RE: PESO: a view from above

2009-03-20 Thread Bob W
> ... and the vehicles akimbo elsewhere.  anyway, I like it 
> more each time 
> I look at it...
> 
> ann

Yes, so do I. I think it's a very good photograph indeed.

Bob


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Re: PESO: a view from above

2009-03-20 Thread Paul Stenquist

I like it. Interesting shot.
Paul
On Mar 20, 2009, at 12:56 PM, Ken Waller wrote:


Wow! Such an image !
And I don't mean that simply because of the photog.

The use of the graphical elements (the fence, road,railing) to move  
your eye thru the image is extremely well done.


Thanks for posting - a great example !

Kenneth Waller
http://www.tinyurl.com/272u2f

- Original Message - From: "Bob W" 
Subject: RE: PESO: a view from above



http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3458/3369203594_e16d39223d_b.jpg

On Fri, Mar 20, 2009 at 01:13:22AM +0100, Luka Knezevic-Strika  
wrote:
> perhaps it is just that. i tought it had a good balance and that  
it

> was graphically compelling.

I liked the colors of the cars, and as far as I could tell on my
crappy monitor at work, technically it is spot on, the tonal range
looks good, everything looks sharp. Perhaps the details detract, I
look for meaning in the people crossing the street, the traffic, and
so forth.

If you like it as an abstract, it might work better if it were more
abstract. Can you throw the digital equivalent of a soft focus on  
it?

Maybe one of those faux oil painting photoshop plug ins?



Why not just vomit on it instead?

It reminded me at first glance of this photo, which also looks like a
snapshot of some parked cars and people.

http://tinyurl.com/dbpxjm

http://www.magnumphotos.com/Archive/C.aspx?VP=Mod_ViewBox.ViewBoxZoom_VPage&;
VBID 
= 
2K1HZOY09145W 
&IT=ImageZoom01&PN=1&STM=T&DTTM=Image&SP=Search&IID=2S5RYD

IIGDSX&SAKL=T&SGBT=T&DT=Image

This word 'abstract' that people use about photographs is pure  
bollocks. A

photograph cannot be abstract. A photograph has formal geometrical
properties which may dominate the subject, as they do in this  
photograph,
but it's not abstract. People also use the term about close-ups and  
pictures
where it's sometimes at first difficult to recognise what the  
subject is.
But they are not abstract, they're just close-ups. It's a misuse of  
the
word, drawn from painting where genuine abstraction is possible.  
People see
they geometric or other non-figurative properties of a painting and  
think

that that's what abstraction means, and consequently misapply it to
photographs.

Bob



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Re: PESO: a view from above

2009-03-20 Thread Ken Waller

Wow! Such an image !
And I don't mean that simply because of the photog.

The use of the graphical elements (the fence, road,railing) to move your eye 
thru the image is extremely well done.


Thanks for posting - a great example !

Kenneth Waller
http://www.tinyurl.com/272u2f

- Original Message - 
From: "Bob W" 

Subject: RE: PESO: a view from above



http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3458/3369203594_e16d39223d_b.jpg


On Fri, Mar 20, 2009 at 01:13:22AM +0100, Luka Knezevic-Strika wrote:
> perhaps it is just that. i tought it had a good balance and that it
> was graphically compelling.

I liked the colors of the cars, and as far as I could tell on my
crappy monitor at work, technically it is spot on, the tonal range
looks good, everything looks sharp. Perhaps the details detract, I
look for meaning in the people crossing the street, the traffic, and
so forth.

If you like it as an abstract, it might work better if it were more
abstract. Can you throw the digital equivalent of a soft focus on it?
Maybe one of those faux oil painting photoshop plug ins?



Why not just vomit on it instead?

