Re: [opensuse-factory] Re: [softwaremgmt] when to refresh?
On Fri July 20 2007 09:04, Klaus Kaempf wrote: > * Duncan Mac-Vicar P. <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [Jul 20. 2007 16:36]: > > On Friday 20 July 2007 01:57:13 pm Klaus Kaempf wrote: > > > For 'zypper sa http://foo bar', why do user NOT want an immediate > > > metadata download ? > > > > > > Lets see > > > - the system is currently offline > > > - the user is adding lots of repos in a batch > > > - the user just wants to prep the system without using the repo > > > immediately What else ? > > > > > > Imho, adding a repo (via zypper or yast) should at least check > > > for reachability of the repo and give immediate feedback. (one > > > might have mistyped the url, access an incompatible architecture, > > > etc.) > > > > Checking for reachability needs network access, which is you did > > not want above. > > What do you propose for error checking and reporting ? All repos from http://en.opensuse.org/Package_Repositories could be offered in a pull down menu for addition offline without risk of typos and without need for error checking. Only new repos need checking and the error message could be: Error: Could not connect to repository. Add anyway? -- Carlos FL Who is General Failure, and why is he reading my disk? - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [opensuse-factory] Re: [softwaremgmt] when to refresh?
* Duncan Mac-Vicar P. <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [Jul 20. 2007 16:36]: > On Friday 20 July 2007 01:57:13 pm Klaus Kaempf wrote: > > For 'zypper sa http://foo bar', why do user NOT want an immediate metadata > > download ? > > > > Lets see > > - the system is currently offline > > - the user is adding lots of repos in a batch > > - the user just wants to prep the system without using the repo immediately > > What else ? > > > > Imho, adding a repo (via zypper or yast) should at least check for > > reachability of the repo and give immediate feedback. (one might have > > mistyped the url, access an incompatible architecture, etc.) > > Checking for reachability needs network access, which is you did not want > above. What do you propose for error checking and reporting ? Klaus - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [opensuse-factory] Re: [softwaremgmt] when to refresh?
On Friday 20 July 2007 01:57:13 pm Klaus Kaempf wrote: > For 'zypper sa http://foo bar', why do user NOT want an immediate metadata > download ? > > Lets see > - the system is currently offline > - the user is adding lots of repos in a batch > - the user just wants to prep the system without using the repo immediately > What else ? > > Imho, adding a repo (via zypper or yast) should at least check for > reachability of the repo and give immediate feedback. (one might have > mistyped the url, access an incompatible architecture, etc.) Checking for reachability needs network access, which is you did not want above. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [opensuse-factory] Re: [softwaremgmt] when to refresh?
Dňa Pi 20. Júl 2007 14:05 Klaus Kaempf napísal: > * Ladislav Slezak <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [Jul 20. 2007 13:47]: > > My proposal for the Yast workflow is here: > > > > When adding a new repository in inst_sources: > > > > - Add a new option to the Media Type dialog (the first dialog displayed > > after pressing [Add]) - a check box with label "Download and parse > > metadata now", turned on by default. > > I agree to the concept but not to the wording, only experienced users will > know what "download and parse metadata" means. > > > After entering URL and pressing [Next]: > > > > - Scan available products in the URL (there is usually just one product, > > but there might be more products) > > Huh ? Are there products encoded in the URL ? ;-) > > > - For each found product: > > - probe repository type > > - download and display the message (if present) > > - download and display the license (if present), > > if it's not accepted remove the product > > This would include checking of repo accessability - but requires network > access. > > > - Display the new repositories in the table > > > > (Note that some files will be downloaded even if the metadata download is > > turned off.) > > Which is fine, if users are told "Checking repository ..." > > > After pressing [Finish]: > > > > - save repositories to /etc/zypp/repos.d, if the repository has just been > > created then download and parse metadata (if it hasn't been turned off) > > (download should be postponed to the end, see bug #208461) > > > > > > When starting the package manager: > > > > - refresh and parse all missing metadata (and also refresh the > > repositories which have autorefresh flag set) > > Didn't we want to get rid of refresh/parse when starting package manager ? I believe 'missing' is important word here. Stano - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[opensuse-factory] Re: [softwaremgmt] when to refresh?
* Ladislav Slezak <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [Jul 20. 2007 13:47]: > > My proposal for the Yast workflow is here: > > When adding a new repository in inst_sources: > > - Add a new option to the Media Type dialog (the first dialog displayed after > pressing [Add]) - a check box with label "Download and parse metadata now", > turned on by default. I agree to the concept but not to the wording, only experienced users will know what "download and parse metadata" means. > > After entering URL and pressing [Next]: > > - Scan available products in the URL (there is usually just one product, > but there might be more products) Huh ? Are there products encoded in the URL ? ;-) > > - For each found product: > - probe repository type > - download and display the message (if present) > - download and display the license (if present), > if it's not accepted remove the product This would include checking of repo accessability - but requires network access. > > - Display the new repositories in the table > > (Note that some files will be downloaded even if the metadata download is > turned > off.) Which is fine, if users are told "Checking repository ..." > > > After pressing [Finish]: > > - save repositories to /etc/zypp/repos.d, if the repository has just been > created then download and parse metadata (if it hasn't been turned off) > (download should be postponed to the end, see bug #208461) > > > When starting the package manager: > > - refresh and parse all missing metadata (and also refresh the repositories > which have autorefresh flag set) Didn't we want to get rid of refresh/parse when starting package manager ? > - start the package manager > Klaus - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[opensuse-factory] Re: [softwaremgmt] when to refresh?
