Re: OT, I'm going for a beer now
After insurance and website, that $500 IS my profit for the year.
Dave
Quoting graywolf <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> One of the things those big companies often do is offer a kickback to
> the manager for giving them the concession. Hard for a one man outfit to
> pay $500 in baksheesh.
>
> --
> graywolf
> http://www.graywolfphoto.com
> http://webpages.charter.net/graywolf
> "Idiot Proof" <==> "Expert Proof"
> ---
>
>
> wendy beard wrote:
>> That's what I've been seeing too.
>> Photog hires a few shooters to cover all three rings at a show and
>> shoots lots ("just hold the button down"). There is a fancy booth with
>> viewing stations. All you have to do is ID your dog and write down the
>> sequence numbers/class and you can buy all 138 full-res jpegs on a cd
>> for $40
>> Then when you get the cd, just cull out 134 of the out-of-focus,
>> badly-timed, arse shots of self and dog and you've still got 4 decent
>> pics for $10 each
>>
>> Wendy
>>
>> On 9/27/06, Bruce Dayton <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>> Dave,
>>>
>>> If it helps, I am seeing the same thing around here. Basically, there
>>> are a few big companies that have infrastructure for booths, sun
>>> shades, multiple sets of equipment, advertising, web sites, etc. They
>>> get the contracts from all the local events and then hire shooters to
>>> cover it. What they offer is full, fast coverage. What they don't
>>> offer is quality. But the event directors are happy with the overall
>>> package, so they tend to get the business.
>>>
>>> It is very hard to compete as a one man show. My business has shrunk
>>> because of it. The smaller guys are getting squeezed out.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Best regards,
>>> Bruce
>>>
>>>
>>
>
> --
> PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List
> PDML@pdml.net
> http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
>
--
Equine and pet photography, York and Durham Region.
www.caughtinmotion.com
--
PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List
PDML@pdml.net
http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: OT, I'm going for a beer now
One of the things those big companies often do is offer a kickback to
the manager for giving them the concession. Hard for a one man outfit to
pay $500 in baksheesh.
--
graywolf
http://www.graywolfphoto.com
http://webpages.charter.net/graywolf
"Idiot Proof" <==> "Expert Proof"
---
wendy beard wrote:
> That's what I've been seeing too.
> Photog hires a few shooters to cover all three rings at a show and
> shoots lots ("just hold the button down"). There is a fancy booth with
> viewing stations. All you have to do is ID your dog and write down the
> sequence numbers/class and you can buy all 138 full-res jpegs on a cd
> for $40
> Then when you get the cd, just cull out 134 of the out-of-focus,
> badly-timed, arse shots of self and dog and you've still got 4 decent
> pics for $10 each
>
> Wendy
>
> On 9/27/06, Bruce Dayton <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> Dave,
>>
>> If it helps, I am seeing the same thing around here. Basically, there
>> are a few big companies that have infrastructure for booths, sun
>> shades, multiple sets of equipment, advertising, web sites, etc. They
>> get the contracts from all the local events and then hire shooters to
>> cover it. What they offer is full, fast coverage. What they don't
>> offer is quality. But the event directors are happy with the overall
>> package, so they tend to get the business.
>>
>> It is very hard to compete as a one man show. My business has shrunk
>> because of it. The smaller guys are getting squeezed out.
>>
>> --
>> Best regards,
>> Bruce
>>
>>
>
--
PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List
PDML@pdml.net
http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: OT, I'm going for a beer now
That's what I've been seeing too.
Photog hires a few shooters to cover all three rings at a show and
shoots lots ("just hold the button down"). There is a fancy booth with
viewing stations. All you have to do is ID your dog and write down the
sequence numbers/class and you can buy all 138 full-res jpegs on a cd
for $40
Then when you get the cd, just cull out 134 of the out-of-focus,
badly-timed, arse shots of self and dog and you've still got 4 decent
pics for $10 each
Wendy
On 9/27/06, Bruce Dayton <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Dave,
>
> If it helps, I am seeing the same thing around here. Basically, there
> are a few big companies that have infrastructure for booths, sun
> shades, multiple sets of equipment, advertising, web sites, etc. They
> get the contracts from all the local events and then hire shooters to
> cover it. What they offer is full, fast coverage. What they don't
> offer is quality. But the event directors are happy with the overall
> package, so they tend to get the business.