It reminded me at first glance of this photo, which also looks like a
snapshot of some parked cars and people.

http://tinyurl.com/dbpxjm

http://www.magnumphotos.com/Archive/C.aspx?VP=Mod_ViewBox.ViewBoxZoom_VPage&;
VBID=2K1HZOY09145W&IT=ImageZoom01&PN=1&STM=T&DTTM=Image&SP=Search&IID=2S5RYD
IIGDSX&SAKL=T&SGBT=T&DT=Image

This word 'abstract' that people use about photographs is pure bollocks. A
photograph cannot be abstract. A photograph has formal geometrical
properties which may dominate the subject, as they do in this photograph,
but it's not abstract. People also use the term about close-ups and 
pictures

where it's sometimes at first difficult to recognise what the subject is.
But they are not abstract, they're just close-ups. It's a misuse of the
word, drawn from painting where genuine abstraction is possible. People 
see

they geometric or other non-figurative properties of a painting and think
that that's what abstraction means, and consequently misapply it to
photographs.

Bob



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Re: PESO: a view from above

2009-03-20 Thread ann sanfedele
Luka - as you know from my original post I like the photo-journalistic 
aspect of it... the helter-skelterness (ugh, someone is
going to get on me for that coinage)  is intriguing - what I see in it 
from a documentary perspective (yeah yeah, here we go with puns)  is the 
recording of what looks like an accident scene in the lower left corner 
... and the vehicles akimbo elsewhere.  anyway, I like it more each time 
I look at it...


ann

Luka Knezevic-Strika wrote:


ah, i've been honored with a PDML-esque discussion. this, if nothing,
makes the posting of the photo in question, worthwhile :)


i do agree that the fact a photograph is based on reality in a certain
objective way is important. but, than again, i don't think it rules
out abstract photography. it's just, a work of art doesn't need a
history or a 'builders' manual' for one to be able to appreciate it,
and if some potential abstract photo does whatever one wants in an
abstract art form, than it is abstract. the fact you can trace it to
film and therefore 'original scene' is meaningless. similarly, finding
roots of pollock's paintings is also meaningless in respect to them
being abstract or not.

On Fri, Mar 20, 2009 at 2:55 PM, Christian  wrote:
 


ann sanfedele wrote:
   


Luka Knezevic-Strika wrote:

 


perhaps it is just that. i tought it had a good balance and that it
was graphically compelling.

   


So do I, Luka... and a nice piece of photo-journalism... might like to see
a black and white conversion though.

 


At first i found it a bit jarring, but I do like the colors and geometry of
it.


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Re: PESO: a view from above

2009-03-20 Thread frank theriault
2009/3/19 Luka Knezevic-Strika :
> http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3458/3369203594_e16d39223d_b.jpg
>
> pentax spotmatic spII
> zeiss 20 2.8
> fuji reala 100

I like it.

At first the lines of parked cars look quite orderly, then you notice
a few that are "out of place".  Then you notice the little clump of
pedestrians making their way across the street.  The orderliness of
the buildings and square, less orderly cars and very disorderly
pedestrians - it's all pretty cool.

I like it!

cheers,
frank




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Re: PESO: a view from above

2009-03-20 Thread Luka Knezevic-Strika
ah, i've been honored with a PDML-esque discussion. this, if nothing,
makes the posting of the photo in question, worthwhile :)


i do agree that the fact a photograph is based on reality in a certain
objective way is important. but, than again, i don't think it rules
out abstract photography. it's just, a work of art doesn't need a
history or a 'builders' manual' for one to be able to appreciate it,
and if some potential abstract photo does whatever one wants in an
abstract art form, than it is abstract. the fact you can trace it to
film and therefore 'original scene' is meaningless. similarly, finding
roots of pollock's paintings is also meaningless in respect to them
being abstract or not.

On Fri, Mar 20, 2009 at 2:55 PM, Christian  wrote:
> ann sanfedele wrote:
>>
>>
>> Luka Knezevic-Strika wrote:
>>
>>> perhaps it is just that. i tought it had a good balance and that it
>>> was graphically compelling.
>>>
>> So do I, Luka... and a nice piece of photo-journalism... might like to see
>> a black and white conversion though.
>>
>
> At first i found it a bit jarring, but I do like the colors and geometry of
> it.
>
>
> --
>
> Christian
> http://404mohawknotfound.blogspot.com/
>
> --
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Re: PESO: a view from above

2009-03-20 Thread Christian

ann sanfedele wrote:



Luka Knezevic-Strika wrote:


perhaps it is just that. i tought it had a good balance and that it
was graphically compelling.

