Re: Is it Veritas or is it smoke and mirrors? again
Michael Kline wrote: There seems to be some big confusion if Veritas is working or not... snip... Recovery has NEVER been tested. Michael Alan Kline, Sr. Principal Consultant Business to Business Solutions, LLC Phone: 804-744-1545 Cell: 804-314-6262 ICQ: 1009605, 975313 Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Web: www.b2bsol.com The two are related. If recovery has never been properly tested, you don't know if your backups (veritas, rman, ksh/sql scripts) are working. Period. End of story. I've encountered enough software/hardware problems to not trust that an 'error free' backup will be recoverable. If the database is not being taken down, or tablespaces are not being put into backup mode, or RMAN is not being used, I'd suspect that none of the backups are recoverable. Daniel The DBA's job is not to backup the database, but to recover it. Finkbegin:vcard n:Fink;Daniel tel;cell:303.808.3282 tel;work:303.272.3225 x-mozilla-html:TRUE adr:;; version:2.1 email;internet:[EMAIL PROTECTED] title:DB Services Lead x-mozilla-cpt:;-4832 fn:Daniel Fink end:vcard
RE: Is it Veritas or is it smoke and mirrors? again
Title: Message Hmmm, sounds like me and what will be my next issue, except I'll be using Veritas to backup to a SAN. I'll watch this thread closely. v/r Stephen S. Wolfe, GS-11, DAFC Data Services Manager [EMAIL PROTECTED] (813) 827-9974 DSN 651-9974 -Original Message-From: Michael Kline [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, July 30, 2003 11:29 AMTo: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-LSubject: Is it Veritas or is it smoke and mirrors? again There seems to be some big confusion if Veritas is working or not... Based on Previous discussions this customer has the Oracle Veritas agent running, and they do nightly backups. How ever, I find absolutely NONE of the RMAN tables updated so they are not using RMAN. I also find that the alert log has no references what so ever to "alter tablespace xyz begin backup" and the "... end backup"... While the agent is there and working, I sure see no signs that anything is happening as far as a REAL backup. It's Oracle 9i, but even that, I would think is going to leave some "hints" that all the hooks are working and backup is occurring. Recovery has NEVER been tested. Michael Alan Kline, Sr.PrincipalConsultantBusiness to Business Solutions, LLCPhone: 804-744-1545 Cell: 804-314-6262ICQ: 1009605, 975313Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Web: www.b2bsol.com
RE: Is it Veritas or is it smoke and mirrors? again
Even more scary was that when checking the readme.txt file, the last version mentioned as being supported with backup exec agent is 8.1.5... The exec says it's version 5.0.1, but the Readme says 1.2 for NT. I was told this morning, Oh yea, I never configured the agent yet... This is a potential new customer that we hope to take on for tuning and DBA work.. They are not sure if they are doing all the right things... Trying to find a politically correct way to say, Uh... NO! You're not. I'm like those who say I'm from Missouri, show me. If they can back up, if they can keep it 100% invisible, they need to prove to me that one can actually recover. To me these are cold backups taken on a LIVE database and someone would have to prove to me differently. When I was Ops Mgr my operators once stopped doing backups because it took too long... I put up a 10 foot banner that said NO BACKUP IS EXACTLY THAT! and said if it ever happened again, I'd be glad help them find a job. Except for shear stupidity from induhviduals I've not lost a table or database in years. And on those following, I think Oracle is migrating towards the RMAN interface for Legato and Veritas as the preferred method... I've just finished a Legato site with about 10-15 databases and once you get all the wrinkles ironed out, it works pretty slick. I've even got the RMAN cleaning itself out based on what Legato wants to keep retention wise. If Legato purges it, so do I from RMAN. It's not bad. Legato came to put it under the scheduler and when he saw what all my scripts were doing including emailing the reports and tracking things, they kept my scripts and decided that they did better than using the scheduler. They weren't all that much magic, but a LOT of help from Robert's book... THANKS ROBERT! Maks. -Original Message- Daniel Fink Sent: Wednesday, July 30, 2003 11:44 AM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Michael Kline wrote: There seems to be some big confusion if Veritas is working or not... snip... Recovery has NEVER been tested. Michael Alan Kline, Sr. Principal Consultant Business to Business Solutions, LLC Phone: 804-744-1545 Cell: 804-314-6262 ICQ: 1009605, 975313 Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Web: www.b2bsol.com The two are related. If recovery has never been properly tested, you don't know if your backups (veritas, rman, ksh/sql scripts) are working. Period. End of story. I've encountered enough software/hardware problems to not trust that an 'error free' backup will be recoverable. If the database is not being taken down, or tablespaces are not being put into backup mode, or RMAN is not being used, I'd suspect that none of the backups are recoverable. Daniel The DBA's job is not to backup the database, but to recover it. Fink -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net -- Author: Michael Kline INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com San Diego, California-- Mailing list and web hosting services - To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
Re: Is it Veritas or is it smoke and mirrors? again
Michael, Do you have access to the Veritas Master server? If so, you can take a look at the activity logs. Better yet, check the logs on the client. NBU_HOME=where ever NetBackup was installed. Look in NBU_HOME/logs/user_ops/dbext/logs and see if logs are being created. Read a couple of the recent ones. The location is the same in Windows or *nix. Could be interesting reading, or non-reading, as the case may be. Jared Michael Kline [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 07/30/2003 08:29 AM Please respond to ORACLE-L To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L [EMAIL PROTECTED] cc: Subject:Is it Veritas or is it smoke and mirrors? again There seems to be some big confusion if Veritas is working or not... Based on Previous discussions this customer has the Oracle Veritas agent running, and they do nightly backups. How ever, I find absolutely NONE of the RMAN tables updated so they are not using RMAN. I also find that the alert log has no references what so ever to alter tablespace xyz begin backup and the ... end backup... While the agent is there and working, I sure see no signs that anything is happening as far as a REAL backup. It's Oracle 9i, but even that, I would think is going to leave some hints that all the hooks are working and backup is occurring. Recovery has NEVER been tested. Michael Alan Kline, Sr. Principal Consultant Business to Business Solutions, LLC Phone: 804-744-1545 Cell: 804-314-6262 ICQ: 1009605, 975313 Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Web: www.b2bsol.com -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net -- Author: INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com San Diego, California-- Mailing list and web hosting services - To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
