RE: Does index need rebuilding when table is truncated

2002-04-11 Thread Connor McDonald

But the original poster was referring to a truncate

... aka Enron using your metaphor :-)

Cheers
Connor

 --- Ron Rogers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Good
point Robert,
>  The reason the index space still exists after a lot
> of deletes is the
> method the index is stored in the database. very
> similar to the old
> organization chart of a large corporation. If you
> eliminate all of the
> people between the CEO and the janitor you still
> have the multiple
> levels displayed on the chart. The may be vacant and
> just pointers to
> the next lower level but the still exist on the
> chart. Indexes are
> stored the same way. One block points to the next
> and so forth from the
> top to the bottom. Remove all of the data between
> the two and the "path"
> from the top to the bottom still exists thus the
> index storage is still
> used. If you export the data, truncate the table and
> import the data the
> "path becomes top-to-bottom one step and the old
> index storage area is
> freed up. The janitor then reports directly to the
> CEO.
> Ron
> ROR mª¿ªm
> 
> >>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] 04/09/02 06:33PM >>>
> There is not a HWM indicator for an index as there
> is for a table.
> When a truncate occurs, the blocks are cleared in
> the index and the
> extents (beyond the initial extent) are deallocated
> (assuming you do
> not
> issue the reuse storage clause). 
> 
> RF
> 
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Tuesday, April 09, 2002 5:52 PM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> Hello,
> 
> Lisa, what I was wondering when I read Rick's e-mail
> was... what about
> the
> HWM for the indexes when someone truncates a table.
> The table's HWM
> pointer
> gets reset of course, but I can never recall seeing
> anything about
> what
> happens to the index space.
> 
> Thank you,
> 
> Paul Sherman
> DBA
> voice -  781-501-4143 (office)
> fax-  781-278-8341 (office)
> email - [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Tuesday, April 09, 2002 5:33 PM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> Hi Rick, 
> 
> Nope.  Try it.  You'll see that the extents clear up
> just like the
> extents
> in the table do, if you don't specify the REUSE
> STORAGE clause.
> 
> Lisa Koivu
> Oracle Database Tank
> Fairfield Resorts, Inc.
> 954-935-4117
> 
> 
> > -Original Message-
> > From:   [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> 
> > Sent:   Tuesday, April 09, 2002 5:11 PM
> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> > Subject:Does index need rebuilding when table is
> truncated
> > 
> > Hi All,
> > 
> > I know if you delete lots of data using delete the
> indexes may need
> > rebuilding. Is this the case if the table is
> truncated?
> > 
> > Thanks
> > Rick
> > 
> > 
> > -- 
> > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ:
> http://www.orafaq.com 
> > -- 
> > Author: 
> >   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> > 
> > Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051 
> FAX: (858) 538-5051
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> access / Mailing
> Lists
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RE: Does index need rebuilding when table is truncated

2002-04-11 Thread Ron Rogers

Good point Robert,
 The reason the index space still exists after a lot of deletes is the
method the index is stored in the database. very similar to the old
organization chart of a large corporation. If you eliminate all of the
people between the CEO and the janitor you still have the multiple
levels displayed on the chart. The may be vacant and just pointers to
the next lower level but the still exist on the chart. Indexes are
stored the same way. One block points to the next and so forth from the
top to the bottom. Remove all of the data between the two and the "path"
from the top to the bottom still exists thus the index storage is still
used. If you export the data, truncate the table and import the data the
"path becomes top-to-bottom one step and the old index storage area is
freed up. The janitor then reports directly to the CEO.
Ron
ROR mª¿ªm

>>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] 04/09/02 06:33PM >>>
There is not a HWM indicator for an index as there is for a table.
When a truncate occurs, the blocks are cleared in the index and the
extents (beyond the initial extent) are deallocated (assuming you do
not
issue the reuse storage clause). 

RF

-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, April 09, 2002 5:52 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Hello,

Lisa, what I was wondering when I read Rick's e-mail was... what about
the
HWM for the indexes when someone truncates a table. The table's HWM
pointer
gets reset of course, but I can never recall seeing anything about
what
happens to the index space.