So do I, Luka... and a nice piece of photo-journalism... might like to 
see a black and white conversion though.




At first i found it a bit jarring, but I do like the colors and geometry 
of it.



--

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RE: PESO: a view from above

2009-03-20 Thread Bob W
> p...@web-options.com writes:
> that's a perfect example  of equivocation. Abstraction in 
> painting refers to
> the removal (ie  abstraction) of representation & subject matter from
> paintings, leaving  only the formal properties of point, 
> line, surface,
> volume, space, form, tone  and colour. That's the type of 
> abstraction you
> refer to when you first use  the word - abstraction opposed to
> representation. 
> 
> You then use  abstract in opposition to concrete, though I 
> question whether
> many of your  examples are abstract, such as emotions, wealth 
> and power. That
> is not what  abstraction in painting refers to. 
> 
> Mondrian, Kandinsky, Pollock and  others are classic examples 
> of abstraction
> in painting. The purpose is  nothing to do with the concepts 
> you list (except
> in so far as art is a means  to wealth, power and strife!), rather the
> purpose is to make the formal  properties themselves the 
> subject of the work.
> 
> This is not possible with  photography because of its 
> inherent relationship
> with subject matter and our  expectations that photographs are 'of'
> something. So-called abstract  photographs always end up as 
> some sort of
> party game where people try to  guess what they are of.
> 
> Bob
> 
> ===
> You refer, of course,  only to unmanipulated photographs.
> 
> Marnie aka Doe  :-)
> 

No, I don't.

Bob


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Re: PESO: a view from above

2009-03-20 Thread Rick Womer

Luka,

I like it.  What holds it together for me is the sprinkling of red cars and the 
red sign on the building on the left side.

Rick

http://photo.net/photos/RickW


--- On Thu, 3/19/09, Luka Knezevic-Strika  wrote:

> From: Luka Knezevic-Strika 
> Subject: PESO: a view from above
> To: "Pentax-Discuss Mail List" 
> Date: Thursday, March 19, 2009, 7:17 PM
> http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3458/3369203594_e16d39223d_b.jpg
> 
> pentax spotmatic spII
> zeiss 20 2.8
> fuji reala 100
> 
> --
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> to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link
> directly above and follow the directions.


  

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Re: PESO: a view from above

2009-03-20 Thread Cotty
On 20/3/09, Luka Knezevic-Strika, discombobulated, unleashed:

>http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3458/3369203594_e16d39223d_b.jpg
>
>pentax spotmatic spII
>zeiss 20 2.8
>fuji reala 100

Cars everywhere, but people take precedence. Nice.

--


Cheers,
  Cotty


___/\__
||   (O)  | People, Places, Pastiche
||=|http://www.cottysnaps.com
_



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Re: PESO: a view from above

2009-03-19 Thread Luiz Felipe

Like the idea, would be tempted to return just before nightfall.

LF

Luka Knezevic-Strika escreveu:

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3458/3369203594_e16d39223d_b.jpg

pentax spotmatic spII
zeiss 20 2.8
fuji reala 100

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Re: PESO: a view from above

2009-03-19 Thread Eactivist
In a message dated 3/19/2009 4:17:57 P.M.  Pacific Daylight Time, 
lukastr...@gmail.com  writes:
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3458/3369203594_e16d39223d_b.jpg

pentax  spotmatic spII
zeiss 20 2.8
fuji reala  100


===
While, I sort of like it, for me, it needs a focal  point (a center of 
interest) to bring it all together into a whole.

HTH,  Marnie aka Doe 

-
Warning:  I am now filtering my email, so you may be censored.  

