Re: [PD] get dir of current pd

[Jonathan Wilkes]

On 07/20/2013 11:13 AM, Jonathan Wilkes wrote:

On 07/18/2013 02:16 PM, Jonathan Wilkes wrote:

On 07/17/2013 09:44 AM, Max wrote:
is there something like [ggee/getdir] but for getting the path of 
the currently running Pd binary?


Seems like I saw this somewhere, but I can't remember where.

I'll add it to [pdinfo]


Hm... there's a function pd_getdirname listed in m_pd.h, but it's a 
mirage because the

function isn't defined anywhere.

What's the story?


Ok, I figured out how to do this, but:

1) Why do you need the directory of the pd binary?  Finding the 
directory of a running
executable is tricky-- I can set it up for Windows and most Linuxes but 
there might
be a distro where it wouldn't work, or a new OS that needs yet another 
trick to find
it.  I guess this is why pd_getdirname doesn't actually get defined 
anywhere...


Getting the current working directory is pretty straightforward, though 
I don't know

if that's useful.

-Jonathan

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Re: [PD] Reverse Kickstarter Update

[Jonathan Wilkes]

On 07/27/2013 04:13 AM, João Pais wrote:

Hi,

nice work. I just tested it on windows xp sp3, and it works. At some 
other point I can test it on w7, and ubuntu.


Some remarks, though, in case it interests you - or shold they be sent 
to someone else?
- when patching, I could open/close an object to text edit it by using 
ctrl-return. This doesn't work here anymore. Was it replaced by 
another key combination?


Hm, I think that was added in Pd-extended/Pd-l2ork, but maybe Pd-Vanilla 
doesn't have it.  My demo build

is based off of Vanilla so that may be why it isn't there.


- which font are you using? it looks a bit strange'


The entire dialog, or just the headings?  I hard-coded some font for the 
headings just to get them
to be bold-- that's something I'll change now that I can test it on all 
platforms.


- alt-f doesn't work to access the file menu. it would also be clearer 
if the shortcut keys (F, E, ...) would be underlined, as usual in 
windows menus


Probably also something that's in Pd-extended (Pd-l2ork?) but not in 
Vanilla.  I'll check.



- I guess autopatching is always on? didn't find a switch for it


On Vanilla, yes.

- what does the "tidy up" command do, besides putting a comment in the 
console? would it be better to remove it?


In Vanilla and Pd-extended, nearly nothing.  In Pd-l2ork, it actually 
tidies up the patch by aligning
objects vertically and horizontally.  (Can't remember the method it uses 
but it seemed to work ok

in Pd-l2ork when I tested it.)

 - it might be a bit strange to have the same preferences menu in the 
media and file menus.


Ah yes, I meant to remove the one from the file menu.  I'll fix that.

And then another preferences menu in Edit. I don't know anything of 
menu design, but why not:

  - add the path and startup sections to the preferences window


I think those sections are deprecated in Pd-extended.  Not sure about 
Pd-l2ork, Vanilla...


  - access this window only through one menu? I guess in Media would 
be the most traditional place, but many programs have it in Edit.


I think "Edit" is the right place on GNU/Linux and Windows, and under 
the main "apple" menu on OSX.


- the GUI profile is a very nice idea, I've been doing it for years 
with Hans' commands. If you want, adding font+size would make it complete.


You mean the font dialog/ font "bomb"?  I think that's per canvas, no?

- are there any patches you would need to test specific parts of your 
work? I might be able to help with that, since I can't program C or tcl/tk


A patch with all the iemguis, text, object boxes, and message boxes is 
sufficient to test the GUI settings.  For the others, if you try to do 
normal audio/midi work and let me know if you hit a snag.





On startup I get the console output:
midiin: windows: not supported
sysexin: windows: not supported
setting SO_BROADCAST

rmstopow~
... couldn't create
powtorms~
... couldn't create
scalar
... couldn't create
scope~
... couldn't create
warning -- 'template' (pd-help-intro.pd) is obsolete; replace with 
'struct'


Sounds like error messages related to the patch that opens when you 
right-click "Help"
on an empty part of a patch.  Except for "setting SO_BROADCAST". Not 
sure what that

relates to.

-Jonathan





2013/7/26 Jonathan Wilkes mailto:jancs...@yahoo.com>>

On 07/26/2013 04:39 PM, Colet Patrice wrote:

Le 26/07/2013 20:53, Jonathan Wilkes a écrit :


I just tested my demo buid using asio via port audio with
the "Test Audio and MIDI" patch and it seems to work.



what system are you using? Mine is windows vista home premium SP2.