* Martin Schlander <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [Jul 19. 2007 18:58]: > Den Thursday 19 July 2007 17:51:39 skrev Duncan Mac-Vicar Prett: > > zypper sa http://foo bar > > Maybe zypper should ask already at this point: "Repository added succesfully. > Do you wish to download metadata (xx MB) now ? y/n?" Being asked every time might annoy people. I'd like to see this configurable. > > > zypper search moo > > zypper install cuack > > > for the search, you need cache, for the cache you need metadata. Should > > ZYpper exit and tell the user to refresh, or should it ask the user whether > > to refresh without exiting? > > Better to ask. Same as above. > > > In the case of YaST, should it download and refresh when adding the repos > > in inst_source, or should it do it during startup of the package selector? > > Could we have it ask "Download repository metadata now?" after adding repo in > yast? Perhaps even with an estimated size of the download. YaST is different from command line zypper and I agree that asking is right here. > > If people select no, then it must do it on startup later. The consequences of selecting 'no' should be made clear. (And maybe a 'Dont ask anymore' checkbox, configurable via menu) > > Personally I think it's more "natural" and intuitive that the metadata is > downloaded when the repo is added. But of course most other package managers > separate metadata download and repo adding completely. What concerns me most is error handling. Having mistyped a URL is pretty annoying when the tools dont report this immediately. > > However to me the important thing is not so much when it's done, but mostly > that the user gets clear information about what's happening when it's done. Good point ! Klaus - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[opensuse-factory] Re: [softwaremgmt] when to refresh?
* Duncan Mac-Vicar Prett <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [Jul 19. 2007 17:51]: > > Hi guys. > > If you read already the news on package management, there are some open > issues > we would like to have feedback from you. > > As you may know, now all operations on repositories are splitted, so you can > add a repository without downloading metadata. But at some point to operate > on them you need valid metadata and a binary cache. > > An example: > > zypper sa http://foo bar > zypper search moo > zypper install cuack > > for the search, you need cache, for the cache you need metadata. Should > ZYpper > exit and tell the user to refresh, or should it ask the user whether to > refresh without exiting? > > In the case of YaST, should it download and refresh when adding the repos in > inst_source, or should it do it during startup of the package selector? I'd also like to ask for the motivation behind immediate vs. delayed refresh. For 'zypper sa http://foo bar', why do user NOT want an immediate metadata download ? Lets see - the system is currently offline - the user is adding lots of repos in a batch - the user just wants to prep the system without using the repo immediately What else ? Imho, adding a repo (via zypper or yast) should at least check for reachability of the repo and give immediate feedback. (one might have mistyped the url, access an incompatible architecture, etc.) "zypper search moo" must have the metadata available. So if the data is not cached on the system, refresh must be done. "zypper install cuack", same as "zypper search" imho. Klaus - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[opensuse-factory] Re: [softwaremgmt] when to refresh?
Martin Schlander napsal(a): > Den Thursday 19 July 2007 17:51:39 skrev Duncan Mac-Vicar Prett: [...] >> In the case of YaST, should it download and refresh when adding the repos >> in inst_source, or should it do it during startup of the package selector? > > Could we have it ask "Download repository metadata now?" after adding repo in > yast? Perhaps even with an estimated size of the download. My proposal for the Yast workflow is here: When adding a new repository in inst_sources: - Add a new option to the Media Type dialog (the first dialog displayed after pressing [Add]) - a check box with label "Download and parse metadata now", turned on by default. After entering URL and pressing [Next]: - Scan available products in the URL (there is usually just one product, but there might be more products) - For each found product: - probe repository type - download and display the message (if present) - download and display the license (if present), if it's not accepted remove the product - Display the new repositories in the table (Note that some files will be downloaded even if the metadata download is turned off.) After pressing [Finish]: - save repositories to /etc/zypp/repos.d, if the repository has just been created then download and parse metadata (if it hasn't been turned off) (download should be postponed to the end, see bug #208461) When starting the package manager: - refresh and parse all missing metadata (and also refresh the repositories which have autorefresh flag set) - start the package manager Any suggestions or improvements? Have a nice day! Ladislav -- Best Regards Ladislav Slezák Yast Developer SUSE LINUX, s.r.o. e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Lihovarská 1060/12 tel: +420 284 028 960 190 00 Prague 9 fax: +420 284 028 951 Czech Republic http://www.suse.cz/ - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[opensuse-factory] Re: [softwaremgmt] when to refresh?
Den Thursday 19 July 2007 17:51:39 skrev Duncan Mac-Vicar Prett: > zypper sa http://foo bar Maybe zypper should ask already at this point: "Repository added succesfully. Do you wish to download metadata (xx MB) now ? y/n?" > zypper search moo > zypper install cuack > for the search, you need cache, for the cache you need metadata. Should > ZYpper exit and tell the user to refresh, or should it ask the user whether > to refresh without exiting? Better to ask. > In the case of YaST, should it download and refresh when adding the repos > in inst_source, or should it do it during startup of the package selector? Could we have it ask "Download repository metadata now?" after adding repo in yast? Perhaps even with an estimated size of the download. If people select no, then it must do it on startup later. Personally I think it's more "natural" and intuitive that the metadata is downloaded when the repo is added. But of course most other package managers separate metadata download and repo adding completely. However to me the important thing is not so much when it's done, but mostly that the user gets clear information about what's happening when it's done. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
