Re: Lunar Eclipse under way!
try it. the difference can be substantial and DOF doesn't cover up for it. why do you think the slack is at the infinity end and not at the short end? Herb - Original Message - From: Graywolf [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, October 28, 2004 10:41 PM Subject: Re: Lunar Eclipse under way! What are you guys shooting at? f/1.4 with a 10,000mm lens? For an example with the 135mm f4.7 on the Graphic set to f/4.7 and infinity everything from 94 feet to the Andromeda Galaxy is in focus (I use that lens because it is one I have calculated). So if my focus is set anyplace between 94 feet and infinity, object at infinity will be in focus. It is not like you don't have any depth of field to work with when your subject is 235 thousand miles away. Even if your hyperfocal distance is something like 10 thousand miles your DOF is far more than enough to insure proper focus.
Re: Lunar Eclipse under way!
On Thu, 28 Oct 2004, wendy beard wrote: http://www.pbase.com/wendybeard/image/35618348 I discovered that I'm useless when it comes to manual focusing. It was cold out too so the camera was probably shivering :-s I think the Earth moved for you ;-) Kostas (maybe the moon too :-)
Re: Lunar Eclipse under way!
And think of long focal length (so much prone to thermal focus shift) on small format film (so much demanding about proper focus). The Graphic is another thing: not enough long focus and not enough small format to show the problem, I guess. I can assure you that precise focus at infinity is a well-known issue among astrophotographers. Please also read my previous message on this same topic. Dario - Original Message - From: Graywolf [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, October 29, 2004 4:41 AM Subject: Re: Lunar Eclipse under way! What are you guys shooting at? f/1.4 with a 10,000mm lens? For an example with the 135mm f4.7 on the Graphic set to f/4.7 and infinity everything from 94 feet to the Andromeda Galaxy is in focus (I use that lens because it is one I have calculated). So if my focus is set anyplace between 94 feet and infinity, object at infinity will be in focus. It is not like you don't have any depth of field to work with when your subject is 235 thousand miles away. Even if your hyperfocal distance is something like 10 thousand miles your DOF is far more than enough to insure proper focus. That BTW is why autofocus is so problematic at infinity. The system can not tell the difference between the hyperfocal distance and actual infinity. Though as long as you are not blowing the photo up beyond the value used to calculate the DOF infinity should still appear sharp. Now if you are shooting something at 20 feet with a 600mm f/4.0 lens having your infinity mark off a 1/4mm or so is going to affect scale focusing, but it will not at infinity you just have too much slack to work with out there. -- Herb Chong wrote: the infinity mark isn't actually focused for an object at infinity except at a specific temperature. Herb - Original Message - From: Graywolf [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, October 28, 2004 1:31 PM Subject: Re: Lunar Eclipse under way! U..? Surely the moon is at infinity. I can not even begin to see how you could have a focus problem. Autofocus problem yes, focus no. -- graywolf http://graywolfphoto.com/graywolf.html
Re: Lunar Eclipse under way!
--- Mark Roberts [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Quick 'n dirty: http://www.robertstech.com/temp/red_moon.jpg Cropped a bit. -- Mark Roberts Cool. Better than mine. My pic is well blurry. Could have been the equipment of course ;-) http://www.pbase.com/wendybeard/image/35618348 I discovered that I'm useless when it comes to manual focusing. It was cold out too so the camera was probably shivering :-s Wendy
Re: Lunar Eclipse under way!
wendy beard [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- Mark Roberts [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Quick 'n dirty: http://www.robertstech.com/temp/red_moon.jpg Cropped a bit. Cool. Better than mine. My pic is well blurry. Could have been the equipment of course ;-) http://www.pbase.com/wendybeard/image/35618348 Most of mine looked like that. Mostly lack of tripod/ballhead capacity for dealing with 600mm of lens. I got lucky with one or two shots. I discovered that I'm useless when it comes to manual focusing. It was cold out too so the camera was probably shivering :-s Some of mine may also have focus problems. When the moon was completely in the umbra it was too dim for autofocus *or* manual focus. -- Mark Roberts Photography and writing www.robertstech.com
Re: Lunar Eclipse under way!