>
> It is very hard to compete as a one man show. My business has shrunk
> because of it. The smaller guys are getting squeezed out.
>
> --
> Best regards,
> Bruce
>
>
--
PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List
PDML@pdml.net
http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
RE: OT, I'm going for a beer now
I don't know your situation Dave, but why don't you hire in a freelancer or two every now and then? If the other guy can, I'd guess you can too. I have been running a one man business myself. Not photography, but I can imagine your situation. I _know_ it's hard to split a low(?) profit. I also know that hiring extra arms means more work. But if you do hire in a man or two, you can compete by getting alternative angles. With your knowledge you can train your extra help not to get in the way. Judging from your description you simply have to choose. Let go, or upscale your operation. Going for a beer sure helps letting some steam out, but it does not solve your problem. Sorry about kicking your lower back. I'm kicking you with the best intentions ;-) Tim Mostly harmless (just plain Norwegian) -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of David J Brooks Sent: 27. september 2006 20:46 To: pdml@pdml.net Subject: Re: OT, I'm going for a beer now I kind of thought that might be the case of late. I know he has a ton invested in gear. Five or six Canon D20's and MKII's, all of them equiped with 70-200 F2.8's. He has 4-5 mac's and 1 for printing, a dyesub printer of some sort, tent etc. When i shoot a rider, i might be able to get 6 shots from their rounds. These guys get about 30-40 from the rounds. They shoot everything, back, front, side etc, but only the odd one is worth buying. I still have a few show managers who are willing to stick by me and my work, so at least i can make back my costs and a few extra for some gear once in a while. Some of the reining shooters only offer on site viewing and print out later and mail. I might look into just doing that and see how it goes. Dave Quoting Bruce Dayton <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > Dave, > > If it helps, I am seeing the same thing around here. Basically, there > are a few big companies that have infrastructure for booths, sun > shades, multiple sets of equipment, advertising, web sites, etc. They > get the contracts from all the local events and then hire shooters to > cover it. What they offer is full, fast coverage. What they don't > offer is quality. But the event directors are happy with the overall > package, so they tend to get the business. > > It is very hard to compete as a one man show. My business has shrunk > because of it. The smaller guys are getting squeezed out. > > -- > Best regards, > Bruce > > > Wednesday, September 27, 2006, 9:42:35 AM, you wrote: > > DJB> Dont know Paul. > > DJB> I just heard, from the barn manager, that the owner of the farm in > DJB> question was impressed by buddies operation at the show he took from > DJB> me in May, that she could buy her daughters pictures right on site. > DJB> It was then, apparently, she asked them to do her 2007 show. > > DJB> His prices are higher than mine. He is VERY bilegerent, VERY pushy, > DJB> but, he hires enough photographers, er shall i say, shooters, to man > DJB> all rings, were i can only do one at a time and have to manage it the > DJB> best i can. > DJB> So far, in 6 years i have only one complaint about how i do my job, > DJB> and that was this year. > > DJB> He does get a lot of complaints about his shooting positions and > DJB> spooking horses, were i have never had that complaint. > > DJB> One bright spot, i quess, is that the manager, not this barn owner, > DJB> looks after the one day schooling shows, and will mostlikely let me > DJB> shoot those.Better than nothing. > > DJB> On a side note, i did do onsite printing up until late 2004, early > DJB> 2005. I dedided it was not work the hassle of equipment break down and > DJB> repairs, and my SO didi not want to do it anymore so that meant paying > DJB> an extra person, and more in insurance premiums, so i quess i am sorta > DJB> shooting myself in the foot, STS. > > DJB> Dave > > > > DJB> Quoting Paul Sorenson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > >>> What is he doing to make this happen and what can you do to stop it from >>> happening? Is he just getting to people first...or undercutting >>> prices...or what? >>> >>> -P >>> >>> David J Brooks wrote: >>> >>>> >>>> 2- Just found out Mr does not use a Pentax, out of focus, spook the >>>> horses, guy has taken another of my big three day events for next year. >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List >>> PDML@pdml.net >>> http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net >>> > > > > DJB> Equine Photography in York Region > > > > > -- > PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List > PDML@pdml.net > http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net > Equine Photography in York Region -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: OT, I'm going for a beer now
