date:20020524


Fantastic research, John!

- Original Message -
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, May 23, 2002 7:13 PM


 Jack,

 I conducted some tests of ANALYZE ESTIMATE vs COMPUTE for my IOUG paper
and
 arrived at the following: (cut-and-paste of relevant parts of the paper)

 --- Begin Quote ---
 MYTH:  COMPUTE IS BETTER THAN ESTIMATE
 This one generates an endless debate actually, so we will not take a firm
 stand either way. Rather, we will present some figures that throw some
light
 on the issue and allow us to step back and look at the situation. The
 problem with COMPUTE is that it has to scan the entire table, sort it and
 figure out the exact data distribution. On the other hand, ESTIMATE steps
 through samples of the data, sorts and analyzes only a portion of the
data.

 In a recent test for the effectiveness of COMPUTE versus ESTIMATE on a
 static clone of a reasonably large Oracle Apps database, the statistics
were
 generated and stored for both COMPUTE and ESTIMATE. The Database consisted
 of about 3,300 tables and 6,000 indexes and occupied approximately 120 Gb.
 The ESTIMATE percentage was defaulted to 10% and no activity other than
 ANALYZE was allowed on this clone during the entire period. Table
statistics
 including row count, average row length and blocks occupied were analyzed.
 This showed that there were some differences in row count and average row
 length on 321 of these tables. Row count differences ranged from a value
of
 53 row less in the ESTIMATE of a table containing 205,743 rows (0.025%)
all
 the way up-to a count difference of 101,704 in 13,311,090 rows (0.76%).
Even
 assuming a difference of a maximum of 5% in these scenarios, you are not
far
 off the goal. Further analysis showed that a smaller average row length
 coupled with a small table produced larger variations than was usually
seen.


 The differences however, were far more pronounced in Indexes - differences
 of upto 300% were noticed. Further analysis showed that this was related
to
 the percentage of deleted leaf rows in the index. If this percentage is
 high, the possibility of ESTIMATE going wrong was also high, as the
 deletions are not factored in correctly. This was especially true if the
 deletions occurred in leaf blocks that were probably not involved in the
 ESTIMATE. When the deleted leaf rows was low or even nil within the index,
 the percentage difference was much lower, in the range of 4 to 5%.

 The real myth killer is the cost of COMPUTE versus ESTIMATE - COMPUTE
 required 66,553,308 reads versus 38,951,158 reads for ESTIMATE - almost
70%
 more reads for COMPUTE. The sorting involved in determining the averages
and
 data distribution was a clincher - COMPUTE processed 4,263,724,259 rows in
 sorting operations while ESTIMATE sorted just 18,025,069 - i.e. about 235%
 more rows were sorted for the COMPUTE operation. The last nail in the
coffin
 was the time taken to COMPUTE statistics - about 36 hours against the time
 to ESTIMATE of just 12 hours.

 While the figures speak for themselves, we will offer some general advice
to
 the cautious: ESTIMATE on tables and COMPUTE on Indexes. Columns are
 analyzed by default, but serve no useful purpose other than showing data
 spread. Hence, you could ANALYZE only Tables and Indexed columns alone. An
 identified list of 'small' tables could also be COMPUTED rather than
 ANALYZED. This advice is given because ESTIMATE on a table comes close as
 far as row count goes, while COMPUTE on Indexes generates a more accurate
 picture of both data distribution as well as object size statistics.
Testing
 the effectiveness of COMPUTE versus ANALYZE is simple and provides you
with
 figures that you can use to decide the strategy for your situation.

 Before we move to the next topic, keep in mind that an ANALYZE/ESTIMATE
with
 a sample size greater than or equal to 50% will result in COMPUTE.

 --- End Quote ---

 The problem is that this simple mathematical model looks only at object
 sizes and did not look at Column spread and sensitivity. However, I
believe
 that the combination of ESTIMATE on Tables and COMPUTE on Indexes would
 catch most of it.

 As always, YMMV!

 John Kanagaraj
 Oracle Applications DBA
 DBSoft Inc
 (W): 408-970-7002

 The manuals for Oracle are here: http://tahiti.oracle.com
 The manual for Life is here: http://www.gospelcom.net

 ** The opinions and statements above are entirely my own and not those of
my
 employer or clients **


  -Original Message-
  From: Jack Silvey [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
  Sent: Tuesday, May 21, 2002 2:44 PM
  To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
  Subject: Statistical sampling and representative stats collection
 
 
  Hi all,
 
  Did some investigation about statistical sampling this
  weekend since we are going to optimize our analyze
  process soon, and would like some input from all you
  orabrains on this one.
 
  I opened a TAR with Oracle asking about the sampling

Re: Diagnose Slow System

2002-05-24 Thread Cherie_Machler



Tim,

I'm curious why you say that utlbstat/utlestat should be run from svrmgrl
and not sqlplus.
I've not heard/read that before.

Cherie Machler
Oracle DBA
Gelco Information Network


   
  
Tim Gorman   
  
Tim@SageLogix   To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
.comcc:   
  
Sent by: Subject: Re: Diagnose Slow System 
  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  
om 
  
   
  
   
  
05/23/02 09:38 
  
PM 
  
Please respond 
  
to ORACLE-L
  
   
  
   
  




Barb,

Can you take a BSTAT/ESTAT while the problem is occurring?  Run the
utlbstat.sql script from SVRMGRL and then 15-25 mins later run
utlestat.sql from SVRMGRL.  It's actually pretty important the
utlestat.sql be run from SVRMGRL and not SQL*Plus.  Please do this at
least once during the periods of slowness -- more than once if possible...

Then, FTP the report.txt file(s) up to your PC and then browse to the
http://www.oraperf.com site.  Use the file-selection browse button at one
of
the upload sections to find one of the report.txt files and click
upload.  The YAPP report will be produced automagically...

What the YAPP report will do is give a great top-down breakdown of where
the system has been spending the majority of what the end-user community
perceives as response time during the 15-25 mins of your BSTAT/ESTAT
sample.  In brief, the database is either working or waiting.  If you like,
you could email me the report.txt file and I'll look through the YAPP
report alongside you...

There are some papers online at www.oraperf.com/whitepapers.htm which
should
explain the YAPP methodology (written by Anjo) and also another paper about
using YAPP with STATSPACK.  The latter paper largely applies to BSTAT/ESTAT
also...

From these reports, we should be able to get a pretty good idea of what is
going on...

Thanks!

-Tim

- Original Message -
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, May 23, 2002 4:13 PM


 List:
 We've been fighting problems for several days. I've sort of overwhelmed
 myself with data, but I don't know what any of it means.

 Solaris 2.6, Oracle 8.0.5, MTS
 Users complain of extreme slowness.  No errors in alert, no trace files
 generated.
 Database is bounced every day.  I capture wait statistics each day before
 the database goes down.  The statistics from v$system_event for enqueue
 waits has gone up considerably since the problems started last Wednesday.
 But when I look at v$lock (I'm using Steve Adams' enqueue_locks.sql
 scripts), nothing pops up.

 Any ideas where I should start looking?   I would appreciate any help.
 (I really believe this is a connectivity (networking) issue, but don't
know
 how to confirm this)
 Thanks!
 Barb

 (accumulted since last night at 11:00 pm)


 EVENT   TOTAL_WAITS TOTAL_TIMEOUTS TIME_WAITED
 AVERAGE_WAIT
 --- --- -- ---
 
 latch free   814316   4064  106360
 130612686
 enqueue 147 26   12033
 81.8571429
 free buffer waits 4  0  23
 5.75
 buffer busy waits  2959  0 567
 19161879
 log file parallel write   68177  0   78788
 1.155639
 log file sync 66683  1   77517
 1.16247019
 db file sequential read 1385334  0  144617
 104391432
 db file scattered read  1113301  0  142545
 12803815


 (The info

Reducing datafile size

2002-05-24 Thread Simon Waibale


Hi all,
I've dropped a couple of tables from my DB -how do I coalesce the tablespace 
to have the associated datafile reduced in size ?

Thanking you,

___
CSW
--
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
--
Author: Simon Waibale
  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051  FAX: (858) 538-5051
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To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message
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(or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from).  You may
also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).

Re: TEST

Title: TEST



Ahhh.

I'm guessing that your employer is filtering out 
any email from these lists? How about if you set up your own free hotmail 
or yahoo account to use to participate in these lists, instead?

I apologize for the curt email earlier, but I (and 
others) had assumed (always a bad thing to do!) that you were trying to test 
some thing (a program?) using the ORACLE-L email list as a guinea pig for your 
experiments. Again, my apologies...

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  RAJESH 
  DAYAL 
  To: 'Tim Gorman' 
  Sent: Friday, May 24, 2002 12:55 AM
  Subject: RE: TEST
  
  
  Hi Tim 
  and list fellows,
   
  Thats not my purpose. I am not getting any mail from this mailing 
  list (including this one).
  I 
  dont know what to do !!! 
  Sorry for inconvenience if any 
   
  
  L,
  Rajesh
  
  -Original 
  Message-From: Tim Gorman 
  [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]Sent: Friday, May 24, 2002 5:37 
  AMTo: Rajesh 
  DayalSubject: Re: 
  TEST
  
  Rajesh,
  
  Please 
  test to some other email address? You are annoying hundreds of people 
  this way...
  
  Thanks!
  
  -Tim
  
  
  - Original 
  Message - 
  
  From: RAJESH 
  DAYAL 
  
  To: Multiple 
  recipients of list ORACLE-L 
  Sent: Thursday, May 23, 
  2002 8:53 AM
  Subject: 
  TEST
  
  TEST 
  ...

Re: Oracle Parallel Server




Thisanswer (i.e. "can't write a dynamic 
hotbackup script for raw disk") is untrue. You would just use the same 
techniques (i.e. query the data dictionary to generate a shell script) as you 
would with any other type of datafile...

Also, you do not need to "put tablespaces into 
backup mode and use 'dd'" if you are using RMAN, OPS or not.RMAN 
wasthe right idea to start with -- directing toward user-managed backups 
is a *big* step backward.

The MML (media-manager layer)choices 
varywith the platform. Each platform (i.e. HPUX, AIX, Solaris, 
Tru64, NT/2000, etc) presents different choices for MML (i.e. Omniback, ADSM, 
Veritas, Legato, etc). There are several good bulletins on MetaLink 
(search keywords like "RMAN MML", for example) as well as excellent 
documentation in the standard docset (search http://docs.oracle.com). Also, the 
Oracle Press book "Oracle Backup  Recovery 101" is excellent and the 
O'Reilly book "RMAN Pocket Reference" will be useful during 
implementation...

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Jalil 
  Zabourdine 
  To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L 
  
  Sent: Friday, May 24, 2002 5:23 AM
  Subject: Re: Oracle Parallel Server
  
  You will need to put tablespace in backup mode and use "dd" to copy 
  the appropriate raw device. Note that you can't write a dynamic hotbackup 
  script for raw disk - your script will need to be modified whenever you added 
  a datafile. 
  HTH 
  Regards, 
  -Jalil 
   [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  wrote: 
  What 
is the best way to implement a HOT BACKUP on an Oracle Parallel Server which 
is using RAW disks.Please describe the process if possible.I know it has to 
be RMAN and some MML--Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: 
http://www.orafaq.com--Author:INET: 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]Fat City Network Services -- (858) 538-5051 
FAX: (858) 538-5051San Diego, California -- Public Internet access / 
Mailing 
ListsTo 
REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail messageto: 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and inthe 
message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L(or the name of 
mailing list you want to be removed from). You mayalso send the HELP 
command for other information (like subscribing).
  
  
  Do You Yahoo!?LAUNCH - Your 
  Yahoo! Music Experience

RE: Statistical sampling and representative stats collection

2002-05-24 Thread Jamadagni, Rajendra


John,

Thanks for a very good explanation between COMPUTE and ESTIMATE. I am
changing the scripts to use DBMS_STATS instead of ANALYZE on out 9012
database, but on 8i I'll keep this in mind.

Thanks again
Raj
__
Rajendra Jamadagni  MIS, ESPN Inc.
Rajendra dot Jamadagni at ESPN dot com
Any opinion expressed here is personal and doesn't reflect that of ESPN Inc.

QOTD: Any clod can have facts, but having an opinion is an art!


***1

This e-mail message is confidential, intended only for the named recipient(s) above 
and may contain information that is privileged, attorney work product or exempt from 
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not the named recipient(s), please immediately notify ESPN at (860) 766-2000 and 
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Re: Reducing datafile size

2002-05-24 Thread Ramon E. Estevez


Simon,

You can do

   ALTER DATABASE DATAFILE 'D:\ORACLE\ORADATA\MYDATAFILE.ORA' RESIZE 500M;


Ramon


- Original Message -
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, May 24, 2002 8:33 AM


Hi all,
I've dropped a couple of tables from my DB -how do I coalesce the tablespace
to have the associated datafile reduced in size ?

Thanking you,

___
CSW
--
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
--
Author: Simon Waibale
  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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-- 
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RE: patchset 8.1.7.3 or 8.1.7.4

2002-05-24 Thread Paul Li


I do not think 8.1.7.4 for Windows 2000 is available.



-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, May 24, 2002 5:43 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Hi

Goto metalink and then goto the patches download screen.Search for this
patch number
2376472 .This will show u the patchset 8174 for all platforms

Manpreet

 Hi
 
 Are these patch sets cumulative? If I am at 8.1.7.0 can I
 just apply the 8.1.7.4 patch set or do I have to apply
 them all in order. Thanks.
 
 -Original Message-
 Travis
 Sent: May 22, 2002 2:39 PM
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
 
 

http://metalink.oracle.com/metalink/plsql/ml2_documents.showDocument?p_datab
 ase_id=NOTp_id=120607.1
 
 http://ap103aru.us.oracle.com/ARULink/PatchSearch/get_form
 
  -Original Message-
  From: Ruth Gramolini [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
  Sent: Wednesday, May 22, 2002 1:06 PM
  To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
  Subject: patchset 8.1.7.3 or 8.1.7.4
 
 
  Dear List,
 
  What is the number of the patch for 8.1.7.3 or 8.1.7.4 and where can I
  download them?   I looking on the FTP site and on Metalink
  but I couldn't
  tell which was which.
 
  Thanks,
  Ruth
 
  --
  Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
  --
  Author: Ruth Gramolini
INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 
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 --
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Re: Oracle Parallel Server

2002-05-24 Thread Jalil Zabourdine

Manpreet,
raw disk is sliced as physical disk so that you can not compress. Do not get confused between DD and RMAN because DD is an OS utility andRMAN is an oracle utility they are totally different.
Regards,
Jalil
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 
OK you can do DD ,but , can you use compression along with DD.What if you have allocated 40-50GB to the database,but in actual only 20GB is used.RMAN can do that.i am not too sure would DD be able to do it.Manpreet You will need to put tablespace in backup mode and use "dd" to copy the appropriate raw device. Note that you can't write a dynamic hotbackup script for raw disk - your script will need to be modified whenever you added a datafile. HTH Regards, -Jalil [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What is the best way to implement a HOT BACKUP on an Oracle Parallel Server which is using RAW disks.Please describe the process if possible.I know it has to be RMAN and some MML -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]  Fat City !
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Re: Diagnose Slow System


Really, it's just the utlestat.sql part -- the BSTAT/ESTAT scripts contain
formatting commands for SVRMGRL, not SQL*Plus.  Formatting really only
matters with utlestat.sql when it is generating the report.txt file...

It's perfectly OK to run SQL*Plus for utlbstat.sql and you can modify
utlestat.sql to utilize SQL*Plus formatting commands in place of the
SVRMGRL ones, but why bother?  I only use BSTAT/ESTAT these days to send to
the YAPP analyzer at www.oraperf.com anyways...  :-)

- Original Message -
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, May 24, 2002 6:53 AM



 Tim,

 I'm curious why you say that utlbstat/utlestat should be run from svrmgrl
 and not sqlplus.
 I've not heard/read that before.

 Cherie Machler
 Oracle DBA
 Gelco Information Network



 Tim Gorman
 Tim@SageLogix   To: Multiple recipients of
list ORACLE-L [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 .comcc:
 Sent by: Subject: Re: Diagnose Slow
System
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 om


 05/23/02 09:38
 PM
 Please respond
 to ORACLE-L






 Barb,

 Can you take a BSTAT/ESTAT while the problem is occurring?  Run the
 utlbstat.sql script from SVRMGRL and then 15-25 mins later run
 utlestat.sql from SVRMGRL.  It's actually pretty important the
 utlestat.sql be run from SVRMGRL and not SQL*Plus.  Please do this at
 least once during the periods of slowness -- more than once if possible...

 Then, FTP the report.txt file(s) up to your PC and then browse to the
 http://www.oraperf.com site.  Use the file-selection browse button at one
 of
 the upload sections to find one of the report.txt files and click
 upload.  The YAPP report will be produced automagically...

 What the YAPP report will do is give a great top-down breakdown of
where
 the system has been spending the majority of what the end-user community
 perceives as response time during the 15-25 mins of your BSTAT/ESTAT
 sample.  In brief, the database is either working or waiting.  If you
like,
 you could email me the report.txt file and I'll look through the YAPP
 report alongside you...

 There are some papers online at www.oraperf.com/whitepapers.htm which
 should
 explain the YAPP methodology (written by Anjo) and also another paper
about
 using YAPP with STATSPACK.  The latter paper largely applies to
BSTAT/ESTAT
 also...

 From these reports, we should be able to get a pretty good idea of what is
 going on...

 Thanks!

 -Tim

 - Original Message -
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Sent: Thursday, May 23, 2002 4:13 PM


  List:
  We've been fighting problems for several days. I've sort of overwhelmed
  myself with data, but I don't know what any of it means.
 