U..? Surely the moon is at infinity. I can not even begin to see how you could have a focus problem. Autofocus problem yes, focus no. -- Mark Roberts wrote: wendy beard [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- Mark Roberts [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Quick 'n dirty: http://www.robertstech.com/temp/red_moon.jpg Cropped a bit. Cool. Better than mine. My pic is well blurry. Could have been the equipment of course ;-) http://www.pbase.com/wendybeard/image/35618348 Most of mine looked like that. Mostly lack of tripod/ballhead capacity for dealing with 600mm of lens. I got lucky with one or two shots. I discovered that I'm useless when it comes to manual focusing. It was cold out too so the camera was probably shivering :-s Some of mine may also have focus problems. When the moon was completely in the umbra it was too dim for autofocus *or* manual focus. -- graywolf http://graywolfphoto.com/graywolf.html
Re: Lunar Eclipse under way!
On Thu, 28 Oct 2004, Graywolf wrote: Surely the moon is at infinity. I can not even begin to see how you could have a focus problem. Autofocus problem yes, focus no. Long lenses don't always are set to infinity at the end of the scale. If getting the moon in focus only had required to turn the focusing ring until it hits the end, it would be easy. But often infinity is a little, little bit before the end. I once read why that is so, on this list, but have forgotten the details. Something to do with temperature. anders - http://anders.hultman.nu/ med dagens bild och allt!
Re: Lunar Eclipse under way!
Focus problems could have been dew on the lens. I shot about 30 frames and then hooked up camera to PC to download and realized the front of the lens was fogged up. Seeing through the viewfinder in the dark is always a problem to begin with. I also discovered that on the Tamron 28-300 I had with me, at 300mm, I had to focus slightly nearer than infinity for the sharpest image. In the end I suspect I will be too embarrased to show anything. Tom C. From: Graywolf [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: Lunar Eclipse under way! Date: Thu, 28 Oct 2004 13:31:50 -0400 U..? Surely the moon is at infinity. I can not even begin to see how you could have a focus problem. Autofocus problem yes, focus no. -- Mark Roberts wrote: wendy beard [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- Mark Roberts [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Quick 'n dirty: http://www.robertstech.com/temp/red_moon.jpg Cropped a bit. Cool. Better than mine. My pic is well blurry. Could have been the equipment of course ;-) http://www.pbase.com/wendybeard/image/35618348 Most of mine looked like that. Mostly lack of tripod/ballhead capacity for dealing with 600mm of lens. I got lucky with one or two shots. I discovered that I'm useless when it comes to manual focusing. It was cold out too so the camera was probably shivering :-s Some of mine may also have focus problems. When the moon was completely in the umbra it was too dim for autofocus *or* manual focus. -- graywolf http://graywolfphoto.com/graywolf.html
Re: Lunar Eclipse under way!
Probably a little slack built into the lens to accommodate thermal expansion. t On 10/28/04 10:41, Anders Hultman wrote: On Thu, 28 Oct 2004, Graywolf wrote: Surely the moon is at infinity. I can not even begin to see how you could have a focus problem. Autofocus problem yes, focus no. Long lenses don't always are set to infinity at the end of the scale. If getting the moon in focus only had required to turn the focusing ring until it hits the end, it would be easy. But often infinity is a little, little bit before the end. I once read why that is so, on this list, but have forgotten the details. Something to do with temperature. anders - http://anders.hultman.nu/ med dagens bild och allt!
Re: Lunar Eclipse under way!
- Original Message - From: Tom C Subject: Re: Lunar Eclipse under way! In the end I suspect I will be too embarrased to show anything. Not feeling well Tom? William Robb
Re: Lunar Eclipse under way!
