Re: [OT] What Facebook knows

[Stephen Price]

Oh oh!! I know the answer to this one!

Greg, you both need to unplug, move to a rural area in Australia somewhere, you 
know where they promise to deliver Internet but can't because our NBN is so 
shit, not bother connecting internet, power or any other services  that would 
have you show you up in some civilised database (ripe for the 
hacking/accidental exposure on the internet) and enjoy your retirement. Oh, 
dont forget your tin foil hat!
Definitely dont have a phone.

Cheers
Stephen

Cheers
Stephen


From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com  on behalf 
of DotNet Dude 
Sent: Thursday, January 23, 2020 4:45:06 PM
To: ozDotNet 
Subject: Re: [OT] What Facebook knows

Reminds me of an article I read yonks ago about a hacker sending the cops a pic 
of his girlfriend’s goodies with a caption like “suck it”, only for this super 
duper hacker not to realise the photo has location information saved in the 
metadata.


On Thu, 23 Jan 2020 at 14:46, mailto:adr...@halid.com.au>> 
wrote:



You can share your phones contact list with Facebook.



What this means is that even if you have never used Facebook before, one of 
your friends could have shared your details (name, phone, email) to Facebook 
because they have chosen to provide/sync their phonebook/contact list with 
Facebook.



Now Facebook knows who you are and you haven’t even signed up or logged into 
Facebook ever.



https://www.vox.com/2016/10/1/13079770/how-facebook-people-you-may-know-algorithm-works

Does Facebook use my phone contacts to make friend recommendations?

Yes. If you share your phone contacts with Facebook or Facebook Messenger, the 
company will use that info to recommend your contacts as “Friends you may 
know.” Timing is a factor here. That means that you may be more likely to see a 
friend recommendation from someone you recently added to your phone, versus a 
contact you’ve had for years.

Do both parties need to be saved into each other’s phones?

No. If someone has added your number to their contact list, you might see them 
in your suggested friends list even if you’ve never added their number to your 
own contact list. It only takes one user to trigger a recommendation.





What might be even more worring to you is Facebooks facial recognition AI.



Imagine that someone that you don’t know takes a photo and your face happens to 
be in the background.

Facebook can match all the faces in the photo, including yours, and link it to 
your Facebook profile.

Essentially now they have a record of the location and exact time you were 
there because somebody else uploaded a photo.





Regards



Adrian Halid



From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com<mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com> 
mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com>> On Behalf 
Of Greg Keogh

Sent: Thursday, 23 January 2020 2:33 PM
To: ozDotNet mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>>
Subject: [OT] What Facebook knows



Folks, most of us probably know what I'm about to say, but when you see it 
live, it's really frightening.



My wife had to join Facebook for the first time ever to follow her nephew who 
is a firefighter in the ongoing disaster. She joined okay without being asked 
for a phone number. The next day she tried to get in via the Apple App and it 
demanded a mobile number. It was an absolute block until a number was entered, 
so she was compelled to. Now it gets scary...



She immediately was offered hundreds of friends that included my friends, 
musicians I have played with, her old work mates in jobs going back 40 years, 
extended family adult and children friends of both sides of our family, old 
workmates of mine going back to the 1980s, etc, and the list goes on to find 
obscure and tenuous links of every imaginable kind.



So … given that she has never been on FB before … where did all those 
associations come from? We know they have good algorithms of course, but it 
means that FB could be used to perform a comprehensive and reliable analysis of 
the complete life of someone who isn't even a member. Imagine if the police, or 
criminals, or an oppressive government simply asked FB "what do you know about 
person X?" Even if X isn't a member, they could compile a fantastically 
detailed dossier.



How much information does FB hold? Who are they sharing it with? It's worse 
than we think.



Greg K

Re: [OT] What Facebook knows

[DotNet Dude]

Reminds me of an article I read yonks ago about a hacker sending the cops a
pic of his girlfriend’s goodies with a caption like “suck it”, only for
this super duper hacker not to realise the photo has location information
saved in the metadata.


