thanks Pascal for keeping us up2date with smart (and others)
Greets
Michael
> cheers
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Re: [opensuse] SuSE-watcher/ksmarttray (was: Package management tool confusion)
Am Samstag, 3. Juni 2006 01:31 schrieb Pascal Bleser: > It's very simple though, it just calls "smart update" on a > regular basis (interval is hardcoded in the sources), checks the > output and reports it. So it's a lot like SuSE-watcher. > > If someone with some KDE hacking skills would like to spend a > little time on it, I think it's pretty easy to expand (it already > does the dirty job of interfacing with smart)... or even use > SuSE-watcher and copy/paste the ksmarttray code "smart update" > output checking code into it. Pascal if anybody would patch the suse-watcher to check about new updates with the smart engine, it would check the smart sources (channels=sources > jpp) for updates. If you then press the Button "Update now", the SuSE(Yast) Online Update would appear, which has mostly different sources. So it would only make sence when the hacked suse-watcher only checks the suse update repo, and for all other sources you can use ksmarttray... Michael - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