For me it was a wasted effort, other than I learned/was taught to member what I forgot for next time. Tom C. From: William Robb [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: Lunar Eclipse under way! Date: Thu, 28 Oct 2004 11:56:59 -0600 - Original Message - From: Tom C Subject: Re: Lunar Eclipse under way! In the end I suspect I will be too embarrased to show anything. Not feeling well Tom? William Robb
Re: Lunar Eclipse under way!
Graywolf wrote: U..? Surely the moon is at infinity. I can not even begin to see how you could have a focus problem. Autofocus problem yes, focus no. actually, I THink when you are using big glass it ISNT at infinity - but I know it sounds odd. I did think it was camera shake or moon movement that caused the less than sharp image in Wendy's photo tho annsan -- Mark Roberts wrote: wendy beard [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- Mark Roberts [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Quick 'n dirty: http://www.robertstech.com/temp/red_moon.jpg Cropped a bit. Cool. Better than mine. My pic is well blurry. Could have been the equipment of course ;-) http://www.pbase.com/wendybeard/image/35618348 Most of mine looked like that. Mostly lack of tripod/ballhead capacity for dealing with 600mm of lens. I got lucky with one or two shots. I discovered that I'm useless when it comes to manual focusing. It was cold out too so the camera was probably shivering :-s Some of mine may also have focus problems. When the moon was completely in the umbra it was too dim for autofocus *or* manual focus. -- graywolf http://graywolfphoto.com/graywolf.html
Re: Lunar Eclipse under way!
NASA sez it's at the 238,855 miles mark. Ann Sanfedele wrote: actually, I THink when you are using big glass it ISNT at infinity - but I know it sounds odd.
Re: Lunar Eclipse under way!
The stop may not be infinity but the mark should be. My Graphic focuses past infinity, that does not mean i can not set it there. Also anything between infinity and the hyperfocal distance should be sharp so you probably only have to be within a quarter turn of the focus ring. I notice in other comments to this thread that people seem to be blaming all kinds of other problems on focus. Out of focus is out of focus. Soft do to mist on the lens is soft. Vibration do to inadequate tripods and heads are motion. Only poor focus is a focus problem and there is no, none whatsoever, excuse for that when the subject is at infinity (600+ X the focal length). -- Anders Hultman wrote: On Thu, 28 Oct 2004, Graywolf wrote: Surely the moon is at infinity. I can not even begin to see how you could have a focus problem. Autofocus problem yes, focus no. Long lenses don't always are set to infinity at the end of the scale. If getting the moon in focus only had required to turn the focusing ring until it hits the end, it would be easy. But often infinity is a little, little bit before the end. I once read why that is so, on this list, but have forgotten the details. Something to do with temperature. anders - http://anders.hultman.nu/ med dagens bild och allt! -- graywolf http://graywolfphoto.com/graywolf.html
Re: Lunar Eclipse under way!
That would be infinity on any lens shorter than 393 miles in focal length. GRIN! -- Caveman wrote: NASA sez it's at the 238,855 miles mark. Ann Sanfedele wrote: actually, I THink when you are using big glass it ISNT at infinity - but I know it sounds odd. -- graywolf http://graywolfphoto.com/graywolf.html
Re: Lunar Eclipse under way!
Graywolf wrote: The stop may not be infinity but the mark should be. My Graphic focuses past infinity, that does not mean i can not set it there. Also anything between infinity and the hyperfocal distance should be sharp so you probably only have to be within a quarter turn of the focus ring. I notice in other comments to this thread that people seem to be blaming all kinds of other problems on focus. Out of focus is out of focus. Soft do to mist on the lens is soft. Vibration do to inadequate tripods and heads are motion. Only poor focus is a focus problem and there is no, none whatsoever, excuse for that when the subject is at infinity (600+ X the focal length). Lens manufacturers don't allow the focus ring to go beyond infinity mark to fool photographers. It's because with long lenses even normal temperature changes can shift the actual infinity position enough for getting out of focus pictures. Hence true infinity focusing can be everywhere around infinity mark, not necessarily on it. For this reason, when focusing at infinity with long telephoto, telescopes and so on, you have to carefully check infinity focus just like you do with any other focusing distance: by looking at image in the viewfinder! BTW, this is why the SLR is the best camera for astrophotography (and not only for that). With other cameras, the only way to get proper focus is to check at film plane. Dario (who shot astrophotography for years, long time ago...)
