Re: [ozmidwifery] waterbirth

[Gail McKenzie]

Thank you so much.  I live at the Gold Coast.  I'll pay a visit.  :)



From: "Dan & Rachael Austin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
To: 
Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] waterbirth
Date: Sun, 11 Feb 2007 10:49:42 +1000

Selangor is located at Nambour on the sunshine coast in QLD :)  It IS a 
great place! :)


- Original Message - From: "Gail McKenzie" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 
Sent: Sunday, February 11, 2007 10:09 AM
Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] waterbirth


Can somebody PLEASE tell me where Selangor is?  I would move if I had to 
work in a place like that.


Gail :)



From: "Lynne Staff" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
To: 
Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] waterbirth
Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2007 16:21:35 +1000

Hi Amy
Sorry I missed your email and found it today. Yes Selangor welcomes 
students. Unfortunately most come for their 'alternative' birth 
experience - this is very telling, don't you think?

Regards, Lynne
  - Original Message -
  From: adamnamy
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
  Sent: Friday, December 22, 2006 6:15 PM
  Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] waterbirth


  Hi Lynne,



  Does Selangor take midwifery students?   It seems a great place to 
learn the skills.




  Amy




--

  From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lynne Staff

  Sent: Thursday, 21 December 2006 8:05 PM
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
  Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] waterbirth



  Hi Mary

  At Selangor we - midwives, obstetricians and paediatricians - have 
'officially' supported women for waterbirth since Feb 1998. Our rate is 
35% of vaginal births and over 1600 babies have been waterborn since we 
opened. We will continue to do so as it has benefits for women, their 
babies and is safe.


  Regards, Lynne





  - Original Message -

From: Mary Murphy

To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au

Sent: Thursday, December 21, 2006 12:50 PM

Subject: [ozmidwifery] waterbirth



Hi everyone, I know this question has been asked before, but I can't 
remember the answer.  Do we have any maternity units, birth centres etc 
who officially do waterbirth?  I know homebirthers do, but I want to know 
about institutions.  Thanks, MM


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Re: [ozmidwifery] waterbirth

[Gail McKenzie]

Can somebody PLEASE tell me where Selangor is?  I would move if I had to 
work in a place like that.


Gail :)



From: "Lynne Staff" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
To: 
Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] waterbirth
Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2007 16:21:35 +1000

Hi Amy
Sorry I missed your email and found it today. Yes Selangor welcomes 
students. Unfortunately most come for their 'alternative' birth experience 
- this is very telling, don't you think?

Regards, Lynne
  - Original Message -
  From: adamnamy
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
  Sent: Friday, December 22, 2006 6:15 PM
  Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] waterbirth


  Hi Lynne,



  Does Selangor take midwifery students?   It seems a great place to learn 
the skills.




  Amy




--

  From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lynne Staff

  Sent: Thursday, 21 December 2006 8:05 PM
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
  Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] waterbirth



  Hi Mary

  At Selangor we - midwives, obstetricians and paediatricians - have 
'officially' supported women for waterbirth since Feb 1998. Our rate is 35% 
of vaginal births and over 1600 babies have been waterborn since we opened. 
We will continue to do so as it has benefits for women, their babies and is 
safe.


  Regards, Lynne





  - Original Message -

From: Mary Murphy

To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au

Sent: Thursday, December 21, 2006 12:50 PM

Subject: [ozmidwifery] waterbirth



Hi everyone, I know this question has been asked before, but I can't 
remember the answer.  Do we have any maternity units, birth centres etc who 
officially do waterbirth?  I know homebirthers do, but I want to know about 
institutions.  Thanks, MM


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RE: [ozmidwifery] Fund rebates

[Gail McKenzie]

I can add to this outrage.  I am a naturopath and as such could not assist 
any of my pregnant patients to birth their babies.  I had to go the 
circuitous route and study first as an RN & then 1 year postgrad to become a 
midwife.  Now, after this four years, as a midwife I cannot claim rebate 
from the system that "trained" me, but as a naturopath I can.  How bizzare 
is that?


Gail



From: "Mary Murphy" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
To: 
Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] Fund rebates
Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 16:38:15 +0900

The voters can and the members of Health Funds can.  We midwives cannot. We
independent midwives have all been trying for years and years. Sometimes 
the

ACMI has a go, but all to no avail so far. MM



  _

This is totally unacceptable and bloody outrageous - how can we change
this???!!