Mine is Windows XP Service Pack 3.

I can test later on a Windows Vista system.

-Jonathan


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Re: [PD] Reverse Kickstarter Update

[Jonathan Wilkes]

Ok, with Dan's help I've now got a quick demo of the dialog preferences 
for OSX (intel):

http://puredata.info/Members/jancsika/Pd-with-prefs-0.43.zip/view?searchterm=pd%20with%20prefs

Turns out the ability to build for ppc arch is no longer supported in 
recent versions of XCode (if I understand it correctly).


I guess I built without support for any other audio APIs, so the 
dropdown is permanently empty which is a little weird.  Also you need at 
least tcl/tk 8.5 on your system.  But other than that it should work.


If you try it out then me some feedback on the preferences dialog.

And if you have some money and like what you see, show me some beans and 
rice: :)

https://jwilkes.nfhost.com/donations.php

-Jonathan

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Re: [PD] Preset saving with SSSAD

[Jonathan Wilkes]

On 07/29/2013 04:18 PM, András Murányi wrote:



[...]
- is the SSSAD in s-abstractions recent enough for these
tricks?

(http://code.google.com/p/s-abstractions/source/browse/#svn%2Ftrunk%2Fsssad)
- is there an example patch of SSSAD local saving available?
i just wish to see/understand how to save and load presets
exclusive for an abstraction instance.
- or, please, is it possible to list the steps of creating
SSSAD local saving for an abstraction? (eventually using
[presetstore]... which I have attached because it's not
hosted anywhere any more)?
- is at viable at all to avoid using rjlib for this (and to
use 'pure' SSSAD), or I couldn't get away without all that
patching that is in u_loader, u_dispatch, u_cocollect etc?

...sorry for the dependent mental state in which I am! :-o


I don't think it's your mental state. Those tools are clunky.



Clunky but portable. I'm still interested in an SSSAD-only solution.



Have you looked at Ivica's [preset_hub] in Pd-l2ork?  You
simply name the [preset_hub],
and all the [preset_node] objects with the same name on that
canvas or a child of it
(including abstractions) work together. No need to use
dollarsign arguments at all.
All state is saved with the patch and adding/removing nodes
works seamlessly, even with
infinite undo.

His preset system even makes an automatic, hidden connection
back into the [preset_node]
so you don't get crossed wires.

-Jonathan


Now that you told it, I gave myself a shot of it. Mm...!
Simple and fast and feels so good.
However... I'm afraid of locking myself in pd-l2ork. That would
mean that my songs are basically in l2ork.
Where does this thing store its data? Is it possible to dump it
out in raw form?


It stores it as hidden args to the relevant [preset_hub].  I told
Ivica I thought there should
be an option to save the state out to a separate file, but he said
that would complicate
things (and he's the one implementing all of it).  After all, if
you're saving state for a patch,
that state isn't much good outside of the context of the patch.


Well, I just RTFM and the feature is there. You bang this into your 
preset_hub:

[symbol $1]
 |
[write $1.txt(
...and voilá.


Ah, nice.  I guess he added it recently.



The one area that this method does not address is abstractions
managing their own state.
The obvious benefit of such self-management is with gui
abstractions, where you want the
abstraction to retain colors, slider values, or whatever when the
parent is saved, and without
manual intervention.

Maybe there's a way to "embed" a preset_hub into a canvas (as an
option in the gop dialog),
so that when the patch is created as an abstraction the preset
state gets saved as args to
the abstraction.

Also-- I think this probably ties in somehow to the idea of
simulating named arguments
by interpreting arguments after a \, as messages to the object. 
In other words,

[foo, pitch 1, decay 3]

would be equivalent to

[initbang]
|
[pitch 1, decay 3(
|
[foo]

I can't remember the exact arg syntax of [preset_hub] for saving
state, but it seems like
it's essentially the same idea, just with the args hidden from the
user.



On the other hand, you've been using l2ork for a while, right?
Can I ask you "how does it feel", do you feel locked in, etc? You
no miss 0.43 plugins...?!


There are only a few things in the hard sense that could lock you in:
* Pd-l2ork uses Max-style [trigger]: e.g., [t b 123] would trigger
the number "123" then a bang
(quite useful in my opinion)


good reminder! I've just noticed a few days ago this works but wasn't 
fully aware it's not portable


Not portable to Pd-extended or Vanilla, but portable to Max/MSP.