Re: Lunar Eclipse under way!
- Original Message - From: Tom C Subject: Re: Lunar Eclipse under way! For me it was a wasted effort, other than I learned/was taught to member what I forgot for next time. At least you got to see it. It was so foggy here last night I could just about see across the street. William Robb
Re: Lunar Eclipse under way!
your picture is motion blurred. at 3s, the moon moved too much. at that magnification, you need to be targeting on the order of 1/2 second maximum shutter times, preferably shorter than 1/8s. Herb - Original Message - From: wendy beard [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, October 28, 2004 10:12 AM Subject: Re: Lunar Eclipse under way! Better than mine. My pic is well blurry. Could have been the equipment of course ;-) http://www.pbase.com/wendybeard/image/35618348
Re: Lunar Eclipse under way!
the infinity mark isn't actually focused for an object at infinity except at a specific temperature. Herb - Original Message - From: Graywolf [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, October 28, 2004 1:31 PM Subject: Re: Lunar Eclipse under way! U..? Surely the moon is at infinity. I can not even begin to see how you could have a focus problem. Autofocus problem yes, focus no.
Re: Lunar Eclipse under way!
Graywolf [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: U..? Surely the moon is at infinity. I can not even begin to see how you could have a focus problem. Autofocus problem yes, focus no. Nope. With big glass there's always some range beyond infinity to accommodate thermal expansion. -- Mark Roberts Photography and writing www.robertstech.com
RE: Lunar Eclipse under way!
THe Red Sox were amazing Note the 86 years since last win and the loss to the Mets in 1986 I hadn't thought of that. :) Queens girl that I am, I was rooting for the Mets the last time around... Manny said You make your own destination :) when he got the MVP Yeah, I caught that, thought it was cute. :) They are an awesome team. I kind of wish I were in Boston right now to soak up the vibe. Most people I know down here don't seem to care.
Re: Lunar Eclipse under way!
What are you guys shooting at? f/1.4 with a 10,000mm lens? For an example with the 135mm f4.7 on the Graphic set to f/4.7 and infinity everything from 94 feet to the Andromeda Galaxy is in focus (I use that lens because it is one I have calculated). So if my focus is set anyplace between 94 feet and infinity, object at infinity will be in focus. It is not like you don't have any depth of field to work with when your subject is 235 thousand miles away. Even if your hyperfocal distance is something like 10 thousand miles your DOF is far more than enough to insure proper focus. That BTW is why autofocus is so problematic at infinity. The system can not tell the difference between the hyperfocal distance and actual infinity. Though as long as you are not blowing the photo up beyond the value used to calculate the DOF infinity should still appear sharp. Now if you are shooting something at 20 feet with a 600mm f/4.0 lens having your infinity mark off a 1/4mm or so is going to affect scale focusing, but it will not at infinity you just have too much slack to work with out there. -- Herb Chong wrote: the infinity mark isn't actually focused for an object at infinity except at a specific temperature. Herb - Original Message - From: Graywolf [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, October 28, 2004 1:31 PM Subject: Re: Lunar Eclipse under way! U..? Surely the moon is at infinity. I can not even begin to see how you could have a focus problem. Autofocus problem yes, focus no. -- graywolf http://graywolfphoto.com/graywolf.html
Re: Lunar Eclipse under way!
Amita Guha wrote: THe Red Sox were amazing Note the 86 years since last win and the loss to the Mets in 1986 I hadn't thought of that. :) Queens girl that I am, I was rooting for the Mets the last time around... I was doing the same -- MOOOKIE :) Manny said You make your own destination :) when he got the MVP Yeah, I caught that, thought it was cute. :) They are an awesome team. I kind of wish I were in Boston right now to soak up the vibe. Most people I know down here don't seem to care. I was on the phone every day with my friend in Boston and fortunately had a few friends here who were enjoying it too (including you it appears!) ann
Re: Lunar Eclipse under way!