  Solaris 2.6, Oracle 8.0.5, MTS
  Users complain of extreme slowness.  No errors in alert, no trace files
  generated.
  Database is bounced every day.  I capture wait statistics each day
before
  the database goes down.  The statistics from v$system_event for enqueue
  waits has gone up considerably since the problems started last
Wednesday.
  But when I look at v$lock (I'm using Steve Adams' enqueue_locks.sql
  scripts), nothing pops up.
 
  Any ideas where I should start looking?   I would appreciate any help.
  (I really believe this is a connectivity (networking) issue, but don't
 know
  how to confirm this)
  Thanks!
  Barb
 
  (accumulted since last night at 11:00 pm)
 
 
  EVENT   TOTAL_WAITS TOTAL_TIMEOUTS TIME_WAITED
  AVERAGE_WAIT
  --- --- -- ---
  
  latch free   814316   4064  106360
  130612686
  enqueue 147 26   12033
  81.8571429
  free buffer waits 4  0  23
  5.75
  buffer busy waits  2959  0 567
  19161879
  log file parallel write   68177  0   78788
  1.155639
  log file sync 66683  1   77517
  1.16247019
  db file sequential read 1385334  0  144617
  104391432
  db file scattered read  1113301  0  142545
  12803815
 
 
  (The info captured below is unusual.  running this repeatedly normally
 shows
  nothing
  except smon TS resource wait)
 
 
  RESOURCE  NSID  SID HOLDING WANTINGSECONDS
   -  --- --- --
  RT-1-0   4 LGWR   X  0
  TM-1949-0   46   46  SX  0
  TM-1999-0  423  423  SX  4
  46   46  SX  0
  TM-2014-0   46   46  SX  0
  TM-2106-0   46

RE: ADMIN: Warning: Your address may have been harvested by a spa

2002-05-24 Thread Jesse, Rich


That's OK.  I get over 100 spams a week right now.  I sent them to our MS
Lookout admin who, after 200 of them, told me to just delete them.  And I
can't setup more filters in MS Lookout because it chokes on more than about
a dozen.

Maybe if I get enough spam to choke our servers someone will notice!  :)

(Erm, that's not an invite...)

Rich Jesse   System/Database Administrator
[EMAIL PROTECTED]  Quad/Tech International, Sussex, WI USA

 -Original Message-
 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
 Sent: Thursday, May 23, 2002 3:03 PM
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
 Subject: ADMIN: Warning: Your address may have been harvested by a
 spammer.
 
 
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Password Expire

2002-05-24 Thread Ramon E. Estevez




Hi list,

Scenario HP-UX Oracle Enterprise Edition 
8.1.7.1.0

I have 2 instances in the same box. I 
expire the password in both of them to change them when the user connect to the 
DB thru forms and in one instance it works and in the other 
doesn't.

The tests are performed from the same 
computer.

Inclusive, I used the same Init.ora file, copy, 
to create the other instance. Checked all the parameters and are the 
same. 

Doesn't know what else to look.

Any comments 

TIA

Ramon

Re: --- re OpenVMS/Tru64/HPUX/etc



We have far too many Oracle on Tru64 installations
to consider a quick migration out.  Apparently, Compaq
has convinced us that Tru64 will still be around
for a few years.  HPUX will be taking up the
good features of Tru64 (AdvFS and Clustering+ClusterFileSystem).
The other concern we had was about Alpha.  I believe
that there would be about two more releases of the Alpha
and then welcome Intel.
We also have SPARC Solaris databases but I'm not
sure how much time the big damagers want to spend
on considering migrating to SPARC Solaris.  Might as well
also look at IBM [although that, too, might go from PowerPC
to Itanium].

Hemant K Chitale
http://hkchital.tripod.com
- Original Message -
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, 24 May, 2002 1:43 AM


Hermat - We are on Tru64 and I couldn't be more pleased. However, I believe
that HP/Compaq has decided to eventually withdraw Tru64. My guess is that is
so they can support HPUX. However, they were pretty clear that OpenVMS would
continue. My guess is that Ron is hinting that there are other reasons to
move to VMS at his company. Just sign me as learning Solaris.
Dennis Williams
DBA
Lifetouch, Inc.
[EMAIL PROTECTED]


-Original Message-
Sent: Thursday, May 23, 2002 11:29 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L



The bane of trying to keep up with technology.
But why OpenVMS and not Tru64, then.
We have a large number of Tru64 Oracle Databases
(we do have OpenVMSs for Promis databases
used in manufacturing, I believe).

Hemant K Chitale

- Original Message -
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, 23 May, 2002 11:03 PM


Hemant,
  The price I am referring to is the cost involved with moving from a
Dell server on Novell to a Compaq OpenVMS server.  There are a lot of
company sided issues that have to be addressed and cases made for the
move. In this case the software is not an issues as you stated, the
issues revolve around the hardware and developmental considerations. I
would be more that happy to move to the latest and greatest solid
platform/database combination. It would allow us to create and implement
browser based applications rather easily and would allow us to use the
9iAS Suite of products.
 For now all I can do is make requests for item to be included in the
budget as we move forward, backwards, sideways, dance on circles.
Ron
ROR mª¿ªm

 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 05/23/02 09:38AM 

An upgrade wouldn't cost anything.  It would be free
as part of your support contract.

Hemant K Chitale

- Original Message -
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, 23 May, 2002 2:41 AM


Kevin,
 I appreciate your testing efforts. Now to convince the bean-counters
to upgrate to 9i.
Ron
ROR mª¿ªm

 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 05/22/02 02:08PM 
I reran my test. with 250,000 rows in the table. It took a whopping
0.25
seconds to complete.

-Original Message-
Sent: Wednesday, May 22, 2002 12:59 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Kevin,
 Yes but does it work with data in the column?, I do not have 9i set
up
yet. If it works as you describe with data in the column it will
really
help with the multi million row tables that they want to rename a
column  after a release of a new lotto game.
thanks,
for the test and update.
Ron
ROR mª¿ªm

 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 05/22/02 10:38AM 
Summary: it works!

SQL SELECT * FROM v$version;

BANNER

Oracle9i Enterprise Edition Release 9.2.0.1.0 - Production
PL/SQL Release 9.2.0.1.0 - Production
CORE9.2.0.1.0   Production
TNS for Solaris: Version 9.2.0.1.0 - Production
NLSRTL Version 9.2.0.1.0 - Production

SQL create table test_table (wrong_name VARCHAR2(40));

Table created.

SQL alter table test_table rename column wrong_name to right_name;

Table altered.

SQL desc test_table;
 Name  Null?Type
 - 

 RIGHT_NAME VARCHAR2(40)

SQL

Kevin Toepke
[EMAIL PROTECTED]



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Confidential
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Access to this Internet electronic mail message by anyone else is
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Re: Calling Unix Shell Var in PL/SQL

2002-05-24 Thread Connor McDonald


If you're on 8i+ you can use java to get the value.

hth
connor

 --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:  Hi ,
   I want to use a unix shell variable value in
 PL/SQL.
 Is it possible,if yes then how..give example.
 
 for e.g at unix prompt :  export inp_val=2000
 
 
 Thanks
 Manoj.
  

=
Connor McDonald
http://www.oracledba.co.uk
http://www.oaktable.net

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RE: Reducing datafile size

2002-05-24 Thread Mercadante, Thomas F


Simon,

Alter tablespace {tbs_name} coalesce;

You can use DBA Studio/Tablespace Map to see what tables/indexes have
extents where within the tablespace files, and either drop and recreate or
move them to allow you to shrink the tablespace.

Tom Mercadante
Oracle Certified Professional


-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, May 24, 2002 9:33 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Hi all,
I've dropped a couple of tables from my DB -how do I coalesce the tablespace

to have the associated datafile reduced in size ?

Thanking you,

___
CSW
-- 
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Re: Reducing datafile size

2002-05-24 Thread Connor McDonald


alter database datafile '...' resize 

you won't be able to resize past the highest used
block in the file (you can get this from dba_extents)

hth
connor

 --- Simon Waibale [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:  Hi
all,
 I've dropped a couple of tables from my DB -how do I
 coalesce the tablespace 
 to have the associated datafile reduced in size ?
 
 Thanking you,
 
 ___
 CSW
 --
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 http://www.orafaq.com
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Re: altering next extent



Is the batch job doing a TRUNCATE table ?

Hemant K Chitale

- Original Message -
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, 24 May, 2002 8:08 PM


 Hi,

 It isn't a local managed tablespace problem because I'm still
 on 7.3.4 db Besides that I'm changing the table specs as far as I know
 this overrules the tablespace specs.

 New is that I created in a new attempt the table on 256K next extent
 then run the batch again and the storage remains on 256K.

 Tia,

 Jeroen

 -Oorspronkelijk bericht-
 Van: Rahul [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
 Verzonden: vrijdag 24 mei 2002 13:18
 Aan: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
 Onderwerp: RE: altering next extent


 LMT ???

  --
  From: Jeroen van Sluisdam[SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
  Reply To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  Sent: Friday, May 24, 2002 6:03 PM
  To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
  Subject: altering next extent
 
  Hi,
 
  I have a strange phenomena. Due to sizing problems with a specific
table.
  I changed the next extent clause with
   ALTER TABLE contingenten.BOEKINGEN_ADDITIONS storage ( next 256K );
 
  Mysteriously after running the batch, it was back on 8K.
 
  Ofcourse I select before (also closing sqlplus and starting it again and
  selecting)
  and after the batch the next extent by
  SQL select next_extent from dba_tables where table_name =
  'BOEKINGEN_ADDITIONS';
 
  NEXT_EXTENT
  ---
 8192
 
  After the batch it was back on 8K. I checked the scripts and there was
no
  alter in the script.
  I turned on the audit on this table and did find only records with
  'session
  rec' in action_name
  What can cause the previous alter to be changed back?
 
  Tia,
 
  Jeroen
 
  Details: oracle 7.3.4 HP-UX 10.20
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  --
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Re: Oracle Parallel Server




The nature of symbolic links in UNIX is that they 
are aliases for files. That's all. Why should it make a 
difference?

Before you respond again, please try it out 
first...

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Jalil 
  Zabourdine 
  To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L 
  
  Sent: Friday, May 24, 2002 8:48 AM
  Subject: Re: Oracle Parallel Server
  
  ## (i.e. "can't write a dynamic hotbackup script for raw disk") is 
  untrue. 
  Ok but in the case when datafile uses symbolic link point to raw device 
  then how this could work? 
  -Jalil 
   Tim Gorman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 
  



Thisanswer (i.e. "can't write a dynamic 
hotbackup script for raw disk") is untrue. You would just use the same 
techniques (i.e. query the data dictionary to generate a shell script) as 
you would with any other type of datafile...

Also, you do not need to "put tablespaces into 
backup mode and use 'dd'" if you are using RMAN, OPS or not.RMAN 
wasthe right idea to start with -- directing toward user-managed 
backups is a *big* step backward.

The MML (media-manager layer)choices 
varywith the platform. Each platform (i.e. HPUX, AIX, Solaris, 
Tru64, NT/2000, etc) presents different choices for MML (i.e. Omniback, 
ADSM, Veritas, Legato, etc). There are several good bulletins on 
MetaLink (search keywords like "RMAN MML", for example) as well as excellent 
documentation in the standard docset (search http://docs.oracle.com). Also, the 
Oracle Press book "Oracle Backup  Recovery 101" is excellent and the 
O'Reilly book "RMAN Pocket Reference" will be useful during 
implementation...

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Jalil 
  Zabourdine 
  To: Multiple recipients of list 
  ORACLE-L 
  Sent: Friday, May 24, 2002 5:23 
  AM
  Subject: Re: Oracle Parallel 
  Server
  
  You will need to put tablespace in backup mode and use "dd" to 
  copy the appropriate raw device. Note that you can't write a dynamic 
  hotbackup script for raw disk - your script will need to be modified 
  whenever you added a datafile. 
  HTH 
  Regards, 
  -Jalil 
   [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  wrote: 
  What 
is the best way to implement a HOT BACKUP on an Oracle Parallel Server 
which is using RAW disks.Please describe the process if possible.I know 
it has to be RMAN and some MML--Please see the official ORACLE-L 
FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com--Author:INET: 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]Fat City Network Services -- (858) 
538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051San Diego, California -- Public Internet 
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ListsTo 
REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail messageto: 
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HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
  
  
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Re: Oracle Parallel Server

2002-05-24 Thread Jalil Zabourdine

## (i.e. "can't write a dynamic hotbackup script for raw disk") is untrue. 
Ok but in the case when datafile uses symbolic link point to raw device then how this could work?
-Jalil
 Tim Gorman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 




Thisanswer (i.e. "can't write a dynamic hotbackup script for raw disk") is untrue. You would just use the same techniques (i.e. query the data dictionary to generate a shell script) as you would with any other type of datafile...

Also, you do not need to "put tablespaces into backup mode and use 'dd'" if you are using RMAN, OPS or not.RMAN wasthe right idea to start with -- directing toward user-managed backups is a *big* step backward.

The MML (media-manager layer)choices varywith the platform. Each platform (i.e. HPUX, AIX, Solaris, Tru64, NT/2000, etc) presents different choices for MML (i.e. Omniback, ADSM, Veritas, Legato, etc). There are several good bulletins on MetaLink (search keywords like "RMAN MML", for example) as well as excellent documentation in the standard docset (search http://docs.oracle.com). Also, the Oracle Press book "Oracle Backup  Recovery 101" is excellent and the O'Reilly book "RMAN Pocket Reference" will be useful during implementation...

- Original Message - 
From: Jalil Zabourdine 
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L 
Sent: Friday, May 24, 2002 5:23 AM
Subject: Re: Oracle Parallel Server

You will need to put tablespace in backup mode and use "dd" to copy the appropriate raw device. Note that you can't write a dynamic hotbackup script for raw disk - your script will need to be modified whenever you added a datafile. 
HTH 
Regards, 
-Jalil 
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 
What is the best way to implement a HOT BACKUP on an Oracle Parallel Server which is using RAW disks.Please describe the process if possible.I know it has to be RMAN and some MML--Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com--Author:INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]Fat City Network Services -- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051San Diego, California -- Public Internet access / Mailing ListsTo REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail messageto: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and inthe message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L(or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You mayalso send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).


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LAUNCH - Your Yahoo! Music Experience

Re: Oracle Parallel Server




Try "dd if=/dev/rdsk/x | compress -c  
/dev/rmt/0" or something like that if you want to compress your backups of "raw" 
devices using the standard UNIX "dd" utility. However, Oracle Support has 
always been leery about the use of "compress" for backups, with regards to 
possible corruption of the contents. Scan MetaLink for discussions on 
this...

Most tape subsystems support hardware-based 
compression, so the issue of whether compression is possible using "raw" or 
"cooked" devices as input is quite irrelevant, for most 
configurations.

The topic of this email thread seems to have veered 
into confusion over the difference between "compression" and "block-level 
incremental backups", so I'll just bail out now...

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Jalil 
  Zabourdine 
  To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L 
  
  Sent: Friday, May 24, 2002 8:18 AM
  Subject: Re: Oracle Parallel Server
  
  Manpreet,
  raw disk is sliced as physical disk so that you can not compress. Do 
  not get confused between DD and RMAN because DD is an OS utility andRMAN 
  is an oracle utility they are totally different.
  Regards,
  Jalil
   [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  wrote: 
  OK 
you can do DD ,but , can you use compression along with DD.What if you have 
allocated 40-50GB to the database,but in actual only 20GB is used.RMAN can 
do that.i am not too sure would DD be able to do 
it.Manpreet You will need to put tablespace in 
backup mode and use "dd" to copy the appropriate raw device. Note that you 
can't write a dynamic hotbackup script for raw disk - your script will need 
to be modified whenever you added a datafile. HTH 
Regards, -Jalil [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What is the 
best way to implement a HOT BACKUP on an Oracle Parallel Server which is 
using RAW disks.Please describe the process if possible.I know it has to be 
RMAN and some MML -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: 
http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: INET: 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]  Fat City ! ! Network Services -- 
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LAUNCH - Your Yahoo! Music Experience--Please see the official 
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Re: Reducing datafile size

2002-05-24 Thread Jack van Zanen



Hi

that will only work if there are no extents past the 500M mark of the
datafile.

Try coalescing first


Jack


   
  
  Ramon E. Estevez   
  
  com.banilejas@codeTo:   Multiple recipients of list 
ORACLE-L [EMAIL PROTECTED]   
  tel.net.docc:   (bcc: Jack van 
Zanen/nlzanen1/External/MEY/NL)
  Sent by:   Subject:  Re: Reducing datafile size  
  
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  
   
  
   
  
  24-05-2002 16:18 
  
  Please respond to
  
  ORACLE-L 
  
   
  
   
  



Simon,

You can do

   ALTER DATABASE DATAFILE 'D:\ORACLE\ORADATA\MYDATAFILE.ORA' RESIZE 500M;


Ramon


- Original Message -
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, May 24, 2002 8:33 AM


Hi all,
I've dropped a couple of tables from my DB -how do I coalesce the
tablespace
to have the associated datafile reduced in size ?

Thanking you,

___
CSW
--
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
--
Author: Simon Waibale
  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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Re: so when did you switch from NT to unix for oracle



No way !  You're pulling a lot of legs
[and hurting a lot of egos who take pride in
pointing out that NT is _not_ an enterprise-class
platform, me included].

Hemant K Chitale

- Original Message -
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, 24 May, 2002 8:00 AM


 How about 250 Gig, 450 users on SAP 4.0B?

