Re: [Openvpn-devel] [DISCUSS] OpenVPN public repositories at github.com

[Alon Bar-Lev]

2012/3/30 Samuli Seppänen :
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> 2012/3/30 Samuli Seppänen :
> [*] As in "We will have the community services on our own servers. 
> Period."
>> BTW: If you like self-hosting, we're experimenting with Gerrit for
>> code review (also provides Git repo hosting as a by-product) and it's
>> looking quite promising. Would formalise the ACK / NACK workflow and
>> allow build bots to verify a patch / patch-set before merging.
>>
> In fact, "Setup Gerrit" is on my TODO. The plan was to set it up after
> the final 2.3 release. We'll see how all this turns out in the end.

Well, I must say it does not work well in OpenSC.
I guess I mean you should wait before jumping into this.
This did not made code review easier, on the contrary much more complex.

github interface is simple and productive... I think we should try
this one in addition to the mailing list first.

Alon.

Re: [Openvpn-devel] [DISCUSS] OpenVPN public repositories at github.com

[Samuli Seppänen]

> Hi,
>
> 2012/3/30 Samuli Seppänen :
 [*] As in "We will have the community services on our own servers. Period."
> BTW: If you like self-hosting, we're experimenting with Gerrit for
> code review (also provides Git repo hosting as a by-product) and it's
> looking quite promising. Would formalise the ACK / NACK workflow and
> allow build bots to verify a patch / patch-set before merging.
>
In fact, "Setup Gerrit" is on my TODO. The plan was to set it up after
the final 2.3 release. We'll see how all this turns out in the end.

-- 
Samuli Seppänen
Community Manager
OpenVPN Technologies, Inc

irc freenode net: mattock

Re: [Openvpn-devel] [DISCUSS] OpenVPN public repositories at github.com

[Fabian Knittel]

Hi,

2012/3/30 Samuli Seppänen :
>>> [*] As in "We will have the community services on our own servers. Period."

BTW: If you like self-hosting, we're experimenting with Gerrit for
code review (also provides Git repo hosting as a by-product) and it's
looking quite promising. Would formalise the ACK / NACK workflow and
allow build bots to verify a patch / patch-set before merging.

Cheers
Fabian

Re: [Openvpn-devel] [DISCUSS] OpenVPN public repositories at github.com

[Samuli Seppänen]

> On 03/29/2012 12:00 AM, Samuli Seppänen wrote:
>> That said, the code itself is hosted externally on SF.net, so we have
>> the _option_ of using GitHub for that part. I'd first look at the big
>> picture of how we want to enhance our development processes and then
>> move on to the tools.
> Although I'm not an OpenVPN developer I've got a real world experience 
> with moving a project to github. For years I've had my little s3cmd 
> project (http://s3tools.org/s3cmd) hosted in SVN on SF.net and really 
> struggled to attract contributors. Once I moved to GIT and github.com 
> people pretty much immediately begun forking the code, developing 
> improvements and sending back merge requests:
> https://github.com/s3tools/s3cmd/network
> Obviously I don't merge everything they send me but the contributor base 
> truly exploded and very many improvements now come from these random 
> developers.
>
> I still keep a copy of the repository in SF.net's GIT but almost never 
> receive any emailed patches or any feedback at all on that front. All my 
> contributors use github.
>
> Just my 2 cents :)
>
Hmm, interesting. I have a couple of projects at GitHub myself, but
they're for a very limited audience, so I haven't experienced any
contributor explosions myself :).

I think the GitHub approach might help get a lot more contributions from
"random" developers. At the moment, they'd have to go through quite a
hassle to contribute:

1) Figure out where to send the patches (told in the Wiki)
2) Figure out how to subscribe to openvpn-devel
3) Figure out how git-send-email works
4) Send mail to openvpn-devel
5) Make modifications, if required
6) Unsubscribe / filter openvpn-devel mails, unless they want their
inbox to clutter with stuff

GitHub would help with 1-4 and 6. Perhaps we should experiment with
using GitHub as an _alternative_ to mailing list patches and see what
happens? The official development trees could still be hosted at SF.net.