Kristin

>Medicare does not recognise Midwives as 'professionals' competent or
capable of practicing without the supervision of a doctor in Australia.
Therefore it will not recompense any services provided by them to pregnant
women.
>HOWEVER: The exception is when working in a remote community :
>in which case you don't even have to be a midwife to provide pre-natal
care, enrolled nurses & aboriginal health workers with NO mid education are
considered quite competent to provide maternity care which medicare will
refund for as long as they are supervised (however loosely) by a doctor 
(who

of course knows much more about normal pregnancy & childbirth then any
midwife) !
>
>If Midwives were as qualified as a chiropractor, chiropodist, naturopath,
herbalist etc then they would get recognition.
>It would appear that we just aren't up to scratch !!!
>Our skills whilst working within a hospital immediately disappear once we
step off the premises apparently.
>Amazing stuff !
>
> >
> > I rang medicare this this week to see on any level particually 
medicare

> > 16400, if they would fund childbirth education classes. Unfortuantely
> > they don't. They suggested ringing hte major health funds, I haven't
> > gotten there yet, but wuold be interested to know too...
> >
> > Rachael
> >
> >> Now all you work from home and have your own business midwives can 
you
> >> please tell me how I am able to offer health fund rebates IF I 
decided

to
> >> fun my own business from home I have been thinking of it for a
while -
> >> not homebirths as such cause I want insurance for that but other
midwifery
> >> services that I can offer?
> >>
> >>
> >>
>

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Re: [ozmidwifery] waterbirth

[Gail McKenzie]

Pardon my ignorance, but where is Selangor?  I too would be interested in 
published outcomes


Luv,  Gail

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Re: [ozmidwifery] What happened with this birth?

[Gail McKenzie]

place. Over time, you may have more influence as trust deepens between 
you.  We need to focus on the long term with our doctor midwife 
relationships. Remember that he is scared of birth and wants to control it 
- the women get in the way of that and get caught in the melee. He is doing 
the best he can with what he knows. Doctors are not enemies, they are, in 
the main, ignorant about normal birthing physiology. Power dynamics, 
history and politics have put them where they don't belong. We as midwives 
have to work with that reality to the best of our ability. Birthing women, 
when they have accurate information, can call the tune. However, if someone 
is doing something that is not medically 'right', then it is important to 
put in a formal complaint and have the matter seen to.


Hope this helps, warmly, Carolyn












- Original Message - From: "Gail McKenzie" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 
Sent: Friday, December 29, 2006 11:04 AM
Subject: [ozmidwifery] What happened with this birth?


It's been so interesting for me to read about this birth and Andrea's 
woman's experience too.  I am a newly qualified student midwife currently 
working in birth suite doing my rotations.  I have come across both these 
types of births and each time I instinctively knew the mother & baby only 
needed to reorientate their head-space.  Unfortunately, hospital protocol 
& "time" would not allow for it.  I even had a "discussion" with the 
doctor about giving more time as the labours were going so beautifully 
until then (coincidentally, both stalled when VE performed by him???)


Outcome was 1 enemy for me & 2 very unhappy women getting C/S.  If it 
wasn't for websites like this one the next 12 months would be the longest, 
most unhappiest of my life.  You are all keeping me sane & knowing that my 
instincts are not wrong.  Thank you, ladies.


Gail x

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[ozmidwifery] What happened with this birth?

[Gail McKenzie]

It's been so interesting for me to read about this birth and Andrea's 
woman's experience too.  I am a newly qualified student midwife currently 
working in birth suite doing my rotations.  I have come across both these 
types of births and each time I instinctively knew the mother & baby only 
needed to reorientate their head-space.  Unfortunately, hospital protocol & 
"time" would not allow for it.  I even had a "discussion" with the doctor 
about giving more time as the labours were going so beautifully until then 
(coincidentally, both stalled when VE performed by him???)


Outcome was 1 enemy for me & 2 very unhappy women getting C/S.  If it wasn't 
for websites like this one the next 12 months would be the longest, most 
unhappiest of my life.  You are all keeping me sane & knowing that my 
instincts are not wrong.  Thank you, ladies.


Gail x

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[no subject]

[Gail McKenzie]

Hello, everybody,

It's been really interesting reading about the birth

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Re: [ozmidwifery] rural maternity services

[Gail McKenzie]

Great idea!! What a fabulous documentary opportunity for someone.  
Wish I could do it.


