Re: What's Wrong With the PDML Server? What's wrong with the archives?
The recent mails concerning the mail server and the archive were really helpful to understand how the system is set up. Obviously the mail-server works very smoothly. Thank you Doug! The archives (only these are availlable on the web) were in a definite mess. When people were complaining about the list they obviously meant the archives (and not the PDML-mail server of Doug). I was suprised by the way people who pointed out difficulties on the system, were attacked by other list members. Comments like do it yourself why don't you offer a better service etc. were abundant. Of course I'd like to, unfortunately I'm not very computer literate. Obviously these comments were just aimed at stuffing the mouths of people who dared notice anything. One list member even send the guidelines of the mail archive pointing out that there was no guarantee what so ever. Suprisingly these guidlines contained the following statement: How can I help? There are several ways you might be able to help out with The Mail Archive. First and foremost, complain! Is something too slow? Could something be done better? Does something not work correctly? Any feedback we get goes towards making a better service. There is a place to submit feedback on the general information page. I looked up the link, the emailadress for this feedback is: [EMAIL PROTECTED] So when people notice difficulties with the archives, I think this is where the comments should go (not to [EMAIL PROTECTED] [I made this mistake myself]). The people who run the archive do this for free (they are enthusiasts as well) so agressive comments are obviously not appropriate. Nevertheless I'm really sure they'd appreciate construtive feedback, where people notice oddities of the archives. Best wishes, Knut - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
[Fwd: Re: What's Wrong With the PDML Server?]
Whatever problems going on at mail-archive.com have absolutely nothing to do with the PDML server. The PDML server is fine. There is nothing wrong with the PDML server. One more time: The PDML server is healthy and happy. I spend a lot of time and not a little money keeping the PDML server fed and happy and it is running very smoothly right now, and I am beginning to resent that any time a service over which I have no control gets, in some people's opinion, behind in its VOLUNTARY service, I get the blame. Both the PDML and the separate organization that handles our archiving are brought to you by people who feel that both are worthwhile. They are both brought to you at no charge. If you have problems with either service that are insurmountable, there is only one course of action. Demand your money back. Doug Me: My wife insists on the right to be testy with me without reason. I've never conceded the point to her, and I won't to anyone else. Firstly: Many of us, Doug, myself included, have expressed our appreciation for your efforts to keep PDML going. We enjoy the list. I thank you again. Secondly: Let me see if I've got this straight: PDML and mail-archive.com are two separate entities. Okay. Now I've got it. I don't recall, however, that this was ever explained. It's still not explicitly explained. I had to ferret it from the above. If this had ever been expliclty explained, then the testiness would be understandable. In the future I'll just throw a brick at the wall, since mail-archive.com gives no place to report faulty performance. Thirdly: Demand your money back implies something for nothing. Fair enough, if the something gets delivered. Lately it hasn't been. I've gotten nearly nothing for nothing. I am very happy that someone runs mail-archive.com as a free public service. I think, though, that one should not offer a service, free or otherwise, unless one can deliver. And, Doug: Did I thank you? I wouldn't complain if I didn't value PDML so much. In the future I'll know not to complain to you. If I complain to the list, please don't read it as a personal complaint. I'll try to be explicit about the fault lying with mail-archive.com. Joe - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
Re: What's Wrong With the PDML Server?
It will be sent in a plain white unaddressed, unstamped envelop. The list is worth every cent we are paying Doug to maintain it. Why he does this for nothing and then has to listen to compliants is beyond me, but I sure appreciate it. Thanks Doug. --graywolf - The optimist's cup is half full, The pessimist's is half empty, The wise man enjoys his drink. - Original Message - From: Doug Brewer [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, November 12, 2001 10:40 PM Subject: Re: What's Wrong With the PDML Server? Demand your money back. - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
Re: What's Wrong With the PDML Server?
List Guys, I personally didn't see any of the complaints regarding the web-version of the PDML as attacks. I thought they were written more in the tone of inquiries as to what the problem might be. Maybe they reflected a little undertone of frustration, but wouldn't we all? I don't think anyone was attacking Doug, at least I didn't see it that way. I can see why members did this. They rely on, and enjoy the web version of the PDML as much as we enjoy the live list. To not have it for days DOES indicate a problem, albeit not with the PDML server. The fact is, excuse me Doug, for speaking out of turn, that Doug is just about, if not the only person, one can address concerns to. The web version, as he says, is not what's running on his server. That is handled somewhere else. I'm sure that Doug has been, and will be passing the concerns along. I'm sure we all appreciate the time and effort Doug puts into this list. Without him, someone else would have to host it, or it wouldn't exist. I'm not sure the 'it's free, so like it or lump it' argument holds water. There are lots of things that are, to an extent, free in this world that we use, depend on, and take advantage of because they are offered. It's like driving down to the filling station and always finding their air hose for tires is out of service. It's free sure, but still of no value. We would not keep driving there to put air in our tires if we knew it wasn't working. The PDML is one of those things. If there is a problem with the web version and it's unreliable, and cannot be made reliable, then maybe it's time to get rid of it. I'm not saying that's the solution I'm just saying... what? If it can become reliable, great. If it's not reliable, then switching over to the live list is probably the next best option for those who consider it to be that valuable. I think raising the red flag is quite appropriate. On the other hand, if Doug's been receiving Damn you fool - get it working messages off-list, I can see why HE would be upset. Hope I didn't offend anyone. Tom C. - Original Message - From: Tom Rittenhouse [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, November 13, 2001 4:37 PM Subject: Re: What's Wrong With the PDML Server? It will be sent in a plain white unaddressed, unstamped envelop. The list is worth every cent we are paying Doug to maintain it. Why he does this for nothing and then has to listen to compliants is beyond me, but I sure appreciate it. Thanks Doug. --graywolf - The optimist's cup is half full, The pessimist's is half empty, The wise man enjoys his drink. - Original Message - From: Doug Brewer [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, November 12, 2001 10:40 PM Subject: Re: What's Wrong With the PDML Server? Demand your money back. - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org . - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
Re: What's Wrong With the PDML Server?