 4 Cpu's 2 Gig Ram.

 Stop making me defend NT!!

 Jared





 Disser, Arno [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 05/23/2002 10:23 AM
 Please respond to ORACLE-L


 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 cc:
 Subject:RE: so when did you switch from NT to unix for
oracle


 Here are my 0.02EUR

 Turn this reasoning around: Why would anyone use NT for a serious Oracle
 DB-server?
 Okay, for some minor development perhaps, but for an production
 environment?

 b.t.w., ever considered a switch to VMS?

 Arno Disser
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Re: Oracle feature



I second, and third, and fourth that.

Actually, I don't have to spend too much time
with Support for RDBMS issues.  It is the
new-fangled technologies -- iAS, Portal, iFS,
Intermedia that I am not comfortable with Support about.

Hemant K Chitale

- Original Message -
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, 24 May, 2002 8:53 PM


 Support assistance that is good at problem solving and if they do not know
 the answer, either get help, or pass it on to someone who does!!

 Regards,
 Melanie

 -Original Message-
 Sent: Friday, May 24, 2002 2:28 AM
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


 --=_MAILER_ATTACH_BOUNDARY1_200252451147571653377373
 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii




 Hi List,


 I want to give an answer to foll. question in a survey form


 * If u want to add or change any feature in Oracle, wot wud it be ?


 (consider oracle8i)


 Regards,


 Sam
 Get Your Private, Free E-mail from Indiatimes at
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 P(consider oracle8i)/P
 PRegards,/P
 PSam/P/FONT
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RE: Data Warehouse experts, a simple question for you| Outdated?

2002-05-24 Thread Rachel Carmichael


Dang, he found out my nefarious plot to so twist your minds that you
would all become my slaves.

I am far from expert on Oracle in general. On data warehousing I am the
merest of newbies.  

Pass that tequila bottle this way if you're done with it sir!

Rachel

--- Jack Silvey [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 can't resist asking ... since *this* answer advises us
 not to trust your answers, aren't you in fact saying
 that we should not trust this answer, which of course
 means that your answers *are* in fact trustworthy?
 
 The everything I say is a lie scenario that Kirk
 used in that one Star Trek episode to confuse the
 robot until it blew up? 
 
 (might be time to put away the tequilla now and go to
 bed, Jack)
 
 ;)
 
 /jack
 
 
 --- Rachel Carmichael [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  you can ask... and if you actually TRUST the answers
  I give, well, you
  are insane
  
  --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
   And that means we can all now  ask Rachel our
  Datawarehousing
   questions 
   and  not RTFM :-)
   
   Cheers
   
   
   --
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   Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
   23-05-2002 11:13 PM
   Please respond to ORACLE-L
   

   To: Multiple recipients of list
  ORACLE-L
   [EMAIL PROTECTED]
   cc: 
   Fax to: 
   Subject:RE: Data Warehouse
  experts, a simple question
   for you| Outdated?
   
   
   Dennis,
   
   I have on my desk, all in varying stages of being
  read: 
   Inmon's book Building the Data Warehouse (very
  understandable)
   
   Kimball's articles from his site and from the
   Intelligententerprise.com
   site (somewhat understandable, I think you need a
  base from which to
   read his articles). His books are on order and
  should arrive today
   
   Tim Gorman's book Essential Oracle8i Data
  Warehousing (this I haven't
   started, as Tim tells me to read it AFTER I have a
  basic
   understanding
   of data warehousing)
   
   The Oracle8i Data Warehousing documentation
  (actually pretty readable
   and understandable)
   
   Ya think I might be over-researching this stuff
  and panicking a bit?
   
   Rachel
   
   --- DENNIS WILLIAMS [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  wrote:
Ian, 

  - In the beginning was the data warehouse and
  yeah it was good.
   It
would
solve all corporate problems and would encompass
  all corporate data
so all
corporate minions would see the same data.
  - But yeah it took so long to create the
  corporate data warehouse
that
management despaired and canceled the project.
  Or by the time the
monster
data warehouse came blinking and straining into
  the daylight all
   the
users
said that the company had evolved in the
  meanwhile and the
   warehouse
was
obsolete.
  - So data warehouses gained a bad rep from
  corporate managers and
yeah
none would fain to propose the conception of a
  data warehouse for
fear of
castigation.
  - Then some marketing interns bribed a DBA to
  send them data
weekly. And
they stored this data in a database and lo,
  their superiors were
impressed.
  - Everyone was in awe of the marketing
  database, but none dared
tarnish it
by speaking the name which shall not be
  mentioned, so it was
christened a
data mart.
  - And lo, the data marts multiplied and were
  fruitful. And the
   DBA
cursed
the day she was weak and did give data to the
  marketing interns.
  - Then another prophet did arise and did
  challenge the prophet
Kimball.
His name was Inmon. And he did claim to be the
  progenitor of data
warehouses. And therefore all should do data
  warehousing his way
   and
use his
terms.
  - And great confusion arose over the land. And
  many debates
   ensued,
including some face to face between Inmon and
  Kimball. And terms
   such
as

RE: so when did you switch from NT to unix for oracle

2002-05-24 Thread Mark Leith


Open your eyes then.. It *can* cope with these types of apps - as many have
said here already, it just takes the right admin..

-Original Message-
Chitale
Sent: 24 May 2002 16:04
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L



No way !  You're pulling a lot of legs
[and hurting a lot of egos who take pride in
pointing out that NT is _not_ an enterprise-class
platform, me included].

Hemant K Chitale

- Original Message -
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, 24 May, 2002 8:00 AM


 How about 250 Gig, 450 users on SAP 4.0B?

 4 Cpu's 2 Gig Ram.

 Stop making me defend NT!!

 Jared





 Disser, Arno [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 05/23/2002 10:23 AM
 Please respond to ORACLE-L


 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 cc:
 Subject:RE: so when did you switch from NT to unix for
oracle


 Here are my 0.02EUR

 Turn this reasoning around: Why would anyone use NT for a serious Oracle
 DB-server?
 Okay, for some minor development perhaps, but for an production
 environment?

 b.t.w., ever considered a switch to VMS?

 Arno Disser
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Re: Reducing datafile size

2002-05-24 Thread Ramon E. Estevez


Connor,

You are right, just putting a number.

tks

- Original Message - 
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, May 24, 2002 9:25 AM


 alter database datafile '...' resize 
 
 you won't be able to resize past the highest used
 block in the file (you can get this from dba_extents)
 
 hth
 connor
 
  --- Simon Waibale [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:  Hi
 all,
  I've dropped a couple of tables from my DB -how do I
  coalesce the tablespace 
  to have the associated datafile reduced in size ?
  
  Thanking you,
  
  ___
  CSW
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 =
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 http://www.oracledba.co.uk
 http://www.oaktable.net
 
 Some days you're the pigeon, some days you're the statue
 
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Re: so when did you switch from NT to unix for oracle

2002-05-24 Thread Sakthi , Raj


Please check the metalink doc Note:46001.1
which gives complete details about  2 Gigs memory
addressing by oracle.

Cheers,
RS
--- Ron Rogers [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Joe,
  I do not know if it is still valid but here is part
 of a message from
 05/2000 that talked about the 4GB on NT.
 With Oracle 8.1.6 on NT there is an option to allow
 you to use all of
 the 4 GIG as noted in the 8I Administrators Guide
 for Windows NT section
 10. 4GB RAM Tuning (4GT) for windows NT server,
 Enterprise Edition. More
 information can be found at

http://www.microsoft.com/ntserver/ntserverenterprise/exec/feature/4gbt.asp
 
 
 Ron
 ROR mª¿ªm
 
 
 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] 05/23/02 12:33PM 
 
 Number of users.  I have a 170G Oracle 8.1.6
 database running on WinNT
 4.0
 with 3xx of RAM just fine, as long as there are no
 more than 2 users. 
 Jump
 up to about 16 users and response time goes down the
 tube.
 
 So I guess that transactions are the answer.  I
 don't have any
 benchmarks.
 Just my $.02.
 
 
 
 
   

 JOE TESTA   
   

 JTESTA  To:
 Multiple recipients of
 list ORACLE-L  
 @longaberger.   
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]

 com cc:
   

 Sent by: rootSubject:   
  so when did you
 switch from NT to
  unix for
 oracle   

 
   

 05/23/2002  
   

 09:48 AM
   

 Please  
   

 respond to  
   

 ORACLE-L
   

 
   

 
   

 
 
 
 
 
 A question has been posed to me, when to switch from
 NT to unix for
 oracle.
 
 Is it when the NT box starts getting out of memory
 issues, number of
 transactions, size of db?
 
 just looking for some ball park answers.
 
 thanks, joe
 
 
 
 
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RE: so when did you switch from NT to unix for oracle

2002-05-24 Thread Jesse, Rich

And server reboots.

Rich Jesse   System/Database Administrator
[EMAIL PROTECTED]  Quad/Tech International, Sussex, WI USA

 -Original Message-
 From: Mark Leith [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
 Sent: Friday, May 24, 2002 10:39 AM
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
 Subject: RE: so when did you switch from NT to unix for oracle

 Open your eyes then.. It *can* cope with these types of apps 
 - as many have
 said here already, it just takes the right admin..
-- 
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Author: Jesse, Rich
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RE: so when did you switch from NT to unix for oracle

2002-05-24 Thread Robertson Lee - lerobe


Apologies to all NT-ophiles out there, but REALLY, this afternoon, you can
kiss my milky white ass.

Lee, having a rather bad NT-centric afternoon


-Original Message-
Sent: 24 May 2002 16:39
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Open your eyes then.. It *can* cope with these types of apps - as many have
said here already, it just takes the right admin..

-Original Message-
Chitale
Sent: 24 May 2002 16:04
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L



No way !  You're pulling a lot of legs
[and hurting a lot of egos who take pride in
pointing out that NT is _not_ an enterprise-class
platform, me included].

Hemant K Chitale

- Original Message -
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, 24 May, 2002 8:00 AM


 How about 250 Gig, 450 users on SAP 4.0B?

 4 Cpu's 2 Gig Ram.

 Stop making me defend NT!!

 Jared





 Disser, Arno [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 05/23/2002 10:23 AM
 Please respond to ORACLE-L


 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 cc:
 Subject:RE: so when did you switch from NT to unix for
oracle


 Here are my 0.02EUR

 Turn this reasoning around: Why would anyone use NT for a serious Oracle
 DB-server?
 Okay, for some minor development perhaps, but for an production
 environment?

 b.t.w., ever considered a switch to VMS?

 Arno Disser
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Re: Diagnose Slow System

2002-05-24 Thread Rachel Carmichael


it formats report.txt properly when run from svrmgrl, does not when run
from sqlplus

and since oraperf.com needs it properly formatted so it can parse it,
you need to run it from svrmgrl

generating the report.txt file from statspack can be done in sqlplus

--- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
 Tim,
 
 I'm curious why you say that utlbstat/utlestat should be run from
 svrmgrl
 and not sqlplus.
 I've not heard/read that before.
 
 Cherie Machler
 Oracle DBA
 Gelco Information Network
 
 
  

 Tim Gorman 

 Tim@SageLogix   To: Multiple recipients
 of list ORACLE-L [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 .comcc: 

 Sent by: Subject: Re: Diagnose
 Slow System   
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]   

 om   

  

  

 05/23/02 09:38   

 PM   

 Please respond   

 to ORACLE-L  

  

  

 
 
 
 
 Barb,
 
 Can you take a BSTAT/ESTAT while the problem is occurring?  Run the
 utlbstat.sql script from SVRMGRL and then 15-25 mins later run
 utlestat.sql from SVRMGRL.  It's actually pretty important the
 utlestat.sql be run from SVRMGRL and not SQL*Plus.  Please do this
 at
 least once during the periods of slowness -- more than once if
 possible...
 
 Then, FTP the report.txt file(s) up to your PC and then browse to
 the
 http://www.oraperf.com site.  Use the file-selection browse button at
 one
 of
 the upload sections to find one of the report.txt files and click
 upload.  The YAPP report will be produced automagically...
 
 What the YAPP report will do is give a great top-down breakdown of
 where
 the system has been spending the majority of what the end-user
 community
 perceives as response time during the 15-25 mins of your
 BSTAT/ESTAT
 sample.  In brief, the database is either working or waiting.  If you
 like,
 you could email me the report.txt file and I'll look through the
 YAPP
 report alongside you...
 
 There are some papers online at www.oraperf.com/whitepapers.htm which
 should
 explain the YAPP methodology (written by Anjo) and also another paper
 about
 using YAPP with STATSPACK.  The latter paper largely applies to
 BSTAT/ESTAT
 also...
 
 From these reports, we should be able to get a pretty good idea of
 what is
 going on...
 
 Thanks!
 
 -Tim
 
 - Original Message -
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Sent: Thursday, May 23, 2002 4:13 PM
 
 
  List:
  We've been fighting problems for several days. I've sort of
 overwhelmed
  myself with data, but I don't know what any of it means.
 
  Solaris 2.6, Oracle 8.0.5, MTS
  Users complain of extreme slowness.  No errors in alert, no trace
 files
  generated.
  Database is bounced every day.  I capture wait statistics each day
 before
  the database goes down.  The statistics from v$system_event for
 enqueue
  waits has gone up considerably since the problems started last
 Wednesday.
  But when I look at v$lock (I'm using Steve Adams' enqueue_locks.sql
  scripts), nothing pops up.
 
  Any ideas where I should start looking?   I would appreciate any
 help.
  (I really believe this is a connectivity (networking) issue, but
 don't
 know
  how to confirm this)
  Thanks!
  Barb
 
  (accumulted since last night at 11:00 pm)
 
 
  EVENT   TOTAL_WAITS TOTAL_TIMEOUTS TIME_WAITED
  AVERAGE_WAIT
  --- --- -- ---
  
  latch free   814316   4064  106360
  130612686
  enqueue 147 26   12033
  81.8571429
  free buffer waits 4  0  23

RE: 64 BIT ORACLE FOR SOLARIS 64 BIT

2002-05-24 Thread Scott . Shafer


http://metalink.oracle.com

click on Patches.

Scott Shafer
San Antonio, TX
210-581-6217


 -Original Message-
 From: Hamid Alavi [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
 Sent: Thursday, May 23, 2002 5:50 PM
 To:   Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
 Subject:  64 BIT ORACLE FOR SOLARIS 64 BIT
 
 Thanks for respond, Now I want to know which Patch of Oracle 8.1.7 is 64
 bit
 for solaris 64 ?
 
 Thanks again
 
 Hamid Alavi
 Office 818 737-0526
 Cell818 402-1987
 
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RE: --- re OpenVMS/Tru64/HPUX/etc


Hemant - We will absolutely still be running Tru64 for many years to come.
However, we have decided not to buy any more Alpha servers. 
About the time we were trying to make a decision, the META Group
forecast that a few years from now there would only be 3 server operating
systems widely used:
- W2K
- Linux
- Solaris
Their prediction was that the other Unix variants would eventually migrate
to Linux. Only Solaris has a strong enough future to remain on its own. I
notice on the news that Sun is releasing more Linux software itself. 
Anyway, it seemed that both W2K and Linux were less proven than
Solaris, so Solaris seemed to be a safer choice.
Dennis Williams
DBA
Lifetouch, Inc.
[EMAIL PROTECTED]


-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, May 24, 2002 9:44 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L



We have far too many Oracle on Tru64 installations
to consider a quick migration out.  Apparently, Compaq
has convinced us that Tru64 will still be around
for a few years.  HPUX will be taking up the
good features of Tru64 (AdvFS and Clustering+ClusterFileSystem).
The other concern we had was about Alpha.  I believe
that there would be about two more releases of the Alpha
and then welcome Intel.
We also have SPARC Solaris databases but I'm not
sure how much time the big damagers want to spend
on considering migrating to SPARC Solaris.  Might as well
also look at IBM [although that, too, might go from PowerPC
to Itanium].

Hemant K Chitale
http://hkchital.tripod.com
- Original Message -
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, 24 May, 2002 1:43 AM


Hermat - We are on Tru64 and I couldn't be more pleased. However, I believe
that HP/Compaq has decided to eventually withdraw Tru64. My guess is that is
so they can support HPUX. However, they were pretty clear that OpenVMS would
continue. My guess is that Ron is hinting that there are other reasons to
move to VMS at his company. Just sign me as learning Solaris.
Dennis Williams
DBA
Lifetouch, Inc.
[EMAIL PROTECTED]


-Original Message-
Sent: Thursday, May 23, 2002 11:29 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L



The bane of trying to keep up with technology.
But why OpenVMS and not Tru64, then.
We have a large number of Tru64 Oracle Databases
(we do have OpenVMSs for Promis databases
used in manufacturing, I believe).

Hemant K Chitale

- Original Message -
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, 23 May, 2002 11:03 PM


Hemant,
  The price I am referring to is the cost involved with moving from a
Dell server on Novell to a Compaq OpenVMS server.  There are a lot of
company sided issues that have to be addressed and cases made for the
move. In this case the software is not an issues as you stated, the
issues revolve around the hardware and developmental considerations. I
would be more that happy to move to the latest and greatest solid
platform/database combination. It would allow us to create and implement
browser based applications rather easily and would allow us to use the
9iAS Suite of products.
 For now all I can do is make requests for item to be included in the
budget as we move forward, backwards, sideways, dance on circles.
Ron
ROR mª¿ªm

 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 05/23/02 09:38AM 

An upgrade wouldn't cost anything.  It would be free
as part of your support contract.