Gail x



From: "diane" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
To: 
Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] rural maternity services
Date: Mon, 23 Oct 2006 15:07:53 +1000

Tragic isn't it that so many of us know this scenario in many regions over 
the country??
Would make a great documentary to travel around our country talking to the 
women in the regions of their experiences with birthing services, including 
those who have solved their problems with good consumer driven services. 
Anyone got filmmaking skills??

Cheers
Di
  - Original Message -
  From: D. Morgan
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
  Sent: Monday, October 23, 2006 2:34 PM
  Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] rural maternity services


  No, Maleny-Sunshine Coast. But I think the story is the same everywhere. 
It is the consumers we need to get moving because no one is listening to 
the healthcare workers.
  I am still stunned at how quickly things have moved since our 
girls(consumers) got their teeth into the problem. They have read 
everything I have given them on models of care, the review of Maternity 
services in Qld, etc. and have a solution to just about every problem that 
has been put to them, I am very proud of them.

  Di M


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RE: [ozmidwifery] The Purple Line

[Gail McKenzie]

This is really interesting.  As a student I have access to hundreds of 
databases.  I went straight to Lancet to access the article.  (Actually, it 
is 1990, 335(8681), not 1997.  Anyway, guess what?  While the article is 
listed in the contents page at the front, it cannot be accessed.  I tried 
all the databases & none of them will let me have it.  Hmmm.Mayhaps 
one will have to dig out an actual copy of the magazine to find it.  Tell me 
again...Who controls access to information?  Should I expect a knock on the 
door anytime soon?




From: "Tania Smallwood" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
To: 
Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] The Purple Line
Date: Mon, 4 Sep 2006 08:25:08 +0930

Hi Mary,



The reference from the article by Lesley Hobbs is the article that was
initially published in the Lancet…here is the complete reference from the
Hobbs article…



Byrne DL, Edmonds DK.  Clinical method for evaluating progress in the first
stage of labour.  Lancet  1997; 335(8681): 122



I haven’t actually seen the original study, just came across the Hobbs
article when I was doing my Mid training in 1998.  She was published in the
Practising Midwife, in November 1998 Volume 1 Number 11 p 34-35.



I have often thought how great it would be to have some more compelling
evidence, in this age of having to justify everything with the research, 
but

the idea of conducting a study, and comparing length of purple line to
cervical dilatation on women throughout labour seems just unthinkable.  So 
I
think it will have to be one of those things that we see, and perhaps 
report

on in a retrospective manner.  Perhaps a national purple line database…just
thoughts!  I think Heather Hancock from Uni SA was considering doing some
research using photos and then looking at the time of the photo showing the
elongated purple line, with the time of birth, and using that comparison to
propose that it could be used as a complementary tool when assessing a
woman’s progress in labour.  Haven’t heard anything else about it though…



Tania

xx



   _

From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mary Murphy
Sent: Monday, 4 September 2006 7:57 AM
To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] The Purple Line



Tania, could I please have a few more details? E.g. author and complete
title of article? I am also puzzled by the (8681). I can’t seem to access 
it

with the details you provided.  Thanks, MM



Tania wrote:

For anyone who's interested, the original piece of research was pubished in

the Lancet 1997, 335(8681): 122 entitled Clinical Method for Evaluat




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RE: [ozmidwifery] midwifery exchange

[Gail McKenzie]

Hi, Paivi,

I for one would be very interested in an exchange program. As a student we 
have very little access to any other form of midwifery other than that 
practised at the hospital we are placed with.  It would be wonderful to be 
able to broaden one's knowledge with first-hand experience of other ways of 
doing.


Regards,  Gail



From: Päivi Laukkanen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
To: 
Subject: [ozmidwifery] midwifery exchange
Date: Sat, 2 Sep 2006 22:54:26 +0300

Hi all,

I am having preliminary thoughts about starting some kind of sponsorship 
program for midwifery exchange. Earlier this year I met a Finnish 
obstetrician, who only does gynegology and homebirths at the moment. ( Only 
4-6 homebirths / year. We only have some 20 homebirths in our country..) 
Every year she travels to Holland to spend time with the local midwives. 
She said she needs this to boost her confidence and get inspiration for 
what she does. After this I have been wondering if I could start to sponsor 
(trough my maternity business) one midwife or midwifery student every year 
to travel somewhere for 2 weeks or 2 months to see how women labor and give 
birth in the non-medicaliced environment and care. This could be spending 
time with a homemidwife or maybe at a birthing centre or even both. If 
there happened to be some great homebirth conference around the time, 
wouldn't that be perfect for her. I think going to Holland the language 
might be bit of a problem, but US, UK or Australia would be great, since 
most people do speak good english.