**Feeling the pinch at the grocery store?  Make meals for Under 
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Re: PESO: a view from above

2009-03-19 Thread Eactivist
In a message dated 3/19/2009 9:26:06 P.M.  Pacific Daylight Time, 
p...@web-options.com writes:
that's a perfect example  of equivocation. Abstraction in painting refers to
the removal (ie  abstraction) of representation & subject matter from
paintings, leaving  only the formal properties of point, line, surface,
volume, space, form, tone  and colour. That's the type of abstraction you
refer to when you first use  the word - abstraction opposed to
representation. 

You then use  abstract in opposition to concrete, though I question whether
many of your  examples are abstract, such as emotions, wealth and power. That
is not what  abstraction in painting refers to. 

Mondrian, Kandinsky, Pollock and  others are classic examples of abstraction
in painting. The purpose is  nothing to do with the concepts you list (except
in so far as art is a means  to wealth, power and strife!), rather the
purpose is to make the formal  properties themselves the subject of the work.

This is not possible with  photography because of its inherent relationship
with subject matter and our  expectations that photographs are 'of'
something. So-called abstract  photographs always end up as some sort of
party game where people try to  guess what they are of.

Bob

===
You refer, of course,  only to unmanipulated photographs.

Marnie aka Doe  :-)

-
Warning: I am now  filtering my email, so you may be censored.  

**Feeling the pinch at the grocery store?  Make meals for Under 
$10. (http://food.aol.com/frugal-feasts?ncid=emlcntusfood0002)

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RE: PESO: a view from above

2009-03-19 Thread Bob W

> > ... It's a misuse of the
> > word, drawn from painting where genuine abstraction is possible.  
> > People see
> > they geometric or other non-figurative properties of a 
> painting and  
> > think
> > that that's what abstraction means, and consequently misapply it to
> > photographs.
> 
> Abstraction can still exist in photographic works, although I agree  
> that the word abstract is often misapplied to photographs where the  
> content is simply difficult to parse visually. Abstraction in  
> photographs means that the intent and emotional impact of the  
> photograph transcends the literal context or content. Since  
> photographs are recordings of light reflecting or being absorbed by  
> subject matter in one way or another, every photograph has some  
> "thing" as its content, as its representational core. But abstract  
> concepts and emotions like irony, sadness, joy, beauty, pain, loss,  
> strife, power, wealth, etc. can be seen beyond the representational  
> aspect of that content, drawn out by the juxtapositions of the  
> geometry, the colors or the situational context represented in  
> content, similar to how painters use color, geometry, 
> juxtaposition of  
> figurative elements, etc, to do the same thing.
> 

that's a perfect example of equivocation. Abstraction in painting refers to
the removal (ie abstraction) of representation & subject matter from
paintings, leaving only the formal properties of point, line, surface,
volume, space, form, tone and colour. That's the type of abstraction you
refer to when you first use the word - abstraction opposed to
representation. 

You then use abstract in opposition to concrete, though I question whether
many of your examples are abstract, such as emotions, wealth and power. That
is not what abstraction in painting refers to. 

Mondrian, Kandinsky, Pollock and others are classic examples of abstraction
in painting. The purpose is nothing to do with the concepts you list (except
in so far as art is a means to wealth, power and strife!), rather the
purpose is to make the formal properties themselves the subject of the work.

This is not possible with photography because of its inherent relationship
with subject matter and our expectations that photographs are 'of'
something. So-called abstract photographs always end up as some sort of
party game where people try to guess what they are of.

Bob


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Re: PESO: a view from above

2009-03-19 Thread Godfrey DiGiorgi


On Mar 19, 2009, at 5:34 PM, Bob W wrote:


http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3458/3369203594_e16d39223d_b.jpg


It's an nice photograph of a street scene, but it doesn't make the  
leap into anything beyond that.


... If you like it as an abstract, it might work better if it were  
more

abstract. Can you throw the digital equivalent of a soft focus on it?
Maybe one of those faux oil painting photoshop plug ins? ...


... This word 'abstract' that people use about photographs is pure  
bollocks. A

photograph cannot be abstract. ...


