[ozmidwifery] Looking for images

[Dr Penelope A Barrett]

Title: Looking for images



Does anyone know where I can get hold (online) of some nice clear graphics that relate to mothers and midwives working together? I want to do some work on a simulation/game for my students and need to get some pictures (photographs and/or graphics) to work with.

Penny B.

Re: [ozmidwifery] hurtful birth experiences

[Dr Penelope A Barrett]

Marilyn,

What can I say ... 


I am thinking and reflecting more on this since my last post - only a couple
of hours ago - there are so many 'horror' stories inside me (amongst a lot
of nice ones too) that they must have some effect on my psyche. During the
midwives' action research group (MARG) conversations when I was doing my
PhD, one of the themes in our women's talk was 'horror stories' - also it
was one of the themes/conversation threads that was part of the mothers'
group that we (MARG) set up for mothers to talk with each other. Here is a
tiny extract from one of the MARG meeting conversations where we would
reflect on our experiences as facilitator at the Early Mothering Groups.
Sorry - it's a bit long. The formatted version is in my PhD thesis. Women's
words make up 5 full chapters (well the text version of their words
transcribed from tapes). Pseudonyms are used.

Penny.

>From Chapter 11 (pp. 385-386) of
Barrett, P. A. 1998, 'Early Mothering - A Shared Experience: Feminist Action
Research with Midwives and Mothers', unpublished PhD thesis, Southern Cross
University, Lismore, New South Wales.

> Mothers¹ horror stories
> 
> Facilitators needed to be strong in themselves to be able to listen to
> mothers¹ Œhorror stories¹ without becoming defensive. We gave mothers
> permission to talk about anything, and some mothers¹ birth stories included
> unpleasant feedback about hospital carers¹ practices.
> 
> Didi...we do a lot of apologising -- [Yes.] in our mothers¹ groups.
> [laughing]
> DianaOh, don¹t we! For everyone. [Mm. Mm.] [Yeah, yeah, yeah.] (We)
apologise 
> for the way they¹re treated in...¹G¹ ward -- apologise for everything. [Yeah]
> LindaI was just telling the group about our lady last time with her
terrible 
> experience...
> Diana...Oh, oh. In the mothering group? [Yeah.] Oh, that was terrible!
[Mm] 
> It was terrible. -- [Mm] -- -- -- [Mm] -- -- It was terrible that she felt
> so...negative about doing anything about it. [Mm] That nothing would
> change...But how awful that -- I couldn¹t even remember which horror story --
> there¹s so many horror stories...[Group. Yeah. Mm.]
> UnaThe lady just said she had a horrible time.
> DianaI know...you hear so many horror stories, you just think, ŒGosh! It
> shouldn¹t be happening¹.
> 
> Laughter, crying and catharsis
> 
> One way that mothers dealt with some of the horrible experiences they had was
> to laugh. In the extract below, the theme of laughter as catharsis reinforces
> previous comments about mothers¹ need for a space to Œlet go¹ of their
> emotions and cry or laugh about whatever they choose to without someone
> passing judgement on them for being distasteful.
> 
> JuneHas anyone noticed that women laugh, a lot, about really awful things
> that they¹ve gone through? [Mm] [Yeah]...Does anyone get that in a group? --
> -- ...You know...crack a joke about -- forceps or some things that¹ve gone
> half way up to their -- [Mm] you know. And then they laugh about it. I found
> that. Kind of in a sarcastic way. A funny way. -- -- Sometimes I think it¹s a
> way of coping.
> BronteYeah, I think it is, too. [Mm]
> BettyYes, and they¹ll sometimes say they feel -- I had one group
that...they 
> weren¹t complaining about staff. It was just how things had gone wrong with
> their birth, (the birth differed) from what they expected. Like one lady had a
> prolapsed cord and...she had to have an episiotomy in a hurry, and you know,
> the baby was flat (cyanosed) and -- another one ended up having a blood
> transfusion, and...you know, [Mm] that¹s devastating to them today, but when
> they all talked about it...and they did have a bit of a laugh, they felt it
> all -- it helped -- it relieved the situation, you know. [mm]
> JuneThat¹s interesting.
> BettyYeah, it was -- it was really good the way...[Mm mm] it got it off
their 
> chest...I did write it down in this story that day, that everybody had had
> such awful experiences from what they expected to be a wonderful experience
> the way they read about (it)  in books and everything. [Mm] Nobody told them
> about these things that could happen...