Hemant K Chitale

- Original Message -
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, 23 May, 2002 2:41 AM


Kevin,
 I appreciate your testing efforts. Now to convince the bean-counters
to upgrate to 9i.
Ron
ROR mª¿ªm

 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 05/22/02 02:08PM 
I reran my test. with 250,000 rows in the table. It took a whopping
0.25
seconds to complete.

-Original Message-
Sent: Wednesday, May 22, 2002 12:59 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Kevin,
 Yes but does it work with data in the column?, I do not have 9i set
up
yet. If it works as you describe with data in the column it will
really
help with the multi million row tables that they want to rename a
column  after a release of a new lotto game.
thanks,
for the test and update.
Ron
ROR mª¿ªm

 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 05/22/02 10:38AM 
Summary: it works!

SQL SELECT * FROM v$version;

BANNER

Oracle9i Enterprise Edition Release 9.2.0.1.0 - Production
PL/SQL Release 9.2.0.1.0 - Production
CORE9.2.0.1.0   Production
TNS for Solaris: Version 9.2.0.1.0 - Production
NLSRTL Version 9.2.0.1.0 - Production

SQL create table test_table (wrong_name VARCHAR2(40));

Table created.

SQL alter table test_table rename column wrong_name to right_name;

Table altered.

SQL desc test_table;
 Name  Null?Type
 - 

 RIGHT_NAME VARCHAR2(40)

SQL

Kevin Toepke

RE: W2K problem in connection

2002-05-24 Thread Thomas Day



Actually, I was wondering if a listener service had been created and
whether the LISTENER.ORA entry had been made.
It is Friday.


   

Mark Leith 

markTo: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L  

@cool-tools.c[EMAIL PROTECTED]

o.ukcc:   

Sent by: rootSubject: RE: W2K problem in connection

   

   

05/24/2002 

06:38 AM   

Please 

respond to 

ORACLE-L   

   

   





That should be:

I know you said the service CREATED fine

Ahh well - it's Friday ;P

-Original Message-
Sent: 24 May 2002 10:48
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


I know you said the service started fine - and this may be a stupid
questions but.. Did you start the Oracle service?

Mark

-Original Message-
Madan
Sent: 24 May 2002 03:38
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Hi,

I'm having problems creating a db on W2K (Oracle version 8.1.7).

I installed the software without any errors. I then created the pfile, and
created the service using ORADIM. The service created fine without errors.

Now I am trying to create the database, but I can't!!! Whenever I try and
log in as sysdba it gives me an ORA-24314 Service handle not initialized.
The ORACLE_HOME and SID are set correctly.

Can someone please help me. I have searched in metalink and I've seen other
people facing the same problem but there aren't many solutions.

Cheers,

Sujatha

---
Sujatha Madan
Database Administrator
Custom Management Centre
Optus Business Operations
'yes' OPTUS
PH # +61 2 9775 5316
Mobile # +61 402 354 347
FAX # +61 2 9775 5360
Email [EMAIL PROTECTED]
WEB http://www.optusbusiness.com.au/
---


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RE: Oracle Parallel Server


I agree with Tim. Start by learning RMAN. If you use RMAN, then the issues
of OPS and raw disks go away. RMAN uses its own backup methods. You can
learn RMAN by backing up to disk, then research whether you need an MML.
RMAN is so superior for this type of backup that you should not consider
creating your own backup using dd or whatever.
Dennis Williams
DBA
Lifetouch, Inc.
[EMAIL PROTECTED]


-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, May 24, 2002 5:24 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


What is the best way to implement a HOT BACKUP on an Oracle Parallel Server
which is using RAW disks.Please describe the process if possible.I know it
has to be RMAN and some MML
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Re: Database backup question.Thank You

2002-05-24 Thread Meomeo Nguyen

 Hi Tim and Connor,
Thanks you all for your very helpful feedback. I do appreciate it very much. In fact, we are in development at this point, so the database is small and transaction volume is very low. Therefore, my choice for primary backup method is the cold backups. However, to safeguard against unsual things, whichmight happen to the database, I will take your advice to run my database in ARCHIVELOG mode.The hot backup will be used. Again, thanks for your very quick responses. 
Regards, 
Trang
 Tim Gorman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 




Trang,

Theoretically, the online redo log filesare be necessary, but the world has a habit of making a shambles of the theoretical.Let's say, in the event that you automate your Friday script, you'llprobably come to realize that SHUTDOWN IMMEDIATE is far from perfect (as well as far from immediate!). Over time, you'll probably construct some kind of "fail-safe" mechanism to SHUTDOWN ABORT if the initial SHUTDOWN IMMEDIATE doesn't shut down after a period of time. Pretty standard thing that DBAs have been writing for years. Hopefully, after the SHUTDOWN ABORT they also STARTUP RESTRICT and then SHUTDOWN NORMAL, but you can't count on it...

So, here's the point: what if you take a cold backup in NOARCHIVELOG mode after a SHUTDOWN ABORT (that should have been a SHUTDOWN IMMEDIATE and wasn't) and you have *not* backed up those online redo log files? Answer: unusable backup. So, back up everything: all datafiles, controlfiles, and online redo logfiles. The latter are not too big anyway -- what's the point of excluding them?

It is wise to take a cold backup after a clean shutdown, but you can even get a valid backup after a SHUTDOWN ABORT or a crash if you've backed up the online redo archive log files. When you restart Oracle, an instance recovery will occur automatically, and you might not evenknow it. Just be certain that the instance is truly "dead" when you take your "cold" backup...

With regards to switching between ARCHIVELOG and NOARCHIVELOG, it's a waste of effort from a recoverability standpoint. At most it may be interesting, but as soon as you switch out of ARCHIVELOG mode, nothing you've done while in ARCHIVELOG mode is valid anymore. Leave it one wayor the other, and then leave it...

...just my $0.02...

Another $0.02: use RMAN for your cold backups. Then you won't forget anything, because RMAN will remember for you...

Hope this helps...

-Tim

- Original Message - 
From: Meomeo Nguyen 
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L 
Sent: Thursday, May 23, 2002 5:33 PM
Subject: Database backup question.

Hi All,
I need to perform a consistent backup for my whole database every Friday by using operating system utilities. My database has been currently operatingin NOARCHIVELOG mode, so the only files need to be backed up are datafiles, control files, the initialization parameter file and other oracle product initialization files (Based on Oracle8.1.6 Backup and Recovery Guide). Since the files in this type of backup are all consistent and do not need recovery, so the online logs are not needed. Since online redo logs is very crucial for recovery, so my question is do I need to back up the online redo log files as I choose to performcold backuptype for my entire database weekly?Here is step by step what I did to back up the whole database:
after the database was closed cleanly and all the above mentioned files had been backed up into the tape. I had torestart the database and mount but not open,thenswitched between NOARCHIVELOG mode to ARCHIVELOG mode in order to archive the online redo log files. Finally, I copied all archived redo log files into the tape while the databasewas open and operated in ARCHIVELOG mode. when it wasalldone, I then switched the database back to NOARCHIVELOG mode. Just wondered whether my procedure to perform a whole consistent database backup is correct? Am I safe to this point? Your help is greatly appreciated it. Your help is greatly appreciated.
Thanks in advance,
Trang


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RE: Oracle and OpenVMS (was: Rename Column in 9iR2)


Mladen - I'm sorry but I'm still struggling with the part of your note that
says After all, I had to resign because I advised my boss to buy MIPS R3300
based DECSystems 5800 with  Ultrix. In slightly less then a year . . .
Let me understand. You made a recommendation, which your boss accepted. Your
company received almost a year of usage, I assume it was good, reliable
service. 
First of all, I think you are better off not working for that
company. Second, other that the salesman's opinion, why do you say that was
the wrong system? Were there other issues, possibly involving his wife? I
can only think of all the idiots that have been promoted for suggesting the
wrong system. Third, I'm kinda glad that nobody has asked my opinion of what
system should be purchased (well, aside from an Altos server running a Z-80,
but that worked out well, but again, NO upgrade path), and in the future I'm
going to be very careful not to give anybody the idea that I'm offering an
opinion unless it is clearly required by my job description.
Dennis Williams
DBA
Lifetouch, Inc.
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 

-Original Message-
Sent: Thursday, May 23, 2002 11:13 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L



On 2002.05.23 22:43 Brown, Pedr wrote:
 OpenVMS is a rock solid plafform, we run 120+ 817 databases (spread
 across
 20 nodes)  with very few platform issues. The downside is some
 functionality
 doesn't work too well (like MTS) and on the benchmarks we've done
 inhouse
 Oracle/Tru64 has always been roughly 2x as fast as Oracle/OpenVMS on
 the
 same hardware configuration.

That is because VMS has an old phylosophy of using CPU modes for 
separation
of privileged parts of the program and, partly, because of the logical 
names.
Logical names are implemented as devices. Turn on IO tracing with the 
set watch
command and you'll see that every access to a logical name table 
(process, batch, group,
system) causes an IO to happen. VMS is an old system with a huuuge 
kernel
which is better suited for TP-monitor type of applications then to an 
intense
myriad of small processes so characteristic for Unix.  The only way to 
beat unix is
not to use two-task architecture at all, because IO is extremely 
expensive on VMS
but to use so called single-task architecture (S:) which used to be 
available on VMS
long time ago. Also, turn off any OS caching (Files11 started doing 
that as of VMS 6)
as Oracle does it's own caching and VMS caching only interferes and 
wastes the necessary
memory. Also, make sure that swapper is not too active. You need to 
tune the memory
variables (FREELIM, BORROWLIMIT,GROWLIMIT) extremely carefully because 
an overactive
swapper can really kill a VMS machine. Also, tune the MPW (modified 
page writer)
and make sure that the non-paged pool is sufficiently large. I was able 
to beat
an HP 735 with HP-UX 7 with a MicroVAX 3900 with VMS 5.0 (a long, long 
time ago in a
galaxy far, far away when there was SQL*Net V1.0 which was started as a 
process called
orasrv). Im sure that modern Alpha machines can beat the crap out of 
OSF/1 microkernel
Unix. Consult an old lore by Clay Prestia and Bruce Ellis (where is 
Billy Bitsandbites
when youneed him?). I used to teach people how to tune VMS (I stopped 
using it when
the world was much younger and the version was OpenVMS 5.5-2) and I 
know that VMS
can be very, very highly tuned. If tuned properly, I'm sure it can beat 
any Unix on
a comparably fast HW.

 
 -Original Message-
 Sent: Friday, 24 May 2002 1:33
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
 
 
 As a side note, please please please become familiar with OpenVMS and
 more
 importantly Oracle on OpenVMS before tackling this.  At least as far


Left OpenVMS for Irix 5.3 and never looked back. After all, I had to 
resign
because I advised my boss to buy MIPS R3300 based DECSystems 5800 with 
Ultrix.
In slightly less then a year, a DEC salesman stopped by and told my 
boss something
like: No upgrade, no trade in, no transition, no support for Ultrix. 
Throw your
boxes away and buy the new and shiny alphas.  Aftere that, I was asked 
to resign.
I am actually glad that DEC has perished. They certainly deserved it! 
No more
OpenVMS for me. I'll stick with the mainstream. Unix rulez!
OpenVMS was a nice system, DEC products were beautifully engineered but 
their
marketing sucked big time. They fully deserved what happened to them.
-- 
Mladen Gogala
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Bitmap vs btree - how to tell? how to test?

2002-05-24 Thread Jack Silvey


Listers,

We are creating indexes on a 300m row fact table
today. I am researching bitmap versus btree (again) to
see where the latest info points. 

Anyone care to comment on the way to determine whether
an index should be a btree or a bitmap? Anyone even
know a good way to test this?

thx,

/jack


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Re: Bitmap vs btree - how to tell? how to test?

2002-05-24 Thread Anand Prakash


I am on leave from May 29 to July 15. Please contact Jaspreet Jajj at
x4338 for any query. Thanks.

Anand Prakash

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Re: Bitmap vs btree - how to tell? how to test?

2002-05-24 Thread Anand Prakash


I am on leave from May 29 to July 15. Please contact Jaspreet Jajj at
x4338 for any query. Thanks.

Anand Prakash

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-- 
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Re: Database backup question.Thank You

2002-05-24 Thread Ruth Gramolini


Good choice...archivelog mode will make your life as a DBA much easier.
Have a look at doing hot backups with rman.

Regards,
Ruth
- Original Message -
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, May 24, 2002 1:12 PM



  Hi Tim and Connor,
 Thanks you all for your very helpful feedback.  I do appreciate it very
much.  In fact, we are in development at this point, so the database is
small and transaction volume is very low.  Therefore, my choice for primary
backup method is the cold backups.  However, to safeguard against unsual
things, which might happen to the database, I will take your advice to run
my database in ARCHIVELOG mode. The hot backup will be used.  Again, thanks
for your very quick responses.
 Regards,
 Trang
   Tim Gorman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Trang, Theoretically, the online
redo log files are be necessary, but the world has a habit of making a
shambles of the theoretical.  Let's say, in the event that you automate your
Friday script, you'll probably come to realize that SHUTDOWN IMMEDIATE is
far from perfect (as well as far from immediate!).  Over time, you'll
probably construct some kind of fail-safe mechanism to SHUTDOWN ABORT if
the initial SHUTDOWN IMMEDIATE doesn't shut down after a period of time.
Pretty standard thing that DBAs have been writing for years.  Hopefully,
after the SHUTDOWN ABORT they also STARTUP RESTRICT and then SHUTDOWN
NORMAL, but you can't count on it... So, here's the point:  what if you take
a cold backup in NOARCHIVELOG mode after a SHUTDOWN ABORT (that should have
been a SHUTDOWN IMMEDIATE and wasn't) and you have *not* backed up those
online redo log files?  Answer: unusable backup.  So, back up everything:
all datafiles, controlfiles, and !
 !
 online redo logfiles.  The latter are not too big anyway -- what's the
point of excluding them? It is wise to take a cold backup after a clean
shutdown, but you can even get a valid backup after a SHUTDOWN ABORT or a
crash if you've backed up the online redo archive log files.  When you
restart Oracle, an instance recovery will occur automatically, and you might
not even know it.  Just be certain that the instance is truly dead when
you take your cold backup... With regards to switching between ARCHIVELOG
and NOARCHIVELOG, it's a waste of effort from a recoverability standpoint.
At most it may be interesting, but as soon as you switch out of ARCHIVELOG
mode, nothing you've done while in ARCHIVELOG mode is valid anymore.  Leave
it one way or the other, and then leave it... ...just my $0.02... Another
$0.02:  use RMAN for your cold backups.  Then you won't forget anything,
because RMAN will remember for you... Hope this helps... -Tim- Original
Message - From: Meomeo!
 !
  Nguyen To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Sent: Thursday, May 23,
2002 5:33 PMSubject: Database backup question.

 Hi All,

 I need to perform a consistent backup for my whole database every Friday
by using operating system utilities.  My database has been currently
operating in NOARCHIVELOG mode, so the only files need to be backed up are
datafiles, control files, the initialization parameter file and other oracle
product initialization files (Based on Oracle8.1.6 Backup and Recovery
Guide).  Since the files in this type of backup are all consistent and do
not need recovery, so the online logs are not needed.  Since online redo
logs is very crucial for recovery, so my question is do I need to back up
the online redo log files as I choose to perform cold backup type for my
entire database weekly?  Here is step by step what I did to back up the
whole database:

 after the database was closed cleanly and all the above mentioned files
had been backed up into the tape.  I had to restart the database and mount
but not open, then switched between NOARCHIVELOG mode to ARCHIVELOG mode in
order to archive the online redo log files.  Finally, I copied all archived
redo log files into the tape while the database was open and operated in
ARCHIVELOG mode.  when it was all done, I then switched  the database back
to NOARCHIVELOG mode.  Just wondered whether my procedure to perform a whole
consistent database backup is correct?  Am I safe to this point? Your help
is greatly appreciated it. Your help is greatly appreciated.

 Thanks in advance,

 Trang



 -
 Do You Yahoo!?
 LAUNCH - Your Yahoo! Music Experience


 -
 Do You Yahoo!?
 LAUNCH - Your Yahoo! Music Experience

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RE: Database backup question.

2002-05-24 Thread Steve McClure




I 
don't understandy why you would switch to and from archivelog mode. You 
can establish a complete cold backup with your datafiles, control files, and 
online redo logs. Actually you don't need the online redo logs, but that 
used to be the case so I always back those up as well. Shut your DB down 
(normal), and back these files up. That is a complete cold 
backup.

You 
certainly could place your database in archivelog mode, and still back it up 
with cold backups. In this scenario you just add the archived logs to your 
list of files to back up. The only valid reason I can think of for 
switching between modes would be to avoid excessive archivalresulting from 
very large processes. If you have room to archive logs you should consider 
leaving your DB in archivelog mode.Your odds of having a 
satisfying recovery scenario are greatly improved that way.


Steve 
McClure

  -Original Message-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Meomeo NguyenSent: 
  Thursday, May 23, 2002 4:34 PMTo: Multiple recipients of list 
  ORACLE-LSubject: Database backup question.
  Hi All,
  I need to perform a consistent backup for my whole database every Friday by 
  using operating system utilities. My database has been currently 
  operatingin NOARCHIVELOG mode, so the only files need to be backed up 
  are datafiles, control files, the initialization parameter file and other 
  oracle product initialization files (Based on Oracle8.1.6 Backup and Recovery 
  Guide). Since the files in this type of backup are all consistent and do 
  not need recovery, so the online logs are 
  not needed. Since online redo logs is very crucial for recovery, 
  so my question is do I need to back up the online redo log files as I choose 
  to performcold backuptype for my entire database 
  weekly?Here is step by step what I did to back up the whole 
  database:
  after the database was closed cleanly and all the above mentioned files had 
  been backed up into the tape. I had torestart the database and 
  mount but not open,thenswitched between NOARCHIVELOG mode to 
  ARCHIVELOG mode in order to archive the online redo log files. Finally, 
  I copied all archived redo log files into the tape while the databasewas 
  open and operated in ARCHIVELOG mode. when it wasalldone, I 
  then switched the database back to NOARCHIVELOG mode. Just 
  wondered whether my procedure to perform a whole consistent database backup is 
  correct? Am I safe to this point? Your help is greatly appreciated it. 
  Your help is greatly appreciated.
  Thanks in advance,
  Trang
  
  
  Do You Yahoo!?LAUNCH - Your 
  Yahoo! Music Experience

Re: Bitmap vs btree - how to tell? how to test?