-Jonathan


* [preset_hub] isn't part of Pd-extended nor vanilla


and i guess won't ever be

* discrepancy between iemgui placement on gop canvas that
evidently makes
some gop abstractions not show up correctly in pd-l2ork


I think everything else would only "lock" in a user in the soft
sense, e.g., infinite undo
makes you feel slightly less like you're programming on an Apple
II from the 80s.

In fact there are so many of the latter type of improvements that
it's probably
less work to port Pd-l2ork to Windows and OSX than it is to put
those features
back into Pd-Extended and Vanilla.  If Pd-l2ork incorporated the
0.43 gui changes
then that's probably what I'd spend my time doing. :)

-Jonathan


make no mistake, I've been using l2ork for more than a year...
it's just that so far I've not burned the bridges behind me

Andr

Re: [PD] Preset saving with SSSAD

[András Murányi]

On Mon, Jul 29, 2013 at 10:06 PM, Phil Stone  wrote:

> On 7/29/13 1:01 PM, Jonathan Wilkes wrote:
>
>> In fact there are so many of the latter type of improvements that it's
>> probably
>> less work to port Pd-l2ork to Windows and OSX than it is to put those
>> features
>> back into Pd-Extended and Vanilla.  If Pd-l2ork incorporated the 0.43 gui
>> changes
>> then that's probably what I'd spend my time doing. :)
>>
>> -Jonathan
>>
>
> Speaking strictly selfishly, that would be a dream-come-true for me. I'd
> love to see the fork reunite, as it sounds like many excellent improvements
> have been made in Pd-l2ork that would be nice to have become mainstream.
>
>
> Phil Stone
> www.pkstonemusic.com
>
>
+1
huh :o}

András
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Re: [PD] Preset saving with SSSAD

[András Murányi]

>   [...]
>>  - is the SSSAD in s-abstractions recent enough for these tricks? (
>> http://code.google.com/p/s-abstractions/source/browse/#svn%2Ftrunk%2Fsssad
>> )
>>  - is there an example patch of SSSAD local saving available? i just
>> wish to see/understand how to save and load presets exclusive for an
>> abstraction instance.
>>  - or, please, is it possible to list the steps of creating SSSAD local
>> saving for an abstraction? (eventually using [presetstore]... which I have
>> attached because it's not hosted anywhere any more)?
>>  - is at viable at all to avoid using rjlib for this (and to use 'pure'
>> SSSAD), or I couldn't get away without all that patching that is in
>> u_loader, u_dispatch, u_cocollect etc?
>>
>>  ...sorry for the dependent mental state in which I am! :-o
>>
>>
>>  I don't think it's your mental state.  Those tools are clunky.
>>
>
Clunky but portable. I'm still interested in an SSSAD-only solution.


>
>> Have you looked at Ivica's [preset_hub] in Pd-l2ork?  You simply name the
>> [preset_hub],
>> and all the [preset_node] objects with the same name on that canvas or a
>> child of it
>> (including abstractions) work together.  No need to use dollarsign
>> arguments at all.
>> All state is saved with the patch and adding/removing nodes works
>> seamlessly, even with
>> infinite undo.
>>
>> His preset system even makes an automatic, hidden connection back into
>> the [preset_node]
>> so you don't get crossed wires.
>>
>> -Jonathan
>>
>
>  Now that you told it, I gave myself a shot of it. Mm...! Simple and
> fast and feels so good.
>  However... I'm afraid of locking myself in pd-l2ork. That would mean
> that my songs are basically in l2ork.
>  Where does this thing store its data? Is it possible to dump it out in
> raw form?
>
>
> It stores it as hidden args to the relevant [preset_hub].  I told Ivica I
> thought there should
> be an option to save the state out to a separate file, but he said that
> would complicate
> things (and he's the one implementing all of it).  After all, if you're
> saving state for a patch,
> that state isn't much good outside of the context of the patch.
>

Well, I just RTFM and the feature is there. You bang this into your
preset_hub:
[symbol $1]
 |
[write $1.txt(
...and voilá.