On Thu, 28 Oct 2004 19:41:32 +0200 (MEST), Anders Hultman wrote: Long lenses don't always are set to infinity at the end of the scale. When my Sigma 400/5.6 APO Macro is set at infinity, it has another 10* or so of rotation left (beyond infinity), at 65*F ambient temperature. It was dark so I don't know where the inifinty mark on the focusing scale fell. :-) TTYL, DougF KG4LMZ
Re: Lunar Eclipse under way!
On Thu, 28 Oct 2004 16:30:28 -0600, William Robb wrote: At least you got to see [the lunar eclipse]. It was so foggy here last night I could just about see across the street. It wasn't that bad here, but a 10/10 cover rolled in over my house just about the time that the eclipse reached totality (moon enclosed in the penumbra) and stayed in place until after the eclipse was finished. TTYL, DougF KG4LMZ
Re: Lunar Eclipse under way!
Mark Roberts wrote: Absolutely clear skies and a great view of the moon from my bedroom window! ist-D, Sigma EX 300/2.8 and 2x teleconverter in operation here. :-) ditto that but I do't think I can get a decent shot - hope you do mark (I keep running back and forth between the TV on the Series and the window) ann -- Mark Roberts Photography and writing www.robertstech.com
Re: Lunar Eclipse under way!
Wish I had that luck! It's completely clouded over here and I can't even see the eclipse! I don't have a long tele, so I was planning to try multiple exposures using an old beat-up Yashica A TLR - well, maybe next time! Do show us what you get, Mark.. Badri On Wed, 27 Oct 2004 21:55:11 -0400, Ann Sanfedele [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Mark Roberts wrote: Absolutely clear skies and a great view of the moon from my bedroom window! ist-D, Sigma EX 300/2.8 and 2x teleconverter in operation here. :-)
Re: Lunar Eclipse under way!
Ann Sanfedele [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Mark Roberts wrote: Absolutely clear skies and a great view of the moon from my bedroom window! ist-D, Sigma EX 300/2.8 and 2x teleconverter in operation here. :-) ditto that but I do't think I can get a decent shot - hope you do mark (I keep running back and forth between the TV on the Series and the window) No such conflict here: We don't have a TV! (I go back and forth between the computer and the window) I'm off to the corner bar after a few more shots. They'll have a television tuned to the game, I suspect. -- Mark Roberts Photography and writing www.robertstech.com
Re: Lunar Eclipse under way!
Quick 'n dirty: http://www.robertstech.com/temp/red_moon.jpg Cropped a bit. -- Mark Roberts Photography and writing www.robertstech.com
Re: Lunar Eclipse under way!
Mark Roberts wrote: Quick 'n dirty: http://www.robertstech.com/temp/red_moon.jpg Cropped a bit. -- Mark Roberts Photography and writing www.robertstech.com Thank you for sharing that! lovely! I watched it through binocs from the roof so beautiful! but I didnt ahve the glass to even attempt to photo it! ann
Re: Lunar Eclipse under way!
I went out with my SFX and the MX, loaded the SFX with my consumer grade Tokina 70-210 and my consumer grade 2x Vivitar teleconverter. I don't expect sharp pictures, I'll be happy as long as there's SOMETHING on that roll. Sheesh, I freezed my butt off out there, it was -2 and the time here is now 5 in the morning. Good morning everybody, nice eclipse we have today! /Henri
Re: Lunar Eclipse under way!
Now rotate it 90 degrees, dress it with a nice Halloween hat, paste a cat somewhere and give us a nice fakezine ;-) Mark Roberts wrote: Quick 'n dirty: http://www.robertstech.com/temp/red_moon.jpg Cropped a bit.
Re: Lunar Eclipse under way!
