Re: OT - Content over technicalities
On Mar 15, 2014, at 6:37 pm, Rob Studdert wrote: > I have given up trying to please photographers and it has let me make so many > more images that I can > say that I'm now truly happy with. Mark! -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: OT - Content over technicalities
On 15/03/2014 8:39 PM, Rob Studdert wrote: LOL, " I will offer an additional photographers position to a peer " should read more like "I will often offer peer photographers a position to shoot with me" not quite sure how I stuff that up so badly. It's English. You aren't. HAR!!! bill -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: OT - Content over technicalities
LOL, " I will offer an additional photographers position to a peer " should read more like "I will often offer peer photographers a position to shoot with me" not quite sure how I stuff that up so badly. On 16 March 2014 13:36, Rob Studdert wrote: > I'm setting up my own shoots now, I have a slew of great models to > choose from and in some cases I will offer an additional photographers > position to a peer or engage less competent photographers as > assistants so that they can get some experience in studio. > > Definitely not interested in shooting fashion, there's only so much > surly I can stand in one day ;) The workshops are really well priced, > generally it's of more benefit to the photographers as a quick folio > building exercise so long as that's that way that you chose to work, > and some do make very good use of these types of events. > > The downside of TFP is as soon as a model actually gets good at being > a model they tend to want to get paid, and that's fair enough. So > generally it's far more laborious to shoot with someone TFP than it is > with paid models as they engage in workshop events. Swings and > roundabouts. > > Time and engagement though is generally the key to securing great > images, sometimes I guess it's just not a practical route. > > Cheers, > > > > > > On 16 March 2014 12:37, Bruce Walker wrote: >> On Sat, Mar 15, 2014 at 1:37 AM, Rob Studdert >> wrote: >>> It's a good article in that it stresses the importance of connection >>> with the subject, however I don't think that the technicalities and >>> the interpersonal relationship between the subject and photographer >>> are mutually exclusive, depending on the shooting environment of >>> course. >> >> Most certainly the technical issues are still important else we'd all >> just use crappy smartphone cams and leave it at that. His point is, as >> I get it, that we need to not stop at "it's technically perfect" like >> so many of us gadget fanatics do. And in fact it's the soft gooey >> people issues that get you a better portrait than merely perfecting >> the image capturing process. >> >> >>> The worst shoots I have been involved in were at studio workshops >>> where the lighting was pre-set and near to perfect but the models came >>> thick and fast. It's like a sausage factory, one model after another, >>> one set then the next. I found that the quality of my images suffer >>> terribly if I have no time to connect with the models, technically >>> they may be flawless but they lack emotion and substance. >> >> That could be a special case though. Fashion photography -- if this is >> what it is -- is all about the _clothes_ and the not the models. The >> models are quite literally mannequins (which is what mannequin means >> in French: model) or clothes horses and they are expected to look >> blank, not engaging with the audience. >> >> Wait, I just re-read your paragraph: studio workshops. I see the >> problem here. :-) These are not designed for good photography, they >> are designed to optimize monetary returns to the organizers. That's my >> cynical take. If you want to get good shots, hire or trade with your >> own model and take your time. Forget these overcrowded workshops. >> Workshops I have attended were closer to 1-on-1. Three students, one >> teacher and an assistant, two models (plus MUA and hair). Total time >> in workshop: 6 hours. Lots of time to engage with the models, and >> everyone else in the session too. Got great expression from models. >> >> >>> On 15 March 2014 01:14, Bruce Walker wrote: An important lesson to learn ... http://fstoppers.com/subject-matters-kicking-technicalities-for-content >> >> -- >> -bmw >> >> -- >> PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List >> PDML@pdml.net >> http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net >> to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and >> follow the directions. > > > > -- > Rob Studdert (Digital Image Studio) > Tel: +61-418-166-870 UTC +10 Hours > Gmail, eBay, Skype, Twitter, Facebook, Picasa: distudio -- Rob Studdert (Digital Image Studio) Tel: +61-418-166-870 UTC +10 Hours Gmail, eBay, Skype, Twitter, Facebook, Picasa: distudio -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: OT - Content over technicalities
I'm setting up my own shoots now, I have a slew of great models to choose from and in some cases I will offer an additional photographers position to a peer or engage less competent photographers as assistants so that they can get some experience in studio. Definitely not interested in shooting fashion, there's only so much surly I can stand in one day ;) The workshops are really well priced, generally it's of more benefit to the photographers as a quick folio building exercise so long as that's that way that you chose to work, and some do make very good use of these types of events. The downside of TFP is as soon as a model actually gets good at being a model they tend to want to get paid, and that's fair enough. So generally it's far more laborious to shoot with someone TFP than it is with paid models as they engage in workshop events. Swings and roundabouts. Time and engagement though is generally the key to securing great images, sometimes I guess it's just not a practical route. Cheers, On 16 March 2014 12:37, Bruce Walker wrote: > On Sat, Mar 15, 2014 at 1:37 AM, Rob Studdert wrote: >> It's a good article in that it stresses the importance of connection >> with the subject, however I don't think that the technicalities and >> the interpersonal relationship between the subject and photographer >> are mutually exclusive, depending on the shooting environment of >> course. > > Most certainly the technical issues are still important else we'd all > just use crappy smartphone cams and leave it at that. His point is, as > I get it, that we need to not stop at "it's technically perfect" like > so many of us gadget fanatics do. And in fact it's the soft gooey > people issues that get you a better portrait than merely perfecting > the image capturing process. > > >> The worst shoots I have been involved in were at studio workshops >> where the lighting