I don't entirely agree.


... A photograph has formal geometrical
properties which may dominate the subject, as they do in this  
photograph,
but it's not abstract. People also use the term about close-ups and  
pictures
where it's sometimes at first difficult to recognise what the  
subject is.

But they are not abstract, they're just close-ups. ...


I agree about that class of photographs. Close-ups are simply  
representational and document something we don't ordinarily see. Few  
of them move much beyond the literal "lookitthat!"



... It's a misuse of the
word, drawn from painting where genuine abstraction is possible.  
People see
they geometric or other non-figurative properties of a painting and  
think

that that's what abstraction means, and consequently misapply it to
photographs.


Abstraction can still exist in photographic works, although I agree  
that the word abstract is often misapplied to photographs where the  
content is simply difficult to parse visually. Abstraction in  
photographs means that the intent and emotional impact of the  
photograph transcends the literal context or content. Since  
photographs are recordings of light reflecting or being absorbed by  
subject matter in one way or another, every photograph has some  
"thing" as its content, as its representational core. But abstract  
concepts and emotions like irony, sadness, joy, beauty, pain, loss,  
strife, power, wealth, etc. can be seen beyond the representational  
aspect of that content, drawn out by the juxtapositions of the  
geometry, the colors or the situational context represented in  
content, similar to how painters use color, geometry, juxtaposition of  
figurative elements, etc, to do the same thing.


Godfrey

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Re: PESO: a view from above

2009-03-19 Thread Jack Davis

Very interesting. Well done! Would make a fine jigsaw puzzle. ;)

Jack


--- On Thu, 3/19/09, Luka Knezevic-Strika  wrote:

> From: Luka Knezevic-Strika 
> Subject: PESO: a view from above
> To: "Pentax-Discuss Mail List" 
> Date: Thursday, March 19, 2009, 4:17 PM
> http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3458/3369203594_e16d39223d_b.jpg
> 
> pentax spotmatic spII
> zeiss 20 2.8
> fuji reala 100
> 
> --
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Re: PESO: a view from above

2009-03-19 Thread ann sanfedele

answering myself --
changed my mind about bw conversion... I don't think it would be as 
compelling :-)

ann

ann sanfedele wrote:




Luka Knezevic-Strika wrote:


perhaps it is just that. i tought it had a good balance and that it
was graphically compelling.

So do I, Luka... and a nice piece of photo-journalism... might like to 
see a black and white conversion though.


ann



On Fri, Mar 20, 2009 at 1:10 AM, Larry Colen  wrote:
 


On Fri, Mar 20, 2009 at 12:17:41AM +0100, Luka Knezevic-Strika wrote:
  


http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3458/3369203594_e16d39223d_b.jpg



I'm afraid that I don't quite understand what this picture is trying
to do. It just looks like a snapshot of some parked cars to me.


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the wrong answer.
Larry Colen l...@red4est.com
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RE: PESO: a view from above

2009-03-19 Thread Bob W
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3458/3369203594_e16d39223d_b.jpg

> On Fri, Mar 20, 2009 at 01:13:22AM +0100, Luka Knezevic-Strika wrote:
> > perhaps it is just that. i tought it had a good balance and that it
> > was graphically compelling.
> 
> I liked the colors of the cars, and as far as I could tell on my
> crappy monitor at work, technically it is spot on, the tonal range
> looks good, everything looks sharp. Perhaps the details detract, I
> look for meaning in the people crossing the street, the traffic, and
> so forth. 
> 
> If you like it as an abstract, it might work better if it were more
> abstract. Can you throw the digital equivalent of a soft focus on it?
> Maybe one of those faux oil painting photoshop plug ins?
> 

Why not just vomit on it instead?