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Re: [ozmidwifery] hurtful birth experiences

[Dr Penelope A Barrett]

I wonder how many midwives have also felt violated and traumatised (but not
been able to find expression) for having to partake in care of women in
hospital that has trauma as part of it - as a witness? I'm reflecting on
some really bad vibes I can remember and the (?) shame/guilt/shock (?) at
having to be witness to some of this and yet not in control of the person
who is perpetuating it. I'll have to give this some thought - it is really
disturbing me - may be an explanation for some tensions I carry.

PennyB.

On 7/11/02 7:21 PM, "Margie Perkins" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> My heart goes out to everyone who is sharing or has had soul and body hurting
> births. It is not ok.  And must change. I have had the honour of supporting a
> number of women who have previously been traumatised by caesareans (or other
> things)  and it is something so special to be part of their new journey.
> 
> love and the greatest respect to you all.
> 

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Re: [ozmidwifery] Australian Story

[Dr Penelope A Barrett]

I wondered why she had said that she was having a caesarean section because
it was 'safest' way to go. She may have had other reasons but this was not a
good editing job (whoever did it) to let this bit get out without context.
The partner's comments I found a bit 'off' - talking about what she had been
prior to the pregnancy and then afterwards - implying it was a bit of a
turnoff - again possibly a poor editing job as comments like this may have
been taken out of context.

I thought that this wasn't such a sound message to be sending out on
national TV as it's not true.

Penny.


On 30/10/02 11:51 AM, "Larry & Megan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> I needed to comment on the follow up of Vanessa,Layla and her very beautiful
> Raphael and I wish no disrespect to her or her choices. I was watching and
> crying as we all no doubt were but when I saw her baby being born by

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Re: [ozmidwifery] Placenta cream

[Dr Penelope A Barrett]

* Big Smile*

> I can show you some beautiful bougainvillias and other spectacular tress
> growing around Sydney where I know some home birth placentas were used
> wisely and not wasted.
> 
> Jan Robinson 
> 


PennyB.

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Re: [ozmidwifery] Placenta cream

[Dr Penelope A Barrett]

In the 70s and 80s, we used to rub the vernix into our hands after births -
I always thought this was true. But then of course, they invented Hep B and
HIV in the 80s so this practice had to cease. As an aside, I was also
reminded in the labour ward at Guy's Hospital in London in 1979 that I
should (being an Australian) be fully aware of the 'Australia antigen' for
hepatitis. 

It wouldn't surprise me as babies have such amazingly soft skin and they're
in liquid all the time until after they're born.

Penny B.

On 23/10/02 4:06 PM, "Jennifer Semple" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:

> I think I remember a midwife who used to live in France saying that
> human placentas are actually made in to cream.  I can't remember if she
> said that the cream is sold in France or if it's exported.  Hmmm... I'll
> have to double check.
> 
> Has anyone else ever heard of anything like this?
>

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Re: [ozmidwifery] NMAP

[Dr Penelope A Barrett]

Title: Re: [ozmidwifery] NMAP



I agree about the power behind NMAP.

I have passed its reference and relevance on to a couple of hundred 3rd year general nursing students (doing a family health unit of study), a class of Grad. Dip. Mid. Students, and six Master of Mid. Students (the latter who, with me, attended the launch in NSW at Parliament House – a ‘living classroom). I have had wonderful, informed, well-argued, and (in many cases, thanks to NMAP, well-referenced) essays come in and presentations from the general nursing students about continuity of carer, choice in childbirth, etc . I am truly indebted to the people who put in the hard ‘yakka’ to get this document together and into the public sphere. From my students and myself, thank you.

Penny B.