I have the horse shooting thing down pretty good, but it would be nice to see inside the tent and how he manages things. As far as working for him, he asked me to help him out one day last year, one of his shooters broke a limb. However this was 5 days after he chased me all over his show in Barrie, harping at me, acusing me of stealing his work etc. This went on for about an hour off and on. I was there to shot my daughter and he knew it. This is the way he operates. He spends more time trying to chase people out of the showgrounds, god forbid you have a "Pro" camera, he really goes nuts, but by doing so misses some pretty good pictures and photo ops. Any way, i have checked in with my other clients yesterday, and i'm assured i'm still part of their team. For now i suppose.:-) Dave Quoting Shel Belinkoff <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > Or learn something - a much better thing, IMO > > Shel > > > >> [Original Message] > >> In the meantime, why not get yourself employed by MrTwatface as a >> shooter. At the very least, you might be able to muck up his operation. > > > > -- > PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List > PDML@pdml.net > http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net > Equine Photography in York Region -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: OT, I'm going for a beer now
Or learn something - a much better thing, IMO Shel > [Original Message] > In the meantime, why not get yourself employed by MrTwatface as a > shooter. At the very least, you might be able to muck up his operation. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: OT, I'm going for a beer now
David J Brooks wrote: > I kind of thought that might be the case of late. > > I know he has a ton invested in gear. Five or six Canon D20's and > MKII's, all of them equiped with 70-200 F2.8's. He has 4-5 mac's and 1 > for printing, a dyesub printer of some sort, tent etc. > > When i shoot a rider, i might be able to get 6 shots from their > rounds. These guys get about 30-40 from the rounds. They shoot > everything, back, front, side etc, but only the odd one is worth buying. > > I still have a few show managers who are willing to stick by me and my > work, so at least i can make back my costs and a few extra for some > gear once in a while. > > Some of the reining shooters only offer on site viewing and print out > later and mail. I might look into just doing that and see how it goes. > > Dave > > > Quoting Bruce Dayton <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > > >>Dave, >> >>If it helps, I am seeing the same thing around here. Basically, there >>are a few big companies that have infrastructure for booths, sun >>shades, multiple sets of equipment, advertising, web sites, etc. They >>get the contracts from all the local events and then hire shooters to >>cover it. What they offer is full, fast coverage. What they don't >>offer is quality. But the event directors are happy with the overall >>package, so they tend to get the business. >> >>It is very hard to compete as a one man show. My business has shrunk >>because of it. The smaller guys are getting squeezed out. >> >>-- >>Best regards, >>Bruce >> >> >>Wednesday, September 27, 2006, 9:42:35 AM, you wrote: >> >>DJB> Dont know Paul. >> >>DJB> I just heard, from the barn manager, that the owner of the farm in >>DJB> question was impressed by buddies operation at the show he took from >>DJB> me in May, that she could buy her daughters pictures right on site. >>DJB> It was then, apparently, she asked them to do her 2007 show. >> >>DJB> His prices are higher than mine. He is VERY bilegerent, VERY pushy, >>DJB> but, he hires enough photographers, er shall i say, shooters, to man >>DJB> all rings, were i can only do one at a time and have to manage it the >>DJB> best i can. >>DJB> So far, in 6 years i have only one complaint about how i do my job, >>DJB> and that was this year. >> >>DJB> He does get a lot of complaints about his shooting positions and >>DJB> spooking horses, were i have never had that complaint. >> >>DJB> One bright spot, i quess, is that the manager, not this barn owner, >>DJB> looks after the one day schooling shows, and will mostlikely let me >>DJB> shoot those.Better than nothing. >> >>DJB> On a side note, i did do onsite printing up until late 2004, early >>DJB> 2005. I dedided it was not work the hassle of equipment break down and >>DJB> repairs, and my SO didi not want to do it anymore so that meant paying >>DJB> an extra person, and more in insurance premiums, so i quess i am sorta >>DJB> shooting myself in the foot, STS. >> >>DJB> Dave In the meantime, why not get yourself employed by MrTwatface as a shooter. At the very least, you might be able to muck up his operation. 8-)) >> >> >> >>DJB> Quoting Paul Sorenson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: >> >> What is he doing to make this happen and what can you do to stop it from happening? Is he just getting to people first...or undercutting prices...or what? -P David J Brooks wrote: >2- Just found out Mr does not use a Pentax, out of focus, spook the >horses, guy has taken another of my big three day events for next year. > -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net >> >> >> >>DJB> Equine Photography in York Region >> >> >> >> >>-- >>PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List >>PDML@pdml.net >>http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net >> > > > > > Equine Photography in York Region > -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: OT, I'm going for a beer now