>
> The one area that this method does not address is abstractions managing
> their own state.
> The obvious benefit of such self-management is with gui abstractions,
> where you want the
> abstraction to retain colors, slider values, or whatever when the parent
> is saved, and without
> manual intervention.
>
> Maybe there's a way to "embed" a preset_hub into a canvas (as an option in
> the gop dialog),
> so that when the patch is created as an abstraction the preset state gets
> saved as args to
> the abstraction.
>
> Also-- I think this probably ties in somehow to the idea of simulating
> named arguments
> by interpreting arguments after a \, as messages to the object.  In other
> words,
> [foo, pitch 1, decay 3]
>
> would be equivalent to
>
> [initbang]
> |
> [pitch 1, decay 3(
> |
> [foo]
>
> I can't remember the exact arg syntax of [preset_hub] for saving state,
> but it seems like
> it's essentially the same idea, just with the args hidden from the user.
>
>
>On the other hand, you've been using l2ork for a while, right? Can I
> ask you "how does it feel", do you feel locked in, etc? You no miss 0.43
> plugins...?!
>
>
> There are only a few things in the hard sense that could lock you in:
> * Pd-l2ork uses Max-style [trigger]: e.g., [t b 123] would trigger the
> number "123" then a bang
> (quite useful in my opinion)
>

good reminder! I've just noticed a few days ago this works but wasn't fully
aware it's not portable


>  * [preset_hub] isn't part of Pd-extended nor vanilla
>

and i guess won't ever be


>  * discrepancy between iemgui placement on gop canvas that evidently makes
> some gop abstractions not show up correctly in pd-l2ork
>

> I think everything else would only "lock" in a user in the soft sense,
> e.g., infinite undo
> makes you feel slightly less like you're programming on an Apple II from
> the 80s.
>
> In fact there are so many of the latter type of improvements that it's
> probably
> less work to port Pd-l2ork to Windows and OSX than it is to put those
> features
> back into Pd-Extended and Vanilla.  If Pd-l2ork incorporated the 0.43 gui
> changes
> then that's probably what I'd spend my time doing. :)
>
> -Jonathan
>
>
make no mistake, I've been using l2ork for more than a year...
it's just that so far I've not burned the bridges behind me

András
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Re: [PD] Preset saving with SSSAD

[Phil Stone]

On 7/29/13 1:01 PM, Jonathan Wilkes wrote:
In fact there are so many of the latter type of improvements that it's 
probably
less work to port Pd-l2ork to Windows and OSX than it is to put those 
features
back into Pd-Extended and Vanilla.  If Pd-l2ork incorporated the 0.43 
gui changes

then that's probably what I'd spend my time doing. :)

-Jonathan


Speaking strictly selfishly, that would be a dream-come-true for me. I'd 
love to see the fork reunite, as it sounds like many excellent 
improvements have been made in Pd-l2ork that would be nice to have 
become mainstream.



Phil Stone
www.pkstonemusic.com

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Re: [PD] Preset saving with SSSAD

[Jonathan Wilkes]

On 07/29/2013 02:49 PM, András Murányi wrote:


On Mon, Jul 29, 2013 at 7:48 PM, Jonathan Wilkes > wrote:


On 07/29/2013 07:50 AM, András Murányi wrote:

On Thu, Nov 25, 2010 at 10:19 AM, Frank Barknecht
mailto:f...@footils.org>> wrote:

Hi,

On Thu, Nov 25, 2010 at 03:28:01AM +0100, András Murányi wrote:
> Cool, i was wandering around in the rj lib but i couldn't
find how this thing
> works.  Can you just tell me in a nutshell please?

yeah, it's a bit convoluted, to make it play nice in the
background without a
user ever having to see a single sssad object ...

Anyway the real interesting feature you will like is not so
much the "saveonly"
message but local saving which is enabled by adding something
like "$0" as
second argument to your [sssad] objects. Such local sssad
objects cannot be controlled
via sending to "SSSAD_ADMIN" anymore! Instead you have to
send to "$0-SSSAD_ADMIN".

In rj, the [u_sssad] objects are copies of sssad.pd and they
are hidden
in [u_dispatch] objects. These objects are in almost every rj
abstraction and
handle two things: Dispatching of "tagged messages" from an
inlet to local
receivers and saving the sssad-parameters.

For example a [u_dispatch $0 freq] will turn messages like
"freq 440" into a
"440" sent to [s $0-freq] and it will also save "440" into a
local(!)
sssad-parameter called "freq" that is local to the value of $0.

Now a second utility abstraction, [u_loader] will build a
bridge between these
local sssads with their $0-SSSAD_ADMIN receivers and two
global receivers
called RJ_SCENE_LOAD and RJ_SCENE_SAVE. Actually these are
seldomly used in
rjdj scenes.

A typical idiom to get the state of all sssads in one
abstraction is to send
"save" to the $0-SSSAD_ADMIN in ony abstraction, then collect
all the responses
into messages and save these into message boxes.  This is
handled inside of
[u_loader] and can be seen all over the rj library,
expecially in Andy's synths
like s_ejun or s_cwc.