 

Re: [ozmidwifery] Midwives & computer databases

[Dr Penelope A Barrett]

Rosalee,

I was interested in this posting as I am doing a degree in IT and education,
and I am always trying to figure out how midwives and others can feel that
they are in control of the 'tools' that can help with being able to be with
women/doing their chosen work whatever this may be. So when I heard about
the computer program that allows this, my interest was aroused.

It sounds great that midwives can control their own data input and save on
notes/reports etc - the repetition of all of this does take away from the
midwifery work, although of course this too is part of it (recording).

For my own doctoral studies, I found that some of the medicos were really
interested in what I was doing (feminist action research with midwives and
mothers) and one even stated that he wished he could be doing something like
this, so I do agree with you that working with other health professionals as
colleagues is really important, yet at the same time this means, as you say,
that we need to be 'in control' of the data we generate with each and every
interaction with mothers and babies. I'm not sure I would call it 'our' data
though. I prefer to think that we are entitled to have access to
acknowledgement by all who work with mothers and babies in childbirth that
what we generate in terms of data and/or knowledge is legitimate. The
ownership thing is a bit 'them' and 'us' to my liking - it all contributes
to the common good, as long as it is used somehow in a constructively
critical way to improve care and/or generate awareness about issues that
count.

Sincerely,

Penny B.


On 1/10/02 5:14 PM, "Rosalee Shaw" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Midwives were well represented on the consortium which developed OBSTET, and
> they continue to be involved with it - any if any of them are on this list
> they might tell you who they are.
> 
> It was designed by midwives, and intended to give midwives control of their
> own data, and yes, I mean the ones with the women !
> 
> Any history of midwifery will throw light on the damage done to the profession
> by its attitude that  "some-one-else" could  mess with data - some-one like
> doctors or beaurocrats.
> 
> The future of midwifery is in our data, and we should control it !
> 
> Regards
> Rosalee
> 
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 10/01/02 03:06PM >>>
> Robin, 
> 
> Were any midwives involved in planning, designing and implementing the
> software? By midwives, I mean the ones with the women.
> 
> Penny B. 
> 

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Re: [ozmidwifery] SUNDAY AND MONDAY's GOOD NEWS

[Dr Penelope A Barrett]

Congratulations Jan,

Your energy is almost palpable here in Hazelbrook. I will send this on to my
midwifery students to help keep them motivated.

Penny.

On 1/10/02 7:44 AM, "Jan Robinson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

>   
> Dear List
> 
> Just giving you the lowdown of what is happening in my personal life and
> within the expanding Maternity Coalition NSW.
> 

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Re: [ozmidwifery] computer databases

[Dr Penelope A Barrett]

Robin,

Were any midwives involved in planning, designing and implementing the
software? By midwives, I mean the ones with the women.

Penny B.

On 30/9/02 8:16 PM, "Robin Moon" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> NO, the OBSTET data base does not take the place of notes and paper
> unfortunately.
> Whilst it is great for generating data in an orderly and easy fashion, it is
> VERY time consuming. Particularly in  a labour ward.It is great however for
> pulling stats when needed to back up one's arguments with medical staff
> etc. But I say, Roll on OBSTET Mark 2 cos this one is wearing thin
> 
> Whilst the intentions were great for it's development and use, I have found
> units that now require of the LW midwife to enter pregnancy and labour info
> on the database, progress notes on the labour AND the partogram. PHew!  No
> wonder we're all stressed!
> 
> Jen, I think the State of the Art hospital in Australia is one that would
> have the woman as their focus. Not documentation, not legalese, not doctors.
> Where is that cos I want a job there! lol.
> 
> Robin
> 
> 
> 
> - Original Message -
> From: "Jennifer Semple" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sent: Monday, September 30, 2002 1:12 PM
> Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] computer databases
> 
> 
>> Please forgive my ignorance on the issue... but does a computer
>> database take place of the midwife making notes & obs on paper?
>> 
>> I was w/ a woman @ her birth in a hospital in the US where they had a
>> PC in every labour & birth room (every room was private)... all of the
>> notes & obs were entered directly on to it & the CTG was hooked up to
>> the PC as well.  Hehehe, it was hard to tell whether the computer or
>> the bed (with the woman tethered to it) was more of a focal point in
>> the room!
>> 
>> I'm a first year BMid student & haven't been on clinicals yet, so I
>> don't know what the "state of the state" in hospital in Oz is.  I'm not
>> passing judgement on the computers... I have no idea what the pros &
>> cons are for the midwife... just my observation from the birth w/ the
>> woman.
>> 
>> Jen
>> 
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Re: [ozmidwifery] A mans point of view.