Thank you,

Paul Sherman
DBA
voice -  781-501-4143 (office)
fax-  781-278-8341 (office)
email - [EMAIL PROTECTED] 


-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, April 09, 2002 5:33 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Hi Rick, 

Nope.  Try it.  You'll see that the extents clear up just like the
extents
in the table do, if you don't specify the REUSE STORAGE clause.

Lisa Koivu
Oracle Database Tank
Fairfield Resorts, Inc.
954-935-4117


> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]

> Sent: Tuesday, April 09, 2002 5:11 PM
> To:   Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> Subject:  Does index need rebuilding when table is truncated
> 
> Hi All,
> 
> I know if you delete lots of data using delete the indexes may need
> rebuilding. Is this the case if the table is truncated?
> 
> Thanks
> Rick
> 
> 
> -- 
> Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com 
> -- 
> Author: 
>   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> 
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Lists
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Re: Does index need rebuilding when table is truncated

2002-04-10 Thread Jonathan Lewis


Beg to differ.

The data segment for an index does have an HWM -
it's just that nobody talks about it very much.

Nevertheless if you dump the segment header block
you will see an entry for the "highwater"; and if
you have an 'index fast full scan' access path occurring,
then the scan goes up to the HWM.  Furthermore
when you truncate the table, the HWMs for the
table and its indexes are reset in an identical fashion.

Thinking laterally to your Urban Legends thread -
there are several statements made about Oracle's
lower-level behaviour which are "incorrect by omission"
because they only describe the behaviour of table
data blocks, and ignore the fact that indexes consist
of data blocks which are sometimes handled differently  -
(although as in this case they are sometimes handled
identically to the table).


Jonathan Lewis
http://www.jlcomp.demon.co.uk

Host to The Co-Operative Oracle Users' FAQ
http://www.jlcomp.demon.co.uk/faq/ind_faq.html

Author of:
Practical Oracle 8i: Building Efficient Databases


-Original Message-
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: 09 April 2002 23:31


|There is not a HWM indicator for an index as there is for a table.
|When a truncate occurs, the blocks are cleared in the index and the
|extents (beyond the initial extent) are deallocated (assuming you do
not
|issue the reuse storage clause).
|
|RF
|


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RE: Does index need rebuilding when table is truncated

2002-04-09 Thread Alex Hillman

Table need to be reanalyzed and with table - indexes.

Alex Hillman

> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent: Tuesday, April 09, 2002 5:11 PM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> Subject: Does index need rebuilding when table is truncated
> 
> 
> Hi All,
> 
> I know if you delete lots of data using delete the indexes may need
> rebuilding. Is this the case if the table is truncated?
> 
> Thanks
> Rick
> 
> 
> -- 
> Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> -- 
> Author: 
>   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 
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RE: Does index need rebuilding when table is truncated

2002-04-09 Thread Freeman, Robert

>> Oracle Database Tank

Hmmm... so are they going to send you to Afghanistan or Iraq in that
database tank Lisa?

RF
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RE: Does index need rebuilding when table is truncated

2002-04-09 Thread Koivu, Lisa

I'm not sure.  My gut says yes... because there's nothing left in the table,
why should there be anything "left" in the index in the way of storage...
but I don't know for sure.  May be a fun thing to play with.  (Wow, I need
to get out more)  

List?  Someone has to know this.  

LK, DBT

> -Original Message-
> From: Sherman, Paul R. [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Sent: Tuesday, April 09, 2002 5:52 PM
> To:   Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> Subject:  RE: Does index need rebuilding when table is truncated
> 
> Hello,
> 
> Lisa, what I was wondering when I read Rick's e-mail was... what about the
> HWM for the indexes when someone truncates a table. The table's HWM
> pointer
> gets reset of course, but I can never recall seeing anything about what
> happens to the index space.
> 
> Thank you,
> 
> Paul Sherman
> DBA
> voice -  781-501-4143 (office)
> fax-  781-278-8341 (office)
> email - [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> Sent: Tuesday, April 09, 2002 5:33 PM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> 
> 
> Hi Rick, 
> 
> Nope.  Try it.  You'll see that the extents clear up just like the extents
> in the table do, if you don't specify the REUSE STORAGE clause.
> 
> Lisa Koivu
> Oracle Database Tank
> Fairfield Resorts, Inc.
> 954-935-4117
> 
> 
> > -Original Message-
> > From:   [EMAIL PROTECTED] [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> > Sent:   Tuesday, April 09, 2002 5:11 PM
> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> > Subject:Does index need rebuilding when table is truncated
> > 
> > Hi All,
> > 
> > I know if you delete lots of data using delete the indexes may need
> > rebuilding. Is this the case if the table is truncated?
> > 
> > Thanks
> > Rick
> > 
> > 
> > -- 
> > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> > -- 
> > Author: 
> >   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > 
> > Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051  FAX: (858) 538-5051
> > San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists
> > 
> > To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message
> > to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in
> > the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L
> > (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from).  You may
> > also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
> -- 
> Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> -- 
> Author: Koivu, Lisa
>   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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RE: Does index need rebuilding when table is truncated