-- 
Samuli Seppänen
Community Manager
OpenVPN Technologies, Inc

irc freenode net: mattock

Re: [Openvpn-devel] [DISCUSS] OpenVPN public repositories at github.com

[Samuli Seppänen]

>> [*] As in "We will have the community services on our own servers. Period."
> I don't understand this argument...
Did I say I do? :P
> Anyway, if you keep services like wiki on your host, please make sure
> change notification is possible, as cooperation without notification
> is invalid.
>
> Alon.

Anyways, I'll see what the new Trac can do on the notification front.
The current version already sends notifications to the IRC, and I
believe email notifications when a ticket is changed (to interested
parties). Adding notifications to Wiki pages would also help.

More on this later.

Samuli

Re: [Openvpn-devel] [DISCUSS] OpenVPN public repositories at github.com

[Michal Ludvig]

On 03/29/2012 12:00 AM, Samuli Seppänen wrote:

That said, the code itself is hosted externally on SF.net, so we have
the _option_ of using GitHub for that part. I'd first look at the big
picture of how we want to enhance our development processes and then
move on to the tools.


Although I'm not an OpenVPN developer I've got a real world experience 
with moving a project to github. For years I've had my little s3cmd 
project (http://s3tools.org/s3cmd) hosted in SVN on SF.net and really 
struggled to attract contributors. Once I moved to GIT and github.com 
people pretty much immediately begun forking the code, developing 
improvements and sending back merge requests:

https://github.com/s3tools/s3cmd/network
Obviously I don't merge everything they send me but the contributor base 
truly exploded and very many improvements now come from these random 
developers.


I still keep a copy of the repository in SF.net's GIT but almost never 
receive any emailed patches or any feedback at all on that front. All my 
contributors use github.


Just my 2 cents :)

Michal

Re: [Openvpn-devel] [DISCUSS] OpenVPN public repositories at github.com

[Alon Bar-Lev]

2012/3/28 Samuli Seppänen :
>> A basic ticketing system is also provided, not sure it is that far
>> from trac features... not a must.
>> It wiki is better than track as people can subscribe for changes,
>> hence cooperate much better than current state.
> A few years ago, when I started setting up the community services I
> discussed the option of using external, hosted services (e.g. SF.net)
> internally and our CEO strongly disagreed[*] with that approach. I don't
> think anything has changed on that front since... and there are
> advantages in the approach we have now, e.g. being able to use the same
> authentication backend for all of our random services.
>
> That said, the code itself is hosted externally on SF.net, so we have
> the _option_ of using GitHub for that part. I'd first look at the big
> picture of how we want to enhance our development processes and then
> move on to the tools. I hope to have the review of the ACK system ready
> by next Monday, maybe sooner. That'll give us some hard data which we
> can use as a basis for further discussion...

OK. I will wait. I think that sourceforge stayed behind the won't
be able to close the gap.

> [*] As in "We will have the community services on our own servers. Period."

I don't understand this argument...

Anyway, if you keep services like wiki on your host, please make sure
change notification is possible, as cooperation without notification
is invalid.

Alon.

Re: [Openvpn-devel] [DISCUSS] OpenVPN public repositories at github.com

[Samuli Seppänen]

> A basic ticketing system is also provided, not sure it is that far
> from trac features... not a must.
> It wiki is better than track as people can subscribe for changes,
> hence cooperate much better than current state.
A few years ago, when I started setting up the community services I
discussed the option of using external, hosted services (e.g. SF.net)
internally and our CEO strongly disagreed[*] with that approach. I don't
think anything has changed on that front since... and there are
advantages in the approach we have now, e.g. being able to use the same
authentication backend for all of our random services.

That said, the code itself is hosted externally on SF.net, so we have
the _option_ of using GitHub for that part. I'd first look at the big
picture of how we want to enhance our development processes and then
move on to the tools. I hope to have the review of the ACK system ready
by next Monday, maybe sooner. That'll give us some hard data which we
can use as a basis for further discussion...

[*] As in "We will have the community services on our own servers. Period."

-- 
Samuli Seppänen
Community Manager
OpenVPN Technologies, Inc

irc freenode net: mattock