[Dr Penelope A Barrett]

Title: Re: [ozmidwifery] A mans point of view.



As one of my colleagues said when we were trying to get things going during the action research project that comprised most of my doctoral project, and there were various stakeholders and gatekeepers with whom we had to negotiate to set up a group for women to talk with each other, ‘Send them love’ (with a northern English accent so the ‘love’ is pronounced in a special way that makes it more memorable and interesting. It worked.

I’m sure Sean’s comments were meant to be humorous but sometimes terribly sad and negative stereotypes can be reinforced like they are in this instance. This was a great and wise response, Carolyn.

Penny B.

 On 21/9/02 7:05 PM, "Heartlogic" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

Mary M, thanks so much for sending this item. The following is a response I sent to Lifematters. 

In solidarity, Carolyn Hastie

Re: [ozmidwifery] SMH Letter

[Dr Penelope A Barrett]

Check out Bettina Arndt's comments on childbirth today in the Sydney Morning
Herald - page 11 - In her bit on 'combining motherhood and politics harder
than a triple twist with a flip' - she goes on to describe her own
experiences and (I am supposing she means well but really) compares having a
baby with owning a pig farm and the language is primarily of of
hazard/danger/.
I'm not sure that everyone will grasp the subtleties of her message.

Penny.

 

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Re: [ozmidwifery] Cup and fingerfeeding

[Dr Penelope A Barrett]

I too would be interested so that I can pass this information on the the
midwifery students I teach.

Penny B.

On 4/9/02 2:22 PM, "Irene Munro" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Can anyone enlighten me as to the recent developments
> in cup and fingerfeeding?   I have just been informed
> that it has been 'banned' because of the increase in
> upper lobe pneumonia in infants.   Is this true?
> Irene Munro LC
> Alice Springs
> 

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Re: [ozmidwifery] Presenting a united front

[Dr Penelope A Barrett]

I am moved to comment here.

I too think that it's really important that we can discuss things freely
within the professional group and also in its periphery and outside of it,
but seeing as how ACMI supports the direction of midwife-led
(medically-backed) care, the strength of the case for all of these
much-needed (and massive) changes will weaken if those who are on the same
side bag the professional organisation representing midwives in this
country.

I know this is a bit corny for some people, but I still believe that
strength is possible in a caring and supportive (and informed) way and
through this, consensus across groups who want similar things after they
have sorted out differences between themselves is a much stronger way to
move the non-believers.

Penny B.


On 30/8/02 9:25 AM, "ACMI President" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Dear Andrea,
> 
> Thanks for this - to suggest that I am devastated by this article is a
> complete understatement, and Robyn is not even a member!!
> 
>> I have just been shown the weekend paper that had an article about
>> independent midwives in it.  Robyn Thompson put forward a confident
>> picture of not being defeated by the withdrawal of insurance but what I
>> found distressing was the need of another midwife to bag the ACMI in
>> public.  (Personally I believe the executive have /are continuing to try
>> and do every thing they can to negotiate insurance of behalf of members
>> who are practicing independently) but even if you don't believe this
>> then the place to take it up is surely with the executive rather than in
>> the paper.  Members bagging our professional organisation in public must
>> damage the organisations credibility in the eyes of the very people we
>> need to influence if we are ever to make inroads on this front.
>> 
>> I understand as well as anybody the frustration those practicing
>> independently without insurance but lets vent our frustration together
>> but present a united front to the public.
>> 
>> Andrea Quanchi

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