It reminded me at first glance of this photo, which also looks like a
snapshot of some parked cars and people.

http://tinyurl.com/dbpxjm

http://www.magnumphotos.com/Archive/C.aspx?VP=Mod_ViewBox.ViewBoxZoom_VPage&;
VBID=2K1HZOY09145W&IT=ImageZoom01&PN=1&STM=T&DTTM=Image&SP=Search&IID=2S5RYD
IIGDSX&SAKL=T&SGBT=T&DT=Image

This word 'abstract' that people use about photographs is pure bollocks. A
photograph cannot be abstract. A photograph has formal geometrical
properties which may dominate the subject, as they do in this photograph,
but it's not abstract. People also use the term about close-ups and pictures
where it's sometimes at first difficult to recognise what the subject is.
But they are not abstract, they're just close-ups. It's a misuse of the
word, drawn from painting where genuine abstraction is possible. People see
they geometric or other non-figurative properties of a painting and think
that that's what abstraction means, and consequently misapply it to
photographs. 

Bob


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Re: PESO: a view from above

2009-03-19 Thread ann sanfedele



Luka Knezevic-Strika wrote:


perhaps it is just that. i tought it had a good balance and that it
was graphically compelling.

So do I, Luka... and a nice piece of photo-journalism... might like to 
see a black and white conversion though.


ann



On Fri, Mar 20, 2009 at 1:10 AM, Larry Colen  wrote:
 


On Fri, Mar 20, 2009 at 12:17:41AM +0100, Luka Knezevic-Strika wrote:
   


http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3458/3369203594_e16d39223d_b.jpg
 


I'm afraid that I don't quite understand what this picture is trying
to do. It just looks like a snapshot of some parked cars to me.


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Re: PESO: a view from above

2009-03-19 Thread Brian Walters
On Fri, 20 Mar 2009 00:17 +0100, "Luka Knezevic-Strika"
 wrote:
> http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3458/3369203594_e16d39223d_b.jpg
> 
> pentax spotmatic spII
> zeiss 20 2.8
> fuji reala 100
> 


Gads!  An image captured on film - and with a Spottie, no less!

I'm not quite sure about this one - lots of vibrant colour and action
but it doesn't seem to have a defined focal point.  

(and why are they all driving on the wrong side of the road  :-)>  )


Cheers

Brian

++
Brian Walters
Western Sydney Australia
http://members.westnet.com.au/brianwal/SL/


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Re: PESO: a view from above

2009-03-19 Thread Larry Colen
On Fri, Mar 20, 2009 at 01:13:22AM +0100, Luka Knezevic-Strika wrote:
> perhaps it is just that. i tought it had a good balance and that it
> was graphically compelling.

I liked the colors of the cars, and as far as I could tell on my
crappy monitor at work, technically it is spot on, the tonal range
looks good, everything looks sharp. Perhaps the details detract, I
look for meaning in the people crossing the street, the traffic, and
so forth. 

If you like it as an abstract, it might work better if it were more
abstract. Can you throw the digital equivalent of a soft focus on it?
Maybe one of those faux oil painting photoshop plug ins?



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Re: PESO: a view from above

2009-03-19 Thread Luka Knezevic-Strika
perhaps it is just that. i tought it had a good balance and that it
was graphically compelling.

On Fri, Mar 20, 2009 at 1:10 AM, Larry Colen  wrote:
> On Fri, Mar 20, 2009 at 12:17:41AM +0100, Luka Knezevic-Strika wrote:
>> http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3458/3369203594_e16d39223d_b.jpg
>
> I'm afraid that I don't quite understand what this picture is trying
> to do. It just looks like a snapshot of some parked cars to me.
>
>
> --
> The fastest way to get your question answered on the net is to post
> the wrong answer.
> Larry Colen             l...@red4est.com            http://www.red4est.com/lrc
>
>
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Re: PESO: a view from above

2009-03-19 Thread Larry Colen
On Fri, Mar 20, 2009 at 12:17:41AM +0100, Luka Knezevic-Strika wrote:
> http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3458/3369203594_e16d39223d_b.jpg

I'm afraid that I don't quite understand what this picture is trying
to do. It just looks like a snapshot of some parked cars to me.


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the wrong answer.
Larry Colen l...@red4est.comhttp://www.red4est.com/lrc


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