Has anyone heard of programs like this?
Are there some legal issues, I should worry about?
Do you think there would be homebirth midwives or birth centres in 
Australia, which would take exchangees like this?

What would be a good length for the stay?
Do you think the exchange midwife could stay at the hosting midwife's home 
or would she need an apartment?
Would it be better if two midwives from same unit would go, so they could 
share their experience and maybe be stronger to change things once they 
return home?
What kind of a payment you feel the hosting midwife would want for this 
time?


Almost twenty years ago I spent a year in Adelaide as a Rotary Exchange 
student. I lived with the local families and attended high school. I must 
say it was one of the best years in my life and it had a huge impact on my 
later life. It was great to learn so much about a different culture by 
living with these families. I am still very close to the people I stayed 
with and consider them my family. Have been back five times since then =). 
I am just thinking how much this experinece could change one midwife's 
views and practise...


Please share any thoughts you have about this.

Regards,

Päivi Laukkanen
Childbirth Educator
Finland



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RE: [ozmidwifery] OMG what next?

[Gail McKenzie]

Mary, I'm a midwifery student & I saw you at the Homebirth Australia 
Conference this year.  I've been on this mailing list since the beginning of 
the year & I've read it every day since I signed on.  I have to say that you 
have an uncanny knack of saying things in such a way that I go "Oh yeah, 
that's another way of looking at it".  You should teach, if you don't 
already.  Being able to break things down & give people "AHA" moments is a 
real gift.  I for one would be a very willing pupil.  I love reading what 
you write.  I love reading what everyone on this site writes. You girls 
rock


LOL Gail :)



From: "Mary Murphy" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
To: 
Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] OMG what next?
Date: Sat, 2 Sep 2006 19:10:58 +0800

Just to play devils advocate, what is so terrible about something that 
helps

women do what they are already being instructed to do??  "Put your hands
behind your knees, pull your legs up against your chest, put your chin on
your chest, close your mouth and push as hard as you can down into your
bottom".  This guy has just made an aid to make all those instructions a
little easier to follow.  I think it is the perception of need for such an
aid that is awful.  MM





That is just awful!

Shelly




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Re: [ozmidwifery] Breastfeeding feedback

[Gail McKenzie]

Jo, do you work in a hospital in a postnatal ward?  I want to know what 
homebirth midwives know about this





From: Jo Bourne <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Breastfeeding feedback
Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2006 16:07:53 +1000

Actually this list is one of the only places I have heard this side of the 
coin, most often I hear women say "I thought it was supposed to be natural 
and easy and just work... I wish someone had told me it might be hard and 
need some work, that we might BOTH need to learn how to do it".




At 3:51 PM +1000 9/8/06, Gail McKenzie wrote:
>Hi All.
>
>The feedback I've gotten so far seems to mirror what I instinctively 
believe breastfeeding to be.  Pamphlets that are distributed at the 
hospital advocate breastfeeding as a "learned response from both mother and 
baby".  Um...May I say.CRAP?

>
>
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[ozmidwifery] Breastfeeding feedback

[Gail McKenzie]

Hi All.

The feedback I've gotten so far seems to mirror what I instinctively believe 
breastfeeding to be.  Pamphlets that are distributed at the hospital 
advocate breastfeeding as a "learned response from both mother and baby".  
Um...May I say.CRAP?



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[ozmidwifery] Breastfeeding

[Gail McKenzie]

To all you magnificent home birth warrior women out there, could you please 
tell me if any of your birthing women have problems with breastfeeding. I'm 
a middy student working on a ward at the present & I'm astounded by how many 
women have problems with breastfeeding.


If your women do not, please enlighten me as to why you think this is.  If 
they do, again, what do you put this down to?



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[ozmidwifery] VBAC

[Gail McKenzie]

Hi everybody,

For those of you who were at that wonderful homebirth conference in Geelong 
last month, you may recall Ina May warning us about women in the US whose 
uterus had been sutured in one single layer instead of two following 
caesareans and the problems this poses for future VBACs.  When I went onto 
PN ward, I told the staff about this & they laughed at me and were adamant 
that it would never happen here in Australia.  Our doctors are too well 
trained.  Guess what?  I've gone through the notes this week of caesars done 
last week & this.  Two of the women had their uteruses sutured in a single 
layer.  Can't happen here?   Just wanted to make you aware it certainly does 
and is.