I'm sure we all appreciate the time and effort Doug puts into this list. I sure do. Thanks Doug! Without him, someone else would have to host it, or it wouldn't exist. When Doug sent that message a while back, saying that we were being kicked off of pentax.com, I first thought the list was going to move to topica.com or Yahoo groups. I'm in a couple of lists hosted by topica, and they work seamlessly (like pdml.net does) but thay also provide a web interface if you want it. Actually, for one of the lists I'm on I get email, the other I read on the web. Doug, if keeping the list going takes a lot of resources I'd suggest you move it to Topica. You can still manage it, but it should be free, and the archive takes care of itself. Just my $.02, j -- --- Juan J. Buhler | Sr. FX Animator @ PDI | Photos at http://www.jbuhler.com --- - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
What's Wrong With the PDML Server?
To maintain my e-mail sanity (or as much as possible), I read and participate in PDML on the web site, not as e-mail. That is, I read it at: http://www.mail-archive.com/pentax-discuss%40pdml.net/ From time to time the server seems to get days behind in posting messages. It happened a few months ago, then 3 or 4 weeks ago, then again this month. That is, it is becoming more frequent. Now it has caught up to Nov. 10, but it seems that about 2/3 of the messages are missing. When I click on a heading, I get a Not Found message from the server. Does anyone know what is happening? Can anything be done to convince whoever maintains the server to do a better job? My ability to participate has essentially been nil over recent weeks. Am I the only one who participates in the list via the web page, rather than through e-mail? Thanks, Joe - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
Re: What's Wrong With the PDML Server?
Whatever problems going on at mail-archive.com have absolutely nothing to do with the PDML server. The PDML server is fine. There is nothing wrong with the PDML server. One more time: The PDML server is healthy and happy. I spend a lot of time and not a little money keeping the PDML server fed and happy and it is running very smoothly right now, and I am beginning to resent that any time a service over which I have no control gets, in some people's opinion, behind in its VOLUNTARY service, I get the blame. Both the PDML and the separate organization that handles our archiving are brought to you by people who feel that both are worthwhile. They are both brought to you at no charge. If you have problems with either service that are insurmountable, there is only one course of action. Demand your money back. Doug At 7:14 PM -070011/12/01, Joseph Tainter wrote, or at least typed: To maintain my e-mail sanity (or as much as possible), I read and participate in PDML on the web site, not as e-mail. That is, I read it at: http://www.mail-archive.com/pentax-discuss%40pdml.net/ From time to time the server seems to get days behind in posting messages. It happened a few months ago, then 3 or 4 weeks ago, then again this month. That is, it is becoming more frequent. Now it has caught up to Nov. 10, but it seems that about 2/3 of the messages are missing. When I click on a heading, I get a Not Found message from the server. Does anyone know what is happening? Can anything be done to convince whoever maintains the server to do a better job? My ability to participate has essentially been nil over recent weeks. Am I the only one who participates in the list via the web page, rather than through e-mail? Thanks, Joe -- Douglas Forrest Brewer Ashwood Lake Photography [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.alphoto.com - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
Re: What's Wrong With the PDML Server?
Can anything be done to convince whoever maintains the server to do a better job? My ability to participate has essentially been nil over recent weeks. Gimme a break... Whatever problems going on at mail-archive.com have absolutely nothing to do with the PDML server. The PDML server is fine. There is nothing wrong with the PDML server. One more time: The PDML server is healthy and happy. Thanks for trying to making that clear, Doug. I spend a lot of time and not a little money keeping the PDML server fed and happy and it is running very smoothly right now, and I am beginning to resent that any time a service over which I have no control gets, in some people's opinion, behind in its VOLUNTARY service, I get the blame. As one of my friends often said, No good deed ever goes unpunished - g. Both the PDML and the separate organization that handles our archiving are brought to you by people who feel that both are worthwhile. They are both brought to you at no charge. If you have problems with either service that are insurmountable, there is only one course of action. Demand your money back. Good advice, Doug. So, let's stop the whining and be a little more appreciative, eh? Fred - This message is from the Pentax-Discuss Mail List. To unsubscribe, go to http://www.pdml.net and follow the directions. Don't forget to visit the Pentax Users' Gallery at http://pug.komkon.org .