On Thu, 23 Jan 2020 at 14:46,  wrote:

>
>
> You can share your phones contact list with Facebook.
>
>
>
> What this means is that even if you have never used Facebook before, one
> of your friends could have shared your details (name, phone, email) to
> Facebook because they have chosen to provide/sync their phonebook/contact
> list with Facebook.
>
>
>
> Now Facebook knows who you are and you haven’t even signed up or logged
> into Facebook ever.
>
>
>
>
> https://www.vox.com/2016/10/1/13079770/how-facebook-people-you-may-know-algorithm-works
>
> *Does Facebook use my phone contacts to make friend recommendations?*
>
> *Yes. If you share your phone contacts with Facebook or Facebook
> Messenger, the company will use that info to recommend your contacts as
> “Friends you may know.” Timing is a factor here. That means that you may be
> more likely to see a friend recommendation from someone you recently added
> to your phone, versus a contact you’ve had for years.*
>
> *Do both parties need to be saved into each other’s phones?*
>
> *No. If someone has added your number to their contact list, you might see
> them in your suggested friends list even if you’ve never added their number
> to your own contact list. It only takes one user to trigger a
> recommendation.*
>
>
>
>
>
> What might be even more worring to you is Facebooks facial recognition AI.
>
>
>
> Imagine that someone that you don’t know takes a photo and your face
> happens to be in the background.
>
> Facebook can match all the faces in the photo, including yours, and link
> it to your Facebook profile.
>
> Essentially now they have a record of the location and exact time you were
> there because somebody else uploaded a photo.
>
>
>
>
>
> Regards
>
>
>
> Adrian Halid
>
>
>
> *From:* ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com  *On
> Behalf Of *Greg Keogh
>
>
> *Sent:* Thursday, 23 January 2020 2:33 PM
> *To:* ozDotNet 
> *Subject:* [OT] What Facebook knows
>
>
>
> Folks, most of us probably know what I'm about to say, but when you see it
> live, it's really frightening.
>
>
>
> My wife had to join Facebook for the first time ever to follow her nephew
> who is a firefighter in the ongoing disaster. She joined okay without being
> asked for a phone number. The next day she tried to get in via the Apple
> App and it demanded a mobile number. It was an absolute block until a
> number was entered, so she was compelled to. Now it gets scary...
>
>
>
> She immediately was offered hundreds of friends that included my friends,
> musicians I have played with, her old work mates in jobs going back 40
> years, extended family adult and children friends of both sides of our
> family, old workmates of mine going back to the 1980s, etc, and the list
> goes on to find obscure and tenuous links of every imaginable kind.
>
>
>
> So … given that she has never been on FB before … where did all those
> associations come from? We know they have good algorithms of course, but it
> means that FB could be used to perform a comprehensive and reliable
> analysis of the complete life of someone who isn't even a member. Imagine
> if the police, or criminals, or an oppressive government simply asked FB
> "what do you know about person X?" Even if X isn't a member, they could
> compile a fantastically detailed dossier.
>
>
>
> How much information does FB hold? Who are they sharing it with? It's
> worse than we think.
>
>
>
> *Greg K*
>

RE: [OT] What Facebook knows

[greg]

Yep, it must be a boon for various agencies to track associations.

 

I remember when digital phones first appeared, the police and agencies couldn’t 
believe their luck. Here Mr Bad Guy, please carry a digital tracker around with 
you. Sure.

 

Regards,

 

Greg

 

Dr Greg Low

 

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile│ +61 3 8676 4913 fax

SQL Down Under | Web:  

 www.sqldownunder.com | 

 http://greglow.me

 

RE: [OT] What Facebook knows

[adrian]

 

You can share your phones contact list with Facebook.

 

What this means is that even if you have never used Facebook before, one of 
your friends could have shared your details (name, phone, email) to Facebook 
because they have chosen to provide/sync their phonebook/contact list with 
Facebook.

 

Now Facebook knows who you are and you haven’t even signed up or logged into 
Facebook ever.

 

https://www.vox.com/2016/10/1/13079770/how-facebook-people-you-may-know-algorithm-works

Does Facebook use my phone contacts to make friend recommendations?

Yes. If you share your phone contacts with Facebook or Facebook Messenger, the 
company will use that info to recommend your contacts as “Friends you may 
know.” Timing is a factor here. That means that you may be more likely to see a 
friend recommendation from someone you recently added to your phone, versus a 
contact you’ve had for years.

Do both parties need to be saved into each other’s phones?

No. If someone has added your number to their contact list, you might see them 
in your suggested friends list even if you’ve never added their number to your 
own contact list. It only takes one user to trigger a recommendation.

 

 

What might be even more worring to you is Facebooks facial recognition AI.

 

Imagine that someone that you don’t know takes a photo and your face happens to 
be in the background.

Facebook can match all the faces in the photo, including yours, and link it to 
your Facebook profile.

Essentially now they have a record of the location and exact time you were 
there because somebody else uploaded a photo.

 

 

Regards

 

Adrian Halid

 

From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com  On Behalf 
Of Greg Keogh
Sent: Thursday, 23 January 2020 2:33 PM
To: ozDotNet 
Subject: [OT] What Facebook knows

 

Folks, most of us probably know what I'm about to say, but when you see it 
live, it's really frightening.