Regards,  Gail


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RE: [ozmidwifery] VBAC in Qld?- Answer for Nicole

[Gail McKenzie]

Hi, Nicole,

VBAC stands for Vaginal Birth After Caesarian.  Not many hospitals will 
accommodate a woman wanting to give birth vaginally after a caesarian, 
quoting it too dangerous and that it could lead to uterine rupture, but the 
research literature supports VBAC and found it to be no more dangerous than 
normal birth.  Go to any of the childbirth websites to find out more. Hope 
this helps.


Gail



From: "Nicole Carver" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
To: 
Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] VBAC in Qld?
Date: Wed, 17 May 2006 13:55:36 +1000

Forgive my ignorance, but what is an EBAC?
Thanks,
Nicole.
  -Original Message-
  From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Philippa Scott
  Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2006 12:57 PM
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
  Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] VBAC in Qld?


  Hi,



  I am in Townsville where we (Birth Buddies) have had a few clients have
VBAC'S and EBAC's. The Townsville Hospital (public) is the best bet up 
here.
I have had a VBAC there to and am always pleased to help those planning 
VBAC

's. I can be contacted if you like on 47734075 or 0407648349.



  Cheers



  Philippa Scott
  Birth Buddies - Doula
  Assisting women and their families in the preparation towards childbirth
and labour.
  President of Friends of the Birth Centre Townsville





--

  From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lynne Staff
  Sent: Wednesday, 17 May 2006 8:57 AM
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
  Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] VBAC in Qld?



  Hi Penny - she would be very welcome at Selangor, but Nambour is a 
little

far from Cairns! Regards,

  Lynne

- Original Message -

From: penny burrows

To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au

Sent: Tuesday, May 16, 2006 8:54 PM

Subject: [ozmidwifery] VBAC in Qld?



Hi everyone

I have some childbirth education clients that are planning a move to
Qld - somewhere between Airlie Beach and Cairns. The mum had a previous
caesarean as her baby was breech (arghhh!!) and she really wants to land
somewhere where she will be supportend to birth vaginally this time. She is
27 weeks pregnant and planning to move next week so we are in a rush to 
find

a destination!!



Anyone have any clues as to supportive obstetricians, doctors, 
midwives

up that way? She doesn't want to birth at home so is looking for support in
a hospital/ birth centre environment.



Thanks in anticipation,

Penny Burrows

  - Original Message -

  From: Mary Murphy

  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au

  Sent: Tuesday, May 16, 2006 8:34 PM

  Subject: [ozmidwifery] Stop me!.



  Now I'm on the thread I cant seem to stop. MM



  Update of:

a.. Cochrane Database Syst Rev. 2000;(2):CD001056.

  Periconceptional supplementation with folate and/or multivitamins 
for

preventing neural tube defects.

  Lumley J, Watson L, Watson M, Bower C.

  Centre for the Study of Mothers' and Children's Health, La Trobe
University, 251 Faraday St, Carlton, Vic, Australia, 3053.
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

  BACKGROUND: Neural tube defects arise during the development of the
brain and spinal cord. OBJECTIVES: The objective of this review was to
assess the effects of increased consumption of folate or multivitamins on
the prevalence of neural tube defects periconceptionally (that is before
pregnancy and in the first two months of pregnancy). SEARCH STRATEGY: We
searched the Cochrane Pregnancy and Childbirth Group trials register. Date
of last search: April 2001. SELECTION CRITERIA: Randomised and
quasi-randomised trials comparing periconceptional supplementation by
multivitamins with placebo, folate with placebo, or multivitamins with
folate; different dosages of multivitamins or folate; prepregnancy dietary
advice and counselling in primary care settings to increase the consumption
of folate-rich foods, or folate-fortified foods, with standard care;
increased intensity of information provision with standard public health
dissemination. DATA COLLECTION AND ANALYSIS: Two reviewers assessed trial
quality and extracted data. MAIN RESULTS: Four trials of supplementation
involving 6425 women were included. The trials all addressed the question 
of

supplementation and they were of variable quality. Periconceptional folate
supplementation reduced the incidence of neural tube defects (relative risk
0.28, 95% confidence interval 0.13 to 0.58). Folate supplementation did not
significantly increase miscarriage, ectopic pregnancy or stillbirth,
although there was a possible increase in multiple gestation. Multivitamins
alone were not associated with prevention of neural tube defects and did 
not

produce additional preventive effects when given with folate. One
dissemination trial, a community randomised trial, was identified involving
six communities, mat