I kind of thought that might be the case of late. I know he has a ton invested in gear. Five or six Canon D20's and MKII's, all of them equiped with 70-200 F2.8's. He has 4-5 mac's and 1 for printing, a dyesub printer of some sort, tent etc. When i shoot a rider, i might be able to get 6 shots from their rounds. These guys get about 30-40 from the rounds. They shoot everything, back, front, side etc, but only the odd one is worth buying. I still have a few show managers who are willing to stick by me and my work, so at least i can make back my costs and a few extra for some gear once in a while. Some of the reining shooters only offer on site viewing and print out later and mail. I might look into just doing that and see how it goes. Dave Quoting Bruce Dayton <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > Dave, > > If it helps, I am seeing the same thing around here. Basically, there > are a few big companies that have infrastructure for booths, sun > shades, multiple sets of equipment, advertising, web sites, etc. They > get the contracts from all the local events and then hire shooters to > cover it. What they offer is full, fast coverage. What they don't > offer is quality. But the event directors are happy with the overall > package, so they tend to get the business. > > It is very hard to compete as a one man show. My business has shrunk > because of it. The smaller guys are getting squeezed out. > > -- > Best regards, > Bruce > > > Wednesday, September 27, 2006, 9:42:35 AM, you wrote: > > DJB> Dont know Paul. > > DJB> I just heard, from the barn manager, that the owner of the farm in > DJB> question was impressed by buddies operation at the show he took from > DJB> me in May, that she could buy her daughters pictures right on site. > DJB> It was then, apparently, she asked them to do her 2007 show. > > DJB> His prices are higher than mine. He is VERY bilegerent, VERY pushy, > DJB> but, he hires enough photographers, er shall i say, shooters, to man > DJB> all rings, were i can only do one at a time and have to manage it the > DJB> best i can. > DJB> So far, in 6 years i have only one complaint about how i do my job, > DJB> and that was this year. > > DJB> He does get a lot of complaints about his shooting positions and > DJB> spooking horses, were i have never had that complaint. > > DJB> One bright spot, i quess, is that the manager, not this barn owner, > DJB> looks after the one day schooling shows, and will mostlikely let me > DJB> shoot those.Better than nothing. > > DJB> On a side note, i did do onsite printing up until late 2004, early > DJB> 2005. I dedided it was not work the hassle of equipment break down and > DJB> repairs, and my SO didi not want to do it anymore so that meant paying > DJB> an extra person, and more in insurance premiums, so i quess i am sorta > DJB> shooting myself in the foot, STS. > > DJB> Dave > > > > DJB> Quoting Paul Sorenson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > >>> What is he doing to make this happen and what can you do to stop it from >>> happening? Is he just getting to people first...or undercutting >>> prices...or what? >>> >>> -P >>> >>> David J Brooks wrote: >>> 2- Just found out Mr does not use a Pentax, out of focus, spook the horses, guy has taken another of my big three day events for next year. >>> >>> >>> -- >>> PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List >>> PDML@pdml.net >>> http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net >>> > > > > DJB> Equine Photography in York Region > > > > > -- > PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List > PDML@pdml.net > http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net > Equine Photography in York Region -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: OT, I'm going for a beer now
Dave, If it helps, I am seeing the same thing around here. Basically, there are a few big companies that have infrastructure for booths, sun shades, multiple sets of equipment, advertising, web sites, etc. They get the contracts from all the local events and then hire shooters to cover it. What they offer is full, fast coverage. What they don't offer is quality. But the event directors are happy with the overall package, so they tend to get the business. It is very hard to compete as a one man show. My business has shrunk because of it. The smaller guys are getting squeezed out. -- Best regards, Bruce Wednesday, September 27, 2006, 9:42:35 AM, you wrote: DJB> Dont know Paul. DJB> I just heard, from the barn manager, that the owner of the farm in DJB> question was impressed by buddies operation at the show he took from DJB> me in May, that she could buy her daughters pictures right on site. DJB> It was then, apparently, she asked them to do her 2007 show. DJB> His prices are higher than mine. He is VERY bilegerent, VERY pushy, DJB> but, he hires enough photographers, er shall i say, shooters, to man DJB> all rings, were i can only do one at a time and have to manage it the DJB> best i can. DJB> So far, in 6 years i have only one complaint about how i do my job, DJB> and that was this year. DJB> He does get a lot of complaints about his shooting