2002-05-24 Thread Thomas Day



LOL

Autoreply.

I hope that they can block this guy PDQ or we'll be swamped.




   

Anand Prakash  

AnandPrakashTo: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L  

@firsthealth.[EMAIL PROTECTED]

com cc:   

Sent by: rootSubject: Re: Bitmap vs btree - how to 
tell?   
 how to test?  

   

05/24/2002 

02:00 PM   

Please 

respond to 

ORACLE-L   

   

   





I am on leave from May 29 to July 15. Please contact Jaspreet Jajj at
x4338 for any query. Thanks.

Anand Prakash

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RE: Bitmap vs btree - how to tell? how to test?

2002-05-24 Thread Mercadante, Thomas F


Either that, or we can contact Jaspreet.

Tom Mercadante
Oracle Certified Professional


-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, May 24, 2002 2:29 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L



LOL

Autoreply.

I hope that they can block this guy PDQ or we'll be swamped.




 

Anand Prakash

AnandPrakashTo: Multiple recipients of list
ORACLE-L  
@firsthealth.[EMAIL PROTECTED]

com cc:

Sent by: rootSubject: Re: Bitmap vs btree -
how to tell?   
 how to test?

 

05/24/2002

02:00 PM

Please

respond to

ORACLE-L

 

 





I am on leave from May 29 to July 15. Please contact Jaspreet Jajj at
x4338 for any query. Thanks.

Anand Prakash

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Re: Database backup question.Thank You

2002-05-24 Thread Keith Peterson


lets not forget the classic exp.

1. Production database (where you can't lose a single
transaction) - ARCHIVEMODE absolutely

2. Development database (few hrs of transactions ok to
lose) - cold backups

3. Development database (no schema changes, say an
application is being developed with a tool such as
using Oracle designer) - a simple 'exp un/pwd' of the
user, is the simplest, quickest, lightest, least
headache,... may also be considered.

Keith

 

Date: Fri, 24 May 2002 09:12:02 -0800 
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Reply-to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Address  | Add to Address Book 
Organization: Fat City Network Services, San Diego,
California 
 
 
Hi Tim and Connor, 

Thanks you all for your very helpful feedback.  I do
appreciate it very much.  In fact, we are in
development at this point, so the database is small
and transaction volume is very low.  Therefore, my
choice for primary backup method is the cold backups. 
However, to safeguard against unsual things, which
might happen to the database, I will take your advice
to run my database in ARCHIVELOG mode. The hot backup
will be used.  Again, thanks for your very quick
responses.  

Regards, 

Trang 

  Tim Gorman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 

Trang,
 
Theoretically, the online redo log files are be
necessary, but the world has a habit of making a
shambles of the theoretical.  Let's say, in the event
that you automate your Friday script, you'll probably
come to realize that SHUTDOWN IMMEDIATE is far from
perfect (as well as far from immediate!).  Over time,
you'll probably construct some kind of fail-safe
mechanism to SHUTDOWN ABORT if the initial SHUTDOWN
IMMEDIATE doesn't shut down after a period of time. 
Pretty standard thing that DBAs have been writing for
years.  Hopefully, after the SHUTDOWN ABORT they also
STARTUP RESTRICT and then SHUTDOWN NORMAL, but you
can't count on it...
 
So, here's the point:  what if you take a cold backup
in NOARCHIVELOG mode after a SHUTDOWN ABORT (that
should have been a SHUTDOWN IMMEDIATE and wasn't) and
you have *not* backed up those online redo log files? 
Answer: unusable backup.  So, back up everything:  all
datafiles, controlfiles, and online redo logfiles. 
The latter are not too big anyway -- what's the point
of excluding them?
 
It is wise to take a cold backup after a clean
shutdown, but you can even get a valid backup after a
SHUTDOWN ABORT or a crash if you've backed up the
online redo archive log files.  When you restart
Oracle, an instance recovery will occur automatically,
and you might not even know it.  Just be certain that
the instance is truly dead when you take your cold
backup...
 
With regards to switching between ARCHIVELOG and
NOARCHIVELOG, it's a waste of effort from a
recoverability standpoint.  At most it may be
interesting, but as soon as you switch out of
ARCHIVELOG mode, nothing you've done while in
ARCHIVELOG mode is valid anymore.  Leave it one way or
the other, and then leave it...
 
...just my $0.02...
 
Another $0.02:  use RMAN for your cold backups.  Then
you won't forget anything, because RMAN will remember
for you...
 
Hope this helps...
 
-Tim
- Original Message - 
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L 
Sent: Thursday, May 23, 2002 5:33 PM


Hi All,

I need to perform a consistent backup for my whole
database every Friday by using operating system
utilities.  My database has been currently operating
in NOARCHIVELOG mode, so the only files need to be
backed up are datafiles, control files, the
initialization parameter file and other oracle product
initialization files (Based on Oracle8.1.6 Backup and
Recovery Guide).  Since the files in this type of
backup are all consistent and do not need recovery, so
the online logs are not needed.  Since online redo
logs is very crucial for recovery, so my question is
do I need to back up the online redo log files as I
choose to perform cold backup type for my entire
database weekly?  Here is step by step what I did to
back up the whole database:

after the database was closed cleanly and all the
above mentioned files had been backed up into the
tape.  I had to restart the database and mount but not
open, then switched between NOARCHIVELOG mode to
ARCHIVELOG mode in order to archive the online redo
log files.  Finally, I copied all archived redo log
files into the tape while the database was open and
operated in ARCHIVELOG mode.  when it was all done, I
then switched  the database back to NOARCHIVELOG mode.
 Just wondered whether my procedure to perform a whole
consistent database backup is correct?  Am I safe to
this point? Your help is greatly appreciated it. Your
help is greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance,

Trang


__
Do You Yahoo!?
LAUNCH - Your Yahoo! Music Experience
http://launch.yahoo.com
-- 
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
-- 
Author: Keith Peterson
  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Fat City Network Services--

changing db name

2002-05-24 Thread Magaliff, Bill


I saw a post on MetaLink (Note 15390.1) about changing db_name and
oracle_sid without recreating the db's.

my question is if I want to change the db_name, do I first need to change
the SID?  Or can I do it in one fell swoop, as follows:

backup controlfile to trace
edit file to create new controlfile using set database newdbname
rename initsid.ora with new sid
edit init.ora file with new controlfile names and new sid, db_name, etc.
create new password file

startup db with ORACLE_SID env variable set to new sid
create new controlfile 

...also

can I rename datafiles and logfiles in the process by putting their new
names in the create controlfile script?

thanks


-- 
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-- 
Author: Magaliff, Bill
  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).

RE: Bitmap vs btree - how to tell? how to test?

2002-05-24 Thread Anand Prakash


I am on leave from May 27 to July 15. Please contact Jaspreet Jajj at
x4338 for any query. Thanks.

Anand Prakash

-- 
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
-- 
Author: Anand Prakash
  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message
to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in
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also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).

Re: Database backup question.Thank You

2002-05-24 Thread Gene Sais


my backup strategy, fwiw:

prod - cold monthly, hot 2x week, exp weekly.
test - cold, hot, exp occassional, always can refresh from prod.
dev - cold  hot occassional, exp daily.

all dbs are in archivelogmode!

gene

 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 05/24/02 03:04PM 
lets not forget the classic exp.

1. Production database (where you can't lose a single
transaction) - ARCHIVEMODE absolutely

2. Development database (few hrs of transactions ok to
lose) - cold backups

3. Development database (no schema changes, say an
application is being developed with a tool such as
using Oracle designer) - a simple 'exp un/pwd' of the
user, is the simplest, quickest, lightest, least
headache,... may also be considered.

Keith

 

Date: Fri, 24 May 2002 09:12:02 -0800 
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Reply-to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Address  | Add to Address Book 
Organization: Fat City Network Services, San Diego,
California 
 
 
Hi Tim and Connor, 

Thanks you all for your very helpful feedback.  I do
appreciate it very much.  In fact, we are in
development at this point, so the database is small
and transaction volume is very low.  Therefore, my
choice for primary backup method is the cold backups. 
However, to safeguard against unsual things, which
might happen to the database, I will take your advice
to run my database in ARCHIVELOG mode. The hot backup
will be used.  Again, thanks for your very quick
responses.  

Regards, 

Trang 

  Tim Gorman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 

Trang,
 
Theoretically, the online redo log files are be
necessary, but the world has a habit of making a
shambles of the theoretical.  Let's say, in the event
that you automate your Friday script, you'll probably
come to realize that SHUTDOWN IMMEDIATE is far from
perfect (as well as far from immediate!).  Over time,
you'll probably construct some kind of fail-safe
mechanism to SHUTDOWN ABORT if the initial SHUTDOWN
IMMEDIATE doesn't shut down after a period of time. 
Pretty standard thing that DBAs have been writing for
years.  Hopefully, after the SHUTDOWN ABORT they also
STARTUP RESTRICT and then SHUTDOWN NORMAL, but you
can't count on it...
 
So, here's the point:  what if you take a cold backup
in NOARCHIVELOG mode after a SHUTDOWN ABORT (that
should have been a SHUTDOWN IMMEDIATE and wasn't) and
you have *not* backed up those online redo log files? 
Answer: unusable backup.  So, back up everything:  all
datafiles, controlfiles, and online redo logfiles. 
The latter are not too big anyway -- what's the point
of excluding them?
 
It is wise to take a cold backup after a clean
shutdown, but you can even get a valid backup after a
SHUTDOWN ABORT or a crash if you've backed up the
online redo archive log files.  When you restart
Oracle, an instance recovery will occur automatically,
and you might not even know it.  Just be certain that
the instance is truly dead when you take your cold
backup...
 
With regards to switching between ARCHIVELOG and
NOARCHIVELOG, it's a waste of effort from a
recoverability standpoint.  At most it may be
interesting, but as soon as you switch out of
ARCHIVELOG mode, nothing you've done while in
ARCHIVELOG mode is valid anymore.  Leave it one way or
the other, and then leave it...
 
...just my $0.02...
 
Another $0.02:  use RMAN for your cold backups.  Then
you won't forget anything, because RMAN will remember
for you...
 
Hope this helps...
 
-Tim
- Original Message - 
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L 
Sent: Thursday, May 23, 2002 5:33 PM


Hi All,

I need to perform a consistent backup for my whole
database every Friday by using operating system
utilities.  My database has been currently operating
in NOARCHIVELOG mode, so the only files need to be
backed up are datafiles, control files, the
initialization parameter file and other oracle product
initialization files (Based on Oracle8.1.6 Backup and
Recovery Guide).  Since the files in this type of
backup are all consistent and do not need recovery, so
the online logs are not needed.  Since online redo
logs is very crucial for recovery, so my question is
do I need to back up the online redo log files as I
choose to perform cold backup type for my entire
database weekly?  Here is step by step what I did to
back up the whole database:

after the database was closed cleanly and all the
above mentioned files had been backed up into the
tape.  I had to restart the database and mount but not
open, then switched between NOARCHIVELOG mode to
ARCHIVELOG mode in order to archive the online redo
log files.  Finally, I copied all archived redo log
files into the tape while the database was open and
operated in ARCHIVELOG mode.  when it was all done, I
then switched  the database back to NOARCHIVELOG mode.
 Just wondered whether my procedure to perform a whole
consistent database backup is correct?  Am I safe to
this point? Your help is greatly appreciated it. Your
help is greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance,

Trang

RE: Oracle and OpenVMS (was: Rename Column in 9iR2)

2002-05-24 Thread Gogala, Mladen

 -Original Message-
 From: DENNIS WILLIAMS [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
 Sent: Friday, May 24, 2002 1:23 PM
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
 Subject: RE: Oracle and OpenVMS (was: Rename Column in 9iR2)

 Mladen - I'm sorry but I'm still struggling with the part of 
 your note that
 says After all, I had to resign because I advised my boss to 
 buy MIPS R3300
 based DECSystems 5800 with  Ultrix. In slightly less then a 
 year . . .
 Let me understand. You made a recommendation, which your boss 
 accepted. Your
 company received almost a year of usage, I assume it was 
 good, reliable
 service. 

Yes it was, but they have expected more then a year.They accused me
of spending money on the computer that was desupported in less then
a year. I was working in a communist country then ( ex Yuogoslavia)
and that's how it was.

   First of all, I think you are better off not working for that
 company. 

So do I, but I still don't like when somebody sells me equipment
that gets despported in a year. DEC should have provided bug fixes
and an easy transition period. They haven't done that. I mean, I'm
driving 3 years old Hyundai and they have newer and better models now,
but I still don't have trash my car, do I? After all, I did receive
4 years of good service but they keep providing spare parts like AC,
transmission, gas pump and alike (I haven't needed them yet). I would
really hate if they told me that I will not be able to obtain spare
parts and that I have to buy a new Sonata, because this one is getting
desupported.
 Second, other that the salesman's opinion, why do 
 you say that was
 the wrong system? Were there other issues, possibly involving 
 his wife? I

Nope. The system was SMP, but Ultrix has never successfully done it. 
There were numerous bugs and DEC wasn't providing bug fixes any more.
Soon IDEAS, Oracle and ArcInfo desupported it and there was no software
for the box. 

 can only think of all the idiots that have been promoted for 
 suggesting the
 wrong system. Third, I'm kinda glad that nobody has asked my 
 opinion of what
 system should be purchased (well, aside from an Altos server 
 running a Z-80,
 but that worked out well, but again, NO upgrade path), and in 
 the future I'm
 going to be very careful not to give anybody the idea that 
 I'm offering an
 opinion unless it is clearly required by my job description.

Good principle which I've learned the hard way.
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RE: Database backup question.Thank You

2002-05-24 Thread Kevin Lange


If you truely mean that ALL of your databases are in ArchiveLog Mode, why
would you do that to your Test and Dev databases ?

-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, May 24, 2002 2:33 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


my backup strategy, fwiw:

prod - cold monthly, hot 2x week, exp weekly.
test - cold, hot, exp occassional, always can refresh from prod.
dev - cold  hot occassional, exp daily.

all dbs are in archivelogmode!

gene

 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 05/24/02 03:04PM 
lets not forget the classic exp.

1. Production database (where you can't lose a single
transaction) - ARCHIVEMODE absolutely

2. Development database (few hrs of transactions ok to
lose) - cold backups

3. Development database (no schema changes, say an
application is being developed with a tool such as
using Oracle designer) - a simple 'exp un/pwd' of the
user, is the simplest, quickest, lightest, least
headache,... may also be considered.

Keith

 

Date: Fri, 24 May 2002 09:12:02 -0800 
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Reply-to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Address  | Add to Address Book 
Organization: Fat City Network Services, San Diego,
California 
 
 
Hi Tim and Connor, 

Thanks you all for your very helpful feedback.  I do
appreciate it very much.  In fact, we are in
development at this point, so the database is small
and transaction volume is very low.  Therefore, my
choice for primary backup method is the cold backups. 
However, to safeguard against unsual things, which
might happen to the database, I will take your advice
to run my database in ARCHIVELOG mode. The hot backup
will be used.  Again, thanks for your very quick
responses.  

Regards, 

Trang 

  Tim Gorman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 

Trang,
 
Theoretically, the online redo log files are be
necessary, but the world has a habit of making a
shambles of the theoretical.  Let's say, in the event
that you automate your Friday script, you'll probably
come to realize that SHUTDOWN IMMEDIATE is far from
perfect (as well as far from immediate!).  Over time,
you'll probably construct some kind of fail-safe
mechanism to SHUTDOWN ABORT if the initial SHUTDOWN
IMMEDIATE doesn't shut down after a period of time. 
Pretty standard thing that DBAs have been writing for
years.  Hopefully, after the SHUTDOWN ABORT they also
STARTUP RESTRICT and then SHUTDOWN NORMAL, but you
can't count on it...
 
So, here's the point:  what if you take a cold backup
in NOARCHIVELOG mode after a SHUTDOWN ABORT (that
should have been a SHUTDOWN IMMEDIATE and wasn't) and
you have *not* backed up those online redo log files? 
Answer: unusable backup.  So, back up everything:  all
datafiles, controlfiles, and online redo logfiles. 
The latter are not too big anyway -- what's the point
of excluding them?
 
It is wise to take a cold backup after a clean
shutdown, but you can even get a valid backup after a
SHUTDOWN ABORT or a crash if you've backed up the
online redo archive log files.  When you restart
Oracle, an instance recovery will occur automatically,
and you might not even know it.  Just be certain that
the instance is truly dead when you take your cold
backup...
 
With regards to switching between ARCHIVELOG and
NOARCHIVELOG, it's a waste of effort from a
recoverability standpoint.  At most it may be
interesting, but as soon as you switch out of
ARCHIVELOG mode, nothing you've done while in
ARCHIVELOG mode is valid anymore.  Leave it one way or
the other, and then leave it...
 
...just my $0.02...
 