2002-04-09 Thread Freeman, Robert

There is not a HWM indicator for an index as there is for a table.
When a truncate occurs, the blocks are cleared in the index and the
extents (beyond the initial extent) are deallocated (assuming you do not
issue the reuse storage clause). 

RF

-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, April 09, 2002 5:52 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Hello,

Lisa, what I was wondering when I read Rick's e-mail was... what about the
HWM for the indexes when someone truncates a table. The table's HWM pointer
gets reset of course, but I can never recall seeing anything about what
happens to the index space.

Thank you,

Paul Sherman
DBA
voice -  781-501-4143 (office)
fax-  781-278-8341 (office)
email - [EMAIL PROTECTED]


-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, April 09, 2002 5:33 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Hi Rick, 

Nope.  Try it.  You'll see that the extents clear up just like the extents
in the table do, if you don't specify the REUSE STORAGE clause.

Lisa Koivu
Oracle Database Tank
Fairfield Resorts, Inc.
954-935-4117


> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Sent: Tuesday, April 09, 2002 5:11 PM
> To:   Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> Subject:  Does index need rebuilding when table is truncated
> 
> Hi All,
> 
> I know if you delete lots of data using delete the indexes may need
> rebuilding. Is this the case if the table is truncated?
> 
> Thanks
> Rick
> 
> 
> -- 
> Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> -- 
> Author: 
>   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 
> Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051  FAX: (858) 538-5051
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-- 
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RE: Does index need rebuilding when table is truncated

2002-04-09 Thread Sherman, Paul R.

Hello,

Lisa, what I was wondering when I read Rick's e-mail was... what about the
HWM for the indexes when someone truncates a table. The table's HWM pointer
gets reset of course, but I can never recall seeing anything about what
happens to the index space.

Thank you,

Paul Sherman
DBA
voice -  781-501-4143 (office)
fax-  781-278-8341 (office)
email - [EMAIL PROTECTED]


-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, April 09, 2002 5:33 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Hi Rick, 

Nope.  Try it.  You'll see that the extents clear up just like the extents
in the table do, if you don't specify the REUSE STORAGE clause.

Lisa Koivu
Oracle Database Tank
Fairfield Resorts, Inc.
954-935-4117


> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Sent: Tuesday, April 09, 2002 5:11 PM
> To:   Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> Subject:  Does index need rebuilding when table is truncated
> 
> Hi All,
> 
> I know if you delete lots of data using delete the indexes may need
> rebuilding. Is this the case if the table is truncated?
> 
> Thanks
> Rick
> 
> 
> -- 
> Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> -- 
> Author: 
>   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 
> Fat City Network Services-- (858) 538-5051  FAX: (858) 538-5051
> San Diego, California-- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists
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RE: Does index need rebuilding when table is truncated

2002-04-09 Thread Koivu, Lisa

Hi Rick, 

Nope.  Try it.  You'll see that the extents clear up just like the extents
in the table do, if you don't specify the REUSE STORAGE clause.

Lisa Koivu
Oracle Database Tank
Fairfield Resorts, Inc.
954-935-4117


> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Sent: Tuesday, April 09, 2002 5:11 PM
> To:   Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> Subject:  Does index need rebuilding when table is truncated
> 
> Hi All,
> 
> I know if you delete lots of data using delete the indexes may need
> rebuilding. Is this the case if the table is truncated?
> 
> Thanks
> Rick
> 
> 
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