positions and DJB> spooking horses, were i have never had that complaint. DJB> One bright spot, i quess, is that the manager, not this barn owner, DJB> looks after the one day schooling shows, and will mostlikely let me DJB> shoot those.Better than nothing. DJB> On a side note, i did do onsite printing up until late 2004, early DJB> 2005. I dedided it was not work the hassle of equipment break down and DJB> repairs, and my SO didi not want to do it anymore so that meant paying DJB> an extra person, and more in insurance premiums, so i quess i am sorta DJB> shooting myself in the foot, STS. DJB> Dave DJB> Quoting Paul Sorenson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: >> What is he doing to make this happen and what can you do to stop it from >> happening? Is he just getting to people first...or undercutting >> prices...or what? >> >> -P >> >> David J Brooks wrote: >> >>> >>> 2- Just found out Mr does not use a Pentax, out of focus, spook the >>> horses, guy has taken another of my big three day events for next year. >>> >> >> >> -- >> PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List >> PDML@pdml.net >> http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net >> DJB> Equine Photography in York Region -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: OT, I'm going for a beer now
Dont know Paul. I just heard, from the barn manager, that the owner of the farm in question was impressed by buddies operation at the show he took from me in May, that she could buy her daughters pictures right on site. It was then, apparently, she asked them to do her 2007 show. His prices are higher than mine. He is VERY bilegerent, VERY pushy, but, he hires enough photographers, er shall i say, shooters, to man all rings, were i can only do one at a time and have to manage it the best i can. So far, in 6 years i have only one complaint about how i do my job, and that was this year. He does get a lot of complaints about his shooting positions and spooking horses, were i have never had that complaint. One bright spot, i quess, is that the manager, not this barn owner, looks after the one day schooling shows, and will mostlikely let me shoot those.Better than nothing. On a side note, i did do onsite printing up until late 2004, early 2005. I dedided it was not work the hassle of equipment break down and repairs, and my SO didi not want to do it anymore so that meant paying an extra person, and more in insurance premiums, so i quess i am sorta shooting myself in the foot, STS. Dave Quoting Paul Sorenson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > What is he doing to make this happen and what can you do to stop it from > happening? Is he just getting to people first...or undercutting > prices...or what? > > -P > > David J Brooks wrote: > >> >> 2- Just found out Mr does not use a Pentax, out of focus, spook the >> horses, guy has taken another of my big three day events for next year. >> > > > -- > PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List > PDML@pdml.net > http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net > Equine Photography in York Region -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: OT, I'm going for a beer now
Scott Loveless wrote: > There's a possible TOPDML coming up. Sounds like a knee-capping party > to me. ;) Let me know if that TOPDML meet is going to happen. I'm due for a road trip. :) -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: OT, I'm going for a beer now
On 9/26/06, David J Brooks <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Two reasons. > > 1- Company is restructuring the restructure, but it still looks like i > might have a position ~somewere~, i hope. Can't help with that one. Sorry. > > 2- Just found out Mr does not use a Pentax, out of focus, spook the > horses, guy has taken another of my big three day events for next year. > There's a possible TOPDML coming up. Sounds like a knee-capping party to me. ;) -- Scott Loveless http://www.twosixteen.com Shoot more film! -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: OT, I'm going for a beer now
On 9/26/06, David J Brooks <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Two reasons. > > 1- Company is restructuring the restructure, but it still looks like i > might have a position ~somewere~, i hope. > > 2- Just found out Mr does not use a Pentax, out of focus, spook the > horses, guy has taken another of my big three day events for next year. > > Is it really worth it.I now have more digital cmaeras than work.:-) > > Need pretzels and loud music, now. > > I may not make much sense on the list later tonight. > > > > Dave, down to 4 Trillium and 5 school shows, Brooks > > Equine Photography in York Region Have one for me, Dave. cheers, frank -- "Sharpness is a bourgeois concept." -Henri Cartier-Bresson -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: OT, I'm going for a beer now
What is he doing to make this happen and what can you do to stop it from happening? Is he just getting to people first...or undercutting prices...or what? -P David J Brooks wrote: > > 2- Just found out Mr does not use a Pentax, out of focus, spook the > horses, guy has taken another of my big three day events for next year. > -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