Another $0.02:  use RMAN for your cold backups.  Then
you won't forget anything, because RMAN will remember
for you...
 
Hope this helps...
 
-Tim
- Original Message - 
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L 
Sent: Thursday, May 23, 2002 5:33 PM


Hi All,

I need to perform a consistent backup for my whole
database every Friday by using operating system
utilities.  My database has been currently operating
in NOARCHIVELOG mode, so the only files need to be
backed up are datafiles, control files, the
initialization parameter file and other oracle product
initialization files (Based on Oracle8.1.6 Backup and
Recovery Guide).  Since the files in this type of
backup are all consistent and do not need recovery, so
the online logs are not needed.  Since online redo
logs is very crucial for recovery, so my question is
do I need to back up the online redo log files as I
choose to perform cold backup type for my entire
database weekly?  Here is step by step what I did to
back up the whole database:

after the database was closed cleanly and all the
above mentioned files had been backed up into the
tape.  I had to restart the database and mount but not
open, then switched between NOARCHIVELOG mode to
ARCHIVELOG mode in order to archive the online redo
log files.  Finally, I copied all archived redo log
files into the tape while the database was open and
operated in ARCHIVELOG mode.  when it was all done, I
then switched  the database back to NOARCHIVELOG mode.
 Just

Re: Bitmap vs btree - how to tell? how to test?



He's just been put in digest mode.  

It's good to be king.  ;)

Jared

On Friday 24 May 2002 11:28, Thomas Day wrote:
 LOL

 Autoreply.

 I hope that they can block this guy PDQ or we'll be swamped.





 Anand Prakash
 AnandPrakashTo: Multiple recipients of
 list ORACLE-L @firsthealth.[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 com cc:
 Sent by: rootSubject: Re: Bitmap vs btree -
 how to tell? how to test?

 05/24/2002
 02:00 PM
 Please
 respond to
 ORACLE-L






 I am on leave from May 29 to July 15. Please contact Jaspreet Jajj at
 x4338 for any query. Thanks.

 Anand Prakash

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Re: so when did you switch from NT to unix for oracle



1)  Not pulling any legs.  That's what we run.

2) We have a few reasons to switch to another platform.
I'm lobbying for Solaris with Veritas Database Edition.  Many
good reasons for doing so, but I'm beginning to have my 
doubts about financing it.

One of our current projects is to put in place an enterprise
class backup and recovery system. The current one is lacking
in several respects.

One of damagement's questions: What happens if we do nothing?

Another was What's the ROI?

PHB's abound.

Jared

On Friday 24 May 2002 08:03, Hemant K Chitale wrote:
 No way !  You're pulling a lot of legs
 [and hurting a lot of egos who take pride in
 pointing out that NT is _not_ an enterprise-class
 platform, me included].

 Hemant K Chitale

 - Original Message -
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Sent: Friday, 24 May, 2002 8:00 AM

  How about 250 Gig, 450 users on SAP 4.0B?
 
  4 Cpu's 2 Gig Ram.
 
  Stop making me defend NT!!
 
  Jared
 
 
 
 
 
  Disser, Arno [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  05/23/2002 10:23 AM
  Please respond to ORACLE-L
 
 
  To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L

 [EMAIL PROTECTED]

  cc:
  Subject:RE: so when did you switch from NT to unix for

 oracle

  Here are my 0.02EUR
 
  Turn this reasoning around: Why would anyone use NT for a serious Oracle
  DB-server?
  Okay, for some minor development perhaps, but for an production
  environment?
 
  b.t.w., ever considered a switch to VMS?
 
  Arno Disser
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Multiple ennvironments with Portal and 9iAS

2002-05-24 Thread paquette stephane


Hi all,

The client has a dev, test, maintenance, QA and prod
environments. Each environment consist of a pipeline
of several applications.

QA and prod have their own independant pipelines with 
their own servers with Oracle 9i, Oracle 8i, Workflow,
Portal and 9iAS

Dev, test and maintenance shares 4 servers.
We would like to have dev, test and maintenance to
have their pipelines with a maximum of independance.

Do you suggest to install 1 setup of Portal and 9iAS
to serve the 3 environments or to install 3 copies of
Portal and 9iAS ?



=
Stéphane Paquette
DBA Oracle, consultant entrepôt de données
Oracle DBA, datawarehouse consultant
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

___
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Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com
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Re: Database backup question.


On Thursday 23 May 2002 20:13, Tim Gorman wrote:
...

 So, here's the point:  what if you take a cold backup in NOARCHIVELOG mode
 after a SHUTDOWN ABORT (that should have been a SHUTDOWN IMMEDIATE and
 wasn't) and you have *not* backed up those online redo log files?  Answer:
 unusable backup.  So, back up everything:  all datafiles, controlfiles, and
 online redo logfiles.  The latter are not too big anyway -- what's the
 point of excluding them?


I have on more than one occasion been glad to have the online redo
logs backed up.  The common wisdom is that you don't need them.

For various reasons they have at times made the difference between
a recoverable backup and an unrecoverable backup.

Particularly on NT, where there is no dearth of people that really don't
know what they are doing with databases.

Jared
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Re: changing db name

2002-05-24 Thread Thomas Day



Having done this on AIX with 7.3.4 several year ago ---

You don't mention TNSNAMES.ORA or LISTENER.ORA --- Those need to be changed
also.

You change the names of the data files and log files using the operating
system, then edit the controlfile script to reflect those new names.  Of
course the database has to be shut down before you can do this.
Alternatively, with the database up but closed you can --
To rename datafiles in multiple tablespaces, follow these steps.
   1.  Ensure that the database is mounted but closed.
   2.  Copy the datafiles to be renamed to their new locations and new
 names, using the operating system.
   3.  Use ALTER DATABASE to rename the file pointers in the database's
 control file.


 For example, the following statement renames the
 datafiles/u02/oracle/rbdb1/sort01.dbf and /u02/oracle/rbdb1/user3.dbf
 to /u02/oracle/rbdb1/temp01.dbf and /u02/oracle/rbdb1/users03.dbf,
 respectively:


 ALTER DATABASE
 RENAME FILE '/u02/oracle/rbdb1/sort01.dbf',
 '/u02/oracle/rbdb1/user3.dbf'
  TO '/u02/oracle/rbdb1/temp01.dbf',
 '/u02/oracle/rbdb1/users03.dbf;




 The new files must already exist; this statement does not create the
 files. Also, always provide complete filenames (including their paths)
 to properly identify the old and new datafiles. In particular, specify
 the old datafile name exactly as it appears in the DBA_DATA_FILES view
 of the data dictionary.
   4.  Back up the database. After making any structural changes to a
 database, always perform an immediate and complete backup. 

Then you won't have to worry about that in the controlfile script.



   

Magaliff, 

BillTo: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L  

Bill.Magalif[EMAIL PROTECTED]

fcc:   

@lendware.comSubject: changing db name 

  

Sent by: root  

   

   

05/24/2002 

03:08 PM   

Please 

respond to 

ORACLE-L   

   

   





I saw a post on MetaLink (Note 15390.1) about changing db_name and
oracle_sid without recreating the db's.

my question is if I want to change the db_name, do I first need to change
the SID?  Or can I do it in one fell swoop, as follows:

backup controlfile to trace
edit file to create new controlfile using set database newdbname
rename initsid.ora with new sid
edit init.ora file with new controlfile names and new sid, db_name, etc.
create new password file

startup db with ORACLE_SID env variable set to new sid
create new controlfile

...also

can I rename datafiles and logfiles in the process by putting their new
names in the create controlfile script?

thanks


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To REMOVE yourself from this

Re: Oracle and OpenVMS (was: Rename Column in 9iR2)

2002-05-24 Thread Stephane Faroult


Gogala, Mladen wrote:
  system should be purchased (well, aside from an Altos server
  running a Z-80,
  but that worked out well, but again, NO upgrade path), and in
  the future I'm
  going to be very careful not to give anybody the idea that
  I'm offering an
  opinion unless it is clearly required by my job description.
 
 Good principle which I've learned the hard way.

Unless, that is, you are an external consultant, in which case you
invoice and run away.
When I still was a student, back in 1983, one of our teachers told us
that, as far as hardware was concerned, there only were IBM and DEC,
because you could then be certain that those two would be around in 5
years time, and much less so about the others. At this time, he was
right.
-- 
Regards,

Stephane Faroult
Oriole Software
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RE: so when did you switch from NT to unix for oracle

2002-05-24 Thread Gogala, Mladen



 PHB's abound.
 

Who are PHB's? (Just kidding, don't worry, I'm not trying to 
move to the damagement.
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Re: Database backup question.Thank You

2002-05-24 Thread Stephane Faroult


Kevin Lange wrote:
 
 If you truely mean that ALL of your databases are in ArchiveLog Mode, why
 would you do that to your Test and Dev databases ?
 
 -Original Message-
 Sent: Friday, May 24, 2002 2:33 PM
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
 
 my backup strategy, fwiw:
 
 prod - cold monthly, hot 2x week, exp weekly.
 test - cold, hot, exp occassional, always can refresh from prod.
 dev - cold  hot occassional, exp daily.
 
 all dbs are in archivelogmode!
 
 gene
 

It's sound practice to test that you can use your backups to recover.

-- 
Regards,

Stephane Faroult
Oriole Software
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Re: Database backup question.Thank You

2002-05-24 Thread Meomeo Nguyen

Thank you all for your responses.You all really confused me about this issue.The whole database backups can be consistentor inconsistent.To perform a consistent whole databse backup is the only valid backup option for databases running in NOARCHIVELOG mode. In contrast,an inconsistent backup is valid if the database is running in ARCHIVELOG mode. So,myquestionis whyhaving my databse running in the ARCHIVELOG mode, I can still perform both consistent and inconsistent backupoptions?
Steve posted :
"I don't understandy why you would switch to and from archivelog mode. You can establish a complete cold backup with your datafiles, control files, and online redo logs. Actually you don't need the online redo logs, but that used to be the case so I always back those up as well. Shut your DB down (normal), and back these files up. That is a complete cold backup."
Steve, I switch to and from archivelog mode because the best way to back up the contents of the current online redo log is always to archive it, then back up the archived logs. Again, I do appreciate you all for your help. I do need very clear picture about this issue. Since I have not done anything like this before so I do need your feedback badly.
Thanks in advance
Trang
Gene Sais [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
my backup strategy, fwiw:prod - cold monthly, hot 2x week, exp weekly.test - cold, hot, exp occassional, always can refresh from prod.dev - cold hot occassional, exp daily.all dbs are in archivelogmode!gene [EMAIL PROTECTED] 05/24/02 03:04PM lets not forget the classic "exp".1. Production database (where you can't lose a singletransaction) - ARCHIVEMODE absolutely2. Development database (few hrs of transactions ok tolose) - cold backups3. Development database (no schema changes, say anapplication is being developed with a tool such asusing Oracle designer) - a simple 'exp un/pwd' of theuser, is the simplest, quickest, lightest, leastheadache,... may also be considered.KeithDate: Fri, 24 May 2002 09:12:02 -0800 To!
!
: "Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L"<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>Reply-to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Address | Add to Address Book Organization: Fat City Network Services, San Diego,California Hi Tim and Connor, Thanks you all for your very helpful feedback. I doappreciate it very much. In fact, we are indevelopment at this point, so the database is smalland transaction volume is very low. Therefore, mychoice for primary backup method is the cold backups. However, to safeguard against unsual things, whichmight happen to the database, I will take your adviceto run my database in ARCHIVELOG mode. The hot backupwill be used. Again, thanks for your very quickresponses. Regards, Trang Tim Gorman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>wrote: Trang,Theoretically, the online redo log files are benecessary, but the world has a habit of making ashambles of the theoretical. Let's say, in the e!
!
ventthat you automate your Friday script, you'll probablycome to realize that SHUTDOWN IMMEDIATE is far fromperfect (as well as far from immediate!). Over time,you'll probably construct some kind of "fail-safe"mechanism to SHUTDOWN ABORT if the initial SHUTDOWNIMMEDIATE doesn't shut down after a period of time. Pretty standard thing that DBAs have been writing foryears. Hopefully, after the SHUTDOWN ABORT they alsoSTARTUP RESTRICT and then SHUTDOWN NORMAL, but youcan't count on it...So, here's the point: what if you take a cold backupin NOARCHIVELOG mode after a SHUTDOWN ABORT (thatshould have been a SHUTDOWN IMMEDIATE and wasn't) andyou have *not* backed up those online redo log files? Answer: unusable backup. So, back up everything: alldatafiles, controlfiles, and online redo logfiles. The latter are not too big anyway -- what's the pointof excluding them?It is wise to take a cold backup afte!
!
r a cleanshutdown, but you can even get a valid backup after aSHUTDOWN ABORT or a crash if you've backed up theonline redo archive log files. When you restartOracle, an instance recovery will occur automatically,and you might not even know it. Just be certain thatthe instance is truly "dead" when you take your "cold"backup...With regards to switching between ARCHIVELOG andNOARCHIVELOG, it's a waste of effort from arecoverability standpoint. At most it may beinteresting, but as soon as you switch out ofARCHIVELOG mode, nothing you've done while inARCHIVELOG mode is valid anymore. Leave it one way orthe other, and then leave it..just my $0.02...Another $0.02: use RMAN for your cold backups. Thenyou won't forget anything, because RMAN will rememberfor you...Hope this helps...-Tim- Original Message - To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Sent: Thursday, Ma!
!
y 23, 2002 5:33 PMHi All,I need to perform a consistent backup for my wholedatabase every Friday by using operating systemutilities. My database has been currently operatingin NOARCHIVELOG mode, so the only files need to bebacked up are datafiles, control files, theinitialization parameter file and other oracle

RE: Database backup question.

2002-05-24 Thread Sherman, Paul R.


Jared,

What in the W is a PHB ? Inquiring minds want to know.

Thank you,

Paul Sherman
DBAElcom, Inc.
email - [EMAIL PROTECTED]


-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, May 24, 2002 4:25 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


On Thursday 23 May 2002 20:13, Tim Gorman wrote:
...

 So, here's the point:  what if you take a cold backup in NOARCHIVELOG mode
 after a SHUTDOWN ABORT (that should have been a SHUTDOWN IMMEDIATE and
 wasn't) and you have *not* backed up those online redo log files?  Answer:
 unusable backup.  So, back up everything:  all datafiles, controlfiles,
and
 online redo logfiles.  The latter are not too big anyway -- what's the
 point of excluding them?


I have on more than one occasion been glad to have the online redo
logs backed up.  The common wisdom is that you don't need them.

For various reasons they have at times made the difference between
a recoverable backup and an unrecoverable backup.

Particularly on NT, where there is no dearth of people that really don't
know what they are doing with databases.

Jared
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RE: Oracle and OpenVMS (was: Rename Column in 9iR2)


Mladen - Thanks for replying. And I thought formerly communist countries
would have had the socialist idea that nobody ever lost their job. How naive
of me I'm hoping that you are in a better job situation today.
Actually, I've always wondered if organizations in foreign companies
sometimes get shafted into unwittingly buying obsolete US products. I
formerly worked at Control Data. When it was on the verge of ceasing its
proprietary hardware business, they were still selling their largest
mainframes to existing customers that were trying to forestall the eventual
conversion, but no new US customers were coming forward. But the company
newsletters were trumpeting new foreign customers like the government of
Thailand, and I wondered how they would feel when the inevitable closing
came.
Just to keep this on Oracle, I thing that when we look at new
platforms, we need to look into the future. For example, many RISC
manufacturers have conceded that they can't compete against Intel's deep
pockets and are switching to the Itanium for the next generation. This may
presage their switch to Linux, since if they are all on the same hardware,
it doesn't make sense for them to maintain their own Unix version. Also,
with a lot of people in the industry counting on the success of the Itanium,
all bets are off if it flops. But as you point out, making hardware
recommendations doesn't come without a cost. Personally I'm going to
remember that moral for awhile, probably being less irritated when my
suggestions are ignored.
Dennis Williams
DBA
Lifetouch, Inc.
[EMAIL PROTECTED]


-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, May 24, 2002 2:48 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L




 -Original Message-
 From: DENNIS WILLIAMS [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
 Sent: Friday, May 24, 2002 1:23 PM
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
 Subject: RE: Oracle and OpenVMS (was: Rename Column in 9iR2)
 
 
 Mladen - I'm sorry but I'm still struggling with the part of 
 your note that
 says After all, I had to resign because I advised my boss to 
 buy MIPS R3300
 based DECSystems 5800 with  Ultrix. In slightly less then a 
 year . . .
 Let me understand. You made a recommendation, which your boss 
 accepted. Your
 company received almost a year of usage, I assume it was 
 good, reliable
 service. 

Yes it was, but they have expected more then a year.They accused me
of spending money on the computer that was desupported in less then
a year. I was working in a communist country then ( ex Yuogoslavia)
and that's how it was.


   First of all, I think you are better off not working for that
 company. 

So do I, but I still don't like when somebody sells me equipment
that gets despported in a year. DEC should have provided bug fixes
and an easy transition period. They haven't done that. I mean, I'm
driving 3 years old Hyundai and they have newer and better models now,
but I still don't have trash my car, do I? After all, I did receive
4 years of good service but they keep providing spare parts like AC,
transmission, gas pump and alike (I haven't needed them yet). I would
really hate if they told me that I will not be able to obtain spare
parts and that I have to buy a new Sonata, because this one is getting
desupported.
 Second, other that the salesman's opinion, why do 
 you say that was
 the wrong system? Were there other issues, possibly involving 
 his wife? I

Nope. The system was SMP, but Ultrix has never successfully done it. 
There were numerous bugs and DEC wasn't providing bug fixes any more.
Soon IDEAS, Oracle and ArcInfo desupported it and there was no software
for the box. 


 can only think of all the idiots that have been promoted for 
 suggesting the
 wrong system. Third, I'm kinda glad that nobody has asked my 
 opinion of what
 system should be purchased (well, aside from an Altos server 
 running a Z-80,
 but that worked out well, but again, NO upgrade path), and in 
 the future I'm
 going to be very careful not to give anybody the idea that 
 I'm offering an
 opinion unless it is clearly required by my job description.