If this sounds too complicated and you want to just have a
presettable
abstraction, you just need to do this:

1) add a [u_loader abstractionname-$1 $0] object
2) add a [u_dispatch $0 parametername] object for every parameter
3) daisychain all [u_dispatch] with connections and connect
the first one to an inlet.
3.1) Optionally: Connect [u_loader]'s outlet to an outlet and
route incoming
  "save" messages to its inlet to save settings in the parent
patch, e.g. with [u_cocollect]
4) Call you abstractions with unique tags as first argument

Now try sending stuff to RJ_SCENE_SAVE and RJ_SCENE_LOAD and
to the inlets of
your abstractions.

Ciao
--
 Frank BarknechtDo You RjDj.me?  _
__footils.org__


Huh, I'm trying to pick this up (after 3 years...)
Honestly, currently my IQ seems to be less than satisfactory to
understand and utilize the advice. (It's also almost 40 degrees C
here so I'll have to think out loud...)

- is the SSSAD in s-abstractions recent enough for these tricks?
(http://code.google.com/p/s-abstractions/source/browse/#svn%2Ftrunk%2Fsssad)
- is there an example patch of SSSAD local saving available? i
just wish to see/understand how to save and load presets
exclusive for an abstraction instance.
- or, please, is it possible to list the steps of creating SSSAD
local saving for an abstraction? (eventually using
[presetstore]... which I have attached because it's not hosted
anywhere any more)?
- is at viable at all to avoid using rjlib for this (and to use
'pure' SSSAD), or I couldn't get away without all that patching
that is in u_loader, u_dispatch, u_cocollect etc?

...sorry for the dependent mental state in which I am! :-o


I don't think it's your mental state.  Those tools are clunky.

Have you looked at Ivica's [preset_hub] in Pd-l2ork? You simply
name the [preset_hub],
and all the [preset_node] objects with the same name on that
canvas or a child of it
(including abstractions) work together.  No need to use dollarsign
arguments at all.
All state is saved with the patch and adding/removing nodes works
seamlessly, even with
infinite undo.

His preset system even makes an automatic, hidden connection back
into the [preset_node]
so you don't get crossed wires.

-Jonathan


Now that you told it, I gave myself a shot of it. Mm...! Simple 
and fast and feels so good.
However... I'm afraid of loc

Re: [PD] Preset saving with SSSAD

[András Murányi]

On Mon, Jul 29, 2013 at 7:48 PM, Jonathan Wilkes  wrote:

>  On 07/29/2013 07:50 AM, András Murányi wrote:
>
>  On Thu, Nov 25, 2010 at 10:19 AM, Frank Barknecht wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> On Thu, Nov 25, 2010 at 03:28:01AM +0100, András Murányi wrote:
>> > Cool, i was wandering around in the rj lib but i couldn't find how this
>> thing
>> > works.  Can you just tell me in a nutshell please?
>>
>>  yeah, it's a bit convoluted, to make it play nice in the background
>> without a
>> user ever having to see a single sssad object ...
>>
>> Anyway the real interesting feature you will like is not so much the
>> "saveonly"
>> message but local saving which is enabled by adding something like "$0" as
>> second argument to your [sssad] objects. Such local sssad objects cannot
>> be controlled
>> via sending to "SSSAD_ADMIN" anymore! Instead you have to send to
>> "$0-SSSAD_ADMIN".
>>
>> In rj, the [u_sssad] objects are copies of sssad.pd and they are hidden
>> in [u_dispatch] objects. These objects are in almost every rj abstraction
>> and
>> handle two things: Dispatching of "tagged messages" from an inlet to local
>> receivers and saving the sssad-parameters.
>>
>> For example a [u_dispatch $0 freq] will turn messages like "freq 440"
>> into a
>> "440" sent to [s $0-freq] and it will also save "440" into a local(!)
>> sssad-parameter called "freq" that is local to the value of $0.
>>
>> Now a second utility abstraction, [u_loader] will build a bridge between
>> these
>> local sssads with their $0-SSSAD_ADMIN receivers and two global receivers
>> called RJ_SCENE_LOAD and RJ_SCENE_SAVE. Actually these are seldomly used
>> in
>> rjdj scenes.
>>
>> A typical idiom to get the state of all sssads in one abstraction is to
>> send
>> "save" to the $0-SSSAD_ADMIN in ony abstraction, then collect all the
>> responses
>> into messages and save these into message boxes.  This is handled inside
>> of
>> [u_loader] and can be seen all over the rj library, expecially in Andy's
>> synths
>> like s_ejun or s_cwc.
>>
>> If this sounds too complicated and you want to just have a presettable
>> abstraction, you just need to do this:
>>
>> 1) add a [u_loader abstractionname-$1 $0] object
>> 2) add a [u_dispatch $0 parametername] object for every parameter
>> 3) daisychain all [u_dispatch] with connections and connect the first one
>> to an inlet.
>> 3.1) Optionally: Connect [u_loader]'s outlet to an outlet and route
>> incoming
>>   "save" messages to its inlet to save settings in the parent patch, e.g.
>> with [u_cocollect]
>> 4) Call you abstractions with unique tags as first argument
>>
>> Now try sending stuff to RJ_SCENE_SAVE and RJ_SCENE_LOAD and to the
>> inlets of
>> your abstractions.
>>
>> Ciao
>> --
>>  Frank BarknechtDo You RjDj.me?  _ __footils.org__
>>
>>
> Huh, I'm trying to pick this up (after 3 years...)
>  Honestly, currently my IQ seems to be less than satisfactory to
> understand and utilize the advice. (It's also almost 40 degrees C here so
> I'll have to think out loud...)
>
>  - is the SSSAD in s-abstractions recent enough for these tricks? (
> http://code.google.com/p/s-abstractions/source/browse/#svn%2Ftrunk%2Fsssad
> )
>  - is there an example patch of SSSAD local saving available? i just wish
> to see/understand how to save and load presets exclusive for an abstraction
> instance.
>  - or, please, is it possible to list the steps of creating SSSAD local
> saving for an abstraction? (eventually using [presetstore]... which I have
> attached because it's not hosted anywhere any more)?
>  - is at viable at all to avoid using rjlib for this (and to use 'pure'
> SSSAD), or I couldn't get away without all that patching that is in
> u_loader, u_dispatch, u_cocollect etc?
>
>  ...sorry for the dependent mental state in which I am! :-o
>
>
> I don't think it's your mental state.  Those tools are clunky.
>
> Have you looked at Ivica's [preset_hub] in Pd-l2ork?  You simply name the
> [preset_hub],
> and all the [preset_node] objects with the same name on that canvas or a
> child of it
> (including abstractions) work together.  No need to use dollarsign
> arguments at all.
> All state is saved with the patch and adding/removing nodes works
> seamlessly, even with
> infinite undo.
>
> His preset system even makes an automatic, hidden connection back into the
> [preset_node]
> so you don't get crossed wires.
>
> -Jonathan
>

Now that you told it, I gave myself a shot of it. Mm...! Simple and
fast and feels so good.
However... I'm afraid of locking myself in pd-l2ork. That would mean that
my songs are basically in l2ork.
Where does this thing store its data? Is it possible to dump it out in raw
form?
On the other hand, you've been using l2ork for a while, right? Can I ask
you "how does it feel", do you feel locked in, etc? You no miss 0.43
plugins...?!

Thanks,

András
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Re: [PD] Please help!!

[Miller Puckette]

I don't think this is presently possible - I think all 8-channel conforming
USB audio devices require USB 2.0 and the only way to get solid audio in or
out of the Pi (as far as I've been able to get working) depends on slowing
the USB to 1.1 speed.  This is certainly just a software thing and I hope it
will eventually get fixed.

OTOH I've been getting good robust stereo in and out using Griffin iMic (and
there seem to be plenty of other even cheaper choices).

cheers
Miller

On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 12:05:47AM +0800, Simon Wise wrote:
> On 29/07/13 21:22, Luca Mani wrote:
> >To everybody, is it possible to run a pd patch with an 8 channel desk on a 
> >raspberry pi with an external USB sound card ?
> >
> 
> Raspberry usb is not great, and some audio devices work while others
> do not, there is apparently an 8-channel output device that works
> ... search this list for details ... it seems you are most likely to
> have luck with basic consumer level devices. I had good results with
> a simple, very cheap stereo output card, but that is a much simpler
> setup than what you are asking for.
> 
> >Features used:
> >
> >Raspberry PI: Model B
> >Audio usb sound card : Tascam us 1800 http://tascam.com/product/us-1800/
> 
> of course also the audio card needs to have linux drivers ... mostly
> this means that the device needs to use standard usb audio drivers
> not its own special driver, and looking at the tascam specs it seems
> to need its own drivers installed to work in windows and OSX, which
> is not a good sign.
> 
> Simon
> 
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Re: [PD] Preset saving with SSSAD

[Jonathan Wilkes]

On 07/29/2013 07:50 AM, András Murányi wrote:
On Thu, Nov 25, 2010 at 10:19 AM, Frank Barknecht > wrote:


Hi,

On Thu, Nov 25, 2010 at 03:28:01AM +0100, András Murányi wrote:
> Cool, i was wandering around in the rj lib but i couldn't find
how this thing
> works.  Can you just tell me in a nutshell please?

yeah, it's a bit convoluted, to make it play nice in the
background without a
user ever having to see a single sssad object ...