was pre-set and near to perfect but the models came >> thick and fast. It's like a sausage factory, one model after another, >> one set then the next. I found that the quality of my images suffer >> terribly if I have no time to connect with the models, technically >> they may be flawless but they lack emotion and substance. > > That could be a special case though. Fashion photography -- if this is > what it is -- is all about the _clothes_ and the not the models. The > models are quite literally mannequins (which is what mannequin means > in French: model) or clothes horses and they are expected to look > blank, not engaging with the audience. > > Wait, I just re-read your paragraph: studio workshops. I see the > problem here. :-) These are not designed for good photography, they > are designed to optimize monetary returns to the organizers. That's my > cynical take. If you want to get good shots, hire or trade with your > own model and take your time. Forget these overcrowded workshops. > Workshops I have attended were closer to 1-on-1. Three students, one > teacher and an assistant, two models (plus MUA and hair). Total time > in workshop: 6 hours. Lots of time to engage with the models, and > everyone else in the session too. Got great expression from models. > > >> On 15 March 2014 01:14, Bruce Walker wrote: >>> An important lesson to learn ... >>> >>> http://fstoppers.com/subject-matters-kicking-technicalities-for-content >>> > > -- > -bmw > > -- > PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List > PDML@pdml.net > http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net > to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow > the directions. -- Rob Studdert (Digital Image Studio) Tel: +61-418-166-870 UTC +10 Hours Gmail, eBay, Skype, Twitter, Facebook, Picasa: distudio -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: OT - Content over technicalities
On Sat, Mar 15, 2014 at 1:37 AM, Rob Studdert wrote: > It's a good article in that it stresses the importance of connection > with the subject, however I don't think that the technicalities and > the interpersonal relationship between the subject and photographer > are mutually exclusive, depending on the shooting environment of > course. Most certainly the technical issues are still important else we'd all just use crappy smartphone cams and leave it at that. His point is, as I get it, that we need to not stop at "it's technically perfect" like so many of us gadget fanatics do. And in fact it's the soft gooey people issues that get you a better portrait than merely perfecting the image capturing process. > The worst shoots I have been involved in were at studio workshops > where the lighting was pre-set and near to perfect but the models came > thick and fast. It's like a sausage factory, one model after another, > one set then the next. I found that the quality of my images suffer > terribly if I have no time to connect with the models, technically > they may be flawless but they lack emotion and substance. That could be a special case though. Fashion photography -- if this is what it is -- is all about the _clothes_ and the not the models. The models are quite literally mannequins (which is what mannequin means in French: model) or clothes horses and they are expected to look blank, not engaging with the audience. Wait, I just re-read your paragraph: studio workshops. I see the problem here. :-) These are not designed for good photography, they are designed to optimize monetary returns to the organizers. That's my cynical take. If you want to get good shots, hire or trade with your own model and take your time. Forget these overcrowded workshops. Workshops I have attended were closer to 1-on-1. Three students, one teacher and an assistant, two models (plus MUA and hair). Total time in workshop: 6 hours. Lots of time to engage with the models, and everyone else in the session too. Got great expression from models. > On 15 March 2014 01:14, Bruce Walker wrote: >> An important lesson to learn ... >> >> http://fstoppers.com/subject-matters-kicking-technicalities-for-content >> -- -bmw -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: OT - Content over technicalities
It's a good article in that it stresses the importance of connection with the subject, however I don't think that the technicalities and the interpersonal relationship between the subject and photographer are mutually exclusive, depending on the shooting environment of course. I shoot a lot of live events these days, often something akin to live portraiture, that's an interesting twist because the artist is playing to the audience. My job is to attempt to capture the expressions of the artist on stage particularly when I see them slip out of performer mode and show that they are really loving what they are doing up there. And often when I connect with the same people one to one to shoot them in a studio environment we have an instant rapport built in part through my live images which makes the shoot far less staid and leads to more natural poses and expressions. And if the shoot has been properly designed and not rushed the resultant images often also exhibit excellent technical quality too. The worst shoots I have been involved in were at studio workshops where the lighting was pre-set and near to perfect but the models came thick and fast. It's like a sausage factory, one model after another, one set then the next. I found that the quality of my images suffer terribly if I have no time to connect with the models, technically they may be flawless but they lack emotion and substance. The last thing is that it's so easy to get caught up in the low noise, high d-range, low ISO roundabout, some of my best and most appreciated pics were shot at very high ISOs and suffer motion blur and boulder sized noise but the punters just don't care for the most part they only see the content in the image. I have given up trying to please photographers and it has let me make so many more images that I can say that I'm now truly happy with. Cheers, On 15 March 2014 01:14, Bruce Walker wrote: > An important lesson to learn ... > > http://fstoppers.com/subject-matters-kicking-technicalities-for-content > > -- > -bmw > > -- > PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List > PDML@pdml.net > http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net > to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow > the directions. -- Rob Studdert (Digital Image Studio) Tel: +61-418-166-870 UTC +10 Hours Gmail, eBay, Skype, Twitter, Facebook, Picasa: distudio -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
OT - Content over technicalities
An important lesson to learn ... http://fstoppers.com/subject-matters-kicking-technicalities-for-content -- -bmw -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