 

My wife had to join Facebook for the first time ever to follow her nephew who 
is a firefighter in the ongoing disaster. She joined okay without being asked 
for a phone number. The next day she tried to get in via the Apple App and it 
demanded a mobile number. It was an absolute block until a number was entered, 
so she was compelled to. Now it gets scary...

 

She immediately was offered hundreds of friends that included my friends, 
musicians I have played with, her old work mates in jobs going back 40 years, 
extended family adult and children friends of both sides of our family, old 
workmates of mine going back to the 1980s, etc, and the list goes on to find 
obscure and tenuous links of every imaginable kind.

 

So … given that she has never been on FB before … where did all those 
associations come from? We know they have good algorithms of course, but it 
means that FB could be used to perform a comprehensive and reliable analysis of 
the complete life of someone who isn't even a member. Imagine if the police, or 
criminals, or an oppressive government simply asked FB "what do you know about 
person X?" Even if X isn't a member, they could compile a fantastically 
detailed dossier.

 

How much information does FB hold? Who are they sharing it with? It's worse 
than we think.

 

Greg K

RE: [OT] What Facebook knows

[greg]

And I should have added that the stronger the common connections, the more 
likely it is to be true. If it finds something within a few links to me, and it 
turns out that that person and I have say 90 people that we both know, what’s 
the chance we know each other.

 

And if you start working the probabilities, the matrix spreads quite rapidly, 
quite fast.

 

They are far from alone though. LinkedIn makes valid suggestions to me all the 
time still. It keeps surprising me about ones that I hadn’t realised that I 
wasn’t connected to.

 

WhatsApp also wants to read your contacts, to add/suggest people who are also 
already on WhatsApp. And keep in mind that FB owns them now too.

 

WeiXin (WeChat) does the same, mostly in my case for various Asian friends. And 
so on, and so on.

 

Regards,

 

Greg

 

Dr Greg Low

 

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile│ +61 3 8676 4913 fax

SQL Down Under | Web:  
<https://nam06.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.sqldownunder.com%2F&data=02%7C01%7Csspahelp%40microsoft.com%7C1f0ea4d6b97e4d897f3708d666d1e890%7C72f988bf86f141af91ab2d7cd011db47%7C1%7C0%7C636809449091516274&sdata=SLHeEGAMmWUY5YIwcC4oAPYr%2F9RIZdi4MNASsdzwX2I%3D&reserved=0>
 www.sqldownunder.com | 
<https://nam06.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fgreglow.me%2F&data=02%7C01%7Csspahelp%40microsoft.com%7C1f0ea4d6b97e4d897f3708d666d1e890%7C72f988bf86f141af91ab2d7cd011db47%7C1%7C0%7C636809449091526278&sdata=IU8tnAITCjBxWafi3A9XpO9lF3PIwZJ8ad3t36lnxvs%3D&reserved=0>
 http://greglow.me

 

From: Greg Low  
Sent: Thursday, 23 January 2020 2:41 PM
To: 'ozDotNet' 
Subject: Re: [OT] What Facebook knows

 

Hi Greg,

 

They seem to apply pretty basic algorithms though. If they have access to your 
contacts on your phone, they can quickly work out who else is on FB. And then 
it gets easy. If you know two people, and they both know another 10, chances 
are high you’ll know some of that 10, and so on, and so on.

 

And it’s sure not just FB. I’ve lost count of the number of OAuth-based apps, 
that want to read your contacts, without giving you any valid reason for doing 
so. You either say yes, or you can’t use the OAuth option to connect. 

 

Regards,

 

Greg

 

On Thu, 23 Jan 2020 at 14:33, Greg Keogh mailto:gfke...@gmail.com> > wrote:

Folks, most of us probably know what I'm about to say, but when you see it 
live, it's really frightening.

 

My wife had to join Facebook for the first time ever to follow her nephew who 
is a firefighter in the ongoing disaster. She joined okay without being asked 
for a phone number. The next day she tried to get in via the Apple App and it 
demanded a mobile number. It was an absolute block until a number was entered, 
so she was compelled to. Now it gets scary...

 

She immediately was offered hundreds of friends that included my friends, 
musicians I have played with, her old work mates in jobs going back 40 years, 
extended family adult and children friends of both sides of our family, old 
workmates of mine going back to the 1980s, etc, and the list goes on to find 
obscure and tenuous links of every imaginable kind.

 

So … given that she has never been on FB before … where did all those 
associations come from? We know they have good algorithms of course, but it 
means that FB could be used to perform a comprehensive and reliable analysis of 
the complete life of someone who isn't even a member. Imagine if the police, or 
criminals, or an oppressive government simply asked FB "what do you know about 
person X?" Even if X isn't a member, they could compile a fantastically 
detailed dossier.