Anyway the real interesting feature you will like is not so much
the "saveonly"
message but local saving which is enabled by adding something like
"$0" as
second argument to your [sssad] objects. Such local sssad objects
cannot be controlled
via sending to "SSSAD_ADMIN" anymore! Instead you have to send to
"$0-SSSAD_ADMIN".

In rj, the [u_sssad] objects are copies of sssad.pd and they are
hidden
in [u_dispatch] objects. These objects are in almost every rj
abstraction and
handle two things: Dispatching of "tagged messages" from an inlet
to local
receivers and saving the sssad-parameters.

For example a [u_dispatch $0 freq] will turn messages like "freq
440" into a
"440" sent to [s $0-freq] and it will also save "440" into a local(!)
sssad-parameter called "freq" that is local to the value of $0.

Now a second utility abstraction, [u_loader] will build a bridge
between these
local sssads with their $0-SSSAD_ADMIN receivers and two global
receivers
called RJ_SCENE_LOAD and RJ_SCENE_SAVE. Actually these are
seldomly used in
rjdj scenes.

A typical idiom to get the state of all sssads in one abstraction
is to send
"save" to the $0-SSSAD_ADMIN in ony abstraction, then collect all
the responses
into messages and save these into message boxes.  This is handled
inside of
[u_loader] and can be seen all over the rj library, expecially in
Andy's synths
like s_ejun or s_cwc.

If this sounds too complicated and you want to just have a presettable
abstraction, you just need to do this:

1) add a [u_loader abstractionname-$1 $0] object
2) add a [u_dispatch $0 parametername] object for every parameter
3) daisychain all [u_dispatch] with connections and connect the
first one to an inlet.
3.1) Optionally: Connect [u_loader]'s outlet to an outlet and
route incoming
  "save" messages to its inlet to save settings in the parent
patch, e.g. with [u_cocollect]
4) Call you abstractions with unique tags as first argument

Now try sending stuff to RJ_SCENE_SAVE and RJ_SCENE_LOAD and to
the inlets of
your abstractions.

Ciao
--
 Frank BarknechtDo You RjDj.me?  _
__footils.org__


Huh, I'm trying to pick this up (after 3 years...)
Honestly, currently my IQ seems to be less than satisfactory to 
understand and utilize the advice. (It's also almost 40 degrees C here 
so I'll have to think out loud...)


- is the SSSAD in s-abstractions recent enough for these tricks? 
(http://code.google.com/p/s-abstractions/source/browse/#svn%2Ftrunk%2Fsssad)
- is there an example patch of SSSAD local saving available? i just 
wish to see/understand how to save and load presets exclusive for an 
abstraction instance.
- or, please, is it possible to list the steps of creating SSSAD local 
saving for an abstraction? (eventually using [presetstore]... which I 
have attached because it's not hosted anywhere any more)?
- is at viable at all to avoid using rjlib for this (and to use 'pure' 
SSSAD), or I couldn't get away without all that patching that is in 
u_loader, u_dispatch, u_cocollect etc?


...sorry for the dependent mental state in which I am! :-o


I don't think it's your mental state.  Those tools are clunky.

Have you looked at Ivica's [preset_hub] in Pd-l2ork?  You simply name 
the [preset_hub],
and all the [preset_node] objects with the same name on that canvas or a 
child of it
(including abstractions) work together.  No need to use dollarsign 
arguments at all.
All state is saved with the patch and adding/removing nodes works 
seamlessly, even with

infinite undo.

His preset system even makes an automatic, hidden connection back into 
the [preset_node]

so you don't get crossed wires.

-Jonathan



András


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Re: [PD] Please help!!

[Simon Wise]

On 29/07/13 21:22, Luca Mani wrote:

To everybody, is it possible to run a pd patch with an 8 channel desk on a 
raspberry pi with an external USB sound card ?



Raspberry usb is not great, and some audio devices work while others do not, 
there is apparently an 8-channel output device that works ... search this list 
for details ... it seems you are most likely to have luck with basic consumer 
level devices. I had good results with a simple, very cheap stereo output card, 
but that is a much simpler setup than what you are asking for.