Good principle which I've learned the hard way.
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Re: Diagnose Slow System

2002-05-24 Thread Greg Moore


 the YAPP analyzer at www.oraperf.com anyways..

The last part of the oraperf report has suggestions for items to investigate
and tune.  Is oraperf really good at spotting the key tuning opportunities?



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RE: Database backup question.Thank You

2002-05-24 Thread Gene Sais


b/c the dba has to develop and test on occassion :).  i like all dbs the same.  oracle 
is much friendlier to various recoveries in archivelogmode.  besides, i generate  
.01% of the archives i generate in prod.  i can afford a few mb.  again, this is my 
strategy, one of many.  whether its best or worst, its the one i feel most comfortable 
w/.

hth,
gene

ps. exports are very impt to developers.  its the easiest way to restore 1 object.

 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 05/24/02 04:03PM 
If you truely mean that ALL of your databases are in ArchiveLog Mode, why
would you do that to your Test and Dev databases ?

-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, May 24, 2002 2:33 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


my backup strategy, fwiw:

prod - cold monthly, hot 2x week, exp weekly.
test - cold, hot, exp occassional, always can refresh from prod.
dev - cold  hot occassional, exp daily.

all dbs are in archivelogmode!

gene

 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 05/24/02 03:04PM 
lets not forget the classic exp.

1. Production database (where you can't lose a single
transaction) - ARCHIVEMODE absolutely

2. Development database (few hrs of transactions ok to
lose) - cold backups

3. Development database (no schema changes, say an
application is being developed with a tool such as
using Oracle designer) - a simple 'exp un/pwd' of the
user, is the simplest, quickest, lightest, least
headache,... may also be considered.

Keith

 

Date: Fri, 24 May 2002 09:12:02 -0800 
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Reply-to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Address  | Add to Address Book 
Organization: Fat City Network Services, San Diego,
California 
 
 
Hi Tim and Connor, 

Thanks you all for your very helpful feedback.  I do
appreciate it very much.  In fact, we are in
development at this point, so the database is small
and transaction volume is very low.  Therefore, my
choice for primary backup method is the cold backups. 
However, to safeguard against unsual things, which
might happen to the database, I will take your advice
to run my database in ARCHIVELOG mode. The hot backup
will be used.  Again, thanks for your very quick
responses.  

Regards, 

Trang 

  Tim Gorman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 

Trang,
 
Theoretically, the online redo log files are be
necessary, but the world has a habit of making a
shambles of the theoretical.  Let's say, in the event
that you automate your Friday script, you'll probably
come to realize that SHUTDOWN IMMEDIATE is far from
perfect (as well as far from immediate!).  Over time,
you'll probably construct some kind of fail-safe
mechanism to SHUTDOWN ABORT if the initial SHUTDOWN
IMMEDIATE doesn't shut down after a period of time. 
Pretty standard thing that DBAs have been writing for
years.  Hopefully, after the SHUTDOWN ABORT they also
STARTUP RESTRICT and then SHUTDOWN NORMAL, but you
can't count on it...
 
So, here's the point:  what if you take a cold backup
in NOARCHIVELOG mode after a SHUTDOWN ABORT (that
should have been a SHUTDOWN IMMEDIATE and wasn't) and
you have *not* backed up those online redo log files? 
Answer: unusable backup.  So, back up everything:  all
datafiles, controlfiles, and online redo logfiles. 
The latter are not too big anyway -- what's the point
of excluding them?
 
It is wise to take a cold backup after a clean
shutdown, but you can even get a valid backup after a
SHUTDOWN ABORT or a crash if you've backed up the
online redo archive log files.  When you restart
Oracle, an instance recovery will occur automatically,
and you might not even know it.  Just be certain that
the instance is truly dead when you take your cold
backup...
 
With regards to switching between ARCHIVELOG and
NOARCHIVELOG, it's a waste of effort from a
recoverability standpoint.  At most it may be
interesting, but as soon as you switch out of
ARCHIVELOG mode, nothing you've done while in
ARCHIVELOG mode is valid anymore.  Leave it one way or
the other, and then leave it...
 
...just my $0.02...
 
Another $0.02:  use RMAN for your cold backups.  Then
you won't forget anything, because RMAN will remember
for you...
 
Hope this helps...
 
-Tim
- Original Message - 
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L 
Sent: Thursday, May 23, 2002 5:33 PM


Hi All,

I need to perform a consistent backup for my whole
database every Friday by using operating system
utilities.  My database has been currently operating
in NOARCHIVELOG mode, so the only files need to be
backed up are datafiles, control files, the
initialization parameter file and other oracle product
initialization files (Based on Oracle8.1.6 Backup and
Recovery Guide).  Since the files in this type of
backup are all consistent and do not need recovery, so
the online logs are not needed.  Since online redo
logs is very crucial for recovery, so my question is
do I need to back up the online redo log files as I
choose to perform cold backup type for my entire
database weekly?  Here is step by step what I did to
back up the whole database:

RE: Database backup question.

2002-05-24 Thread Whittle Jerome Contr NCI

Title: RE: Database backup question.






Paul,


There's a comic strip about office life called Dilbert. PHB stands for Pointy-Hair Boss. You can check it out at the site below. This week the PHB has been demoted back to worker-bee.

 http://www.dilbert.com/


Jerry Whittle

ACIFICS DBA

NCI Information Systems Inc.

[EMAIL PROTECTED]

618-622-4145


-Original Message-

From: Sherman, Paul R. [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]

Sent: Friday, May 24, 2002 3:59 PM

To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L

Subject: RE: Database backup question.


Jared,


What in the W is a PHB ? Inquiring minds want to know.


Thank you,


Paul Sherman

DBA Elcom, Inc.

email - [EMAIL PROTECTED]

RE: Database backup question.

2002-05-24 Thread Gogala, Mladen

 -Original Message-
 From: Sherman, Paul R. [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
 Sent: Friday, May 24, 2002 4:59 PM
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
 Subject: RE: Database backup question.

 Jared,

 What in the W is a PHB ? Inquiring minds want to know.

PHP is an abbreviation for Pointy Haired Boss, who is a shining example
of damagement and lives at http://www.dilbert.com
I cannot believe this!? There is actually somebody who doesn't know 
who is PHB? What is next? You will tell me that you don't know the
answer to the question of life, universe and everything?
-- 
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-- 
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RE: Statistical sampling and representative stats collection

2002-05-24 Thread John Kanagaraj


Hi Jack,

 One question - you mention that an index analyze
 provides beter data distribution. Could you discuss
 what you found in more detail?

What I meant was that the Histograms that are created during an
ANALYZE/COMPUTE on Indexes will provide an almost perfect picture of the
data distribution in such columns. Under _some_ circumstances, the CBO will
be able to use this information to decide the best path (FTS or Indexed
read). On the other hand, and simply stated, when bind variables are used in
a cursor, this information about data distribution is not used since the
value of the bind variable is not used during the parse prior to 9i. In
other words, the access plan is built without considering the value of bind
variables that would have otherwise influenced the plan when histograms (and
thus information about data distribution) is avialable. However, 9i kinda
rectifies this and I quote from the Fine Manual: (Oracle9i: Database
Performance Guide and Reference)

Cursor Sharing Enhancements
The CBO now peeks at the values of user-defined bind variables on the first
invocation of a cursor. This lets the optimizer determine the selectivity of
any
WHERE clause condition, as well as if literals had been used instead of bind
variables. When bind variables are used in a statement, it is assumed that
cursor
sharing is intended and that different invocations are supposed to use the
same
execution plan.

This gives us the best of both worlds (in some cases). Of course, it all
depends on the number of buckets defined for Histograms and the width of the
data spread (and that is why I emphasized _some_ and 'simply stated' above).

I haven't tested this extensively, and I would appreciate any further inputs
from the Gurus! (For the rest of us: A 10053 trace should show up what's
happening. There was a _great_ presentation from Wolfgang Breitling on this
topic at the recent IOUG).

Btw: Searching for 'bucket' in the 8i SQL reference came up with the NTILE
function (new in 8i), and I said Wow! because I was looking for such a
function. Goes to say that we need to read the fine manuals more than we
normally do!

John Kanagaraj
Oracle Applications DBA
DBSoft Inc
(W): 408-970-7002

The manuals for Oracle are here: http://tahiti.oracle.com
The manual for Life is here: http://www.gospelcom.net

** The opinions and statements above are entirely my own and not those of my
employer or clients **


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RE: Database backup question.

2002-05-24 Thread Jesse, Rich


Actually, *PHB* is Pointy-Haired Boss.  *PHP* is a cool scripting
language.  PCP is Phencyclidin, aka Angel Dust.

DNB is DBA Need Beer.

TTFN!

Rich Jesse   System/Database Administrator
[EMAIL PROTECTED]  Quad/Tech International, Sussex, WI USA


 -Original Message-
 From: Gogala, Mladen [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
 Sent: Friday, May 24, 2002 4:54 PM
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
 Subject: RE: Database backup question.
 
 
 
 
  -Original Message-
  From: Sherman, Paul R. [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
  Sent: Friday, May 24, 2002 4:59 PM
  To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
  Subject: RE: Database backup question.
  
  
  Jared,
  
  What in the W is a PHB ? Inquiring minds want to know.
  
 
 PHP is an abbreviation for Pointy Haired Boss, who is a 
-- 
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
-- 
Author: Jesse, Rich
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RE: Database backup question.

2002-05-24 Thread Sherman, Paul R.


Mladen,

It's not my fault. My karma was in the wrong quadrant as I read Jared's
e-mail, and to make matters worse, the universal constant had become
inconsistent.

However, I do have all the answers that you seek. Simply send $1 million and
I will reveal all.

Thank you,

Paul Sherman
DBAElcom, Inc.
voice -  781-501-4143 (direct #)
fax-  781-278-8341 (secure)
email - [EMAIL PROTECTED]


-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, May 24, 2002 5:54 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L




 -Original Message-
 From: Sherman, Paul R. [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
 Sent: Friday, May 24, 2002 4:59 PM
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
 Subject: RE: Database backup question.
 
 
 Jared,
 
 What in the W is a PHB ? Inquiring minds want to know.
 

PHP is an abbreviation for Pointy Haired Boss, who is a shining example
of damagement and lives at http://www.dilbert.com
I cannot believe this!? There is actually somebody who doesn't know 
who is PHB? What is next? You will tell me that you don't know the
answer to the question of life, universe and everything?
-- 
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
-- 
Author: Gogala, Mladen
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Re: Database backup question.

2002-05-24 Thread Joe Testa

42

Gogala, Mladen wrote:

-Original Message-
From: Sherman, Paul R. [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Friday, May 24, 2002 4:59 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
Subject: RE: Database backup question.

Jared,

What in the W is a PHB ? Inquiring minds want to know.

PHP is an abbreviation for Pointy Haired Boss, who is a shining example
of damagement and lives at http://www.dilbert.com
I cannot believe this!? There is actually somebody who doesn't know 
who is PHB? What is next? You will tell me that you don't know the
answer to the question of life, universe and everything?

-- 
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
-- 
Author: Joe Testa
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RE: Database backup question.

2002-05-24 Thread Gene Sais


dont forget DBA=DrinkBeerAgain

Happy Memorial Day (a day to remember those who gave us this freedom)!

Gene

*Semper Fi*

 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 05/24/02 06:15PM 
Actually, *PHB* is Pointy-Haired Boss.  *PHP* is a cool scripting
language.  PCP is Phencyclidin, aka Angel Dust.

DNB is DBA Need Beer.

TTFN!

Rich Jesse   System/Database Administrator
[EMAIL PROTECTED]  Quad/Tech International, Sussex, WI USA


 -Original Message-
 From: Gogala, Mladen [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] 
 Sent: Friday, May 24, 2002 4:54 PM
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
 Subject: RE: Database backup question.
 
 
 
 
  -Original Message-
  From: Sherman, Paul R. [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] 
  Sent: Friday, May 24, 2002 4:59 PM
  To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
  Subject: RE: Database backup question.
  
  
  Jared,
  
  What in the W is a PHB ? Inquiring minds want to know.
  
 
 PHP is an abbreviation for Pointy Haired Boss, who is a 
-- 
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com 
-- 
Author: Jesse, Rich
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RE: Database backup question.

2002-05-24 Thread JoJo Al-Zawawi


Paul,

Haven't you seen Austin Powers ?  $ 1 million isn't very much these days.
You need to up your rates.

Cheers,
JoJo


-Original Message-
R.

Mladen,

It's not my fault. My karma was in the wrong quadrant as I read Jared's
e-mail, and to make matters worse, the universal constant had become
inconsistent.

However, I do have all the answers that you seek. Simply send $1 million and
I will reveal all.

Thank you,

Paul Sherman
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RE: newbie seeks career direction: become a DBA or DEVELOPER?

2002-05-24 Thread Sherry Lopata

Thanks for the tip.
Have a great weekend!
Sherry

From: JoJo Al-Zawawi [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: newbie seeks career direction: become a DBA or DEVELOPER?
Date: Wed, 22 May 2002 17:23:23 -0800

Hi Sherry !

I understand that Washington Mutual often hires entry-level Oracle DBA's.
Try them!

Cheers,
JoJo (Glendale, CA)
http://www.jojo-zawawi.com

-Original Message-
Lopata
Sent: Wednesday, May 22, 2002 5:33 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L

Hi gurus,
I have taken a few Oracle DBA courses at UCLA Extension, passed my first 
DBA

certification exam, but have not been able to find an entry level position
in this area. (My background is in printing and marketing... big career
move...  I've been told my timing is bad cause the job market is bad
here).
It was suggested to me, by someone at the LA Oracle User Group meeting, 
that

I become an Oracle Developer first. Is this the path you recommend?
Although I liked the UCLA classes, I was dissappointed that the Career
Center was off limits to the Extension students. Can you suggest any
better/cheaper classes in Southern California? Any with career placement?
I have acquired many of the books that have been suggested in these 
postings

and have learned much by being a subscriber to this mailing list.
Thanks in advance!
SL
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_
Join the worlds largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. 
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Re: Database backup question.Thank You



Meomeo,

Your confusion will be eliminated by acquiring 'Oracle Backup and
Recovery Handbook' by Rama Velpuri.

Read it:  do all of the examples.

There is *no* other way.

Jared

On Friday 24 May 2002 13:53, Meomeo Nguyen wrote:
 Thank you all for your responses.  You all really confused me about this
 issue.  The whole database backups can be consistent or inconsistent.  To
 perform a consistent whole databse backup is the only valid backup option
 for databases running in NOARCHIVELOG mode.  In contrast, an inconsistent
 backup is valid if the database is running in ARCHIVELOG mode.  So, my
 question is why having my databse running in the ARCHIVELOG mode, I can
 still perform both consistent and inconsistent backup options? Steve posted
 :
 I don't understandy why you would switch to and from archivelog mode.  You
 can establish a complete cold backup with your datafiles, control files,
 and online redo logs.  Actually you don't need the online redo logs, but
 that used to be the case so I always back those up as well.  Shut your DB
 down (normal), and back these files up.   That is a complete cold backup.
 Steve, I switch to and from archivelog mode because the best way to back up
 the contents of the current online redo log is always to archive it, then
 back up the archived logs.  Again, I do appreciate you all for your help. 
 I do need very clear picture about this issue.  Since I have not done
 anything like this before so I do need your feedback badly. Thanks in
 advance
 Trang

   Gene Sais [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: my backup strategy, fwiw:

 prod - cold monthly, hot 2x week, exp weekly.
 test - cold, hot, exp occassional, always can refresh from prod.
 dev - cold  hot occassional, exp daily.

 all dbs are in archivelogmode!

 gene

  [EMAIL PROTECTED] 05/24/02 03:04PM 

 lets not forget the classic exp.

 1. Production database (where you can't lose a single
 transaction) - ARCHIVEMODE absolutely

 2. Development database (few hrs of transactions ok to
 lose) - cold backups

 3. Development database (no schema changes, say an
 application is being developed with a tool such as
 using Oracle designer) - a simple 'exp un/pwd' of the
 user, is the simplest, quickest, lightest, least
 headache,... may also be considered.

 Keith



 Date: Fri, 24 May 2002 09:12:02 -0800
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L

 Reply-to: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Address | Add to Address Book
 Organization: Fat City Network Services, San Diego,
 California


 Hi Tim and Connor,

 Thanks you all for your very helpful feedback. I do
 appreciate it very much. In fact, we are in
 development at this point, so the database is small
 and transaction volume is very low. Therefore, my
 choice for primary backup method is the cold backups.
 However, to safeguard against unsual things, which
 might happen to the database, I will take your advice
 to run my database in ARCHIVELOG mode. The hot backup
 will be used. Again, thanks for your very quick
 responses.

 Regards,

 Trang

 Tim Gorman wrote:

 Trang,

 Theoretically, the online redo log files are be
 necessary, but the world has a habit of making a
 shambles of the theoretical. Let's say, in the event
 that you automate your Friday script, you'll probably
 come to realize that SHUTDOWN IMMEDIATE is far from
 perfect (as well as far from immediate!). Over time,
 you'll probably construct some kind of fail-safe
 mechanism to SHUTDOWN ABORT if the initial SHUTDOWN
 IMMEDIATE doesn't shut down after a period of time.
 Pretty standard thing that DBAs have been writing for
 years. Hopefully, after the SHUTDOWN ABORT they also
 STARTUP RESTRICT and then SHUTDOWN NORMAL, but you
 can't count on it...