 

How much information does FB hold? Who are they sharing it with? It's worse 
than we think.

 

Greg K

Re: [OT] What Facebook knows

[Tony Wright]

Facebook is currently used by various agencies. It is helpful for
determining associations between people that are not otherwise known to the
agencies.

On Thu, 23 Jan 2020, 2:33 pm Greg Keogh,  wrote:

> Folks, most of us probably know what I'm about to say, but when you see it
> live, it's really frightening.
>
> My wife had to join Facebook for the first time ever to follow her nephew
> who is a firefighter in the ongoing disaster. She joined okay without being
> asked for a phone number. The next day she tried to get in via the Apple
> App and it demanded a mobile number. It was an absolute block until a
> number was entered, so she was compelled to. Now it gets scary...
>
> She immediately was offered hundreds of friends that included my friends,
> musicians I have played with, her old work mates in jobs going back 40
> years, extended family adult and children friends of both sides of our
> family, old workmates of mine going back to the 1980s, etc, and the list
> goes on to find obscure and tenuous links of every imaginable kind.
>
> So … given that she has never been on FB before … where did all those
> associations come from? We know they have good algorithms of course, but it
> means that FB could be used to perform a comprehensive and reliable
> analysis of the complete life of someone who isn't even a member. Imagine
> if the police, or criminals, or an oppressive government simply asked FB
> "what do you know about person X?" Even if X isn't a member, they could
> compile a fantastically detailed dossier.
>
> How much information does FB hold? Who are they sharing it with? It's
> worse than we think.
>
> *Greg K*
>

Re: [OT] What Facebook knows

[Greg Low]

Hi Greg,

 

They seem to apply pretty basic algorithms though. If they have access to your 
contacts on your phone, they can quickly work out who else is on FB. And then 
it gets easy. If you know two people, and they both know another 10, chances 
are high you’ll know some of that 10, and so on, and so on.

 

And it’s sure not just FB. I’ve lost count of the number of OAuth-based apps, 
that want to read your contacts, without giving you any valid reason for doing 
so. You either say yes, or you can’t use the OAuth option to connect. 

 

Regards,

 

Greg

 

On Thu, 23 Jan 2020 at 14:33, Greg Keogh mailto:gfke...@gmail.com> > wrote:

Folks, most of us probably know what I'm about to say, but when you see it 
live, it's really frightening.

 

My wife had to join Facebook for the first time ever to follow her nephew who 
is a firefighter in the ongoing disaster. She joined okay without being asked 
for a phone number. The next day she tried to get in via the Apple App and it 
demanded a mobile number. It was an absolute block until a number was entered, 
so she was compelled to. Now it gets scary...

 

She immediately was offered hundreds of friends that included my friends, 
musicians I have played with, her old work mates in jobs going back 40 years, 
extended family adult and children friends of both sides of our family, old 
workmates of mine going back to the 1980s, etc, and the list goes on to find 
obscure and tenuous links of every imaginable kind.

 

So … given that she has never been on FB before … where did all those 
associations come from? We know they have good algorithms of course, but it 
means that FB could be used to perform a comprehensive and reliable analysis of 
the complete life of someone who isn't even a member. Imagine if the police, or 
criminals, or an oppressive government simply asked FB "what do you know about 
person X?" Even if X isn't a member, they could compile a fantastically 
detailed dossier.

 

How much information does FB hold? Who are they sharing it with? It's worse 
than we think.

 

Greg K

[OT] What Facebook knows

[Greg Keogh]

Folks, most of us probably know what I'm about to say, but when you see it
live, it's really frightening.

My wife had to join Facebook for the first time ever to follow her nephew
who is a firefighter in the ongoing disaster. She joined okay without being
asked for a phone number. The next day she tried to get in via the Apple
App and it demanded a mobile number. It was an absolute block until a
number was entered, so she was compelled to. Now it gets scary...

She immediately was offered hundreds of friends that included my friends,
musicians I have played with, her old work mates in jobs going back 40
years, extended family adult and children friends of both sides of our
family, old workmates of mine going back to the 1980s, etc, and the list
goes on to find obscure and tenuous links of every imaginable kind.

So … given that she has never been on FB before … where did all those
associations come from? We know they have good algorithms of course, but it
means that FB could be used to perform a comprehensive and reliable
analysis of the complete life of someone who isn't even a member. Imagine
if the police, or criminals, or an oppressive government simply asked FB
"what do you know about person X?" Even if X isn't a member, they could
compile a fantastically detailed dossier.

How much information does FB hold? Who are they sharing it with? It's worse
than we think.

*Greg K*