Features used:

Raspberry PI: Model B
Audio usb sound card : Tascam us 1800 http://tascam.com/product/us-1800/


of course also the audio card needs to have linux drivers ... mostly this means 
that the device needs to use standard usb audio drivers not its own special 
driver, and looking at the tascam specs it seems to need its own drivers 
installed to work in windows and OSX, which is not a good sign.


Simon

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[PD] Please help!!

[Luca Mani]

To everybody, is it possible to run a pd patch with an 8 channel desk on a 
raspberry pi with an external USB sound card ?

Features used: 

Raspberry PI: Model B 
Audio usb sound card : Tascam us 1800 http://tascam.com/product/us-1800/

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Re: [PD] Preset saving with SSSAD

[András Murányi]

On Thu, Nov 25, 2010 at 10:19 AM, Frank Barknecht  wrote:

> Hi,
>
> On Thu, Nov 25, 2010 at 03:28:01AM +0100, András Murányi wrote:
> > Cool, i was wandering around in the rj lib but i couldn't find how this
> thing
> > works.  Can you just tell me in a nutshell please?
>
> yeah, it's a bit convoluted, to make it play nice in the background
> without a
> user ever having to see a single sssad object ...
>
> Anyway the real interesting feature you will like is not so much the
> "saveonly"
> message but local saving which is enabled by adding something like "$0" as
> second argument to your [sssad] objects. Such local sssad objects cannot
> be controlled
> via sending to "SSSAD_ADMIN" anymore! Instead you have to send to
> "$0-SSSAD_ADMIN".
>
> In rj, the [u_sssad] objects are copies of sssad.pd and they are hidden
> in [u_dispatch] objects. These objects are in almost every rj abstraction
> and
> handle two things: Dispatching of "tagged messages" from an inlet to local
> receivers and saving the sssad-parameters.
>
> For example a [u_dispatch $0 freq] will turn messages like "freq 440" into
> a
> "440" sent to [s $0-freq] and it will also save "440" into a local(!)
> sssad-parameter called "freq" that is local to the value of $0.
>
> Now a second utility abstraction, [u_loader] will build a bridge between
> these
> local sssads with their $0-SSSAD_ADMIN receivers and two global receivers
> called RJ_SCENE_LOAD and RJ_SCENE_SAVE. Actually these are seldomly used in
> rjdj scenes.
>
> A typical idiom to get the state of all sssads in one abstraction is to
> send
> "save" to the $0-SSSAD_ADMIN in ony abstraction, then collect all the
> responses
> into messages and save these into message boxes.  This is handled inside of
> [u_loader] and can be seen all over the rj library, expecially in Andy's
> synths
> like s_ejun or s_cwc.
>
> If this sounds too complicated and you want to just have a presettable
> abstraction, you just need to do this:
>
> 1) add a [u_loader abstractionname-$1 $0] object
> 2) add a [u_dispatch $0 parametername] object for every parameter
> 3) daisychain all [u_dispatch] with connections and connect the first one
> to an inlet.
> 3.1) Optionally: Connect [u_loader]'s outlet to an outlet and route
> incoming
>   "save" messages to its inlet to save settings in the parent patch, e.g.
> with [u_cocollect]
> 4) Call you abstractions with unique tags as first argument
>
> Now try sending stuff to RJ_SCENE_SAVE and RJ_SCENE_LOAD and to the inlets
> of
> your abstractions.
>
> Ciao
> --
>  Frank BarknechtDo You RjDj.me?  _ __footils.org__
>
>
Huh, I'm trying to pick this up (after 3 years...)
Honestly, currently my IQ seems to be less than satisfactory to understand
and utilize the advice. (It's also almost 40 degrees C here so I'll have to
think out loud...)

- is the SSSAD in s-abstractions recent enough for these tricks? (
http://code.google.com/p/s-abstractions/source/browse/#svn%2Ftrunk%2Fsssad)
- is there an example patch of SSSAD local saving available? i just wish to
see/understand how to save and load presets exclusive for an abstraction
instance.
- or, please, is it possible to list the steps of creating SSSAD local
saving for an abstraction? (eventually using [presetstore]... which I have
attached because it's not hosted anywhere any more)?
- is at viable at all to avoid using rjlib for this (and to use 'pure'
SSSAD), or I couldn't get away without all that patching that is in
u_loader, u_dispatch, u_cocollect etc?

...sorry for the dependent mental state in which I am! :-o

András


presetstore.pd
Description: Binary data


presetstore-help.pd
Description: Binary data
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