 So, here's the point: what if you take a cold backup
 in NOARCHIVELOG mode after a SHUTDOWN ABORT (that
 should have been a SHUTDOWN IMMEDIATE and wasn't) and
 you have *not* backed up those online redo log files?
 Answer: unusable backup. So, back up everything: all
 datafiles, controlfiles, and online redo logfiles.
 The latter are not too big anyway -- what's the point
 of excluding them?

 It is wise to take a cold backup after a clean
 shutdown, but you can even get a valid backup after a
 SHUTDOWN ABORT or a crash if you've backed up the
 online redo archive log files. When you restart
 Oracle, an instance recovery will occur automatically,
 and you might not even know it. Just be certain that
 the instance is truly dead when you take your cold
 backup...

 With regards to switching between ARCHIVELOG and
 NOARCHIVELOG, it's a waste of effort from a
 recoverability standpoint. At most it may be
 interesting, but as soon as you switch out of
 ARCHIVELOG mode, nothing you've done while in
 ARCHIVELOG mode is valid anymore. Leave it one way or
 the other, and then leave it...

 ...just my $0.02...

 Another $0.02: use RMAN for your cold backups. Then
 you won't forget anything, because RMAN will remember
 for you...

 Hope this helps...

 -Tim
 - Original Message -

RE: Database backup question.Thank You

2002-05-24 Thread Steve McClure




Allright,

My 
response wasn't meant to confuse you. I will try to do better. a 
cold backup -- by definition taken when your database is shutdown. The 
shutdown process is normal. If you shutdown using shutdown immediate or 
abort you will need your online redo logs in order to recover from this 
backup. It is generally recommended that you startup restrict the database 
after this and then shutdown normal. This will ensure you have a "clean" 
backup. The cold backup should include your data files, control files, 
your archived redo logs(if in archivelog mode), and your online redo logs. 
Again your online redo logs aren't technically required, but wouldn't we all 
feel stupid if being technically correct cost us a clean recovery, so back them 
up as well.

ok now 
hot backups. Hot backups are made with your database up and running. 
This kind of backup requires you to place your tablespaces in backup mode. 
This can be done manually or through scripting. Your database is required 
to be in archivelog mode, in order for this kind of backup scheme to 
work.Since your database is up and running while it's files are 
being copied, it is by definition an inconsistent backup. Oracle will use 
archived logs to recover from this kind of backup. 

As I 
said before you can place your DB in archivelog mode and back it up cold. 
If fact I would recommend doing it this way for a while, until you are 
comfortable with the backup/recover process. I highly recommend you check 
into Rama Veluri's "Oracle Backup and Recovery Handbook". You should at 
least refer to the Oracle Backup and Recovery guide.

Good 
Luck,

Steve 
McCLure

  -Original Message-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Meomeo NguyenSent: 
  Friday, May 24, 2002 1:54 PMTo: Multiple recipients of list 
  ORACLE-LSubject: Re: Database backup question.Thank 
  You
  Thank you all for your 
  responses.You all really confused me about this 
  issue.The whole database backups can be consistentor 
  inconsistent.To perform a consistent whole databse backup is the 
  only valid backup option for 
  databases running in NOARCHIVELOG 
  mode. In contrast,an inconsistent backup is valid if the database is running 
  in ARCHIVELOG mode. 
  So,myquestionis whyhaving my databse running in the 
  ARCHIVELOG mode, I can still perform both consistent and inconsistent 
  backupoptions? 
  Steve posted : 
  "I don't understandy why you would switch to and from archivelog 
  mode. You can establish a complete cold backup with your datafiles, 
  control files, and online redo logs. Actually you don't need the online 
  redo logs, but that used to be the case so I always back those up as 
  well. Shut your DB down (normal), and back these files up. 
  That is a complete cold backup." 
  Steve, I switch to and from archivelog mode because 
  the best way to back up the contents of the current 
  online redo log is always to archive it, then back up the archived 
  logs. Again, I do 
  appreciate you all for your help. I do need very clear picture about 
  this issue. Since I have not done anything like this before so I do need 
  your feedback badly. 
  Thanks 
  in advance 
  Trang

RE: Statistical sampling and representative stats collection

2002-05-24 Thread Larry Elkins


John,

Great work. I do have some comments and questions, but don't take it as
being critical. Your work on this is greatly appreciated. My
comments/question are in-line and only asked so that the list can bounce
around some more ideas and thoughts.

 --- Begin Quote ---
 MYTH:  COMPUTE IS BETTER THAN ESTIMATE
 This one generates an endless debate actually, so we will not take a firm
 stand either way. Rather, we will present some figures that throw
 some light
 on the issue and allow us to step back and look at the situation. The
 problem with COMPUTE is that it has to scan the entire table, sort it and
 figure out the exact data distribution. On the other hand, ESTIMATE steps
 through samples of the data, sorts and analyzes only a portion of
 the data.

True, if we can get good stats that result in effective plans by using
ESTIMATE, by all means go that route since a COMPUTE is much more expensive.


 In a recent test for the effectiveness of COMPUTE versus ESTIMATE on a
 static clone of a reasonably large Oracle Apps database, the
 statistics were
 generated and stored for both COMPUTE and ESTIMATE. The Database consisted
 of about 3,300 tables and 6,000 indexes and occupied approximately 120 Gb.

My question here is would this database and your findings be applicable to
other databases and the nature of their data? I wouldn't think it would be
since the characteristics can be so different, but, if I'm reading you
correctly, you aren't saying that ESTIMATE is always the only way. But, the
title Myth: Compute is better than Estimate. Well, we have all seen cases
where compute worked out better (or 10% or 1% might have worked better than
the 30% specified). So maybe it's just a minor quibble (no Jack Silvey, not
a Tribble) and if the title included ...is ALWAYS better..., then I would
totally agree with it being a myth. We have all been there, and I worked
with a group recently who had the luxury of doing full computes every
Sunday. Someone accidentally analyzed the schema at 30% on Monday and a lot
of things went down the toilet. Going back to COMPUTE fixed things. Then
again, maybe a 10% ESTIMATE would have fixed things. Jack and I both work
with a guy who has talked about COMPUTE resulting in undesired plans, 10%
did as well. They got the desired plans by going to 1%. So, even if one
agrees that we don't necessarily have to COMPUTE, and in many (probably
most?) cases we don't, there is still a lot of testing to be done to find
the best estimate percent, and this could very well be different for
various objects. And I think that's the battle we all face -- what is the
best sampling percentage. And right now, it still seems to be done on a
trial and error basis. I have some ideas on how one might attack this in an
automated fashion, but it's still a *very* rough idea that I need to bounce
off a few cohorts.

SNIP
 While the figures speak for themselves, we will offer some
 general advice to
 the cautious: ESTIMATE on tables and COMPUTE on Indexes. Columns are
 analyzed by default, but serve no useful purpose other than showing data
 spread. Hence, you could ANALYZE only Tables and Indexed columns alone.

If I read this correctly, are you saying we only need to gather table stats
and the column stats for indexed columns, and that there is no practical use
for these stats on non-indexed columns? If so, I disagree on this point,
even if it is general advice and not a rule. Stats on non-indexed columns
can play a *large* role in CBO decisions. I'm not going to go into details
and examples here illustrating that, but those stats can still help decide
the driving table, the join methods between tables, etc. I built a sample
case some time back to illustrate the importance of gathering these
non-indexed column stats. Now, it might not be important for all systems,
but if you are ever using indexed columns, and, still specifying criteria on
non-indexed columns, the gathering of stats on the non-indexed columns could
be *very* important. I can send you more details back-channel if you are
interested.

 An
 identified list of 'small' tables could also be COMPUTED rather than
 ANALYZED. This advice is given because ESTIMATE on a table comes close as
 far as row count goes, while COMPUTE on Indexes generates a more accurate
 picture of both data distribution as well as object size
 statistics. Testing
 the effectiveness of COMPUTE versus ANALYZE is simple and
 provides you with
 figures that you can use to decide the strategy for your situation.

Ok, it sounds like you aren't saying a one size fits all.


 Before we move to the next topic, keep in mind that an
 ANALYZE/ESTIMATE with
 a sample size greater than or equal to 50% will result in COMPUTE.

 --- End Quote ---

 The problem is that this simple mathematical model looks only at object
 sizes and did not look at Column spread and sensitivity. However,
 I believe
 that the combination of ESTIMATE on Tables and COMPUTE on Indexes would
 catch most of it.

 As

RE: Statistical sampling and representative stats collection

2002-05-24 Thread MacGregor, Ian A.


John are you saying to create histograms on all indexed columns, or just the ones with 
distributions which are skewed and also for ones which although symmetric in 
distribution  have some values much more prevalent than others?  

Ian MacGregor
Stanford Linear Accelerator Center
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, May 24, 2002 3:01 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Hi Jack,

 One question - you mention that an index analyze
 provides beter data distribution. Could you discuss
 what you found in more detail?

What I meant was that the Histograms that are created during an
ANALYZE/COMPUTE on Indexes will provide an almost perfect picture of the
data distribution in such columns. Under _some_ circumstances, the CBO will
be able to use this information to decide the best path (FTS or Indexed
read). On the other hand, and simply stated, when bind variables are used in
a cursor, this information about data distribution is not used since the
value of the bind variable is not used during the parse prior to 9i. In
other words, the access plan is built without considering the value of bind
variables that would have otherwise influenced the plan when histograms (and
thus information about data distribution) is avialable. However, 9i kinda
rectifies this and I quote from the Fine Manual: (Oracle9i: Database
Performance Guide and Reference)

Cursor Sharing Enhancements
The CBO now peeks at the values of user-defined bind variables on the first
invocation of a cursor. This lets the optimizer determine the selectivity of
any
WHERE clause condition, as well as if literals had been used instead of bind
variables. When bind variables are used in a statement, it is assumed that
cursor
sharing is intended and that different invocations are supposed to use the
same
execution plan.

This gives us the best of both worlds (in some cases). Of course, it all
depends on the number of buckets defined for Histograms and the width of the
data spread (and that is why I emphasized _some_ and 'simply stated' above).

I haven't tested this extensively, and I would appreciate any further inputs
from the Gurus! (For the rest of us: A 10053 trace should show up what's
happening. There was a _great_ presentation from Wolfgang Breitling on this
topic at the recent IOUG).

Btw: Searching for 'bucket' in the 8i SQL reference came up with the NTILE
function (new in 8i), and I said Wow! because I was looking for such a
function. Goes to say that we need to read the fine manuals more than we
normally do!

John Kanagaraj
Oracle Applications DBA
DBSoft Inc
(W): 408-970-7002

The manuals for Oracle are here: http://tahiti.oracle.com
The manual for Life is here: http://www.gospelcom.net

** The opinions and statements above are entirely my own and not those of my
employer or clients **


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RE: Statistical sampling and representative stats collection

2002-05-24 Thread Larry Elkins


 Hi Jack,

  One question - you mention that an index analyze
  provides beter data distribution. Could you discuss
  what you found in more detail?

 What I meant was that the Histograms that are created during an
 ANALYZE/COMPUTE on Indexes will provide an almost perfect picture of the
 data distribution in such columns. Under _some_ circumstances,
 the CBO will
 be able to use this information to decide the best path (FTS or Indexed
 read).

And stats on the non-indexed columns can also play a large role in deciding
driving table order and join methods. Ok, touched on that in an earlier
email ;-)

 On the other hand, and simply stated, when bind variables
 are used in
 a cursor, this information about data distribution is not used since the
 value of the bind variable is not used during the parse prior to 9i.

In my case, and Jack's (I'm now doing some work with a DB where Jack is
dealing with the analyze strategies), the bind thing isn't an issue.
Everything is ad-hoc, and, literals *are* used. But, there really isn't much
of an opportunity for sharing SQL even if binds were used. One user might
specify 5 values for one column, 3 values for another, 2 values for five
other columns. The combinations of the criteria specified, and the number of
values specified for each of those columns, not to mention the tables
specified, very few, if any, of the SQL statements could be shared even if
using binds. Plus, in this case, with histograms being very valuable, one
could live with less cursor sharing even if there were some that could be
shared when using binds. In this case, the literals are needed and their use
is not causing any shared pool or library cache contention.


 Btw: Searching for 'bucket' in the 8i SQL reference came up with the NTILE
 function (new in 8i), and I said Wow! because I was looking for such a
 function. Goes to say that we need to read the fine manuals more than we
 normally do!

The analytic functions are great. The analytic functions first came about in
8.1.6, a few more functions added in 8.1.7, and taken even further in 9i. A
lot of the traditional ways we might have done things, often times including
self joins, or, procedural code, are thrown out the window. I've found all
kinds of uses for them that (1) improve performance over the old approaches,
and (2) are simpler to understand. Then again, some of the analytic function
examples leave my head spinning. I'm still working through a lot of them for
better understanding. But yeah, analytic functions like NTILE are very, very
nice.


 John Kanagaraj
 Oracle Applications DBA
 DBSoft Inc
 (W): 408-970-7002

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RE: Oracle on (Ssshhh IT) / Re: ORACLE-L Digest -- Volume 2002, Number 143

2002-05-24 Thread Eric D. Pierce


Sean  folks,

www.amazon.com (used) books claims to have the 
Oracle8  Windows NT Blackbook

fwiw:

--

Oracle9i for Windows(R) 2000 Tips  Techniques
by Scott Jesse, Matthew Hart, Mike Sale

Paperback: 612 pages ; Dimensions (in inches): 1.52 x 9.12 x 7.37 
Publisher: Osborne McGraw-Hill; 
ISBN: 0072194626; 1st edition (December 7, 2001) 

---
[NT/2000]

Oracle9i for Windows(R) Handbook
by Rama Velpuri, Anand Adkoli

Paperback: 528 pages ; Dimensions (in inches): 1.28 x 9.12 x 7.36 
Publisher: Osborne McGraw-Hill; 
ISBN: 0072190922; 2nd edition (April 19, 2002) 

---

Also, from your list of URLs, this is a nice index page

http://www.dbatoolbox.com/Content/nt2000_wp.htm

(click NT misc under white Papers at  http://www.dbatoolbox.com 
)


And of course (Halloo Roland), a nice Oracle beginners page:

http://www.dbatoolbox.com/Content/beginners_wp.htm

regards,
ep




ORACLE-L Digest -- Volume 2002, Number 143
 --
 
  From: O'Neill, Sean [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  Date: Wed, 22 May 2002 14:37:06 +0200
  Subject: RE: Oracle on (Ssshhh NT)
 
  From: Robertson Lee - lerobe [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  Date: Tue, 21 May 2002 15:42:19 +0100
  Subject: RE: Oracle on (Ssshhh NT)
 
 Thanks Rachel, this will be (for this year anyway) on Oracle 8 (not =
 even
 8i,
 don't ask !!!)
 
 As you're stuck with Oracle 8 I'd recommend the following book which I
 believe is out of print but which you may be able to find via used = books
 site: Oracle8  Windows NT Black Book ISBN: 1-57610-248-3 Published by =
 Coriolis.
 
 Following Oracle8 NT papers may also be of interest:
 http://www.nyoug.org/tune8nts.pdf
 http://www.nyoug.org/ora8winnt.pdf
 http://www.dbatoolbox.com/WP2001/nt2000/tips_techniques.pdf
 
 Following site might also be of use:
 http://www.ipass.net/~davesisk/oont_main_menu.htm
 
 HTH,
 -
 Se=E1n O' Neill
 Organon (Ireland) Ltd.
 [subscribed: digest mode]=20
 
 


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Re: ORACLE-L Digest -- Volume 2002, Number 143

2002-05-24 Thread Eric D. Pierce


Another option would be to go for a marketing job *at* oracle.

apparently you don't have to know anything technical, or even much about the 
product. :)



ORACLE-L Digest -- Volume 2002, Number 143
 --
 
  From: Sherry Lopata [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  Date: Wed, 22 May 2002 16:25:57 -0700
  Subject: newbie seeks career direction: become a DBA or DEVELOPER?
 
 Hi gurus,
 I have taken a few Oracle DBA courses at UCLA Extension, passed my first
 DBA certification exam, but have not been able to find an entry level
 position in this area. (My background is in printing and marketing... big
 career move...  I've been told my timing is bad cause the job market is
 bad here). It was suggested to me, by someone at the LA Oracle User Group
 meeting, that I become an Oracle Developer first. Is this the path you
 

...

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Author: Eric D. Pierce
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CLARIFICATION !

2002-05-24 Thread guess who


Hi, I am from india and my doubt is as follows :

  I have installed ORACLE 8i in windows xp(professional 
edition).But my problem is when ever i boot my system the services 
like oracle instance orcl is not starting at all. That is, its 
status is still starting ,  so when i log in to oracle the 
following error message is displayed

ORA-01034 : oracle not available

But one thing, if i type svrmgrl in the run box and i connect to 
internal/oracle then its telling connected and if i type startup 
then the database is started and now if i goto oracle and log in , 
then its logging correctly.So in the boot up of the system i must 
start the oracle instance service automatically... but which is 
not starting .

Tell me how ,please.

Regards,
Prakash.

_
Click below to visit monsterindia.com and review jobs in India or 
Abroad
http://monsterindia.rediff.com/jobs

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Author: guess who
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Re: Multiple ennvironments with Portal and 9iAS