It's perfectly clear here in Michigan, but I'm not going to shoot it. I took a quick look though. That's enough for me. Paul On Oct 27, 2004, at 10:28 PM, Badri A wrote: Wish I had that luck! It's completely clouded over here and I can't even see the eclipse! I don't have a long tele, so I was planning to try multiple exposures using an old beat-up Yashica A TLR - well, maybe next time! Do show us what you get, Mark.. Badri On Wed, 27 Oct 2004 21:55:11 -0400, Ann Sanfedele [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Mark Roberts wrote: Absolutely clear skies and a great view of the moon from my bedroom window! ist-D, Sigma EX 300/2.8 and 2x teleconverter in operation here. :-)
Re: Lunar Eclipse under way!
On Wed, 27 Oct 2004, Mark Roberts wrote: Absolutely clear skies and a great view of the moon from my bedroom window! ist-D, Sigma EX 300/2.8 and 2x teleconverter in operation here. :-) This is from Stockholm, Sweden: http://anders.hultman.nu/dagens/041028-043855 *ist D, Vivitar 400/5.6 anders - http://anders.hultman.nu/ med dagens bild och allt!
Re: Lunar Eclipse under way!
Anders Hultman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Wed, 27 Oct 2004, Mark Roberts wrote: Absolutely clear skies and a great view of the moon from my bedroom window! ist-D, Sigma EX 300/2.8 and 2x teleconverter in operation here. :-) This is from Stockholm, Sweden: http://anders.hultman.nu/dagens/041028-043855 *ist D, Vivitar 400/5.6 I just went through my shots of the eclipse and it looks as if the one I posted is the sharpest of the lot. I really need a better tripod head to handle 600mm on the ist-D :( (Probably a better tripod wouldn't hurt, either!) -- Mark Roberts Photography and writing www.robertstech.com
Re: Lunar Eclipse under way!
Amazing pic, Mark! Thanks for sharing. btw check out http://www.mreclipse.com/LEphoto/LEphoto.html it has some really nice hints for photographing eclipses (the site appears to be down right now), especially 'eclipse trails' or multiple exposures Badri
RE: SPAM-LOW: Re: Lunar Eclipse under way!
ditto that but I do't think I can get a decent shot - hope you do mark Bah - I got to see it in Manhattan, but by the time I got home to Queens, it was cloudy. Oh well, at least the Red Sox won the series...
Re: Lunar Eclipse under way!
Absolutely clear skies and a great view of the moon from my bedroom window! ist-D, Sigma EX 300/2.8 and 2x teleconverter in operation here. :-) -- Mark Roberts Photography and writing www.robertstech.com We were on a rooftop. Moon playing hide seek with the clouds. I had my *ist D with 80-320 and sometimes 70-200 FA; better half running film through ZX-10 with the same two lenses (traded out a few times); children had Optio 550 and a pair of Pentax binoculars. But I won't be doing a thorough edit of my images tonight; it's on my agenda for tomorrow. ER
Re: Lunar Eclipse under way!
I shot the last one, (last winter, sure was cold), used a couple of rolls of film in two different bodies, MX and LX didn't get anything as nice as this too many clouds and none were particularly photogenic... Ann Sanfedele wrote: Mark Roberts wrote: Quick 'n dirty: http://www.robertstech.com/temp/red_moon.jpg Cropped a bit. -- Mark Roberts Photography and writing www.robertstech.com Thank you for sharing that! lovely! I watched it through binocs from the roof so beautiful! but I didnt ahve the glass to even attempt to photo it! ann -- I can understand why mankind hasn't given up war. During a war you get to drive tanks through the sides of buildings and shoot foreigners - two things that are usually frowned on during peacetime. --P.J. O'Rourke
Re: SPAM-LOW: Re: Lunar Eclipse under way!
Amita Guha wrote: ditto that but I do't think I can get a decent shot - hope you do mark Bah - I got to see it in Manhattan, but by the time I got home to Queens, it was cloudy. Oh well, at least the Red Sox won the series... Did you see what Mark photoed? IT was sooo beautiful through binocs. THe Red Sox were amazing Note the 86 years since last win and the loss to the Mets in 1986 Manny said You make your own destination :) when he got the MVP ann
